₦airaland Forum

Chavez is making a big mistake - its not like FARC rebels have anything positive to offer their people except kidnapping and drug selling - they remind me of all the profiteers running around Niger Delta using social reform as an excusing for illegal profiteering and all sorts of inhumane activities - they are also criminalising the real freedom fighters.

That is not to say that the Colombian Paramilitary is any better sha.

Secondly, Chavez should simply not involve himself because his people are not ready with war with Yankee. War is never a good thing - and Venezuela has not been sufficiently provoked to cause this over-the-top reaction. Chavez needs to chill and cool the fire in his belly cos he is coming off as a ragtag rebel.

Thirdly, he has wasted all Venezuelas oil reserves on political and international patronage. To be honest, Chavez is the kind of left-winger who gives social politics a bad name. He typifies the usual fiscally irresponsible left-wing politician which is a poor representation of socially minded politicians.

Man - the last time I went to Benin, the place was bleeped up - but no less bleeped up than Onitsha and Aba.

BTW, the reference to Ancient Benin is not a diss - it is said in respect of Benin's cultural heritage. Benin City existed long before Naija and it will still be here long after Naija is gone.

Jakumo:
Nigeria has exported crude oil to the West for half a century, but the same arm-chair economists who have repeatedly called for the diversification of Nigeria's economy have now abruptly switched to wagging their fingers in disdain because Nigeria has begun the large-scale export of BEAVER, a commodity almost as vital to the West as gasoline.

lol - that is diversification all right. It is probably our second largest export good. However, unlike Crude Oil, the proceeds are not enjoyed by the whole country. They are mostly enjoyed by residents of Benin.

Drogba should hurry up and leave abeg - he is a wastepipe.

As for Lamps - I don tire sef. He would like to leave but according to Newspaper reports no club is willing to offer him more than £100,000 a week.

Malouda sef needs to go along with other wastepipes like Sheva, Wright-Phillips, Pizzaro, Ben Haim and Sidwell

Real Madrid want Essien - although he is still OK, he is not the type of player that ages gracefully because his game is based on stamina - he does not have much technique. I think it is the perfect time to let him go. By my estimation, he is about 31 or 32 real age. We all know these Ghanaians add more VAT to their age than Nigerians sef. Has anyone else noticed he does not run around as much as when he first came?

Real Madrid also want Carvalho. No way Jose! Ricky has to stay. He is probably our best defender.

We need Quaresma, Modric and Renato Augusto.

Don't worry - Avram Grant is moving back upstairs into his director of football role this summer.

Rumuors are that either Frank Rijkaard or Guus Hiddink are coming. I prefer Guus - Rijkaard is poor tactically. Infact, Guus is the only man now that can takeus forward after JM.

Trust me, I am from Rivers State. We have never seen a fool like this Odili. Firstly he introduced blood politics to Rivers State. We never used to have electoral assassinations till this guy came to power. So many people HATE this guy completely.

As I speak now, my village is completely burnt down and desolated because this fool sent assassins (Tom Ateke) to my village to clear it out because of his beef with Rufus Ada George, who is from my village.

This guy is a medical doctor who is supposed to save lives - but he specialises in taking lives. God will punish him eternally and all his family.

And yes - this idiot stole like never before. If you think Ibori and the rest of them stole - trust me, that is a drop in the Ocean compared with this guy. Not to talk about his $80m hospital in South Africa.

Whoever said there is not serious oversupply of Prostitutes in Naija. There is SERIOUS oversupply - thats why prices are dropping. 

Please don't ask me how I know - I just remember that Prostitutes in Naija used to be a lot richer than they are now (despite inflation).


@ Romeo -

Naija never fit do correct census - na prostitute we go fit count correctly? Trust me, if our university students are prostitutes - then we have a LOT of prostitutes. Prostitution even starts with fathers who marry their daughters to rich men.

