₦airaland Forum

Kobojunkiee:
The definition of Karma contained in that link is the one I work with. If your idea does not align with that then I can't help you, can I?

If that's the definition you're working with,then why have you dismissed karma as not existing.

You believe actions don't lead to consequences?

Besides, how is it possible for you to work with opposing ideas about karma from different groups as it's contained in that page?

One group insists it's tied to rebirth while the others says no,yet you say it's what you're working with? Which one are you working with?

What's clear to me now is that you hurriedly posted a link to an article you didn't take you time to read and understand very well.It's disappointing to even know it's something I have read before.

If you don't want to directly reply me about what I asked, What you understand by karma in your own words, then please don't bother anymore.

I know I how to use Google to search for answers,but only quoted you to have some discussion with you concerning the topic .

And since it appears you don't want that ,my apologies for quoting you. Have nice day.

Kobojunkiee:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karma

I had wanted you to explain in your words what you understand by karma and not you directing me to a page where you think it's explained.

How do even you know if what's contained in that you shared is the correct thing?.

Kobojunkie:
That is nothing like Karma. What a man sows in this life is rather the decider of God's eventual Judgement against said man. God's Judgment is not promised in this life -- judgment comes after death -- whereas karma is believed to happen in this life. See the stack difference between the two?

Please what's karma?

MadeINchenzen2:
so of what use is forgiveness?

It's to absolve you of guilt. That's all.

DropsMic:
Doesn’t exist.

If e dey exist, our politicians would be the most unfortunate people on the face of the earth.
If e dey exist, the descendants of those who participated in the transatlantic slave trade would be suffering today.

Also, prayers don’t work. If it did, Tinubu won’t be the president today.

Subconsciously we all know this these things, but for some reasons, na we believe in them pass.

Karma is the consequence of your actions and inactions. That's the true meaning of karma. It's not a punishment from a god as you understand it.

Zonefree:
With money, you can hire a wise person to manage your enterprise.


Get money, all things will fall in line.

Where will you get the wisdom to hire a wise person to manage your enterprise?

The Op asked you to choose one.

PoliteActivist:
Go watch his videos below. They are not that long to watch

I said your thoughts doesn't align with Harry's.

Before you send me to watch any video, prove first to me that what you said about the human being is the same as his.

PoliteActivist:
I said there's high probability things are as we perceive them, but NOT SURE!
But even Einstein who was sure still drank water. See below

If you know nothing and not sure of anything, it also mean you're not even sure of what you declared above.



What Einstein affirmed in the past was his own personal opinion about what he was in the dark about. I want to read something that's factual and true, and not the untested personal thoughts of individual.

PoliteActivist:
Ok, unless you believe in supernatural, when a child or a dog is born, does it have a "self". How does the self develop? What's your argument to this below

What's contained in the screenshot you shared is hypothetical. It hasn't happened yet.

Please bring examples of something in "real life" that has happened already, but the problem is that you're not even sure of what's 'real'. So how can you prove anything to me?

Besides, you have avoided answering the questions I asked about the dog. Have you ,or anyone you know of ,tried experimenting with a dog to be sure if what you imagined is possiblity? Yes or no

You can't use what's not possible or is a figment of your imagination to argue your case. It doesn't make sense.

PoliteActivist:
If your memory is wiped, "you" seizes to exit TOTALLY.

Wrong. What seizes to exist is the human personality, "the false self" that's a product of those memory. My " real self", the real me continues to exist.

If another person's memory is put in that body, that person becomes "you". exist!

My friend, the human being is not a machine or a bot for that to happen, and infact science says such a things is scientifically impossible since the neural pathways which controls our objective behaviour is unique to the individual. You don't know this science hence you have imagined what can never happen.

Same applies to a dog or anything else. You are your accumulated memory, NOTHING ELSE! Without memory the individual, the "self", does not exist!

Have you tried it with a dog before to know or you are just imagining things?

