₦airaland Forum

menabadoo:
if you don't know buhari is a coupist then U are not a nigerian. Don't forget, senility also comes with age.

Oga show me evidence that state he is a coupist. I mean a credible evidence.

Your sitting president is senile and confused over time despite his age.

okoromike:
When he ruled btwen '83 and '85 was his runing not a fellow JIHADIST moslem??How about that?,,,,,,, ODE

Can you tell me how Buhari's reign in the 80's Jihadistic despite his struggle against Mainstaine islamist (a jihad movement).

If Buhari supports Jihad, he wouldnt have killed mainstaine from their struggle.

You bloody coward. . . . . . . You've got to use your brain

menabadoo:
You are not only a religious extremist but a coupist, tribalist and anything bad that can be accorded a desperate politician who want to rule @ the age of 73years.

- Where is your evidence that he pltted a coup?

- He is a tribalist, yet he choose from both Yoruba and Igbo as his running mate. Stop spreading lies just because of hate. . . . .

- Bro dont forget, wisdom comes with age. The GEJ you have in Aso Rock cannot match with ants and honey bee when it comes to political intelligence.



GMB 2015

okoromike:
But in 2003 general elections,you said no muslim should ever vote a christian..So how about that? BIGOT.

Was his running mate then not a christian?

How about that ret.ard?

Niggar trying hard to appear relevant. Abeg this stunt is becoming stale.

GEJ came up with shoeless slogan. . . . . .just to appear he live an impoverish live.

GMB came up with loan for acquisition of his form. . . . .just to appear as if poverty dey under him clothes.

Atiku is here with his own stunt. . . This stunt would have been better if he is ready not to receive any allowance.

Also, if he thinks he would serve the nation for free, why cant he dash the motherless children and widows in his home state the 27 million naira he used to acquire form?

Sometimes I wonder, cant these people sever people without holding an office?

Never knew Seun has sold Nairaland to PDP. All I was thinking is that I am in Nairaland but this Seun has revealed that this Forum is now PDPland. Why should I be in the forum where the admin has been sold and now clouded with bias mind.

The better day would come. . . . . .and GMB would be Nigeria president come 2015. You can have all your forum Seun where you can propagate your hatred fully.


Give us the chance so that we will be able to deactivate our accounts. We thought we were on nairaland without knowing we are in PDPland. Let us go seun. Provide the deactivation key. . . . . .

Operation kick Jonathan back to Otueke

ProphetUdeme:
k. Are u on facebk, whatsapp. Will be inclined towards knowing u more thanks

Our ladies are not whoore like Mother Mary.

Pls back off

macof: I blame folykaze for entertaining things like this

Spirit wife ko, spirit kids ni

Oga, you should know I ignore him when he raise some silly questions?

The way you stylishly insult our people is what I hate about your post on this thread.

Orisha A gbe a. Eja ya she

nnofaith: Africans and BS!

To think some of these folks actually went to school!!

Silly white as s-licker.

macof: Lol you probably didn't understand a thing I posted as you didn't even answer my questions

I'll leave u to ur belief that abiku are evil spirits tormenting a family for revenge

What is the question you asked that have not been answered?

And where did I say Abiku torment people for a revenge?

How is barring one from attaining Iwa pele is a revenge?

Is 'Eyin Aseni' not understandeable enough to you?


This is not about believe, it is about the fact on ground from Odu Ifa (body of knowledge) which you tagged as lack of knowledge. If you cant reach your awo, you can get some books and read. . . . ..

macof: Yes, I said Abiku is preceded by illness..is that not true?

Have u heard of an Abiku case where the child dies without ever falling sick?
It's a medical issue, an illness just less understood than malaria

Because Spirits control all things doesn't mean that we keep blaming spirits for what we failed to understand

If you think you understand Abiku
What is the reason for Abiku? Why does it affect the same couple several times?
Don't tell me it's a curse, or the spirit just wants to torture them for fun

Am nt saying abiku children have not been saved using medicines and rituals that give them strength but in very few cases...even upon the rituals they still fall sick regularly
or have u heard that an abiku child was cured?

Malaria, fever, chicken pox were easy deal for Olosanyin(medical practitioners) they never lasted two days but not Abiku.which constantly required certain measures to keep the child living...and it wasn't 100% failproof

Brother, I want you to understand that aisan or arun (disease) is one of Ajogun that battles human from ataining Iwa-pele. So you should understand how aisan is more spiritual like than mere medical problems.

Saying Abiku is preceeded by illness is not completely true. Some Abiku are healthy at birth but still die when they have spent there agree time. And you have not tell us what of specific is the illness or disease that affect Abiku which Yoruba people lack knowledge of. How can people that pervert an Abiku from dying be described by you as non-knowledgeable? The insult you throw at our people is unbearable.