^^^^ You dey mind am - all these so called Nigerian legends like Thunder Balogun - people too dey exaggurate their skills. I didn't catch Sam Okwaraji's time but they used to tell me he was the best player in the world. I laugh when I think about it now. They even said the same thing about Etim Essien. Naija sabi exaggurate too much.

SabiSabi, na true you dey talk - thank God say no be only me wey dey shame for some of these coconut heads.

Whether it is a good idea or not, what can we do about it? The stakeholders in Nigeria's misery are more than happy keeping the status-quo at the moment.

[quote author=Tayo-D link=topic=116574.msg2013823#msg2013823 date=1204421456]@Ibime,
So are you agreeing with me or some of us that the welfare system as practiced by the West should be scrapped? The system breeds nothing but lazy people who not only milk the hard work of others, but also limit their personal growth and success based on the route they have chosen.[/quote]There are NO Africans I know who do not grumble about the welfare system. However - No, I don't think it should be scrapped. It should be properly implemented to serve the use for which it was originally intended. This has started to be done in Holland - and I am sure will be taken up by other govts.

The issue of welfare is a bit like the issue of Iraq - do you withdraw straightaway or do you act strategically. Withdraw benefits straightaway and there will be total chaos.

There is a sizeable correlation between welfare and the reduction in crime - take away welfare suddenly and crime will increase - and it is way more expensive to house criminals in prison than to pay them welfare outside.

Personally, I have never claimed a single benefit in my life. However, I know many of my Naija brothers claim benefits when they first come to UK. Infact, some people opposing benefits in this thread may have claimed it at some time in their lives.

Also, no govt. can guarantee its citizens 100% employment - without creating useless jobs (which is a Communist idea - I'm sure you all oppose that wholeheartedly!)

[quote author=Tayo-D link=topic=116574.msg2013823#msg2013823 date=1204421456]How will that work practically? The Govt does not produce anything. It takes money from people and spend it. They cannot spend more than their budget for the year, and their needs will always grow to accomodate any excess of money allocated to any branch or dept of govt. Now if there is economic trouble, the truth is that the govt's budget will also be affected because the govt gets its money from the citizens. So how will the govt have money to give in times of economic uncertainty? Besides, why should somone else pay for my economic woe?[/quote]This debate about the black hole in Welfare has been raging for the last 25 years. Every government except Andorra, Liechtenstein and Monaco collect money from its people - so if you don't like it, you can move there. We are lucky to live in countries where government are fiscally responsible so I am sure they are not spending money any and anyhow. If they are spending money on Welfare and social programs, I am sure they are balancing it against things like Crime and health - I do not wish to live in a Ghettoised society - I have had enough of that in Naija. I thank God the UK Government taxed people so I could go to university for free. Otherwise, I would not have been able to afford. How else can we bridge the gap and give people the opportunity to live the so called "American dream?"

A wicked man can get no peace, even in his own house.

^^^^Hehehehe - that must have been fun. Last game I went to was Everton at home in Carling Cup.

nateevs:
You probably wanted to say Anelka has got better foot work than Drogba. . . not a question over his team spirit. . .

Secondly Drog was not played because of the mid-week Champions League match. .

You are damn right. Drogba has the first touch of a donkey. I have never liked him because he is the most difficult striker to partner. De guy no dey on the right wavelength. Team spirit or not, de guy no get class for in football. E no fit read pass or trap ball sef.

I could tolerate him last season when he was scoring x amount of goals - but this season, he seems to think he is some sort of Messiah swanning around the pitch, not working hard, forgetting that if he doesn't work hard, then he is useless.

Its not just me sef - in the second half of the Spurs game, my brother in-law called me to ask if we were playing with ten men - thats how lazy Drogba was. I hope they don't recall him to the team.

Abeg - no make me start on Drogba oh.

