₦airaland Forum

I don't excuse the nonsense that goes on in Nigeria. I am only pointing out the fact that the US should face their own problems and stop their predictions as regards other countries.

When Nigerians are ready they will change Nigeria. For now they are not yet ready based on the comments and understanding of the problems in Nigeria by Nigerians.

benlay:
I don't believe in Nigeria again, we should stop deceiving ourselves, US  has predicted that Nigeria will be divided in 2015. let's wait for the unfolding drama,

You mean the same USA that did not know when planes were hijacked on 911 or when they gave visa to someone his father already reported as having strange/extremist agenda?

Or the one that claimed Saddam had WMD?

Please, do not pay too much attention on what USA says as they could be 100% as they have been on some issues in the past.

Good idea.

It is good we are beginning to realize that we cannot continue to wait for government for us to move forward.

When I built my inverter in order to stop wasting money on running generators many people told me I was wasting my time. This year will make it 6 years I have been without a generator and many businesses claimed they had to close shops due to power problems and when I hear them say this I feel sorry for them.

Now, everyone is talking about alternative energy, energy efficiency and conservation, more than 6 years after I started preaching these things.

As regards getting a blog for this initiative I can develop one that will be specific to the relevant activities needed rather than relying on a generic blog.

Something similar to www.justalternativepower.com like www.afamservices.com could be customized if need be. Put differently, I can develop that at no cost if you guys want it.

As for me, I will continue to do things I consider progressive especially when it comes to self reliance and need to produce or manufacture instead of importing almost everything when we can actually produce some of them.

With parts from a typical mechanic workshop one can build a wind turbine that will generate electricity without waiting for PHCN. Even fans and radios can be built without too much wahala only if we believe.

When I praise Sanusi people don't understand. Without his intervention things would have been really really bad.

Personally, once someone tells me he/she is a born again I dust my shoes and take off.

Beaf:
"There are insinuations that since Nigeria's driver's seat has been vacant, the country has run like a vehicle with a full load of passengers yet without anyone controlling its direction," said the nairaland.com news service. It warned there could be a "fatal crash" unless drastic measures are taken to put competent hands on the wheel.

Which one come be nairaland.com news service abeg?

chidichris:
i want wisemen like afam and co to comment on the missing president.
the muslims must be reminded of the 24hrs ultimatum for dead bodies to be buried so in case yar has died and refused to be buried, he shld forget heaven.

And who the hell are you to want me to comment on the nonsense you write on this forum? You are sick and you need help.

metal-gong:
Secretary of the Council of Ulamas and a foremost northern critic, Major Abubakar Umar (rtd), has fired another blistering attack on the northern elite, describing them as a disgrace, first to the religion of Islam, the north and Nigeria.

Major Abubakar Umar (rtd)? The newspaper no get editor?

This

myhouse:
Re: I Need A Ready Made Website,not More Than #30.000: And I Want: .com
« #8 on: October 09, 2009, 10:46 AM »

yawa-ti-de --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That I don't know but I am sure others may know and want to help.

Sorry I couldn't be of further assistance

does not in any way show that this

myhouse:
@ yawa-ti-de,you recommend this guy to me, now you have to be responsible for this

you guys should check this out

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-334695.32.html

translates to yawatide recommending anyone to you.

When people warn you guys about N5,000.00 websites or impossible features at ridiculously low prices you think they are joking.

ndu_chucks:
The  Jaunuary Coup was an Igbo coup, period!

With less than 18 hours into 2010 we still have Nigerians thinking in this way even when facts show otherwise.

Feel free to shout the reproduced content every morning into the ears of your children if that will make you happy and especially if that will help make you justify the killing of innocent Igbos by their neighbors, colleagues, friends etc.

Even though I believe in a larger nation with comments like yours I think the idea of separating and going our own ways may be the best.

However, you realize the fact that your agreement with anything or otherwise has absolutely nothing to do with the fact on ground.

mtam:
Are u saying that if i buy the domain from another hosting company and direct nameservers everything would be alright in about 48-72hours

Yes.

@Katsumoto,

Thanks for your comments.

