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Christianity Etc › Re: The Failure Of Christian Deism by budaatum: 4:55pm On Nov 02, 2017

STUPUDTHEISTS:
But Ebuka worships at chosen church and also believes in a god who interferes via miracles and whatnot. Truth is, the weasel is a nuthead Christian fundamentalist. He deceitfully argues for the deist god 'cause of the stupid and idiotic nature of the Bible god. Lol

Hmm, I wonder. I would describe him as a former Christian atheist deist, who is afraid of jettisoning the first two for fear of, well, something or the other, and evolving into a full blown fundamentalist atheist. A work in progress, at best.

I too would be afraid to realise and accept that my current state were apeish. But the joy of finally evolving into a human being sure would out way continuing in a state of not realising I had heretofore been stark naked in the Garden of Eden!

Christianity Etc › Re: The Failure Of Christian Deism by budaatum: 4:47pm On Nov 02, 2017

I hope I've shed light on KEB's position on the Stupid thread.

Christianity Etc › Re: Reformation: 500th Anniversary by budaatum(op): 4:35pm On Nov 02, 2017

Riko2:
here in Nigerian we don't celebrated dis things, and our churches never Recognize or mention anything like dis what we celebrated are Good Friday, Easter,Christmas and new year

Thank you. I am certain that if what you claim was not true, more people would have contributed here.

Christianity Etc › Re: The Failure Of Christian Deism by budaatum: 4:17pm On Nov 02, 2017

JackBizzle:
Bro, your thread was attacked because the op did not make sense. There is no such thing as a moral atheist or a science atheist.

And when we tried to explain it to you, vaxx, despite having worked between the limitations you set, you claimed your subjective opinion was objective reality but others subjectivity was them foolishly placing teapots in the sky (though I am certain you used stronger words of insult than that). The impression I had at the time was that of a child sulking in the rain but refusing to accept it was cold and wet. However, it occurred to me that that might be the exact same subjective opinion you had of me.

(I wonder if we are ready to discuss the differences between subjective opinion and objectivity yet? Just a thought.)

Christianity Etc › Re: The Failure Of Christian Deism by budaatum: 4:06pm On Nov 02, 2017

JackBizzle:

Keep helping the remixers of religion remix.

Thats how we ended up with "christian atheism".

It can't be helped, or stopped I'm afraid. It's proper name is 'Philosophy', just that we ride on the religious words that we have been taught and know, but rather than evolve, we believe! Which is the natural state of the unenlightened, and which is symbolised in the Myth of the Garden of Eden

Many would not agree, but even Christ mixed all sorts to create Christianity, "The Kingdom of God is within you," he said, reiterating the creation mix whereby Yahweh mythologically breathed himself into mud to create Man. And if you do not get it, "I will send the Holy Spirit to minister to you", he is further written to have said. But just in case people go too far and make up their own law, they add that he "did not come to change the law", but came to fulfil it, and mythologised that he died for people's sins and now sits on the right hand of god where he judges the living and the dead!

We are demythologising god here. That's us doing philosophy. Soon, you will note that the bible is completely degodded and revered no more than any old book. Be assured, a people of power are being wrought here.

What's that voice in my head that makes me think my subjectivity is objective again? Holy Ghosts!

Christianity Etc › Re: The Failure Of Christian Deism by budaatum: 1:28pm On Nov 02, 2017

JackBizzle:
You have given some good counter arguments. However, it all points to your summary that religion is just subjective ~~bollocks~~. Anyone can claim anything nowadays. Women now call themselves "muslim feminists".

That's exactly my point. Thanks for seeing it.

By the way, muslim feminism is possible and desirable. It is a position that fights against the misogyny that some have justified with their interpretation of the relevant religious text. Whatever one thinks, those texts were enlightenment when they were written, and thought on it evolves. So one must beware not to take the text, or the interpretation some give it, as the god. Or as the Buddhist would claim, do not mistake the finger for the moon it points to.

