₦airaland Forum

shadeyinka:
NO Body relays tomorrow. You can only relay (prophetically) the content of tomorrow!

Exactly!

shadeyinka:
Acts21:11 was an example of prophecy I gave you when you said the future doesn't exist

Acts21:11 is a prophecy of the future for Paul (what will happen in the time yet to be spent/the future).

Acts 21:11 is NOT time.

Hurray! ShadeYinka is back. Now you see, we've all been discussing on the content and not the 12 am per say. I mean the "what will happen in the..."
Now, do you perfectly understand my view?

advocatejare:
Did you see the he was like Son of Man?

In visions, that means he had the appearance of a man.

advocatejare:
Son of Man is just a title in fulfilment of the prophecy that Jesus would bruise the head of Satan the serpent. He's divine, how do you explain his conception without his mum having intercourse with a man?

Wetin consign me?
All I need is a proof with the old testament only of "Divinity become humanity" of Jesus.

shadeyinka:
The future is dynamic and changeable. What the Seer sees are only what I have done with my present set of choices within my available constraints.

You said this. Can you see 11 O' clock? Can you see 12 O' clock?
You can't see time, it's abstract. You can however see "what happened in time"...
Again, we've been talking about content.

shadeyinka:
But if that is the case,
1. What is prophecy

Acts 21:11:
"And when he was come to us, he took Paul's girdle, and bound his own hands and feet, and said, Thus said the Holy Ghost, So shall the Jews at Jerusalem bind the man that ownes this girdle, and shall deliver him into the hands of the Gentiles."

You said this again... Is Acts21:11 time or what will happen in time?
Again sir, everyone including you have been focused on the content.

shadeyinka:
What is prophecy if not relaying the FUTURE?

You said this ooo.
What shall we say then, that prophecy is relaying tomorrow and not what will happen tommorow.
Boss Boss, we've been focused on the content I don't know why you are bringing something new now.

shadeyinka:
What then is Prophecy if the future does not exist?
Why is the book of Revelation speaking of a nonexistent future?

Let me remind of your very own words...
See this!
We both know prophecy is not about time alone, Prophecy is "what will happen In Time "

shadeyinka:
Slow down and analyse what you've just written.

The Past is Spent TIME duration
The Present is Current TIME duration
The Future is Yet to be Spent TIME duration

The Past contain so many event events that no one in the world know a fraction: how much more the future!

Are you ShadeYinka? If not, please give the phone to ShadeYinka.
Since the page 1 of this thread, everyone's been talking about the "content" in time whether past, present, or future.
What I am saying is - The future has no content! Except If God declares this or that to happen in it.

advocatejare:
"In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all nations and peoples of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed" (Daniel 7:13–14).

Fulfillment:
"You will conceive and give birth to a son, and you are to call him Jesus. He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High. The Lord God will give him the throne of his father David, and he will reign over Jacob's descendants forever; his kingdom will never end" (Luke 1:31–33).

This is more of Humanity (son of Man) become divinity (God).
The challenge was " Divinity become humanity "

MuttleyLaff:
1. Did God make salvation possible (i.e Did he declare salvation) or was it Just something He knew of by foreknowledge?
Response:
It is a combination of both

He declared it and thus knows what he himself declared. Yes or No?

2. Is Christ a different person from the lamb of God?
Response:
God is "I AM that I AM" God will be whatever is necessary for Him to be[/size]

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Kosi problem.

shadeyinka:
Crucifixion:
Is to kill through asphyxiation by hanging a person by his limbs usually on a wooden contraption.

Slay(slain):
To kill

Crucifixion is just one method of killing.


Was the LAMB of God in Rev13:8 crucified?
That was the question!

The Lamb of God is the same as Christ. The word slain in that context was no different from "being crucified".
Go and read John 1:29 and John 1:36.
Also, see Peter's words here
1 Peter 1:18-20 For you know that it was not with perishable things such as silver or gold that you were redeemed from the empty way of life handed down to you from your forefathers, 19 but with the precious blood of Christ, a lamb without blemish or defect. 20 He was chosen before the creation of the world, but was revealed in these last times for your sake. (NIV)
We both know that the precious blood was shed on the cross of Calvary.. And that same blood is the Lamb's blood.
I should have asked you - Who slained the lamb? But you see, I don't intend to be the one pushing people into errors because of a foundational doctrine.

shadeyinka:
I am not everybody!
I do not understand this your view. For my own God is omnipresent in all time (past, present and future) and all space. Therefore, He sees the future as easily as He sees the past and present.

