₦airaland Forum

OLAADEGBU:
But what would they do with them?

I think Allah will re-grow their penis. He needs to. That's the least he can do

smallrincowis16:
QURAN, is already in written form during the time of prophet and prophet had already prophesized that what every his companion agreed on is part of the religion.
the INJEEL was actually given that name cos no other claimant nor resemblance do we find for it

What are you saying?

smallrincowis16:
just answer this simple question. whats the name of bible according to bible to confirm its validity

The Koran confirmed its validity. Or you want to deny that?

The death of Jesus is a contradiction. Contradiction have no place in reality. How about those who died before Jesus was born? Does that mean they would miss heaven? And why can't God undo a damage without demanding a ransom in return? Jesus was innocent, why did God drag him into our mess? What the cunting _fuck kind of sadistic game is this? I'm sick and tired of god.

He preached to those in hell? So you are saying people are already in hell? And will that be of any help?

Love, love, love, love. God loves me. He loves you. He loves us. He is compassionate, loving, filled with compassion, filled with love. He loves the world. He loves humans. He loves everybody. He is love. God is love. But he would throw us into a furnace of burning sulphur, where we would scream, wail, cry forever... If we don't obey him. Only a psychopath would do that. God is a malevolent brute, a beast, a sadist with a perpetual scowl, a bully, a big jerk, a trouble maker, a bleeped up relentless _fucker, a twisted pervert, and for all these, he should be held behind formidable bars. Flee from god. God hates you. He doesn't love you.

Why are you so angry?

analice107:
Allah and acts of love? Hmm. Let me see. OK ok ok. I remember. The 72virgins in Heaven. Did I try?

Analice you never fail to crack me up

ItsMeAboki:
Yes, we do e.g. Shekau and others that go astray; however, many of us are not as gullible as Christians who obviously fall for the tricks of these false prophets who fleece them off their hard earned money while living in opulence and their followers in relative poverty.
Furthermore, we do not rely on our Imams/Alfas to always intercede with God on our behalf or expect them to perform miracles in order to prove their spiritual strength (hence why many of your pastors resort to juju and tricks) but rather we prefer to pray directly to Allah without an intermediary therefore not placing too much pressure on our Imams/Alfas to prove themselves.
In my opinion, Nigerian Christians seem to be straying away from the prescribed form of worship; all this excessive hancing and music (bordering on waywardness) seems to be out of place and more or less resembling traditional/cultural pre- Christian native stuff - no offense meant.

What could you possibly know about Christianity? You are a Muslim! And you claim not to be Gullible? Really? Any Muslim that stops being gullible stops being Muslim because he can see through the lies of the Koran and the Hadiths. No offense meant.

I just have to wonder. Dear Atheists, we Christians are a deluded set of people. Mad even. So why are you trying to prove to a mad man that he is mad? I understand mocking us is the only way we can notice you anyway. So you have been noticed. Next!

annunaki2:
Maybe you should ask him to produce the original injeel now. Remember mohaamed came 600 years after Jesus and he confirmed the injeel which was already in widespread circulation and canonised as part of the bible. Let him produce the injeel that mohamed confirmed or admit that he is a pathetic islamic liar.

Lol. All these "Bible has been corrupted" Muslims that can't defend their claim. Ayam waiting for him.

smallrincowis16:
thats why i say you've never studies qur'an very well. whats mentioned in QUR'AN is injeel, which is quiet different from today's bible. Today's bible is not know to jesus himself. Bible was written by men not from instruction of jesus

And Koran was written by who? Remember Mohammed died before it was compiled and even Uthman was first reluctant when Abu Bakr asked him to compile what was left cuz many people who had memorized it had died in the battle. And you say Injeel is different from today's Bible? I thought Injeel meant Gospel which we have? Please clearify me. Thanks

smallrincowis16:
there is no single evidence in bible that confirm it cv a world of ALLAH

ERM...but the Koran confirms it.

dalaman:
Islam is the most dangerous and and illogical religion that exist among the world's major religions. It's level of intolerance is second to non. They kill each other, kill those that do not believe in their religion, kill those that are muslims but disagree with their sect or doctrine, kill kill kill.