Christianity Etc › Re: How Much Hell Do I Get? by budaatum(op): 1:02pm On Nov 02, 2017*

ScienceWatch:
TO argue with the wise is expensive - Muhammad Ali.

Socrates would not agree, and he wasn't expensive.

To discuss with the wise is seeking to know and become wise too!

1 Like 1 Share

Christianity Etc › Re: The Failure Of Christian Deism by budaatum: 12:56pm On Nov 02, 2017

JackBizzle:
The points I made are very simple.

1. The God of the bible is a personal God. How can you be a deist and still follow Jesus or the bible when both of them make it clear that it is a prerequisite to believe in the personal God called Yahweh. No matter how you treat it, it is a contradiction. Christian Deism is an oxymoron.

What is meant by "believe in the personal God called Yahweh"? The fact that it is personal means my relationship is whatever I say it is. But I agree that it may seem contradictory and oxymoronic to perceived opinion

JackBizzle:
2. The bible is written by men inspired by God. That is the common saying but you are right- "inspired" is not appropriate because it is an understatement. What I mean to convey is that the bible is written by men who were in contact with God. That is a personal God.

There's that "personal" again!

JackBizzle:
3. Being a christian is far more than just picking a few teachings of Jesus christ. After all, few of his teachings are universal in many philosphies and religion. So, because I agree with the golden rule, I am now a christian?

Bollocks, pardon my Spanish. A certain Christian prayed to God in Jesus name last night before going to rob a bank. A certain Pastor prayed for his congregation last Sunday in Church, took from the offering and went to a LovePeddler house afterwards in the jet he bought. Surely we have taken a "few of his teachings" and disregarded the bits that do not suit our purposes. We are a la carte Christians taking from the menu as suits our hypocritical needs. Jesus is still lord, we would claim, and saviour. We don't have to be perfect you know, and the fact that Jesus died to wash my sins away is a comforting bonus!

JackBizzle:
4. Jesus was not a deist. Simple and short.

Jesus was what he was. Come on man! Some say Jesus was a god! Do I have to become a god too in order to followhim?

Buda is what buda is, least as far as buda is concerned. Simple and short

JackBizzle:
5. If you are rejected by a mainstream of your religion, then you are not a valid school of thought within the religion. Even if your logic is sound, you are outside the religion. An outlier.

Rubbish. And sorry again, it's for effect and not aimed at you personally. Church, or mainstream may reject me, but I intend, first, to lie and make them think I am holy, and second, I can go to a different church and not tell them, and third and more importantly, I can do my worship in private. I wouldn't be the first one doing a Jacob nor do I need authority to be whatever sort of Christian I claim to be!

JackBizzle:
6. We have a christian deist here that tries to make moral arguments based on his christian deism. That is what I am challenging. The difference with atheists (especially humanists) is that they base their morality on logic/rationality. The christian deist ignores over 75% of the bible but still wants to use a form of religious morality. How?

"Jesus is my lord and saviour. Jesus is not a god!" I have come to this conclusion based on logic and rational, as far as I am able to and it satisfies me. I may be an oxymoronic, non-mainstream, logical, rational, deist, atheist, Christian to some, but their opinion or label stamping, is not my problem!

My point is, ones relationship with ones god is inherentally subjective and personal to the individual.

Christianity Etc › Re: Please Nairalanders Help My Mum Is Dying by budaatum: 10:24pm On Nov 01, 2017

Dear Mod,

Please do not close this thread. Individuals are able to decide on their own what to do about it.

Buda

2 Likes 2 Shares

Christianity Etc › Re: How Much Hell Do I Get? by budaatum(op): 9:41pm On Nov 01, 2017

ScienceWatch:
Therefore my humble opinion is that all your conclusions are logically correct but is subject to change when higher reason and experiential
reality is applied. It would be an interesting experiment to see what you will produce after applying reason and experiential reality to your perfectly logical conclusions here.

Someone might apply "reason and experiential reality" this very instant.

