₦airaland Forum

Ephesians 4:13-14:
13 This will continue until we all come to such unity in our faith and knowledge of God’s Son that we will be mature in the Lord, measuring up to the full and complete standard of Christ.
14 Then we will no longer be immature like children. We won’t be tossed and blown about by every wind of new teaching. We will not be influenced when people try to trick us with lies so clever they sound like the truth.

The above scripture encourages us to study and understand the scriptures so we would not be manipulated and tossed up and down by preachers who try to trick us with clever lies. Evidently borrowing scriptures from the bible[i.e Malachi 3:8-10] and twisting it to mean something else is a very good example of clever lie which as now been instutionalized into the practise of the religion by these false teachers. By quoting bible verse to justify their heresies they deceive innocent people who might not understand the verse in it's proper context.

Tithing was part of the defunct jewish laws, this is what Paul had to say about it.

Galatians 3:10-11:

10 But those who depend on the law to make them right with God are under his curse, for the Scriptures say, “Cursed is everyone who does not observe and obey all the commands that are written in God’s Book of the Law.” 11 So it is clear that no one can be made right with God by trying to keep the law. For the Scriptures say, “It is through faith that a righteous person has life.”

My people don't allow your pastor to push you under the curse of God by making you obey a useless law that as been anulled.

2 Corinthians 11:3-4:
3 But I fear that somehow your pure and undivided devotion to Christ will be corrupted, just as Eve was deceived by the cunning ways of the serpent. 4 You happily put up with whatever anyone tells you, even if they preach a different gospel[prosperity gospel] than the one we preach, or a different kind of Spirit than the one you received, or a different kind of gospel than the one you believed.

Paul and the other apostles neve preached about material prosperity and tithes.

The bible says that by their fruits ye shall know them.

chukwudi44:
Jesus was on this plant for 33 yeas why didn't he demand tithe in the order of melchizedek

Because Jesus wasn't in the business of twisting scripture to satisfy his material needs.

2 Peter 2:10-19:
10 He is especially hard on those who follow their own twisted sexual desire, and who despise authority.
These false teachers are proud and arrogant, daring even to scoff at supernatural beings without so much as trembling. 11 But the angels, who are far greater in power and strength, do not dare to bring from the Lord a charge of blasphemy against those supernatural beings.

12 These false teachers are like unthinking animals, creatures of instinct, born to be caught and destroyed. They scoff at things they do not understand, and like animals, they will be destroyed. 13 Their destruction is their reward for the harm they have done. They love to indulge in evil pleasures in broad daylight. They are a disgrace and a stain among you. They delight in deception even as they eat with you in your fellowship meals. 14[b] They commit adultery with their eyes, and their desire for sin is never satisfied[/b]. They lure unstable people into sin, and they are well trained in greed. They live under God’s curse. 15 They have wandered off the right road and followed the footsteps of Balaam son of Beor,[d] who loved to earn money by doing wrong. 16 But Balaam was stopped from his mad course when his donkey rebuked him with a human voice.

17 These people are as useless as dried-up springs or as mist blown away by the wind. They are doomed to blackest darkness. 18 They brag about themselves with empty, foolish boasting. With an appeal to twisted sexual desires, they lure back into sin those who have barely escaped from a lifestyle of deception. 19[b] They promise freedom, but they themselves are slaves of sin and corruption. [/b] For you are a slave to whatever controls you.

2 Peter 2:1-3:
The Danger of False Teachers
1 But there were also false prophets in Israel, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will cleverly teach destructive heresies and even deny the Master who bought them. In this way, they will bring sudden destruction on themselves. 2 Many will follow their evil teaching and shameful immorality. And because of these teachers, the way of truth will be slandered. 3 In their greed they will make up clever lies to get hold of your money. But God condemned them long ago, and their destruction will not be delayed.

1 Peter 5:2-3:
2 Care for the flock that God has entrusted to you. Watch over it willingly, not grudgingly—[b]not for what you will get out of it, but because you are eager to serve God. 3 Don’t lord it over the people assigned to your care,[/b] but lead them by your own good example.

