₦airaland Forum

@ekwah,
Let me ask you too a question. What do you think will happen if at the end of the day after death you realise that your religious belief is not the true one. You realise the true god is actually vishnu or krishna as against Yahweh or Yeshuwa?

@All,
There is only one way we can prove or disprove that these MOGs are for real. They should restore an obvious amputee. That would be a permanent condition of shut up for all atheists/agnosts including myself.
@Enigma/FXKing,
You forgot to quote the concluding part of wikipedia report on religion in denmark
'By the end of 2007, 82.1%[2] of the Danish
population were members of the Evangelical Lutheran
Church which dropped to 81.5 % in 2008.[3] However,
similar to the rest of Scandinavia, North-west Europe
and Britain, only a small minority (less than 10 % of
the total population) attends churches for Sunday
services. In Copenhagen, membership of the Danish
state church dropped to 65% in 2008'. I guess it was an honest omission otherwise it would have further butressed my position.
I laugh in scandinavian

@emofine,
Yes music is a form of worship especialy if the being you are singing to actually exist. The kind of feeling I have when I hear or sing this songs now is no different from what I feel when I listen to Pakuru mo by whiz kid. No single emotional attachment, I just enjoy the rhythm thats all.

The OP does not believe in Santa Clause yet he holds fast to his belief in God. The only difference between God and Santa is that the Bible spoke about one but said nothing about the other. If the bible had made mention of Santa Clause, Christians all over the world would be worshiping him. These few similarities that I managed to gather: All blessings flow from God, all christmas gifts flow from Santa. God has flying angels and one of them is called Michael, Santa has flying reindeers and one of them is called Rudolf. God lives in the sky while Santa Stays in the north pole. God does things in secret different people, Santa does his own benevolence in secret through the chimneys. God is omnipresent cos he can be everywhere everytime, Santa tours round the world in one night. One final similarity. Both Santa Clause and God are somewhat imaginary magical beings

@Uyi Iredia,
You have a somewhat qeer philosophy. Good for you though especially as it relates to your religious belief system. It gives you a form of fluidity and a sense of formlessnessm Now I can appreciate where you are coming from.

@Uyi Iredia,
Now I understand your point. But your definition about your line of belief does not readily conote that of the christians, which of course I belonged to. They believe they can always tip situations in their favour. They believe they have authority over everything, including life and death. They will always quote texts like 'with long life shall the Lord satisfy me and show me his salvation', whereas several die untimely preventable deaths. This of course were some of he questions I asked myself: why hold fast to a belief that promises so much, takes so much from you yet gives so little. I also asked, what benefit has a christian over an atheist apart from the promise of eternal life which no one is sure about. I researched the lives of several christians and I realised that everyone is exposed to the same quatum of problems. Pastor Bimbo died in a plane crash just like any other person, , so what is the benefit? My answer was none.

Thank you so much for that answer.
Here is another story:
I was in my room one night.
Suddenly, my room became exceedingly bright.
Next thing I know there is an angel in my room.
He tells me an amazing story.
He says that there is a set of ancient golden plates
buried in the side of a hill in New York.
On them are the books of a lost race of Jewish
people who inhabited North America.
These plates bear inscriptions in the foreign
language of these people.
Eventually the angel leads me to the plates and lets
me take them home.
Even though the plates are in a foreign language,
the angel helps me to decipher and translate them.
Then the plates are taken up into heaven, never to
be seen again.
I have the book that I translated from the plates. It
tells of amazing things -- an entire civilization of
Jewish people living here in the United States
2,000 years ago.
And the resurrected Jesus came and visited these
people!
I also showed the golden plates to a number of real
people who are my eye witnesses, and I have their
signed attestations that they did, in fact, see and
touch the plates before the plates were taken up
into heaven.
Now, what would you say to me about this story?
Even though I do have a book, in English, that tells
the story of this lost Jewish civilization.

@OP,
Tell me if you think the following story is true and try to explain your position.

There is a grey bearded man who lives with his wife and somelittle beings called elves in the north pole.
Throughtout the year, he along with his family members busy themselves making toys.
On December 24th of every year, he packs all the toys for all the children of the world in a bag, mounts the bag on a sleigh and pulls the sleigh by a retinue of 8 or 9 flying reindeer. The name of one of the reindeers is Rudolf. He flies arround all the houses in the world dropping through the chimneys and delivering gifts for all children. He finishes just before Chrismas morning and goes back to the north pole to prepare for another year. The name of this man is called Santa Claus
Do you think this story is true. If yes why? If no Why?

@Uyi Iredia,
Is that what deify means? Accept insults even when the most vile words are used?
Honestly when people were attacking you at the opening of this thread I thought they were unfair. Ithought they should hear you out before castigating you. But with your last post, am actually speachless. You make very little sense with this. You are trying very hard, but unsuccessfuly, to assume formlessness and mystery while still trying to be philosophical at the same time. Unfortuanately you are doing a very bad job.

