Ileke-IdI:


You do know that Asians have no group cohesion right?

There's as much ethnic hatred in China/India than in Nigeria.

I doubt Nigeria's problem is lack of group cohension, infact Nigerians are closer to each other out of Nigeria than inside Nigeria. I think Nigeria's problem is fast success (fast money).

Is India, and China the same country?

shymmex:



^^^ Laugh at that!

You can't really use that as evidence of Black folks arriving in the UK. Indian slaves were also moved to the UK at about the same time.

Ileke-IdI:


You do know that Asians have no group cohesion right?

There's as much ethnic hatred in China/India than in Nigeria.

I doubt Nigeria's problem is lack of group cohension, infact Nigerians are closer to each other out of Nigeria than inside Nigeria. I think Nigeria's problem is fast success (fast money).

There is group cohesion amongst Asians. I see it everyday amongst the Koreans, Chinese and Vietnamese students at my grad school each day. They study together, they look over each others notes etc. Even though there is not much cohesion between their respective countries, when they come to a foreign land, they seem to gravitate to each other.

The Chinese and Indians do not even consider themselves the same "race." China considers itself the progenitors of Korea, Japan and other Asians countries, but not India.

Nebeuwa:

Nice! I support this 100%.

Where I live, I support black owned businesses as well. We need to learn how to keep wealth within our community. Why is it that Koreans in the U.S. own every hair products stores in urban areas? It is stuff like that, which boggles my mind.

Blacks have been trained to feel that they cannot do business. When they look at their history we see slavery and colonization we don't see any great empires that we had. So we have an inferiority complex which makes us feel inferior so we are mental slaves. We need freedom from mental slavery. We must unite, join the movement: http://www.facebook.com/pages/THE-REUNION-OF-BLACK-FAMILY-WORLD-WIDE/137580649597223

shymmex:

Is India, and China the same country?

Asians ==> India and China .

I specifically used those two as examples because they're two of the largest Asian groups in UK and USA. Someone was just correcting you and you want to jump on my post without reading clearly? Don't go there.

Nebeuwa: I have to love the Nigerian spirit. We all enjoy competing with ourselves in anything we do. But can we not have more group cohesion, so we can take on [size=18pt]Asians[/size] and other groups?

shymmex:

The thread is about violent crime, not fraud. Don't derail the topic.

@ Shymmex, Maybe you should go and read the post again,or let me clarify it for you since you are have trouble reading. In summary it's about Nigerian's commiting crime and suffering from crime(no specifications as you've incorrectly alluded).It's also about gangs and the possible correlation of the above with the offender's background(family) and geographical location (U.K vs U.S.A).
So Mr wiseguy(not) it ain't a derailment but an expansion of the topic.

Nebeuwa:

Nice! I support this 100%.

Where I live, I support black owned businesses as well. We need to learn how to keep wealth within our community. Why is it that Koreans in the U.S. own every hair products stores in urban areas? It is stuff like that, which boggles my mind.

It wasn't always like that,
I can remember in the early nineties when 125th in Harlem had black owned beauty supply stores, fast forward 10 years later I'm walking store after store and I'm tired of seeing Mr Wong's face and that of his brother in every store i walked into.The only black owned store as of 7 years ago was owned by a guy from Senegal who had customers walk in and fly out!!

Unfortunately his store didn't have the latest stuff people feel they wanted or needed I wonder if he is still in business.Mr Wong from Korea can afford to purchase all the stuff because he comes from a country where they always give back to their own community,so if biz is slow he only needs to bring it up to and his uncle's cousin's nephew will be willing to help him boost his business.

Same way it's disturbing that black folk have a very high number of ordering Chinese what happened to good old soul food be it Naija or any other African cuisine? It's just easier ordering those dumplings and fried rice from Feng's restaurant

Katsumoto:
You can't really use that as evidence of Black folks arriving in the UK. Indian slaves were also moved to the UK at about the same time.

I was referencing those who arrived after slave trade to do menial jobs, some of them became aristocrats e.g Olaudah Equiano. Blacks have been here for a long time, and naijababe insinuating that most black people arrived here in the 80s and 90s - is disingenuous.

Krucifax:
@ Shymmex, Maybe you should go and read the post again,or let me clarify it for you since you are have trouble reading. In summary it's about Nigerian's commiting crime and suffering from crime(no specifications as you've incorrectly alluded).It's also about gangs and the possible correlation of the above with the offender's background(family) and geographical location (U.K vs U.S.A).
So Mr wiseguy(not) it ain't a derailment but an expansion of the topic.