A true prophet would adhere to the teachings above. Is your pastor lording it over you

James 2:1-5:
A Warning against Prejudice
1 My dear brothers and sisters, how can you claim to have faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ if you favor some people over others?
2 For example, suppose someone comes into your meeting dressed in fancy clothes and expensive jewelry, and another comes in who is poor and dressed in dirty clothes. 3 If you give special attention and a good seat to the rich person, but you say to the poor one, “You can stand over there, or else sit on the floor”—well, 4 doesn’t this discrimination show that your judgments are guided by evil motives? 5 Listen to me, dear brothers and sisters. Hasn’t God chosen the poor in this world to be rich in faith? Aren’t they the ones who will inherit the Kingdom he promised to those who love him?

Does the above example remind us of the descrimination that goes on in our churches when they wealthy men and top politicians attend services? even the clergy and the church heirachy is also guilty of this discrimination. In most churches the church leadership provide special chairs for themselves whilst the congregation that provide the funds have to seat on benches and cheap plastic chairs.

Titus 1:14-16:
14 They must stop listening to Jewish myths [tihes, seed sowing, first fruit e.t.c] and the commands of people[false teachers] who have turned away from the truth.
15 Everything is pure to those whose hearts are pure. But nothing is pure to those who are corrupt and unbelieving, because their minds and consciences are corrupted. 16[b] Such people claim they know God, but they deny him by the way they live[/b].[flamboyant preachers] They are detestable and disobedient, worthless for doing anything good.

Why am i writing this thread and exposing the antics of false prophets? Because the bible makes it clear we should hence they continue to destroy lives of other people.

Titus 1:11:
11 They must be silenced[exposed], because they are turning whole families away from the truth by their false teaching. And they do it only for money.

OLAADEGBU:
Misuse of the Bible

". . . his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction." (2 Peter 3:16)

It is vitally important for every Christian to study and use the Scriptures, for they constitute our only real authority (note Matthew 5:18; John 10:35; 14:26; 2 Timothy 3:15-17; 2 Peter 1:19-21; etc.). In doing this, however, it is just as important that we not misuse the Scriptures, for this can be almost as dangerous as ignoring them altogether.

Many people twist the Scriptures, seeking to make them fit some opinion of their own, hoping thereby to give a pseudo-biblical authority to their peculiar prejudices, instead of allowing the Lord to say what He means. Such distortion of Scripture has generated a plethora of cults and heresies--past and present. This was essentially Christ's view of the Pharisees: "in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men" (Matthew 15:9).

Similar--perhaps even worse--is claiming to receive new Scripture, or perhaps new (and authoritative) insight on existing Scripture. "Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it" (Deuteronomy 4:2). "Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar" (Proverbs 30:6).

Cults and heretics distort and supplement the Scriptures, but still deadlier are the liberals who try to explain away the Scriptures. "If any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life" (Revelation 22:19). This act of distorting and then denying God's word ("Yea, hath God said. . . . Ye shall not surely die," Genesis 3:1, 4) was the very lie of Satan which brought sin into the world. No wonder the Bible warns so severely against it! HMM

The above coming from you is really shocking!!!! So you know this much about the dangers and evil of twisting scriptures yet you routinely and obessesively indulge in twisting the scriptures na wa for you O. Anyway on that day you won’t be able to claim ignorance. Whilst we are at it maybe you can explain to us how biblical tithes that was agricultural produce meant to be given to levites once in three years was twisted to mean money from income to be paid weekly/monthly.

mactao:
@poster
Come on. How stupid do you think Nigerians are?

By the way, what do you mean when you say "people like us"?

By "people like us" he mans people using other power codes in the league of T.B Joshua. The only problem is that he is not as successfull as T.B hence he is jealous of the man's success and his sprawling business empire.

Horus:
My last post bring more informations about the annunagis. I dont think that you even bother to read it. Your question is strange because you know what this thread is talking about.