Christianity Etc › Re: How Much Hell Do I Get? by budaatum(op): 9:38pm On Nov 01, 2017

MightySparrow:
When you refuse to argue with the wise your foolishness is boundless

..

I'm trying to figure this out. I would have thought that arguing with those 'wiser' than oneself would be foolish. But then, we could be arguing about which is the wiser, I suppose.

Christianity Etc › Re: The Failure Of Christian Deism by budaatum: 9:30pm On Nov 01, 2017

JackBizzle:
Christian deism is a term for those who believe in christianity, especially the teachings of Jesus but reject the divinity and miracles.

It is an interesting take on christianity but it is deeply flawed;

Why?

JackBizzle:
1) It has glaring contradictions (an oxymoron)
How can you be a deist who does not believe in personal gods but follow the teachings of a man who claims to receive instructions from a personal God in heaven? How can a "non-personal" God inspire people to write a bible?

We used to read stories about the hare and the tortoise when I was young. Would a lack of belief in any aspect of those stories stop one from being inspired by them? Does one have to believe in hare and tortoises to be inspired by them?

JackBizzle:
2) It has no agreed meaning How does this even relate to christianity.

It has a meaning, you just don't want to allow it to have one. Please read the quote below for further comprehension

JackBizzle:
Also, different christian deists agree and disagree on various aspects of Jesus's teaching.

The fact that Christ is a source of their inspiration would make some people classify them as Christians.

JackBizzle:
3) It is rejected by mainstream christianity as there is no church that preaches it.

The beliefs of the individual do not require mainstream acceptance. And one does not need a congregation to validate ones stance!

JackBizzle:
4) Jesus himself was not a deist. He was a full on theist who believed in a personal God

Some would argue he was a Jew but he seems to have stepped out of the box. It could also be argued that he has inspired one to do likewise, hence the personal position/perspective/ ideology etc.

JackBizzle:
5) Christian deism has no real morals as it picks and chooses whatever moral teaching from Jesus it like.

I've heard that one before, and it goes like this:

"Atheists have no morals because they....."

Get the drift?

Christianity Etc › Re: Reformation: 500th Anniversary by budaatum(op): 10:43pm On Oct 31, 2017

Is this Reformation being celebrated in today Nigeria?

Did your church acknowledge/recognise/or even mention it?

Christianity Etc › Reformation: 500th Anniversary by budaatum(op): 10:41pm On Oct 31, 2017

A special religious service is being held in the German town of Wittenberg to mark the 500th anniversary of the Reformation.

On this day in 1517, Martin Luther is said to have nailed 95 theses to the door of All Saints' Church in the town. The theologian said Christians could not buy or earn their way into heaven but only enter by the grace of God.

His criticism led to a split with the Roman Catholic Church and the birth of Protestantism. The Reformation caused lasting change in Europe, leading to wars and persecution, but also to greater freedom of religion and expression.

Christianity Etc › Re: Second amendment-> How do you find God, By intuition or by Logic? by budaatum: 5:21pm On Oct 31, 2017

otr1:
If God was to destroy Satan the moment he sinned, what would go through the minds of all the other angels? Fear would enter into their hearts right? And then they would end up serving God out of fear rather than love, which would destroy the very reason that God created heavenly beings and humans in the first place. And not only that, the universe could also be in a permanent cycle of sin and destruction. Someone sins, God destroys them, someone else sins and God destroys them. Then there wouldn't be an understanding of what sin is and why God is destroying those who sin. And the universe would never be a place of harmony and peace again. Also, Satan sucessfully caused a third of all God's angels to rebel and join him. Which means Satan was able to cast doubts in the minds of the angels. So if God just destroyed Satan and the angels who followed him, then the angels who didn't join with Satan could forever be left with doubts in their minds. And even if God just destroyed all of His creation and started again, there would be no guarantee that it wouldn't happen again. So God Had to have a plan to rid the universe of sin FOREVER.
First, God HAD to let Satan's rebellion take it's full course, so that the universe could see the wicked nature of Satan's plans. Until fully developed, Satan's rebellion would not appear the evil thing that it was. Second, God HAS to let sin and destruction (suffering) continue in this world in order for the RESULT of sin to be seen by all. And by seeing the result and utter suffering because of sin, it will stop sin and rebellion from rising up a second time.

