₦airaland Forum

plaetton: God has caused so many problems in this country, so much bloodshed, so much hatred and division, so much exploitation, so much abuse of the poor, innocent and the defenceless, so much slapping, raping and sapping. Isn't it time we do a little bit of introspection and ask ourselves some questions about god?.

Now, I expect everyone to say my god is not connected to evil,my own god is this and my own god is that.
Yeah sure!
That is exactly the main problem: the very idea that your god is better than the god of the other person.
We have seen and are seeing much destruction of both the physical and metal potentials of an entire race as a result of this obscene obsession with middle east gods.
I say with a very loud voice that It is high time we DEPORT god back to where ever they conjoured him up from.
The bible and the koran seem to be acting as trojan horses in our society.

I hear that god caused a lot of trouble in the middle east as well as in Europe too.

Can you imagine,the governor of Plateau state has just informed us that god had revealed to him that he was punishing Plateau with death and terror as recompense for her sins. Wow.
This means that the governor has abdicated his responsibility to protect the people of plateau State from the terror of Fulani jihadists.
So, to the people of plateau state, you are on your own, god has sanctioned and commandeth it that you shall perish.
Who can argue with god?

Again, I say, lets deport god from our land and see if we can have security,peace and dignity.

Lets see a show of hands if you support this idea.
I actually want to take a poll on this, how do I do it?

GOD didn't cause any problem in 9ja....

Corrupt humans did.......

Governor JANG is saying things out of his own originality....he's a weakling.......

The problems 9ja as a whole is as a result of corruption.....

Leave GOD out of it......

Besides how do u deport GOD when u can't see him....

Abi u smoke something??

MacDaddy01: U are going to hell.

I don't know yet....

But I don't go to church.....

I make sure I imitate Christ till death....

And If I do that and endure to the end then I'll survive....

.........


I aint going to hell with u nigga...lol

@poster......

Me sef dey ask that question o......

I for one believe Jesus must have had to be a spirit to get into the heavens........

Because only spirit persons live in the heavens.....

OLAADEGBU: Thanks for answering my kweshun. Why do you say that politicians cannot be true Christians? Can you explain further?

They receive power from the dragon(satan) as mentioned in revelations.....

These guys aint acting according to there own originality....they are being controlled by the GOD and ruler of this world....

And u know who that is...

SATAN!!!!!!!!!!

How can they still be christians??

No way they aint....

They are never nothing like Jesus......

The Jesus I know will come to destroy all human ,political set ups.......

Thank u!!!!!!!

Niflheim: only 4 empires on earth?what about attila the hun?what about the mongols under genghis khan?the book of john was written after the death of pontius pilate and you claim that it predicted greece,persia and babylon which flourished in it's past?

Daniel did prophesy 1st about d roman empires fall.......

John just did a review of daniels prophecy,and also in-corporated the fall of the roman empire and d next world powers after rome.......

And john did give us a fore gleam of how it'll all happen.....

Thank u......

U seem correct.....

Those acts Jesus condemned are exactly what many of the churches love doing....

U are correct.........

Oh yeah revelation says it all....

It tells how world powers,kingdoms,governments had arisen in the past and fallen,and how the present world powers now existing would be destroyed....

If only persons could know the end result of human governments they'll be advocating no other government but Gods kingdom......

Revelations is really a book of revelations....

buzugee: DUNNO DUDE. I HAVE NEVER FASTED IN MY LIFE

Lol

buzugee: Ijawkid the violent man. i got a lil scripture for that. PSALMS 18 VS 48 He delivereth me from mine enemies: yea, thou liftest me up above those that rise up against me: thou hast delivered me from the violent man.

Lol....

Hey bro go to ya mail.....

We got sometin to talk about.....

Enigma: I think this is the very heart of the problem. I have pointed this out to several anti-Trinitarians on the forum, including especially some of the non-Christians most vehemently opposed to the doctrine or even the idea of the Trinity.

One other thing that I have also noticed about the opponents of the Trinity idea is a tendency to get rude and abusive instead of engaging with the arguments.