When will muslims learn to allow Allah fight those that insult him and his religion? Surely they know that Allah is imaginary and can do nothing that is why they are always killing people. Islam is a religion of hate pure and simple.

The whole problem is from the Koran. Why the Christian God claims to Love the World (unbelievers), Allah claims to hate those who don't believe in him. So this is bound to trickle down to their followers.

JideAmuGiaka:
Well said. Atheists sometimes are too illogical, they always try to make provocative comments against any religion. To them, nothing is evil I wonder how they leave their lifes. Not supporting the killing thou.

No matter the illogical comment made, no one is supposed to raise a finger on him. As a Christian, I am to show love to every person including Atheists and Muslims. The love of Christ is what draws these people to God and not hatred and killing. This cannot be justified in any sense no matter what he said.

hesupamo:
If God is real, HE DOES NOT NEED YOUR FUCKING HELP TO KILL PEOPLE.

Holy books are full of supposed examples of God lashing out with plagues, snakes, earthquakes, angels, and demons against those that make him cranky or look at him funny or breathe the wrong way.

If God hates atheists that much, he could incinerate them all with fire from heaven in one stroke.

If God requires you to kill for him, he's not a very powerful God.

As a Christian, I will say God LOVES atheists. The love is in capital letter.

Shafiiimran99:
Luke 22:41-44
He withdrew about a stone's throw beyond them, knelt down and prayed, "Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done." An angel from heaven appeared to him and strengthened him. And being in anguish, he prayed more earnestly, and his sweat was like drops of blood falling to the ground. Y can't he take the cup away himself since he has the like God according xtians

Hmmmm. There are some points to note here.
1. Jesus was human on earth. So he felt pain and emotions like any other human being.
2. Jesus has always been the son of God even before He was on earth. John 8:52 says Very truly I tell you," Jesus answered, "before Abraham was born, I am!" So he was before Abraham. He has always been the son of God. Gen 1:1 says in the beginning, God made the heavens and the earth. The Hebrew word for God used there was Elohim which is actually plural. That is God with an "s". So the Son of God has always been there.
3. Establishing that fact, you should go back and read my former reply to you. Jesus and God are equal in being and different in persons or roles. Jesus' role is to be submissive to the will of the Father, but that doesn't make Him any less than a God being. You are to obey your boss, but that doesn't make u less human than your boss. If I asked u, are you and your boss equal? You can reply yes cuz u are both distinct humans. But your role in the office is to obey him. Any more confusion

Shafiiimran99:
I want simple answer YES or No

Yes

Shafiiimran99:
Is Jesus equal to God?

Let me as plain and simple as possible. The trinity is one in being but three in persons. How is that so? As a being, I am human and as a person I am ilynem. Now God the father, the son and the Holy spirit are one in Being, or substance or essence in the sense that they are all God. But different in persons or you can say roles. In person, I am below President Buhari , I will always answer to him and he can command me to do anything. But that does not make me less than a human being.
Now Jesus role in the God head is to answer to the Father. That is His role. So in Being, they are one. In person they are three. Hense the Trinity. Any confusion?

Shafiiimran99:
It is xtians that don't read Bible with open mind that is y u don't like ans any question we ask

Please do well to ask your questions sir.

Shafiiimran99:
It is defined as God only

My point. You use Tawhid as the doctrine of God. Tawhid was never mentioned in the Koran yet you can see signs of it sprinkled every where in it. Why do we need the work "trinity" in the Bible? When we have proofs of it everywhere.

