₦airaland Forum

FBS:
Ibime, kai, fuk shait with all them stats. na wetin? You no dey tire? Stats aint everything man. Abi you no dey take your own eye dey watch match ni? Something tells me you don't watch La Liga much sef.

Understand the argument before jumping.

Fergie said his problem is Iniesta and Xavi because "they keep the ball all night long".

Who keeps the ball all night long? Xavi or Iniesta? Busquets even chokes possession more. The passing stats is therefore needed.

Ive seen Barca play in the flesh with Xavi and without Xavi. Its 2 different games.

Lets put it this way - Barca are more content to counterattack these days because the metronome Xavi is no longer there. He is the foundation of the Barcelona system.

These days they more rely on Neymar, Messi and Suarez to make a difference than on controlling the ball till the opponent is seasick.

Lets just say that if you take the UCL final last year and swap the strikers of both teams, Juve would win 3-0. So Iniesta is just a beneficiary.

With Xavi it is different. He could still choke Juventus to death with possession even if you swapped the strikers. The difference being in this scenario that Xavi is the orchestrator while Iniesta is the beneficiary.

homesteady:
Before 2009 UCL final -
As Sir Alex Ferguson noted back in 2009: "I'm not obsessed with Messi, Iniesta is the danger. He makes the team work."

That is a journalists redaction. Every top player has quotes but the full quote is below:

"It wasn't really Messi who was the problem. It was Iniesta and Xavi. They can keep the ball all night long."


Once again that is a case of Iniesta being lauded for another mans work. If you talk of Barcelona choking the opposition of possession, Xavi was the critical element. Busquets is even more critical to that than Iniesta. You can check all the passing stats.

sleekdot:
I'm sure Berbatov thinks its easier to score the EPL same with Demba Ba and Debruyne

Lampard was the highest goal scorer in most of his seasons at Chelsea, He would be in Barca playing with the most prolific player in the game

All his Free kick goal and penalties where would get them? Henry the 30 goal a season henry went to barcelona and he became a 15goal ninja

Stats show more goals are scored per game in Bundesliga than any other league. Lewa already got it too easy in Bayern vs say Hamburg. It would actually be harder with Barca vs La Liga opponent.

Henry was not the same player when he left England. His last season he scored 12 goals. Besides he played left wing.

Remove 7 goals from Lampard for penalties and freekicks, he would get that back against Levante and Almeria when Barca flog them 6-0 each.

sleekdot:
In Barca currently Suarez is scoring more Messi is scoring less. Typical Messi by February would already be on 40 goals. Whats your comparison for neymar to know he scores more

In Pep time, Messi was at peak he was scoring 60 regularly. He takes all Penalties, all free kicks where lampard gets a quarter of his goals from

Henry went from 30 goals guaranteed to 15-20 goals at Barca

Are you saying a peak Ronaldo would join Barca and score 60 like he normally does with Messi and say Lewandoski

Messi has moved to the wing so naturally he will score less.

Suarez in the same CF position is scoring more.

Neymar is scoring more. His Brasileiro record is less than 1 in 2. Forget State Championship.

Henry had injury problems last season in England and only scored 12 goals.

Why wont Lampard score more?

Only Lewa may score less because it is easier to score in Bundesliga as historical stats show.

homesteady:
Why is Gotze not yet in contention to win Balon d'or? He scored the wining goal on the biggest stage! Why didn't it create a big emotional connection that would make him appear more important than Lahm or Neuer?

Big difference is Gotze was not a starter at the World Cup neither is he a sure starter for Bayern.

How would you crown a nigga who cant get into his 11?

If Gotze had done that shyt in the middle of winning back to back Bundesliga with Dortmund, then throw in UCL, he would be voted 3rd in WPOTY.

sleekdot:
Ibime if Lampard had gone to Barca under Pep he wouldnt score as much as he was at Chelsea

What helped Lampard at Chelsea was that he was the focal point of the attack, Even your strikers play to knock down for him.

With a phenomenon like messi scoring 60 per season where Lampard wan see 27 when Etoo/Villa sef dey there

Ancelotti did not play any knock-down style of football yet Lampard scored 27.

It was Deco, Ballack, Anelka and co on tippy tappy football.

Everybody scored more. There was no high ball for Drogba yet he scored a career high 33 goals. Malouda scored 14 or so for the first time.