@ Tayo-D

Who is talking about lazy people here? Did you here me say let us give money to the lazy people? If you read the thread earlier where I pinpointed measures being taken by Holland to get the lazy off their backside - I am in support of Social Welfare - as a safety net. That was the original idea in the first place. As for me being a leftist, I don't know any leftist watching the Financial Markets as I do or studying derivatives.

And if the government here is stupid, why not go back to Naija since na you sabi.


@ Kobojunkie,

Trust me, after your comments on the South African Urine thread, I see discussion with you as pointless. And why you sef dey bring things in about me from other threads? Abi you dey follow me?

See - I told you guys Drogba should be dropped - you can see the result now. Anelka is more of a team player.

He- you must think this is literal and debating society or something. Firstly, your breadth of knowledge is too shallow - you should leave it to Bamowolo - at least he backs up his arguments with facts - you just spew rhetoric. Secondly, I am not so interested in convincing you of anything - discussion sharpens the mind - I also pick up things from debate. Thirdly, you just wanna LMAO! as if that validates your point. Fourthly, it is late and I got to tap soccer tomorrow so I got to go.

Look - you can LMAO all you want. When I say Jesus was a 'do-good' leftist, you are the one reading literal meaning into it. If I say Ghandhi was a 'do-good' leftist, you wouldn't complain, although Ghandhi never described himself as a leftist. You guys are the one using the label 'leftist'. I wouldn't even describe myself as a 'leftist' so why woud I describe Jesus as such. If I am leftist then Britain must be a leftist country because I like their social systems. Anyway, I don tire for you.

But Jesus did say give to Ceaser what is Ceasers and Give to God what is God's - and love your neighbour as yourself.

Hehehe - you are the one speculating whether Jesus is pro-Welfare state or not, not me.

Nobody is claiming Jesus in any debate - just stating facts. Jesus cared for all men, especially the poor - so I don't know what you are laughing about.

I am sure you have heard the seven beautitudes. The fact is that if Jesus was here, you would probably call him a left wing do-gooder as well.

I am not claiming Christian or anything - just telling you.

Kobojunkie:
I am not the one claiming JESUS ON MY SIDE IN A POLITICAL DEBATE HERE, you are, What next?? God give you Visions that you are right and your opponents are hell bound?? Education at work!!!LMAO!!!

O-boy grow up! Shebi, you were campaigning for Shagari in 1982 when I wasn't even born. Please act your age.

Kobojunkie:
OH MY GOSH!!! LMAO!!! Jesus was also a do-gooding leftist?? the same jesus that watched a widow give all she had and praised her for doing that was a do-gooding leftist?? It is almost good to claim jesus is on your side in any argument , LMAO!!!

No - Jesus was a 'do-bading' rightist.

What do you think?

Go and read the book of acts and see how the first Church lived together, ate together and contributed together. Ananias and his wife were even killed for lying about his income - just like you probably do on your tax form. Jesus lived with his disciples and shared his 5 loves of bread and fishes the same way. Remember what he said to the rich young man whom he asked to sell all his possesions and follow him? Wealth is not how much you own, it is a state of mind - grredy or giving. And BTW, Jesus praised the woman because of her giving spirit - not because he wanted the Church to have the money.

They have eyes but they do not see.

4 Play:
Its because we have a pension system here,its as if we can't do without it.People can be compulsorily required to invest their money.What is most important for me is that any money a particular person receives in his old age comes from money he has saved or invested during his working life not from a central Govt pot.

You reap what you sow eventually.

The key point you are both missing is that with demographic changes,the current pension system is unsustainable.Its that simple.Unless you want society to be equally poor,its better that most of society reaps the benefits of welfare reforms.

This is the problem with 'do-gooding' leftists.They would rather everyone be poorer than some left behind.However,with compulsory measures to ensure savings and investment by the "clueless,"even that worst case scenario can be averted.

Well thank God you aren't in Government. Every civilised government in the world is doing the opposite of what you are saying - so either they are stupid - or you are. Cancel that - no need for insult.

