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Christianity Etc › Re: Answers To Jehovah Witnesses Devil-inspired Questions About JESUS CHRIST!!! by brocab: 12:42am On Dec 24, 2017

Tomorrow is a day the Catholic Church had made Christmas day as a day to worship the Sun, but the rest of the world see's the 25th is a day to celebrate the Son.
One day of the year, by law we celebrate the birth of Christ, some people celebrate Santa-it doesn't concern us what day Christ was born-it matters we recognise that Christ is alive in our hearts-now and forevermore.
This is a time the world had made Christmas to be, when we spend our time with Him, family and friends, some prefer to be alone, others have no choice, ask the Lord to open a door for you, so you won't be alone for His day and your day will be celebrated the way you decide it to be.
{Matthew 22:9-10} So go to the main highways that lead out of the city, and invite to the wedding feast as many as you find.’ Those servants went out into the streets and gathered together all the people they could find, both bad and good; so the wedding hall was filled with dinner guests [sitting at the banquet table].But go out unto the streets and find as many as you can find and bring them into my place

Christianity Etc › Re: Nigerian Man Starts Preaching In London Bus And Is Told To Shut Up by brocab: 12:51am On Dec 23, 2017*

{Luke 9:1-27} See the problem is, Jesus trained His disciples, to go out unto every nation and preach the gospel.
One would think the man preaching the gospel on the bus, wouldn't fear everybody, but with all the advertising the news caste around the world about terrorism, people feared him, and I am sure everyone that preaches outside the square are treated the same , not because they preach the gospel, its because people these days are told by the authorities religion causes terrorism.
One time people could rely on the Church for protection 'these day's when we hear of insolent's such as these, the Church go's into a silent attack! I remember the day's the Church would stand up against television companies over swearing on Tv programs, the Church would stand up-against music against God!
This man was told to shut up "In London its a different story-every thing bad that happens in London, they call it a terror attack-in my country Muslim men mowing down 7 plus people in a built up area in cars, they blame it on drugs, or a mental state of mind.
The secret society is lying to the world, and no-one takes any notice, but when a man preaches on a bus, everyone panics and the world around them is coming to an end..
Is anybody watching the news lately, Churches have opened up doors of survival 'Churches are led by Government authorities, tax free systems are pushing the Churches down further to be worldly, not spiritual?
In some countries many Churches are already underground, like most believers who are told to shut up, the Word of God is slowly but surely disappearing from the Hearts of many.
It's the few that stand up for Him" and I myself have had the experiences told by "Christians" to shhhhh, shut up, not because they disbelieve, it's because of the nations have continualed to broadcast lies against religion, and the world fears after it's own kind.

Christianity Etc › Re: Higher Everyday — Making Wrong Right by brocab: 10:32pm On Dec 22, 2017

Merry Christmas...

Christianity Etc › Re: The Pentecostal Church Verses The Catholic Church. by brocab(op): 9:24pm On Dec 20, 2017*

I see you have used these scriptures to follow up on you argument, you have already written down the answer, and it seems you are not reading what you have written, how can anybody caste out anything in anyone's name-if they refuse to believe? These men said I caste out the demon by the Jesus whom Paul preaches.
"First" these men weren't believers in Christ, they used this name, because Paul had shown them in JESUS NAME he can caste out demons, Paul knew if He didn't believe in Christ-he didn't have the power to do so. No-one can caste out demons without the name of Jesus, these men tried to say in the Jesus Paul preaches-they didn't believe in Jesus themselves, this is why they couldn't caste out the demon.
These Jewish priest didn't believe in Christ-they said, we cast out the demon in the name Paul preaches.
{Matthew 19:26} explains this perfectly-With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.
This means we can't do anything without Christ-no-one can caste out demons without believing it's His name all things are possible, man alone can't do anything without God, these men tried to caste out the demon without believing, priest do the same, they don't honestly believe, they could caste out demons in Jesus name; the evidence is there-God compel you, the saints commands you.
So this is what the demons said:{And the evil spirit answered and said, “Jesus I know, and Paul I know; but who are you?”}Paul preaches Jesus because he believed.
These priest had no authority to cast out anything, they were men preaching a gospel, that not even themselves truly believed the Messiah had come..
{Acts 19:13-18} Then some of the itinerant Jewish exorcists took it upon themselves to call the name of the Lord Jesus over those who had evil spirits, saying, “We[a] exorcise you by the Jesus whom Paul preaches.”
{14} Also there were seven sons of Sceva, a Jewish chief priest, who did so.
{15} And the evil spirit answered and said, “Jesus I know, and Paul I know; but who are you?”
{16} Then the man in whom the evil spirit was leaped on them, overpowered[b] them, and prevailed against them,[c] so that they fled out of that house naked and wounded.
{17} This became known both to all Jews and Greeks dwelling in Ephesus; and fear fell on them all, and the name of the Lord Jesus was magnified.
{18} And many who had believed came confessing and telling their deeds.
Footnotes:When in any crisis's, there's only one name that is above all other names, that can do any miracle, the priest use every other name besides Christ to caste out demons.

Jolliano:
Lol. Firstly, Christ is Jesus na. So don't act like He was not mentioned.

Secondly, using Jesus name =/= mentioning or saying Jesus name.
Using Jesus name = Acting with His authority. In the NT testament, how many prayers ended with/included "In Jesus' name"? Just 2. So are we to assume that all the other prayers where "In Jesus name" was not mentioned did not work?

Even your quotation shows it. In Acts 19:13 - 18, the Sons of Sceva actually mentioned Jesus' name and yet the demon didn't move because he didn't know them. Meaning, it is not by mentioning Jesus' name, it is by actually having his authority in you.

Thirdly, the movie does not give you a leg to stand on because the movie is not from the Church. Anyone can act and say whatever he wants, if you now decide to replace the Reality of The Church with the fiction of a movie made by people outside the Church, then that is your issue to contend with. I do not muddle up reality with fiction when discussing.

Christianity Etc › Re: Answers To Jehovah Witnesses Devil-inspired Questions About JESUS CHRIST!!! by brocab: 1:52am On Dec 18, 2017*

{Romans 8:13} for if you are living according to the [impulses of the] flesh, you are going to die. But if [you are living] by the [power of the Holy] Spirit you are habitually putting to death the sinful deeds of the body, you will [really] live forever.
Next question JW's do you believe, it's the Spirit of God who keeps us alive forevermore, or would you prefer to stay as you are? "Dead in the spirit, dead in knowledge, dead in Word and wisdom, dead etc etc etc..
{Romans 8:6-8} "Now the mind of the flesh is death [both now and forever—because it pursues sin]; but the mind of the Spirit is life and peace [the spiritual well-being that comes from walking with God—both now and forever] {7} the mind of the flesh [with its sinful pursuits] is actively hostile to God. It does not submit itself to God’s law, since it cannot, {8} and those who are in the flesh [living a life that caters to sinful appetites and impulses] cannot please God {9} However, {the believers} are not [living] in the flesh [controlled by the sinful nature] but in the Spirit, if in fact the Spirit of God lives in you [directing and guiding you]. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him [and is not a child of God].
This is laying down the law-so JW's which of the two do the prefer?
Do you JW's believe this>{Romans 8:14-17} For all who are allowing themselves to be led by the Spirit of God are sons of God.
{15} For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading again to fear [of God’s judgment], but you have received the Spirit of adoption as sons [the Spirit producing sonship] by which we [joyfully] cry, “[b] Abba! Father!”
{16} The Spirit Himself testifies and confirms together with our spirit [assuring us] that we [believers] are children of God.
{17} And if [we are His] children, [then we are His] heirs also: heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ [sharing His spiritual blessing and inheritance], if indeed we share in His suffering so that we may also share in His glory.

Christianity Etc › Re: Answers To Jehovah Witnesses Devil-inspired Questions About JESUS CHRIST!!! by brocab: 1:18pm On Dec 17, 2017

And when we witness, we go out unto all the world and preach the gospel, just by a push of a button in the comforts of our homes..
And In silents we do this> {Isaiah 42:1-3} Behold My servant whom I up hold, My chosen One in whom My soul delights, I have put My Spirit upon Him, He will bring forth justice to the nations. He will not call out nor shout out loud, nor make his voice heard in the street. A broken reed he will not break {off} And a dimly burning wick, He will not extinguish {he will not harm those who are weak and suffering} He will bring faithfully justice.

manikal:
https://www.nairaland.com/4230607/meditation-omnipresence-christ-mind#63322737

1 Like

Christianity Etc › Re: The Pentecostal Church Verses The Catholic Church. by brocab(op): 3:43pm On Dec 16, 2017*

At least the movie gave me a leg to stand on, and I do remember what the priest said to the demon God compel you.

Jolliano:
"I adjure you, ancient serpent, by the judge of the living and the dead, by your Creator, by the Creator of the whole universe, by Him who has the power to consign you to hell, to depart forthwith in fear, along with your savage minions, from this servant of God, N., who seeks refuge in the fold of the Church. I adjure you again, + (on the brow) not by my weakness but by the might of the Holy Spirit, to depart from this servant of God, N. , whom almighty God has made in His image. Yield, therefore, yield not to my own person but to the minister of Christ. For it is the power of Christ that COMPELS you, who brought you low by His cross. Tremble before that mighty arm that broke asunder the dark prison walls and led souls forth to light. May the trembling that afflicts this human frame, + (on the breast) the fear that afflicts this image + (on the brow) of God, descend on you. Make no resistance nor delay in departing from this man, for it has pleased Christ to dwell in man. Do not think of despising my command because you know me to be a great sinner. It is God + Himself who commands you; the majestic Christ + who commands you. God the Father + commands you; God the Son + commands you; God the Holy + Spirit commands you. The mystery of the cross commands +you. The faith of the holy apostles Peter and Paul and of all the saints commands + you. The blood of the martyrs commands + you. The continence of the confessors commands + you. The devout prayers of all holy men and women command + you. The saving mysteries of our Christian faith command + you."