One more point while I am in ----- regarding God the Holy Spirit and "the spirit of God":

- The Holy Spirit is a specific "entity" in the Bible ---- very clearly; He instructed, forbad etc

- if speaking of the "spirit of God", you could even go as far as speaking of seven spirits of God e.g.

Revelation 1:4

Revelation 3:1

But then even having spoken of the seven spirits of God, consider carefully the point of this post I made some time ago:

https://www.nairaland.com/497445/trinity-doctrine-invented-council-meeting/1#6775459

Sorry if we sound kinda vehement....

Now if u want we could discuss on the seven spirits of God mentioned in revelation....revelation itself tells us who those spirits are.....they are angels.......

But as regards the holy spirit is it an angel or is it God or is it even a person......

I would love if we all go back to consider the greek and hebrew word that is translated to holy spirit or the spirit of God.......

Thanks....

And sorry once again for sounding a lil violent....it sometimes makes. D discussion fun......:-)

Ihedinobi: Now I am beginning to wonder if you're being deliberately annoying.

STOP ASKING ME QUESTIONS AND ATTACKING A POSITION THAT IS UNAVAILABLE TO YOU. Answer my questions first. I am going to ignore you henceforth if thinking logically proves too hard a task for you. You got on this thread to respond to my opening post. Either respond to it or quit trying to drag me into your frivolous merry-go-round.

When your head settles from all that buzz and you get around to fixing the difficulties that I have indicated as associated with your position as I perceive it, if I do not accept your explanations, then and only then can you reasonably ask me for better ones. Until you do so, I'll pay no mind to you.

Ok settle down....

The issue here is trinity isn't it??

And ur take is that the trinity is biblical.......

Not so??

I'm settled now......

Ask ya questions,then I ask mine......

Mr_Anony: Oh my God! you miss the point entirely. I think the problem here is that you do not understand what is meant by Trinity at all. I believe you understand the scripture so I won't continue throwing scripture back and forth with you because we will only succeed in abusing scripture by doing so.
There is an approach Ihedinobi is asking you to consider. You have chosen to ignore it, but are more interested in attacking the image of Trinity in your mind.

Let us approach this another way....

Could you briefly describe what you know to be the nature of God. i.e. Who is God?

There are many GODS.....

Use names please......

GOD is nobody's name......

Ihedinobi: Why, thank you, sir, I'm much relieved. Now, accommodate me just a little more and tell me if the positions I set out in that earlier post before the one you quoted and responded to in your comment above rightly describe your arguments. If they do, please help me further by answering the questions I raised with respect to them. Thank you very much.

Have u read 1 corinthians 15: 24,27 $ 28

That scripture is d final that ends d trinity wahala.......

I want u to explain those verses coupled with all the discussions we'v been having here.....

Like I said sincerely consider those texts and ask urself if Jesus is actually the 1 true GOD or if Yahweh is part of a triangle that says Jesus is d same as the Father(Yahweh).....

Mr_Anony: ^^^^^Just to make sure you understand what I mean when I say Trinity and so we are on the same page, I'll quote myself from another thread.


I believe the above post answers your questions......

That definition is wrong....

That definition is according to some man made creed........

God does not exist in 3 forms or persons.....

The title GOD is nobody's name.....

Use names of individuals and let us get on with this....

Hiding behind d cloak of the title GOD is what u guys are using to foster a dogma based on paganism.....

I want to hear names....

Call them names.....

God does not worship himself....

Now ur definition of trinity is quite different from frosbels,from the posters,from other trinitarians,,,,,

The trinity dogma has been remixed over and over again because its not compatible with d bible......don't u see it??

If God is one and then exists in different forms then u'll have to prove why

## God prayed to himself....

##Why God annointed himself......

##Why God hands over a kingdom to himself....

##Why God knows and doesn't know when the end will come......

##why God worshiped himself....

##why GOD died leaving d heavens devoid of a GOD.....

Use names and let us understand ourselves.......

Stop all this 1 GOD divided into 3 places or persons.........

The bible does not teach that......

U guys just don't want to face d fact that d trinity fosters worshipping triad GODS.......

Its a pagan concept and was never taught by d apostles.......