I know what the thread is taliking about and that is why i asked cos what you posted as already been posted in one form or the other in this thread a number of times and it is getting repetitive. I initially thought it was some fresh information when i saw the post only to be disappointed when i read it.

bayo1:
Prosperity in the bible does not only refer to financial prosperity. It is prosperity all around - Spirit, Soul and Body. 3 John 2. And neither did Jesus come to spread the message of penury. Who among you want to be wished "long life and poverty"
Poverty stinks, the bible says the poverty of the poor is their destruction. Show me where in the bible where Jesus advocates poverty. He came poor so we can be rich. How can the one who own the earth and the fullness thereof gives birth to paupa? Wake Up! You can be as poor as mosque rat and still go to hell, whereas you can be as rich as Abraham and still find a place in heaven. Stop this hypocrisy.

I thought the phrase was "poor as a church rat" are you saying there are no more poor church rats as they are now all very rivh courtesy of out tights and offerings.?

AjaraEwuro:
Trying to change the focus of the topic just points to how shallow minded you guys are - even if I am an illegal immigrant in the UK, what has that got to do with your smelly mouth father and mother and your foolish lineage? If you need employment in the UK, call me, [b]I will employ you and feed your moda fu cking atheist minds - foolish goons.[/b]An Atheist who attends a christian school has completely lost his mind- explain to me the logic behind his thinking.

Is dat how papa Oledepo taught you to address others That is simply most unchristlike.

chukwudi44:
Since christ is doing burnt oferings for us in heaven he must also be paying tithes for us in heaven so we need to bother abi why should he do one and leave the other when he can do both of them

Abi oh

Chukwudi44 don't mind them, the extent his people would go, now they have stopped twisting scripture they are now inventing their own scripture all with the objective of justifying heretic greedy and unchristlike practises in the church.

One thing i know for sure the tithes collection in RCCG would be significantly depleted since two of their major contributors investors are now incapacitated. That is apart from the fact that they have failed to reap the benefits of all their investements guaranteed to them by daddy G.O

I don't know wh you guys are bothering to respond to Abuzola? Is he not a self confessed homicidal maniac? If you argue with a mad man how would peoplebe able to tell the difference?

@chukwudi44
Whilst i agree that Jesus christ is The son of God almighty, it does not make him the same person as his father as he constantly made it clear in scripture he was sent by someone superior to him. The principle of trinity tries to suggest that Jesus and God are co-equal and one and the same, this i find not to have any scriptural basis. the implications of it are quite garguatan and i believe if it were true it would be expressly stated so in the bible and not just "implied". I believe people ae just reading wat they want to believe in the bible and not what is there, verses that are used t justify trinity are not explicit, it is like you are forcing a verse to say what you want it to say. The only explicit truth we can hold on to from the bible is that Jesus is the son and his father is superior to him even thoug he is also a God.

OLAADEGBU:
Going through your post one will begin to realise why you don't believe that all Scriptures are given by inspiration of God but a collection of the Roman Catholic priests. It also explains why you don't believe in the deity of Christ nor the doctrine of the trinity, the infallibility of the Bible or what it means to be born again. It also becomes understandable the reason of your campaign against the principle of tithe and offering in the Church of Christ.

Isn't it hypocritical of you to on one hand describe the bible as infallible and on the other hand to condenm the very institution the catholic church that compiled the books canonized as scripture and you now describe as infallible. That apart i have NEVER denied the deity of christ as i love worship and adore him, however i don't believe in the concept of trinity which does not have any sound scriptural basis and was only introduced to christianity centuries later by the very same roman catholic church you detest soo much. On the issue of being born again you and most pentecostals like yourself have no clue as to what it means to be born again if going by the fruits you display on this forum are any thing to go by. And lastly it has been proven time and time on this forum that tithing as no basis in christianity and those preaching it are distorting the scripture and are probably bound for hell if they don't repent. I have never argued against voluntary offerings in the church.

So how come he is always deleting anti-islamic threads? Is he afraid of fatwah being placed on nairaland?