Shafiiimran99:
New Bible dictionary against u

Did this doctrine originate in the Bible or in the early Church? The New Bible Dictionary answers: “The term 'Trinity' is
not itself found in the Bible. It was first used by Tertullian at the close of the 2nd century, but received wide currency and formal elucidation only in the 4th and 5th centuries” (Inter-varsity Press, Downers Grove, Ill., 1996, p. 1209, emphasis added). The word Trinity didn't come into common use until several centuries after the last books of the Bible were completed.

Charles Hodge, a Protestant thinker who trained thousands of ministers in the 1800s, described the Trinity as “mysterious” and “out of analogy with all other objects of human knowledge.” In other words, the doctrine of the Trinity is totally unlike anything else God created or unlike anything else we humans can understand. While promoting belief in the Trinity, Hodge admits that “no such doctrine as that of the Trinity can be adequately proved by any citation of Scriptural passages” ( Systematic Theology , abridged edition, Baker Book House, Grand Rapids, 1988, pp. 166, 168).
Why is the concept of the Holy Spirit as a third person of a supposedly triune Godhead so difficult to grasp or explain? Because the Bible does not teach it! One cannot prove something from the Bible that is not biblical.

Do you have the problem with the term? You don't have to call it "trinity" if the term is your problem. Just know that God exists in three persons. Now let me ask you. What is the doctrine of God in Islam? Tawhid. Was it ever mentioned in the Koran? Nope. So there you go.

The problem with our Muslim brothers and sisters is that it is difficult for them to unlearn what they have been taught. So they judge everything from the perspective of the Koran. That's one they can't grasp the fact that Jesus was human on earth. But we have to keep praying for them. Anyone who wants to have an intelligent conversation about the divinity of Jesus must be ready to drop everything he has learnt and discuss with an open mind. I did that once, and that's why my faith is so much stronger today.

hahn:
Whatever. I can't believe I just wasted my time reading that rubbish you wrote up there

Exactly. Narrow minds! And you lot claim to be smarter than us. Smh.

hahn:
Very much the same like Jesus has. None

You are joker. There are people who have dedicated their lives to the study of Jesus. I will rather trust a renowned researcher like Gerd Ludemann (who is more Atheist than your narrow mind will ever be) than a key board warrior like you. And you know Gerd said? I will leave you to find out yourself. Instead of following what other narrow minded atheists on nairaland say, try doing some little research and think for yourself. Peace.

hahn:
"The bible is no more proof that god exists like a comic book is not proof that superman exists"

Classic

Keyboard apologists. Which historical backing does superman have?

OLAADEGBU:
Are men and women equal in God's eyes? Are men and women equally created in the image and likeness of God?

OP, I don't know if you are a Christian. But if you are then you should be grateful to a group of women for this. The basis of our faith lies in the testimony of women who were the first to take the news of the resurrection to the world. God saw it fit to reveal the revelation, first to women. Also read Gal 3: 26-28. So women are as important as men.

Richirich713:
That's it, I have to believe in the Quran because it uses first person pronouns.

That's just laughable. Actually their biggest proof that the Koran is the word of God is that it was so nicely written that it had to be God talking. For God's sake, Shakespeare wrote better books than that thing. Is Romeo and Juliet also the word of God?

ilyasmuy:
You dont know anything about Quran. Why is it incomplete and incoherent?? Why is it not objective?? How does Quran supports idol woship??

Its incomplete because Uthman burnt some of it. Some of the reciters where also killed in a battle. And let's not forget the verse Aisha's sheep ate.
Its incoherent because there are a lot of contradictions. On one hand the Koran recommends the Turah and the Gospels and on the other hand it orders the killing of those who believe in the Turah and the Gospel. It also claims that Mary is the sister of Aaron when they lived about 1400 years apart.
Walking around the Kabar (which was also a pagan temple) and then kissing a black stone. If that's not pagan, I don't know what is. Peace