And still there's nothing in here to say the priest used Jesus name-so who's name have they used-the power of Christ that compel you-"is this it? God the Father commands you, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit commands you, and the mystery of the cross commands you?
And the faith of the Holy apostles Peter and Paul and all the saints command you-could you explain to me, which of these names are casting out the demon?
Jesus name has the only power and authority to caste out demons, it is His name the Catholic Church have refused to use to caste out demons, there is no other name above that can caste out demons.
{Acts 19:15} Says this-One day the evil Spirit said: "Jesus I know and Paul I know""but who are you?
Do you honestly believe this actually works, you have priest that cast out demons, without using Jesus name? Do you really believe these demons would allow the priest to cast them out, without them using the power in the Lord name, You are dreaming.
Priest haven't got this authority nor the power to do so, do the demons leave, or do they just lay low for a while until the priest have gone, and after the house is sweep they come back bringing back with then 7 other spirits more evil then the first.

Jolliano:
Lol.
1. The movie does not give you a background of exorcism or knowledge about exorcism because it is not a movie by the Catholic Church. If you want to research exorcism, search for what the Church says it is and does, not what a movie or series says and does.

"God compel you" is not what the Catholic Church says during exorcism.
Here is an excerpt from the full EXORCISM prayer

"I adjure you, ancient serpent, by the judge of the living and the dead, by your Creator, by the Creator of the whole universe, by Him who has the power to consign you to hell, to depart forthwith in fear, along with your savage minions, from this servant of God, N., who seeks refuge in the fold of the Church. I adjure you again, + (on the brow) not by my weakness but by the might of the Holy Spirit, to depart from this servant of God, N. , whom almighty God has made in His image. Yield, therefore, yield not to my own person but to the minister of Christ. For it is the power of Christ that COMPELS you, who brought you low by His cross. Tremble before that mighty arm that broke asunder the dark prison walls and led souls forth to light. May the trembling that afflicts this human frame, + (on the breast) the fear that afflicts this image + (on the brow) of God, descend on you. Make no resistance nor delay in departing from this man, for it has pleased Christ to dwell in man. Do not think of despising my command because you know me to be a great sinner. It is God + Himself who commands you; the majestic Christ + who commands you. God the Father + commands you; God the Son + commands you; God the Holy + Spirit commands you. The mystery of the cross commands +you. The faith of the holy apostles Peter and Paul and of all the saints commands + you. The blood of the martyrs commands + you. The continence of the confessors commands + you. The devout prayers of all holy men and women command + you. The saving mysteries of our Christian faith command + you."

Do you see the only place where compel is used and how it is used?

2. Seeing as the Catholic Church was founded by Christ Himself on St. Peter and the Apostles with a promise that "Hell would not prevail" and that the Holy Spirit would always be with them to guide them, I would rather trust the CATHOLIC CHURCH than any other person, pastor or faith community.

So, it is protestants who should be wary of Matthew 7:21.

2. Let's stay on topic, please. Although it is normal for protestants to keep accusing Catholics of doing things without giving any proof of Catholics doing that, so I'm not surprised.
However, if you are talking about images, God still allowed the building of images o. The Bronze serpent, the Cherubim on the Ark of Covenant and the one in the Temple built by Solomon.

For the fourth commandment, be articulate and state your accusation plainly. We will then see if it is true or not.

Or if it's like that time you said Jesus forbade the use of "Father" and then I should you where His disciples and even Jesus himself used the word.

3. Guy, na wa o.
You first said Priests can not chase away demons. When I showed you that they can, you now switched to saying that is Satan that uses the Priests. You are just flying from argument to argument saying things that you can not defend.

Anyways, "A student is not above his teacher, or a slave above his master. A student should be glad to become like his teacher, and the slave like his master. If the head of the family has been called Beelzebul, how much more the members of the family! So, do not be afraid of them." - Matthew 10: 24 - 25

Also read Matthew 10:1-4 in addition to the verse 8 you are quoting. The people Jesus was talking to were the 12 Apostles, not every one of his followers. Apostles are not disciples. However, all Christians can conquer demons.

A question does come to mind though. If you agree that they were given this authority in Matthew 10:8, why don't you agree that they were given the authority to forgive in John 20:23.

Christianity Etc › Re: The Pentecostal Church Verses The Catholic Church. by brocab(op): 3:26pm On Dec 16, 2017

Here I go again, Now this time pay attention-In {John 20:23} Jesus tells His disciples, “If you forgive anyone his sins, they are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven." The very core of the gospel message is the truth that the way someone has their sins forgiven is by having faith in Jesus Christ as his or her Lord and Savior.
In {Acts 10:43-44} when Peter was sharing the gospel, he said, “Everyone who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name.”
Did you understand that? He said: Everybody who believes in Christ receives forgiveness of sins through His name.
{First John 5:1-5} tells us only he who believes in Jesus will overcome the world.
{Luke 5:20} says, “When Jesus saw their faith, He said ‘Friend, your sins are forgiven.
{Colossians 2:13-14} says Jesus forgave all our sins.
All these passages confirm that Jesus is the one who forgives sin, and He forgives all of our sins.
If we have had genuine faith in Him, someone else cannot later decide we are not forgiven one sin or another.
Only God can forgive sins, and Christ, being God, has the power to do so as well, but He never communicated any such power to His disciples, nor did they ever assume any such power to themselves.
The key to understanding the meaning of {John 20:23} lies in the previous two verses: “Again Jesus said, ‘Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you.’
And with that he breathed on them and said, ‘Receive the Holy Spirit.’” He sent them, as He is sending us, to bring the good news of the way to salvation and heaven to the whole world.
Jesus was leaving the earth physically but promised God would be with them in the person of the Holy Spirit living in them. As they proclaimed the gospel, they could honestly tell people who believed in that message that their sins were forgiven, and they could honestly tell people that did not believe in the message that their sins were not forgiven and that they stand condemned in God’s eyes.
Jesus said, “Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on him” (John 3:36)
You won't believe this but we today have the very same mission given to us! We are obligated to share the gospel message, the way to heaven, to others in the world, and we go about that mission with the Holy Spirit living inside us, guiding us as we share His truth.
We are obligated to tell people the only way to be forgiven is through faith.
Jesus said in {John 8:24} “If you do not believe that I am (God), you will indeed die in your sins.” This is the very core of the gospel message and the very heart of what we are to explain to the world. It was Jesus’ last command to His followers before He physically left the earth—carry forward the message of hope and save as many as will believe in Him.
Jesus preached a crucial message about forgiving our brothers, as God forgave us. We stand in grace, and He expects us to keep our hearts pure toward others, not holding grudges or harboring a spirit of unforgiveness, especially after He gave us such undeserved love and forgiveness at such a high personal cost to Himself! Jesus said those who have been forgiven much, love much (Luke 7:47)
He expects us to forgive others 70 times 7 times (Matthew 18:22) We are also told that if we are praying but hold something against anyone, we are to forgive that person so our relationship with God is right and righteous!
Your not here to learn, nor are you here to know the truth, but you come to me, preaching a twisted doctrine, I have written to many organisations who claim Christ built their Church above every other Church, while the rest of the believers in the body, sit in darkness waiting in fear until He returns. It blows my mind-when I hear different organisations such as yours, claiming to know Christ, and lie against the truth-its blasphemy to even think your priest have the power to forgive sins.

Jolliano:
Again, only God forgive sins. But He gave the Apostles the authority to forgive sins. Their authority is gotten from God's own. So when they forgive, it is not by their power that forgives but God through the authority he has given them.

JOHN 20: 23

Do I follow Christ or a Priest?
Lol.
“The one who hears you hears me, and the one who rejects you rejects me, and the one who rejects me rejects him who sent me.” - Luke 10:16

The Priests have been ordained as ministers of Christ and so they are our spiritual fathers just as St. Paul said he was on 1 Cor. 4:15.

How do I know who to follow and who not to follow? Simple.
"But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach a gospel to you besides that which we have preached to you, let him be anathema.
As we said before, so now I say again: If any one preach to you a gospel, besides that which you have received, let him be anathema." - Galatians 1: 8 - 9.

Anyone who teaches what cannot be traced to the Apostles is a FALSE TEACHER. So again, check what the Apostles taught and believed and see if it is different from yours.

Christianity Etc › Re: Answers To Jehovah Witnesses Devil-inspired Questions About JESUS CHRIST!!! by brocab: 1:38am On Dec 16, 2017*

Well if you can't see the fruit, then you aren't reading your bible, everything I have written is said in the Word of God.
And what is the commandment I have refuse to do? I have gone out unto the world to preach the gospel, I have shared the Word of God, and you say I am bragging, because the Word of God is the vine, and I am grafted in that vine, preaching the Word of God.
Because I explained to you what the Lord had done in me, He had changed me, I am a different person, you don't recognise it, "And what is the answer" because the spirit that is in you, isn't the same Spirit that is in me, If I was to come to you speaking my own language you would recognise it, because I would have the same spirit that is in you.
In what way had the Lord Changed me" His Word is written on my heart, His Word is preached through to you-that all the world will know that Christ sent me {John 20:21}
You deny the Word of God from another preacher man, who preaches to you In Jesus name, the way of the Lord, a way you haven't been taught-you call this hypocritical, because a branch that's connected to the vine, believes the Word of God in all his heart mind and soul..
{1 Samuel 10:6} The Spirit of the Lord will come powerfully upon you, and you will prophesy with them, and you will be changed into a different person.
That Christ had done great works in me, Christ had changed me into a different person.
But you haven't been changed, you are still that same person you started out to be, but if Christ was in you, you will know, how Christ changes us from the inside, but you don't know, because you aren't grafted into the vine, and the Word of God isn't in you, to know Jesus Christ is Lord and saviour of the world..

JMAN05:
I just doubt your claim to believe Gods word. For example, you keep going against its clear command.