Note for the sake of knowledge, Sickness, illness or disease is one of the 8 Ajoguns who serve as a servant for Eshu. Aisan and Iku according to Odu Otuurupon Meji are keepers of Orunmila treasury (Akapo). According to that Odu, Orunmila is the one that cast divination to Iku, and made Aisan his Representative. The verse is saying specifically that aisan or arun and Iku shouldnt scare us away because Ifa know who they are and us. So babalawo, Aisan or Iku are one Awo-ifa. This should explain how they are spirits.

In Odu Owonrin Meji, there is a verse that shows you can communicate with stomach ache to leave you. Ofo is used for communicating with Aisan. In the book, Ijinle oun enu ifa, there are lot of Ofo for different diseases. . . . .this is because they are spirits and are alive.

Ifa knows each disease and what is best for chasing them away. If someone is sick, Eshu is the one that take sacrifice for Ajogun, Emere and Orishas. Eshu takes 5% share and deliver the rest to who needs them. So how would you make medicine for illness without consulting the spirit? Is it Osanyin or Ifa or the herbs who are spirits on it own are what you will ignore? Or you dont know Iroko, Bara, koko and other herbs are spirits? And you dont know aisan is a spirit?

I think one day, you will advice your Awo to clean his Ifa with tura soap and sponge. Or when awede cant be found in the bush, you ask your awo to use Klin detergent because it just a stain or dirt problem which woule be removed so nothing spritual about it. And use poutry chicken instead of local chicken for sacrifice because they are both chicken. These herbs, illness or death are spiritual agent meant for a purpose.

Abiku are called 'Eyin aseni' in Osa Meji. They are evil doer. . . . .hindering person from achieving Iwa-pele. Yoruba people say 'Eyin kule lota wa, ile l'aseni ngbe'. Abiku live and dwell with us. . .they are part of us but never with the intention of making us getting Ire (owo, omo ati alafia pelu Iwa baba oro).

pesty100: the fact that sin was created and humans had to die; is that also metaphoric

Where did you read in the passage that sin was created?

One they were never married, and they had sex which lead to pregnancy. In the bible, is this not fornication? Why were Adam and eve not punished for fornication if they had sinned?

The fruit was eaten by human so they have to die like you stated. . . .was it eaten by animals and plants too because they die?

You just dont read bible like story book. And all ancient accounts have there essense.

Someon on this thread explained Adam and Eve are nations of people. Reading from you won lines, you mean they are two individuals.

Some people understand the account to be passage of time and change of ages. You took it as a time within short period.

You dont have to hold me down if you got perplexed in between.





And between. . . .no time for argument on sundat. There is nothing to achieve here so I better hook up with something better

I think the passage is metaphoric. . . .

Would come back. . . .busy with her

macof: I never said there's no way for preventing abiku??

I said abiku is a most likely a medical problem which needs medical approach nt excessive talks of spirits
I haven't seen anything to make me think otherwise, maybe when I sleep on it Orunmila might show tonight

Going spiritual is different from blaming a spirit for something that could have been prevented if understood better.

Illness is nt something of joy but instead of blaming spirits illnesses don't just appear for no cause and reason, the result of lack of understanding in an illness without a known cure usually results to death

You indeed said Abiku cases is proceeded by illness and isnt a spiritual thing but medical proble. You even label it as lack of understanding of some medical problems. And you have stylishly took the blame on medicine. So how would you explain the cases of abiku that were perverted from dying? How would explain kokumo and Durojaye who are old today without any medical problem posing death threat?

And again you keep mentioning Illness. . . . .what exactly is the illness of Abiku? What specifically is the disease that cause there early death? If it is all about medical approach, dont you think there is enough herbs in the forest for medication? And yes, there are cases of ones that are healthy but die at early stage. . . .does this not make you think issue has gone beyond medical approach?

This is the reason Yoruba people ask parents to pre-check Isekojaye of their children so that they can know who is who and how to handle such a child. I know what and what to touch and not to touch because my parent have been warning me since I was a child just because they know who I am. A mother that frequently give birth to Abiku tends to get closer to Babalawo who would do the necessary things from early stage of pregnancy. This is where such children get there names. . . .rituals and sacrifice with medicines given to them defines who they really are.

And bro, everything is an effect of a spirit. Be it medical problem or spiritual. . . . .it is all spirit.

I know of a little gal that is scared of everything. They call the spirit tormrnting her 'Eru'. No matter how her parents tried to brace courage round her, she is scared of even her shadow. And the necessary ritual was done. . . .it was just incision and application of some stuff in her blood. That was the end of excessive fear.

In Ifa, efori is caused by a spirit, majele is a spirit, even olejija which some call a psychological problem is effected by a spirit. Call it force or spirit, something effects it.

This is not a matter of blaming the spirit, this is a matter of knowing what is what and doing what is necessary to curtain this effects.