plainbibletruth:
I’ll give my response in short points.
- Unfortunately the quran has a lot against it that makes it difficult for any OBJECTIVE reader or student of it to believe it as the direct word from God.
- In history many “sane” people have claimed that they were God. [According to you such ones must have been enticed or misled by Satan]. But why should we not believe them? So, what should make a man’s claim of divinity or being called of God to be a prophet should go beyond mere claim or ability to make ‘idol-worshippers’ turn to a belief in one God.
- Many contradictions in the quran are irreconcilable. Yet millions follow the religion. On the one hand it may appear to warn against idolatry and ‘evil practices’ but on the other hand we see practices in islam that are CLEARLY these. So?
- To believe the quran is not authored by God creates NO PROBLEM at all for Christians. Many evil men live longer than good men. Many documents of antiquity (which predate the quran) whose correctness may be in question still survive till today. So again, longevity does not prove approval of content of the material by God.
- The Bible states in many places that impersonators and liars will always be.
- Deuteronomy 18: Rightly understanding what “a prophet like Moses” means is a KEY to identifying who such a one is when he comes on the scene. Context is also very important. Choosing a word or two or some phrases out of a sentence or passage does not do justice to it. It may in fact be DECEPTION at the end of the day.
You left out VITAL words from the Deuteronomy 18:18-22 you referred to in justifying Mohamed as the person talked about.
That portion says: “I will raise up for THEM a prophet like you FROM AMONG THEIR BROTHERS, I will put my words in his mouth ….”
Did you notice the highlighted words? Who is THEM? From among WHOM was the prophet to be raised? Mohamed was neither a Jew nor was he descended from anyone in Israel.

- Fulfilment of “prophecies” that are easy to fulfil leaves much to be desired as a claim for divine authorship.
- Experience may be real but needs to be rightly evaluated to give it a right perspective.
- NOTHING in the book of Deuteronomy remotely suggests that the quran is the last and final word of God.

The quran is INCOMPLETE in many parts as well as being INCOHERENT. Contrary to what many muslims are made to believe, it was compiled DECADES after Mohamed died according to hadith. Some versions were burnt by Uthman Ibn Affan.
You may wish to see:
Sahih Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 61, Number 509 & 510
Sahih Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 82, Number 816
Who gave Uthman the authority to burn the copies of the quran that he destroyed?
Did he receive DIVINE INSPIRATION to do that which he did?
How did he come to choose which versions to destroy?
Why did he burn others?

So, Abdulgaffar, the quran you hold today has lots of question marks against it. You will only get clarity by going to THE PEOPLE OF THE BOOK.

You know, I was preparing a long reply, but you really couldn't have done this any better. Well done sir.

I wonder what atheists hope to achieve with all their hate filled posts. You lot don't believe in the afterlife, we do so that motivates us in preaching Christ to people. Mr OP, may I ask what your motivation is? You don't believe in the afterlife, so you have let's say a maximum of 60-70 short years left to live. I think you should use it for something constructive instead of spewing your frustration on "a God that doesn't exist".