Except sin did not stop, and rebellions go on more than ever!

Christianity Etc › Re: How Much Hell Do I Get? by budaatum(op): 4:53pm On Oct 31, 2017

vaxx:
Believing in judgemental God and non existing devil steal your future.....

You are the architect of your own destiny......

Whatever you become today is as a result of your handwork, for every action there is always reaction..... Isaac Newton law....which is the same thing as karma law....

There is nothing like hellfire or any devil....

I get you now. Thanks for your contribution.

Christianity Etc › Re: How Much Hell Do I Get? by budaatum(op): 4:51pm On Oct 31, 2017

vaxx:
This kind of karma is not a mysterious spooky force, but just a way of accepting the reality of reciprocity

I do not do doubt as far as gods are concerned. Nor am I asking to be preached to please. This is purely an exercise in thought. Do note, the premise is based on the following:
There is god.
There is heaven.
There must be hell
There must be a devil.
If you are in dispute with any of these assumptions, we may want to open a thread to discuss, but I do not wish to entertain them in this thread please.

So, karma, as you said, in a nut shell means, one reaps what one sows. I have relisted my sowings below.

budaatum:
Would a 'sinner', like me, a regular joe, never killed anyone born or unborn, told the occasional lie, stolen nothing huge and only from ma whilst in the early days of existence; said, "there are no gods" so a fool at best, broken say 62% of the commandments about 40% of the time etc.

They may not sound like really hell bound sins, but imagine they are.

The question might be, what would my karmic reward be, assuming I do not repent or accept Jesus as my lord and saviour, and die? Or are you suggesting my agony will be dished out here on earth?

Christianity Etc › Re: How Much Hell Do I Get? by budaatum(op): 12:42pm On Oct 31, 2017

vaxx:
Believing in judgemental God and non existing devil steal your future.....

You are the architect of your own destiny......

Whatever you become today is as a result of your handwork, for every action there is always reaction..... Isaac Newton law....which is the same thing as karma law....

There is nothing like hellfire or any devil....

Or gods? Which begs the question, from where cometh karma? is there like a savings account kept for all the things one does and the proceeds get dished out going forward? Then what would be the likely karmic reward for my sins and transgressions

p.s. I slipped that last word in. You need to work with the fact that my sins and transgressions amount to way more than any good I might have done before I died. My karmic account is negative.

Christianity Etc › Re: How Much Hell Do I Get? by budaatum(op): 2:52am On Oct 31, 2017

asalimpo:
You're a brave soul. I admire your courage. I believe ur mind is made up.
First, let me say this- you'll ever live to regret it .
That's oxymoronic. I know.
But God being just, will punish each person fairly.
To those who did great sins, great punishment will befall them,
to those who did lesser, lesser punishment. But it would be like it is bearable. They'll be no respite,
no matter what. Just that some ppl's own will be more than others.
For all inmates, they'll be weeping and gnashing of teeth!
Their fire wont go out day and night! forever!

So Hitler and I will not get the same punishment but both our punishments will be forever?

Would it be a fitting analogy of the magnitude of difference of weeping and gnashing of teethiness Hitler and co, and I will suffer, to say, if we were sentenced to the same prison term, while I might experience a reasonable amount of mosquito bitings, electric small small and a cold shower every six months; Hitler will receive tons of scorpion bites, 2 minutes of candle light at best and a freezing shower every ten years?

That might be fair! Least I can look at Hitler and co and thank God that I am not like those Soul Collectors over there!

By the way, I'm getting a feeling hell is a Catholic concept. Surely Protestantism has hell too?

