Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 7:46am On Mar 20, 2025 |
Thankgod89: The entire process of salvation is God’s gift, which includes grace, faith, and being saved. Both salvation and faith are gifts from God. true it is God's gift, well you have gone from saying salvation is 100% a free gift to saying salvation is attainable. I can understand us seeing salvation as a gift from God but God doesn't go about dashing salvation. The rich man asked Jesus how to receive eternal life, Jesus told him to obey God's commands. When Zacchaues repented, offered restitution and obeyed Jesus teaching to give to the poor, that's when Jesus declared that salvation has come to him. Zacchaues didn't do those things for Jesus to come to his house, you can say Jesus accepting his invitation or going to his house was a gift but his decision to submit and obey brought salvation to him. It is better to call salvation a reward, for the grace of God through Jesus gives us eternal life. While the reward for sin is death. But then we are rewarded only because God is merciful and forgives all our sins and doesn't count any of them but counts only our obedience to him. That is salvation as a result of God's gift |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 7:28am On Mar 20, 2025 |
malvisguy212: very good. Bless you. James complement Paul work. Paul teaches that Abraham believe and James complement the teaching by saying Abraham don't just seat down and claim he believed, he show the evidence of his faith by taken a bold step to sacrifice his son Isaac. James clearly writes that the works are an evidence of faith not an evidence that a man is saved. Infact when James writes about faith, he like Paul and Peter say faith leads to salvation, James specifies the kind of faith Jas.2.14 What good is it, my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him? Except you are saying faith is salvation instead of faith leads to salvation. Look the question is, "if salvation is a gift like some teach it, how can one work it out like Paul writes in Philippians 2:12. Ephesians 2 mentions through faith not by works, and obviously Paul writes what he refers to as works as he usually does, circumcision and laws of Moses, of which our faith isn't based on. James clearly states the works that are a result of our faith that leads to salvation. What did Jesus teach gives a man eternal life, that he believes hears and disobeys or that he hears and obeys doing God's will |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 7:12am On Mar 20, 2025 |
Thankgod89: I'm not mixing faith and salvation but emphasizing that faith leads to salvation.
“For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not from yourselves; it is the gift of God, not by works, so that no one can boast.” (Ephesians 2:8-9)
Faith is God-given, not something we generate on our own. We believe in what God has done through Christ, and that faith leads to salvation.
Meanwhile James does not contradict Paul but highlights that true faith produces works as evidence of salvation: you agree that faith leads to salvation so which is the gift faith or salvation |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 8:00pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
malvisguy212: answer this question. When you are saved. How can you show the evidence of a save faith? Good works are not what a man DOES in order to be SAVED; Good works are what a SAVED MAN DOES .
Now listen, God’s holiness utterly condemns the best man but God grace freely justify the worst. first off God's holiness doesn't condemn the best man, seeing as the best man is Jesus neither does it even condemn the worst of us who repent, believe and obey God. Also God's grace doesn't justify the worst, no, Paul wrote those who are called, God justified but we know from what Jesus said not every one called would answer, so, Jesus said, many are called few are chosen. Chosen, elected by grace. |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 7:55pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Thankgod89: I see your point, and I agree that salvation is attainable and secure in Christ (John 10:28). However, while salvation includes eternal life, the ultimate goal is not just receiving eternal life but being fully restored to perfect fellowship with God (Revelation 21:3-4) and conformed to Christ’s image (Romans 8:29).