Mr_Anony: In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God [/b]moved upon the face of the waters. [/i]Genesis 1:1-2

[i]In the beginning was the [b]Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made John 1:1-3

The two passages clearly show the Father, the Word and the Spirit existing at the very beginning of existence uncreated. I hope I have satisfied you sir.

A little small question for u before I answer the questions here....

Is the spirit of God the same as GOD the holy ghost??
Hmmm.....

U had better go back to the hebrew word that was translated spirit of God b4 u run into some serious confusion........

Is d expression God d holy spirit the same as the spirit of God??

Remember I also do not agree that the spirit of God is an individual person forming a trinity.....

Like I also earlier said that spirit for once in d bible was never called a God or God.....

I know Jesus took part in creation as Gods agent......Jesus has always been Yahwehs agent...

Let me stick to names and not using the title (GOD).......

I want u to do a research on the words that are always translated holy spirit,it will go a long way to show or prove to u if the holy spirit is a seperate person or Yahwehs force or strength.......

Meanwhile if u have a goodnews bible I'll like u to read genesis 1:1-3 and see the perfect way it describes what d holy spirit is......

concrete research work,contextual reading,and understanding d original intentions of the hebrew and greek words enables one solve this trinity wahala......

Ihedinobi: You could help us nitwits by addressing the truths in an orderly manner. Just answer the questions in the order that I have set them out. We might surprise you by actually understanding.

Lol....you aint no nitwit....

Why would u call urself that.....

We'r jus having a di§cussion.....

My point is if Jesus has a Father and GOD that is above him then it automatically squashes d trinity teaching.....

I want to quote 1 scripture that has made me know that d trinity teaching can't hold even in heaven ....

1 corinthians 15: 24 ,27 $ 28.....

No sincere hearted person will read those verses and cling to the trinity teaching....

Now u guys might understand me when I and Je§us say there is only 1 true God.....

.............

Thanks........

Mr_Anony: ^^^^^^ @Ijawkid and Freksy,

As I said, you will have to deny a lot of scripture to hold on to your stance. You even go to the point of allowing for two "Gods" in the bible one "Mighty" and the other "Almighty" (Blasphemy watch)

I could keep throwing scripture at you all night but now I know it will be futile because you'll just come up with another shoddy explanation.

I give up. I really can't help you guys

Just show us where the expressions God the HOLY spirit is then I might concede....

Ur formular has been debunked a long time ago......


I just told u who a God is.......

U'll have to simultaneously prove that the HOLY spirit is God or God....

Show us where it explicitly says the holy spirit is God.....

Jesus/Yahweh discussion has been deliberated on this forum for too long.....

I wuld quote a scripture that trinitarians never have an explanation to.....

But if u say ur tired then no wahala.....

There is only 1 truÉ God that Jesus talked about and wo®shiped.....

Jesus didn't worship himself even if he is a GOd.....don't u get it??

Jesus worshipped somebody.....his Father......

Mr_Anony: Lol, let's not play semantics over the meaning of oneness. I'll let it go for now but even at that, you have not explained why Isaiah refers to Jesus in his prophecy as Mighty God and Everlasting Father.

I'll give you yet another verse to chew on.
Jesus said:
[i]And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self [b]with the glory which I had with thee [/b]before the world was. [/i]John 17:5 KJV

Does God share His glory with anyone?

....to deny Trinity my friend, you will have to deny a truckload of scripture.

So the word mighty GOD is ur problem??

now my question is who is a GOD or what is a God??

GOD na person name??

I culd remember I gave a detailed exegesis on this ""GOD"" issue.....ELOHIM......

Isaiah prophecy's about the messiah's coming......

ELOHIM is a title that all spirit creatures in heaven are entitled to....

Even u as a human can be a God.....psalms tells u that........

Jesus is a God I agree.....after all angel.s are called ELOHIM too,I'm not that myopic not to know,but Jesus certainly isn't Yahweh.....


That word GOD is not limited to Yahweh alone but to all spirit creatures even sometimes it extends to humans.......


But Jesus himself knew who his God was....

Jesus had a Father and GOD......