The knowledge of illness has caused lot death. Malaria has been killing in millions despite the knowledge of it in our society. You dont blame death on lack of knowledge, it is problem of not taking precautionary measure considering time, person, cause and getting of whats needed.

My dad does not waste time treating headache with medicine, he only speaks to it and it get cured. I have a uncle that know this things but they are not ready to teach. . . .due to age factor. I came across this ofo in wande abimbola book but it not complete so not working.

Everything is effect from the spirit, medical problem included. Ti o ba ti mo oruko ti aisan je, a ba wi ni, a fun ni oun ti ofe a si fi ni sile. Hope you get that?

And pls do more research on Abiku

Ubenedictus: If i had an explanation for every story i hear from africa, i would be the wisest man alive.


Any way, since macof and folykaze are here, i have a question.

There are stories my mum told me about, dead people (usually those who died by accident) who go and live in some other places at times even fathering children.

What i your takes on that?

Guy I heard about this but have not seen one. . . .

lastchild: good narration,pls what is ire?

Goodness or prosperity

macof: Personally I don't believe Ogbanje/Abiku spirits.
While there is a sort of consciousness in everything, a spirit for everything. I think the case of the children of the same parent dying before marriageable age is due to some health issues not supernatural evil spirits haunting the family

I have no reasons to take the Ogbanje spirits hypothesis seriously because in all ogbanje issues, the death is preceeded by illness

In another light they are caused by evil spirits as spirits control the unseen but instead of dwelling on the spirit part there's also a medical approach some ancients failed to understand

Sorry to cut in bro. . . . .when did you learn that there is no way from perverting Abiku from dying? Oh pls, the remilekun, durosinmi, olorundaisi, pamilerin, ikuyinminu and kokumo I know are married, now big men and women in towns. Some have even lost their teeths due to old age. . . ..yet they are Abiku, and also bearing Abiku's name. This evidently shows Abiku can be made to stay to marriage and walking on three foot age. . . . . .

And since you think medical approach should be followed, I think we should have a final stop on child mortality rate. This would help stop the tears rolling on the cheek of our mothers.

And will Babalawo takes medical approach without going spiritual? Will Babalawo prescibe medicines without doing proper consultation with spirits? Will Babalawo or Onisegun take herbs and prepare concortion without evoking the spirit? Friend, you are more than this. . . . .and I expect answers from you.

Read between your words, you mentioned that Oganje (Emere) death proceed from illness. . . .if I may ask, is illness something of Joy? Have you seen someone happy over sickness of their heir? 'Se nkan ire ni aisan abi o mo wipe agbana buruku ni'?

For the record, Emere grows old. . . .even older than normal person. They are the ones affecting one Ire to either good or bad.

So much I respect your believe friend, your points have no ground.

edogho: i would recommend u speak with macof or folykaze on this topic. where be dis guys esp folykaze? been long o. will wait sha... NB: i'm in the dark as to their existence. so what i'm not aware of, doesn't have any bearing to what i believe. folykaze and macof oya make una come out with it..

Hey Man.

Nairaland has become boring. . . .that is the reason I only read through threads without parting in the discussions.

@ the topic

I have learnt about believe in Abiku. . .and have also meet person who lost her children some days after birth who and others claim the deceased babies are Abiku.

Base on what I learnt and heard, Abiku when splitted is 'Abi' (being born) + 'ku' (died). It is a tag given to a baby that die immeidately or some days after birth. In the Yoruba society, they are believe to be beings from spiritual world on a short period journey to earth. They of specif comes to earth on the purpose of making their parents unhappy, causing them to cry and troubling them. On most occasions and from my experience, these babies die a day after or before or the very day of naming ceremony. You know how sadden that would be.. . . .

And on the other case, emere which the OP refer to as Oganje is different from Abiku. Though they are both from the spritual realm. . . . .and note, everything on earth including every individuals are from the spiritual realm. There is this saying in Yoruba, 'Ajo Laye' (earth is a sojourning path) which reveal we are all from Ajule Orun (spiritual realm) and on a course of attaining 'Iwa pele'. This is the reason we circled after death bringing us to attainment of Iwa pele. . . . . . . This circling journey is what Yoruba people call Asehinwaye (kind of reincarntion).

So on this cousre, there are seven Ire (prosperities); child bearing is included which Man should acquire which would guild him through achieving Iwa Pele. So Abiku are there to obstruct this achievement.

While Abiku die after birth to cause bitterness in a home, Emere have potentials of affecting Ire in a home. Emere does not die after birth. Some even can die of old age. . . . .but there course is affecting one's Ire.