Salvation is both a gift received and a journey of transformation. Those who are truly saved will bear fruit, not as a means to earn salvation but as evidence of genuine faith (Ephesians 2:10, James 2:17). James 2:17 you are mixing faith and salvation again. In Ephesians Paul already clarified that faith is the process, through faith and he doesn't refer to salvation as the process because it is the goal that we are saved. It is because the faith required for us to be saved comes from God not from ourselves that makes faith in Jesus whom God sends to us, the gift. Paul wrote this is faith, that we don't think who will send Jesus to us or bring him out from the grave but God has done all that, that we believe what God has done and live by it. While our relationship with God is being restored through the reconciliation brought by Jesus Christ our way to God. Our full transformation occurs only after we have left his world, as this present body cannot inherit the Kingdom of God and it is not his flesh that is saved but our souls. |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 7:47pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Thankgod89: Salvation and eternal life are not separate; rather, eternal life is an essential part of salvation, not just its ultimate goal and I don’t believe I ever implied otherwise, Mind you the ultimate goal of salvation is not just receiving eternal life but being fully united with God, transformed into the image of Christ, and dwelling with Him forever.
When a person is saved, they immediately receive eternal life (John 3:16, John 5:24). However, the full experience of eternal life will be realized in the future when we are glorified with Christ (Romans 8:30, Philippians 3:20-21).
Also, I’d like to emphasize this: "Someone who merely claims to be saved but does not bear fruit may not truly be saved."
Are these not your very words? "The ultimate goal is eternal life with God, but salvation is the doorway into that life." Now you are saying you didn't imply it, and writing that, "ultimate goal of salvation is not just receiving eternal life but being fully united with God, transformed into the image of Christ, and dwelling with Him forever." Adding more words doesn't change what you wrote. Anyway this isn't a simple answer to yes salvation and eternal life are the same, because I believe that's what you mean when you write when a person is saved they receive eternal life. And that salvation and eternal life are not separate so they are the same. |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 7:38pm On Mar 19, 2025*. Modified: 8:27am On Mar 20, 2025 |
malvisguy212: the work of our salvation is already done. All you have to do is believed.
Now, how can we recognise the saved man, ? We can only recognise him by his good work, this work is not the work of his salvation, is an evidence for a save faith.
Is like you want to go for a journey, you simply enter the car, rest and allowed the car take you to your destination. You are resting on the work of this car .
I do not work my soul to save, That my Lord hath done but I will work like any slave for the love of God dear son. except that you actually have to drive the car to get to your destination. The work of salvation is the work towards salvation, so when you say the work is already done you mean the person is already saved then there is no more work needed for the person has entered God's rest. But then even Paul said he had not yet attained it, or that he should miss it. If you are referring to the cross of Christ, that work is the foundation of our faith but Jesus never said that once he died there was nothing for us to do. He was asked a number of times concerning eternal life and salvation and his response was obedience to God. Jesus said pick up your cross and follow me. You wrote of evidence of a saved man, well what is a man saved from, if you say from sin then that means he would never commit a sin till he dies if you say saved from death then it means he would never physically die. Now the evidence you speak of, is for those who believe and have faith, those whose hope is for the salvation of their souls. 1Pet.1.9 for you are receiving the goal of your faith, the salvation of your souls. |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 7:00pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Thankgod89: Salvation is not merely a means to an end; it includes eternal life but also leads to its full realization in the future.
According to Ephesians 2:8-9, salvation is 100% a free gift—not something we earn. However, receiving salvation marks the start of a lifelong journey, not just a one-time event. The Bible speaks of salvation in different tenses:
Past: "You have been saved" (Ephesians 2: – Justification (declared righteous).
Present: "You are being saved" (1 Corinthians 1:18) – Sanctification (growing in holiness).
Future: "You will be saved" (Romans 5:9-10) – Glorification (final transformation).
Thus, while we don’t work for salvation, we are called to work out our salvation (Philippians 2:12) because God is actively working in us (Philippians 2:13).
You also asked that can Someone Be Saved and Still Perish?
No. If salvation is a gift from God and is received by faith, a truly saved person will not perish (John 10:28). However, someone who merely claims to be saved but does not bear fruit may not truly be saved (Matthew 7:21-23).