Christianity Etc › Re: How Much Hell Do I Get? by budaatum(op): 2:25am On Oct 31, 2017*

asalimpo:
You pay for your sin ke, says who?
Who'll accept your payment? God?

I knew this will come up when I wrote "pay", and "cost".

Can it be like figure of speech please? I'm well aware gold is of no use to God, except tithes of course. Shall we understand me to mean "to serve my punishment"?

Do note, I do not intend to all of a sudden claim 'Jesus is Lord' on my deathbed. I think that will be dishonest, and reprehensible!

Christianity Etc › Re: Please Nairalanders Help My Mum Is Dying by budaatum: 2:17am On Oct 31, 2017

emmanueloti65:
now that you found out the moniker is he a scammer? That is the big question

I wasn't trying to prove if you are a scammer or not. I was curious why you wouldn't use your old moniker.

Take me, a going to hell atheist, according to some. If I asked people on here for financial assistance, I have no doubt I would get some. I'd even go as far as claiming the person who has insulted me the most on here would be the very first person to assist me. And I'd stick my neck out and claim the person I've insulted the most would be the very second - though the first and second might be the same person and neither is an atheist.

Honesty helps with credibility for starts. The relationships built up over time too even if they are insults thrown at each other. And a loving heart - not mine, mind!, but peoples on here despite our inability to be nice to one another, and my rudeness, and arrogance, and stupidity, and numerous other sins etc. I sure would lose all that goodwill if I were to all of a sudden need assistance from people I've been relating with for a number of years but decide to adopt a new moniker for the purpose and not even bother to say so or worse still, lie about it when I am finally rumbled. But that's me. A going to hell sort of weird like that kind of person.

I hope your ma gets well.

Christianity Etc › Re: How Much Hell Do I Get? by budaatum(op): 1:14am On Oct 31, 2017

Humanistme:
were you a Catholic?

being in State of grace doesn't mean being without an atom of sin. it means being without the so called mortal sins like murder, idolatry etc.

If anyone dies with venial sin he/she can avoid hell. they even believe the prayers/penance of his beloved ones can help him escape hell. This why Catholics pray for the dead.

No, I was not a catholic. Wasn't brought up with gods in any religious way. My initial knowledge of them came from reading Greek and Egyptian mythology. And then I met Nigerians!

I'm not trying to avoid going to hell here. I've done my sins and strongly believe in paying what's due. I'm just wondering what it will cost.

Christianity Etc › Re: Please Nairalanders Help My Mum Is Dying by budaatum: 1:06am On Oct 31, 2017

TheControversy:
Four bottles of Orijin for you sir

The bottles must go to 1Sharon. She clued us into the number.

1 Like

Christianity Etc › Re: Please Nairalanders Help My Mum Is Dying by budaatum: 12:42am On Oct 31, 2017

emmanueloti65:
you want the big answer ? yes! Now what is my crime? Just because i ask for help i cant keep my privacy again.

Thank you for answering.

You can do whatever you want dude. You just ain't doing it on my money. You need to learn some manners, and some humility would do you good, but don't mind me, please.

2 Likes

Christianity Etc › Re: Please Nairalanders Help My Mum Is Dying by budaatum: 12:25am On Oct 31, 2017

emmanueloti65:
and what is the crime or the scam emilo2stay has commited

Did you read my question? Have you answered it?

2 Likes

Christianity Etc › Re: Please Nairalanders Help My Mum Is Dying by budaatum: 12:14am On Oct 31, 2017

emmanueloti65:
pls dont lay false accusation where is your proof?

1Sharon:
He posted a number here, I searched it and that moniker came up

emmanueloti65:
about 90 thousand naira to discharge her so we can take her to anambra state. Any thing u can help with will be greatly appreciated. I can provide u with any proof you want. My phone is 08137694232 my account no is 0236653255 gtb acc name emmanuel ifeatu otti

EMILO2STAY:
interested. 08137694232

EMILO2STAY:
iphone5s white for sale 75k but negotiable call 08137694232
location owerri

EMILO2STAY:
add me too 08137694232

Are you EMILO2STAY or not?

