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This lady said it all while responding to similar questions on another thread. Hopefully she'll come here and share more thoughts. nuesaweso: |
nuesaweso:God Bless you my sister. I couldn't have said it better. We need more educated opinions like yours in this country. You may want to also contribute to this thread https://www.nairaland.com/2308462/buhari-govt-eyeing-lagos-template/6#33671990 |
OrlandoOwoh:I gave the example of Afam because I heard Afam is deliberately not generating to maximum installed capacity because the national grid cannot take the power (I can't confirm this but I tend to believe the story). So, the guy in ikeja may probably not be sleeping in darkness if this was not the case. Don't get me wrong because I am not asking for more money to be pumped into the grid. I just don't want us to lose that flexibility but yanking off an upper layer of connectivity as backup. Again I repeat, I am for 1000% decentralization. But now consider this scenario: suppose Lagos alone needs more than 10 IPPs because of the share size of population and commercial entities. Who says all the IPPs have to be installed in Lagos? Lagos is even expanding into the atlantic ocean! Are we going to sacrifice schools and parks and possible further development just because of this when we have untapped land in Osun for example with less than a quarter of Lagos power needs. If Osun or Ekiti or bayelsa need 100MW for example, why not install 300 or even 500MW and transport the rest to Lagos through this upper layer? That way you keep the lifestyle in Lagos and also industries in Ogun going while generating employment in Osun/ekiti and improving their economy. This does not mean 8 out of the 10 IPPs that Lagos need cannot be installed around the Lagos state. In summary: Retain the national grid as it is without pumping more money for now and concentrate on local generation for communities using the DISCos. The definition of community need to be clear - is it state, LGAs, LCDA, estates, streets etc). However, DISCos should be encouraged to generate more power so as to sell to other DISCos serving other communities that may need it if/when required through an upper distribution or transmission layer. aresa:I don't think the local communities should handle this. Who will coordinate this? The local government chairmen? I believe this will be creating another mini FG in the various communities. Gov. Fashola was once credited to have said "government does not have business in business" and I completely agree with him. Let the discos handle this as a commercial venture. Nigeria is already covered by the various discos. But there may be need to reonstitute the discos to better serve the communities. Let give them power to generate and remove any bottleneck preventing them from getting finance from banks. |
aresa:Of course it has to serve as backup. That is why i propose focusing less on the national grid and pay more attention to local generations. But it still has a role to play. |
OrlandoOwoh:Does it also make sense for someone in Ikeja to keep sleeping in darkness while there is excess power in Afam in Rivers state that cannot be pushed to national grid? better still, does it makes sense for someone in Mowe/Ibafo to be sleeping in darkness while their is power in Berger simply because we refuse to make room for that flexibility? What happens to the idea of the DISCO serving Berger to sell power to the DISCO serving Mowe? Having said that, I am 100% for decentralization (generating power nearby to the people that need it), but I also believe flexibility and robustness should not be thrown out of the window. |
aresa:I understand. That is why I asked earlier where do we draw the line - state level, LGAs, LCDA or at street level? Obviously every street cannot have a power plant and on the flip side of the coin, Lagos is "too big" for just one power station. But then, we can't just use Lagos as bench mark. There are over 700 LGA in Nigeria, so I don't think its economical to have 700 power stations. Some states will survive with just two or three power station while some may need up to ten or more. But my point is whatever the number of stations are in any state, there should be the flexibility to share power with other states/regions through a higher level of connectivity (i.e transmission). |
TonySpike:Exactly!! |
Mynd44:Ok maybe we are saying the same thing from different angles. BUT I still don't think we should abandon the existing transmission out-rightly. We have seen generators and transformers go up in flames. That can also happen to a local power station. The idea of national transmission is to create room for flexibility and maneuvering. Imagine something happens to Eko disco that is exclusively generating and serving Lagos. If anything happens to the transformer or generator without the flexibility of "sharing" power with the rest of the country, the entire state will be under darkness while their will be power in Mowe and Ibafo ![]() I think the national grid should be left alone for now and concentrate on local/regional generation with the possibility of taking/pushing power from/to the national grid when it becomes necessary. Let us not get too carried away and throw away the baby with the bathwater. |