I don't
Understand why it is hard to accept this plain truths even from Jesus himself

Mr_Anony: Lol, let's not play semantics over the meaning of oneness. I'll let it go for now but even at that, you have not explained why Isaiah refers to Jesus in his prophecy as Mighty God and Everlasting Father.

I'll give you yet another verse to chew on.
Jesus said:
[i]And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self [b]with the glory which I had with thee [/b]before the world was. [/i]John 17:5 KJV

Does God share His glory with anyone?

....to deny Trinity my friend, you will have to deny a truckload of scripture.

So the word mighty GOD is ur problem??

now my question is who is a GOD or what is a God??

GOD na person name??

I culd remember I gave a detailed exegesis on this ""GOD"" issue.....ELOHIM......

Isaiah prophecy's about the messiah's coming......

ELOHIM is a title that all spirit creatures in heaven are entitled to....

Even u as a human can be a God.....psalms tells u that........

Jesus is a God I agree.....after all angel.s are called ELOHIM too,I'm not that myopic not to know,but Jesus certainly isn't Yahweh.....


That word GOD is not limited to Yahweh alone but to all spirit creatures even sometimes it extends to humans.......


But Jesus himself knew who his God was....

Jesus had a Father and GOD......

I don't
Understand why it is hard to accept this plain truths even from Jesus himself

Ihedinobi: What is your position? Describe clearly in terms of the categories described in my opening statement.

My position is I'm a unitarian.....shikena....

I don't believe in the trinity @ all.......

And that's why we've been discussing @ length.....

Mr_Anony: Lol, let's not play semantics over the meaning of oneness. I'll let it go for now but even at that, you have not explained why Isaiah refers to Jesus in his prophecy as Mighty God and Everlasting Father.

I'll give you yet another verse to chew on.
Jesus said:
[i]And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self [b]with the glory which I had with thee [/b]before the world was. [/i]John 17:5 KJV

Does God share His glory with anyone?

....to deny Trinity my friend, you will have to deny a truckload of scripture.

So john 17:5 supports d trinity??

Abi I dey dream??

Lol.....

The same way the Father glorifies the son is the same way the son glorifies his disciples....

What ever happens between The Father and the son is what the son extends to us humans as well....

U had better start adding us to the trinity formular....

U barely understand context and scriptural explanations.......

##The Father glorifies the Son,the Son glorifies disciples......I still dÓnt know if u've read thru those verses I gave u....

##The Father and the son are one.....the Son and his disciples are one.......

The relationship goes on.....

##The Father is greater than the Son,The son is greater than man.....1 corinthians 11:3......


It goes on and on......

Why would Jesus be begging his Father to glorify Him if he was part of a formular that shows that He is the Father or equal to the Father....

Why would Jesus even pray in the 1st place??

It is d trinity doctrine that has so much discrepancies.....not long ago we spotted a verse that was added by trinitarians just to support there pagan stance.....

It only takes a false or spurious verse in d bible to support a false doctrine....

As easy as ABC.......

Truth is light just asked every one here to show us where in the bible the holy spirit was called a God or God........

U have a lot to prove my bro......

Ur just struggling to prove what constantine and his crew started....

Ona go tire very soon......

There's one more thing...

I was recently baffled to find out that just as our( mans) existence is dependent on Jesus,so also Jesus's existence is dependent on His God and Father...


Abi no be wetin john 6:57 talk??




#New International Version (©1984)
Just as the living Father sent me and I live
because of the Father, so the one who feeds
on me will live because of me.

#New Living Translation (©2007)
I live because of the living Father who sent
me; in the same way, anyone who feeds on me
will live because of me.

#English Standard Version (©2001)
As the living Father sent me, and I live
because of the Father, so whoever feeds on
me, he also will live because of me.


There is 1 reason Jesus lives....

And u know the reason....

Like wise for us to live we too as humans must depend on Jesus.....

Yahweh-----Jesus-------man........


Now that's d chain bro..........

It seems man is part of the trinity....

I can't wake up 1 day and assume that we humans is Jesus Christ.....

That'll be madness!!!!!!!!!!!

Mr_Anony: And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one [/i]1John 5:8 KJV

Notice your clever wordplay? Clearly, verse 7 and verse 8 are not saying the same thing.

