₦airaland Forum

Noblemanonpoint:
Calling people fools when that title plainly rest with your likes that have no basic understanding of economics.

So you're saying manual labourers and other artisian should be paid 600k monthly even when the business that employed them earn way less than that as their monthly turnover, or you think minimum wage is only applicable to civil service workers.
Did you guys go to school?

It would lead to severe hyper inflation, it's not realistic!!

That would totally bring the country on its knees. There has to be equal economic growth before such amount can be proposed and implemented.

The leadership of NLC are dunderheads.

You have come with you moronic talk again.

You keep repeating it would lead to hyperinflation without for once providing instances in the past it led to that in Nigeria and other countries where minimum wage was increased. I don't think you even know what's hyperinflation .

Funflipper:
Even if the minimum wage is increased to 1 million, that same bag of of rice will go up to about 500k.

Why will it go to 500k a bag?

Angelfrost:
Lol... These people don't seem to know how inflation and economics work.

The best FG can do is #100,000.

...And that can only be for federal government workers only or mostly.

We all know most states will never pay that... Some are still struggling to pay the current paltry minimum wage.


NLC needs to quit clowning around...!

It's you who don't know "how inflation and economics work "

Moreover, you're not the federal government to know the best they can do. Nigerian civil servants who are privy to certain secrets about the government are in a better position to know what government can pay or not pay.

And please mention the "most states" not paying minimum wage. You people keep regurgitating things you read elsewhere without confirming if true or not. Some states are paying above the minimum . Are you even aware of that?
The states you claim not paying minimum wage are actually paying what's very close to it. So don't mislead the public with half truth.

Teymanhenry:
What now happens to us in the private sector

Minimum wage is binding on both the public and private sector. Please read the article again.

femicyrus:
Power ministry is trying to generate more revenue by increasing tariff, u complained. Wait for other MDAs to either generate or increase revenue and see whether you will continue to open your mouth waaaah like trash can

Don't mind these jobless people on Nairaland trying to advise the government about what they don't know.

Ezechimma:
Everything wod increase geometrically.

What do you know?

Well known economic experts in Nigeria and elsewhere who know more than you haven't advised against increasing minimum wage, but you're here mentioning "geometrically" as if you know what you're saying.

Just rest abeg. This wan pass you

Omoapena:
🤣🤣🤣

Tell me you're joking pls, if 600k is approved, do you know the damage it will cause to the economy.
Imagine cleaners earning 600k as minimum, even Deloitte don't pay their new entry more than 300k a month.

Can't imagine how hyperinflation will finish the country if that is approved

What do you know about the economy and wage negotiations?

And where did you read it from Mr text book economic expert that an increase in minimum wage will result in hyperinflation?

It's your own personal opinion if you think a cleaner doesn't deserve to earn 600k.

Ezechimma:
If it approved even the senate wod increase to 350m a month

Who tells you that?

helinues:


Jokes taken too far . Where would the state get the money from if the basic salary is N600k.

Well may be na typor error sha, it could be N61,500

This na gaslighting things jor

You have come again with your wayward talk. The 600k is just a proposal.

If you don't know where the states government will get the money,then shut up.

Why are you not asking what have they been doing with the excess allocations going to them since the removal of fuel subsidy?

Kobojunkie:
1. The OP is the one who attempted to draw some religious angle, specifically a Scriptural one, to the idea of Karma and I saw fit to point out that no such exists.

If I was clear from my first comment that Karma has nothing to do with the world of sin and forgiveness and judgment, why would you feel the need to rope sin and forgiveness and judgment back into it all?

And what exactly is that idea of karma you know that you were trying to make clear for the OP? You have been running away from stating that clearly. Is that not so?

2. Your response regarding the seed that failed to germinate due to natural occurrences beyond my control is ludicrous. First of all, sin, forgiveness, etc., have nothing to do with the planting of a mere seed abeg ! Second, the natural laws described were beyond me and there was nothing I could have done about them given my ignorance of the weather and all. Unless you meant that my lack of knowledge of natural laws that could impact seed germination -- along with inability to foresee the future-- is my Karma-- a type of ignorance--- , i fail to see the substance to be obtained from your response on the subject of karma.