Prov 27:2 says "2 Let another man praise thee, and not thine own mouth; a stranger, and not thine own lips"

When invited to make a defense for our faith, the bible says

1pet 3:15
15But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:

No need to make brags to obedience to Gods word while doing the opposite, let your actions show you really obey God. Imagine if someone had invited Paul to discuss the reason for his belief, he will hesitate and say " I am a new branch connected to the branch", yet do not agree to a scriptural discussion from Gods word. That's hypocritical if you ask me. Apostle Paul would never do that. The fsct is, when someone is sure of what he believes, he fears no call to prove it.

Well, when ever you are ready to make a defense, let me know. Wishing you a great day!

Christianity Etc › Re: Answers To Jehovah Witnesses Devil-inspired Questions About JESUS CHRIST!!! by brocab: 8:34pm On Dec 13, 2017*

I was talking with a man yesterday, if this is going to help you in anyway, but first to be truthful, I find this conversation, you have created against the Word of God is quite amusing about the trinity, it truly shows us viewers you haven't a clue where you are going with this conversation.
Every time I have spoken about the Word of God, the JW's had always claimed to know God more than others, by their fruit we will know them-and I have never met a JW to have any experiences with God, but as usual not reading the Word of God they had found other findings from books not related to God written in the bible, just to prove who's right and who's wrong..
Many are called, but few are chosen, going back to my story, I said to this man yesterday, why do people call themselves Christians if they have never heard from God, this is what being a Christian is all about "God" believing is our goal to know God.
Is he hearing from God, is anybody hearing from God, most people believe God speaks to them in a everyday conversation about their daily routine, some people's stories about God are really wild, "But do others believe?
I am not expecting people to believe my story, but I have experience God's presents around me, even now, He speaks to me through His Word, the Lord seems to hit me when I am awake in the mornings, sometimes He wakes me up with scriptures running through my mind. "Do you know, God speaks through the bible, but will you" JW ever find Him there.
I am not a judge, back in time, people who wanted Christ were taught by members in the Church, how to pray and communicate with God, just the way Jesus taught His disciples to pray, and how to understand the Spirit.
The Church was once the house of God, a place for the poor and hungry, a place we could sit in silents, listening to the wind blowing through the emptiness of our souls..
Until we hear from God-no-one can honestly claim they are saved, He speaks to us through His Word, listening really blows my mind, its a hole new ball game, when God speaks to us through His Word, the scripture just comes alive, and the understanding of it, is so simple-but our flesh won't allow us to see what God see's, it's His spirit that allows us to see what He see's, you claim you can reason the bible, your flesh, verses the Spirit, how many times have I listened to unbelievers; who believe they are mightier then the creator.
You can't reason with me, that's the truth, the Word of God had already won, you have tried in so many ways, you can't twist it, and you can't find any resources to separate it, the Word of God stays, it doesn't matter how you understand it, the point is God speaks through it, and God lives it.
These day's people are coming to Church just like you, and from all walks of life people are not hearing from God, just like you, you claim you do, but your fruit is so far from God,"You will know when the Lord speaks to you-your inter-self changers within, you are not the same person you started out to be, God changes you, and He keeps on feeding you through His Word, He's a loving Father that doesn't quit-He will keep you on the right track-until its your time, He uses you for Him, and only Jesus you shall serve.
This doesn't happen over night, but what had happen is one had decided to accept the Spirit of the Lord, His teachings teaches you to believe, and how we are to rely upon Him at all cost-Jesus's Spirit connects with you, don't you understand how simple this is.
"The trinity in Him have now began in you-Jesus's spirit is connected to the Father, and we are one in them, His seed your new seed is connected together in spirit and in truth. the seed is the Word' I am a believer in Christ and I have been grafted in, I am a new branch connected to the vine, the vine is the Spirit, I am being fed daily by the Spirit while I continual in the Word of God, I am being fed daily as I seek the kingdom of God, the Word of God that abounds in me, is One with the Lord in Word and in truth.

JMAN05:
We can examine this belief of yours together from the bible. You are sure there is trinity, am sure there isn't. You believe you have a scriptural proof for your belief, I believe the same too for my belief. Don't you think we should look at each others evidence to see who amongst us is missing some thing? You could be wrong, just like I might be wrong too, but how do we know, if we don't analyse what the other person believes and the reasons for it?

I mean I can equally say the same thing you said above about you. Am not caged against doing so. I can say you believe in the trinity because you don't have the spirit of the Lord. You work by flesh and not by spirit. In fact that you do not have the spirit of God to interprete sacred things to you. I can go further to say that you have been blinded by Satan so that you can't see the truth. (2cor 4:4). I can go on and on. Instead of spewing wrath, will it not be best we look at this issue together with an open mind? Using the scriptures to guide us? Think about it!

Christianity Etc › Re: Answers To Jehovah Witnesses Devil-inspired Questions About JESUS CHRIST!!! by brocab: 10:52pm On Dec 12, 2017*

That was a waste of time, everything you had written adds nothing. Your disbelieve carries no evidence, no-one can compare the truth-you either have the spirit of the Lord to believe it, or you haven't the spirit, its as simple as that.
Walk away from the watchtower it's doing your head in, their teachings are miles of the track, really your spirituality isn't there, you are arguing against the Spirit of the Lord, no-wonder the JW's have such a bad name, this sort of information causes disputes among the believers within.
If you were a believer-truly you wouldn't deny Christ nor the Father nor the Spirit, truly to be a believer, first you must believe-which you yourself can't seem to do, you haven't produce any evidence to prove the Word of God is wrong, "typical" you without God are trying so hard to workout His knowledge through your mind.
There isn't one piece of evidence you have come up with to prove you are right, have you heard your flesh is carnal minded.
{Romans 8:5-6} Those who live according to the flesh, have their minds set on what the flesh desires, and visa versa in the spirit. The mind of the flesh is death, and the mind of the spirit is life.
{Romans 8:8} and those in the realm of the flesh can not please God.
And you brother can not please God, for a price your disbelief is causing you to wonder away from the truth.
Have you ever wondered why the Lord said: many are called, but few are chosen, maybe you should be worried what this actually means..
If Jehovah God is your main attraction, to bring you closer to Jesus, then you are travelling on the wrong road, you need to get yourself right with Jesus before you can see the Father. And your disbelief isn't helping, you at all...

JMAN05:
although the definition is not quite elaborate. maybe you will tell me more as we discourse. I would really like to see these scriptures that shows that the trinity does exist.

You quoted 1cor 13:14, if you wish to prove trinity with it, am yet to see how it proves it. can you explain?

the only thing i will agree with you hear is that there is unity in the authority by which one is baptized. But I didnt see that place mention that all three mentioned form one Godhead.

Or, are you saying that God and Jesus has no distinct name? At least that is what you can argue, it said "NAME", not "EQUALITY". In other words, you can argue that the Father, The Son, and the holy spirit has the same name (if that is absurd, well that is what you can argue from the verse. You cant add what it didnt say). not that they are all equal.

But do they really have one name?

The Father - Jehovah (psalm 83:18)

The Son - Jesus

the holy spirit - what is the name of the holy spirit?

The "name of" logically refers to the authority of; You have to acknowledge the function of Gods holy spirit, the part played by Jesus to be effectively baptised.

See what this book, written by a trinitarian says: According to McClintock and Strong’s Cyclopedia of Biblical, Theological, and Ecclesiastical Literature, “proves only that there are the three subjects named, . . . but it does not prove, by itself, that all the three belong necessarily to the divine nature, and possess equal divine honor.

See your comment I bold faced. That is why your definition is not quite elaborate. Are you of the opinion that The Father, the son and the holy spirit are not separate persons, but they are just inside one godhead? pls help me understand your view of trinity, so that i dont reply to what you dont believe. so far, your definition doesnt paint the picture so clearly.

That phrase in 1john5:7 is not found in the ancient and trusted bible manuscripts. That is why modern versions omit it. The issue was never on contradiction.

2. Excuse me, do you believe in trinity, or are you viewing trinity to mean tri-unity -that is, that the three work in unity.please include this as you tell me more about what you mean by trinity. pls paint the picture well so that i understand your belief.

Are you emphasizing unity of the three in that Luk 3:22? Because if you are trying to prove three in one God, there isnt anything there talking about three in one God. When the God, Jesus and holy spirit is mentioned together, my dear, there is no way you can prove that three persons are one just because they are mentioned together performing a task. I mean if i adopt this teaching,I will just walk up to someone, in other to convince him, I will say, "well read luk 3:22, you see, Jesus was there, then the holy spirit came in form of a dove in his shoulders, and then God spoke from above. Now there you have it - three in one God". Maybe you have to make me understand you well, because there isnt any convincing prove i see there. I mean if we are to be honest.

It is true that Jesus could be called a God (Weather capitalized or not makes no difference in greek), But to believe that the Jesus (as a god), and the Father (as a God) are the same, this verse doesnt prove that or you have to help me see the point.

The word(Jesus) was with God(the Father), refers to two persons there. and these two persons each has the title "God" attached to them. So two Gods are here mentioned, not three in one. Mind you, the word "God" is a title.

I just saw Jesus Christ, God, and holy ghost mentioned. Nothing about weather they are three in one or are equal in everything. Pls let me know if there is something am missing there.