I'll give you another verse to chew on:

[i]For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Isaiah 9:6

I hope you do realize that Isaiah was prophesying about Jesus Christ's coming. I have highlighted some interesting titles this child has.

.........maybe it is the evil latin vulgate at work again

Agree in ONE,ONE,in agreement are all d same......

Jesus said we (his disciples) are one with him just as he is one with the Father..go read john 17:22-24....

Are we Jesus??

If we are one with Jesus then u shuld understand where this all ends...

U had better go check up other verses of the bible to help u give d right exegesis.....

Isaiah prophesied about the coming of Jesus,but not of Yahweh...

I hope u understand??

Meanwhile throw away that spurious verse from 1 john .....

Its because of that verse we are even discussing this issue in d 1st place....

I don't know why the word ""ONE"" is still a problem to u guys after much scriptures to help u understand.....


Even husband and wife are to become 1 flesh after there marraige....

Mayb we shuld call them 2nity...

Since its hard to understand oneness.....

My nairaland people....for a while now the issue of the soul,spirit and body has been on...

Now I got a little question for every1 and I wanna hear ur view points.....

I for one believe the soul is the existing person,.........any individual is a soul.....nothing more nothing else....

All the spirit,body and soul theory has just got everytin mixed up....

Now how can we explain this scripture.....

Psalms 11:5.......

##New International Version (©1984)
The LORD examines the righteous, but the
wicked and those who love violence his SOUL
hates.

##English Standard Version (©2001)
The LORD tests the righteous, but his soul
hates the wicked and the one who loves
violence.

##New American Standard Bible (©1995)
The LORD tests the righteous and the wicked,
And the one who loves violence His soul hates.

##King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
The LORD trieth the righteous: but the
wicked and him that loveth violence his soul
hateth.


##Aramaic Bible in Plain English (©2010)
Lord Jehovah examines the righteous ones; the
evil and those who love evil his soul has hated.
.....


Is God a SOUL or is there a part of Him that is soul??

Is it God Himself that hates those who are violent or is it a part of Him(soul) that hates those who practice violence??...

Or what??

Is the SOUL not the individual under consideration??

Can we please explain this verse up there....

Mayb my thought on this verse mite not be correct but I want every1 to come explain it...

Thanks.....

Ihedinobi: Ok. So it's not in the original Greek. Does it disagree with the rest of the Bible? If you think it does, show us how.

What is ur take on verse 8 of that 1 john chapter 5.....

And sorry if it sounded as if I and buzu were insultive.....

What do u have to say about the holy spirit also being one with blood and water....

Remember the scriptures explains itself....

buzugee: what you quoted is not talking about the trinity. what that means is that your deeds are monitored by the father, the holy spirit in you and the word ( which is the spirit of christ ). so these are the 3 things that store up your deeds. they are one in that they all record mans deeds.

its like how you have 3 score boards recording one game. they are a unit because they are recording the same game but they are 3 different separate things.

Let us assume that,that verse did exist in d original text,it still does not support or even mean d trinity...

Verse 8 tells us that blood,water and spirit(that same spirit that is in verse 7 mr anony quoted) are also one.....

is blood and water also part of a trinity or do they form a trinity??



I ask trinitarians this question a lot...

Meanwhile buzu bobo good explanation.....

Mr_Anony: For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one 1John 5:7 KJV.

Now that's a bit of scripture for you guys. Can we now get down to the bible and start discussing properly without shouting all over the place?

Mr anony are u new to this forum??

That verse u quoted has been debunked as spurious.....

An addition from the latin vulgate...

Throw away that verse and let us discuss......

That verse does nt exist in the original greek text.....

Abi u no know??

Jerry2i: who cares if u do?mtchewwwww.the doctrine of d Blessed Trinity is mystery dat u can't n will neva understand,except by His divine wisdom.

And so u understand d mystery abi??

Mystery my foot!!!!!!!!!!!......

The nicean creed instigated the mystery
..........