PoliteActivist:
Well, I wrote this below. Isn't it similar to Harris?

If you don't believe there is a supernatural, then you must agree that the "self", the individual person, doesn’t exist - it is an illusion of accumulated memory. If your memory is wiped, "you" seizes to exit TOTALLY. If another person's memory is put in that body, that person becomes "you". Same applies to a dog or anything else. You are your accumulated memory, NOTHING ELSE! Without memory the individual, the "self", does not exist!

This is completely off and no where near what Harry postulated. You didn't understand what you read from him at all.

The "self" he talked about is not the "real self" but the "false self" ,the human personality, which is a product of the environment the individual grew up in.

He says the human personality, the false self, which most identify themselves with is not real person, but illusion that's controlled automatically by neural pathways in the brain formed from what's made of the impressions received through the five senses .

And he recommended that to transcend this "false self" one should practice meditation to rewire the brain and free themselves from it's control and influence and start operating from the position of the "real self "that existed before it, human personality, was formed..

But for you you have mistaken the "false self" for the "real person" and believe if the thoughts which has created it is eliminated, the real person seizes to exist. That's not true.

LordReed:
LoLz. This why I find all these kinds of people uninteresting. If they could demonstrate a set of experiences where this reality they insist isn't really real was in fact different under the same set of circumstances we could have had something to truly dig into. Alas this is yet to be had. She is going to drink this water she claims is not really real. Bwahahahahahaha!

Maybe she wouldn't drink it since she wants to be sure first. lol

PoliteActivist:
Everything is hypothetical. We basically don't know anything.

About "really there", that's the point, we have no way of being sure. We perceive it's out there

You're generalise nearly everytime. Everything is not hypothetical.

We "basically" know something, but not everything. That's the correct thing to say, or maybe it's you who " don't know anything" , your own words in quote, and assume everyone else doesn't .

We don't need to be completely sure of what's "out there" before we start interacting with it through our senses. That's what our reality is,and it's about time you embraced it to end confusion.

And we have been doing that , interacting with what's out there, and that's why, for instance, it's possible for both of us to have this conversation through the gains of such interaction; the Internet.

A blind person from birth is still able to interact with it's environment to be "sure of what's out there , how much you with eyes to see., but seem not to want to use because you already assume it's inadequate.

PoliteActivist:
That's the point, we don't know. Neither do we know what are oxygen and hydrogen which make it up. We met them here and gave them those names. Quantum mechanics is teaching us everything is information, only information exists

No. I don't agree with you.

We know enough of what water is and what it's made of through interacting and experimenting with it .

But If you, yourself, are not sure or confused about what it's, then you can try this little experiment to clear your confusion.

Stop using that we all call water for three weeks starting from today; Don't drink it and don't bathe with it, and after then, please
come back to share your experience with us so we learn from you..

It's said that nothing can be known except through its opposite. I believe when you experience the opposite of not using water
for that period of time you will learn something..

Is he also causing badluck to other people that you know of?

If he's not, then the badluck is from you, your mind, and not him.

PoliteActivist:
I don't know how you people reason. How can a religionist even remotely entertain the things I've been saying - that the universe could be anything at all, and could exist entirely in your head, and that the individual self is an illusion?

"Could exist entirely in your head" is hypothetical and not truth statement

And that our senses could be such that they don't tell us what is really there -

And where "is really there" ?
Inside your head or out there?[/quote]

@ PoliteActivist,
When you transcend the illusion of the self through contemplation according to Sam Harry, "where" do you arrive at?

PoliteActivist:
Folks please help us find out, is Sam Harris (below) a religionist? He's saying the sorta things I've been saying!

I have gone through the thread and cannot find any evidence that what you have been saying is the same as Sam Harry's

PoliteActivist:
What is water? Really, what is it? And why in that particular form? YOU DON'T KNOW! You met it here like that and called it water. !