Please, do not misunderstand me, I don't see everything as insult to the Igbos, I only point out what can be proven especially the glaring ones.

Do have a fruitful new year ahead.

Many thanks for your time.

Thanks for your response. You helped to explain other salient issues I left out and that will benefit all the parties.

As regards your comments with words like "COULD" or "THINK" I would reply thus - let us stick to the facts as we cannot think or claim to know what some of the participants had in mind and more importantly the Igbos never needed the military to help them progress as they were already doing well.

Comparing a possible military induced Igbo advantage to the current style where excellence is being sacrificed at the altar of mediocrity by having incompetent people appointed into office is a collective insult on the Igbo people as such never existed.

However, the Machiavelli quote could also be used by the Igbos that survived the massacres to kill non Igbos and I am sure no one would justify that. So, while some famous quotes may sound cool, in reality the acceptance could be catastrophic.

No one has monopoly of violence and I am sure that for the simple fact that you still find Igbos in all parts of Nigeria including where their brothers and sisters were massacred in the past without any reason goes to show that the Igbos do not harbor hate otherwise they would not venture into non Igbo states.

All the Igbos want are justice, fair play, equality and honesty. Let the best man win. No magomago, no wuruwuru QED.

citizenY:
Point of correction, there were no Igbos in the former Mid west.
Let somebody deny that.

Look for your history teacher (if any) and ask the person instead on committing avoidable blunders on a public forum.

So, we need not deny the ignorant statement at all.

1. The first coup was an Igbo coup

2. No Igbo officer died in the coup

3. There was no massacre of innocent Igbo men. women and children especially in the Northern parts of the country

4. That Ironsi (who foiled the coup and jailed the coupists) was spared by the coup planners.

Ok, you disagree with nos 1 and 4 above based on your response.

I also appreciate your preference for facts so we will base our agreements or disagreements on them, not speculation, abi?

1. The majority of the coup planners were Igbos with officers from other parts of Nigeria that are non Igbos.

A simplistic conclusion would be that the Igbos planned the coup but would this line of argument stand any serious scrutiny when officers (not even mentioning soldiers who were armed while Nzeogwu was not when he led them into the palace and these people were informed about what they were about to do) from other tribes took part in the coup?

2. These officers never represented the Igbos as they were career officers just as you have bankers today and as such claiming that they represented the Igbos is another blatant lie that should not be allowed to stand any day.

Do we now label arrested armed robbers for instance as representing the tribe majority of them represent based on simple arithmetic?

3. It is a well known fact that the Igbos (outside the military) were doing well in different sectors and as such do not need anyone to carry out a coup to help them in anyway. This is another important point that is being overlooked. Why would a people that are doing well want bloodshed to continue doing well?

The reality is that anyone that is doing well will likely lose out in any war so the actions of some of the officers cannot be said to help the Igbos in any form.

4. Ironsi not court marshalling the coupists cannot be equated to being part of the coup even though he foiled it and imprisoned the coup plotters.

May I also remind you that even in the military then the issue of coup was new as that was the very first coup so i doubt if there was any precedence for him to reference so as to kill them for people to stop alleging the coup plotters spared him.

5. Ojukwu never attacked anyone from the first coup to the second counter coup and up to the declaration of Biafra 3 days after Gowon created some states in order to weaken the Eastern region by using divide and rule hence the issue of abandoned properties and carving out of large portions of Igbo land and giving them to Rivers state.

So, Ojukwu in reality defended the Eastern region after declaring Biafra when Nigeria waged a war with the region.

I am glad that we are airing our opinions on these based on facts so that those who are not aware will be aware instead of the hate that is being spread from generation to generation based on lies and speculations of what the Igbos represented or what they did.

We must move ahead but not without setting the records straight and those responsible accepting responsibilities of their actions or inactions.

Bottom line is that the killing of over 30,000 Igbo people by their neighbors and colleagues cannot be justified anytime any day.

Katsumoto:
I agree with the above but do not understand the text in bold; please expantiate further. What facts were twisted and who twisted the facts? I may know what you are talking about but I am not certain.