Even Jesus never talked about the trinity but here we are arguing over nothing....

buzugee: FOCUSING ON TRINITY IS DEMONIC AND NOT SCRIPTURAL. THIS IS ROMAN CATHOLIC BULLCRAP. STOP TALKINGGGGG ABOUT TRINITY. NEXT TIME I READ ABOUT TRINITY AGAIN ON NL I PROMISE TO SMASH MY PUTER

Thanks my brother...

How can we be deliberÀting on some crap set up on paganism??....

Trinity,trinity,trinity but that wonderful word does nt even exist in d scriptures(I knw sometimes trinitarians wish d word was sneakÉd into d latin vulgate)...

How can a doctrine which is central tÓ true worship not be found in the bible but Ónly in some man made creeds....

Then what the hell are we to deliberate on??....

just a lil whilÉ from now they'll run around celebrating the birthday of Jesus,Yahweh and d holyspirit joined together on decem.ber 25th just as pagans. From whom the triune .doctrine was .borrowed. From always do..........

Logicbwoy: Ode...a circle is flat.

Lol....

As usual u interprete d bible d way u wanna just to refute actual truths.....

Keep doing that until u agree.....

buzugee: Whappun Rastaman

Oboy hw far?

Long time

Delafruita: do animals have a soul/spirit?

Animals are souls just like humans....

They are breathing and living creatures as well......

Logicbwoy: Prove that the tree is literal. How do you know what is literal and not? Is God metaphorical?

Ok here I am with my scriptures.....

Like I said any Jew who read Gods word daily wuld knw that the earth was round and hanging on nothing....

Centuries b4 science could discover the earths make up God had inspired men to pen down truths about the earth......

Since mayb u don't have a bible I'll quote...

And mind u these scriptures are to also explain that the tree mentioned in daniel isn't just a literal tree....

Isaiah 40:22.....

##New International Version (©1984)
He sits enthroned above the circle of the
earth, and its people are like grasshoppers. He
stretches out the heavens like a canopy, and
spreads them out like a tent to live in.

##New Living Translation (©2007)
God sits above the circle of the earth. The
people below seem like grasshoppers to him!
He spreads out the heavens like a curtain and
makes his tent from them.

##English Standard Version (©2001)
It is he who sits above the circle of the earth,
and its inhabitants are like grasshoppers; who
stretches out the heavens like a curtain, and
spreads them like a tent to dwell in;

##New American Standard Bible (©1995)
It is He who sits above the circle of the
earth, And its inhabitants are like
grasshoppers, Who stretches out the heavens
like a curtain And spreads them out like a tent
to dwell in.

##King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the
earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as
grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens
as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent
to dwell in:.

##King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
It is he that sits upon the circle of the earth,
and its inhabitants are as grasshoppers; that
stretches out the heavens as a curtain, and
spreads them out as a tent to dwell in:

##American King James Version
It is he that sits on the circle of the earth,
and the inhabitants thereof are as
grasshoppers; that stretches out the heavens
as a curtain, and spreads them out as a tent to
dwell in:

Mayb u can say this verse was added after scientist traveled outer space to confirm the earths roundness.......

How on earth culd isaiah have known this scientific truth??

Meanwhile let's see what job has to say about the earth.....

##New International Version (©1984)
He spreads out the northern [skies] over
empty space; he suspends the earth over
nothing.

##New Living Translation (©2007)
God stretches the northern sky over empty
space and hangs the earth on nothing.

##English Standard Version (©2001)
He stretches out the north over the void and
hangs the earth on nothing.

##New American Standard Bible (©1995)
"He stretches out the north over empty space
And hangs the earth on nothing.

##King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
He stretcheth out the north over the empty
place, and hangeth the earth upon nothing.

##GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
"He stretches out his heavens over empty
space. He hangs the earth on nothing
whatsoever.

##King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
He stretches out the north over the empty
place, and hangs the earth upon nothing.
American King James Version
He stretches out the north over the empty
place, and hangs the earth on nothing.


Long before scientists culd invent the telescope ,travel outer space the bible,Gods inspired word has it that the earth was hanging on nothing.......

Is or was the bible lying??

Jews knew all this scientific facts.......

The apostles who had read d law and those of the prophets knew all these......

I'll be back to explain what the tree in daniel u quoted means.....