@Uyi iredia,
Where exactly do you belong? Are you a christian, Moslem, atheist or agnos?
@Obi1kenobi,
Truth is I do not discard all christian teachings with on fell swoop. I still try to imbibe some of the moral teachings which are not bad in themselves but when these MOGs pick these teachings up and twist them to fit their desires I become pensive. Another thing that turns me off is their superstious paranoir and them deifying their MOGs. Catholics, methodist and anglican still maintain some sense of sanity but the penterascals can drive you mad with their blind faith and bigotry.

@emofine,
I wont say I am redundant, or that God has takem over my home. I just love my wife and I want to make her happy. Besides, I enjoy the songs the sing in church, probably the only attraction there. The decision to do away with s.tupid religious belief was not something that came suddenly, it took me time because in my previous post I talked about my older brother who is an ordained reverend. I actually lived with him throughout my University days so I was deeply entrenched into the christian doctrines and dogmas which of course I believed but lately I went through some critical and logical thinking. One day I was in church, during a worship service I asked myself, what if all of us in this service were actually deluding ourselves thinking we are praying to God, but rather we are only talking to the thin air. Later I examined the lives of several people I know are true christians. Some of them have been praying for one thing for several years yet nothing has happened for them. After that I came to Nairaland. The information I got from Nairaland actually sealed everything. Through NL I got books, articles etc. Am still reading, and thats why I said it is a journey.

@Martian,
I do not have a iota of respect for any MOG either. Despite my wife's insistence that I go to church she knows religious programmes are a no no, especially when am in the living room. Cos when I listen to the crap those people have to say on air, I almost want to throw up. They are all too deceitful. Another interesting twist is that my elder brother is pastor in a new covenant church, in fact he was ordained a reverend sometimes last year. The only good thing about his pastoral work is that he is a successful businessman. Pastoral work for him is valauntary and the same goes for all the pastors in that ministry. Some of them are bank executives, proffessionals in different feilds and businessmen who have nothing to do with church funds. This of course does not make him any better than the rest of the crew who do nothing but milk the congregation for money.

Ooook! Oyedepo's God waited until winners was bombed before he asked him to make a pronouncement, Oyaks God is also waiting, very soon he to will be asked to make his own. How laughable. Their God had to wait for hundreds of people to be killed before he wakes up to inform His men to curse. Maybe your God needed to see people die first. He is probably a blood thirsty God as have been expressly described in the bible. That means there is a collabo btw your God and BHs God

Being an african atheist is not so easy especially in an environment that is so superstitious. People are always under the illision that they are being hunted by some unseen enemies hence the need to pray down fire and brimestone on them. I am an agnost but on a journey to becoming a non-theist. A few of my friends know and as for my wife, she is trying hard to make me change my mind to the extent of reporting me to everyone that matter in Daystar Christian Centre including the chairman of the church BOT and some pastors. I still go to church to make her happy and my house is also a hse fellowship center

I am particularly disturbed about the line of reasoning employed by you and your MOGs. I wonder why it doesnt bother you all that the people that have been killed were primarily human beings. Whatever faith they belonged to is of little significance. But for you guys so long as they do not belong to your faith and in extreme cases your denomination, they neither deserve your sympathy nor assistance. If truly the words spoken by the MOGs are as potent as you claimed it to be they should have made the pronouncements as soon as it was ascertained that these sect were a threat to human live and by extension national security. Honestly, I wish these things were potent too but I no it all a fluke. Unfortuanately your leaders were not bothered because the people being killed were hausas and a lot of them were not pentecostal christians. The truth is both you and Boko Haram are guilty of the same crime against humanity.

Why am I not surprised that you would say that there were no casualties. And why has your Jerry curled pastor Chris not said anything about Boko Haram or are the people being killed not human beings? Oh ok, I know why, they haven't attacked his business centre. Now that they have sent a message to him, maybe he would make his own mindless empty pronouncement. You claimed pastor chris' pronouncement would mark the end of the sect, does that mean Oyedepo's is not potent enough such that it took several months and the help of police, army and SSS to make it work? Lets see what would unfold in few days time, maybe pastor Oyakiole would shout or he would pretend that he is waiting for them to repent.

www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-874533.0.html
FXKing, the above link is for you. Boko Haram hit Suleja again today, attacking another charlatan organisation, Christ Embassy church. Now is the curse still working? You know you make me laugh everytime you post a reply.
@Jokingly, the scripture you posted is from Ephesian 6:12 right? For your info am not ignorant of your bible or the teachings of your MOGs. If you dont wrestle against flesh and blood continue to curse BH while they continue to anihilate you. I sincerely hope you wake up to smell the cofee on time. On one side I am saddened at the spate of killings by BH but on the side it has helped to reveal the falsehood behind the fear that MOGs have used to enslave Nigerians. Since Boko Haram members are not afraid to die because they have been deceived by their own leaders that 72virgins are waiting for them on the other side, they have been emboldened to puncture the balloon of lies created by your own MOGs like Oyedepo, Oyakilome etc.

