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 Christianity Etc › Re: we are no longer under law but grace, but you do err christians. by trustman: 2:58pm On Dec 22, 2013 |
MEILYN: Jesus brought grace and truth to the world, and the bible says truth is the law. Do u wanna argue that bro?." For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ". - John 1:17 This appears to me to be a CONTRAST between the law that came through Moses and what Jesus brought. Nowhere here is TRUTH equated to the law. Where did the Bible say that truth is the law? Secondly, without GRACE man is hopeless. If we stop preaching that which give life, hope and eternal life to anyone what hope will there be for anyone? 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 2:33pm On Dec 22, 2013 |
Bidam, It is obvious you're mixed-up in your understanding of the Bible. You also deliberately decide to ignore issues and comments that clearly debunk your stand on tithing. What Christ instituted after his work on earth was done far superceeds ANYTHING that was before it, whether it was what was in operation up to and including the time of Abraham or what the law and the prophets presented. By ANYTHING i mean any system for living the spiritual life or relating with God WHETHER rituals or any other form of observances such as tithing. Therefore, NO MAN TODAY HAS THE RIGHT TO INSIST on TITHING under the grace and truth that Jesus Christ brought - For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ(John 1:17). The insistence on tithing today turns Christians away from living their true spiritual lives. Rather than focusing on what Christ has done it makes them focus on their WORKS such as TITHING as a means of gaining God's approval or blessings. In Christ we have been blessed with every blessing we can think of - "Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ"(Ephesians.1: 3). We cannot merit any blessing from God on the basis of what we do including TITHING. The ONLY thing that satisfied God was Jesus' work. Our expression of gratitude to God for what he did for us in Christ is what should DRIVE our spiritual lives, not seeking to present a scorecard of our works before God. That expression of gratitude can come in any form including GIVING. But giving must not be forced from any Christian whether covertly or overtly. It must be the INDIVIDUAL CHOICE of the believer. This point Apostle Peter made clear in the issue of Ananias And Sapphira - "Didn’t it belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn’t the money at your disposal? What made you think of doing such a thing? You have not lied just to human beings but to God.” (Acts 5:4). This understanding is what pervaded their thinking that we find NO SINGLE directive on tithing in the new testament epistles; GIVING, yes, but not any insistence on giving ANY FIXED PERCENTAGE OR AMOUNT. The plain truth is that all that is truly critical or important for the Christian way of life has been given to us in the writings of these apostles. On the other hand anything not given to us by these men but propagated today as critical to the Christian’s spiritual life is man-made and will be wood, hay and stubble at the evaluation throne of Christ. |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by trustman: 12:00am On Dec 21, 2013 |
Image123, on your issue - In Matthew 23:23, Jesus said the weightier matters of the law are judgment, mercy, and faith. Now that the law is abolished, are these heavy matters of the law abolished? Any significant thing required of the Christian will be found in the New Testament epistles which constitute the blueprint for living the Christian life. 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by trustman: 11:39pm On Dec 20, 2013 |
On Image123’s REBUTTAL OF M4/M5 NOBODY HAS ANY RIGHT to say what God did not say. NOBODY HAS ANY RIGHT to determine his ‘rule of engagement’ with God. God is sovereign, so we either stick to his revealed will or we don’t. But to choose OUR OWN ‘terms’ or ‘rules of the game’ as far as God is concerned is the height of unbridled arrogance. If Image123 and co will be honest with themselves they are using tithing to earn some points with God. They give undue emphasis to it, not because they can show where it is prescribed under the new covenant, but because they have bought a lie that there is some perceived benefit in doing it. If not, why the excessive prominence given to it in the church today? They have not answered the key question – ‘Where is this TITHING prescribed for the new testament believer?’ They may agree that things like animal sacrifices, though in scripture, no longer need to be practiced today. Why then is it difficult for them to accept that tithing is no longer compulsory. Why a constant reference to the past when – Hebrews 8:6 – “But in fact the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, since the new covenant is established on better promises.” 13 By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear. The Law was the greatest thing the Jews could reference in terms of what God had instituted. To them it was greater than anything else; anything before it or any other system that existed in other nations coterminous with it. when we are told that the new has replaced the old it means the new has replaced that which was greater than than anything that was before it. If the law was that superior then when we are told that the new has replaced the old we need to stand at attention and give a salute instead of resorting to rhetoric. 3 Likes |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 10:56pm On Dec 20, 2013 |