Christianity Etc › Re: The Pentecostal Church Verses The Catholic Church. by brocab(op): 11:08pm On Dec 10, 2017

Exorcism from a movie is a good start, God compel you, this gives someone outside the square something to go by, I don't know if you are one that studies the scriptures or not-but did you know the devil can counterfeit miracles (2 Thessalonians 2:9)
In fact, Jesus warned, “Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers’” (Matthew 7:22–23)
Do you know the Catholic Church openly breaks God’s Ten Commandments (the second and fourth – Exodus 20) and is not purified by the truth.
Sadly, its priests can be used by the devil to perform counterfeit miracles.
Satan has some powers and he uses these powers to deceive the world. Satan is a master trickster and the father of lies (John 8:44; 2 Corinthians 11:14)
Whether to possess a person or be cast out of that same person, the devil uses every possible way to achieve his deceptions.
Exorcism strengthens the faith of people in the authority of priests. {It strengthen your faith towards priest} It causes people to trust the priest’s authority and their teachings even though it contradicts the Bible.
But the good news is that every Christian has the power to defeat the devil “And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils” (Mark 16:17)
Believers are given the authority to “cast out devils” (Matthew 10: cool

The only power that is guaranteed to defeat Satan every time is the power of the Holy Spirit residing within a believer who is equipped with the armor of God’s Word (Ephesians 6:11–17; 2 Corinthians 10:4)
As Christians submit to God, they can “resist the devil, and he will flee” from them (James 4:7)
And there is nothing impossible for the believers for “with God all things are possible” (Matthew 19:26)

Christianity Etc › Re: The Pentecostal Church Verses The Catholic Church. by brocab(op): 11:06pm On Dec 10, 2017

No Jesus didn't just give the apostles the authority to forgive sins.
I have explained to you, the authority we have is to forgive those who have sinned against us-visa versa, we all have this gift to forgive.
The subject matter in this passage, the forgiveness of sin, is an enormous issue in that regard, for the Old Testament made it very clear that only God could forgive sins. This will help us understand the response of the teachers of the Law, and the reason for the authenticating miracle.
Jesus stepped into a boat, crossed over and came to his own town.
2 Some men brought to him a paralytic, lying on a mat. When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralytic, “Take heart, son; your sins are forgiven.”
3 At this, some of the teachers of the Law said to themselves, “This fellow is blaspheming!”
4 Knowing their thoughts, Jesus said, “Why do you entertain evil thoughts in your hearts?
5 Which is easier: to say, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Get up and walk’?
6 But so that you might know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sin . . . .” Then he said to the paralytic, “Get up, take your mat and go home.”
7 And the man got up and went home.
8 When the crowd saw this, they were filled with awe, and they praised God, who had given such authority to men.
Some religious leaders say that the disciples and apostles were given authority by Jesus to forgive the sins of others just like what Roman Catholic priests do in their confession booth. And they use {John 20:23 and James 5:16} to support their claim.
“If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you withhold forgiveness from any, it is withheld.” (John 20:23, ESV)
“Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person is powerful and effective.” (James 5:16, NIV)
Only God Forgives Sins
{Daniel 9:9} “To the Lord our God belong mercies and forgiveness…”
Even in the Old Testament, a Levite priest cannot pronounce absolution of sin to the repentant sinner. The priests can only communicate the forgiveness that God has already given to the sinner based on the ceremonies and rules in the earthly sanctuary God gave to Moses.
{Leviticus 4:26} “And he shall burn all his fat upon the altar, as the fat of the sacrifice of peace offerings: and the priest shall make an atonement for him as concerning his sin, and it shall be forgiven him.”
The verse never said “and the priest can now forgive the repentant sinner”.
The Jews knew that God alone can forgive sins (absolution). This is the reason the Pharisees accused Jesus of blasphemy when Jesus forgave the sin of the paralytic man in {Mark 2:3-12}
The same is true in the New Testament. Nowhere in the Bible mentioned that the apostles nor disciples exercised the forgiving of sins of their fellow men in behalf of God. Why? Because they fully understood what Jesus exactly meant in {John 20:23} The remission of sin is the prerogative of God alone.
{1 John 2:1} tells us that we have only one Advocate or Mediator with the Father, and that is Jesus Christ. This Advocate can forgive sins as what He had demonstrated in His earthly ministry.
So what was Jesus saying in {John 20:23} is that any Christian can declare that those who genuinely ask for forgiveness and repent the sins he committed and accept Jesus and His Gospel will have his sins forgiven by God.
However, for those who will hardened their hearts and not accept Jesus and follow His Gospel will die from their sins. Jesus gave that privilege to any of His followers."Next Question are you a follower of Christ, all would you prefer to follow after a priest?

Jolliano:
Lol. I am not floating. I am actually the one who is responding directly and not copying articles from sites, making claims, repeating them and not backing them up.

Anyway, you don't seem to read my responses. I answered you from the Bible first and then I specifically said "Having quoted the bible, I will also include quotes from the Early Christians to counter your personal interpretation." I did that to contrast your interpretation with that of the Early Christians and obviously they are different.

You ask why do Catholics need to arm up......? Bros, I have been quoting from the bible in every of my response and you have failed to respond with one quote that counters the Apostles receiving that authority in John 20:23. You are instead posting quotes about how God can forgive sins(which no one is arguing about anyway).
PS: Only God can give life. But St Paul and Elisha also did.

You say that they are not books that you would use and yet from the Bible (which I assume is the book you would use), you have not provided one quote or statement that counters what Jesus said in John 20:19 - 23 (which is the basis of this argument).

Also, can you stop using false information and lies in this discussion? I quoted from the "DIDACHE" which was written about 70AD and you are talking about (or more accurately copying and pasting a short description of) "THE DIDACHE BIBLE" which was written recently and can be found here https://www.ignatius.com/Products/DBIB-H/the-didache-bible-with-commentaries-based-on-the-catechism-of-the-catholic-church.aspx

So you mean that Jesus asked Christians not to literally use the word "father"? Lol.

Jesus himself said: "And he called out, 'Father Abraham, have mercy upon me, and send Lazarus to dip the end of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am in anguish in this flame.'" - (Luke 16:24-25)
Maybe St. Paul forgot when he called himself father: "I do not write this to make you ashamed, but to admonish you as my beloved children. For though you have countless guides in Christ, you do not have many fathers. For I became your father in Christ Jesus through the Gospel" (1 Corinthians 4:14-15).
Maybe he forgot again when he said: "Brethren and fathers, hear the defense which I now make before you"- (Acts 22:10)
Even St. Stephen forgot when he said: "And he said, Men, brethren, and fathers, hearken; The God of glory appeared unto our father Abraham, when he was in Mesopotamia, before he dwelt in." - (Acts 7:2)
Then St. John must have been very forgetful (and by your logic, sinful) because he said: "1 My little children, I am writing this to you so that you may not sin; 13 I am writing to you, fathers, because you know him who is from the beginning. I am writing to you, young men, because you have overcome the evil one. I write to you, children, because you know the Father. 14 I write to you, fathers, because you know him who is from the beginning. I write to you, young men, because you are strong d, and the word of God abides in you, and you have overcome the evil one." - (1 Jn 2:1, 13-14)
Him own no be father serf, na fathers.

Jesus meant that no one was to bring in his own interpretation or create his own version of Christianity. In other words, all fatherhood must truly flow from the Fatherhood of God. He was referring to the Scribes and Pharisees and their errors. Read (Matthew 23:1-12). Always read the bible in context. Don't carry one verse away from its background and start giving whatever interpretation you like best.

Which bible? The one that said: "Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive anyone’s sins, their sins are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven.” in John 20: 19 - 23 Which bible, bros?

Again, no one is arguing about the Father being able to forgive or whether people can or should forgive others. The argument is did Jesus give the Apostles the power to forgive sins? John 20: 19 - 23 says YES. Reply with a bible verse or area that says NO.

Exorcism no be film o. You watched a movie, bros. I said research EXORCISM, not go and watch film.

Christianity Etc › Re: Jehovah's Witnesses: 17 Facts People Should Know About Them by brocab: 7:26am On Dec 08, 2017

I am glad you aren't forcing me, bro, you are not seeing the picture, because you don't have the Spirit to see it, No-one is insulting anybody, if you are expecting people to listen to you, then at least come up with facts not fiction.
I have travelled to the darkest side of the moon, and I found Kingdom hall is planted smack in the middle of it all;
I have witnessed the truth to the lost sheep around every corner, and there's no other truth that could be found, other then the written Word of God.
You brother need saving, you need to turn your ways, away from your self loved life, and turn for Christ, because your kingdom hall will keep you walking the highways blinded, and you will never find the narrow road, you will never see Christ, nor will you ever know Christ to be your Lord and savour.

Crysthaniel:
All you do is abuse we jehovah's witnesses bro..

I hope that you finally come to know the truth about this... Ai cannot force you bro..

Christianity Etc › Re: Jehovah's Witnesses: 17 Facts People Should Know About Them by brocab: 7:04am On Dec 08, 2017

Again without you reading the topic you call it abuse cool

Crysthaniel:
All you do is abuse we jehovah's witnesses bro..

Christianity Etc › Re: Jehovah's Witnesses: 17 Facts People Should Know About Them by brocab: 5:37am On Dec 08, 2017*

What happened to you bro, are you searching for love, what made you disbelieve in the truth? If you are looking for answers read the bible.
I have written down the Word of God, and still you refuse it, do yourself a favor, test the spirit, do you know God speaks to us through the bible, did you know flesh wars against the Spirit, and you brother are warring against the Word of God, you are trying to work the scriptures out through your mind, the mind can only work so far, while the Spirit can work much further.
Brother you need to become a born again believer before you can understand the Spirit of the Lord, Jesus said< one must be born of water and the spirit before he can enter into the kingdom of God {John 3:5}
As a man Jesus can forgive sins against Him, Jesus asked the Father to forgive them, Just like we do, we forgive those who sinned against us, we pray to the Father as men.
If you were to read {Matthew 10:28} Do not be afraid of those who can kill the body, but cannot kill the soul. So your answer to this question is "No the Spirit can not die..
It shows you haven't any interest to learn the scriptures, Emmanuel was born to save the world.
This scripture>I and the Father are one, is taken out in a Spiritual term, it is impossible for two fleshly men to become one, but it isn't impossible for one man and one Spirit to become one. God said let Us make man in our image, We are all made, man and "soul..
{Leviticus 26:11-12} 'Moreover, I will make My dwelling among you, and My soul will not reject you. I will also walk among you and be your God, and you shall be My people.
Don't forget no-one has seen God at any time, because God is Spirit, and the Spirit of God walked among us.
{John 1:14} And Jesus was made flesh and walked among us.
Did you know Jesus never worked alone, He seed was God's seed, He relied upon the Father everything He said and done, "Jesus was given authority from the beginning, before Abraham was born I am, Jesus had all power to be God.
As a man He claimed God is His Father, and God said to Him, your throne O God is forever and forever {Hebrews 1:8} God called Jesus His God, And yet In {Isaiah 42:8} God won't give His glory to another.
This makes so much sense-if God doesn't share Himself with another, then God's glory belongs to Himself, and God Himself lived among men in the flesh? So Emmanuel became a man just to save us sinners.