Another reason why compulsary tithing is dangerous is that it gives people a false sense that they have fufilled their christian obligation to give and they ignore the true essence of chrisitian giving which is to give to the poor and needy. The passage below deatails how christ recommended that we give to him. Please note that church giving talkless of tithes is glaringly absent.

Matthew 25:31-40:
The Final Judgment
31 “But when the Son of Man[a] comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit upon his glorious throne. 32 All the nations[b] will be gathered in his presence, and he will separate the people as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will place the sheep at his right hand and the goats at his left.
34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the Kingdom prepared for you from the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry, and you fed me. I was thirsty, and you gave me a drink. I was a stranger, and you invited me into your home. 36 I was naked, and you gave me clothing. I was sick, and you cared for me. I was in prison, and you visited me.’
37 “Then these righteous ones will reply, ‘Lord, when did we ever see you hungry and feed you? Or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 Or a stranger and show you hospitality? Or naked and give you clothing? 39 When did we ever see you sick or in prison and visit you?’
40 “And the King will say, ‘I tell you the truth, when you did it to one of the least of these my brothers and sisters,[c] you were doing it to me!’


Moral of the story: Giving to the poor and needy is a christian obligation and is giving to God. Jesus never recommended we give to hime through our chuches/ pastors.

@Horus
What is the purpose of your last post

OLAADEGBU:
Of course, men wrote the 66 books of the Bible. When you type letters on this forum, do you type them or is it the keyboard? Obviously it's you. The keyboard (and the internet connection) is merely the instrument you use to type your message. Likewise, about 40 different men from all works of life wrote the 66 books of the Bible by the inspiration of God and they are therefore undiluted.

"The Bible must be the invention either of good men or angels, bad men or devils, or of God. However, it was not written by good men, because good men would not tell lies by saying 'Thus saith the Lord;' it was not written by bad men because they would not write about doing good duty, while condemning sin, and themselves to hell; thus, it must be written by divine inspiration." -- Charles Wesley

As usual you present very poor and shallow logic to prove your assertions.

Akanniade:
If there be inconsistency, errors or any ambiguity in the bible it is purely of penmanship not from a faulty source. The compedium of books called the bible serves to strenghten faith not to proof faith. The burden of proof lies with the holy spirit.

You are absolutely correct

Krayola2:
If that was the only reason given then I can see why u would think it is ridiculous. But in that post i read that Mazaje did a lot of researh on the history of religion, christianity included, and the decision was based on that. I don't understand how that is ridiculous.

Mazaje's research findings were faulty and distorted.

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=312423.msg4466257#msg4466257 date=1251878653]Hope this idiot knows nairaland is owned by seun an ATHEIST.
You are also a hypocrite and a man of no conviction for posting on an atheists website. Foolish oyedepo maga![/quote]I thought seun was a muslim

@Tonye-t
I am sorry if i sounded rude in any of my posts but it really ticks me off when i see people twisting the word of God for the sake of money, i think it is one of the greatest sins imaginable and the truthis ssooo glaring and obvious for every one to see hence i sometimes loose my patience in responding to some psots. However i have already written a lot of things on this issue on nairaland and i have been able to esatblish in several ways than one that tithing was never directed at chrisitans and the type of tithing done today is even alien to biblical tithing. I am quite sure you know the truth but for what ever reason best known to you, you decide to hold on to the man made doctrines which is clearly derived fom twisting the biblical version of tithes. You even go on to say it was a standard this i found really nauseating as it shows that you are just grasping at straws to justify it by all means since there is no christian justification for it in the bible. I remember asking why burnt offerings and other standard jewish practises before the law where not included in list of your standards[that contains only one item] I also asked how Abraham's one off gift of tithes from war booty and Jacob's unfufilled promise to tithe became a standard with which we must practise every week/month? even going by Abraham's "standard" it means we should tithe only when we have an extra ordinary income and by Jacob's standard we should tithe only conditionally when God answers a specific prayer first. Even your "standards" contradict each other and they were voluntary and not instructed by God. So if you must preach tithes my dear brother i suggest you preach it as voluntary act and not as mandatory based on the obsolete/irrelevant verses in Malachi 3. Remember we would all be called to give account of our stewardship on that day and it is a sacriledgeto twist God's word.