Salvation results in a transformed life, but good works are the evidence of salvation, not the requirement for it (Ephesians 2:10). now from 1 Corinthians 1:18 and Romans 5:9-10 that you quoted we can see the agreement with John 3:16 that salvation is the goal. Now the basis of the question was on you previously suggesting that salvation is the means of attaining eternal life. But one understands that salvation is eternal life, one would know it is impossible to perish when you have been saved. It shows it as an end goal. Like you quoted John.10.28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish. No one will snatch them away from me,... and also Matt 7:21-23 of those who confess but do not obey God, would not be saved. So it stands to reason that salvation is attainable. Good works are actually an evidence of faith which results to salvation for those who please God. |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 6:42pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Thankgod89: Salvation is not merely a means to an end; it includes eternal life but also leads to its full realization in the future.
According to Ephesians 2:8-9, salvation is 100% a free gift—not something we earn. However, receiving salvation marks the start of a lifelong journey, not just a one-time event. The Bible speaks of salvation in different tenses:
Past: "You have been saved" (Ephesians 2: – Justification (declared righteous).
Present: "You are being saved" (1 Corinthians 1:18) – Sanctification (growing in holiness).
Future: "You will be saved" (Romans 5:9-10) – Glorification (final transformation).
Thus, while we don’t work for salvation, we are called to work out our salvation (Philippians 2:12) because God is actively working in us (Philippians 2:13).
You also asked that can Someone Be Saved and Still Perish?
No. If salvation is a gift from God and is received by faith, a truly saved person will not perish (John 10:28). However, someone who merely claims to be saved but does not bear fruit may not truly be saved (Matthew 7:21-23).
Salvation results in a transformed life, but good works are the evidence of salvation, not the requirement for it (Ephesians 2:10). First off in Ephesians 2, Paul is addressing those who have repented from their former way of life, verse 2- 5... in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient. All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our sinful nature and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature objects of wrath. But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions--it is by grace you have been saved. (NIV) So because of those sins we were dead but then because of God's mercy we are made alive and then by grace we have been saved. Then in verse 8, Paul mentions faith If we are to say what does Paul mean by works, he usually mentions it in line with circumcision, laws of Moses and the Jews which he does once again in verse 11. But in verse 10 Paul talks about the purpose of our new creation is to do new works which I believe is opposite of the works of sin and the flesh the believers repented from. Have you tried considering that maybe salvation isn't what Paul is referring to as "it is the free gift of God" It is not by works, what is not by laws of Moses or circumcision, thats salvation. If the "it" is salvation, which is not by works but by the gift of God, do you realize then that Paul didn't write that salvation is 100% a gift of God? |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 6:26pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Thankgod89: Salvation is not merely a means to an end; it includes eternal life but also leads to its full realization in the future.
According to Ephesians 2:8-9, salvation is 100% a free gift—not something we earn. However, receiving salvation marks the start of a lifelong journey, not just a one-time event. The Bible speaks of salvation in different tenses:
Past: "You have been saved" (Ephesians 2: – Justification (declared righteous).
Present: "You are being saved" (1 Corinthians 1:18) – Sanctification (growing in holiness).
Future: "You will be saved" (Romans 5:9-10) – Glorification (final transformation).
Thus, while we don’t work for salvation, we are called to work out our salvation (Philippians 2:12) because God is actively working in us (Philippians 2:13).
You also asked that can Someone Be Saved and Still Perish?
No. If salvation is a gift from God and is received by faith, a truly saved person will not perish (John 10:28). However, someone who merely claims to be saved but does not bear fruit may not truly be saved (Matthew 7:21-23).
Salvation results in a transformed life, but good works are the evidence of salvation, not the requirement for it (Ephesians 2:10). before I give a detailed response to this. Are you now saying that Salvation and eternal life are not two different things anymore but that eternal life is in salvation and not the goal of salvation? |
Christianity Etc › Re: Jesus Answered Her, “I Was Sent Only To The Lost Sheep Of The House Of Israel". by gohf: 5:56pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
BlackViper: We don't derive the divine nature of the Triune God from a diagram, rather we get a full picture from Scripture.