[quote author=ABDULADINO][/quote]Where in the following does the word LAW refer to ceremonial law or otherwise? Galatians 3 - 10 For all who rely on the works of the law are under a curse, as it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.” 11 Clearly no one who relies on the law is justified before God, because “the righteous will live by faith.” |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 10:36pm On Dec 20, 2013 |
[quote author=ABDULADINO][/quote]Bidam, you said: Under the law the person is estranged from God. CAN YOU BACK UP YOUR STATEMENT WITH SCRIPTURES? Genesis 17:14 - "Any uncircumcised male, who has not been circumcised in the flesh, will be cut off from his people; he has broken my covenant.” Exodus 12:48 - “A foreigner residing among you who wants to celebrate the Lord’s Passover must have all the males in his household circumcised; then he may take part like one born in the land. No uncircumcised male may eat it." Also that: [b]The Abrahamic covenant is foundational to all of Scripture. It is the key to both the Old and New Testaments and is foundational to the whole program of redemption. All subsequent revelation is the outworking of this covenant. This covenant, and the subsequent covenant framework, is the key to understanding Scripture. Hebrews 7 - "This Melchizedek was king of Salem and priest of God Most High. He met Abraham returning from the defeat of the kings and blessed him, 2 and Abraham gave him a tenth of everything. First, the name Melchizedek means “king of righteousness”; then also, “king of Salem” means “king of peace.” 3 Without father or mother, without genealogy, without beginning of days or end of life, resembling the Son of God, he remains a priest forever. 4 Just think how great he was: Even the patriarch Abraham gave him a tenth of the plunder! 5 Now the law requires the descendants of Levi who become priests to collect a tenth from the people—that is, from their fellow Israelites—even though they also are descended from Abraham. 6 This man, however, did not trace his descent from Levi, yet he collected a tenth from Abraham and blessed him who had the promises. 7 And without doubt the lesser is blessed by the greater. 8 In the one case, the tenth is collected by people who die; but in the other case, by him who is declared to be living. 9 One might even say that Levi, who collects the tenth, paid the tenth through Abraham, 10 because when Melchizedek met Abraham, Levi was still in the body of his ancestor. Here you see Melchizedek considered greater than Abraham and then to prove the point that Christ's priesthood and the New Covenant he instituted is greater than anything before it, whether Abraham, the Levitical priesthood or the law. Although DrummaBoy had made this remark about you before now, the question is - How do you take a simple statement as 'The law is ... ...' and then turn into 'The law here refers to ceremonial laws'? How do decide where law refers to ceremonial law and when it refers to the whole law and so on and so forth? If you claim to hold on to all scripture then you cannot pick and choose what you like and you seem to be doing this quite a lot! |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 12:16am On Dec 20, 2013 |
Bidam: The sacrifices were a shadow of what is to come,Christ has Come,so only the sacrifices were done away with. Even from the very beginning God was never interested in animal sacrifices, He said so Himself.Talking about shadows, was it only sacrifices that were a SHADOW of what is to come? See what Hebrews 10:1 says - "The law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming—not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship." Does God want you to obey the reality rather than the shadow? |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Malachi,Tithes & Devourer: The Silliest Children's Monster Story Ever Sold by trustman: 11:43pm On Dec 19, 2013 |
Omexonomy: Too much problem full nairaland.Are those hard drugs complaining? Does that mean many of them can't be harmed by it? 3 Likes |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 11:10pm On Dec 19, 2013*. Modified: 11:38pm On Dec 19, 2013 |
Bidam: No it isn't my concoction..last time i checked the bible the priestly function wasn't abolished in the new covenant, there was a change of priesthood not a change of tithing,You also said these: A vital principle to remember concerning the Old and New Covenants is that what did not originate with the Old Covenant did not die with it. ( You of all people is guilty of this error. ) Even at that the judaizers were advocating for Moses custom of circumcision for salvation, no where did it mention Abraham. I then went on to show you how 2 things - family priesthood & circumcision - that predated the law are no longer applicable or compulsory for the Christian. A little education for you here - anyone can still undertake circumcision, but anyone who decides not to be circumcised is not estrange from God. Pre-law or Under the law this was not so. And this referred to PHYSICAL CIRCUMCISION even though God would later make reference to circumcision of the heart. On the family priesthood you had no answer. This was to debunk your statement that 'what did not originate with the Old Covenant did not die with it. By the way, what about sabbath day observance, hope you know it predated the law? When it came to the New Covenant what happened? It was obvious to the judaizers that the Mosaic Law replaced anything before it. So their reference