Talk to me, what do you mean by God sees the future ?
Also, Define prophecy...
Let me not lie for you, it's almost as if another person is using your account to reply me. This is not the same person I engaged yesterday.

shadeyinka:
Aren't you confused?

No sir, you are the one confused.
I'm showing you how empty 11pm is without what will happen in 11pm.
You said- Yesterday, Last year, Last Decade is PAST
This current time is Present
Tomorrow, Next year and Next Decade is FUTURE...
As long as it doesn't entail "What will happen IN it, then we are all omniscient"....

shadeyinka:
.......
But
WHAT WILL HAPPEN IN TIME YET UNSPENT?

Kosi problem..
Let me oblige your new introduction.
You claimed - God foreknows what will happen IN the Future.
Now I am saying - There is Nothing like What will happen in the future ...
Are we cool now?
PS: Everyone except you understood this as my view.

Emusan:
About the Father - KJV: The eternal God is thy refuge, and underneath are the everlasting arms: and he shall thrust out the enemy from before thee; and shall say, Destroy them. Deu 33:27

KJV:  Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen 1 Tim 1:17

100%

About the Son - That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life; (for the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us) 1 John 1:1-2 KJV

John 1:1 "In the beginning was the word"... Is the WORD a Person?

About the Holy Spirit - How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? Hebrews 9:14

I concur.

You can see how scripture said THE THREE PERSONS are ETERNAL.

Is your word a person? So far, I see an Eternal Spirit and an Eternal God. As for me, I see God as " Higher than a Person"...

Hurray! I know the future everybody. I know the future!
The future is 11pm!
The future is 12am!
The future is tomorrow!
Huray! I know the past everybody! I know the past!
The past is 8pm!
The past is 7pm!
The past is yesterday!
The past is 9/9/2019!
Hurray! I know the present!
The present is 19 minutes after 10
Hurray! I am omniscient !
ShadeYinka, do you now see the kasala you've just created?
Infact MuttleyLaff is Omniscient, even DrLiveLogic is omniscient, even you yourself are Omniscient!

shadeyinka:
When was Jesus Christ crucified?
Who crucified Him?
Why was He crucified?

Was the Lamb of God slain from the foundation of the world CRUCIFIED or SLAIN?

Excuse me sir, you are going off board.
To be slain is to be killed. To be crucified is to be killed. They are the same thing in this context! Read your Bible again.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
God who speaks to things which are yet not as though they are. Christ has not been crucified yet but God speaks as though he has died and redeemed us already. That's it!
Please you are really shaking so many things by still trying to hold on to this nonsensical future theory.

ShadeYinka, Define Prophecy.

shadeyinka:
The future isn't "what I will do" nor "what will happen" but the TIME not yet spent.

Compare this...

So, when we ask the question: "Does God know the future?", What we are asking is :
"Does God know about our unspent time and what we'll do with it/what will happen in it?

...with this. You just contradicted yourself sir.
You said the future is not " what I will do",,, now you are saying that the question: "Does God the future?" Means that "Does God know about our unspent time and what we will do with it/what will happen in it?
You see, you were not able to separate the " what I will do" and the "time not yet spent".
You yourself said - Time is an INTERVAL OF EVENTS! In fact, I will go search for it and quote it again.

[color] Can there be HOPE if there is no FUTURE? [/color]

Yes sir! That is where hope is fully at work!
If there is a future, why do you pray?
Do you see why atheists bash many Christian easily?

Jer 29:11:
"For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, saith the LORD, thoughts of peace, and not of evil, to give you an expected end ."

Is the expected end not in future?

See your last question again... Now compare that with the book of revelations... Is the book of revelation just TIME YET SPENT or WHAT WILL HAPPEN IN TIME YET SPENT?
Weren't you the one asking me What the book of revelation is, if a future does not exist?
Abeggii... We all have the same definition or perception of future, I don't know why you are trying to invent something new.

shadeyinka:
This is the summary of your talk!