The OP created the thread because of the Nigerian kids jailed for murder.

Freesia: @ Nebeuwa,
You asked some questions and received some answers but your responses have turned to be contradictory.

Visiting a place and living in a place are two different things,you say you visited London,did you travel anywhere else? there is more to England than just London,and you may be surprised to hear this but not all successful Nigerians live in London.Many might work in the city but commute to other towns you know like some people work in New York but commute to Jersey or CT

Having lived in both sides of the Atlantic I have seen first hand that race plays the biggest role in both countries but that hasn't stopped hard working and determined Africans from getting to where they want to be in both continents

Loaded post. You sum up the OP's confused agenda succinctly and also establish what most well-travelled folks know to be the undeniable truth. Some black basketball players swanking around with $100 million dollar contracts , in the USA, is not proof of anything when we consider that a Nation should be deemed comparatively more successful than others in respect to how it meets the needs of the majority. Can it be said that the USA meets the needs of its average black population better than the UK does? Not at all. Events such as the flooding of New orlean shows how extremely disenfranchised some black folks are even if OP , clearly fond of generalising, want to play Ostrich to suit an obviously shallow agenda.

Ileke-IdI:

Asians ==> India and China .

I specifically used those two as examples because they're two of the largest Asian groups in UK and USA. Someone was just correcting you and you want to jump on my post without reading clearly? Don't go there.

Chinese are not the majority in the UK - when we say Asians in the UK, we're talking about India, Pakistan, and Bangladesh. UK is different from USA, and our terms are different. India, Pakistan, and Bangladesh used to be the same country.

You're the one jumping into what you don't understand.

shymmex:

[size=18pt]Chinese are not the majority in the UK[/size] - when we say Asians in the UK, we're talking about India, Pakistan, and Bangladesh. UK is different from USA, and our terms are different. India, Pakistan, and Bangladesh used to be the same country.

You're the one jumping into what you don't understand.

Who said they were the majority?

PS: Are you typing with a clown hat on your head?

Do you understand what "two fo the largest GROUPS" means?

shymmex:

The OP created the thread because of the Nigerian kids jailed for murder.

Are you not ahsamed to say this? OP never hinted at this when he started the thread and in fact, if I remember correctly, he only alluded to what you say about 6 pages into the thread when he was backed into a corner. Do you think Nairalanders are mind readers like you and the OP? Most of us can only speak based on what is submitted in writing and not anything else.

shymmex, are you not ashamed?

Ileke-IdI:


Who said they were the majority?

PS: Are you typing with a clown hat on your head?

Do you understand what "two fo the largest GROUPS" means?

STFU if you don't know what people are talking about. Are Chinese people visible in the UK?? You don't live in the damn country, or probably has never been there - yet you want to argue with those who live there.

Chinese are nowhere near the one of the largest groups here.. There are more Iraqis in the UK than Chinese, that shows how small the Chinese community is out here.. You jumped into a discourse without understanding what people meant, when they said "Asians" - yet you're still arguing.

Go take a nap!!

Gbawe:
Are you not ahsamed to say this? OP never hinted at this when he started the thread and in fact, if I remember correctly, he only alluded to what you say about 6 pages into the thread when he was backed into a corner. Do you think Nairalanders are mind readers like you and the OP? Most of us can only speak based on what is submitted in writing and not anything else.

Uncle, it's common sense. he created the topic after seeing the thread about the three Nigerian kids jailed on Friday for murder. You don't have to be a mind reader to know why he created the thread.

Gbawe:

Loaded post. You sum up the OP's confused agenda succinctly and also establish what most well-travelled folks know to be the undeniable truth. Some black basketball players swanking around with $100 million dollar contracts , in the USA, is not proof of anything when we consider that a Nation should be deemed comparatively more successful than others in respect to how it meets the needs of the majority. Can it be said that the USA meets the needs of its average black population better than the UK does? Not at all. Events such as the flooding of New orlean shows how extremely disenfranchised some black folks are even if OP , clearly fond of generalising, want to play Ostrich to suit an obviously shallow agenda.