Not good for you to strawman my comments.I never said planting of seeds has something to do with sin and forgiveness. That's your own talk.I said karma is concerned with actions or inactions and the results,good or bad, which comes from it. What's difficult for you to understand in that? Natural occurrences affecting what you plant is to be expected. Every farmer expects this and don't complain when it happens. It's part of the business of planting. If you don't want that to happen to you, karma,then don't even plant at all because if you do and natural occurrence affects it ,then simply accept it as normal and don't blame anyone else but yourself for planting in the first. If you don't know how to swim avoid going near any large body of water because if someone pushes you in and you almost got drowned, don't blame anyone else but yourself for the initial action,cause, you took to go near the body of water where you almost got drowned. You know you can't swim , why take the risk and then blame natural occurrences after. Anyway the law of karma ,cause and effect ,is much more what I have said about here. It's not for everyone to accept it even make sense of, especially those who don't want to take responsibility for their own actions.

See, this is why I prefer the religious definitions of the idea. They at least offer something more tangible in way of explaining this and not some fluff that can't be reduced any further.

If you're asked to provide the so called religious definitions,you won't, but to go on a tangent of saying nothing. From your responses so far, I know that what you're referring to as religious definitions of it are nothing but misconceptions about karma held and expressed by some religious groups in order to ensnare the ignorant public. Unfortunately, you too have been misled by those.You prefer such lies to the actual truth of what the law of karma really describes because it helps you to argue confidently but ignorantly that your religious beliefs are superior to those who hold on to the idea of karma.

4. I don't believe that life can be wrapped up as simply as your karmic ideas lead you to believe at all..

I never said life can wrapped up in "karmic ideas" as you assume.

Kobojunkiee:
The way I see it, even natural laws fail as karmic laws.
What happens if I plant the seed in the ground and nothing springs forth due to unforeseen circumstances? What is the karmic conclusion in that instance? Was my action/deed/work/act wrong or bad? If you unknowingly plant a bad seed or you plant a seed and snow falls the whole of that week leading to the seed decaying in the soil and eventually failing to germinate, is it your fault that things turned out the way they did? ...does that mean your karma is bad? ...

I cannot help but to respond to this. Your comments here has further confirmed that you have no clue what karma is. You're still interpreting it in the light of your religious beliefs.

Who planted the seed?
You of course .

The seed not germinating is your karma, the consequence from the action you took.You didn't do anything bad,but only took and action that resulted in something. Learn from what has happened and then next time find a better way of doing it t so you reap a good harvest That's all.

You continue to miss it because you still see karma as sin which requires forgiveness from a God. Karma is taking responsibility for your actions and not blaming external forces or circumstances for what has happened to you. The knowledge of karma is an empowering concept that will help anyone to change their life if things aren't working as they want
it. You're responsible for happens to you and if you don't like the results you see in your life, you have the power to change it by taking necessary action. That's what
karma says.

Kobojunkiee:
You asked me a question and I answered you. If you instead wanted me to read your particular mind and post your particular ideas on the topic, I would have not responded since I don't care for that.

What sort of talk is this?

I asked you a question and the next thing is to share a link like a bot to an article you never bothered to read in detail ,and you say you answered me.? That's
not fair at all..


If everyone were to act like you , then there won't be much discussion going on this
forum. Sharing only links about something you were asked by another without stating your own thoughts first on the matter is not only dismissive and disrespectful , but also you indirectly telling the person they don't know how to use Google to search for answers themselves.

If I were not ready to engage you on the topic under discussion,I would simply type on any browser, what's is karma, and don't bother you . I expected you to understand this, but you continue to pretend .

I have read the article a long time ago. So what do I do with it now?

Another descriptive word for what karma refers to in that you pretended to have read,is ,"cause and effect",yet you say karma don't exist in this world.? You don't know what you're saying, and you just exposed yourself


Abeg rest.

Kobojunkiee:
Please stop trying to flip this all over the place when there is no need to. You asked the definition of Karma and I provided you with a link that connected you to the prevailing ideas held of it by those of the religions Hinduism, Buddhism, and Jainism. It has always been a religious idea and not something any tom-dick-and-harry can cook up a definition for.

I never asked you for a link to a definition of something, I know how to use Google myself,but what you understand about
karma. . You have shown you don't really understand it. So why continue to argue over what you don't fully grasp?

In my later responses, I proceeded to explain that Karma does not apply in the Scriptural context because all things Scripture are weighed against God's Law. The mandate of Obedience from God to all who are under the Law is the determining factor for all things in the lives of individuals. Karma does not apply at all.

karma has nothing to do with your religious beliefs .So why are you trying to interpret it based on what's contained in your Bible

Heck
Karma does not even work in the real world many of us live in.

You say so because you're hung up on the word,karma,and not what it really another name for,Karma, is cause and effect and you say it doesn't work in the real world?

About Reincarnation, I would say it is quite possible for those who are not born-again. Anyways, that is all I have on that.

But I don't subscribe to the born again talk. Reincarnation is reincarnation, born again is church doctrine.