The fact is, if the ball is in the area more, Lampard will always score more because he has the lungs to always be in the box when the play is in opposition box. Thats why he was Marathon Man of EPL for 7 years in a row. He would absolutely HAMMER at Barca.

Everybody going to Barca scores more. Suarez scores more, Neymar scores more. What makes you think a GOAL-HUNGRY nigga like Lampard will score less? Has he been instructed not to score like some of our friends?

.

ollah1:
Pep spent 4 years at Barca. Hw often were hleb, keita, fab and thiago playing and starting matches? How often did fab start in midfield ahead of the false 9 role?

Add all 4 together, and tell me how many matches Iniesta played LW.

Like I said Im willing to bet Iniesta played 50% of matches on the wing.

So what are you saying that Pep would never push Iniesta to the wing for an outsider?


Meanwhile Homesteady, can you tell me how Iniesta won MOTM in Euro 2012 final when Xavi had 2 assists and he had none. Iniesta is just a likeable nigga. No way he deserved MOTM over Xavi. I could say the same for few of the awards he won in his career.

ollah1:
Like sleek rightly said earlier, I wonder why a player in his prime, in his boyhood club move away from his favoured position for another player coming from outside

He could have moved under FR buh definitely not under PG. When PG moved him there, his midfield wasn't as productive as him been played in the middle with Xavi hence the exits of keita and fab.

It was Pep that moved Iniesta to the left wing so what are you talking about?

Do you know your own club?

Before Pep, Ronaldinho always played left wing.

Infact Im willing to bet that Iniesta played more left wing under Pep than centrally.

List of ninjas Pep played centrally and pushed Iniesta to the wing include Keita, Hleb, Fab4 and Thiago.

If Lampard came to Barca, Iniesta will pack there permanently!!!

homesteady:
Ermm.... are you skipping the part were he has been the MOTM in the final of the 3 biggest football competitions in the world? If it was one, we would have considered it a fluke, but not 2 but 3! Ibime 3!
You definitely know that this would discredit any thoughts of him been a carry-along in both Spain and Barcelona! Not to mention that he has won UEFA best player! Though it wasn't existing when Lampard was at his 'Peak' , but did he do anything significant to merit the award if it was in existence then?

So Because he was scoring freely for Chelsea that means he would also replicate the same feat in barcelona? who were the strikers he was playing with? can you compare them to barcelona strikers? even the greatest of them all - Drogba hasn't scored more goals in a season than Neymar, not to mention 'em Torres! Besides what did Fabregas goals win for barcelona - 1 or 2 la liga and a trophyless season! Rakitić was scoring many goals for Sevilla, but now he scores far less frequently! He moved to the best club in the world, wasn't his stats supposed to increase bucketloads?

Would Lampard have been half as efficient as El Ilusionista in creating space, dragging out defenders and turning up on the big stage?

Some players are lucky to get lucky on the big stage which creates a big emotional connection with the fans and the whole world watching. That makes them bigger than they are in the eyes of the world.

You cant tell me a nigga who scores 3 goals a season is the greatest just because one of those 3 times was when the whole World was watching.

If that makes him a great, he should replicate that consistently.

In the pantheon of Barca ballers, Iniesta is nowhere near Xavi but it would not surprise me if singular moments like World Cup final etc will make some "highlight watchers" give Iniesta more than his due especially in relation to Xavi.

Xavi assisted twice in Euros final, but that is not a headline to grab your attention.


As for Lampard, he would scatter goals in Barca, no doubt.

Some ninjas used to say that Lampard would not score or assist his usual 20 goals if Chelsea play tiki-taka.

When Ancelotti brought tiki-taka, he scored 27 goals and assisted 20.

More attacking football just means more goals for Lampard. He would fit in with Barca play just as well as he did with Ancelotti and just like Seydou Keita did with Barca. Infact at Barca, he will certainly be aiming for 30 goals a season, 35 in a good season.

sleekdot:
To me Ballack was a better midfielder than Lampard. He moved position because he met Lampard at Chelsea

If it was Lampard that came to bayern too at that time, he would have changed position to accomodate Ballack

Ferguson was begging Ballack to come to man utd and pick the Captain hand band

At Ballacks peak he was one of the best

Maybe. I cant take anything away from Ballack, but for sure Iniesta will move position because he always moves to the wing at Barca and you cant compare his productivity in the central area.

Ballack in his prime would also move Iniesta to the wing if he went to Barca, no doubt because Ballacks productivity is through the roof. Im talking almost a goal every 2 games at Bayern.