Don't get me started with the health Insurance stuff in the US
paying through your teeth just to see a doctor if you don't have the "right Insurance"
while some white folk in the UK are whinging about the NHS,they need to see how it feels paying for your hospital bills from your pocket across the pond,some don't know how good they've got it compared to their continental cousins in the good old U S of A

Why are people still comparing two foreign countries they have no stake in?? Go fix Nigeria, and stop comparing!!

NHS this, NHS that - can you compare the taxes the citizens of the two countries pay monthly?

Let's stick to the topic!

shymmex:

STFU if you don't know what people are talking about. Are Chinese people visible in the UK?? You don't live in the damn country, or probably has never been there - yet you want to argue with those who live there.

Chinese are nowhere near the one of the largest groups here.. There are more Iraqis in the UK than Chinese, that shows how small the Chinese community is out here.. You jumped into a discourse without understanding what people meant, when they said "Asians" - yet you're still arguing.

Go take a nap!!

That's because you took the stats yourself. No they're not visible, they're wearing invisible capes. ode.

1. You had a problem with "/"

2. You had a problem with China and India being amongst the largest ASIAN populations in the UK.

You need to argue with someone to sound smart or sth?

Ileke-IdI:


That's because you took the stats yourself. No they're not visible, they're wearing invisible capes. ode.

1. You had a problem with "/"

2. You had a problem with China and India being amongst the largest ASIAN populations in the UK.

You need to argue with someone to sound smart or sth?

Ok, Mrs. "Know all."

Are you not the same chic measuring people's Yoruba-ness?? You're stuck up, and you need to calm your arse down. It seems you know more than everyone, even in places you have never been to. You probably know more about my family, than me - psychic..

Nebeuwa: I have to love the Nigerian spirit. We all enjoy competing with ourselves in anything we do. But can we not have more group cohesion, so we can take on Asians and other groups?

Now your mischief and fickleness is in full view here to the shame of the likes of Shymmex and brixtonyute who swallowed your deciet to the extent of accepting your deceptive Jerry Springer-style stage that demeans them but entertains you and others.

You claim to have started this thread in search of understanding your fellow Nigerians and their 'peasant' existence in the UK yet, even as I was never fooled from page one because of your propensity to generalize unreasonably, you now want a 'Kumbaya' unity of black folks to "take on Asians and other groups"?

Dude, go and find a hobby instead of using naive and disgruntled Britons like Shymmex and Brixtonyute to get your kicks. I saw through you from the start and you have succeeded in making a fool of yourself. that tends to happen when the agenda was always one of deception to begin with.

shymmex: Why are people still comparing two foreign countries they have no stake in?? Go fix Nigeria, and stop comparing!!

NHS this, NHS that - can you compare the taxes the citizens of the two countries pay monthly?

Let's stick to the topic!

Yet you're arguing about Asian groups and what not.

Have you also forgotten that this are Nigerian youths we're talking about?

shymmex:

shymmex: Why are people still comparing two foreign countries they have no stake in?? Go fix Nigeria, and stop comparing!!

NHS this, NHS that - can you compare the taxes the citizens of the two countries pay monthly?

Let's stick to the topic!

Mr Shymmex the topic has already been battered in the first few pages,it's done and dusted,
The poster asked,compared,generalized and asked again but still stood by what he believes,what more is there to add?
A short visit to london,a quick look in the international news and he has misinterpreted a few things here and there

Ileke-IdI:


Yet you're arguing about Asian groups and what not.

Have you also forgotten that this are Nigerian youths we're talking about?

You need to look at the CONTEXT my argument was argument was about. I never made reference to the countries - my argument was based in context of what "Asians" mean in the UK.

Accept you're wrong for the first time on NL - and please don't question my Yoruba-ness.

shymmex:

You need to look at the CONTEXT my argument was argument was about. I never made reference to the countries - my argument was based in context of what "Asians" mean in the UK.

Accept you're wrong for the first time on NL - and please don't question my Yoruba-ness.

Wrong about what?

No, your initial post to me was to argue about India and China being the same country, just so you can have something to rant about.

Ileke-IdI:


Wrong about what?
No, your initial post to me was to argue about India and China being the same country, just so you can have something to rant about.

Madam Ileke and arse, will never cease to amaze me on NL.. You said they don't get along, the way Nigerians get along - and I reminded you that they're not the same people, so why should they get along?

