Artemisthe1st: king James, is triple times better than NIV, but it was compiled by the Anglicans, and there just abt 500 yrs old... I prefer using scriptures that av nt bn soiled by human hands... U knw say sm of d reasons we av many denominations is because of the number of different translated bibles... So i use the new Jerusalem bible, or the Armenian or the Septuagint, those were the first scripture compiled books used by the apostles themselves

Now here's the king James version
New King James Version (NKJV)- 1 Corinthians 15:24-28

24 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power. 25 For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet. 26 The last enemy that will be destroyed is death. 27 For “He has put all things under His feet.”[a] But when He says “all things are put under Him,” it is evident that He who put all things under Him is excepted. 28 Now when all things are made subject to Him, then the Son Himself will also be subject to Him who put all things under Him, that God may be all in all.

Jutresbien:

That's what the Jews claimed, not what Jesus said. We haven't exhausted the things he said about he and his father and you think we should start looking out how his listeners(not his disciples but his enemies) understood him? Naaaaaah. Now this is how his disciples understood him- MATT 16:16. 'In response Peter said to him, you are the CHRIST, THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD"

Re-read John 5:18. Unlike John 10:33, it wasn't the jews speaking now. It was John, the author, explaining what was happening.

And it's interesting that no one addressed my post here:

https://www.nairaland.com/1113061/believe-holy-trinity/1#13110823

Jesus was worshipped, prayed to, and praised and given glory.

If you worship, pray to, or praise someone other than God, just know you're an idol worshipper.

Chuksxp:

Re-read John 5:18. Unlike John 10:33, it wasn't the jews speaking now. It was John, the author, explaining what was happening.

The account simply states what the Jews said. Maybe its ur turn to explain JOHN 14:28, 1ST Cor 11:3 and the many other scriptures that categorically say that GOD IS GREATER THAN JESUS

Chuksxp:

Re-read John 5:18. Unlike John 10:33, it wasn't the jews speaking now. It was John, the author, explaining what was happening.

But who said that Jesus was making himself equal to God? Not Jesus. He defended himself against this false charge in the very next verse (19): “To this accusation Jesus replied: . . . ‘the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees the Father doing.’”—JB.
By this, Jesus showed the Jews that he was not equal to God and therefore could not act on his own initiative. Can we imagine someone equal to Almighty God saying that he could “do nothing by himself”? (Compare Daniel 4:34, 35.) Interestingly, the context of both John 5:18 and 10:30 shows that Jesus defended himself against false charges from Jews who, like the Trinitarians, were drawing wrong conclusions- NAMELY THAT HE CLAIMED HE WAS EQUAL TO GOD

Am nt a bible geek bt sm wr in d old testament reads "in d begining was The Word, The Word was wit God nd The Word was God", sm wr in d new testament reads "and The Word was made Flesh nd dwelt among us"

Chuksxp:

Re-read John 5:18. Unlike John 10:33, it wasn't the jews speaking now. It was John, the author, explaining what was happening.

John was explaining what the Jews thought.

Actually, Jesus is not the only one to be called son of God. Angels are several times called the sons of God (e.g. Job 38:7) since they had no fathers, being directly created. Likewise, Adam was called the son of God (Luke 3:38), because he was directly created.

Jesus, of course, is far special from the other sons of God because he is "the only begotten Son of God", far above Adam and angels. Something the Jews also misunderstood.

Chuksxp: And it's interesting that no one addressed my post here:

https://www.nairaland.com/1113061/believe-holy-trinity/1#13110823

Jesus was worshipped, prayed to, and praised and given glory.

If you worship, pray to, or praise someone other than God, just know you're an idol worshipper.

I didn't see it earlier. I'll respond after you say whether the titles ALMIGHTY and MIGHTY mean thesame thing. And if not, which is greater.