It was Ronaldinho who begged Barca to bid for Lampard, but Lampard refused to leave Chelsea. When the greatest player in the world push for your signing, it is not to come and change position with Iniesta. There is a reason why they called for you. Iniesta must move position for him.

nonsoroyalty:
Ibime were u serious about xavi being your best mildfielder of all time or were u trying to be sarcastic?

I dont judge midfielders on the big occasion eg scoring in World Cup final that makes them seem greater than they are.

I judge midfielders on consistency.

I believe Xavi in his prime is a midfielder you just cant win the midfield battle against.

I have watched him over the last 8 years time and again and never seen a match where he did not win the midfield battle or dominate. We even went through the records and only once in Xavis career did we find a match where the opposition had slightly more possession than his team.

I am old enough to have also watched Zidane consistently for 90 minutes and he lost prolly 30 percent of his midfield battles.

Zidane is the only guy I can compare to Xavi and thats my criteria. If Zidane plays Xavi midfield 100 times, Zidane will not see enough possession 95 times. The one match where Zidane floored him was WC QF 2006 but Xavi was not in his prime.

I just dont think Zidane will touch ball if he faced Xavi in his prime. Xavi chokes the midfield from deep position even before it gets to the AM area of the pitch.

ollah1:
Balack moved to a different position when he arrived at Chelsea.
Iniesta would have moved to another position too if Barca had signed Lampard

Every midfielder must clear road for Lampard.


Wow!! Lampard must be the best midfielder of our time

Which AMF no go clear road for 27 goals and 20 assists? Is the manager crazy?

Ballack moved position - thats not conjecture, thats fact.

Ballack was one of the best AMs when he came to Chelsea - thats not conjecture, thats fact.

No be today wey Iniesta start to play left-wing. Hes prolly played close to 50% of his Barca games there. Na Seydou Keita, Fabregas, and Hleb dey move am go there before. He go just pack load kpatakpata when Lampard land for AMF.

There are two ninjas in Barca that are out of this World in their position - Messi and Xavi.

Recently you can add Neymar and Suarez to "almost out of this world" category.

Most other players are great but meant to seem greater than they are because of Messi and Xavi who guarantee dominance.

There are some players who are just good but made to look great eg Pedro and Pique.

One or two players are outright shyte but get carried along to win accolades nowhere near their talent, most notably Victor Valdes.

homesteady:
Ibime


My post on barcelona thread concerning this issue!
For a stats-less player to have this many accolades, then he must have been really special.

Benefits of playing in the best team seen in our lifetime. I think he deserves 2 or 3 of those. The others are just carry along. 2013 and 2014 was absolute ojoro - just people voting on reputation. Im sure Pique also has multiple entries.

Dont forget Lampard was 2nd in WPOTY when Chelsea was dominant.

If Iniesta came to Chelsea at Lampards peak, he woulda been asked to play in the pivot just like Ballack who was one of the top 3 AMS in the world when he moved to Chelsea.

Likewise if Barca had been successful in signing Lampard, they would have pushed Iniesta to the left wing to accomodate him.

Like I said, only a mad manager who already has a dominant midfield and attackers would choose Iniesta over Lampard in AMF. Iniesta is good enough to demand a place in the team, but he will find some other position to accomodate him. The currency of a nigga who will score you 27 goals and get you 20 assists guarantees you trophies in that Barca team.

Chelseafan1:
But I still think it isn't fair if that guy is judged solely because of his number of assists and goals scored when great players like Iniesta, Robben and Ribery weren't all that great statistically.

To each his own abeg.

Robben and Ribery are fantastic statistically.

Ribery makes 17-20 asssists a year.

Robben scores every other game when he is fit.

Only Iniesta is "instructed" not to score or assist.

Hazard will have to start scoring and assisting bucketloads to be rated with Neymar.

Would Messi be in the running with Ronaldo for WPOTY if he was scoring 18 goals a season to Ronaldos 60?

dmcdad:
I asked a simple question and you are digressing.

Zizou vs Lampard, who is/was the better footballer?

Cc: Ibime.

Zizou is the better midfielder but Xavi is the greatest midfielder of all time.

ollah1:
Your team played a beautiful footie under ancelotti and our guys scored loads of goals. How come you won a double In his first year and went trophyless the second year??