My position:

Let's clear this please: Are you saying future is "a period of time" I.e. 10pm-Infinity Pm or future is "what will happen in a period of time" I.e what will happen from 10pm-Infinity PM?
Also sir, Define prophecy please.

shadeyinka:
Not different.
However, at a point in time about 2000 years ago, the Word became fully flesh. The Flesh from the Word is called the Anointed One, Messiah or Christ Jesus.

Why then did you juxtapose between them and said "Christ was slain 2000+ years ago while the lamb of God was slain before the foundation of the world?"

DrLiveLogic:
1/ how Light had to produce a light(lucifer) that produced darkness. Where then did the darkness or its possibility arise from, if its grandparent is Light without darkness.

A perfect potter produced a perfect pot. The pot having freewill dropped itself from the table and cracked from the impact on hitting hard on the floor, thus, the perfect pot became imperfect.
God (who is light) created Lucifer (light bearer). Lucifer by free will separated himself from the source of light, thus Lucifer became dark.

2/ Also what does God then mean by claiming to know good and evil in Genesis 3:22.

God knows what it is for something to be Good, He knows also what it is for something to be evil. The knowledge of Evil does not make you evil.

3/ after a sinner chooses, does God then know the sinner's present and also his end which according to you isn't part of God's foreknowledge?

Yes He does. However, I wasn't supposed to answer you.

4/ If he then knows, has he then updated his knowledge and become more than what he initially was? and yet many other questions.

I can ask you the same question that before God foreknows and after He foreknows, has he updated his knowledge?
He spoke to Abraham after He laid Isaac on the altar saying - Genesis 22:12
"And he said, Lay not thine hand upon the lad, neither do thou any thing unto him: for now I know that thou fearest God, seeing thou hast not withheld thy son, thine only son".. That's the word of God himself.

5/ how God predicts the future of both the good and the evil, like Jacob and Esau etc., before they even make their choices

Israel going into Egypt is God's orchestration.
Abraham being a father of many nation is God's orchestration.
When He declares, will he then have no knowledge of what he has declared?

6/ whose names are not in the book of life and why do these people exist since they are not part of God's foreknowledge.

No literal names were written. To us, Christ died 2000+ years ago, To God, Christ died before the foundation of the world. His realm is NOW! No later, no tommorow.

7/ and how they could create a reality that didn't exist in God. Is the end then different from the beginning?

Those that believe in future are those who will have an error with this. The end of a point is the same as it's beginning. Which reality? You still don't get it, you can never directly create darkness, if you want darkness, take light away.

8/ What is meant in Isaiah 45:7, how God forms light and creates darkness and good and evil.

The psalmist said "Light and darkness are the same to you". God's darkness is Light. God's evil is still Good.

9/ As for his case with Isaiah 46:10, he ended up just replacing God's forthtelling with foreknowledge which are two distinct attributes of God and he does both. Forthtelling is how he brings his foreknowledge to play in this movie.

I did not replace anything. We all agree that Declaring is predetermining and not foretelling.

MuttleyLaff:
What make you think that God doesnt beforehand know what in the next 5 minutes you'll be doing next, huh?

Again, this was everyone's definition of future. Now, someone is trying to say that His definition of future is different from mine.

MuttleyLaff:
God knows what you'll do in 5 years, time, 10 years time and even 100 years time, if you get to live that long

Is this not your definition of future? "What you will do in 5 years, 10 years time"....
It's like Shade is now saying Future is 5 years time and now " what I will do in 5 years time".

MuttleyLaff, I also want to know where you stand on this;
1. Did God make salvation possible (I.e Did he declare salvation) or was it Just something He knew of by foreknowledge?
2. Is Christ a different person from the lamb of God?

MuttleyLaff:
"¹⁴Then God commanded,
“Let lights appear in the sky to separate day from night
and to show the time when days, years, and religious festivals begin;
¹⁵they will shine in the sky to give light to the earth”—and it was done.
¹⁶So God made the two larger lights, the sun to rule over the day
and the moon to rule over the night; He also made the stars.
¹⁷He placed the lights in the sky to shine on the earth,
¹⁸to rule over the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness.
And God was pleased with what He saw.
¹⁹Evening passed and morning came—that was the fourth day."
- Genesis 1:14-19

Oinn, on the 4th day of creation, time was properly instituted and done for man's benefit and standpoint, so for man, to easily observe, aided with the creation of two great lights (i.e. Genesis 1:16)

If time stops, then, it means 11pm will cease to exist, that what by 11pm that was meant to happen, will not have the chance to come about, hence nothing will happen because there's no 11pm for the event to happen on condition of it happening at/by 11pm. Future ceased, because 11pm, proxy time, was terminated. What's operating, since after the obliteration of time, is perpetuity

You and Shadeyinka are using Man's measurement of time. I am Using God's measurement of time. There is nothing like 11pm to God, everything is NOW!
That I why He says, I am the Beginning And at the same instant, The Ending....