Mynd44:But there is no where in the world where distribution is phased out. Where do we draw the line? State level, LGAs, LCDA, Street? There is need to generate power in a central location within a region and distribute within that region. Except you are advocating everybody should generate their own electricity (which is pretty much what we have now with the numerous noisy i-pass-my-neighbours) there is no way you can eliminate distribution. You are right, there is nothing stopping enugu from generating from coal and kano from solar. But every street in enugu cannot have a coal power plant! In the same manner, ever street in kano cannot have a solar farm. That is why there should be a central location in enugu/kano where the coal plant/solar farm will be installed and DISTRIBUTED across the state. But I disagree with the idea of transporting gas in bottles to power plant. The recurrent logistics/efficiency/risk is just not worth it. Run a pipe to a central place like it is being done by some now. Generate the electricity and again DISTRIBUTE across the state or jurisdiction (if we are using discos that cut across a number of states) |
Reference:In other words, we should fold our arms and resign to fate. But why hasn't there been any incident to the supply line of the various companies that are currently generating electricity using gas? People living close to flour mills and lafarge that are generating from gas have not experienced any misharp till date. I understand the risk of vandalism with crude and petrol lines. But who is the fo0l that will go and vandalize gas pipeline? Will he put it in 20liter kegs or buckets? Agreed that efficiency rises with size/scale but we don't have the grid to pump the electricity into. so the short/medium term solution in my opinion is decentralization. |
Code213:Double figures? Where you wan see that one? better go check well o. I calculated mine and its exactly 5.6%. The statement showed my total contribution from the beginning and also shamelessly showed the total gain. A simple calculation of gain divided be total contribution gave me 5.6%. What a scam!! |
aresa:Thank you jare my broda. We don't really need this much dependence on the national grid. Although I will not be too eager to say it should be demolished out-rightly. I think Nigeria is basically covered by the spread of the various DISCOs. If there is any law preventing the DISCOs from generating power for there jurisdictions, such laws should be reviewed and relaxed. Of what benefit is a DISCO that doesn't get power to distribute to its customers? If we let the DISCOs generate a percentage of the power demand from their localities and augment with whatever they get from the national grid, we would have solved over 60% of our electricity problem without having to wait for another decade to fix the national grid. |
carpenter:So what is the primary supply to these national and local grid? Selling back to the grid is done by individuals in US - I'm not sure about locality selling back to the grid. How many individuals in Nigeria can generate enough for himself and still have enough to sell to the grid. Decentralization is good and it is the way to go in my opinion. But going too deep is unrealistic, wasteful and unsustainable. I think the discos have covered nigeria and if the decentralization is done on that basis we should be fine. Don't ask alimosho local gov. generate and then mushin also to generate. We will have 774 generating station do we has space for that? Will these be optimally utilized? I think we should just do the decentralization at the state level or at the DISCO level. |
Mynd44:I agree with you only to the idea of decentralization. But going Bit-by-bit to as low as local government generation is wasteful, inefficient and unsustainable. A number of companies here in Nigeria are already generating their own power from gas. Why IPPs continue to hide behind lack of gas supply is still untenable to me. The only conclusion I have made is that there is no political will or intent to solve the power problem. If the pdp led gov. had allowed Tinubu to go ahead wit the enron power project, other states would have replicated it and we won't be where we are today. It is only when it comes to IPPs that gas becomes an issue. Gaslink (a subsidiary of oando) and others have partnered with Nigerian Gas Company (NGC) and have been delivering gas to private companies. Some of these private companies are using the gas to generate power. Here is a small list: Rusal Industries, Ikot Abasi, Akwa Ibom State get gas from NGC (Nigerian Gas Company) http://www.rusal.ru/en/about/51.aspx Alausa power Limited get gas from GASLINK - commissioned in 2013 http://www.oandoplc.com/oando-gas-and-power/subsidiaries/alausa-power-limited/ Flourmills http://www.fmnplc.com/home/about.php Lafarge already generating about 90MW from gas is looking to more than tripple power generation http://www.ventures-africa.com/archives/49321 Our transmission line cannot support our national power need. We need to decentralise (even if it is partial decentralization). My proposal is similar to that of Tinubu. It is about empowering DISCOs to generate a bit of the power required for their respective territories to augment what they get from the national grid. We already have companies generation power from gas in this country, so nobody should ask me how will the discos get gas. The question should be how we will relax the law preventing them from generating limited amount of power. |
aresa:I have a similar hypothesis and I have not seen why it should not work. I stated this on another thread a few days ago. gists: |
While reading, I was really happy and excited for the people of Biafra until I read this statement. xmich:With 5 governors, deputy senate president and deputy speaker HOR and a good number of ministers for the last eight years, and considering how money play a major rule in Nigeria political space, I wonder how else these guys hope to find enough finance to pursue their course. And did i just read this statement "we think the people we are fighting for will appreciate the effort, but they have not bought into the idea of supporting the movement," Jokers like this make it difficult for people to take them serious. When the Igbos are truly serious and settle down on what they want, they will be a force to recorn with (Some what Biafra while some want to see an Igbo president of Nigeria). |
