₦airaland Forum

tunnytox:
@mazaje
you are obviously taking the Bible passage out of context and i'm not going to open up an argument with you on that, what I'm happy about is that at this age and times only fools will allow themselves to be deceived without taking time to read, study and find out the truth.

The truth is that the bible tells people to stone to death their children and Jesus said that he did not come to destroy the law of the prophets but to fulfill them. . . .Christians are still killing their children whom they tag as witches in Nigeria according to the divine law of the bible no?

[flash=400,400]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvurX-VMDsk&hl=en_US&fs=1&[/flash]

Christians in Africa burning "witches" to death according to the biblical law that says that people should kill witches. . .

toba:
Jesus was never mad to support madness.Jesus is the prince of peace&not prince of madness or murder.Thats y we celebrate christmas,instead of jungle justice by God,jesus laid himself as a sacrificial lamb so as to avoid these barbaric acts.Yet it still occurs

Was it not the same jesus(who some christians claim is the same as the god of the OT) that told the people during the time of moses to stone to death people for picking sticks on the sabbath according to the bible? Why did he change his mind? . . . . In case there are videos of christian still burning witches to death in Kenya. . .

davidylan:
Am i the only one disgusted by the fraudulent and deliberate misquoting of the bible? Was Christ REALLY advocating the stoning to death of disobedient children? Why then did he stop the stoning of the woman caught in adultery? Was He practicing double standards?

Careful and HONEST reading of Matthew 15 tells us what was happening . . . the pharisees were trying to trap Christ and His disciples with a LITERAL interpretation of the laws of Moses namely - it is wrong to eat with unwashed hands.

Well Christ simply countered them by saying . . . if you accuse my disciples of not following the letter of the law then you are also hypocrites for NOT stoning your disobedient children which is also a part of the law. Which is why He calls them hypocrites in verse 7.

Sure Jesus was displaying that he was a hypocrite. . .Remember he was berating them for not following the LAW of god and putting their traditions above it. . . .

tunnytox:
This is not propaganda hating dear, this is an incident that did happened and its being reported, yes stoning was in old testament in the Bible, what they practice in old testament is not Xtianity that Jesus brought for us its Judaism and that is the more reason why Jesus never allowed that woman caught in adultery to be stoned he challenged every religious fanatics who came to ask him whether to stone the woman to cast the first stone if they are not guilty themselves.

Jesus agrees and fully supports stoning to death of disobedient children. . .In fact he was berating the people for not upholding the law that says that should stone to death their disobedient children. . .

Mat 15:1 Then some Pharisees and teachers of the law came to Jesus from Jerusalem and asked,
Mat 15:2 "Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? They don't wash their hands before they eat!"
Mat 15:3 Jesus replied, "And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition?
Mat 15:4  For God said, 'Honor your father and mother' [fn] and 'Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death.' [fn]
Mat 15:5 But you say that if a man says to his father or mother, 'Whatever help you might otherwise have received from me is a gift devoted to God,'
Mat 15:6 he is not to 'honor his father [fn]' with it. Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition.

This passage above shows that jesus clearly was in favor of stoning to death of children that disobey their parents. . . By the way jesus said that he did not come to destroy the law of the OT but to fulfill them. . . .Christian also did this before so no need pointing fingers at the moslems. . .go read up a lil history and all the atrocities committed in the name of Jesus . . .

[quote author=Aloy.Emeka link=topic=366818.msg5119199#msg5119199 date=1260895356]How is the business booming?. Do you pay your tithes?. Tithing is the only way your business can prosper.[/quote] . Do some of you guys think before you post?

OLAADEGBU begins by spreadıng ridiculous and pathetic lies that sound ''true'' to the gullible and blind, once his petty assertions are checked they all turn out to be baseless lies. . . . . .Pathetic. . . .

I bet there were all shouting allah is great as they were carrying out the barbaric crime. . . .FOOLS. . .

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=363977.msg5119719#msg5119719 date=1260899176]Does anybody know what this fool is talking about? [/quote]Hey baby why all the fury? . . .Come lets get down and have some fun . . . . .I miss that killer body of yours. . .

noetic15:
once again mazaje runs round in circle. . . . .but this time, I give up

I am only following your footsteps. . .