2 Likes

Christianity Etc › Re: Creative Thoughts About God (A Compilation) by budaatum: 11:03pm On Oct 30, 2017*

butterflyl1on:
I never asked for your acknowledgement oh ye high and mighty dolt. You can take your acknowledgement and drown it.

Aowh, don't be like that. Verily verily I say unto thee, if you were sensible would you not be acknowledged? But no, you go around spewing hatred as if there were no god!

Repent and enter ye into the kingdom of god, or continue in your sinning ways and rot in the fiery fire of hell if you wish.

Christianity Etc › Re: Creative Thoughts About God (A Compilation) by budaatum: 10:56pm On Oct 30, 2017

KingEbukasBlog:
I'm a theist , you are an atheist , why are we talking about the bible ? Whether it is fallible or not does not question the existence of God . There are theists (deists) who criticize religious books and they acknowledge God's existence .

I guess you are used to a certain sort of atheist, or are used to justifying the existence of god. I know for a fact that no Alice went through a looking glass, for instance, but still quote from Through the Looking Glass, by Lewis Carroll. After all, do not words mean exactly what we say they mean, no more no less, regardless of whether there really was an Alice outside the imagination of Lewis Carroll?

That, I reckon, is what the problem is when discussing the Bible with an atheist. The words just tend not to hold the same meaning for those two! One is a fool and going to hell and the other is deluded and already in hell. And both think whatever they conjure up in their heads really matters. Except it really does, in the whole scheme of things.

But that's the beauty of that book. It is significantly influential in social development that to not understand why some people deify it (Word of God, God inspired, infallible, etc) implies a huge gap in the knowledge of the individual. But still, its function is served, regardless.

Hey! Thanks. I like it when you talk sexy!

Christianity Etc › Re: Creative Thoughts About God (A Compilation) by budaatum: 9:41pm On Oct 30, 2017

butterflyl1on:
Why not post your reaction to his apology when he realised his error. Would your phenomenally dumb riddled brain be able to swallow its pride and post what came after the post you are experiencing orgasm over?

No. You are too rude to be acknowledged any further than you are acknowledged, but when god gives you manners, I promise I will then.

Christianity Etc › Re: Creative Thoughts About God (A Compilation) by budaatum: 9:38pm On Oct 30, 2017

KingEbukasBlog:
Its a waste of time . It mostly leads to no where. Totally gratuitous .

Religious skepticism has nothing to do with atheism and atheism does not reject religion . There are religious atheists . Questioning religious books or doctrine does not impugn God's existence , so why waste our precious time ?

I can only discuss the bible with the deists and adherents of other religions .

Are you suggesting religious books are not infallible? (No, don't answer that. It sounds like one of those traps we atheists set, then juvenilely yell, voila!)

I don't think it is a waste of time. It creates doubt and awakens curiosity, which makes the individual ponder existence. Religious books have been significant in every societies development after all.

Christianity Etc › Re: How Much Hell Do I Get? by budaatum(op): 9:14pm On Oct 30, 2017

hopefulLandlord:
Your roasting would be equal, equal with that of a 7yo who's only sin was stealing 20 naira from his mother's purse to buy sweets

Hey! How is that fair? Should the punishment be commensurate with the sin?

Christianity Etc › Re: How Much Hell Do I Get? by budaatum(op): 9:12pm On Oct 30, 2017

Humanistme:
according to Catholicism you will go to purgatory to pay for your sins, then go to heaven after. They have mortal sin and venial sin, so all sin ain't equal. protestants and Pentecostals disagree.

Yea, purgatory crossed my mind. However, I found I might not qualify as I would not have died in a state of grace. I am assuming Hitler et al wouldn't qualify either.

Only those who die in the state of grace but have not yet fulfilled the temporal punishment due to their sin can be in Purgatory, and therefore no one in Purgatory will remain forever in that state nor go to hell. Wiki

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