Code213:my broda no be small thing o. What I have with those guys can buy a small tear-rubber car! It hurts to get turned-down by people you call friends who for reasons best known to them refuse to give you this loan - especially when you know they have it. So, I was just thinking how to get this short-time loan and the next thing I saw was a statement of account from my PFA in my inbox telling me I have x million. The PFA is not even ashamed to tell me my money has grown by a miserable 5% since I stated. Their should be a way to talk to these guys to let me take a part of it for the next 6 weeks as loan. I don't mind signing an undertaking that I will return 100% the money in 2 months max! |
ttomexy:I am currently in a reasonably good job by Nigerian standard. That is why I am confident I will return the money (100%) and also sure I can raise the money on my own if I have more time. But I need money urgently - in the next 3-5 weeks so I am wondering if my PFA will listen to me. Sadly, no loan benefit where I work. |
This may be funny but worth considering. Seriously, I have some considerable amount doing absolutely nothing in my PFA. I just need to borrow some part of it and I can prove that I will return the money (which is still mine anyway) in about a month or two maximum? I know this is supposed to be a safety net for me when I retire. But I need a "nano-short time" loan and going to the bank doesn't make sense in this case. I am 10000% sure I will return ALL the money (but I am sorry I cannot pay interest on my own money ). I need to borrow this money because of the urgency because ordinarily, I can raise the money myself if I have more time.Can this be worked out? Experts should please chip in a word or two. |
This may be funny but worth considering. What if I just want to borrow from it and return the borrowed money (which is still mine anyway) in about a month or two maximum? I am 10000% sure I will return the money (but I am sorry I cannot pay interest on my own money ).But seriously, I have some considerable amount doing absolutely nothing in my PFA. I just need to borrow some part of it and I can prove that I will return the money. Can this be worked out? Experts should please chip in a word or two. |
barcanista:This is getting really getting annoying with all due respect. When people say Lagos has Igbo men in her cabinet and questions which SE state can reciprocate that goodwill. Our friends are quick to say Igbokwe does not represent the interest of Igbos - an example is this guy I engaged during the April 11 elections gbosaa:Fastforward to May, Obiano, the present gov of Anambra state held an opinion prior to the election which the majority of Igbos (at least on NL) related/relates with. Sadly, we are now being told it was his personal opinion and not share by the majority of Igbos. How about that of Arthur Eze? The man that suggested Ngige betrayed Ndigbo by joining Awolowo people at a PDP presidential campaign somewhere in SE. Now suddenly, after that public pronouncement which was covered by national dailies, we are now being told that it was his personal opinion. The body (whether a fraction or not) named Ohaneze has come out and made a statement and yet again, we are being told it not from the general Ndigbos. The question now is who the hell is speaking on behalf of Ndigbos that will not be denied a couple of months down the line? At this rate, I doubt if a statement or position of the Obi of Onitsha is representative of the position of Ndigbos as it can easily be denied when conditions are not favourable. I am definitely not qualified or even interested in advising anybody, but I find it hard to believe any group will be taken seriously if it keep this 2-face double-standard "hypocrisy". |
anyaekekehinde:I have no idea of how much each party pay for gas. I have this unfortunate believe that we can't eat our cake and still have it. If we need constant (relatively) electricity, we're gonna have to cough out the cash for it. Electricity is not cheap in most part of the world. Having said that, why should the IPPs pay higher rate for the gas? Isn't there a regulatory body to challenge this seeming anomaly? Gov. Fashola keep boasting that he has taken the street lights and general hospitals in Lagos off national grid. I am assuming he is generating electricity from turbines, is Lagos also paying the high rate for gas? All this still point to my first submission - the problem is lack of political-will (caused by corruption) and not lack technical know-how or availability of equipment. |
Reference:The problem with people like you is that you fail to see you're being fed with lies and will rather clap for mediocre performance while creating all sort of excuses for a failed government. Why not ask companies like flour Mills that are generating power from gas where they get the gas from. Or are they not in this same Nigeria? Flour Mills has also made significant investments in power generation. The Company has 11 General Electric (GE) Jenbacher gas generators at its Apapa Mills, with a combined capacity of 30 megawatts. This has enabled the company to reduce the occurrence of production stoppages. In addition, the Company has a 30megawatt diesel plant at the same site to act as a backup in the event of any shortage of feedstock to the gas generators.Imagine flour mills have enough gas to generate power. I bet EKO disco and many other discos can do same if given the right. i dare say gas is not the problem but political-will while I will not rule-out saboteurs, it still boils down to political will to get the situation arrested. |