Anyway, let's end this. Thanks for your time.

Kobojunkiee:
1. Huh? Hindu and Buddhist understanding of karma are not acceptable?

2. I am afraid I don't follow your meaning at all. In Scripture, evil/sin is defined by the Law and as such it is by transgressing the law that you incur the condemnation of sin or curse. That, I explained, is not how karma works.

3.

I'm talking about certain ideas attached to it which makes it difficult for most people to understand what karma really is.

Buddhism ties it with reincarnation, but others don't ,or do you believe in reincarnation ?

Karma is not sin,but simply the results from an individual's actions and inactions . These results are not punishment from any god. People who talk as if karma is punishment are only speaking metaphorically ,not understanding this ,is probably the reason you're trying to compare it with what is in the scripture you subscribe to.

Go back to the article you shared and see where karma is defined at the beginning as ,deeds ,or actions, and that they lead to consequences.The word, karma ,is originally from Sanskrit,one of the oldest language in the world.

Without karma,cause and effect,not will happen in this world.. Focus on what the word, karma, actually describe so you understand it better before considering any thing being connected to it

Kobojunkiee:
In the context of Scripture, Karma does not exist nor apply given that instead what applies are laws laid down by God.

2. There are many ideas regarding Karma out there. However, it does not matter whether they oppose themselves or not because the major case here is that none of that applies as far as Scripture is concerned.

3. If you wish to believe that, it's fine by me.

In all you still don't know what karma is. What you know about it is what some religious groups have said about it,and that's why you say it doesn't apply to Scripture.

Karma is not transgressing the laws of any deity as you think you. It's the principle of cause and effect. That's all

The actions you take are the causes of what you get. But your hand in fire, you get burned and learn the lesson. It's has nothing to do with what is contained in Scripture.

Kobojunkiee:
The definition of Karma contained in that link is the one I work with. If your idea does not align with that then I can't help you, can I?

If that's the definition you're working with,then why have you dismissed karma as not existing.

You believe actions don't lead to consequences?

Besides, how is it possible for you to work with opposing ideas about karma from different groups as it's contained in that page?

One group insists it's tied to rebirth while the others says no,yet you say it's what you're working with? Which one are you working with?

What's clear to me now is that you hurriedly posted a link to an article you didn't take you time to read and understand very well.It's disappointing to even know it's something I have read before.

If you don't want to directly reply me about what I asked, What you understand by karma in your own words, then please don't bother anymore.

I know I how to use Google to search for answers,but only quoted you to have some discussion with you concerning the topic .

And since it appears you don't want that ,my apologies for quoting you. Have nice day.

Kobojunkiee:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karma

I had wanted you to explain in your words what you understand by karma and not you directing me to a page where you think it's explained.

How do even you know if what's contained in that you shared is the correct thing?.

Kobojunkie:
That is nothing like Karma. What a man sows in this life is rather the decider of God's eventual Judgement against said man. God's Judgment is not promised in this life -- judgment comes after death -- whereas karma is believed to happen in this life. See the stack difference between the two?

Please what's karma?

MadeINchenzen2:
so of what use is forgiveness?

It's to absolve you of guilt. That's all.

DropsMic:
Doesn’t exist.

If e dey exist, our politicians would be the most unfortunate people on the face of the earth.
If e dey exist, the descendants of those who participated in the transatlantic slave trade would be suffering today.

Also, prayers don’t work. If it did, Tinubu won’t be the president today.

Subconsciously we all know this these things, but for some reasons, na we believe in them pass.

Karma is the consequence of your actions and inactions. That's the true meaning of karma. It's not a punishment from a god as you understand it.

Zonefree:
With money, you can hire a wise person to manage your enterprise.


Get money, all things will fall in line.

Where will you get the wisdom to hire a wise person to manage your enterprise?

The Op asked you to choose one.

PoliteActivist:
Go watch his videos below. They are not that long to watch

I said your thoughts doesn't align with Harry's.

Before you send me to watch any video, prove first to me that what you said about the human being is the same as his.

PoliteActivist:
I said there's high probability things are as we perceive them, but NOT SURE!
But even Einstein who was sure still drank water. See below

If you know nothing and not sure of anything, it also mean you're not even sure of what you declared above.



What Einstein affirmed in the past was his own personal opinion about what he was in the dark about. I want to read something that's factual and true, and not the untested personal thoughts of individual.

PoliteActivist:
Ok, unless you believe in supernatural, when a child or a dog is born, does it have a "self". How does the self develop? What's your argument to this below

What's contained in the screenshot you shared is hypothetical. It hasn't happened yet.