Jutresbien:

The account simply states what the Jews said. Maybe its ur turn to explain JOHN 14:28, 1ST Cor 11:3 and the many other scriptures that categorically say that GOD IS GREATER THAN JESUS

C'mon. Relax and read that passage. John wasn't repeating what the jews said. He was explaining what was happening.

As for John 14:28 and 1 Corinthians 11:3, I've explained it earlier. I believe there's still an order in the Trinity. Furthermore, though Jesus was God, Phillipians 2 says He became a human being and a servant. That's why He prayed to the Father, ate food, slept, etc. So, of course His human nature would worship the Father. The Bible even says He was made lower than the angels.

Chuksxp:

Of course they killed Him. Their hearts were evil. They saw the Light and despised the Light because they loved their darkness.

So they lacked real understanding na.

TroGunn:

John was explaining what the Jews thought.

Actually, Jesus is not the only one call son of God. Angels are several times called the sons of God (e.g. Job 38:7) since they had no fathers, being directly created by God. Likewise, Adam was called the son of God (Luke 3:38), because he was directly created.

Jesus, of course, is far special from the other sons of God because he is "the only begotten Son of God", far above Adam and angels. Something the Jews also misunderstood.

Everything you have said here is scriptural and I agree. HE IS SO SO SPECIAL,HE'S THE ONLY ONE WHO IS 'ONLY BEGOTTEN SON', 'FIRST BORN OF ALL CREATION'-COL 1:15, AND HE'S 2ND IN COMMAND ONLY TO GOD-1ST COR 14:26-28

LemonBoy1: Am nt a bible geek bt sm wr in d old testament reads "in d begining was The Word, The Word was wit God nd The Word was God", sm wr in d new testament reads "and The Word was made Flesh nd dwelt among us"

LOL. Yep. Both in the new testament. John 1:1 and John 1:14

Jutresbien:

Now this is interesting. GOD DIED FOR US! The 3 GODS OR 1? And there are inseperable? So who raised them(or him) from the dead?

The being or person part is just English. I'll have to use a dictionary and get back to you.

did you know the bible said a man would leave is parents and cling to his wife and they shall become one Flesh?
God is a being with three persons, as simple as that.

@ChuksXP
Just like Trinitarians today, the
Jews thought that Jesus was
claiming to be God, but Jesus
defended this accusation with the
following words in John 10:34-36 34 "Is it not written in your Law, 'I have said you are gods' ? 35 If he called them 'gods,' to
whom the word of God came and
the Scripture cannot be broken
36 what about the one whom the
Father set apart as his very own
and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy
because I said, 'I am God's Son' ? So the Jews accused Jesus of
saying he was God and instead of
agreeing and saying something
like "Yes I am God" Jesus
defended himself with the
statement "You are gods and then he stresses that he was
claiming to be the Son of God."
Many Christians still make the
same mistake today. Read John 10:27-36

Chuksxp:

LOL. Yep. Both in the new testament. John 1:1 and John 1:14

tnk U my bros, so wats d debate stil about

Jutresbien:

I didn't see it earlier. I'll respond after you say whether the titles ALMIGHTY and MIGHTY mean thesame thing. And if not, which is greater.

No, they're not the same. My guess is, you're probably heading to Isaiah 9. Yes, Jesus was called mighty God. But even the Father was also called mighty God several times in the old testament. Does that strip Him of His "Almighty-ness"?

EDIT:

Let's not forget Jesus said He had all authority on heaven and on earth. Sounds like Almighty to me.

tevinsolt:

did you know the bible said a man would leave is parents and cling to his wife and they shall become one Flesh?
God is a being with three persons, as simple as that.

