₦airaland Forum

Joshthefirst: I know none of those deal with the sin problem that bedraggles all mankind.

Jesus dealt with the sin problem.

African traditional religions don't deal with sin. Buddha realized he was an imperfect human being.

You cannot use comparative religious beliefs to back up your claims because christianity is more than a belief system or form of worship.

Many readily use God, but look at their life styles. Give me examples of some who dared use a free life to back up their claims of truth.

Only Jesus I know was the first to use a free life.

He said "can any of you accuse me of sin?"


People all the time try to reduce this strong stuff that actively denies religion to religious practices itself. But when they see the real deal, they recognize it.

I've read of hinduism, I know of african traditional religion. These dop not solve the basic problem. They dance around the problem.

How do u know dat Jesus(the Jewish criminal) dealt wit sin?

How do u know dat Adam and eve are the grand ancestors of all of humanity?

How do u know dat their sin still affects us now? Even tho Jews(who own the Adam and eve story) say Adam and eve have nothing to do wit today's sin


U don't know anything about Hinduism or any ATR u big liar

Joshthefirst: my life backs up my claim.



Culled from introductiongalatians; the message remix:

"When men and women get their hands on religion, one of the first things they do is turn it into an instrument for controlling others, either putting or keeping them "in their place". The history of such religious manipulation and coercion is long and tedious. It is little wonder that people who have known religion on such terms experience release or escape from it as freedom. The problem is that the freedom turns out to be short-lived."


Life is more than religion you see. Christianity is more than religion. The cure for all of mans ailments is Jesus Christ. It is him that I subscribe to. I am his disciple. Religion only keeps people in bondage of rules. And atheism only gives seeming relief to those truly in bondage of sin.

I've quoted this verses many times. People seem to ignore its intensity, maybe their hearts are hardened. I pray you will read this verses from the bible with all honesty and sincerity and ponder and think:

Matthew 11:28-30 "Are you tired? Worn out? Burned out on religion? Come to me. Get away with me and you'll recover your life. I'll show you how to take a real rest. Walk with me and work with me—watch how I do it. Learn the unforced rhythms of grace. I won't lay anything heavy or ill-fitting on you. Keep company with me and you'll learn to live freely and lightly."(The Message)


The real rest I have found in Christ Jesus is rest from the burdens of sin.

Wat if Jesus is one of the numerous false Messiah as the Jews say? Afterall he lived among them and they know him better than anyone.

U claim the Jews prophesied his coming but if u ask a Jew he would say the prophecy isn't about Jesus.

Joshthefirst: Nice thread.

Religion is shallow and hypocritical.

But its different with me shaa. I've examined every other with an open mind, even christianity, and I've seen futility.

But now, I know what I believe. Depth of life, reality. Deep stuff about knowlge of God. I've had doubts before, but they've been resolved.

I've seen the difference between religion and life. I know the difference, and by God, I'm living the difference.

Wat do u know about any other religion?

Do I know anything about judaism? The father religion of christianity

Have u asked questions?
Have u read the Koran?

Do u know ur ancestral spirituality that ur pastors love to condemn?

MamiWata: Nope I'm not a Yoruba practitioner. Interesting to hear your thoughts on Ifa being universal rather than ethnic.

It's universal knowledge of philosophy by the ancient Yoruba.

Ifa doesn't relate to the Yoruba people alone. Intelligence and wisdom is universal

Acidosis: Lol..

Just follow the TRUE and ONLY GOD..
others are gods..

I believe if you ask God to reveal himself to you, he'll definitely answer you.

There's no such thing as true and only God

All Gods are true. You can only say the supreme God.

And if u like pray from now till nx yr asking God to appear to u, he won't.

God cannot appear any more than he already appears through his children(The Gods)

You can never understand God because he is too magnificent and above human comprehension.

You all need to attain spiritual enlightenment for urself, no Bible or Koran can teach u wat Ori would teach u.

Just grow in consciousness

Katsumoto: Don't be condescending. Be explicit and lucid.