Governments know better than to leave people starving - because a hungry man is an angry man, so you better hide behind your electric fences when they get angry. Actually, that is already happening in Naija now. The rich neglected the poor and now the poor are killing them like fowls - either by armed robbers, potholed roads or ineffective bootlegged drugs. Go figure!

Do-gooding leftist? - yes, thank God I am. Jesus was also. I'm in good company. Rather 'do-good' than 'do-bad'.

Do you not think the people running these Pension funds are professionals? Can they not do a better job than 95% of ordinary people?

Bamowolo - you are just starting to get pedantic now - anyway, call it how you see. Debate cannot be endless, so this is my last rebuttal - call it how you see it.

I ask you about China's healthcare, you start to talk about their cultural revolution. Did I ask you about forced collectivisation or any of their other communist agenda?

Next thing, you are telling me Turkey is a developed country - and using Eastern Europe to buttress your point.

Then you are talking about Canada's healthcare not being of the same standard throughout. Which countries is? Just because you don't have doesn't mean you should criticise those who do. Of course there are population pressures in migrant communities. It is the same with Britain, France and every other country with Universal HealthCare. You cannot get the same speed of service in London as you do in Shropshire, for example - but you do get served.

Now you are saying Beckham only brought his whole family for tax reasons. Abi, can't a man live with his family again? BTW, most British celebs go to UK to avoid Paparazzi and attention. Beckham cannot walk any UK street without being mobbed but many celebrities go incognito in LA. Also, he wants to build a career out there after football cos he has already conquered the UK market and he has many Hollywood friends. Trust me, if UK celebrities were going to LA to escape tax, there are many places in Europe where they can pay zero tax. From Jersey to Monaco, them boku.

No, the government shouldn't dictate how much rich people spend? Then who should? Should it be voluntary?

Don't worry, we are all going to stop paying tax completely. Let us see what happens to society then. We will all fly to the Cayman Islands and let these peasants kill themselves over the little crumbs that are left in the feudalistic states we leave behind. No problem.

4 Play:
That being said,I prefer being independent and poor than being a wealthy subject of the British Empire.

Oh boy speak for yourself oh! Not me! Tufiakwa! The fact is that you are now living in a foreigners land because your country is independent and poor. There is nothing independent about that. Forget politics! If Naija was a subject of the British Empire, I would be back home enjoying the sun and chewing suya.

After all, many French Carribean Countries are really enjoying themselves now as subjects of France. They even have French passports - although they hardly leave their Islands.

4 Play:
There are already safety nets for the disabled.Covering the disabled is one thing because only a minority proportion of the populace will fall into that category,whereas,virtually everyone will reach retirement age and covering everyone is financially unfeasible with changing demographics.

You hand it to people with "knowledge." I read somewhere that ordinary people match "experts" in returns on their equity investment.If it takes introducing "money managment" at school level,so be it.

We are talking of the West.The West has seen virtually unstoppable long term growth for centuries.Even if you retire during a recession-recessions are temporary anyway-the returns you made over the "boom" years should more than cover up.

My guy, you dey talk like say Mr Average know all this thing wey you dey talk. You fit talk from now till tomorrow - I already sabi wetin you dey talk. I be President for Investment Club. The fact is, most people have no clue how to invest - or even who to give their money to - some people no want hear am sef - all the investment talk puts them off.

The fact is that we are talking about running a country here, not running a society of highly educated people - and you have to come up with a better solution than what you are suggesting.

4Him:
The British left in 1960 . . . up until 1980 (20yrs after) our economy was still favourably on par with those of the Asian tigers until Shagari came into power and we took a nose dive.

Nigerians built Ahmadu Bello University, the Yoruba's built Unilag and OAU without the British . . . all these whinning for white people is just sickening.

Nobody is whining for the Brits. I was just arguing the taxation issue. Left to me, I would say we should have either split up or stayed under the Brits until we could properly stand on our own two.