FXKing,
Do you know why myself and a lot of other people are attacking you? Its because you, like every other apologist, have a superstitious mindset. As a result, everything that happens to BH is because your lying cowardly Bishop prayed (Notice I don't fail to say something negative about him, it because am waiting for his god to unleash his wrath on me like you people have been warning and till date nothing has happened). In the 1920s, Flemmings was performing an experiment on bacteria in some petri dishes. When he was done with his experiment on one particular day, he packed the dishes into a sink and as he was about to clean them up, he noticed mould growing on one of the dishes, which was not unusual, but the unusual thing was that the bacteria arround the mould were all dead. Flemmings and several more scientist went to work to study this phenomenon with the mould. After series of work, time and money were expended penicilum notatum was isolated, tested on bacteria infected mice and then on human beings. The rest is history now because even Oyedepo himself has benefited from the works of people who did not think God sprinkled molds in the dish to kill bacteria. They investigated the mold, the bacteria and all other conditions that make the mold potent. This is what rational thinking is all about, not some dillusional thinking that some daddy in the sky is responding to cries and has come to deliver. According to your bible, when men tried to build the tower of Babel, God came down to confuse their Language, was He on vacation when men built Burjh Khalifa and Has He relocated to Galaxy Andromeda since the Hubble Telescope was launched.

Oga FXKing,
Don't bury your head in the sand like the proverbial ostrich and pretend nothing is wrong with your religious belief. Let me ask you, how come the story of Horus and Osiri, as well as the conception story of Krishna are strikingly similar to the story of Mary and Jesus, the only difference being that those other stories were several hundreds of years older than the story of Jesus. Am sensing there is plagiarism from somewhere or don't you. I laugh in Chinese. hu hu hu hu

Enigma, trust christian apologists to discredit other people's work without a second thought. The writer cited Zuckerman for his work in Denmark in 2005. Zuckerman is a social scientist and he spent more than 14months in Denmark for the singular purpose of studying the lifestyle of an average Dane so the work was not that of an errant blogger. You know what, I dont want to join issues with you on Denmark on this particular thread because I dont want to derail the Thread. start another one, If it is interesting enogh i will join issues with u.

Enigma, trust christian apologists to discredit other people's work without a second thought. The writer cited Zuckerman for his work in Denmark in 2005. Zuckerman is a social scientist and he spent more than 14months in Denmark for the singular purpose of studying the lifestyle of an average Dane so the work was not that of an errant blogger. You know what, I dont want to join issues with you on Denmark on this particular thread because I dont want to derail the Thread. start another one, If it is interesting enogh i will join issues with u.

@Enigma, I do no make claims that I do not have a little piece of facts to back up. check this link out:
lindsay-mylifeasaforeigner..com/2011/03/religion-in-denmark.html

@FXKing,
I will pretend I did not see what you posted but let me give you a piece of advice. Go on and do your findings, come here make your submissions, pick holes in dissenting arguments and make informed conclusions rather than running arround the page looking for whom to attack without saying anything sensible. Honestly, I am dissapointed at the people who raised you, they did a poor and shoddy job. I am not saying this because you are religious but because your brain has been put on perpetual hybernation. I know a few smart but yet religious people like Sam Adeyemi, Poju Oyemade and Tunde Bakare but you, ? Calling you s.t.upid would mean I am insulting people that are genuinely s.t.upid

Volataire said whoever can make you belive absurdities can amke you commit atrocities. You are saying we should expand our view whilw you said you can never read anything that tries to discredit your belief in God. You sound so much like the priests in Galiloe's days who would not look into the telescope for fear of what they might discover. Your bible says the earth is flat and os the centre of the Universe, is that not enough reasons to probe into its authenticity? It also describes the stars like tiny lights in the sky that would drop on earth during the great tribulation. Now we know that these stars are even bigger than the earth itself. Let me tell you almost everyone here has read the bible and have at one believed it just like you, but when the claims therein were subjected to sound critical reasoning it was found wanting. I wont try to prove the existence or otherwise of a skydaddy, I wont derail the thread. Dare2think asked you a question, pls answer it in simple straightforward language