The diagram is simply a schematic to help explain what the basic idea of the Trinity is. where did you find that full picture in scripture? Where you are told there are three gods God the father god the son god the spirit. Please post the scripture here so we can read it, even if it's not in the scriptures use the gospels and letters and revelations as well. |
Christianity Etc › Re: Is The New Testament A Requirement For Salvation? by gohf: 5:52pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Antichristian2: You asked what happened and i told you nothing! Do you expect thunder to strike? When God forgave sins what usually happens?
Allah says what means: "And O Adam! Dwell you and your wife in Paradise, and eat thereof as you both wish, but approach not this tree otherwise you both will be of the Zalimun (unjust and wrongdoers)." (Qur'an Al Araf 7:19)
No punishment was specified aforehand! But later he was sent to earth!
There's nothing like original sin or fake sin. Sin is sin!
No sin is hereditary! Left outside of which Garden? the word original in this case relates to origin not necessarily authenticity. Which you agreed Adam sinned and was kicked out of the garden. Expect you are saying Adam wasn't the first of mankind. And now are you pretending not to know "which Garden" again? The question still stands if you can answer is, if the consequences of Adam's actions were not inherited according to you, why were he children of Adam left outside the garden or are you saying the children were allowed in, expect Adam who received that as a punishment, according to what you have said? Now for what you are asking me, I do not expect thunder to stroke and you asked when God forgives sins what usually happens. To answer that, do you know the story of David who was punished for taking his soldier wife and later killing him, or the story of pharaoh taking Abraham's wife and being punished for it. It is recorded in Genesis that after pharaoh was forgiven and prayed for, the wombs of the women in his house were opened. I can give you more explains of God's mercy and forgiveness. But to say that God continues to punish a man he has forgiven is that not a lie? To me that is a lie. |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 5:39pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Thankgod89: Salvation is both a gift and the beginning of a journey rather than just the final goal.
When we receive salvation, we are saved from sin and given eternal life (John 3:16), but that’s not the end of the story. Salvation is also a process of transformation where we grow in Christ, becoming more like Him (Romans 8:29). This is why Philippians 2:12 tells us to “work out” our salvation—not to earn it, but to live it out and grow in it.
The ultimate goal is eternal life with God, but salvation is the doorway into that life. It’s like being given citizenship in a new country—you receive it freely, but now you must learn its culture, laws, and way of life.
So, in a way, salvation is not just the end goal; it is the beginning of a lifelong journey of faith, leading to our final glorification with Christ (Philippians 3:20-21). so you are saying salvation is both a free gift and what you work for? Or you are saying it's just a gift and the beginning of a journey rather than a final goal. If it's the later then your answer to my question is that salvation is not the goal but a means to an end, the end being eternal life. You defined salvation as being saved from sin and given eternal life but then you say salvation is a means to an end which is eternal life. So you are saying the person didn't receive eternal life when they received salvation.. Right? Now the verses you quoted John.3.16 "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. This verse doesn't differentiate salvation from eternal life like you did. Neither Rom.8.29 For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the likeness of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. Then you explain "work out" in Philippians 2:12 to mean to live in it, to grow in it. The Greek word used there is "katergazesthe" to effect by labor, to achieve. In that very verse and even the next on, Paul writes about obedience which is brought about by God enabling us to obey Him. According to your explanation salvation means you are already a citizen of God's kingdom, why does Paul then tell them to achieve it by obeying God. How does one "live out salvation" if it's not to attain it through obedience to God? Remember the question is if salvation is a free gift why should a person "live it out". Either you are saying a person can be saved and not attain eternal life, or that salvation is free but you have to work for eternal life, so you can be saved and still perish. |
Christianity Etc › Re: Is The New Testament A Requirement For Salvation? by gohf: 5:13pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Antichristian2: Original sin is the sin other humans inherit from Adam in Christianity!
He was sent away from the garden!