[quote author=IbnIslam post=54683866][/quote]Lol. OK. Let me clear the Hadith problem first. I know I am discussing with a Muslim (and from the look of things, an intelligent one) so you don't expect me to start giving you fraudulent sources. Let me start from the beginning.
Sahih al- Bukharin 6.61.510: Uthman sent to every Muslim province one copy of what they had copied and ordered that all the other Koranic materials, whatever written in fragmentary manuscripts or whole copies, be burnt!
So here we can see that Uthman had already ordered some part of the Koran to be burnt. I didn't write this or make it up. You can confirm. Now let's move on.
Sahih al- Muslim 2286 : Abu Harb b. Abu al-Aswad reported on the authority of his father that Abu Musa al-Ash'ari sent for the reciters of Basra. They came to him and they were three hundred in number. They recited the Qur'an and he said: You are the best among the inhabitants of Basra, for you are the reciters among them. So continue to recite it. (But bear in mind) that your reciting for a long time may not harden your hearts as were hardened the hearts of those before you. We used to recite a surah which resembled in length and severity to (Surah) Bara'at. I have, however, forgotten it with the exception of this which I remember out of it: "If there were two valleys full of riches, for the son of Adam, he would long for a third valley, and nothing would fill the stomach of the son of Adam but dust." And we used so recite a surah which resembled one of the surahs of Musabbihat, and I have forgotten it, but remember (this much) out of it: "Oh people who believe, why do you say that which you do not practise" (lxi 2.) and "that is recorded in your necks as a witness (against you) and you would be asked about it on the Day of Resurrection" (xvii. 13).
So from this place you can see that some chapters of the Koran were missing because they were forgotten! Are you following me?
Sahih al-bukari 6.61.527: Ubay was the best of us in the recitation of the Koran. Yet we leave some of what he recites. Ubay says, I have taken it from the mouth of Allah's messenger and will not leave it for anything whatsoever.
Notice that Ubay was one of the four teachers of the Koran who Mohammed recommended that the Koran be learnt from. And yet some things in his recitation are left out of the present Koran. Follow me, let's keep going.
Now who put together the Koran we have today? Zayd ibn Thabit. Was he one of the top four teachers recommended by Mohammed? Nope. Who were they? Abdulla Ibn Mas’ud, Salim (a freed slave of Abu Hudhaifa), Mu’adh bin Jabal and Ubay bin Ka’b. (Sahih Bukhari 6.61.521).
So definitely, one of these four must have compiled the Koran we have today? Nope. Instead Zayd Ibn Thabit compiled it. Now notice that the first name Mohammed mentioned in the teaching of the Koran was Mas'ud? What did he have to say about today's Koran?
Jami At- Tirmidhi 3104: Az-Zuhri said: "'Ubaidullah bin 'Abdullah bin 'Utbah informed me that 'Abdullah bin Mas'ud disliked Zaid bin Thabit copying the Musahif, and he said: 'O you Muslims people! Avoid copying the Mushaf and the recitation of this man. By Allah! When I accepted Islam he was but in the loins of a disbelieving man' - meaning Zaid bin Thabit - and it was regarding this that 'Abdullah bin Mas'ud said: 'O people of Al-'Iraq! Keep the Musahif that are with you, and conceal them.
Now not only did ubay (best reciter) disagree with today's Koran, Mas'ud (number one teacher) did too. Let's not even go into Aisha's sheep eating verses on stoning and breastfeeding (more on this if you still want to discuss). Now let's sum this up.
Sahih al- Bukhari 6.61.509 : Narrated Zaid bin Thabit:
Abu Bakr As-Siddiq sent for me when the people! of Yamama had been killed (i.e., a number of the Prophet's Companions who fought against Musailama). (I went to him) and found 'Umar bin Al-Khattab sitting with him. Abu Bakr then said (to me), "Umar has come to me and said: "Casualties were heavy among the Qurra' of the! Qur'an (i.e. those who knew the Quran by heart) on the day of the Battle of Yalmama, and I am afraid that more heavy casualties may take place among the Qurra' on other battlefields, whereby a large part of the Qur'an may be lost. Therefore I suggest, you (Abu Bakr) order that the Qur'an be collected." I said to 'Umar, "How can you do something which Allah's Apostle did not do?" 'Umar said, "By Allah, that is a good project. "Umar kept on urging me to accept his proposal till Allah opened my chest for it and I began to realize the good in the idea which 'Umar had realized." Then Abu Bakr said (to me). 'You are a wise young man and we do not have any suspicion about you, and you used to write the Divine Inspiration for Allah's Apostle. So you should search for (the fragmentary scripts of) the Qur'an and collect it in one book)."
So what do we have here? Many reciters of the Koran died in a battle and many of the Korans where lost. So Abu Bakr asked Thabit to compile what was left. I'm not done. Now read the entire passage of Jami At- tirmidhi you will find out that different people had their own different manuscripts. Disputes started to happen on what should be in the Koran and what should be left out. Ibn Mas'ud had 111 chapters according to Ibn Abi Daud, kitab al-masahif. Ubay had 116 while while Zayd had 114 chapters. Check the source, I didn't make this up. So you see? Koran has had its own dispute too. Now to the Bible.
I understand you Muslims very well. You tend to pay attention to detail which is admirable. But let me tell you. Do you know that the old testament of the Bible is just a long arrow pointing to Jesus? What do I mean? The whole point of the Bible is Jesus. The old testament talks about the lineage in which Jesus was born. From Abraham to Judah to David down to the birth of Christ. The whole point of the old testament was to confirm the new. Hence the hundreds of prophesies about Jesus in the old testament. Now the Bible is a combination of Historical records and God's word. Unlike you, we do not have a Hadith were we can put stories. All of it are put in the Bible. Going through your list, you can see that most of the discrepancies are that of numbers. May are shock you that those numbers are actually irrelevant? They are history, written across 1400 years and there are bound to be errors since there are from different sources. But the whole point of the Bible is Jesus and that is what matters. Its like a movie. The beginning is important, but the point of the whole movie lies at the end. And that end is Jesus.
You sound like an intelligent dude. Read your history by yourself.