Marlbron:
Kunle,

I think you have to be clear what you are fighting. Are fighting the paying of tithe or are you against its use in the church? They are two different issues and to be sure men of God have abused Tithe money for their selfish pursuits. You need tithe for the church to grow, for full time men of God to be paid and for evangelism. The economics of churches will fail without tithe, with only free will offering. That means propagation of God's words suffer.

The early church in Acts did more than tithing. They offered 100% to the service of God. If you held back, you were found dead. Matter of fact, God owns your money 100%, so if you don't tithe, you invite some other situation to yourselve. Other angels like devil, sickness, accident, armed robbery, 419, etc could dispossess you of more than you could have paid tithing.

What I am against is the twisting of scriptures to collect ten per cent of the income of the flock in the name of tithes, this is completely wrong and contrary to all the christian teachings on giving in the bible. The church and pastors are supposed to be above board and if the same instituition that is teaching us to leave a moral life is depending on immorally twisting the scriptures to survive then there is something seriously wrong some where and such an instituition cannot be of God. The early church which you referenced never paid tithes and they never gave 100% they gave as the spirit lead and the instance you are referring to in Acts is being quoted out of context annanais and sapphire died becos they lied and NOT becos they withheld. Also note that the collections made by the early church was always used to take care of the poor and needy and NOT to spread the gospel as our preachers claim today. The apostles worked to support themselves [2 thessalonians 3:6-9]. That apart how many of these churches are actually propagating the gospel? As most of them concentrate their braches in urban areas were the gospel as already reached and concentrate on snatching members from other churches instead of winning souls. They prefer to travel the seas to America and Britain [christian nations] to “preach” the gospel whilst benin republic our next door neighbour is a predominantly pagan country, is it becos there is no ready market there and easy tithes and offerings to collect??

Datope:
If my pastor or anyone can twist the bible for me to pay tithes, anyone be it pastor or not also can twist the bible for me not to pay tithes.

My response to this would be found here: 1 Thessalonians 5:20-21:
20Do not spurn the gifts and utterances of the prophets [do not depreciate prophetic revelations nor despise inspired instruction or exhortation or warning].
21But test and prove all things [until you can recognize] what is good; [to that] hold fast.

1 Timothy 6:5-11:
5 These people[false teachers] always cause trouble. Their minds are corrupt, and they have turned their backs on the truth. To them, a show of godliness is just a way to become wealthy. 6 Yet true godliness with contentment is itself great wealth. 7 After all, we brought nothing with us when we came into the world, and we can’t take anything with us when we leave it. 8 So if we have enough food and clothing, let us be content. 9 But people who long to be rich fall into temptation and are trapped by many foolish and harmful desires that plunge them into ruin and destruction. 10 For the love of money is the root of all kinds of evil. And some people, craving money, have wandered from the true faith and pierced themselves with many sorrows. 11 But you, Timothy, are a man of God; so run from all these evil things. Pursue righteousness and a godly life, along with faith, love, perseverance, and gentleness.

The scriptures speak for it self, above the love of money is described as evil and timothy as a man of God is told to run away from the love of money, but today our men of god have not runaway from this evil love for money instead they have induldge in it and as a result of that they engage in twisting scripture which in itself is evil to make more money hich they are not suppose to covet in the first place

Paul's letter to timothy was written specifically to him to teach and set the standards of how a true christian leader MUST conduct himself, any leader that does not conform to these satndards can not be a true minister of the gospel.

1 Timothy 3:2-3:
2 So an elder[church leader] must be a man whose life is above reproach. He must be faithful to his wife. He must exercise self-control, live wisely, and have a good reputation. He must enjoy having guests in his home, and he must be able to teach. 3 He must not be a heavy drinker or be violent. He must be gentle, not quarrelsome, and not love money.

How many church elders/pastors today live a life that is beyond reproach and do not crave for money which is demonstrated by twisting scripture to extort money from the flock.