Please bring examples of something in "real life" that has happened already, but the problem is that you're not even sure of what's 'real'. So how can you prove anything to me?

Besides, you have avoided answering the questions I asked about the dog. Have you ,or anyone you know of ,tried experimenting with a dog to be sure if what you imagined is possiblity? Yes or no

You can't use what's not possible or is a figment of your imagination to argue your case. It doesn't make sense.

PoliteActivist:
If your memory is wiped, "you" seizes to exit TOTALLY.

Wrong. What seizes to exist is the human personality, "the false self" that's a product of those memory. My " real self", the real me continues to exist.

If another person's memory is put in that body, that person becomes "you". exist!

My friend, the human being is not a machine or a bot for that to happen, and infact science says such a things is scientifically impossible since the neural pathways which controls our objective behaviour is unique to the individual. You don't know this science hence you have imagined what can never happen.

Same applies to a dog or anything else. You are your accumulated memory, NOTHING ELSE! Without memory the individual, the "self", does not exist!

Have you tried it with a dog before to know or you are just imagining things?

PoliteActivist:
Well, I wrote this below. Isn't it similar to Harris?

If you don't believe there is a supernatural, then you must agree that the "self", the individual person, doesn’t exist - it is an illusion of accumulated memory. If your memory is wiped, "you" seizes to exit TOTALLY. If another person's memory is put in that body, that person becomes "you". Same applies to a dog or anything else. You are your accumulated memory, NOTHING ELSE! Without memory the individual, the "self", does not exist!

This is completely off and no where near what Harry postulated. You didn't understand what you read from him at all.

The "self" he talked about is not the "real self" but the "false self" ,the human personality, which is a product of the environment the individual grew up in.

He says the human personality, the false self, which most identify themselves with is not real person, but illusion that's controlled automatically by neural pathways in the brain formed from what's made of the impressions received through the five senses .

And he recommended that to transcend this "false self" one should practice meditation to rewire the brain and free themselves from it's control and influence and start operating from the position of the "real self "that existed before it, human personality, was formed..

But for you you have mistaken the "false self" for the "real person" and believe if the thoughts which has created it is eliminated, the real person seizes to exist. That's not true.

LordReed:
LoLz. This why I find all these kinds of people uninteresting. If they could demonstrate a set of experiences where this reality they insist isn't really real was in fact different under the same set of circumstances we could have had something to truly dig into. Alas this is yet to be had. She is going to drink this water she claims is not really real. Bwahahahahahaha!

Maybe she wouldn't drink it since she wants to be sure first. lol

PoliteActivist:
Everything is hypothetical. We basically don't know anything.

About "really there", that's the point, we have no way of being sure. We perceive it's out there

You're generalise nearly everytime. Everything is not hypothetical.

We "basically" know something, but not everything. That's the correct thing to say, or maybe it's you who " don't know anything" , your own words in quote, and assume everyone else doesn't .

We don't need to be completely sure of what's "out there" before we start interacting with it through our senses. That's what our reality is,and it's about time you embraced it to end confusion.

And we have been doing that , interacting with what's out there, and that's why, for instance, it's possible for both of us to have this conversation through the gains of such interaction; the Internet.

A blind person from birth is still able to interact with it's environment to be "sure of what's out there , how much you with eyes to see., but seem not to want to use because you already assume it's inadequate.

PoliteActivist:
That's the point, we don't know. Neither do we know what are oxygen and hydrogen which make it up. We met them here and gave them those names. Quantum mechanics is teaching us everything is information, only information exists

No. I don't agree with you.

We know enough of what water is and what it's made of through interacting and experimenting with it .

But If you, yourself, are not sure or confused about what it's, then you can try this little experiment to clear your confusion.

Stop using that we all call water for three weeks starting from today; Don't drink it and don't bathe with it, and after then, please
come back to share your experience with us so we learn from you..

It's said that nothing can be known except through its opposite. I believe when you experience the opposite of not using water
for that period of time you will learn something..

Is he also causing badluck to other people that you know of?

If he's not, then the badluck is from you, your mind, and not him.

PoliteActivist:
I don't know how you people reason. How can a religionist even remotely entertain the things I've been saying - that the universe could be anything at all, and could exist entirely in your head, and that the individual self is an illusion?

"Could exist entirely in your head" is hypothetical and not truth statement

And that our senses could be such that they don't tell us what is really there -

And where "is really there" ?
Inside your head or out there?[/quote]

@ PoliteActivist,
When you transcend the illusion of the self through contemplation according to Sam Harry, "where" do you arrive at?