Where did I compare them in my post?

shymmex:

Madam Ileke and arse, will never cease to amaze me on NL.. You said they don't get along, the way Nigerians get along - and I reminded you that they're not the same people, so why should they get along?

Where did I compare them in my post?

now you want to argue about me saying they dont get along?

Lemme clarify for you ehn:

Within Chinese groups, there's a major and minor groups. there's even more discrimination amongst them than we have in Nigeria.

Within indian groups, there's more division based on ethnicity and shade of skin.

Remember, I go to school with a large population of these people. I know what they say and they're worse off than Nigerians.

So competition amongst Nigerians is not the main issue or cause of criminal wave.

What else do you want to rant about now?

Typical ☺₣ NL, any thread that has more than 5 pages has most likely been derailed, just a group ☺₣ people flinging insults at each other and useless statistics, mtcheewww.

Abeg wetin be the topic again? I lost y'all in page 3....#zooms off to avoid any possible insults#

Nebeuwa: Gbawe -

You asked me if I have ever been to the UK? The answer is yes, I spent a summer in the UK a few years ago staying with family members. And I've seen firsthand the "gangsta culture" that is pervasive amongst black youth in the UK. I was quite taken aback by it, because these black youth in the UK try to imitate the hip hop culture that is present in the United States, which I found amusing.

England is smaller than the United States, but I believe there are more Nigerians living in the UK than there are in the US. I could be wrong though.

That being said, you cannot deny the fact that many British of Nigerian descent are finding themselves in the news committing heinous acts. Was it not a couple of days ago that three Nigerian youth killed a young man in cold blood in the UK? I hate to say this, but stop living in lalala land and wake up and smell the coffee, or tea if you like. Something needs to be done about this wave of criminality that is not only impacting Nigerian youth in the UK, but black youth in general in that country.

This is not about competition between Nigerians in the UK and Nigerians in the US, because there is no competition. We in the US have more opportunities to succeed than those in the UK. Affirmative Action is one example.

both yourself and brixtonyute are right.

coogar:
contrary to what you think, britain is one of the most multi-cultural country you can think of.
every race is accepted. it's no biggie. we don't have hilly-billy rednecks or white supremacists nonsense
you guys deal with over there. yes, racism still exists but it's so negligible, it can be ignored.

the usa is not immigrant friendly than the united kingdom, that is farcical!
canada have more opportunities for immigrants? this is becoming a joke now.
i am sure afghanistan and somalia have more opportunities too.

You must be smoking on some good weed!
Because WE ALL KNOW that's a lie!

Katsumoto:

Isn't it safer to know your enemy than your enemy who is pretending to like you but killing you silently?

How do you ignore racism in the UK?

lol good question.

Gbawe:

Now your mischief and fickleness is in full view here to the shame of the likes of Shymmex and brixtonyute who swallowed your deciet to the extent of accepting your deceptive Jerry Springer-style stage that demeans them but entertains you and others.

You claim to have started this thread in search of understanding your fellow Nigerians and their 'peasant' existence in the UK yet, even as I was never fooled from page one because of your propensity to generalize unreasonably, you now want a 'Kumbaya' unity of black folks to "take on Asians and other groups"?

Dude, go and find a hobby instead of using naive and disgruntled Britons like Shymmex and Brixtonyute to get your kicks. I saw through you from the start and you have succeeded in making a fool of yourself. that tends to happen when the agenda was always one of deception to begin with.

@Gbawe, why are you so freakishly defensive?.....are you one of the Queen's royal family in disguise??...lol

Anyway, it doesn't take much to know Nebeuwa was talking about "take on Asians and other groups" by blacks in the vein of excelling and outshining them.

Also, even as you're very successful in the Uk with a couple of your friends as you said, that is not a reason, why we should dwell on our laurels and not push on to break the glass ceiling (posing questions when we think our youths/we are going in the wrong direction), earning more, been in prominent and recognized positions(in a higher %) and also hoping and working on how it will become true for more percentage of blacks in the Uk

quote author=Nebeuwa]There seems to be a wave of criminality that is impacting some British of Nigerian descent. Everyday, we hear news of another young Nigerian either committing a crime, or being the victim of crime in the United Kingdom. What I want to know is what is the problem?

The same cannot be said of Nigerians who live in the United States. It is very rare that you hear about a Nigerian in the United States being involved in a gang. It is so rare, that I have never heard of such, even though I know it probably does exist. Are there any differences between the Nigerians in the United States and Nigerians in the United Kingdom?