I don't think you understand what that even means. Okay if a man leaves his father and mother to stay with his wife does that really make them the same being? The wife is still subject to the husband just as Christ is subject to Yahweh

Todaynatoday: @ChuksXP
Just like Trinitarians today, the
Jews thought that Jesus was
claiming to be God, but Jesus
defended this accusation with the
following words in John 10:34-36 34 "Is it not written in your Law, 'I have said you are gods' ? 35 If he called them 'gods,' to
whom the word of God came and
the Scripture cannot be broken
36 what about the one whom the
Father set apart as his very own
and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy
because I said, 'I am God's Son' ? So the Jews accused Jesus of
saying he was God and instead of
agreeing and saying something
like "Yes I am God" Jesus
defended himself with the
statement "You are gods and then he stresses that he was
claiming to be the Son of God."
Many Christians still make the
same mistake today. Read John 10:27-36

Son of God or God, all join. If I say I'm the son of a man, then automatically I'm claiming to be a man, right? Likewise, by saying He's the Son of God, Jesus is claiming to be God.

Please answer this qestion. Why was Jesus worshiped?

Chuksxp:

LOL. Yep. Both in the new testament. John 1:1 and John 1:14

He was with God, so he couldn't have been the same person he was with. So two persons are referenced here. Isaiah said Jesus would be called Mighty God. He is, however, not the Almighty God, who is superior to him. That's the crux of the issue.

John 1:1 does not show equality or that they are the same person. Other Bible verses clearly show that God is the head of the Christ. Jesus also clearly said the Father is greater than him.

If you agree that God the Father is above Jesus, then there's no argument. And you do not believe the Trinity. You need to check the definition of the Trinity by it's creators - Athanacean (sp?) creed they call it, I think.

Chuksxp:


Son of God or God, all join. If I say I'm the son of a man, then automatically I'm claiming to be a man, right? Likewise, by saying He's the Son of God, Jesus is claiming to be God.

Please answer this qestion. Why was Jesus worshiped?

What is the difference between MIGHTY and ALMIGHTY? Which is superior?

Plus u need to get a more encompassing word, the angels are sons of God(n therefore GODS according to you), Adam was also referred to as son of God(and therefore God, according to you). So there are definitely not just 3. You just showed that TRINITY IS FALSE.

TroGunn:

He was with God, so he couldn't have been the same person he was with. So two persons are referenced here. Isaiah said Jesus would be called Mighty God. He is, however, not the Almighty God, who is superior to him. That's the crux of the issue.

John 1:1 does not show equality or that they are the same person. Other Bible verses clearly show that God is the head of the Christ. Jesus also clearly said he Father is greater than him.

If you agree that God the Father is above Jesus, then there's no argument. And you do not believe the Trinity. You need to check the definition of the Trinity by it's creators - Athanacean (sp?) creed they call it, I think.

I agree. No one said they were the same person. One God: three persons.

You say John 1:1 does not show equality. Please tell us what it shows.

Jesus said He had all authority on heaven and on earth. Sounds like Almighty to me. In Revelations He calls Himself the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end.

“I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty.” ~ Revelation 1:8

When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. I am the Living One; I was dead, and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades. Revelation 1:17,18

I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. Revelation 22:13

Chuksxp:

I agree. No one said they were the same person. One God: three persons.

You say John 1:1 does not show equality. Please tell us what it shows.

Jesus said He had all authority on heaven and on earth. Sounds like Almighty to me. In Revelations He calls Himself the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end.

“I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty.” ~ Revelation 1:8

When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. I am the Living One; I was dead, and now look, I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades. Revelation 1:17,18

I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. Revelation 22:13

WHO GAVE HIM ALL THE AUTHORITY? PLEASE READ 1ST COR 14:24-28 BEFORE YOU RESPOND.

Jutresbien:

What is the difference between MIGHTY and ALMIGHTY? Which is superior?

Plus u need to get a more encompassing word, the angels are sons of God(n therefore GODS according to you), Adam was also referred to as son of God(and therefore God, according to you). So there are definitely not just 3. You just showed that TRINITY IS FALSE.

I addressed your question earlier:
https://www.nairaland.com/1113061/believe-holy-trinity/5#13114002

Almighty is superior. The thing is, Jesus was called both Mighty and Almighty in the Bible. See Rev 1:8 and Isaiah 9. Even the Father was called Almighty and Mighty. So, it's all the same.

Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. The only capital 'S' we see in the Bible.

Todaynatoday: I don't think you understand what that even means. Okay if a man leaves his father and mother to stay with his wife does that really make them the same being? The wife is still subject to the husband just as Christ is subject to Yahweh

a woman being the helper to her husband doesn't disqualify the fact they're both Human by worth
a boss being higher than his employee doesn't make him more of human or the employee less a human

my dad is higher than me but we are still coequal in the sense that we both have the ability of doing what a human can do. as simple as that bro

Chuksxp:

I addressed your question earlier:
https://www.nairaland.com/1113061/believe-holy-trinity/5#13114002

Almighty is superior. The thing is, Jesus was called both Mighty and Almighty in the Bible. See Rev 1:8 and Isaiah 9. Even the Father was called Almighty and Mighty. So, it's all the same.

Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. The only capital 'S' we see in the Bible.

JESUS has never been referred to as ALMIGHTY COS HE'S NOT. Google REV 1:8 and confirm that that verse refers to His father.

tevinsolt:

a woman being the helper to her husband doesn't disqualify the fact they're both Human by worth
a boss being higher than his employee doesn't make him more of human or the employee less a human

my dad is higher than me but we are still coequal in the sense that we both have the ability of doing a human can do. as simple as that bro

so u dont agree that JESUS IS EQUAL TO HIS FATHER?

Artemisthe1st: king James, is triple times better than NIV, but it was compiled by the Anglicans, and there just abt 500 yrs old... I prefer using scriptures that av nt bn soiled by human hands... U knw say sm of d reasons we av many denominations is because of the number of different translated bibles... So i use the new Jerusalem bible, or the Armenian or the Septuagint, those were the first scripture compiled books used by the apostles themselves

You mean your bible is written in Aramaic, Greek & Latin? Bros you try O°˚˚˚ can I come and see dat ya Bible...

Jutresbien:

JESUS has never been referred to as ALMIGHTY COS HE'S NOT. Google REV 1:8 and confirm that that verse refers to His father.

First off, a version of my Bible which shows Jesus' words in red, shows that verse in red.
Secondly, when you read the whole context you'd see the emphasis was on Jesus.
Thirdly, He said who is, was and is coming. Who is coming back?
Fourthly, Jesus calls Himslef the Alpha and omega again towards the end of Revelation.

Chuksxp:


Son of God or God, all join. If I say I'm the son of a man, then automatically I'm claiming to be a man, right? Likewise, by saying He's the Son of God, Jesus is claiming to be God.

Do you know that the angels were also called sons of God, did/does that make them God? Jesus never explicitly claimed to be God. If He was God, He would have said so clearly but rather He called himself the Son of God.

Please answer this qestion. Why was Jesus worshiped?

Because God ordained Him and exalted Him to the highest position and told us(by us here, I mean every creature created by God) to worship Him.

Just look at this scripture:

In a loud voice they were saying: “Worthy is the Lamb, who was slain, to receive power and wealth and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and praise!” ~ Revelation 5:12

Please just think about this for a moment. Who dares accept such worship, other than God? If Jesus wasn't God, this would be blasphemy in the highest. God said, His glory He would share with no one. Yet, we see the angels giving Jesus all the glory. Jesus is God.

Todaynatoday:
Do you know that the angels were also called sons of God, did/does that make them God? Jesus never explicitly claimed to be God. If He was God, He would have said so clearly but rather He called himself the Son of God.
Because God ordained Him and exalted Him to the highest position and told us(by us here, I mean every creature created by God) to worship Him.

So you mean it's right to worship Jesus? I didn't know you worshiped Jesus. Awesome!

I wonder how many other non-Trinitarians here who also deem it ok to worship Jesus. Any one else?

Again, Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. Notice 'Begotten' and capital 'S'

Jutresbien:

so u dont agree that JESUS IS EQUAL TO HIS FATHER?

my post was explaining how Jesus can be the son of God and God at the same time