Twisted facts

1. The first coup was an Igbo coup

2. No Igbo officer died in the coup

3. There was no massacre of innocent Igbo men. women and children especially in the Northern parts of the country

4. That Ironsi (who foiled the coup and jailed the coupists) was spared by the coup planners.

These are some of the twisted facts.

Katsumoto:
I meant no disrespect by that; I apologise if you take offence. Igbo is not derogatory and neither is chaps.

No wahala.

Katsumoto:
I agree with you. I have advocated previously on this forum that any region that does not feel a part of the nation should be allowed to go. Secession or disintegration should be part of any discussion or SNC. I am however of the opinion that we should strike at the heart of our problems and consequently be rid of the ills in our society.

There is a reason for this. Igbos are good at certain industries, Yorubas are good at certain things, the same for the Ijaws, hausas, Tivs, etc. If we iron out our difference, Nigeria will be better for it. Divided we fall. But to summarise, if one region wants to continue to deliberately marginalise other regions, then we should be free disintegrate Nigeria.

If the Igbos are periodically massacred for living and engaging in profitable enterprise in other regions of Nigeria, then I can not be-grudge them for wanting out.

I believe that a bigger nation would benefit everyone rather than balkanization of the country on the condition that fair play, justice and equity must be respected.

However, let us remember that we are not yet a nation hence the mutual mistrust amongst ethnic groups. Throw in the events between 66 - 70 and the deliberate plan to twist the facts and you get a dangerous scenario.

No one can undo what was done in the past but acknowledgement would help a great deal towards healing the wounds. I doubt if any Igbo man or woman wants to get paid for the massacres. Just acknowledgement and for once let the facts be respected.

A regular truth and reconciliation type of arrangement would help in this regard.

After all before the coup most of the officers had mentors from other regions and people trusted themselves irrespective of tribe.

I must agree that the coup created problems due to the execution but that can never justify the senseless killing of tens of thousands of people whose crime was  just being Igbos or from the then Eastern region.

The counter coup targeted officers and soldiers from Eastern region and most of the victims were even butchered in the prisons and you won't hear Igbos complaining about that because in the real sense it was a counter coup and meant to pay back in kind so to say.

But to kill innocent civilians who were friends, colleagues, neighbors etc based on what some soldiers did? I refuse to believe that anyone can justify that.

In fact, the very fact that it cannot be justified is the sole reason for the twisting of the facts concerning what happened. But, how long can you tell a lie? One day, the lie will collapse and wounds that should have been healed long ago would reopen as if they are fresh wounds.

GNBohr:
I have read and digested the comments on this thread carefully, sometimes going through them second or third time to comprehend the contents and assess the personality behind each commentaries. I only came out with one conclusion, we treat issues with a lot of emotional push. This emotional verge separates us into being called apathetic or sympathetic.

The issue on ground is operating at pedestal that convolutes apathy with sympathy resulting in reality. Look at it this way, no one under normal circumstances would wish evil of another. no employer would under normal circumstances lay off employees. Circumstances make people to do what on normal situations, they would not have readily done.

People do a lot of things, legally in this respect to survive including seeking employment. Those who are fortunate to start businesses whether early or later in life are not necessarily sharper, smarter or better endowed but circumstantially enabled. Besides it follows natural laws to be leaders and followers, poor and rich, masters and servants, employers and employees.

Misfortune can under any circumstance affect any person, group, business or nation. When misfortunes comes, natural laws expects us to look after each other and not necessary castigate. Misfortune could be accidental (controlled and uncontrolled) or man-made, and according to Murphy's Law, it comes when least expected.

Those affected by the misfortune of the banks into losing their jobs are just unfortunate to be caught in the web just as businesses can be unfortunate to be caught in other webs that lead to collapse or death.

What I do not subscribe to is for some people to over pity them instead of giving a supporting hand or for someone to be boasting about his non vulnerability to misfortune ( a joke). I want NAIRALANDERS to begin to suggest how those affected by the job losses can survive the setback and move forward with their lives. Counselling and pieces of advice on enterpreneural ventures, job opportunities, financial sponsorship of viable business ideas is what I want us to give to these people.

