₦airaland Forum

frosbel: My question to Pat is :

Why is it that people like me who have not tithed for years are in very good health ?

My own kweshun is, why is that me that teach against tithe and STOPPED tithing in the past 2-3 years is more blessed, with good health, good job with paid vacation, paid medical and life insurance, paid immediate relative health insurance and overtime pay, blessed with two cars, etc. Why had devourer not devoured me ever since? I don't tithe but I am a giver!!! All my inheritance and heritage is IN Christ.

Gombs: ^^
Behave o!
Or I'll have you banned!...

Holman Christian Standard Bible
But the law is not based on faith . . .

International Standard Version
But the Law has nothing to do with faith. . . .

People who keep deceiving themselves and others saying they tithe BY FAITH. You don't understand the finished works in the way of Faith that negates the way of law. Where was it said that tithing is BY FAITH, give us just one scripture. You must understand your confession of tithe by faith has nothing to do faith but law as long as you doing Matthew 23:23 or Malachi. Faith has nothing to do with law (monthly tithe\weekly tithe) just as law has nothing to do with faith. Two opposite poles!!!

Those who say they tithe by FAITH deceive themselves and many. Scripture does not say tithe should be done BY FAITH neither did Abraham tithe by FAITH, it was a COMMANDMENT. Scripture also say, law is not of Faith. You can't be tithing according to Malachi and Matthew 23:23 and say you tithing by FAITH...that's DECEPTION!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IAhDGYlpqY

I am getting same kind of message in my spirit recently? Who do we think we are? We are absolutely NOTHING except for God grace IN Christ.

Blessed article, @ the OP.

Deceiving members with vain words.

That verse is often read 'into' or read in a superlative 3D mode. You can understand scriptural difficulties when you follow context and study word meanings USING CONCORDANCE.

So, get a concordance, word meaning each words used and place your meanings back into the context. You will get a whole different meaning and interpretation from the religious interpretation.

Bless you!

E don tay wey we don dey fight this good fight of faith. Bumper harvest thread. Great job, @ OP.

Ol boy, this thread don waka o. I need read from where I left off and digest before I can comment. Chei.

Shaking my head @ tithe advocates.

frosbel: I will first ask you a question :


What are we saved from ? in fact what is salvation ?

I will answer your questions and I need you answer mine, maybe later, I have to go to work now. Before then, do you believe there is ONE salvation as used in scripture tenses? I will be back, maybe at lunch or at night.

frosbel: Morning beloved Bro ,

How can we already be saved when the MASTER said that ONLY he who endures to the end will be saved ? Is Jesus contradicting himself ?

First, you didn't answer the simple question - what does it mean to 'work out' one's one salvation? Do YOU HAVE SALVATION by YOURSELF?

Two, in how many "tenses" does scripture used the word "salvation" or "save"? And don't tell me now that there's ONLY ONE salvation because scriptures will fly over you.

frosbel: It says :

Philippians 2:12
King James Version (KJV)
12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

Note the statement ' work out ' which is not passive but active. In other words we act and obey.

Remember that song, 'Trust and Obey , for there is no other way to be happy in Jesus but to trust and obey '.

The lyrics become irrelevant if our trusting and obeying does not determine our state in Christ.

Good morning, my brother Frosbel,

Please, what does it mean to 'work out' one's own salvation IF ONE IS ALREADY SAVED BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH, NOT OF ONE'S SELF BUT WHICH IS GOD GIFT?

frosbel: The Gospel is the good news of the kingdom and was never anything else, however to become part of that kingdom, , the death, resurrection and burial of Jesus were an integral necessity for 3 reasons :

1. Shedding of blood for the remission of our sins, hence forgiveness - no sinner or sin can enter into the kingdom of God , but with the blood of Jesus and obedience to his word, we are assured of eternal salvation.

2. To raise up all who believe in him on the last day in the same manner - only those who are resurrected by Jesus or have their bodies transformed will enter into the kingdom of God, the rest will be judged and destroyed.

3. Breaking down the wall of partition between Jew and Gentile making us all One Body and hence One people who will dwell in peace and love in this new kingdom.

Chei, see my brother Frosbby dey fall my hand. Okay. Make I comot first, I dey come back. You will understand by force by fire.

frosbel: @Bro Goshen360 , there is only ONE gospel and this is what Jesus preached and commanded his followers to preach.

You cannot contradict the words of Jesus to suit theology.

"And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation." - Mark 16:15

fulfilled here and still ongoing :

"Then I saw another angel flying in midair, and he had the eternal gospel to proclaim to those who live on the earth--to every nation, tribe, language and people." - Revelation 14:6



I will rather take Jesus's words as the final authority.

You are still missing my message. I never said there're TWO GOSPELS. There're only ONE in EVERY TIME AND DISPENSATION.

Quick question: Did Jesus PREACHED the GOSPEL of HIS DEATH, BURIAL AND RESURRECTION? Did Jesus preached that, by His death, you shall be free from the law? Did Jesus preached the gospel of JUSTIFICATION through his resurrection? Did Jesus preached the Gospel of GENTILES coming into the kingdom, through his death? Did Jesus preached the GOSPEL of YOU ARE SET FREE FROM CURSES BY HIS CROSS?