I don't know how else to explain ni

Sango God of lightening and thunder
Thor God of lightening and thunder

Both wielding heavy weapons used to generate lightening

Even zeus has a sword he uses to direct lightening bolts

It's the same force just that the people understand it differently and give it different personifications

[quote author=olu_kenzo ]^^Fact. The Ijebus were already on ground before the coming of the Oba nta -- king is outside-- as divined. The king present on the stool then, had to abdicate (can't recall his name now). The Obanta was the third king, the first being his maternal grandfather, Olu-Iwa. Thus, through intermarriage and adsorption, the real inhabitants of the area before that Obanta bearing wave of migration have gone extinct. Some of them had to move to the outskirts of the town (my memory fails me once more) because they couldn't face the superior civilization of these migrants from Ile-ife.

It is well. OP carry on, I am never against "academic" exercise.[/quote]Olu-iwa I thought it was Oba ijasi.
Wat I heard was
The 1st was Oba Ijasi who left the throne for Obanta( king outside).
The 2nd was of course obanta(ogboroganda) and his nephew who had previously stayed in Ife

The indigenes lived peacefully wit the new and large imigrates from Ife(Sudan earlier)

ladionline: Marcof, I'm glad of your final descovery of yoruba origin. You finally hit at home what terracotta radoillo 9Jacrip et all were trying to say. charles Darwing is wiser than Yoruba ancestors put together. The world did not have history until Darwin came. Biology can not make mistake, its MAN'S gift to man. Darwin did not only describe creation as it ought to be, he created it. Darwin is the most high MAN, by the time we evolve as gods (next level) we can elect someone as the most high god. For the records, you will find the Iwo or Ife man, like the pittsburg man, I Want to suggest a name for it: homo macof.

Obalufon: Yoruba worship moon " Osu"and sun and four cardinal point forces . Think they've stopped sun watch.

Where pls?

I have never heard of moon and Sun worship

And to ur moniker do u know anything about Obalufon deity? I need info on this

Just Last week I met a guy where I play football, I immediate felt as if I knew him somewhere before even tho I was very sure I couldn't know him.
I also admired his football skills and from that time we have become good friends.

I have begun to think maybe our souls have a good relationship in the spiritual realm.

MamiWata: Are you ok with non-Yoruba viewing Ifa as a "universal" spirituality that anyone can pick up, wear, and tailor to fit their shape? IMO the issues arise when the spirituality is taken out of its ethnic context and twisted and turned to suit the needs of another culture. Is it still Ifa and are you ok with them using it to suit their needs?

Ifa has always been universal we Yorubas don't keep Ifa to ourselves alone, those who are serious and interested in Ifa can be initiated.

But the rules of Ifa must stand and Ifa cannot change because of a different culture.
So they can pick it up and wear it but not tailor it to their fit

Do u know if any odu-Ifa is against homosexuality?

obanta wasn't even their leaders real name but ogborogan and his nephew.

His nephew established mobalufon in honor of his father agbo-iwa who died on the way from Sudan.

Mobalufon??....doesn't it have something to do wit Obalufon(3rd ooni of Ife? Could be omo-obalufufon( child of Obalufon) meaning that the whole Sudan claim is a lie

Katsumoto: And what does that prove?

If u don't still get it, I wonder how u would

emotional: thanks bro,for your enlightening responds




Actually not during divination i will say initiation cos rites are involved and then prepared in plate with a cover(the 32 nuts) given to the client to offer sacrifices and oblations when necessary(the reason for my first question in my first post) note, the client knows nothing abt casting Ifa divination.

No bro.

U are welcome

I don't know much about Ifa divination but maybe the problem of the client needed a fowl's blood and so the Babalawo went ahead wit d ritual immediately after divination.

Katsumoto: Hammer and Axe are not the same things.

But lightening is

ladionline: macof, macof, I have given you the clue, abi o ti gbagbe "great Ape" ni? Omo nla!

egbon mo gbagbe o, jo ron ti mi

rationalmind: The thread wasn't meant for you.

his post made it worse

Mr Troll: i don't gerrit anymore. are people this stupid?