Nothing happened. so according to your response and your believe in Islam, God's forgiveness results in nothing? What was the sin Adam committed and what did God tell him would happen when he did such? So you don't deny that original sin is the first sin, just that you don't believe that humans inherited the consequences of Adam's actions. So if it wasn't inherited according to your understanding why were the children of Adam left outside of the garden? |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 4:23pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
CodeTemplarr: no...something to be worked out and upon. Or is salvation live chicken to you? you didn't explain your analogy Someone gave another a chicken without telling them what to use it for? And now you are writing salvation is to be worked out and upon, without explaining what that means. |
Christianity Etc › Re: Is The New Testament A Requirement For Salvation? by gohf: 4:21pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Antichristian2: Yes, those who died in idolatry/ association of partners to God will be in hell. There's no forgiveness for them!
There's no original sin in Islam. Adam sinned and he was punished! He sought forgiveness and was forgiven! original sin means first sin, saying there was no first sin and yet saying Adam sinned is confusing. What do you think original sin means? You said Adam was punished, what was his punishment? And when he was forgiven what happened? |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 4:18pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
CodeTemplarr: yes. so salvation is something you are supposed to cook and eat, or use for your satisfaction? |
Christianity Etc › Re: Jesus Answered Her, “I Was Sent Only To The Lost Sheep Of The House Of Israel". by gohf: 4:17pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Antichristian2: He was sent to the whole world! Israel is just a subset of the world!
So we should take the Phrase as a lie then! Jesus lied to the canaanite woman that he was sent to the lost sheep of Israel. is that your answer to the question I asked you of why you are asking? So according to you Isaiah wrote about Muhammad so what was his message to the Israelites |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 4:12pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
CodeTemplarr: If your neighbour dash you free chicken, swallow it alive. is the chicken supposed to be your analogical synonym with salvation? |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 4:10pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Thankgod89: Salvation is a free gift from God, not something we earn. However, it is our responsibility to respond to it by embracing and living it out. This response is what it means to "work out our salvation."
Think of it like receiving a free gym membership—you didn’t pay for it, but to benefit from it, you need to exercise. Your effort doesn’t earn the membership, but it helps you grow stronger. In the same way, while salvation is a gift, our obedience and spiritual growth enable us to fully experience its transforming power. so are you saying that salvation is a means to an end and not the end or goal itself? |
Christianity Etc › Re: Jesus Answered Her, “I Was Sent Only To The Lost Sheep Of The House Of Israel". by gohf: 4:06pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Antichristian2: This was referring to another person as Jesus was never mentioned! I can even claim it is Muhammad!
Did Jesus lied he was sent only to Israel? was Muhammad sent to the Israelites? Was he an Israelite? Why would you ask if Jesus lied, when you claimed he wrote nor sanctioned any book? |
Christianity Etc › Re: Is The New Testament A Requirement For Salvation? by gohf: 4:05pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Antichristian2: Opuro Jesu!
Show us the evidences! mighty sparrow just posted a verse about an apostle of Allah, is that Muhammad whom you claimed leads you to salvation. By the way I heard that Islam teaches that there is no salvation through one man as God forgave the original sin Adam committed thereby forgiving all of it, after Adam repented. |
Christianity Etc › Re: Is The New Testament A Requirement For Salvation? by gohf: 4:02pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Antichristian2: No other Prophet came after Jesus apart from Muhammad!
As Jesus didn't write anything nor did he sanction any book during his time, anything written after him will need authentication! There's no assurance any Jew wrote anything!
And even if they did write, we know the Jews are not a trustworthy folks! You quoted Muhammad claim to be closest to Jesus because he is a prophet, I asked you why you believe so and your answer is to say that it's because you believe after Jesus came Muhammad was sent. You make you statements based on your assumptions so they can be disregarded. You claim no Jews wrote anything, they are not trustworthy people. Yet you associate Muhammad to Jesus and Moses Now you tried to associate Muhammad with Jesus and Moses, so tell us what did Jesus teach, what did Moses teach and what did Muhammad teach |
Christianity Etc › Re: Is The New Testament A Requirement For Salvation? by gohf: 3:56pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Antichristian2: All scriptures are usually written by verified and known people unlike the Bible!