I think answers to these questions will help you understand what we've been saying.

OLAADEGBU: And what do we call those who preach the lawless gospel?

Keep on preaching and teach the gospel of the LAW, we already know those whose are teaching SPIRIT-LED gospel. The law gospel had it time and dispensation, it was UNTIL the promised will come. Now that the promised had come, what are you still doing with a tutor like a child?

New International Version
What I am saying is that as long as an heir is underage, he is no different from a slave, although he owns the whole estate.

New Living Translation
Think of it this way. If a father dies and leaves an inheritance for his young children, those children are not much better off than slaves until they grow up, even though they actually own everything their father had.

Galatians 4:1

I'm really struggling to make our brethren see some difference here on the Gospel preached to them and to us BUT PEOPLE AREN'T SEEING THE DIFFERENCE. First, let me make it very clear here that STUDY OF DISPENSATION IS WHAT IS MEANT BY RIGHTLY DIVIDING THE WORD OF TRUTH. Now, let's pull some scriptures together and let's see if gospel preached at ONE time (dispensation) IS THE SAME WITH THE GOSPEL MANDATE WE HAVE TODAY. Again. the Gospel is ONE in every dispensation but the gospel (messages) preached to them is not the SAME preached to us but because it's God's Good news at each time and dispensation, it is\was called Gospel.

New Living Translation
What's more, the Scriptures looked forward to this time when God would declare the Gentiles to be righteous because of their faith. God proclaimed this good news to Abraham long ago when he said, "All nations will be blessed through you." Galatians 3:8

Here ^ the gospel message was clear - In you, shall all the families of the earth be blessed.

New Living Translation
This letter is from Paul, a slave of Christ Jesus, chosen by God to be an apostle and sent out to preach his Good News. God promised this Good News long ago through his prophets in the holy Scriptures. Romans 1:1-2

Here ^ the gospel was promised long ago. So what gospel was preached to Abraham and yet another gospel promised?

New Living Translation
The Good News is about his Son. In his earthly life he was born into King David's family line, Romans 1:3

Here, the gospel is ABOUT JESUS CHRIST. What is it about Jesus Christ that the gospel says or we should be saying as the gospel message? Is this another gospel or what?

1 Corinthians 15:1-5 also outlines another Gospel.

New International Version
For we also have had the good news proclaimed to us, just as they did; but the message they heard was of no value to them, because they did not share the faith of those who obeyed. Hebrews 4:2

Here ^ it proves every GOSPEL carries a specific message - gospel was preached to them and also gospel is preached to us. What was PREACHED TO THEM? Is it the same message PREACHED to us AS GOSPEL....but they both called gospel. Find out the message preached to them and what preached to us and compare if the same?

John and Jesus in the gospel accounts was also preaching the gospel WITH A SPECIFIC MESSAGE. Is what John saying the same gospel message Apostle Paul said the gospel is about Jesus Christ and that it is THE ONE Gospel given or preached unto us?

New International Version
But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God's curse!

New Living Translation
Let God's curse fall on anyone, including us or even an angel from heaven, who preaches a different kind of Good News than the one we preached to you. Galatians 1:8

Here ^ the Apostle declared there's just ONE GOSPEL in our time and dispensation preached unto us as the Church and Christians and says WE SHOULD NOT LISTEN TO ANOTHER GOSPEL....meaning there's more than THE ONE that had being preached to us, making inference to the GOSPEL OF THE LAW OR WORKS which the false teachers had infiltrated the Galatians Christians with.

The truth here is, EVERY DISPENSATION CARRIED A SPECIFIC GOSPEL MESSAGE and that's why we can read all the different messages in the gospel given to each messenger at each time. The Gospel mandate we have or preached to us, Christians is NOT, the same as was given to the prophets of old and messengers.

New International Version
In the past God spoke to our ancestors through the prophets at many times (DISPENSATION) and in various ways,

New Living Translation
Long ago God spoke many times (DISPENSATION) and in many ways to our ancestors through the prophets. Hebrews 1:1

New International Version
but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe.

New Living Translation
And now in these final days, he has spoken to us through his Son. God promised everything to the Son as an inheritance, and through the Son he created the universe.

If we are still carrying the messages of God that WAS FOR PEOPLE OF THE PAST, WE ARE MISSING WHAT GOD IS SAYING IN AND THROUGH CHRIST'S FINISHED WORKS TODAY AND NOW .....which Apostle Paul says, the Gospel is ABOUT HIS SON JESUS CHRIST. I'm really interested in this gospel topic because, what we see today is, many are NOT preaching the Gospel that was handed down to the Church which is ONE but preaching ANOTHER which is OPPOSITE of THE ONE GOSPEL handed and preached to us.

Lemme buttress more a little.

The gospel preached to Abraham was "In your seed shall shall all the families of the earth be blessed...you shall be a father of many nations...etc". God never preached this gospel to YOU or ME but to Abraham. Yes, we can reference this as gospel preached but it wasn't preached to any of us because Christ is NOT the seed of ANY OF US.