Then, what's that thing we all collectively refer to as water, and what should it be called?

thesolutions:
you must have published several books.

First, that something has to be reviewed does not mean it has to be increased. It can be reduced based on available reality. Government won't continue to borrow just to pay unproductive sector salaries.

The minimum wage is not binding on the private sector. What tax are you referring to. It is more profitable for the government to invest in productive private sector that not only drives the economy but also generate revenue to the government.

Any attempt to impose minimum wage on private sector will not only crumble the economy, it will be the end of this administration.

Businesses makes profits and pay salaries from profits. They are not government that will borrow money to pay salaries to unproductive civil servants and then turn to oppress the private sector with taxes.

The bolded shows you're not paying attention or care to find out first what they law says concerning minimum wage review in Nigeria.. Where in the world are salaries reviewed to reduce it after 4 years? Do you even know what you're saying? Minimum wage is not only for government workers whom you considered in your ignorance unproductive, but also for those in the private sector.
Go and read what the minimum wage act says and come back here too tell they won't benefit. Use Google.

You can continue to wail , but nothing will stop the increase. It's law.

I cannot continue to argue with someone who is ignorant of what the law says. Good day.

What's the vague statement of civil servant turning to" oppress the private sector"

Wetin you smoke this evening?

Godfullsam:
Some states can't even payment current minimum wage of 30k.

Please stop telling half truth. Yes some states cannot pay the 30k minimum wage, but it doesn't mean they're not paying something very close to it or still paying the old minimum wage.

They can actually pay the 30k but won't pay for fear they won't have enough to steal after.

Corruption and wickedness is why some governors are unwilling to pay correctly not that they can't.

The allocation from the centre to states after few subsidy removal has almost tripled, yet some of these evil governors have refused to listen to the plea of Tinubu to pay wage awards and provide other palliatives before things improve.

They continue to ignore Tinubu while quietly stealing the access money coming to them as if nothing as changed.

Modified. FYI, some states are paying above the minimum wage. Why don't you talk of those ones but to mention states unable to pay?

thesolutions:
What we need is not increasing minimum wage but reducing cost of production and improving farmers output as well as curbing security challenges.
Even if states are able to pay minimum wage of N200,000, it is same as saying inflation can go ahead and destroy the economy.

A work in progress needs no distractions.

Anyways, no one cares about workers in the private sector. No salary increase, no pension, no gratuities, no bonu package. All from hand to mount work.

So you know better than the lawmakers who came up with the law which makes it mandatory that minimum wage in this country is reviewed once every four years.?

And do you also think they never carried out adequate consultation with economic experts to find out the economic implication of what was signed into law?

FYI, minimum wage in Nigeria is not a privilege,but the inalienable right of Nigerian workers to have their salaries reviewed compulsorily once every 4 years so they earn a living wage that's commensurate with what they put in daily in their different places of work.

You're certainly ignorant of the law, the minimum wage act, hence your ill-informed advice that workers salaries shouldn't be increased.


The Tinubu led federal government cannot help put increase salaries of Nigeria workers at this time, and they're not about to do so on their own to please workers as most of you assume. It's what the law mandates them to do they're trying fulfill. So keep your advice to yourself as it cannot supersede the law.

And also, contrary to what you think, the new minimum wage being proposed by labour is also binding on the private sector once it's passed into law. Any company operating in Nigeria that has 50 workers and above in its wage bill must pay minimum wage . That's what the law says. If you work in such a place and you don't receive what you deserve , take them to court,but not without reporting them first to the appropriate authorities for sanction.



Some private employees also receive pension , not from the government, but from pension companies managing pension deductions for them. Ask around and know what's happening around you before coming to Nairaland to offer suggestions and criticism.




You talked of inflation once salaries are increased, but businesses in this country are struggling and are on the verge of shutting down due to high cost of production and poor sales caused by the abnormal reduction in the purchasing power of the populace after fuel subsidy removal and the floating of the naira.