to what was subsisting at their time was only normal. As at their time the Mosaic Law was ALL that God expected them to follow; nothing else. So if Abraham was not mentioned it was because the Law was the 'Standing Order' as at their time not Abraham's system. Colossians 2: 8-11 – See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the elemental spiritual forces of this world rather than on Christ. For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form, and in Christ you have been brought to fullness. He is the head over every power and authority. In him you were also circumcised with a circumcision not performed by human hands. Your whole self ruled by the flesh was put off when you were circumcised by Christ, Colossians 3 11 Here there is no Gentile or Jew, circumcised or uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave or free, but Christ is all, and is in all. |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 10:45pm On Dec 19, 2013 |
Goshen360: ^ You seems not to understand this thing we have been saying yet. Yes, the Abraham example predates the law but the Abraham example is not a law for Christians. Preachers make it a law for Christians by citing Abraham example and\but backing it with Malachi curse while they also lift law tithing scripture to support Abraham tithing.Goshen360, you hit the nail right on the head. Absolutely on point here! |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 11:59pm On Dec 18, 2013 |
Bidam: Here you also go again asking for specifics..Remember where we started from: Bidam: The tithes is To Jesus.Heb is clear on that. Now, the portion you quoted has INCLUDED IN IT the following: Hebrews 7: 12 – “For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.” Adding one more verse you have: Hebrews 7: 18 - 19 “The former regulation is set aside because it was weak and useless (for the law made nothing perfect), and a better hope is introduced, by which we draw near to God.” To respond simply - no where did it or remotely mention that “The tithes is to Jesus”. What we have here is that a CHANGE HAS OCCURRED – the priesthood has changed, the FORMER regulation has been set aside and a better hope is introduced. This should be very clear reading this portion of scripture. Again, no where did it or remotely mention that “The tithes is to Jesus”. This must only be your concoction. When you use the word ‘principle’ what really do you mean? Do you have your own definition of it? Yes, the New Testament talks about support for ministers but does it also say how? If so why try and go off its recommended approach and still insist on going back to the Law or Pre-law? Simply find out what the change in priesthood and regulation says and STICK to it. Any other thing is arrogance and indeed disobedience to God. Now on what predates the law or not I offer the following: One thing that did not originate with the Old Covenant was family priesthood. However, as early as when the Mosaic Law came into force that system DIED. Bidam, circumcision did not originate with the Old Covenant but when the New Covenant came what happened? It DIED. Galatians 5: 2-3 – “Mark my words! I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all. Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law.” Galatians 6: 12 – 16 – “Those who want to impress people by means of the flesh are trying to compel you to be circumcised. The only reason they do this is to avoid being persecuted for the cross of Christ. Not even those who are circumcised keep the law, yet they want you to be circumcised that they may boast about your circumcision in the flesh. May I never boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, through which the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world. Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything; what counts is the new creation. Peace and mercy to all who follow this rule—to the Israel of God.” Again, the issue is really simple – What is required of the church-age believer under the new covenant? Seek it, get it and stick to it. Remember Peter’s vision where the Lord told him in Acts 10:15 - The voice spoke to him a second time, “Do not call anything impure that God has made clean.” Peter refused to heed the initial instructions because the animals he was seeing where considered unclean. Yet it was the Lord giving the command. But then the Lord had made a change – made them clean. Therefore it was now ok to eat the same animals but now made clean. While the application is there in scripture and clear as far as this incident is concerned a lesson for us is this – WHENEVER THE LORD CHANGES A SYSTEM WE MUST GO WITH HIS LAST ORDER. 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 10:56pm On Dec 17, 2013 |
Bidam: The tithes is To Jesus.Heb is clear on that.There you go again! Can you please give me specific reference in the book of Hebrews to clarify this? 3 Likes |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 6:54am On Dec 17, 2013 |
Bidam: Did bakker actually mention tithes and offerings as the errorWhat do you think is at heart of the prosperity message? Service to God or money, particularly tithing? 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by trustman: 6:50am On Dec 17, 2013 |