I mentioned TRUE xtians and not xtians by name like u once were.

Abeg go sleep joh . . . .The word christianity is subjective and depends on who is making the claim. . .There are various christians I know who will tell you to your face that you are lost and not one of them or that you are being mislead by your denomination. . . The is no universally acceptable form of christianity na just pick, chose and follow based on your own interpretation and dogmatic positions. . .

At OP what is Islam? Islam means death destruction and more death. . . .

Pictured: Islamic militants stone man to death for adultery in Somalia as villagers are forced to watch

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1235763/Pictured-Islamic-militants-stone-man-death-adultery-Somalia-villagers-forced-watch.html#ixzz0ZmPFwtTU

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/12/14/article-1235763-0796C749000005DC-686_634x448.jpg
Begging for his life: Mohamed Ibrahim appeals to Islamic militants not to carry out the execution as he is buried in the ground as his villagers are forced to watch

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/12/14/article-1235763-0796CC53000005DC-209_634x617.jpg

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/12/14/article-1235763-0798A090000005DC-484_634x667.jpg

[quote author=the_seeker link=topic=365527.msg5116849#msg5116849 date=1260879754]Pls ignore Mazaje. He is a typical arrogant atheist who thinks he can open his mouth and condemn anybodies religion or beliefs. You cant reason with someone who does not believe in anything![/quote]At least I do not go around beheading people heads while chanting allah is great. . .I do believe in a lot of things but I have zero tolerance to myths lies and fraud. . . .

aletheia:
Better make your arguments from outside the bible, for your can never defeat the word of God. Again the bible answers your bolded statement above.
Act 1:6-9 So when they had come together, they asked him, "Lord, will you at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?" He said to them, "It is not for you to know times or seasons that the Father has fixed by his own authority. But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth." And when he had said these things, as they were looking on, he was lifted up, and a cloud took him out of their sight.

I laugh. . . . . . . .Did jesus not tell his disciples that he will come back and establish his kindom before the finish going through the cities of Israel? Why are you quoting verses that talk about some imaginary deity establishing his kingdom in Israel? Did you not see the word Israel? Are you an Israeli? . . .You clearly see where it was stated that Jesus was talking about Judea and Samaria etc. . .No mention of Nigeria there. . .The same jesus told Caiaphas the Chief Priest, that hereafter he shall see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven. . .That was 2000 years ago. . . .and who ever Caiaphas was he did not live to see that day. . .

The problem with you atheists is that in your vaunting pride and worship of your flawed intellects; you can not even distinguish between what the bible actually says and what other fallible men say the bible says. It is a book. Read it for yourself and stop presenting third-hand fictions about what the bible says.

The problem with theist is that in your vaunting and worship of flawed myths, imaginations and legends you can not even distinguish between reality and the myths, legends, imaginations and fantasies that were written in the bible. I have read the bible so many times and I once subscribed to the christian delusion. . .so no thanks. . .

OLAADEGBU:
Science is just catching up with the Bible and it still has a long way to go.  Let us see the history of science compared to what the Bible has revealed.

When you tell LIES like this then be prepared to be exposed. . . .

The Bible that has been verbally inspired between 2,000 to 3,000 years ago made certain statements that science during those times did not get right.

This is false. . . .Greek philosophers have made far more accurate predictions about science in antiquity that any thing that can be found written in the bible. . . .

[list]
[li]The Bible then stated that the earth is a sphere (Isaiah 40:22).  Science then, said the earth was a flat disk.  Science has now discovered that the earth is a sphere.[/li]
[/list]

The bible DOES NOT say that the earth is a sphere, it only says that god sits upon the circle of the earth"". . . the earth is not a cricle by the way is it? Where does the bible say that the earth is a sphere? If the author of Isaiah meant sphere or ball, he would have used the Hebrew word 'duwr', which means a sphere or ball.  Which science is it that says that the earth is flat? By the way is it not the same bible that says the world can not be moved because it is firmly established? Surely the world is established, so that it cannot be moved"{Psalm 93:1} The same bible says the earth has four corner. . . .1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on FOUR CORNERS OF THE EARTH, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.Revelation 7:1. The ancient Greeks used what we now call observation, reasoning and science. Anaximander was the first recorded person to suggest the Earth is a sphere. Erastothenes basically worked out the circumference. It was proven 1800 years later by Magellan's voyage.