ShadeYinka, please I want you to clarify this:
Is Christ a different person from the lamb of God?

shadeyinka:
I am sorry, I didn't mean to be harsh on you. But your usage or definition of future isn't convectional. We are not on the same page at all.

The future is just a YET to be spent time duration. That was why I asked you simple questions about 11pm tonight knowing that it is a time yet to be spent. Is 11pm tonight then the past, present or future?

Your definition of future is definitely different from what everybody know as the future and that is why you make categorical statements like "tomorrow doesn't exist".

Figuratively:
Tomorrow (the future) doesn't exist is different from tomorrow is yet to exist.

Tomorrow (the future) doesn't exist is an affirmation that the sun will not rise and time will somehow freeze just before tomorrow. Tomorrow doesn't exist only in a state of annihilation

Tomorrow is yet to exist is a true statement of NOW without an affirmation that tomorrow wouldn't be.

The future isn't "what I will do" nor "what will happen" but the TIME not yet spent. When that time comes, them we can do things and things can happen.

So, when we ask the question: "Does God know the future?", What we are asking is :
"Does God know about our unspent time and what we'll do with it/what will happen in it?

[color] Can there be HOPE if there is no FUTURE? [/color]

Jer 29:11:
"For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, saith the LORD, thoughts of peace, and not of evil, to give you an expected end ."

Is the expected end not in future?

Do me a favor sir. Kindly juxtapose my supposed view of what the future is and everyone's (or your own) view of what the future is.

shadeyinka:
FUTURE
A period of time that is to come:

Examples:
1. Sometimes I worry about the future.
2. I wonder what the future holds for (= what will happen to) you and me.
3. I'm sure at some point in the future I'll want a baby.
4. We need to plan for the future.
5. Do you plan to leave New York in the distant future or the near future?
6. I can see those two getting married in the not too distant future (= quite soon).

© Cambridge University Press 2020

https://www.google.com/amp/s/dictionary.cambridge.org/amp/english/future



I believe you have seen the confusion you manufactured for everyone.

You should first have defined YOUR meaning of FUTURE before asking the question "does God know the future"?

Of a truth, you've wasted everybody's time!

We all know we are talking about things that are yet to happen...
Why the sudden change of discussion?
See you painting me like some time-waster.. According to you, "God foreknows What I will do by 11pm" and to you that is what the future means.
Now, why are you now saying that 11pm is the future and not what will happen by 11pm.
I don't like this at all... You just shifted goalpost and threw shades at me.

shadeyinka:
The highlight is a direct contradiction of the scriptures

Rom 8:29:
"For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren."

No sir.
Did God foreknow salvation or did he declare salvation?

II. When was Christ crucified / when was the Lamb slain?

Christ was slain about 2000 years ago
The Lamb of God was slain from the foundation of the world.

I am not getting you o. Are you saying Christ is different from the Lamb? Christ is the Lamb of God nah...

What happens to those who nail Christ to the cross twice? Paul made mention of this...

I believe you've seen my response before.

If such can happens, It is forever impossible for them to be restored again.

Yes sir, although close to impossible, such can happen.

But do you notice that you don't answer questions? Yet you churn out yours. That is not how fruitful discussions are made.

Is there any of your question I skipped? I don't think so sir.

shadeyinka:
I guess your definition of FUTURE is different from the convectional.

Tomorrow is Future!
Is this true or false?

Tomorrow is not future! What will happen tommorow is what you call future.

11pm this night is future!
Is this true or false?

11pm is not future! What will happen by 11pm is what you call future.You still see time from a man's standpoint and that's why you continue to think that there is anything like "future"

If there is no future, is 11pm or tomorrow coming?

You yourself said "time is the interval between events"... It is not a tangible quantity but an abstract one.