Crysthaniel:
Bottom line if Jesus is God can Satan EVEN DARE TO TEMPT Him?? Also note Jesus replies in obedience to jehovah his father...

Yes as a man we are tempted, if you bow down to me, I will give you all these kingdoms, and Jesus said: get behind Me Satan, you shall worship the Lord your God and Him only you shall serve..Jesus showed Satan, He has the authority in heaven and on earth.
Not Satan.
Satan picked on Jesus as a man alone in the desert, this is how Satan works, Satan test God's people everyday, how many of us actually walk on the highways, and not on the narrow, are we growing in Christ, by their fruit we will know them. Satan tempted Him and had failed.
Just in Jesus's name is full of power, no-one can cast out the demonic without Jesus's name. What other name is their that have greater strength then Jesus's name, the scriptures tells us we can't use Jehovah God's name to cast out demonic spirits?

Christianity Etc › Re: Jehovah's Witnesses: 17 Facts People Should Know About Them by brocab: 3:31am On Dec 08, 2017

Good on you bro, these JW's love you dearly, and I am sure you are well and truly needed here.

Christianity Etc › Re: The Pentecostal Church Verses The Catholic Church. by brocab(op): 2:25am On Dec 08, 2017*

To be honest you are floating or over the place, now you have brought in the heavy guns, Didache or Philadelphia is not the books I would use in this conversation, but I little brotherly love doesn't go astray, why do Catholic's feel they need to arm themselves up, when the bible is concerned, no-one is interested in other literature's from outside God's Word the bible.
First, how is this going to support your theory on seeking a priest for prayer with this>-Didache 4:14; 14:1 - As early as 70 The Didache Bible presents extensive commentaries, based on the Catechism of the Catholic Church, for each of the books of the Holy Bible. It also includes numerous apologetical inserts to assist the reader in understanding the Church's teachings on current issues.
Second, Philadelphia, which means “brotherly love,”
I should throw this one in, since its starting to look like a competition? King James Bible {Matthew 23:9} And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
To be honest I don’t see how the Catholic Church can teach that a priest can forgive sins. It’s against the Bible.
The Psalmist, speaking to God, says in {Psalm 130:4} "But with you there is forgiveness." A man cannot forgive the sins of another person.
The only sins a man can forgive are those against him directly. Jesus said we should forgive those who sin against us. But how can a priest, or any human being, forgive sins which are not against him directly. Only God can do that.
But In your case you need a earthly priest to forgive your sins, of cause you will see this as a judgement, but the Lord said we will know them by their fruit, and when it's time for you to hit heaven, you will say to the Lord see I have done everything I was taught, He will turn to you and say, I do not know you, do you not know the bible is God speaking to you, and everything concerning the bible, you disagree, ask yourself this>when was your last time you had a conversation with the Lord? IF EVER huh

{1 John 1:8-10} If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
{Psalm 25:11} For Your name's sake, O LORD, Pardon my iniquity, for it is great.
{Matthew 18:19-21} “Again I say to you that if two of you agree on earth concerning anything that they ask, it will be done for them by My Father in heaven. For where two or three are gathered together in My name, I am there in the midst of them.”Then Peter came and said to Him, "Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me and I forgive him? Up to seven times?"
Peter said his brother sinned against him, so Peter should forgive him up to seven times, Peter never had the authority to forgive another mans sins, especially if the sin wasn't against Peter, or visa versa, so you are wrong to think an earthly priest can forgive sins that isn't against him.
{Mark 11:25}"Whenever you stand praying, forgive, if you have anything against anyone, so that your Father who is in heaven will also forgive you your transgressions.
Our Father in Heaven hollowed be your name your kingdom come, that will be done, on earth as it is in heaven. This is a good example how to pray to and whom too, as we forgive those who sinned against us, the Father will forgive our trespass.
{Exodus 32:32} "But now, if You will, forgive their sin--and if not, please blot me out from Your book which You have written!
"{Luke 23:34} But Jesus was saying, "Father, forgive them; for they do not know what they are doing " And they cast lots, dividing up His garments among themselves.
{Psalm 19:12} Who can discern his errors? Acquit me of hidden faults.
How can a priest warn those who are sinning, when he is just a man. Peter was also a man filled with the Holy Spirit, Peter couldn't see unless the Spirit of the Lord had showed him to see..
{Luke 17:4} "And if he sins against you seven times a day, and returns to you seven times, saying, 'I repent,' forgive him."
If you forgive others their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you, but if you do not forgive others their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses. If my brother asked me to forgive him, I shall forgive him, and I will say to him let us pray to the Lord. There's no power in forgiveness without the Father.
{Daniel 9:9} "To the Lord our God belong compassion and forgiveness, for we have rebelled against Him.
{James 5:15} And the prayer offered in faith will restore the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up, and if he has committed sins, they will be forgiven him.
{Genesis 50:17}'Thus you shall say to Joseph, "Please forgive, I beg you, the transgression of your brothers and their sin, for they did you wrong."' And now, please forgive the transgression of the servants of the God of your father." And Joseph wept when they spoke to him.
Look in this verse, they asked Joseph to forgive their sins.
{Ephesians 4:32} Be kind to one another, tender-hearted, forgiving each other, just as God in Christ also has forgiven you.
I do remember the Exorcist, but even then, what name do the priest use to cast out demons, I watched the Exorcist, and I don't recall the priest using Jesus name to cast out the legion of demons. God compel you 'was the terms used.
It took the priest weeks to cast it out, I suppose without the name of Jesus, one would ask-is the Exorcist really true, or is it just a story to draw in the people, demons casting out demons?
This gift was given to the apostles, they used Jesus's name, and the demons flew out in seconds. And you claim priest are the new generation of the apostles from Peter, so what went wrong?

Jolliano:
Seeing as I have responded to majority of what you're saying here, I will just refer you to my earlier responses (especially because you are not making new points but instead repeating points that you have been unable to back up with the Bible)

The Catholic has these gifts. Does he heal the sick? Yes, when it is the will of God.
Does he raise the dead? Yes, when it is the will of God.
Does he cast out demons? Yes. Go and research Exorcism.

And yes the Priest is a man but so was St. Peter when his shadow was healing people and St. Paul when he brought Eutychus back to life. There is a huge difference between Apostles and Disciples (a lot of authority were given to only Apostles) and yet both groups were made up of only men.

Seeing as this your argument (confess directly to God when you feel the sin doesn't affect anybody else and confess to everyone when you feel it does) is not from the Bible nor from any Early Christian Writing, it is nothing but your personal interpretation. AND it is wrong.

1 Corinthians 12:12 - 27 shows that we are all parts of one body and that if one part of the body suffers, the whole body suffers. Then if one part of the body is injured, then the whole body is injured. (If I had an injury on my head, I would say "I am injured" not "My head is injured."
So your sin as a member of the Body of Christ affects the whole Body of Christ. There is no sin between you and the Lord only (This is a product of the new and wrong mentality of a personal relationship between me and God only. There is no use of the word personal in anything faith related in the NT. Also, no accept Jesus as your personal Lord and Saviour in the Bible). Christianity has and will always be a communal faith just as Judaism was. This is why it is part of the greatest commandment to "Love your neighbor as yourself".
In summary, there is no sin that is private, all sins are public.

Having quoted the bible, I will also include quotes from the Early Christians to counter your personal interpretation.

1. Didache 4:14; 14:1 - As early as 70 AD

Confess your sins in church, and do not go up to your prayer with an evil conscience. This is the way of life…. On the Lord’s Day gather together, break bread, and give thanks, after confessing your transgressions so that your sacrifice may be pure.

2. St. Ignatius of Antioch [50-117 AD]
Epistle to the Philadelphians ch 3

"For as many as are of God and of Jesus Christ are also with the bishop. And as many as shall, in the exercise of penance, return into the unity of the Church, these, too, shall belong to God, that they may live according to Jesus Christ"

3. St. Cyprian of Carthage - 250 AD
The Lapsed 15:1-3; 28

The Apostle likewise bears witness and says: ….”Whoever eats the bread and drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord” [1 Cor 11:27]. But [the impenitent] spurn and despise all these warnings; before their sins are expiated, before they have made a confession of their crime, before their conscience has been purged in the ceremony and at the hand of the priest…they do violence to his body and blood, and with their hands and mouth they sin against the Lord more than when they denied him.

….Of how much greater faith and salutary fear are they who…confess their sins to the priests of God in a straightforward manner and in sorrow, making an open declaration of conscience. God cannot be mocked or outwitted, nor can he be deceived by any clever cunning….Indeed, he but sins the more if, thinking that God is like man, he believes that he can escape the punishment of his crime by not openly admitting his crime….I beseech you, brethren, let everyone who has sinned confess his sin while he is still in this world, while his confession is still admissible, while the satisfaction and remission made through the priests are still pleasing before the Lord.

There are a lot more that show that the Early Christians believed in the Apostles/Bishops/Priests having the power to forgive sins.

Christianity Etc › Re: Jehovah's Witnesses: 17 Facts People Should Know About Them by brocab: 1:33pm On Dec 07, 2017

Maybe, but it's always good to have the helping hand.Plus the JW's are flocking in from all directions.

johnw74:
Stick around bro, there are plenty of JW's coming to play God..

you are doing well by yourself

Christianity Etc › Re: Jehovah's Witnesses: 17 Facts People Should Know About Them by brocab: 4:14am On Dec 07, 2017

Stick around bro, there are plenty of JW's coming to play God..