I have my own hypothesis, in which Nigerians in American want to differentiate themselves from African Americans who are often seen at the lower levels of United State society, but Nigerians in the United Kingdom do not have that luxury to differentiate themselves from other black groups in the UK since they are all recent arrivals.

Another hypothesis that I have is that there are more opportunities for Nigerians born in the United States than Nigerians born in the United Kingdom. The U.S. is more of a merit based society, even though it is being eroded compared to the United Kingdom when it depends on not only your social class, but also your pedigree.

Are there any other reasons that you can think of? [/quote]


[size=16pt][b] First and foremost, you're biased and have no clue of what you're talking about here and we know where your loyalty lies.

Also, you can not compare America with the UK e.g. in History, Land space or population. America is hundred times larger than Uk in land and people. Also, in History, she's relatively a young Society compared with the Uk - UK has been going on for at least, since 10th Century.

America is Country built by the Slaves where as Uk is a Country developed with Slave Money. Blacks did not built United Kingdom rather, they physically built America because, the slave Masters who were mainly British ensured, slave ships were forwarded straight to the Americas thus, not many of the those ships stopped over, on British shores.

Check your British History you'd be more informed than here! That's why the British are adamant in keeping and dictating what happens in their Country irrespective of the fact, they embraced EU and diversity.

Yes, the American systems and that of United Kingdom may seem similar but they operate differently in terms of their Laws and Social provisions/care.

For curiosity sake, I just want to know when did America become a 'Merit Based Society'? Does it include the 'enshrined Affirmative Action' that enabled Blacks and other ethnic groups to jump the queue for Equal Opportunities without having to work hard to earn it? ?Merit it.

Before, Affirmative Action came into place, Blacks Americans were suffering badly because the system failed to provide Equal Opportunities for all in the first place? So, Affirmation Action was enshrined in their Law to ensure employers allow everyone equal employment opportunities and better life, ok!

However, the equivalent in the Uk is the Equal Opportunities Act 1972 as Amended in recent years. Equal Opportunity cases can present difficulty proving in Tribunals though, people still succeed in doing so, and winning their cases/compensations.

That aside, take out the Affirmative Action measures in America and see whether Black Americans can compare with those in the Uk in terms of hard work, they wouldn't stand a chance yet, with those measures, American Blacks are not much better off, than those in the UK.

Also in comparison, the level of crimes there are much worse than the Uk - There are many Nigerians languishing in American jails (also in British jails but not as much!!)and that's the reason why you don't hear much about recent crimes committed by Nigerians over their - and how could you hear about that, when they are all in jail?? Check it out!

And those who are not yet in jail, are taking precautions and learning their lessons from what happened to their brother and sisters out there.

Why? Because, American Courts sabi how to hand-over jail terms - theirs are usually between 30 - 1000 yrs minimum, ask people. That's one of the main reasons you don't hear much about crime among Nigeria youths out there. They're clever ain't they? Who wants to waste their lives in jail without parole?

On the other hand, Uk sentencing is much, more softer - they get parole even if they committed murder. Depending on the case, it usually about 30yrs (or worst case scenerio life) and with good behaviour in prison, you serve half of that and out with parole.

Now, you can see why? That's why some idiotic youths in the UK are taking advantage of the system here to join the locals in committing crimes thinking it's fun.

But what do you mean by Nigerians trying to differential from the stigma of poverty or lower level status attached to African Americans? And, who told you that all British Blacks are recent arrival - in your dreams?

Listen man, Nigerians have been in the Uk since 16th Century - so Blacks have been there since then therefore, your assertion does not hold at all. In addition, in the West - Black is black irrespective of who you are, and no one can't pull that out, no matter how hard they try! Societies changes with time - see how long its taken a black man to enter the White House? Well, I wonder when one would enter No. 10 D. Let's hope!

However, Nigerians in America can try as hard as they can, until society changes i.e. changes their beliefs and values, they are just wasting their time.

Finally, you mentioned about the Class system in the Uk - look, every Society has it own class system including Nigeria. Nobe una dey worship and idolate una Government Ministers wey dey steal our money, come carry them for 'Ghana Must Go' and una go dey praise them! Haba!!! How about some tribes that have Kings and Emirs - are theirs not categorised as class?

So man, check your source of information - and try and get it right next time.[/b][/size]