[list]
[li]The Bible maintained that there were innumerable stars (Jeremiah 33:22).  Science then insisted that they were only 1,100 stars.  Now they admit that there are innumerable stars. [/li]
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[/quote]This is a LIE. . . .Anaxagoras thought that the sun was not just a small glowing circle of light. He thought of it as a large glowing rock, larger than the Peloponnese peninsula. For that belief he was exiled.

Aristarchus suggests that the heavenly bodies revolve around the sun and calculated (because of the lack of parallax) that the stars were extremely far away. Your bible says that the sun revolves around the earth and that stars will someday fall into the earth. . . .  

[quote][list]
[li]The Bible described the Free float of earth in space (Job 26:27).  Science then thought that the earth sat on a large animal.  Science now has discovered the free float of earth in space.[/li]
[/list]

Which science is it that says the earth sat on the back of a large animals? Will you stop LYING? Which science is it that said that? Thales: The first of the Greek philosophers, c. 629-555 B.C. He thought the planets, stars, sun, moon, and earth were all composed of different forms of water. He appears to be the first to assert that celestial bodies were not gods, but were made of familiar substance. In those mystical times, this was a radical departure.

[list]
[li]The Bible declared that Creation was made of invisible elements (Hebrews 11:3).  Science then was ignorant on the subject.  Science now agrees that Creation is made of invisible elements (atoms).[/li]
[/list]

Aristotle (c. 384-322 B.C.): Called "The Philospher" by the learned of the European Middle Ages and Renaissance, his ideas were considered as reliable (and sacrosanct) as Bible passages. His chemistry consisted of four elements, earth, air, water, and fire, plus a fifth element (quintessence) for the stars because the stars were believed to be immutable and unchanging. His physics stated that the natural state of motion of any thing was to be at rest, and that elements possessed a natural affinity for themselves. This latter idea became Aristotle's theory of gravity: earth attracts earth, so all solid bodies fall to earth, and a body that is twice as heavy will fall twice as fast to the earth. Likewise, water seeks the ocean, and fire attempts to fly to its natural home above the atmosphere. In cosmology, the Earth was a stationary sphere surrounded by other spheres that carried the planets and a final sphere upon which the immutable stars were fixed. The Greeks postulated the 'atom' as the smallest particle of a substance.

[list]
[li]The Bible says each star is different (1 Corinthians 15:41).  Science then claimed that all stars were the same.  Science now has come to the conclusion that each star is different.[/li]
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Which science claimed that all the stars were the same? STOP lying all the time. . .Aristarchus (c. 310-230 B.C.): boldly attempted to find the relative sizes and distances of the moon, earth, and sun. (1) The earth-moon relative size was obtained from the curvature of the earth's shadow cast on the moon during lunar eclipses. (2) The earth-moon distance was found from trigonometry to be 25 earth diameters. (3) The sun's distance was obtained by trying to find when the moon was at exactly first quarter phase. At that point the earth-moon-sun angle must be 90 degrees exactly, and Aristarchus thought that this position differed from where the moon should be halfway beteen new and full by 3 degrees. If 3 degrees is accepted, the sun is 20 times further than the moon, and (4) also 20 times larger in diameter. Beyond these amazing attempts, Aristarchus also proposed in a serious way a Sun-centered (heliocentric) cosmology, motivated by the observation that the sun is much larger than the earth. A prediction of this model is that the stars are enormously distanct, since they cannot be seen to shift as the Earth swings in its wide arc around the sun.  