IbnIslam:
that is ur own explanation bro just like other xtians would do....taking ur words as someone who knows d bible, Tell me why there is contradiction in the bible regarding the number of books in the bible? The Catholic claim it is 73 while the Protestants claim it is 66. On what basis where this books accepted or rejected by these denominations?

OK let me break it down for you. I am not catholic and truth be told, I haven't researched on why Catholics have more books but I have heard a friend try to explain. With time, I will do my own research. Now, some of the books in the Catholic Bible have factual errors. You should know that the Bible is a book that was compiled 1400 years apart. From Moses to Jesus was about 1400 years. So knowing this, people will come up with things are aren't really in line with Historical evidence. Just so you know, the Bible is so unique that for every event, we can back it up with Non-christian sources. That is, sources from historical writers that are not even Christians. For instance, the death of Jesus is not just in Christian sources but in roman, Greek and Jewish sources. So anyone that didn't pass this non-christian source test was taken out. For instance, The book of Judith claimed Nebuchadnezzar was the king of Assyria when historical proof says that he was the king of Babylon. But like I said, I will do more research.
Noe to your Koran. You lot claim that the Koran was perfectly preserved but if you know your history, you will know that is not true.
Sahih al-Bukhari 6.61.509 claims that people who knew the Koran were sent to war and many were slaughtered that day. This was after the death of Mohammed and the Koran had not yet been compiled. So Zayd Ibn Thabit put together what was left.
Ubbay who was Mohammed's best reciter of the Koran had 116 books in his Koran. Ibn Masud had 111. Today's Koran has 114 which was compiled by Zayd ibn Thabit. Do you know that Ubbay claims that those who read today's Koran are guilty of deceit? So let's not pretend like the Koran hasn't had its own controversy on what and what should be in it.

IbnIslam:
u said research? If true, then by now u should have known that out of all the various versions of ur bible, no two bibles are identical... Fact. Also as expected I know u would resort to insult just to cover ur ignorance...but if u want intellectual discussion then I am ready.

Insult? Nah. That is not me. No two versions are identical? In case you do not know we are in a time of open knowledge where every thing can be researched. For every English word in the Bible, I can search for the root word. And I will say this, there are ancient Hebrew and Greek manuscripts, hundreds of them that if we want to re-write the entire new testament again, we can do it with all those manuscripts provided. Having different versions of the Bible does not mean they all say different things, it means they just explain what another version didn't make clear. They do not contradict each other.

Maximus85:
Sorry to burst your balls, you don't even know Christ. Christ never condem others for their beliefs. But just look at you. Calling another man's belief psychotic.

You need to learn.

For your information, I'm not a Muslim but it's a shame they know the Bible better than you who claim to be a Christian.

Bury your head in shame.

I am not condemning the man. I am condemning the belief. There is a difference. And they know what Bible better than me? Please! I even know their Koran and Hadiths way better than most of them. Please step.