₦airaland Forum

Krayola:
I have videos of a Christian Professor saying the same stuff. . . And of a Priest who is also a prof saying the same stuff.   I'll keep trying till I get thru to somebody. . .Anybody. But I know what u mean. . . I have a lot of stuff, 14GB worth of stuff. If I can get thru to just one person it'll have been worth the effort.

I will watch the video when I get home. . . .

Deep Sight:
Krayola!!!!!!! Brilliant! Nice one, thanks, i watched the video, perhaps it will do Mazaje some Good.

Am at work now and I can't watch the video will have to wait till I get home to watch it. . .

@Krayola

Do you really believe that people will want to listen to what a Hebrew professor of old testament has to say with regards to the OT or what their own sunday school teachers, pastors, priest, GO etc have to tell them about the OT?

^^ He is a black Jew that hates white people. . . .

OLAADEGBU:
Believing in an approximately 6,000-year-old earth sets a proper foundation for believing Jesus Christ because you are letting God speak through His Word, without taking ideas to the Bible.  In the same way, by trusting the Bible first, we realise that sin and death are intrusions into the world that go back to Genesis 3 which is the foundation for the gospel.  Jesus came to save us from sin and death.

Even though I am not a Christian I think you clearly do not know what you are talking about. Where in the bible does it say that believing that the universe or the earth is 6000 years old sets a proper foundation for beliving in Jesus? Are you saying that those that do not subscribe to your opinions with regards to the 6000 years ridiculous hypothesis lack a proper foundation for believing in Jesus?

I really think that you need to go and take over from Kent Hovind and run his organization now that he is in prison. . . .

muhsin:
Funniest thread of the day!

Do muslims not also cheat, lie, rape, muder, steal, and do all short of bad things while believing that allah is watching them? Sure if you guys truly believe that allah is watching you guys you guys won't be doing all these things no?

A Christians is some one who believes in Jesus and lives according to the teachings of the bible. . . . .Correct me if I am wrong. . . .

Why are all these muslims saying? . . . .The koran gives the impression that the world is flat in some parts so why the arguments?

Deep Sight:
Mazaje, i think this from Mavenbox summarizes what i was trying to say:

For heaven's sake, if an ancient writer saw a UFO, he would describe it as a spinning ball of fire.

How in hell does that make him a liar or ignorant? He only describes what he sees according to the language of the day. period.

The fact that an ancient writer does not know what a UFO is says that he is ignorant and saying that a UFO is a ball of fire when it is not a ball of fire says that he is not telling the truth. You are a lawyer and I know you know how to agrue kinds of things and logic better than me. . . .But we are not agruing as if we are in a court room. . . let the evidence speak for them selves. . . . hope you get what I am trying to say. . .

The point is this; even if its an optical illusion, then all the current writings will serve to -

  1. Show what kind of illusory effect it had on observers

  2. Show what the illusion looked like to onlookers at the time

  3. Record the daily perceptions of those living within the illusion and importantly -

  4. State in the language of the time what that illusion appeared to be -

All of which have definite historical and cultural value and none of which will mean that the current writings are lies, even if they disclosed a limited understanding.

Why are you saying this? Evil spirits were once thought to be responsible for diseases? Lightening was once thought to be the wrath of god, the rainbow was once thought to be the necklace of a goddess and some of these thoughts were written down and once believed. How are they not lies?

Deep Sight:
Again i wholly agree. People should to be good because goodness springs naturally from their hearts, and not because they have been promised a carrot in heaven or threatened with a stick in hell.

I want davidylan to tell us if the only thing that is stoping him from becoming a serial rapist, a drunk, a murderer or a bugler is because he believes that he will be punished when he dies. . . .What system of morality is this that is based purely on the self-interested desire to escape some imaginary damnation I ask again?

mavenbox:
In truth, one thing I say often is that human beings are the ones limited by languages and forms of expression. God is not limited. So when God communicates with man, he speaks with him in a way that man can understand. God does not speak Urdu, Hausa or Spanish, he speaks to the heart and the heart translates into understanding. Besides, the knowledge of mankind is progressive, and if it is all revealed to him at once, he may not be able to handle it. e.g. some ritual practices declared in Leviticus may have seemed irksome at the time, but maybe if they knew of micro-organisms and epidemiology they would observe the routines with more knowledge.