[list]
[li]The Bible declares that Light moves (Job 38:19,20).  Science then said Light was fixed in place.  Science has now admitted that light moves.[/li]
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This is pathetic the bible does NOT say that light moves at all. . . .Hipparchus (c. 194-120 B.C.): The first great observational astronomer compiled a catalog of positions and brightnesses of 1080 stars as well as the sun, moon, and planets that remained unparalled until the late 1500s. He discovered the effect of precession by comparing to older star charts. With his data on planet positions, he realized that simple motion around a sphere was comletely inadequate to explain the loopy motion of the planets among the stars and invented the "epicycle", a smaller sphere centered on the main sphere, on which the planet moved so that it was periodically carried backwards with respect to its usual direction.

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[li]The Bible states that Air has weight (Job 28:25).  Science then said that air was weightless.  Science now says that air has weight.[/li]
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Where is your evidence that ancient scientist did not know that air has weight. . . .surely the felt the weight of the air around them no? This attempt to discredit science is really pathetic. . .

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[li]The Bible says winds blow in cyclones (Ecclessiastes 1:6).  Science then said that winds blew straight.  Science now confirm the Bible by saying winds blow in cyclones.[/li]
[/list]

If you read the passage you will realize that you are lying because the bible says no such thing at all. . .which science says that the winds blow straight? Why are you just lying all over the place?

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[li]The Bible reveals that blood is the source of life and health (Leviticus 17:11).  Science then was convinced that sick people must be bled.  Science now agrees that blood is the source of life and health.[/li]
[/list]

This is a LIE stop lying. . .which science says that sick people must be bleed to death? is it not the same bible that says that evil spirits cause diseases?

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[li]The Bible says ocean floor contains deep valleys and mountains (2 Sam.22:16; Jonah 2:6).  Science then claimed that ocean floor was flat.  Modern science now confirm that ocean floor contains deep valleys and mountains.[/li]
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Which science says that the ocean floor was flat?

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[li]The Bible says ocean contain springs (Job 38:16).  Science then said ocean fed only by rivers and rain.  Science now admits that ocean contains springs.[/li]
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Which science makes this claim. . .pls show us. . . stop lying. . .

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[li]The Bible says when dealing with disease, hands should be washed under running water (Leviticus 15:13).  Science then said hands must be washed in still water.  Science now says when dealing with disease, hands should be washed under running water.[/li]
[/list]

Which science said that? Is it not the same bible that says that evil spirits cause diseases?

With all these facts you will think that scoffers would have learnt a lesson or two and realise that the Bible is not only far ahead of modern science but is fresher than tomorrow's newspaper.

The bible knows nothing about science talk less of modern science. . .With the way you are busy lying through your teeth I know you will come back and tell us that the formula for computing was found in the bible. . . .Pathetic Liars

aletheia:
I just love how the bible has an answer for every one of your rantings:
2Pe 3:3-9  knowing this first of all, that scoffers will come in the last days with scoffing, following their own sinful desires. They will say, "Where is the promise of his coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all things are continuing as they were from the beginning of creation." For they deliberately overlook this fact, that the heavens existed long ago, and the earth was formed out of water and through water by the word of God, and that by means of these the world that then existed was deluged with water and perished. But by the same word the heavens and earth that now exist are stored up for fire, being kept until the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly. But do not overlook this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.
This describes you mazaje to a tee. The Lord is patiently holding out his hand towards you, that you should repent of your foolishness.

First of all you did not even address any of the things I said instead you went on rambling about nothing. . .Did Jesus tell his followers that he will come and establish his kingdom during their life time? Yes he did and that was 2000 years ago so what does that tell you? It says that Jesus LIED. And as for your other ramblings all I have to say to that is, Of course the writers of the bible need to explain away the non fulfillment of the coming of Jesus by assuring those that believe that they alone are covered or have the ability to see while others that point out to the fallacies of their mythical assertions are blinded or lost and can not se, how else do you expect them to keep people in line and make them to keep on believing in their stories and lalala tales? You definitely will expect them to say that their god works in mysterious ways or is slow to act or what ever excuse they can throw around no? T

The bible does not describe me, The writers knew for sure that their assertions were false and looked for ways to make light of their falsehood by claiming that some people wil laugh and scoff at those that believe. . . The koran is full of such statements too. . .And when and where was the earth created from water?