Also, we weren't economically stable before Shagari - an economically and culturally stable country with the right system of democracy canot be undone by one man who only ruled for a few years - the only explanation is that we started disintegrating from the moment the Brits left. Politicians started collecting 10% bribes immediately after independence and over time all these problems compounded.

Finally, if you say we were stable before Shaghari, I guess you were not in Biafra between 1966 and 1969. The fact is that we started imploding straight after independence. No thanks to the Brits for putting Hausa's in the seat of power.

However, politics aside, all a man wants is to eat properly, be happy and secure - and we had that until independence.

doyin13:
but say your savings are invested in equities and they tank in value come close to retirement time. . .

In that situation e no good make government intervene. . . .if such misfortune were to befall me. . .I would sure vote for a govt. that would help.

Talkless of, God forbid, if you are disabled in an accident - I am sure you will be happy for the saftey net then.

No doubt, Welfare has its problems - some people just don't want to work - but I am sure everyone would rather there was a safety net than not unless you are mega-rich. That is the difference between cicilised and uncivilised society. Plus governments around the world are starting to force lazy people off their backside. I know that in Holland, the government actually gives you a job - and if you don't take it, they cut ya benefits. I think UK has started employing a similar scheme. I also know that Yankee is looking to do something similar in the near future.

Plus not everyone is wise with investments. Some people study other subjects like Psychology and Social Sciences and  have no clue how to invest their money. The system you guys are suggesting only applies to people who have knowledge of investments. OK- what if you retire just at the time of an economic downturn or recession? Whether you are a guru or not, you will feel the pinch.

Hehehe - you don come again!

bawomolo:
i'm a liberal, do u want me to explain my liberal stance on issues such as the legalization of weed, gay marriage, abortion and free trade??

Please go ahead - help me waste your own time.

bawomolo:
so what's turkey, an underdeveloped country

No - a DEVELOPING country. Come to Europe and see how many Turkish economic migrants litter the streets then ask me again. Maybe Fox News tell you it is a developed country to make it seem as if you have a credible ally in the War against Iraq.

bawomolo:
spain is a member of the EU.

Yes - don't you understand English. I said they will come into line with the rest of the EU.

bawomolo:
are u trying to argue that universal healthcare has varying success in canada depending on region??

Do they have UNIVERSAL healthcare or not? Stop being pedantic.

bawomolo:
here are the tax rate of a few universal healtcare countries.

http://www.taxindenmark.com/article.31.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxation_in_the_United_Kingdom
http://www.heritage.org/Index/country.cfm?id=Sweden

u see how people are complaining about the taxes are burdensome, u see how folks like beckham are running to the US?? why do u expect rich people to pay more when they already cover 85% of US tax revenue??

Yes, and so? Do we still not attract foreign investment? Is London not the 2nd biggest financial Centre after Wall Street? Are the Scandinavians not living better than anyone else except Oil Rich Gulf nations?

The rich cover 85% of taxes because they own 85% of the wealth. What is your point?

If you know anything about football, you will know that Beckham did not go to the US for tax reasons but for the humoungous pay packet they are offering which is potentially far and above any other player in the world.

bawomolo:
the United states isn't a central government, it's a confederation of states. each state can choose to have universal healthcare whether they want it or not. nigeria has a centralized system, the US doesn't.

Do you understand sarcasm or not? Read the original post.

bawomolo:
lol what kind of social healthcare program just china have. i see u are pretty unenlightened for someone allegedly with a masters degree.

Yes, it has been scrapped under the new regime - but didn't they have it under Mao? You are missing the point - the point is that if a big Country like China can organise it, then I am sure Yankee can as well.

bawomolo:
stick to algorithm and avoid discussions about politics.

We are discussing Economics, not Politics. I minored in Economics so don't get slick.

bawomolo:
are u running away??

I dey Kampke.


As for Kobojunkie, I no go even answer you. At least Bamowolo get brain - as for you, I no go waste my breath.