Let me just explain something to you. . .You seem to be a very nice person so I will just state my case. . . .You don't have to reply.  You talked about god talking into the hearts of people right? The tittle of the thread is Questions To All The YEC In The House. Is the same god that is talking to the hearts of the YEC about the age and making them to sincerely believe that the earth and the universe are 6000 years old based on what is written in the bible the same god also talking into the hearts of the Old earth creationist who believe that the earth is millions or even billion of years old based on what they believe is also written inside the bible? Why would such a god be sending very different messages to different people and making them to understand or interperet things differently?. . . .Why the lack of agreement?

mesings:
@ all the atheist in the house

i always wondered, how does it feel to live without hope?

It depends on what you mean by hope, If by hope you mean that we wake up hoping to see a better day with less challenges then, it will be very difficult to live without that kind of hope, but if by hope you mean having faith in the fantasies and myths that others have written which have been demonstrated to be lies then I will tell you that we don't have that kind of hope. Can't you see that what you tag as hope requires FAITH?. . . .I always defined faith as a belief held in the absence of evidence or even despite contradictory evidence. Because at some level everyone realizes that believing on faith means nothing more than believing it because you have an emotional bias for believing it and they also realize that wanting to believe that something is true is in no way evidence for and doesn't even have any logical relationship to whether that thing is actually true. . . . . .

People only believe on faith when they are forced to,due to a lack of evidence for the thing they want to believe. Only when and where they are forced to rely on faith due to lack of evidence, do they then proclaim that faith itself is a virtue. This is merely a post-hoc attempt to con themselves into thinking that faith might actually have evidential value and to lessen the shame they feel for the self-delusion and abandoning or their own reasoning mind that faith entails. The idea that some god would reward faith based belief is senseless, and even theists realize it on some level. Theists do not have faith because they think their god will reward faith. They have faith because they want to believe in a god and an afterlife but have no rational basis to do so, then they make up the notion that having faith is itself a good thing. . .We choose to accept reality it as it is and do not need false hope. . . .

OLAADEGBU:
Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men . . . That no flesh should glory in His presence. -- 1 Cor. 1:25, 29

In a world where the rich get richer and the poor get stomped on, we are informed that God has gone to the other end of the line with the message of everlasting life.  How has He done that you may ask.  He has done that by simply choosing that which is weak, base and despised.  You can see this by the kind of questions and conclusions these skeptics made on this thread.  Do they believe that Jesus' nativity historical account actually happened?  Of course they don't believe.  To say that they believed the greatest story ever told would mean that they would have to surrender their intellectual dignity.  Who in their right minds will ever do that?  The answer is simply that God has chosen foolish, base, weak and despised things of the world to confound those who think they are wise.

The problem is that you do not even agree with the bible you are trying to explain. . . .What is this nonsense about the god of the bible using the weak? According to the bible solomon was the wisest man on earth, Samson was the strongest man alive, Job was the richest man alive, so what really are you saying? Where is your evidence to show that the nativity story is a historical account? The two version of the stoty in the book of matthew and luke say it is nothing but a myth. . . .When was Jesus really born? Matthew's account places the birth during the reign of Herod the Great, who died in 4 BC, but Luke dates it to the census of Quirinius ten years after Herod's death. So who are people supposed to believe?

Krayola:
cool stuff. I actually sat through the whole thing. pretty long tho

Quite interesting I must say. . . .even though I disagree with a lot of what he says. . .

Deep Sight:
I don't know what more i can do or say to stress the applicability of language, metaphor and visual images.

I think you have got it wrong though: nobody is saying they were right: they wrote according to their understanding, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Would modern astronomical and cosmological writings become trash if in future it is dicovered that the universe is an optical illusion?

Think.

I read through your arguments with wirinet and toneyb and I do not exactly know what you are trying to say. Modern astronomical and cosmological writings will become trash if the universe is later found to be an optical illusion.

wirinet:
Let me add more questions;

To all Atheist, Agnostics, Deists, Theists ( including Christians); If the gods, Tiw, Thor and Saturn did not exist, why name the days of the week after them. Isn't that a good enough substantiation of their existence?

What of Gods Janus, Mars, Juno, etc, if they are myths, why continue to name the months of the year after them

@ Wirinet and Toneyb

You guys should stop assuming that davidylan knows what he is talking about. He talks about moral values as if there is any to be found in the myth he subscribes to. His evidence to show that christians are more morally responsible for their lives than atheist is?. . . . i laugh in greek. . .By the way what kind of morality is it that is entirely predicated on a self-interested desire to escape some imaginary damnation? This seems to bypass the very core of what we mean by morality, which is an actual concern for the welfare of other human beings. Clearly it is possible to teach our children to form such a concern and to grow in empathy and compassion without lying to ourselves or to them about the nature of the universe,without pretending to know things we do not know.