Christianity Etc › Re: Answers To Jehovah Witnesses Devil-inspired Questions About JESUS CHRIST!!! by brocab: 4:02am On Dec 07, 2017

How many times have I written this, trinity the three persons of the Christian Godhead; Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
This is what it means to me.
Don't you read the bible, or do you leave it up to others to give you the answers, 'Why don't you explain to me, how you see the trinity, I have been asking you, since you started this page, and maybe I could show you another way, you may understand it..
But I won't know until you explain how you understand it, and then we can go from there..
Plus do you understand the seed?

JMAN05:
In case you forgot, the first thing I asked you was:

You now stated:

Firstly are you a JW, and do you know the spirit of the lord?

Although that was irrelevant to my question, I still answered it. But you have not given a definition to Trinity all these while. State what you understand by trinity, what you keep doing is bring in more and more distraction to the main issue. Go straight, be forward, answer the question straight. Define what you mean by trinity. Let that be the only thing you are typing in reply to me, don't add anything more. Let's not go in circles, let's face the topic straight. If you aren't ready, I will find my way. What is trinity, elaborate on that term so much that the picture is clear to a lay man. Oya....

Christianity Etc › Re: Jehovah's Witnesses: 17 Facts People Should Know About Them by brocab: 2:26am On Dec 07, 2017*

It was an effort wasn't it, but I did it for you, just to show how much you claim to believe in the written Word of God.

Crysthaniel:
Remember Matthew 7:14 says narrow is the way to life only few will EVER find it..

I am glad you have Kept this verse in mind, because denying the Word of God, causes people to stay on the highways, accepting the Word of God will surely keep us on that narrow road.
{John 14:28} You heard me say to you, ‘I am going away, and I will come to you.’ If you loved me, you would have rejoiced, because I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I.
If we were to study other scriptures, I am going away, and I will come to you, then it proves Jesus is coming back, Not the Father as the JW's believe.
{Matthew 28:18} If all the authority of heaven and earth had been given to Jesus, then He has all power to send His Holy Spirit to finish the work, He has complete power to make whom He chooses to be, He can be the Father and the Son at the same time because all power had been given to Him, "As we can see, there is no time flame when God had given Jesus all the heavenly authority.
{John 1:14} And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us.
{If Jesus had all the authority from God then this authority had come within the guild lines from the beginning of time, well before "Jesus and God raised Himself from the dead}.
{John 2:19} Jesus answered destroy this temple and in 3 day's I will raise it up.
{1 Corinthians 6:18} God raised up the Lord?
So what does this mean to you? "They are One Spirit?
But when we see, only One has all the authority, the only One can save, then every verse that say's 'Father 'Son are One the same, we don't separate them, separating them causes confusion within the body of Christ, separating them could lose a multitude of believers away from Him who created all things visible and invisible.
{Isaiah 45:22} Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.
{1 Timothy 1:15} This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief.
If you truly believe in Jesus then believe every Word He says, Jesus saves "Jesus" came,"Jesus" died, and "Jesus" lives forevermore?

Crysthaniel:
Please my watsapp 08175893693 ...

Is this your phone number! My home is across the other side of the moon brother..

Crysthaniel:
I appreciate your effort bro.... Please endeavor to contact jw members in your area face to face and ask them questions about the matter i have done my part.... Note at John 14:28 Jesus said his father is greater than he is....
Waht else can i say brother? Please my watsapp 08175893693 ... Remember Matthew 7:14 says narrow is the way to life only few will EVER find it..

Christianity Etc › Re: The Pentecostal Church Verses The Catholic Church. by brocab(op): 5:37am On Dec 06, 2017*

I have been into confession myself, I sat beside a priest spilling my guts, about the sins I had committed, this is before I knew Christ-He set me free, from the law.
This isn't the wrong argument, you say, going to a priest will make all the difference, but the point is, we don't have to seek after a priest, for our confession, we just need to seek after God the Father about our confession in our rooms.
No-one has the authority to forgive sins, only the Father, the priest is a man, he can forgive, just as well as you can forgive, but God is our last resort to forgive our sins.
The Catholic priest does not have these gifts, does he heal the sick, does he raise the dead, does he cast out demons.

Jolliano:
Catholic priests have this gift(office/faculty/whatever you want to call it) because they have been sent just as Christ sent the Apostles in an unbroken succession (Apostolic Succession).

For example, if a man looks with lust at a woman, he should immediately confess the sin to the Lord. It would not be needed or appropriate to confess that sin to the woman.
That sin is between the man and the Lord. However, if a man breaks a promise, or does something that directly impacts the woman, he must confess to her and seek her forgiveness. If a sin involves a large number of people, such as a church, a man or woman must then extend the confession to the members of the church. So the confession and apology should match the impact. Those impacted by the sin should hear the confession.
While our forgiveness with God is not dependent on our confessing our sins to others and/or their forgiving us, God does call us to be honest and forthcoming with others regarding our failings, especially when our mistakes involve them.
When we have offended, hurt, or sinned against others, we should seek to offer a sincere apology and confession and ask for forgiveness. Whether the forgiveness is granted is up to those who were confessed too. Our responsibility is to genuinely repent, confess the sin, and ask for forgiveness.
We must do this with each other, not just turn to a priest, expecting your sins are forgiven, many people are taught by asking a priest to forgive their sins, they don't need to settle any accounts with their brother sister they had sinned against.
"No you must turn to your brother, you must ask him for your forgiveness and make amends with your brother and yourself, a priest can not do this..If you hate your brother, the kingdom of God is far from you.

Jolliano:
You quoted John 20: 21 and 22 but did not quote v 23 which is the completion of the statement. Here is the complete quotation:

19 On the evening of that first day of the week, when the disciples were together, with the doors locked for fear of the Jewish leaders, Jesus came and stood among them and said, “Peace be with you!” 20 After he said this, he showed them his hands and side. The disciples were overjoyed when they saw the Lord.

21 Again Jesus said, “Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you.” 22 And with that he breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive anyone’s sins, their sins are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven.”

Your interpretation of this passage and the statement in v 23 to mean "He sent them, as He is sending us, to bring the good news of the way to salvation and heaven to the whole world." is a very wrong one. It is in no way traceable to v 23.

Also, this is not his last appearance before Ascension. This is actually his first appearance after his Resurrection and the message is clear, "if you forgive...., they are forgiven". The mission on which they are sent here is directly spelt out: The forgiveness of sins.

NOTE: The mission of Christ has many different (related but different) parts; teaching, healing, interceding, forgiveness of sins, e.t.c. Even St Paul says "All this is the work of God who in Christ reconciled us to himself, and who entrusted to us the ministry of reconciliation." - 2 Corinthians 5,18

This is another wrong arguement. If you say that Jesus giving us this authority would mean there was no need to repent, then what you are implying is that when Jesus Himself was using this authority on earth (Matthew 9: 1 - 7, Luke 7: 44 - 48), people didn't need to repent. And so that argument is weightless.
Also, the fact that some people can heal has not stopped anyone from asking the Father for healing, has it?

Catholic priests have this gift(office/faculty/whatever you want to call it) because they have been sent just as Christ sent the Apostles in an unbroken succession (Apostolic Succession).

On the issue of meeting Jesus on the final day,......

Well, I too do not want that. This is why I am a Catholic, a member of the Church founded by Our Lord Jesus Christ upon St Peter, which for more than 2000 years has carried on his mission of making disciples of all Nations, of teaching them all that He revealed to the Church through Apostolic Teaching and Writing, of forgiving the sins of those who repentantly confess their sins, of caring for the poor and needy and of saying and standing by the Truth even when everyone else hates the Church for it.
The testimony of the Early Christians(disciples of disciples/Apostles of Christ) show me what and what are actually the tenets and doctrines of the Christian faith and those tenets are that of the Catholic Church and not that of anyone who wakes up one morning and feels that his interpretation of the Scriptures is more accurate than that which has been continously passed down for 2000 years.

My advice: Read the Early Christians/Church Fathers and compare their Faith/Practices to yours and see if they are the same or not.

Christianity Etc › Re: The Pentecostal Church Verses The Catholic Church. by brocab(op): 4:57am On Dec 06, 2017*

No priest nor I, have the final authority to forgive sins, but Christ Himself can forgive sins. I have forgiven my brothers sin against me, but it's his choice to ask the Lord to forgive him. We should seek forgiveness from the Lord for every sin.
He desires “truth in the inward parts” (Psalm 51:6) If our relationship with the Lord is right, then our relationships with other people will fall into line. We will treat others graciously, with justice and honesty (Psalm 15)
To sin against someone and not attempt to make it right would be unthinkable.
The extent of the apology for a sin should match the extent of the impact of the sin. In other words, we should seek forgiveness from whoever was directly involved in order to ensure healing, but it's his choice to ask the Lord to forgive Him, "Not ask the priest.
“Does any man have the right to forgive sins?
Some Catholic's suggest that Jesus granted this authority to the apostles, and then, through them, to others (John 20:23).
Can the bible actually explain this passage, before you go of the deep end?”
Shortly before His ascension, Jesus said to his apostles:“Whose soever sins ye forgive, they are forgiven unto them; whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained” (Jn. 20:23).
The Roman Catholic Church teaches that Christ was actually granting to the apostles the authority to forgive sins, and that the apostles passed on to their successors (supposedly the Roman priesthood) the same license to pardon sin.
This is false-Jesus has the final say, not priest, Consider the following points.
First, no interpretation is to be placed upon a difficult and obscure passage (such as this one) that would place it in direct conflict with numerous other clear texts.
The fact is, though all Christians are to forgive one another, i.e., have a forgiving disposition (Eph. 4:32), ultimately, only God can bestow absolute pardon (cf. Psa. 130:4; Isa. 43:25; Dan. 9:9; Mic. 7:18; Acts 8:22).
The Lord did not grant that right to the apostles or anybody else.
Bro it is easier for any man to not waste his time going to make a confession to any priest, but go into your room and pray to the Father and ask Him for your forgiveness, go and make some kind of amends with your brother, who you feel he have sinned against you, or visa versa, make it right either way. If my brother feels I am leading him up the wrong road, then I advise him to seek after the Word of God, not something you have been taught by the church, church teachings can be wrong in many cases, seeking God's word can make a big difference to you and your family eternal.