On Image123 Rebutting M3 Image123 said: One main purpose of tithing is as a show of appreciation and acknowledgement to God. It was also multipurposed for the Levites to be taken care of, as they were not working except in the temple(abi na tabernacle). Such a purpose would have being lost in Numbers 31 as nobody was working yet, they were all receiving manna. There was yet to need to give the tenth to the Levites. The tithe was their salary, a compensation for their not being allowed to work full time outside like other tribes. It was given to take care of them and to help them serve without distraction. Some times if the people were not faithful in their giving, the levites became discouraged and withdrew to go do some work. Num 18:21 And, behold, I have given the children of Levi all the tenth in Israel for an inheritance, for their service which they serve, even the service of the tabernacle of the congregation. First, I’m sure it’s clear to tithers that the Levitical priesthood has been done away with. Therefore there is no need today to give to a set of Levites a 10% that constitutes “their salary, a compensation for their not being allowed to work full time outside like other tribes. … … to take care of them and to help them serve without distraction”. Those in certain positions of Christian ministry (every Christian is in full time service today) may be given money for their upkeep, etc but the GIVERS must not be made to give a compulsory 10% of their income or whatever. If the purpose of giving is to show appreciation to God then, like the widow’s mite, ANY AMOUNT coming from a person’s free heartedness will be acceptable to God. He also said: Tithing is a personal decision, and Abraham took that decision. – This is correct. Consequently, in Christ, a Christian can decide ON HIS OWN to give a fixed amount regularly: But it must be a personal decision. “Each man should give what he has decided in his heart to give, NOT RELUCTANTLY or UNDER COMPULSION, for God loves a cheerful giver” 2 Corinthians 9:7. No Christian is to be coerced into giving ANYTHING – whether a fixed percentage regularly or a one-off giving. It must be a personal decision of the individual otherwise it is no longer given by grace and will amount to nothing before God. We are saved by grace and we are to live out our lives by grace. See also Peter’s remark to Ananias in Acts 5:3-4. The Passover was God’s instruction to Israel but when it was clear that the new covenant set it aside was there still any need to insist on it? On the other hand where there is no direct or clear evidence that God made a thing compulsory under the New Covenant there is no reason for any church today to make it mandatory for the Christian no matter how plausible the rationale presented for it is. Is there a direct or clear evidence that God made tithing compulsory under the New Covenant? I would want Image123 & co to show this. 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 11:28pm On Dec 15, 2013 |
Bidam: okIf you agree, like you have done, that - The levitical office and sacrifices were abolished when Jesus went to the cross.The laws, statutes, and regulations of the Old Testament always need to be understood through the light of the New Testament. why then do you find it difficult to see what the New Testament teaches about Christian giving? |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Inviting Tithers To A Theological Discuss with Miwerds and Candour On Tithing by trustman: 10:46pm On Dec 15, 2013 |
Image123 said in Response to Rebuttal R3 : We give tithe of what God increases us with. If God increases us with currency, then we tithe of it. Tithe is a tenth of income. It is not something we do to be justified before God. i've heard of folks that obey a 'do not tithe' law, because they want to be justified. They believe that if they tithe, they stand to be condemned or to lose their salvation. So there is a i MUST not tithe law that they obey, so as to be justified. This is old covenant pattern. The main point about Abraham's tithe and jacob's tithe is that God and Moses recognised that what they gave was a tithe. They did not say that it did not qualify under God's criteria. The Holy Spirit called it tithe, and it is acceptable. Can a legitimate be done in such a way that can be considered wrong? For example, is it right to have a bath? Will it be considered ok to have a bath in broad day light in the market square? A fitting scripture to such a thing would be – Let everything be done decently AND IN ORDER. Giving, Prayer and fasting may be legitimate things but when done wrongly what do we find? Matthew 6:2 [Giving]“So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. Matthew 6:5 [ Prayer ] “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. Matthew 6:16 [ Fasting ] “When you fast, do not look somber as the hypocrites do, for they disfigure their faces to show others they are fasting. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. We are not at liberty to define our terms before God. We need to understand God’s terms and stick to them. We are not at liberty to define or determine what we think TITHE is. We must understand and stick to God’s own definition of it. Period. We cannot arrogate to ourselves a level of spiritual height where we now choose how we relate with God or our terms for it. He is supreme and sovereign. Humility demands that we conform to His revealed will not choose our own systems for dealing with Him. If you must pay tithe then do it in line with God’s revealed will for it. How did God say tithe is to be practiced? But then what do we find in scripture? Ephesians 2:14-15 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; To the tithers who say they do it because the law prescribed it, Christ abolished what? The same God, yes. Certain similar principles, yes. But quite a different system for living and administering the spiritual life. That a practice is in the Bible does not necessarily recommend it to be used or practiced by the Christian. The Christian must rightly divide whether such a practice is for him or not under the new Covenant. For example, the Bible, in the Old Testament has requirements for animal sacrifices and so on. Would anyone therefore justify animal sacrifice today simply on the basis that it is in the Bible? 7 Likes |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 9:57pm On Dec 15, 2013 |