Nezan:
God was giving them time to repent as is the case with many atheists on this forum, BTW, do you know what latter happened to them?

When did any god appear to you and tell you that he is giving them time to repent? They already have allah so they need not repent of anything that allah does not consider to be a sacrilege. I know very well what happened to them. We are still close friends allah has been taking very good care of them and protecting them.

lagerwhenindoubt:
GBAM!!. God has laid down the rules, Right or Wrong you choose and face the consequences. when and where-ever they happen. I doubt his style as recorded in the New Testament is as strict and exacting as in the days of Moses and teh Supreme Court. these days you have a system of Appeals and you can keep appealing just to delay your final judgment.

And you were there when god was lying down the rules eh? Interesting . . . . .

noetic15:
2. again u speak with a vain and beclouded world view. it still remains the perrogative of God to do as He pleases. show mercy unto whom He pleases cos its not of he that willeth or runneth but of the Lord that sheweth mercy. What all of the above people have in common is their fame and willingness to openly mock God. This illustrates that they knew who God was and chose to disbelieve to the extent of publicly mocking Him. they would not be the first or the last.

What has this got to do with anything?

3. quite unlike your distorted analysis. God is not a manual or text book that has a finite/limited or defined way of doing things. that explains why we say that His ways are numerous. So God's decision to strike one mocker today, another mocker 15 years later or to spare a mocker is not dependent on your flawed understanding of God, your preconceived notions or dogmas or your inherent misunderstanding of God's will.

And your evidence that it was your god that stroke them to death is? . . . . . .I laugh, . What exactly is your god's will? Haven't you heard of stories about people who mocked allah and died because allah ''stroke'' them to death?

4. again u goofed in the marthin luther king scenario. I ask u, what does the will of God entail? do u know if marthin had done all that God required of Him and His time was up?
True xtians do NOT fear death. . . . .for death is described as an ENEMY of Jehovah and the last enemy to be destroyed.
true xtians learn to submit and live by the will of God. . .do u know the will of God for martin?

This is quite false because If Christians do not fear death as you claim they will not pray or cry to their god to protect them when they are in trouble or when they come face to face with death. What exactly is the will of your god for martin luther? The way this god hypothesis is framed does or offers no real explanation for anything if some thing god happens to a person it the will be termed as the will of god, If something bad happens to the same person it  will also be termed as the will of god, so what exactly is this will of god and how come it is only apologist that always lay claim to this elusive will of god?

All these mocking of god anecdotal tales. I remember back in the days when I was in Kano Nigeria and some of my moslem friends used the pages of the bible(Gidieon's new testament bible) to wrap their weed and smoke. Yours truly was a Christian back then and I secretly used to wish that god will teach them a lesson and make them go mad for that act of sacrilege   . The never went mad instead the continued smoking and smoking using the pages of the bible to wrap their weed all the time. . . . .Christians mock allah daily Moslems mock the trinity and the god of the christans daily while atheist mock all the gods all the time and nothing has ever happened and nothing will ever happen to them.

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=365785.msg5113422#msg5113422 date=1260830602]^^
You now claim the lucifer story about war in heaven is a myth but moments ago you were blabbing using the SAME story as basis for your crap theory about "proximity with summit of all thought".

Several times on this forum this guy has claimed the garden of eden did exist now he's here ranting Adam and eve were jewish myths.

You are a confused fake. Pick a religion and stick to it, stop boring us on NL with your psychobabbles.[/quote] Why is deepsight all over the place? How can you say that the garden of eden existed and claim that adam and eve were myths deepsight?

davidylan:
It is logically nonsensical. Would Epicurus then use the goodness and complexity of the earth to make a case for the existence of a God?

He doesn't need to do that since all the proponents of the God hypothesis use that argument to make a case for their various Gods. . . .Non of them ever uses the problem of evil when making a case for their God/Gods. . . .