U have no idea

rationalmind: The bolded is what I don't think I fully agree with bro. While growing up, there are certain things considered right and wrong in our community that We've grown to consider as superstition and we easily go against them. A very good example is this idea that when your father dies as an igbo, it is wrong and a taboo to eat at any other burial ceremony until the burial ceremony of your father has been conducted.

Same applies for ince.st or homosexuality, I don't think I agree that going against them on the basis of community acceptance while one was young is damaging to the soul (if there's any) since many of those stuffs are either just superstitious or ancient and worn out beliefs.

When u start to take some beliefs as superstition and untrue resulting to no consequence u are freeing urself from ur previous conscious state.

And wat could ever make a typical yorubaman(who doesn't know that homosexuality is done else where) take the custom as mere superstition?

It's foreign influence and exposure that opens the way to such thoughts.

Sal C: I think one might easily misunderstand the aim of the thread judging from the title of the thread.

It could have been better to say Jesus is "The" word of God while the bible is "a written aspect of the word of God"
This is because, not every thing written in the bible is an account per say, some are actually instruction given directly by God.

Shut up

God didn't instruct anybody to give any written account.

chukwudi44: The god of Chosenis differant!!

the god of Daddy GO is differant!!

the god of Oyedepo is differant!!!

the god Of bakare is diffrent!!

and so on and on abeg na whom we go follow?

Follow the God of ur ancestors

rationalmind: Good one bro. But I have a question for you. As a spiritualist, is homosexuality also bad for the soul?

YES and No

Yes because where iam from it is unheard of, in all of yorubaland homosexuality and inbreeding isn't encouraged

No because where one thing is bad, it could be good in somewhere else,
In America homosexuality is cool and even some are initiated into Ifa.

So it's not my spirituality dat is against It, it's my ethnicity dat is.

when growing up, there are things that u perceive as right and wrong due to ur community, and dat becomes part of ur consciousness(Ori) as a taboo, when u go against these rules it damages ur consciousness and affects ur soul.

ROSSIKE: Thanks..... You see, what you have explained here is African religion in its purest form. The concept of non-exclusivity. Of legitimate multiplicity. There is no 'right' and 'wrong' religion. All paths lead to the same glorious destiny. This concept is at the very heart of African religion, and its truth has been confirmed in recent years by NDE accounts of the afterlife etc.. Ironically, the concept is probably the greatest weakness of African religion, as it attaches no punishment to 'abandoning' the faith, and offers no punishment for embracing 'other gods'. There is also no interest in proselytising. A man should be attracted to his god by natural happenstance, not by direct instigation. These foundational principles of African religion - thoroughly humanist, are what is required to be learned by the other world religions.

Fear is wat pushes people away from paganism and embrace Islam/christianity

Most of them are too afraid of the fabled hell coupled wit d lies against paganism- that it's demon worship, satan worship, idol worship. Many of them now hate their own ancestors and hate being African.

Islam preaches that if u are not muslim u would go to hell

Christianity preaches if u are not Christian u would go to hell

But ATR only preaches doing wats right according to ur understanding

If only people can understand more

rationalmind: Lol, I deliberately decided not to involve christians. I'm aware few of them may have tangible things to say but majority are just going to come here to demonstrate their folly. Let's just leave them out of this.

So, in your opinion, do you see anything wrong in ince.st? If yes, why?

U right it shouldn't be about any religion but I just wanted to point that out so Christians can shouldn't just come and start condemning

Personally I don't like incest. As a spiritualist I believe it's bad for soul because it isn't part of Yoruba customs

But communities have different laws and tradition
I heard inbreeding was cool in ancient China
And still happens in Niger
If the community has nothing against it, no one should condemn the people.

Katsumoto: That is inconclusive. All ancient groups had the same survival needs, hence why there are similarities in the gods they prayed to. And the Sango carrying hammer was a non-Yoruba creation; as Sango was said to be Thor's cousin.