Bidam: What aspect do you think was abolished?I quoted your own statement - Bidam: The levitical office and sacrifices were abolished when Jesus went to the cross.The laws, statutes, and regulations of the Old Testament always need to be understood through the light of the New Testament. and asked a very simple question but either that by trying to be cunning or deceitful you avoided a direct answer. Look at that your statement again. What are you saying there or did you mistakenly write what you wrote? When you try to get around scripture and REFUSE to accept its plainly revealed mind of God then you create endless difficulties for yourself. |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 9:51pm On Dec 15, 2013 |
[quote author=DrummaBoy][/quote]Thanks again my brother. |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 3:35pm On Dec 15, 2013 |
Bidam: The levitical office and sacrifices were abolished when Jesus went to the cross.The laws, statutes, and regulations of the Old Testament always need to be understood through the light of the New Testament.So you admit here that some aspects of the Law were abolished. Right? Then why is it hard for you to see what we have been telling you. No Christian is at liberty to pick and choose what he wants or think is abolished from the Law. Scripture alone and the New Testament epistles in particular should be our guide. |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 9:10am On Dec 15, 2013 |
Bidam: The levitical office and sacrifices were abolished when Jesus went to the cross.The laws, statutes, and regulations of the Old Testament always need to be understood through the light of the New Testament.So you admit here that some aspects of the Law were abolished. Right? Then why is it hard for you to see what we have been telling you. No Christian is at liberty to pick and choose what he wants or think is abolished from the Law. Scripture alone and the New Testament epistles in particular should be our guide. 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 12:17am On Dec 15, 2013 |
Bidam: The argument was whether the Torah(five books of moses) was being read and used..since the compilations of the NT wasn't done till 30 AD..and i showed form scriptures beyond any shadow of doubt that it was.As for trustman question i was answered him.For your information, and the point has been made by others too, whenever and wherever the OT was quoted, used or discussed in the NT it was always to point people to Christ. Let me quote from Jesus himself in Luke 24: 27 “And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he explained to them what was said in all the Scriptures concerning himself”’ So teachings from the OT to Christians – Church age believers – was not for them to keep following rituals of the Old but to see the reality in Christ just as he himself did AFTER THE RESURRECTION in the portion I quoted above. Does this begin to open your eyes a little? |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 11:31pm On Dec 13, 2013 |
Zikkyy: who told you Christians were following and adhering to OT instructions? Na where you read that one?I beg help me ask am. |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 11:12pm On Dec 13, 2013 |
Bidam: May be you need to check your statement once again...The bible is complete.We don't only adhere to NT teachings but OT as well cos All scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching and instructions. The bible never said only NT teaching is inspired but the whole scripture.Now take your time on this; you don't need to answer in a hurry. OK. What is the meaning of Colossians 1:26? |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 10:43pm On Dec 13, 2013 |
Bidam: Tithing is pre Law. Go through what you said when you opened your thread. I can't quote cos i am on phone.The issue is not whether the PRACTICE is pre-law or post law. The issues is this: Is there a single INSTRUCTION to the Church age believer to tithe? The simple answer is that there is NOT ONE such directive in the New Testament epistles which constitutes the blueprint for the spiritual lifestyle under the Church age. 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 9:59pm On Dec 13, 2013 |
Bidam: Yawns...I think the article is boring..BTW i don't forget conversations easily like you..Go through Olaa..thread on tithes and offering that was the time you introduced your so called tithing101.com that i told you i don't need.So to say you are his ally is not an understatement.:pThe Christian is not under the Old Testament Law, therefore he is under no further duty than to give cheerfully and liberally (2 Corinthians 9: 6-7) You are doing EXACTLY what i said - having allies or buddies or friends: what has that your statement got do with the issue at stake? Do you not have friends yourself? Address issues rather than resort to assault on persons. |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 9:40pm On Dec 13, 2013 |