This is my submission base on what I have learnt from book and people. Feel free to ask any question on what have written

oduastates: ESHU(the God the evil ,crusading xtian slavemasters falsely called the devil)

Eṣù is the God of the crossroad, and plays frequently by leading mortals to temptation and possible tribulation in the hopes that the experience will lead ultimately to their maturation.
Eshu presents you with choices and guides you to make the right choices thereby helping you to develop Iwa (good behaviour/character)

Ekiti got to Orita-meta(crossroad), they had
1 fayemi (the mostly stable road on which they were travelling)
2 Fatose (the Jaga JAGA thuggery/assassination/lawless /corruption road they had travelled before.
3 bamidele( the road they have never travelled )

It does not take rocket science or mystic powers to make the right choices.
It is obvious that EKITI is suffering from a deficiency in the Iwa and the omoluabi department.
All those who voted for this evil thug of a man are a disgrace to the yoruba nation and they mock Eledumare.

Omo awo, awo Ifa

Wa pe, obi a gbo lenu re kinkin

TB Joshua is acting in accordance with the laid down scripture from God. Bribery is scriptural and all the dumbfvck christians trying hard to defend him are doing contrary to the laid down inspiration of God.

Proverbs 17:8 ESV
English Standard Version

8: A bribe is like a magic stone in the eyes of the one who gives it; wherever he turns he prospers.

TB joshua had thought it well base on what he learnt from the bible that bribery is like a magical stone which would magically get the birds on their flight. A man of God inspired by the holy ghost that could say in the released record that those journalist should help him go and correct what is out there. . . .has done what is written. The birds actually flew away but the stubborn one sang to the hearing of wilds what it saw while sitting on the wall. Halleluyah!

Unfortunately, this precious stone doesnt make the hand of it thrower prosper.

There is nothing new in this since it comes from christianity. . . . .the bible even support it. . .

Proverbs 17:8 ESV
English Standard Version

8: A bribe is like a magic stone in the eyes of the one who gives it; wherever he turns he prospers.

Hehehehehehehe

TB Joshua thought bribery would work magically like a precious stone, this place it turns, it brings disgrace. . . .

Somebody shout Halleluyah

bolaino: no I haven't used my drugs, mr orisha worshiper, lol

I have my Ori and I venerate it. . . . . .better than a crook claiming to be a CIA agent.

Oga propeht, what vision do you have to deliver? Wizkid didnt hear your voices. . . . .why cant you take your cowardice to GEJ?

Pastor Babalawo chief Prophet CIA agent at it again. . . . .

Have you used your drugs?

naija2dabone: You amaze me. How does a change in nomenclature affect the outcome of a debate?

If really, a change in name affects sense of reasoning, then my advice to your is to change your moniker then maybe, (maybe) you might begin to make some sense.

Tell you lie lie Mohammed to take up the challenge or shut d f up forever.

We prefer to have a chat with Jay-Z just like your drunken boss debated with D-banj. . . . . . .

GEJ dogs barking at the top of their voice. . . . . .shebi dem don feed them well?

They should take their rally to Maiduguri where their awareness is needed most

akpos4uall: What a nice thread with some nice replies. Thanks to FOLYKAZE & macof I've just learnt something new about consciousness. Clearly, few or nobody else agrees with both of them. To me, with their view, a better understanding of the terms/words life, death & afterlife can be easily explained. Hence, if you both don't mind, may you give us some examples as well as questions that will clarify what life, death and afterlife are before finally answering the OP?

There is this statement I will employ here. . . . .

"You are alive – can you say what life is? You are alive – can you reduce your experience of life into objective knowledge and make a statement of what life is? And remember that you are alive, so you must know.

You don’t know life while you are alive and you are bothering about death! You will have enough time in your grave. At that time you can meditate on what death is. Right now, live! And don’t live lukewarm.”"

Mediate on this

I will like to ask Uyi, why did you choose to return to christianity and not Islam?

OlaoChi: is it the Orungan who raped his mother Yemoja?

Yes

Ghost01: You danced around the concept ni jare, without hitting the nail on the head. It's the same every time you "attack" an atheist for his/her unbelief. And that necessitated my tagging and asking you. Vagueness is not (always) clarity.

I attack atheists or they bark at me for calling them out?

From ny previous post, I made mention of theartre gallery, infuencial or admired or adored person, natural entities and Mind DEFINED as God. Can you tell me how this is vague?

Will an atheist desbelieve in God defined as theatre gallery, influencial person, natural entities and mind?

If they disbelieve, it isnt too far to see they have problem with their head.

If they believe, it isnt far to know they aint an atheist anymore.




This is very simple. . . . . .stop denying the obvious

Ghost01: @FOLYKAZE - Would you be so kind as to define "God" before I answer your two questions?

Oga pls dont be dodggy abeg.

There are many definitions of God. . . . .I have like two different definitions in my previous post which could guide you through answering my question.

Thanks

@ TheBigUrban2

When are you going to be man enough to have a conversation with Osanyin. . . .the doll?