I am pretty sure this perennial problem is more of political will than technical know-how. This is the result of the fraudulent privatization that some saTANists wants us to celebrate and praise gej for. What else can we really expect when the gov. sell public assets to their friends and allies as compensation for their roles in dirty politics just to hang on to power. I flew in to Nigeria some months back in the night and everywhere was dark - sharp contrast to what I saw when I left and got to my destination also in the night. While privatization is the way to a lasting solution to this disgraceful problem, using it as a compensation for cronies can only produce more reduction in available power - how else do we explain lower available power when gej was on commissioning spree a week to elections. I know for sure some private companies are already generating electricity from gas. I strongly believe this can be replicated by the discos. It is only when it comes to IPP that gas supply becomes an issue. The discos should be given a "partial" license to generate a fraction of the electricity demand for their area. All legislation barring them to generate should be relaxed. Imagine kaduna disco or eko disco or phed generating about 30% of the demand. Add that to what is already being supplied to them from the grid. It should come to about 60%. At an individual level, this translate to about 16 hours of electricity for everybody. Their is no miracle Buhari can perform if we have to wait for the national grid. The discos needs to be given a bit more role. |
OoduaVanguard:OoduaVanguard stop misleading people. pdp did not lose because of that picture you posted. This is the real reason why pdp lost ![]()
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Trailblazer1:I use them every single day. Some directly (even sometimes consults my text books) while others indirectly - as a result of applied knowledge. Ask a practicing civil engineer if he doesn't apply bending moment or a practising chemical/process engineer if (s)he doesn't apply PVT equations (Pressure Volume and Temperature) in calculations everyday. If you don't see the need to use your axioms, its either you're job description doesn't relate to what you studied or you're just not thinking deep enough. Its like a project manager having gone through the rigors of acquiring PMP certification saying (s)he doesn't apply cost/schedule/scope/risk management while practicing - simply because he doesn't have any need to specifically write "cost management" on any document. |
I have always said this. Boko Haram is very easy to stop. War is very expensive in every ramification - financial, human, logistics- name it. The government knows this but they just simply chose to play politics with human lives. Block the financial source to BH and it will die a natural death. Here is what I said back then: gists: |
What? Are you kidding me? I am almost certain the op has used touched-screen portable device before. How do you think those devices are made? Far more complex algorithms are simulated to test and fine-tune devices like that. And what about airplanes? Do you think Boeing and Airbus just fix some aluminium sheets together and install turbine engines and people fly from Lagos to US in just hours? How do you think the airline companies come about the luggage weight limit for each passenger? Mathematical equations are used to simulate the aerodynamics of the plane for smooth flights, tyre pressure for take-off and landing, GPS and radio communication etc. Do I need to talk about importance of such university knowledge as it applies to civil engineering? The third mainland bridge and the new 2nd niger bridge are not just some mixture of cement and stones. The bearing weight and stress from the waters are also calculated to determine the span, required strength and diameter/shape of the supporting pillars. And like someone said, education obtained within the walls of the university is meant to sharpen your problem solving mind and not applicable only in engineering - very applicable in marketing, law, politics, and every human endeavor. It helps you (if harnessed and used like it should) think outside the box to solve problems. |
Kai!! Nigerians!! Did anybody bother to check the source the OP provided? That article was written far back in december 2011. I suggest we always check how current an article is to see if its still relevant before making comments. |
Someone should please remind me which court case has Tinubu and his team ever lost in the last 16 years? Not even his out-going master could nail Tinubu in a code of ethics tribunal case. [size=18pt]J[/size] imi [size=18pt]Ok[/size] echukwu [size=18pt]E[/size] gbeje (JOKE) is really kidding |
chidexy:It is obviously a glory and lovely sight to behold. But maybe I didn't make myself clear enough. I was referring to the cost-benefit ratio as it relates to Nigeria because the OP asked if we can have this in Nigeria. Certainly the Germans can build and maintain this masterpiece without much fuss. But I am pretty sure it will cost Nigeria more than an arm, a leg and an eye to build and more importantly maintain this. If the sole purpose is to move goods efficiently, I dare say a modern rail system is more than sufficient for our needs at this time. We have had enough of white-elephant project. Anyway thanks for the background info on the bridge. |
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, and get back to us so that we can follow suit!! 