DrummaBoy: O' boy see me see wahala O.Very succinctly put my brother! I am really getting to a conclusion the pro-tithers in this forum are yet to clearly understand why they stand for what they think they stand for. I am still to see them put up a simple logical or commonsensical argument on their position. Instead they resort to attacking those who do not hold their position perhaps to intimidate them (?) Truly like the Scriptures say - my people perish for lack of knowledge. But like the hymn says: we need to rescue 'the perishing' 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 4:29pm On Dec 13, 2013 |
Bidam: i don't have the luxury of time going through silly websites..nairaland is littered with tithe threads already go thru them and learn..As for tithing by faith i answered that query in the thread opened by drummaboy..i guess you are his ally or maybe him.You had said in a one of your posts: If Paul could commend the tithes and offerings(gifts) he received from the Philippians and say it is a sacrifice acceptable and pleasing to God(he cannot see) by faith. That means it is very much scriptural to tithe by faith. But hey, where was Paul said have received tithes from the Philippians? You also responded to another Nairalander with the following: Ok lemme help you since you are hard in hearing. faith IS AS NATURAL AS AIR. It is the very Nature and fundamental of our christian walk.Everything in the Kingdom operates by faith that includes prayers,fasting,tithing,giving alms,doing business with people etc..etc... The bible records we walk by faith not by sight.The bible records we are in the world but not of the world. The executive Governor of the Kingdom we are in is the PERSON OF THE HOLY SPIRIT.Without him we can do nothing for in Him we move,live and have our being. The kingdom of God is not in observations.So if you feel your walk with God is by sight and human senses do go ahead and humour us. Here you fail to directly quote scripture to support your position largely because your logic is not based on right understanding of scriptures but on philosophy of men. What is faith? How is it used in scripture? Faith is not only … … trust in someone or something, faith also encompasses what is believed. So when in Hebrews 11 we see those who by faith were stoned, sawn in two, killed with the sword, etc (Heb. 11: 34 and following) what do people like you make of it – faith? I believe you get stuck. If there were to be anything as “tithing by faith’ it should tithing by a clearly revealed word of God. There is nothing like that for the Church age believer in the Lord Jesus Christ. 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 4:03pm On Dec 13, 2013 |
Bidam: i don't have the luxury of time going through silly websites..nairaland is littered with tithe threads already go thru them and learn..As for tithing by faith i answered that query in the thread opened by drummaboy..i guess you are his ally or maybe him.Your typical self and approach to responding as shdemidemi will say and has been pointing out all along. 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 3:46pm On Dec 13, 2013 |
Bidam: We as christian tithe by Faith and not because some law says so.The SIMPLE issue is this: where in scripture is the Christian asked to 'tithe by Faith' ? Nowhere. If any show me. You may wish to visit www.tithing101.com I have been there. When you do then you will see that i have perhaps more knowledge than you on tithing. You may also wish to see my post: Still On Tithing, Etc: The Book Of Acts Gave Us The Solution 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 3:19pm On Dec 13, 2013 |
Bidam: Ok..why not tell us the truth rather than this your ad hominem.The truth is this: Galatians was addressing believers in the Lord Jesus Christ. They had veered off The Christian Way of Life by turning back to JUDAISM. Paul was showing them that all that they (OR ANYONE for that matter) can have in Abraham or the law of Moses found fulfillment in Christ. In Christ we have ALL that we need; there is no reason whatsoever to go back to ANY observance in Abraham or the Law as a yardstick for living our spiritual life under the LAW OF THE SPIRIT OF LIFE IN CHRIST JESUS. |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 3:09pm On Dec 13, 2013 |
shdemidemi: I am starting to think this Bidam guy is aware of the truth (not that he knows the truth). But for inexplicable reasons he has failed to accept the Word as absolute, he would rather treat the Word as being uncertain.Thanks for this. You are absolutely right here! 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: If You Tithe, You Are Obligated To Keep The Whole Law! by trustman(op): 11:01pm On Dec 12, 2013 |
Bidam: Funny indeed. This is not a court session where you would be asking me questions. I am at liberty not to answer or answer a question that seems to be a ridicule.Already you have the answers why ask the questionsRemember what you said - "Since you don't want to study and you are lazy, let me explain the Galatians scripture you quoted in CONTEXT. I have already answered the other scripture so no wahala." Now i ask you about a portion in Galatians and you look for an escape route? The issue is simple: Apostle Paul was addressing those who were ALREADY believers in the Messiah. Was he not? Therefore was he just stating HOW one can be saved or how not to live their spiritual lives after salvation? I will really want your answer on this though you seem to always avoid questions that you see challenge your position. |
? Stop reading tithes into every article you see abeg.It's high time you stop this folly of yours and grow up.