FXKing,
The issue in the Arab spring nations is not really a civil war in the real sense of it but of people who just got tired of a theiving rulling class that has governed them for too long. They rose up and fought that class which led to the ouster of people like Mubarak and Gadaffi. Nigeria on the other hand is too fearful. We are too afraid to stake our blood for a worthy cause which has hitherto led to the perpetuation of bad leadership. We are not at war because we are too docile, easily controlled and infinitely gullible. Now we know where this where this complacent attitude stems from. Its from the church and our religious inclination because we cannot touch the annointed/leaders because God put them their and they are answerable to God only. Lets hand him over to God is a popular phrase in our country. Instead of openly calling leaders to order you are busy praying. You open that your mandibles to say it is the prayers of Christians and you shamellessly type away with your tallons supporting these challatans, can you compare the standard of Living in Nigeria to Turkey or any other predominantly muslim middle eastern countries? For your information, irreligious countries like Denmark has one of the lowest corruptions indices in the world but Nigeria where saints like Oyedepo et al are praying against civil is one of the most corrupt in the world. Denmark, though has a state church, Lutheran Church, the average Danish only goes to church for weddings, funerals and on celebration days. They do not pray to a personal God and the stories in the bible are just that, Stories. The population has about 80% atheist yet it is about the fouth least corrupt Nation in the world. Nigeria on the other hand has a church at every street corner, people troupe to church in millions every sunday not to talk of weekly fellowships conducted by pentecostal generals like Oyedepo, Adeboye, Oyakilome, etc yet we proudly ranked 134 out of 187 countries examined. What then is the value of their prayers and/or curses?

Eeeyah, Fxking, sorry o o, i never meant to insult you but if my statements sounded like one, i apologise. Concerning qualifications trust me you cannot be my lecturer. If you r actualy as qualified as you claim them your tutors are disapointments cos they did not teach you how to reason logicaly. You are there claiming it is the christian prayer that has prevented civil war, was it god who told you or was it your men of god? Maybe you havent been listening to the lately, wars are not the only thns that destroys a nation, economic depresn is another culprit. Standard and Poors, a few days ago, reduced the rating of Spain, Italy, Greece etc.These are christian nations arent they? China today is amongst the top world best economies and it is far from being a christian nation. True there has been the arab spring but is there any form of war in saudi arabia, kuwait, dubai, oman, abu dhabi, quata and so many other muslim countries. Pls reason critical before you put your paws on the keyboard.

FXKing, pls what is your accademic qualification? Am asking this because the way you reason and present arguments actually connotes someone who doesnt have more than a secondary education. Your arguments are shallow, myopic, unintelligent, lack content. Sometimes when I read your posts I feel like throwing up. This is a forum where people are free to air their opinions about issues but this should be presented inteligently to make it interesting to read. Pls try and present your points like you have some brains inside that your skull

www.skeptic.ca/christ_conspiracy.htm

The above link is a comprehensive review of the Christ conspiracy.
Now if God was all knowing how come He had to ask Adam if he had eaten the fruit, if He was all knowing how come He didn't know man was going to stray? If he was all powerful why didn't He just destroy the Devil? Everything is just a bunch of bogus adaptation from several other religions arround the world. The jews do not even believe the Bible to be historical but rather allegorical. Christians are now unhappy because they think Christmas celebration is taking attention of Jesus but now on Santa Clause. The good thing about this is that Santa Clause was a real person, Jesus on the other hand was a collaboration of several mythical entities.

Kindly provide a proof of the above assertion.

I thought prayers and curses issued by these MOGs could work independently. Jesus did not have to wait for a lumber jack to kill the fruitless or did he? Its like saying a particular fluid you poured in your gas tank made your car work better, but this begs the question: Would your car work without this special fluid? Yes; Would your car take you to your destination if this fluid were not poured? Yes; Could this fluid power you car independent without petrol, engine oil, brake and gear oil? No. Then this fluid is not so important and it couldnt have helped your car to work better. That fluid is your prayers.
In another twist, how come your MOGs have never prayed against corrupt polititians milking our nation dry? And if he did, how come we are still 'blessed' with more corrupt leaders? Why is he attacking the symptom and leaving the disease to fester. Boko Haram is just an offshoot of corruption in government. He is not cursing because he/they have benefited immensely from the corrupt system

The founders of the Christian religion were somewhat smart. They envisaged people reaction and ability to question the bogus stories scripted in the new testament hence they came up with the concept of faith which really means suspend all rational and logical reasoning and embrace every dogma presented to you by the christian church and its bible. They invented Jesus who had no origin and no father. Just a mother and a phantom spirit. Elementary genetics teaches that to get a male child there will be a donation of 23 'Y' chromosomes from the father and another 23 'X' chromosomes making it 23 pairs of chromosomes. Now the question is where did the 'Y' chromosomes in Jesus come from. If from the Holy Spirit, then do spirits have any physical characteristics or features or properties such as the possession of sperm needed to fertilize Mary's ovum? Faith says believe absurdities that defy natural laws thus selling us creation of the Universe by an Uncreated God.

Lmao, if your MOGs put together are all powerful let the come out of hiding behind their bodyguards and pulpits and let the face BH. FXKing, tell me would the curses have worked if there were no security forces?