Enough of PITYING and BOASTING. GIVE HELPING HAND IN FORM OF IDEAS ON BUSINESSES AND OTHER SURVIVAL TIPS.

100% in agreement.

Almost all the problems we have in Nigeria can be solved by Nigerians and if we can look for ways to solve these problems we will be useful to the society and still make money while employing others.

I design websites, develop software and database driven applications. When I am not doing these I design, manufacture and install inverter backup systems.

I am neither a computer engineer nor an electrical engineer to be doing any of these. I read chemical engineering, practiced process engineering and project management before saying bye bye to paid employment.

Humility, willingness to learn and determination will help to succeed in any venture. Knowledge is out there for anyone that wants it irrespective of tribe, sex etc.

So, let them get out of their comfort zones, get their hands dirty on some problems around, try to solve them and make money in the process.

Katsumoto:
Afam,

We are all here to share opinions, educate, and learn at the same time. Why do you continue to call it justification even when I have condemned the unjust killings?

It is not a secret that the Igbos were doing very well in the North. I suspect, going by the trends that I have observed in my lifetime, that the Northerners would have been envious of the success of the Igbos. I am not sure if I have heard of a call to kill the Igbos and take their properties but I can not doubt that it is true. The question I have for you is this, 'was the call before or after the first coup?'.

Before the coup.

Katsumoto:
If there was a call to kill the Igbos, why did they remain in the North, why were they not protected? Why are there still so many Igbo people in the North today? The North has not changed much since the 60s; if anything, they strike at southerners for the most flimsy excuses.

This is the problem. When the Igbos want out Nigeria will not let them go. When they try to survive by setting up businesses in regions outside their own people wonder why they have to go to other regions to do business. I guess this answers your questions.

I am sure if you conducted a survey today and ask Igbos anywhere in the world if they would want a separate nation you would find out that the majority would answer in the affirmative due to the many injustices, unequal opportunities and deliberate stagnation of the typical progressive nature of the Igbos.

Now, can Nigeria allow them to go? If yes, then they should. If no then they should stop wondering why they are complaining.

Katsumoto:
Now a question for the Igbo chaps; Dede, Afam, OnlyTruth, and others
Does a coup carried out by predominantly eastern officers targeting non-igbo political and military elite appear to have an objective of making the Igbo the predominant power brokers in Nigerian politics and military circles? Please be objective, we all seem to be educated and enlightened individuals. I have repeatedly admitted that the Igbos were targeted unjustly and that the massacres can be called genocide.

Igbo chaps? I will attempt to answer your question when you leave out the Igbo chaps stuff as that was not necessary. I do not even know your tribe but it does not affect our discussions so you can do without labeling people.

sayhi2ay:
nice


You can move "Hello Guest Login | Signup" to the right end of the nav box

You mean remove from current location and move to another location? If yes, why? I wanted everything to be easy to access and straight forward.

Thanks though for the comment.

afam4eva:
Wow, the site is cool, Aren't you JUST the man.

Thanks. Still trying to make the site better and more useful to Nigerians.

Katsumoto:
Afam
I have stated my opinion which is that the killings were not justified.
The analysis I gave is from the point of view of an observer. How did I justify the killings? I was only trying to paint a picture of what must have fuelled the hatred of the Northern soldiers for the Igbos. Something was responsible for the hatred that fuelled the murder of fellow citizens. Do you think the Northern soldiers were waiting for the coup of January so that they could use it as an excuse to annhilate the Igbo? I don't think so. The events of Jan 66 pushed them to that point.

About 3-4 thousand people died on september 11. How many Iraqis and afghans have died since then? Tens of Thousands and they are still dying daily.

Was Ironsi not spared? Did anyone attempt to kill Ironsi? If he was killed, would he have foiled the coup? There could be many reasons for sparing Ironsi. The Northerners argue he was spared because he was Igbo like most of the plotters. Some argue that Ironsi was part of the plot. I don't know how true that is. Even though Ironsi foiled the coup, he resisted pressure from the Northerners to try the coup plotters. Maybe the plotters spared him, assuming that he may spare their lives as he was Igbo like them. But we do know that Ironsi was not killed by the Jan 66 plotters.