Christianity Etc › Re: Jehovah's Witnesses: 17 Facts People Should Know About Them by brocab: 3:30am On Dec 06, 2017*

These are the many verses I have laid out on this page-as a sign to prove JW's are not even Christian, but a false religion against Christ, and the Father that is in Christ. Lets put it to the test-how many JW's actually believes these verses exist, do they believe in Hell fire? Do they believe Jesus has power to caste them into the outer darkness "Hell fire if they don't repent.
And Jesus is the One true God and everlasting life. {John 17:3}
{Revelation 21:8} But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.”
JW's believe those who have been caste out of there Church, are the disobedient God will condemn. Marriages have been separated families have been torn apart from mothers without children and husbands without wife, because the JW's believe they are God's chosen, and God punishes those who disagrees with their watchtowers kingdom.
{Matthew 25:41} “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.
{Matthew 25:46} And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”
{Matthew 10:28} And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather fear him who can destroy both soul and body in hell.
{Romans 6:23} For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
JW's don't believe we are saved through Christ-only Jehovah can save you.
{Romans 2:6-8} He will render to each one according to his works: to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life; but for those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, there will be wrath and fury.
JW's believe only their works will give them life with father Jehovah.
{2 Thessalonians 1:9} They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might,
JW's believes God won't punished His people the JW's, but punish those who aren't JW's on Earth..
{Mark 9:43} And if your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than with two hands to go to hell, to the unquenchable fire.
{Revelation 20:15} And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
{Jude 1:7} Just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.
{John 3:36} Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.
{Luke 16:19-31} “There was a rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and who feasted sumptuously every day. And at his gate was laid a poor man named Lazarus, covered with sores, who desired to be fed with what fell from the rich man's table. Moreover, even the dogs came and licked his sores. The poor man died and was carried by the angels to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried, and in Hades, being in torment, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham far off and Lazarus at his side. ...
{Mark 9:48} ‘where their worm does not die and the fire is not quenched.’
{2 Peter 2:4} For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept until the judgment;
{Revelation 20:14} Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire.
{Revelation 14:11} And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night, these worshipers of the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name.”
{Matthew 23:33} You serpents, you brood of vipers, how are you to escape being sentenced to hell?
{Luke 16:24} And he called out, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus to dip the end of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am in anguish in this flame.’
{John 3} “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
JW's don't believe Jesus Christ have the authority to give life, only Jehovah can give life and save.
{Revelation 2:11} He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. The one who conquers will not be hurt by the second death.’
{1 Timothy 5:8} But if anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for members of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.
{1 Corinthians 15:26} The last enemy to be destroyed is death.
{1 Peter 3:19} In which he went and proclaimed to the spirits in prison,
{James 4:7}Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
These are just the few the JW's don't believe in.

Christianity Etc › Re: Jehovah's Witnesses: 17 Facts People Should Know About Them by brocab: 12:15am On Dec 06, 2017*

I hope you don't mind reading the truth, about who Christ really is, and I Pray this will open up some light over you "JW" 'who chooses to stay in darkness, your disobedience against the Lord God, when He comes back, you will surely be delivered into your paradise of burning fire for eternity.
I find you JW's quite unstable in all your ways, you are arguing against the bible, one verse says this, and you disagree, wake up and ask the Lord into your lives, accept the Holy Spirit to guild you in all truth.
"And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent," (John 17:3)
The Jehovah's Witnesses, among others, cite {John 17:3} as a proof-text to deny the Trinity and claim that Jesus Christ is not God. They reason is that if Jesus were God, then He would not have called the Father, "the only true God." If the Father is the only true God, then it must require that Jesus cannot be God.
First, of all, it is not proper to make a theological doctrine out of one verse. Of this, the Jehovah's Witnesses are sometimes guilty. Nevertheless, they do tend to take one or two verses on a subject and use them to interpret all the others. Instead of getting a balanced position, they arrive at an interpretation that is in agreement with their theological position. This is called "proof-texting" and is something the Jehovah's Witnesses frequently do.
Second, the context of Jesus' comment was that He was speaking as a man to His God. Remember, Jesus is both God and man, the second person of the Trinity, and the word made flesh (John 1:1, 14)
Since He was both divine and man, as a man, He would naturally and properly say that His Father was the only True God. He was not denying His own divinity but affirming the Trueness of God as was done in the OT: "Now, O LORD our God, deliver us from his hand that all the kingdoms of the earth may know that You alone, LORD, are God," (Isaiah 37:20).
The truth is that Jesus was a man made under the Law (Gal. 4:4); and as a man, He would be subject to God.
Only, in this case, Jesus was subject to the Father. That is why Jesus called the Father the only true God; but it is not a phrase that excludes Christ, for Christ Himself said, "Before Abraham was, I am," (John 8:58) and did not deny being called God by Thomas in {John 20:28}
Third, {John 17:3} must be examined in the light of the totality of scripture. We see that Jesus is called God in {John 1:1, 14; 8:58; 20:28; Col. 2:9; and Heb. 1:8} Therefore, {John 17:3} cannot be interpreted in a way that disagrees with other scriptures. Of course, some people simply state that {John 17:3} cannot allow for Jesus being God, but the simple fact is that Jesus is called God by God and others. Therefore, the whole of scripture must be harmonized.
Fourth, this verse reflects the sonship of Jesus. The Father and the Son have a unique relationship. Jesus is the eternal Son. The terms Father and Son denote a relationship which is why God is called the God of the Son in {2 Cor. 11:31}
Fifth, Jesus identifies Himself with the Father. Jesus is in the Father, and the Father is in Jesus (John 10:38)
Jesus is one with the Father (John 10:30)
They are not divided in essence. So, in one sense Jesus is in the Father; and if the Father is the only true God, then Jesus is the True God.
Also, in {1 John 5:20} Jesus is called the only true God: "And we know that the Son of God has come, and has given us understanding, in order that we might know Him who is true, and we are in Him who is true, in His Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and eternal life." Jesus is not contradicting the word.
Sixth, if we are to be consistent using the Jehovah's Witness logic that the Father is the only true God, then the following verses present a problem - if we use their logic.
"For certain persons have crept in unnoticed, those who were long beforehand marked out for this condemnation, ungodly persons who turn the grace of our God into licentiousness and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ," (Jude 4)
Does this mean that the Father is not our Master and Lord? Of course not. Yet, Jesus is called our only Master and Lord.
"There was the true light which, coming into the world, enlightens every man. He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him,"(John 1:9-10)
Here we see Jesus being called the true light. Does this mean that the Father is not the true light? If not, then we have both the Son and the Father being the true light.
"And Jesus said to him, "Why do you call Me good? No one is good except God alone," (Mark 10:18)
Does this verse mean that Jesus is not good? Jesus said only God was good. Then, if we use the Jehovah's Witness logic, Jesus is not good. Of course, that doesn't make any sense.
"I, even I, am the Lord [YHWH}; And there is no savior besides Me," (Isaiah 43:11)
We know that Jesus is the Savior. Again, according to Witness logic, Jesus could not be the Savior since the Bible tells us that YHWH is the only Savior.
"Blessed be the Lord God, the God of Israel, Who alone works wonders," (Psalm 72:18)
Jesus performed many miracles. But if the Lord [YHWH] is the one who alone performs wonders, how then can it be that Jesus also?
"Thus says the Lord, your Redeemer, and the one who formed you from the womb, 'I, the Lord [YHWH], am the maker of all things, Stretching out the heavens by Myself, And spreading out the earth all alone,'" (Isaiah 44:24)
According to {John 1:3 and Col. 1:16-17} Jesus made all things. With JW logic you would have a problem.
{Col. 1:16-17} says, "For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities, all things have been created by Him and for Him. And He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together." Since God alone created all things, how could Jesus have done it?
I am not expecting you to know any of the truth, you have already denied Christ in your hearts, if you don't repent, God Jesus will deliver you to your paradise of burning hell fire {Revelation 20:12-13}

Crysthaniel:
Now I see you are a JW, had you notice, the
scripture says no-one had seen God at anytime,
because(God is Spirit, and His Spirit the Holy
Spirit was in Christ and Christ in the Father at
the same time.) What you write here is not possible brother let's be true to ourselves...

Christ can'not be in the father because there were instances that jehovah(the father) spoke directly from heaven concerning the approval of his son both at baptism and even in the transfiguration Luke 3:22, Matt 17:5 one thing to note from this two occurrences was that Jesus was already filled with the Holy Spirit before the Father declared from heaven so we can say that the father and son are different...

Remember Jesus words 'am the WAY the TRUTH and LIFE no one comes to the father except through me John 14:6 what comes to mind 1 or 2?