Which is more moral?Helping the poor, feeding the hungry, defending the weak,out of a mere concern for their wellbeing, or doing so because you think the creator of the universe wants you to do it and will reward you for it?, . . . .The truth is people do not need to be threatened with damnation to love their children, to love their friends, to want to collaborate with strangers, or indeed to recognize that helping strangers and not hurting others can be one of their greatest sources of happiness. . . . .

OLAADEGBU:
@wirinet,

You can now see that the seeming 'errors' that you think you see in the Bible are there for a reason.  God has deliberately included these seeming 'errors or contradictions' in His Word to "snare" the proud.  He has "hidden" things from the "wise and prudent" and "revealed them to babes" (Luke 10:21), purposely choosing foolish things to confound the wise (1 Cor.1:27).

More deluded apologetics. . .so your god delibrately included errors and contradictions is his word whom you claim is infallable to "snare" the wise eh? How can something that is infallable contain errors and contradictions? . . . .I know you need to believe in this "snaring the wise" hypothesis so that you can diffuse the many many contradictions and errors that abound in your so called infallable word of god. . . . .I laugh in greek. . . .

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=363940.msg5080748#msg5080748 date=1260389690]Hmmm, sucking lollipop isn't for free, you aint lil wayne. . . .I gave you a trial run yesterday to show you the voluptuous stuff i'm made of. Today you must pay else i return to that gate man sodomized by krayola , he feels traumatized by the whole krayola incident, i must be there for him. [/quote]I've gat the dough baby so come along. . .that krayola is truly a pervert. . . . .You can attend to his gateman later. . . .come along you've gat work to do baby. . . .

Tudor will you come suck a big lolly pop and be quite? Why are you all over the place gossipng and wasting time? Don't you know you have work to do?

OLAADEGBU:
Ken Ham a biblical creationist puts it succintly by saying: Many people think the Bible is just a book about religion or salvation.  It is much more than this.  The Bible is the History Book of the Universe and tells us the future destiny of the universe as well.

According to the bible this is how the earth will end. . . .

Rev 6: 12 I watched as he opened the sixth seal. There was a great earthquake. The sun turned black like sackcloth made of goat hair, the whole moon turned blood red,
6:13 and the stars in the sky fell to earth, as late figs drop from a fig tree when shaken by a strong wind.
Rev 6:14 The sky receded like a scroll, rolling up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place.
Rev 6:15 Then the kings of the earth, the princes, the generals, the rich, the mighty, and every slave and every free man hid in caves and among the rocks of the mountains.

According to you bible and its so so stories the stars in the heavens will fall into the earth just as late figs frop from a fig tree when end of everything comes according to the revelation which was "revealed" to one of the writers of the bible. . .Are we really to believe this fiction? Yet you guys desperately hold on to the imaginations of people who know nothing about the sun and stars but still believe that they have a clue with regards to how the earth began and how it will end. . . . .Surely the writers of the bible have demonstrated that they have NO idea of what the sun or stars are, they did not know that the stars are distants suns like ours some even bigger than our sun with planets orbiting them like our own sun and can NEVER fall into the earth. . . . .

davidylan:
Puerile rubbish. I dont care . . . i am only here to dispel the nonsense you folks peddle as "facts". If this thread didnt exist . . . neither would mazaje as far as i'm concerned.

And how have you dispelled anything that we have said. . . .I said that satan is a mythical character that exists only in your deluded imaginations and in on the pages of your religious book. . . .How have you dispelled that assertion. . . .your evidence that satan is not a mythical construct is?. . . . .

do we really need evidence of your own spiritual insecurity?

. . . .More deluded talk. . . .What exactly is this spiritual insecurity myth?. . . . . I laugh in hausa. . . . . .

OLAADEGBU:
Educate yourself Here

Is there anything that looks or sounds educating on the propaganda site called answers in genesis. . . . . . .Its very clear that you do not know what education means. . . . .

What's your alternative to the creation account, since you don't believe in it?

I personally have non. . . .but that does not mean that your mythical tales about the creation of the earth or the universe have any basis in reality. . . .

davidylan:
No they dont . . . try not to be deliberately obtuse.

Your parents forced their religious teachings on you right from a young age . . . now rather than you take it up with them you come here bleating about how bad religion has been. Well guess what . . . we really dont care.

You don't care and you are here debating with me and others over what you do not care about? Surely you will not be wasting time over what you do not care about and attend to better things no? You are really pathetic. . . .