In Ancelottis 2nd year, Deco left . . . . and Ballack was replaced by Ramires. Go figure.

ollah1:
Fab is a better goal scorer than iniesta but does that make him a better player??

Besides he also played as a false 9

Fab is not a better player because he has zero fitness and can't run.

Like I said, any coach that already has a stable midfield that dominate possession would be mad to choose Iniesta over Lampard as his AMF. Who will turn down 27 goals and 20 assists when you already have Xavi and Busquets dominating the opposition midfield and Messi already scoring 60 goals and breaking opposition tactics. Lampard's additional goals, assists and workrate will just take that team beyond planet earth.

Chelseafan1:
What if the Coaches' tactics and instructions were for him to look for the pass rather than take shots?

That is what Ollah1 wants you to believe to justify the fact Iniesta has scored less goals than John Terry in his career.

Why did Iniesta go begging Guardiola to teach him how to score and assist? It's not because of no bloody instruction. He needs to improve on that side of the game, not hide under some fabled "instructions".

What were Fabregas instructions that made him score 15 goals a season at Barca?

Besides, Lampard does not take shots from outside the box like that. 95% of his goals are from inside the box. It's called timing of run and anticipation.

ollah1:
I didn't read ur message well.

No wonder you asked a stewpid question.

I see you have progressively been trying to make more and more excuses why Iniesta is not productive.

Kindly tell us why Fab4 scored 13, 14 and 15 goals in his 3 seasons there? (Please don't tell me he was false 9 for 3 seasons!)

I thought midfielders were not allowed to score or assist at Barca?

ollah1:
Seydou keita and fab played together in Barcelona??

Are you stewpid?

ollah1:
When fab hit those assists, he did that playing in the front role and not in the middle

That is not assists. That is goals. . . . and Fab4 scored most of em from midfield. 13 goals in his first year, 14 goals in his 2nd year, 15 goals in his 3rd year.

With the few minutes Seydou Keita used to get each game, he still scored healthily with the few minutes he got. He is more like Lampard in style.

Lampard would have scattered Barcelona with goals.

ollah1:
Ohh it's now assists. Nope he won't cos after passing it go the attackers, they would pass it to the goal scorer.

Then he would be the goalscorer after receiving the pass back from them.

Look at this bytch arse ninja consecutively making excuses why a certain someone can't score or assist.

Fabregas hit 13, 14, 15 goals every year at Barca from the bench. Lampard would hit 35!!!

ollah1:
Nope he won't. He would lay the passes to the attackers.

Then he would make 30 assists!

There was a time Barca was chasing Lampard.

If they had got him, they would have elevated him to the status of a Neymar when he scatter them with goals and assists.

The year we had Ancelotti playing tiki-taka football here, Lampard scattered 27 goals and 20 assists.

I think he would have reached 35 goals playing for that Barca team.

ollah1:
Oh really. How come Chelsea don't always win trophies??

Chelsea always won trophies when Lampard was in his pomp.

No Messi or no Xavi either.

If a manager already has a stable midfield who dominate possession, he would be mad to choose Iniesta over Lampard as his AMF.

Lampard's 27 goals and 20 assists will guarantee him trophies every year.

Gary Neville is just ruining his younger brother Phils name

Why not allow Phil to quietly go about being the assistant coach at Valencia where nobody knows if he is good or not.

Gary had to go take the top job in a country where he doesnt speak the language and spoil his brothers name ontop.

asEdeyHOT:
Like it is unexpected? Right?

When The buffoon called Jonathan spent all the nation's finances to fund his failed second term aspirations

Nigeria is a mono economy and the oil we depend on is currently almost valueless, so what are the options?

Borrow and use the money judiciously

God bless Buhari

You said it all.

Many Nigerians are fools and just like to rant upandan. Instead of going to hold Fortunato and his colleagues who stole all the reserves when the going was good and left nothing for the rainy day, they will be ranting like uneducated baboons.

Trolls dey make me laugh about this Terry leaving thing.

"He gave everything off the pitch as well. Should his statue be standing up or lying down?" - Wayne Bridge reference.

"Thanks for the good work JT. Your medal from Moscow 2008 is in the post." - Utd Fan.


On a more serious note, Emenalo couldnt call JT and tell him face to face? It was left to the agent to phone JT. It is this same cluelessness to understand the club and the fans that led him to recommend Benitez of all people to coach the club. Thats the equivalent of Barca Sporting Director appointing Mourinho to manage Barca.