The scripture revealed to Moses is definitely not the Old testament you have today!
Also Jesus was not aware of anything in the New testament!
Of course some may be right but it's a mix. so none of the people who wrote the tanakh were verifiable yet the nation of Israel and to extent Judah held unto the writings, ans kept the practice of the temple forming sects in turn... so none of them was verified? Now if you claim that the Torah used today wasn't written by Moses, then you should present proof of that or you would be a false accuser. |
Christianity Etc › Re: Jesus Answered Her, “I Was Sent Only To The Lost Sheep Of The House Of Israel". by gohf: 3:49pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Kobojunkie: According to the books of the Gospel, the same Jesus Christ equally made clear through direct word — figures of speech included — that He was sent by His Father only to the bloodline of Jacob.
⚉ In John 6 vs 37-38, Jesus Christ proclaimed, "The Father gives me my people. Every one of them will come to me. I will always accept them. I came down from heaven to do what God wants, not what I want." This statement invariably means Jesus Christ of Israel had no choice in picking the people that would be His; His Father is the one who made the decision as far as the people Jesus Christ was sent. ⚉ In Matthew 15 vs 20, Jesus Christ announced that He was sent by His Father only to the Lost Sheep of Israel— the bloodline of Jacob. By this, He officially declared Himself savior to the race of Israelites and not of any other race — Jesus Christ of Israel. ⚉ In John 3 vs 14 - 18, we learn from Jesus Christ of Israel that the people whom His Father loves — YHWH(God of Israel) were the very same people whom Moses, who was sent before Him, raised the Serpent in the desert to save. He went on to describe them as " the World"(a metonymy, a figure of speech, used as a reference to the condemned of Israel), which God loved. ⚉ In Matthew 7 vs. 6, Jesus Christ of Israel openly warned His followers against giving what is Holy to the dogs — non-Israelites— declaring the dogs incapable of handling that which is Holy — they are unqualified to do so. ⚉ In Matthew 10 vs. 1 - 6, when Jesus Christ of Israel had the opportunity to send His disciples out to announce the Kingdom of God, He sent them only to the Israelites. ⚉ Then, in Matthew 28 vs. 16-20 and Mark 16 s 15 - 18, applying the same metonymy he had earlier used, Jesus Christ of Israel dispersed His followers into the World which He had previously described to His followers. ⚉ To seal it all, in Luke 24, Jesus Christ proclaimed that His Word is Everlasting meaning it can never be changed ---- not by Him, or any human being even after He is dead and gone.
YHWH bestowed on Himself the title of "God of Israel", and this as He gave the name "Israel" only to the man named Jacob. Jesus Christ of Israel, himself a descendant of the bloodline of Jacob who is called Israel, NEVER indicated that He was sent to or came to save non-Israelites. The lie that He did was fabricated entirely by those of the religions of Christianity and Islam.  Isa.49.6 He says, "You will do more than restore the people of Israel to me. I will make you a light to the Gentiles, and you will bring my salvation to the ends of the earth." |
Christianity Etc › Re: Jesus Answered Her, “I Was Sent Only To The Lost Sheep Of The House Of Israel". by gohf: 3:49pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Antichristian2: New International Version He answered, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel.”
New Living Translation Then Jesus said to the woman, “I was sent only to help God’s lost sheep—the people of Israel.”
 Isa.49.6 He says, "You will do more than restore the people of Israel to me. I will make you a light to the Gentiles, and you will bring my salvation to the ends of the earth." |
Christianity Etc › Re: Is The New Testament A Requirement For Salvation? by gohf: 3:46pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Antichristian2: No! Jesus was meant to be be followed by the israelites until Muhammad came!
When Muhammad came he became the Prophet of all mankind!