If the situation persists and workers salaries are not increased immediately and quickly enough to match with current realities,the economy might collapse,as they the manufacturers and traders cannot continue to produce as before or do business as they used to with very little sales coming to them for their products and services

The effect will be job losses and reduction in tax revenue to government.

helinues:
And I repeat again, tithes paying is a scam

You haven't succeeded in proving how it's a scam for those paying it.

helinues:
Because it's logical

It's logical doesn't mean true.

You need to provide proof to support your accusations they don't pay their taxes.

You cannot say the civil servants amongst them don't pay. It's deducted from source once salaries are paid.

And these days it's hard for anyone doing business in Nigeria to escape from paying taxes.

Government agents are everywhere making sure people comply. Also, you're denied certain services if it's discovered you don't pay your taxes.

If you're not aware of any of these, then it's either you don't live in Nigeria or one of those who don't pay and because of that assume everyone does the same like you.

helinues:
Why should those who are not paying taxes be expecting anything from the government?

And how do you know they're not paying?

Tell me

helinues:
Anti religious kwa.

Okay, let me tell you what inspired this. When you go online, you see people shouting hardships, expecting government to put food on their table even for the fact that they dont pay tax.

This thread was created on politics section before it was moved here. My point is, if those who are not paying tax are expecting something in return from government, what exactly have they gotten in return for tithing almost every Sunday?

Shouldn't their pastors and Imam come their needs during this hard time, after all the money they could have used to package this period have been donated to them. Or do they still need to wait for God's intervention?

You get the point now

I can't find anywhere in the Christian Bible or the Koran where it's stated that once a church person or Muslim pays their tithes and offerings, all their needs will be taken care of by their religious leaders to the extent they no longer have to bother themselves or complain about what the tax collecting government is expected to do for them ,but don't do.

BTW, how did you get to know that those religious persons who conplain online don't pay their taxes to government ?

And I repeat again, tithes and offerings are religious obligations which shouldn't be equated with payment of taxes to the government . They're not the same.

You need to support your op with something reasonable for it to sell.

helinues:
No

If you don't, why do you think you're in a better position to discuss something you're not part of or don't do in order to convince those currently paying to abandon the practice?

If you don't have a direct experience of what you're advising people against, you're not taking serious or listened to. You don't really know why they're doing it and what they might be benefiting from fulfilling such religious obligation.

I said , it's proven religious practices provide salutary effect on the human mind, but you ignored that.

helinues:
At emboldened is where the scam lies. Why are there so many poor religious people, not trying to shade any group oo but the lord chosen members are mostly living in an abject poverty, same from other sects.

Have those people being abandoned and neglected upon how they have been faithful to tithes donation?

Bring your money to the church so that you can be blessed by God. What a scam line.

What precisely are they doing with the money?

I think you more interested here in discussing your anti religious sentiments than to discuss your own op .

Please be focused and provide valid reasons why churches and mosques should be taxed in Nigeria.

That's the only thing I'm interested in and not why so many poor church goers or whether religion is a scam.

helinues:
Why paying for something you won't benefit from? Have you bother to question those who made it so?

Do you pay tithe to any church or mosque?

helinues:
The people which have been donating all in the name of tithes, what do they get in return?

Tithing is religious obligation for the faithful

They don't expect to get anything tangible in return but blessings from their God whom they believe is pleased with such acts .



And it's proven that participation in religious activities or the fulfilment of religious vows can provide salutary effect on the mind. That may be the "return" who knows?

helinues:
If they are not selling anything why are people paying/tithing?

Tithing is religious obligation and not payment for anything.

helinues:
How are the current Churches and Mosques different from a business center?

You should first of all explain how they're business centres. Finish what you started and don't use "mago mago" to threw it back at me.

Prove they're a business centres that should be taxed. It's your responsibility to do that, not mine.