Christianity Etc › Re: Answers To Jehovah Witnesses Devil-inspired Questions About JESUS CHRIST!!! by brocab: 10:50am On Dec 05, 2017

"And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent," (John 17:3)
The Jehovah's Witnesses, among others, cite {John 17:3} as a proof-text to deny the Trinity and claim that Jesus Christ is not God. They reason is that if Jesus were God, then He would not have called the Father, "the only true God." If the Father is the only true God, then it must require that Jesus cannot be God.
First, of all, it is not proper to make a theological doctrine out of one verse. Of this, the Jehovah's Witnesses are sometimes guilty. Nevertheless, they do tend to take one or two verses on a subject and use them to interpret all the others. Instead of getting a balanced position, they arrive at an interpretation that is in agreement with their theological position. This is called "proof-texting" and is something the Jehovah's Witnesses frequently do.
Second, the context of Jesus' comment was that He was speaking as a man to His God. Remember, Jesus is both God and man, the second person of the Trinity, and the word made flesh (John 1:1, 14)
Since He was both divine and man, as a man, He would naturally and properly say that His Father was the only True God. He was not denying His own divinity but affirming the Trueness of God as was done in the OT: "Now, O LORD our God, deliver us from his hand that all the kingdoms of the earth may know that You alone, LORD, are God," (Isaiah 37:20).
The truth is that Jesus was a man made under the Law (Gal. 4:4); and as a man, He would be subject to God.
Only, in this case, Jesus was subject to the Father. That is why Jesus called the Father the only true God; but it is not a phrase that excludes Christ, for Christ Himself said, "Before Abraham was, I am," (John 8:58) and did not deny being called God by Thomas in {John 20:28}
Third, {John 17:3} must be examined in the light of the totality of scripture. We see that Jesus is called God in {John 1:1, 14; 8:58; 20:28; Col. 2:9; and Heb. 1:8} Therefore, {John 17:3} cannot be interpreted in a way that disagrees with other scriptures. Of course, some people simply state that {John 17:3} cannot allow for Jesus being God, but the simple fact is that Jesus is called God by God and others. Therefore, the whole of scripture must be harmonized.
Fourth, this verse reflects the sonship of Jesus. The Father and the Son have a unique relationship. Jesus is the eternal Son. The terms Father and Son denote a relationship which is why God is called the God of the Son in {2 Cor. 11:31}
Fifth, Jesus identifies Himself with the Father. Jesus is in the Father, and the Father is in Jesus (John 10:38)
Jesus is one with the Father (John 10:30)
They are not divided in essence. So, in one sense Jesus is in the Father; and if the Father is the only true God, then Jesus is the True God.
Also, in {1 John 5:20} Jesus is called the only true God: "And we know that the Son of God has come, and has given us understanding, in order that we might know Him who is true, and we are in Him who is true, in His Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and eternal life." Jesus is not contradicting the word.
Sixth, if we are to be consistent using the Jehovah's Witness logic that the Father is the only true God, then the following verses present a problem - if we use their logic.
"For certain persons have crept in unnoticed, those who were long beforehand marked out for this condemnation, ungodly persons who turn the grace of our God into licentiousness and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ," (Jude 4)
Does this mean that the Father is not our Master and Lord? Of course not. Yet, Jesus is called our only Master and Lord.
"There was the true light which, coming into the world, enlightens every man. He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him,"(John 1:9-10)
Here we see Jesus being called the true light. Does this mean that the Father is not the true light? If not, then we have both the Son and the Father being the true light.
"And Jesus said to him, "Why do you call Me good? No one is good except God alone," (Mark 10:18)
Does this verse mean that Jesus is not good? Jesus said only God was good. Then, if we use the Jehovah's Witness logic, Jesus is not good. Of course, that doesn't make any sense.
"I, even I, am the Lord [YHWH}; And there is no savior besides Me," (Isaiah 43:11)
We know that Jesus is the Savior. Again, according to Witness logic, Jesus could not be the Savior since the Bible tells us that YHWH is the only Savior.
"Blessed be the Lord God, the God of Israel, Who alone works wonders," (Psalm 72:18)
Jesus performed many miracles. But if the Lord [YHWH] is the one who alone performs wonders, how then can it be that Jesus also?
"Thus says the Lord, your Redeemer, and the one who formed you from the womb, 'I, the Lord [YHWH], am the maker of all things, Stretching out the heavens by Myself, And spreading out the earth all alone,'" (Isaiah 44:24)
According to {John 1:3 and Col. 1:16-17} Jesus made all things. With JW logic you would have a problem.
{Col. 1:16-17} says, "For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities, all things have been created by Him and for Him. And He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together." Since God alone created all things, how could Jesus have done it? For more on this subject see the JW paper on {Col. 1:16-17}
As we can see, we cannot simply make a doctrine out of one verse. To do so is to invite error and it only serves to use the Bible to validate preconceived ideas about doctrine.

CANTICLES:
Stop running in circle man

Where is Jesus called " the only TRUE GOD" ?

KINDLY show us where Jesus said " I and the Father are ONE GOD" ?

Christianity Etc › Re: Jehovah's Witnesses: 17 Facts People Should Know About Them by brocab: 12:14am On Dec 05, 2017

Now I see you are a JW, had you notice, the scripture says no-one had seen God at anytime, because God is Spirit, and His Spirit the Holy Spirit was in Christ and Christ in the Father at the same time.
I" and the Father are one.. Those who believe in Christ, are connected to Him in Word and in truth.
We preach what, Jesus preached.
Have you actually read {John 17:3-8} Verse 5 and now O Father glorify Me with Yourself, with the Glory I had with You before the world was.
Have you not read {Isaiah 42:8} I am the Lord that is My name, and My Glory will I not give to another.
And Jesus is praying this to the Father, Glorify Me with Yourself, like I was before time began.

Crysthaniel:
This is not what about jehovah witnesses says.. We say according to the Bible... Note John 1:18 says NO MAN AS SEEN GOD AT ANY TIME.. also 1john 4:12says the same.. Jesus is not God but jehovah's first ever creation.. Colosians 1:15

Also shortly before his death Jesus made some declarations in John 17:3-8 please endeavor to read this Bible portion..

Christianity Etc › Re: Jehovah's Witnesses: 17 Facts People Should Know About Them by brocab: 12:09am On Dec 05, 2017

Well done, good and faithful servant..Are you a JW?

Crysthaniel:
please i don't know how am new to nairaland... Please how can I write on my page?

Christianity Etc › Re: Answers To Jehovah Witnesses Devil-inspired Questions About JESUS CHRIST!!! by brocab: 11:55pm On Dec 04, 2017*

I have been waiting for you to start this conversation, I will only give you the answers, when I have heard your side of trinity?
I already believe in the trinity reformation, The Father the Son and the Holy Spirit, these 3 are One.
So are you going to start this page? On a JW's point of view?
You have denied the truth, and you don't know the spirit of the Lord, If your spirit was connected in Christ-you would say, I know the spirit of the Lord.
And if I had asked you a question, I must be still waiting for the answer, because I haven't received a word from you..
I would like to here your side of the trinity, how you understand it, and what does it mean to you?
Feel free to write down what you believe, prove to me trinity, doesn't exist-because you are a JW, or prove to me trinity does exist because the form of trinity is written in the bible?

JMAN05:
Am not here to explain the spirit of the lord. I offered to discuss trinity. You asked me question, I ve answered it. I know the spirit of the lord.

I asked you to define Trinity as you understand it. What does trinity mean as you understand it? This will give the discussion a focus. I ve been waiting for your reply since.

Christianity Etc › Re: Jehovah's Witnesses: 17 Facts People Should Know About Them by brocab: 11:38pm On Dec 04, 2017

Please try writing on your own page..[quote author=Crysthaniel post=62986545][/quote]

Christianity Etc › Re: The Pentecostal Church Verses The Catholic Church. by brocab(op): 2:14am On Dec 04, 2017

You won't what I am about to write, but really who gave the priest any rights that only God can do is forgive our sin, if you aren't willing to seek God the Father, asking Him to forgive you, your sins are not forgiven. huh

Only God can forgive sins, and Christ, being God, has the power to do so as well, but He never communicated any such power to His disciples, nor did they ever assume any such power to themselves.
The key to understanding the meaning of {John 20:23} lies in the previous two verses: “Again Jesus said, ‘Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you.’ And with that he breathed on them and said, ‘Receive the Holy Spirit.’”
He sent them, as He is sending us, to bring the good news of the way to salvation and heaven to the whole world.
Jesus was leaving the earth physically but promised God would be with them in the person of the Holy Spirit living in them. As they proclaimed the gospel, they could honestly tell people who believed in that message that their sins were forgiven, and they could honestly tell people that did not believe in the message that their sins were not forgiven and that they stand condemned in God’s eyes.
Jesus said, “Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on him” (John 3:36)
Believers today have the very same mission given to us! We are obligated to share the gospel message, the way to heaven, to others in the world, and we go about that mission with the Holy Spirit living inside us, guiding us as we share His truth.
We are obligated to tell people the only way to be forgiven is through faith. Jesus said in {John 8:24} “If you do not believe that I am (God), you will indeed die in your sins.”
This is the very core of the gospel message and the very heart of what we are to explain to the world.
It was Jesus’ last command to His followers before He physically left the earth—carry forward the message of hope and save as many as will believe in Him.
Jesus preached a crucial message about forgiving our brothers, as God forgave us. We stand in grace, and He expects us to keep our hearts pure toward others, not holding grudges or harboring a spirit of unforgiveness, especially after He gave us such undeserved love and forgiveness at such a high personal cost to Himself!
Jesus said those who have been forgiven much, love much (Luke 7:47) He expects us to forgive others 70 times 7 times (Matthew 18:22)
Man if Jesus gave us this authority, no-one would have to repent nor go to the Father asking Him for our own forgiveness.
Its insane even thinking only your priest have this gift, I wouldn't like to meet Jesus on judgement day just to find out I believed in something that is all wrong, and unscriptural and end up in hell fire..

Jolliano:
The People of God are referred to as His sheep.
“For he is our God and we are the people of his pasture, the flock under his care” ( Psalm 95:7 ).

In John 10, Jesus identifies Himself as our Good Shepherd (John 10:11) and then says "My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me." - John 10 : 27.

Then when He was about to ascend into heaven, He gave Peter a three-fold command to “feed my sheep” in John 21:15-17.

Here, He makes Peter a Shepherd, physically PRESENT to rePRESENT Jesus, the Good Shepherd.

The Popes as successors of Saint Peter continue to do this feeding and will continue to until the Good Shepherd returns.
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On the other half, priests don't believe they are God (else they would be worshipping themselves na).

They forgive sins because they are ordained to that ministry and office.
In Mathew 9, Jesus says the Son of Man has the authority on earth to forgive sins
In John 20:21 - 23, Jesus gave the Apostles the power to forgive sins while sending them as the Father sent Him.

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