Where did u get this from

Even before the name "Sango" was given to the force of lightening, "Jakuta" was used and also had a hammer which u used to shape stones and send them down to earth as lightening.

Sango(the human, king of Oyo) used a double headed axe and when he died, Sango(the force of lightening) was portrayed holding a double headed axe

Thor holding hammer, controlling lightening isn't a coincidence.

It means Thor and Sango are same force with different personification

Katsumoto: I don't doubt that you can show examples. But what I find funny is that on one hand you claimed that evolution happened after migration and then on the other hand you are claiming that there are similarities between gods in different groups. That there is inconsistency.

In any case, you introduced evolution into the debate. Macof fed into it because it fits into his belief of the world being created at Ife. We know that to be false. Ife may have been the pre-eminent Yoruba state at some point but there is nothing to suggest that there weren't other Yoruba groups around at the same time.

Of course I know Yorubas didn't know who Thor was.

I am not saying that Ife is where the world was created, I am saying that Ife is where the Yoruba ancestors that were ape-like evolved into modern man.

That's why Yoruba people can't remember any history predating Ife.

So it's wrong for people to claim anywhere other than Ife as the origin of Yoruba

There were also other Towns around Ife eg Iwo, Doromi, iranje, oke-ora(seems this one was actually part of Ife) but these places recognized Ife has their origin.

Ife before Oduduwa was a place wit other independent communities

740megawatts: I think evolution happened after pangea. This is logical because pangea led to different climatic conditions as a result of continental shelves travelling away from Africa. This would explain the need for genetic re-programming for adaptability. But then, this would only be true if apes had spread out before pangea.

this makes sense. Because pre-humans couldn't have spread across the world if pangea already happened

[quote author=PAGAN 9JA]who said life started in Ehtiopia[/quote]I don't know where people get this from

emotional: @FOLYKAZE/MACOF.
Is like d concept of Orunmila by (MOST) Edos(binis) is either 1.adulterated 2.is a different Orunmila(there is only one I supposed) 3.or is just a scam.
From my findings so far(mostly from u guys),what many Babalawos(in benin) refers to as Orunmila is not,because the way and manner it being done which is quite different from their Yoruba counterpart where Orunmila has its Origin.the Edo concept, 32 nuts are involved,blood of 'hen' is required first and seventh day and these 'nuts' are to be used as means or representation of Orunmila.imagine these 'nuts' being given to a client( who has no idea of divination) as Ifa/ Orunmila,it will yield Zero result I think.

The Edos(binis) traditional means of divination,is Iha/Ominigbon(thou also brought to Benin Kingdom by a foreigner) similar to Ifa/Orunmila which I would have believed to be d Bini's version of Orunmila is also strictly a divination tools which doesn't require blood.

One of the reasons(lack of proper knowledge) stated above could make pple embrace other foreign Belief.

True the bini came to know about the personality of Orunmila through Ife but bini/Edo Doesn't have to have the same practices since they don't like to be referred as part of yorubaland.

Isekiri also has the Orunmila personality and concept but wit little difference in practices.

In yorubaland, Babalawo doesn't use blood for divination, only during initiation

The only tools are : opon Ifa(Ifa tray), opele, ikin. the client doesn't take part in the process(he doesn't know Ifa divination) he doesnt need to talk about his problem, his duty is to find how Ifa's message relates to him or let the Babalawo do the full interpretation(if he has been told wat d problem is already)

Ifa/Iha is an old system in bini, existing since Eweka.

do u know how many Odu Ifa exist in the bini version?

Abraham married his sister
Nahor(Abraham's bro) married Haran's(another bro) daughter

Isaac married Nahor's daughter
Jacob married Laban's(son of Nahor) daughters(two sisters)

Judah married his sons wife

So let me see Christians condemn the above people first.

As for homos, Jesus was more gay than straight

Uyi Iredia: If you think all pagabs do the bolded, na YOU_yes you!_be YEYE pesin.

Lol that's wat pagans face in the hands of muslims and Christians, they don't know anything about us and our practices yet they condemn it and condemn their own ancestors. Smh