The gospel preached to Israel that wasn't mixed with faith was gospel of the law - Bring me a sacrifice and I will bless you through the sacrifice but they never understood it. In the law gospel, some people began to understand God and mix the message with faith and walk in faith, and hence, we have the hall of faith in Hebrews 11.

If we can't see that the death, burial and resurrection of Christ MADE A CHANGE and difference, then we don't understand our gospel mandate. We mix the whole thing up and draw people away from God than bringing more to God. It's not as if we should go into the world and be saying to everyone "Christ died, was buried and resurrected..." but what his death, burial and resurrection delivered and gave and did for us. That's the ONE gospel given to us in this time and age.

So the Apostle can boldly say, "We PREACH Christ AND HIM CRUCIFIED"

^ I tried to fellowship with brother Frosbel yesterday so I can gradually show him up to the present time and dispensation of what the gospel is IN OUR TIME but I guess it didn't happen, that's why I started out with questions.

Many of us do not really understand what the gospel GIVEN OR PREACHED TO US, THE CHURCH OR CHRISTIANS really is. We understand from scripture, the gospel was preached IN EVERY DISPENSATION but is not the same gospel preached to us TODAY AND THE CHURCH even though the gospel IS ONE IN EVERY DISPENSATION.

The Apostle said in Romans 1:3-5, THE GOSPEL IS ABOUT JESUS CHRIST. We then ask, what is it ABOUT JESUS CHRIST that we should be saying to the world that makes it a goodnews?

It is about what and everything he had done - through his death, burial and resurrection. I can go on and on to talk about what he did through his DEATH, through his BURIAL and through his RESURRECTION but no luxury of time but its all revealed to the Apostles.

This gospel is a whole topic on its own and because many of us don't understand what it is, many are not or don't preach the gospel. For instance, under the dispensation of the law, the gospel OF REPENTANCE is turn away from your sins or go to hell or perhaps, face God's wrath or judgement as you see in case of John the Baptist BUT under grace, the gospel of REPENTANCE is, goodness of God LEADS TO REPENTANCE.

We can't be telling sinners in the world to repent or go to hell anymore, but telling and reminding them, the goodness of God, that's what leads them to change of heart and turn away from their sins unto God, we tell them, God is not holding their sins against them anymore, they should come home to the father because the father had already held their sins on Christ. That's the goodnews.

didfy: @ OP must you start a thread before you get your answer? Read other threads and practice your old covenant believes

Which old covenant believes? Do you think the new is a continuation to the old covenant?

^ Sir, do you understand what righteousness of God is?

^ Stepping out now from home, I will continue from my phone.

frosbel: Read Genesis 3:15

That's why I said, God didn't just step out of the scene, he preached or gave them the gospel.

Now, that you mentioned it, that's the gospel God preached to Adam and Eve; Is the above goodnews (even though man fell) the same as what is being preached to YOU. Did God say this same thing said to Adam & Eve to YOU ?

Pastor Kun: Come to think of it, tithing is a form of gambling and like most gamblers, tithers always end up loosing money whilst the casino ('church') always profits from the loss.

Acts 11:26 in any translation.

frosbel: The gospel means good news and the news is about everlasting life in the kingdom of GOD.

There's kingdom of God and kingdom of heaven. Let's leave that for now so we can concentrate on the gospel. Off course the gospel means GOODNEWS......BUT.....my\the question is WHAT GOODNEWS is it that was preached or SAID to people at one time or the other? Let's continue

frosbel: I am also unsure what you mean by gospel preached to Adam , since preaching started after the fall and not before.

When Adam fell, God didn't just stepped out of the scene. His fall gave birth to THE GOODNESS. Frosbel, If you can't point out the goodness preached to Adam & Eve, then, I'm afraid, you need to study from the dispensation as to what is said - that's what is means to RIGHTLY DIVIDE THE WORD OF TRUTH.

frosbel: However, we can say that Adam had the same choice as us, i.e to obey and live or to disobey and die. In this context, yes it is the same gospel.

NO sir. You have to mention the gospel preached to the Adam & Eve first before you can confidently says yes or no. If you point it out, then we can easily know if it is the SAME THING PREACHED TO US....that's my first starting point and objective and we move gradually.

frosbel: God has only one objective for mankind, not 2, and it is to grant life to the compliant or to destroy the non-compliant forever.

I agree - God had one objective to achieve from the gospel NOT two. Again, the ONE gospel to Adam and others, is it the same ONE gospel preached to us?

^ I or We need to take this step-by-step in systematic way. That's how we can understand what is confusing here. I might also continue this thread from my phone while I'm out from home soon.

@ Frosbel and others, I await you answers, at least let's start the gospel (goodness) from Genesis down to our time, picking just few instances.

^ Okay frosbel,

The gospel preach to Adam & Eve,

1. What is it AND

2. Is it the same gospel preached to YOU?

Self - service is se.x perversion and by itself is fornication.