A prominent hadith, narrated by Abu Huraira, states that Prophet Muhammad said, "Both in this world and in the Hereafter, I am the nearest of all the people to Jesus, the son of Mary. The prophets are paternal brothers; their mothers are different, but their religion is one." he the nearest of all people to Jesus, so tell us why do you believe that? Seeing as you reject the writings of those who were Jews and had heard from him and about him. |
Christianity Etc › Re: Is The New Testament A Requirement For Salvation? by gohf: 3:42pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Antichristian2: But there will be additions and subtractions!
How can you judge with such narrations? what do you want to judge? Whether the teaching occured or not? |
Christianity Etc › Re: Is The New Testament A Requirement For Salvation? by gohf: 3:26pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Antichristian2: The New Testament is based on hearsays mostly as Jesus was not involved at all in its development. It was developed decades after Jesus. If you were told to write down the life story of your dad as you are now you will only be able to write what you witnessed especially when grown!
Those disciple met Jesus when he was about 30 years. It was clear they did incorporate hearsays as evident in what Luke said in Luke 1:1-4. whether they incorporated hear says or not it doesn't invalidate the gospel. People remember things differently which proofs such a thing actually occurred. If you ask 100 different people about a particular incident they will answer you based on their perspective and memory. If you go for a lecture all of the students would recall different things does that mean the lecture didn't occur? Of course it doesn't. |
Christianity Etc › Re: Is The New Testament A Requirement For Salvation? by gohf: 3:20pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Antichristian2: Yes, now the salvation is based on following Muhammad.
During Muhammad salvation was based on following Jesus.
During Moses's time salvation was based on following him. so did Muhammad follow Jesus? |
Christianity Etc › Re: Women Were Not Initially In God’s Plans- Pastor Biodun Oladele by gohf: 3:18pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
Daejumong: ‘ Women were not in the original plans of God’- Pastor Biodun Oladele(General Overseer of Spirit Chapel Int’l Church)
Biodun made this statement with confidence recently on a popular podcast watched by thousands of people and women. He cited Gen 2 where God said it wasn’t good that man be alone and created Eve. He invariably suggested that their creation was an afterthought!
I however completely disagree with Pst Biodun. In Gen 1, He created male and female in His own image. Gen 1 26 Then God said, “Let us make human beings in our image, to be like us…. 27 So God created human beings in his own image.In the image of God he created them;male and female he created them. 28 Then God blessed them and said, “Be fruitful and multiply. Fill the earth and govern it.
Jesus(Son of God) who was present at creation confirmed it in Matthew 19:4
4 “Haven’t you read,” Jesus replied, “that at the beginning the Creator ‘made them male and female
Biodun must be careful in making statements which are against those of Jesus. Saying women were not initially in God’s plans paints God as anti women and not all-knowing! He should understand that doctrine is not built with one verse . He should also understand that what God the Son said supersedes any other account in Genesis 2 . I would advise he publicly retracts that statement as such is not healthy for our society!
Daejumong 19/3/2025 It's surprising what some say concerning women, it's almost like they forget they had mothers and it maybe because of their own relationship with their mothers and women in general that make some say what they do. But I see it an inspiration from the devil, who seems to hate women, most especially daughters of God. If God creating the woman to solve a problem is an evidence of afterthought then Adam also should be an after thought, after all, God saw the need for one to work the ground so he formed Adam from the dust to do so. The record of God's own words says, that Adam wasn't good as he was. So the woman should be seen as a solution to the state in which God proclaimed Adam to be. |
Christianity Etc › Re: If Salvation Is A Free Gift Why Do I Have To Work It Out? by gohf(op): 3:08pm On Mar 19, 2025 |
gohf: Eph.2.8-9 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast. (NKJV)
Phil.2.12-13 Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure. (NKJV)
Sir, I read this verses and I have a question how can salvation be a gift and I have to work my salvation out with fear and trembling? To answer this question I ask one question, Paul mentions three things, grace, salvation and faith, so which of these three is actually the gift of God (the 'doron' of God)? |