If you do not accept my analysis, please feel free to enlighten me on why the Northerners attempted to annhilate the Igbo and why Ironsi was not killed. I am most interested in getting an Igbo view on this.

Let me make this crystal clear.

Tens of thousands of Igbos (or any tribe for that matter) cannot be killed for the actions of a few soldiers that do not represent them unless there are other reasons for the massacre.

If your justification is ok then I believe it makes sense for the Igbos to target and kill non Igbos especially those that killed their own in the massacres? Does this make sense to you?

sleek_p:
If you agree the events of 66 there goes your answer.

In other words Afam is saying the North over reacted.

The problem you have is that you are a tribal bigot and cannot see anything unless you are using a tribal prism to view it.

If you call the killing of innocent people by their own neighbors and friends as over reaction even when the victims had not connection with the actions of a few soldiers then you are living in denial.

There is no justification for the massacres.

However, feel free to justify it but remember that what goes around comes around and if in your lifetime a similar thing happens to your people don't just complain.

Why do we try to twist the facts about the events between 1966 and 1970 if it is as simple as the north over reacting?

I guess you have not heard of a call to kill Igbos and take their properties in the North long before the war by politicians who believe the Igbos came to their lands to do business and they are making progress and buying up properties everywhere? If you have not heard about this please try to learn about it as I won't be pointing you to any material.

Katsumoto:
15 prominent figures will never be equal to 30,000 innocent easterners. But you have to take certain points into context.
1. Just like you have argued about certain issues which are central to Igbo culture, you also have to consider the god-like statures of the murdered northerners. Ahmadu Bello was a descendant of Uthman Danfodio; Balewa was PM
2. When Nzeogwu went after the Sardauna, he shelled the building not caring about the lives of the women and children in the building.
3. The murder of Maimalari and largema by Ifeajuna was taken badly by the northern soldiers. Maimalari was the most senior Northern officer in the Army and was Ifeajuna's boss. Maimalari escaped Okafor by jumping over a fence but flagged down Ifeajuna not knowing Ifeajuna was one of the coupists. Ifeajuna promptly shot him. Removing Maimalari's name plate at Brigade HQ almost caused a riot because the Northern NCOs refused to believe he was dead. Largema, CO of the 4th Battalion at Ibadan came to Lagos to attend Maimalari's party and was staying at a hotel in Ikoyi. Largema was away from his troops; there was no reason to kill him. He was killed by Ifeajuna who was aware of his accommodation due his relationship with Maimalari. Largema's body was thrown down from the floor he was staying on. Ifeajuna was a protege to Maimalari
4. Ifeajuna warned his cousin Zik about the coup. Zik went to chill in the Caribbean on health grounds. He was president and Igbo and everyone around him in power was being slaughtered

I have delibrately left out others, prominent Yoruba, killed that day because the Northerners would not have acted because of the Yoruba elite murdered.

Like I said, killing 30,000 innocent Igbo because of the murder of prominent northerners can not be justified but there is no law that says that when you kill my one son of mine, I can not kill all your children. I may be so enraged at losing my favourite son that I decide to kill your whole family. I still believe that the actions of jan 1966 set off a chain of events.

You cannot be speaking from both sides of the mouth. The Igbos who complain about the massacre of innocent men, women and children based on what some soldiers did (not even all of them were Igbos) and even if they were all Igbos they never represented the Igbos considering their profession do so because there is no justification for that.

Everyone knows that the events of 1966 led to the problems and massacres including the war but can you justify the killings?

If you can then do not deny those who complain and cry out for the senseless loss of lives.

If you cannot or do not justify it then make it clear.

You cannot claim that the killings were not justified and yet in the same post go about trying to justify the killings.

Meanwhile, your take on reprisals is ok with me as I believe so but in doing that I will hit back at those responsible and not anyone that remotely comes from the same village or region with the person I want to attack. Doing so would mean that you are no different from those who visit their neighbors to slaughter them just because in another region someone from your tribe was killed based on a personal matter between the person and another.