You bring up Abuzola as an analogy . . . how does that make a shred of sense? Is Abuzola my father? Do i know him from Adam?

Of course i am not so much of a coward as to not be able to confront my dad on issues pertaining to the bible . . . why cant you do the same?

And you came to the conclusion that i have not based on what evidence?. . . . . . . . .

Kay 17:
the purpose of this post was to find out what dating method used by YEC was reliable and damn accurate not be bored to death by theology.

My thoughts exactly. . . . .

OLAADEGBU:
Those are scientific laws which all confirm the Bible.  ?

Ok care to tell me how Newton's Laws of Motion or Avogadro's Law confirm the bible. . . .

Why don't you tell me the working formulas for evolution theory and why they have not considered to be scientific law for the past 150 years?

I did not say anything about the working formula of evolution, you did. . . . .

davidylan:
How does that correlate?  Is Abuzola my father?

At least i dont shy away from posing some hard ques to my father when we dont agree on a particular verse of the bible . . . unlike some slow-witted idiots who come here bawling when they can only whimper like timid mice in real life.

The relate so well. . . .You believe that allah is a demon no?. . .why not tell that to one of your moslem fellow students in school or is it only on nairaland that you can come and shout endlessly about what a lair and a fraud mohammed is? When will you actually man up and tell your fellow muslim neighbours?. .Did i hear you talk about timid mice in real life? . . . .Hopeless fool. . . .

OLAADEGBU:
Birds of the same feather

Will you answer a simple question? . . . . . Which of these laws of science did yawheh create since you said that all laws of science were created by yahweh. . . .

Newton's Laws of Motion
Law of Archimedes (or Archimedes' principle)
Avogadro's Law
Dalton's law of multiple proportions
Einstein's General and Special Laws of Relativity
Boyle's Law in thermodynamics
Charles' Law (or law of volumes)
Gay-Lussac's Law
Noether's theorem
Pauli Exclusion Principle
BCS theory (Bardeen, Cooper, Schrieffer)
Biot-Savart law

davidylan:
Actually, you slowpoke, WE did not force you . . . your parents did. Go take it up with them . . . bunch of rudderless cowards.

I will do that exactly when you stand in front of abuzola and tell him that allah is a demon. . . .deluded slowpoke. . . . .

davidylan:
If you fools bothered to look around, you wont find a single thread here by a christian proclaiming the devil is true. Do we hold this as a private belief? YES WE DO and we have a right to! Now why is this an obvious problem to you to warrant an entire thread? How does the existence or non-existence of the devil threaten you?

How is a private belief in the devil a PROBLEM to you?

If only this deluded slowpoke will only read what he wrote. . . .We have every right to talk about anything we want no? last time I checked nairaland does not belong to you. . . .How does talking about the mythical devil equate to having a problem with the myth? . . . .Some times i really wonder if you are sane. . . .Where did any body talk about the existence of the mythical devil threatening him on this thread?. . . . .

The moslems whom you are always berating here on nairaland have no right to their private beliefs? Last time I checked no muslim here on NL has ever come to your doorstep and threantened you with violence. . . .so why are you always on their back. . . . ? You guys really don't like it when a taste of your own medicine is giving to you. . . .

davidylan:
and these atheists are equally concerned and outraged at the followers of Zeus? Or they just coincidentally seem to have a grudge with the christian God alone?

Actually no atheist here was forced to believe that zeus was the creator of the universe since childhood. . . .All the atheist here were forced to believe that the tribal god of the jews created the universe. . . .atheist disbelieve in the gods that they were raised to believe in. . . .By the way i am yet to see your own post showing that Zeus is a demon. . .You have so many post trying to show that allah is a demon no? Why is there no talk from you about zeus?

Kay 17:
davidylan is so unbearable!  you are a Christian not because you studied other religions and weighed them nor was it because you exercised your thinking faculty but because your parents were Christians and you were conditioned to be one. you have no idea as to the origin of the bible or Christianity. you are in that sect of christianity because your parents were in it too. religion is a belief, a state of mind. not a matter of fact.

Forget davidylan he is clearly deluded. . . .He is quick to display his agression towards others because he knows deep inside that what they are saying might be true. . . He says that your claims are nothing but conspiracies but ended up insulting you . . .I Know the feeling I was once there. . . The problem is they claim that things like the mythical satan are true but they are having a hard time trying to prove something that no proof even exist for. So they have to resort to insults or name calling to diffuse their irrational and illogical beliefs. . . .As i aforementioned enjoy the delusions. . . .