We must rise above the pettiness and hidden hate that are usually masked with general statements or we should be bold enough to support a position whether right or wrong.

You also stated that Ironsi was spared and yet he foiled the coup. What manner of analysis is that?

And the company in question remains a secret up to this day?

Fair enough. Well stated. Don't have any facts on the actual amount of money paid the disengaged bankers but the point has to be made that they could be better off outside what they see as comfort zones.

asha 80:
Which of the station branches because the AIT international is showing on my laptop.

Alagbado, Lagos

Onwan may be too harsh with his choice of words but I agree with him in principle that graduates should do more than look for white collar jobs in an economy where almost every single problem is an opportunity to offer a solution and make money doing so.

Many (if not all) of the disengaged bankers were paid off but they seem to be silent on that part making it seem like they were fired or sacked and that is part of the insincerity of the average Nigerian.

If the main hope of graduates to survive is to work in banks or oil companies then Nigeria will be worse in no time.

All the rich men and women in the world today make money by providing solutions to problems and if we are really sure of our education then we can do same.

This is not about being lucky. It is about a choice, a choice that remains 100% open till tomorrow.

Back to the topic,

Sanusi has done well and well meaning Nigerians know that. The intervention is in order and should be supported.

Heard on TV (MITV) about 30 minutes ago that there were reports of fire at AIT premises this afternoon.

And the station has been off.

Any news on this?

Seems there is no active web hosting account for that domain name as the domain name is ok. Contact the guy you paid and demand to check the web hosting (if you paid for any).

From Dede1,

@Afam

I meant whenever the issue of Biafra shows up on this forum, few novices will immediately identify such issue as Igbo. It is evidential fact on this board that many Nigerians had wished that memories of Biafra disappear into the tinny air. Nigerian government had changed the name of a landmark from Bight of Biafra to Bonny. However to these skewed and centrist views, the voice of contrarian (a person who expresses a contradicting viewpoint, esp. one who denounces the majority persuasion) should not be censored.      

Despite the fact I borrowed the numerated words and phrase from your previous post, please do not deduce that my subsequent post was a disguised attack on your person.

No wahala. I was surprised because part of my post was reproduced in your write up and my views have never opposed any valid complaints and wickedness by anyone, group or nation.

No one can silence those who feel hurt and who are hurt by injustices by fellow Nigerians. I have been a victim of such injustices so would not stop voicing them out especially when others want you to stop with the funny suggestion that we should move forward without even acknowledging the mistakes and errors of some people in the past.

However, my opinion is that we should focus on the issues and let us not allow those who derail threads with insults to continue to do so.

I disagree with all manner of people on all manner of issues outside this forum and we don't bring in insults because there is usually mutual respect and as long as everyone understands that things become easier to handle.

Kilonso:
I don't understand people o, was there any failed bank? And what makes you think the arrested are the only ones guilty of their punishment? Was there ever a time your brother went to bank and could not withdraw money?

Ok, now I understand your point. You wanted to see banks fail before you know we had issues with some of the banks. Allowing them to fail would have been disastrous and am I sure you would turn around to blame Sanusi for not acting in his capacity to prevent the failure. Now he has acted to prevent some banks from failing you are blaming him.

What do we really want in Nigeria? I am sure some of us would complain of too much electricity if we see steady power supply in Nigeria.

otawa:
You lost all credibility!

God sent?

You never had any.

Kilonso:
@ Afam: There are some things one isnt so sure of, and one is that those banks would have collapsed within 18 months. All these years they didnt collapse so stop that blasphemous talk about Sanusi being God-sent because we havent felt anything positive as a result of the actions he has taken order than the news that our banking ogas were fraudstars , or have you? tell me one?

18 months is even a lot of time. If UBA that did not have the type of problem the likes of Oceanic and Intercontinental had and it is disengaging staff then it should be clear to you that some of the troubled banks would have gone under in no time.

Were the banks healthy enough to guarantee depositors funds?

Good move even if permanent measure as long as it helps in the area of security. Passengers would (or should) be happy to even strip naked before boarding a flight if that will prevent one from blowing up a plane mid air.