@noetic15

I respect your convictions and we will always disagree over all these things. . . .I understand the theological explanations to all these things, I was just trying to point out that Epicurus was making his arguments based on the idea that was set before him. By the way he wasn't a christian or a jew. He was a greek philosopher and they greeks during his time had their own Gods that were different from the christian God at that time. . . . .He was using the problem of evil to make his case against the non existence of the Gods/God which I believe was well stated. I am not trying to blame any God for the evil we see around you should know my position by now. . . .I was just pointing to the problem of evil and using the argument as he has done to support my position. . . .

aletheia:
I notice you were so careful to quote from the KJV, since it translates the Hebrew word ra'ah as evil and thus seems to make your point. So that I would not miss your point you indicate KJV.
Consider the same verses below.

I thought you guys go around bandying this lie that some supernatural force inspired men to write words on his behalf?. . .So your god could not protect his perfect word from translation errors eh?. . .You guys are just too funny. . .

Isa 45:7 I form light and create darkness, I make well-being and create calamity, I am the LORD, who does all these things.(ESV)

Amo 3:6 Is a trumpet blown in a city, and the people are not afraid? Does disaster come to a city, unless the LORD has done it?(ESV)

1Sa 16:14 Now the Spirit of the LORD departed from Saul, and a harmful spirit from the LORD tormented him.(ESV)

The problem is that there are so many other english translations that use the word evil. . .but that aside, your god says he is responsible for all the disasters that comes to a city, he says he creates all calamities, and he sends a harmful spirit to his servant David. . . yet you guys go around bandying this lie that your god is the embodiment of love who love you guys as a father will love his children. . .will you send a harmful spirit to torment your child whom you love?

And this: 2Pe 3:15-16 And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures.

The verses in no way impute a manichean duality to YHWH. They indicate that He is sovereign. Totally in control.

As for evil not being the consequence of sin:
Rom 5:12 Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned--
Jas 1:13-15 Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God," for God cannot be tempted with evil, and he himself tempts no one. But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire. Then desire when it has conceived gives birth to sin, and sin when it is fully grown brings forth death.

But of course this will make no impression on your stony heart since darkness cannot comprehend light: Joh 3:19-20 And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil. For everyone who does wicked things hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his works should be exposed.

I believe I have addressed all this special pleading in another thread so Next. . . .

aletheia:
Yet, biblically and philosophically a third option is that God wants to abolish evil and can, yet He functions on his own timing and He has not done it yet because He has a higher purpose in allowing evil to persist for a time.
.

This is false if we are to really go by what the bible actually says. . . If you read the bible you will see that the god of the bible claims he abhors evil. . .He is alleged to have destroyed the earth through a flood so that he can rid the world of evil, killing every thing that lives just because he wanted to put and end to the evil the exist in the so called hearts of men. . .He sometimes used to come down himself to engage  some alleged evil men in physical battle just to rid his alleged creations of evil. . . .

God did not create the world with evil; it is the result of sin

Some of the extent that you guys go to prove non existent point is truly pathetic, where did you get that?

I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things. (Isaiah 45:7, KJV)

Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it? (Amos 3:6, KJV)

Samuel 16:14-15 states, "But the Spirit of the LORD departed from Saul, and an evil spirit from the LORD troubled him. And Saul's servants said unto him, Behold now, an evil spirit from God troubleth thee."

I do not believe in the passages above about your god creating evil or not , But these passages do not talk about evil being the product of sin do they?

Chrisbenogor:
@mazaje You don spoil ground finish oh

Na wetin I use spoil ground now? . . . . How body?

davidylan:
One of the problems i have with Epicurus's quote and atheism in general is the one-sidedness of their alleged "arguments".

when all is fine and dandy God is nowhere near the discussion . . . when it comes to evil all of a sudden its God's fault?

When we talk of the immaculately designed earth . . . its all about "nature". When tornadoes strike then Epicurus and his equally silly fans cry about where God was hiding his face?

Can any argument be more flawed than this? If Epicurus wants us to blame God for natural disasters or cancer, can he at least be sensible enough to credit God for creating a sun to warm us all?

Epicurus was not even arguing against the christian god, He was arguing against  the existence of the greek god/gods as described by the proponents of that god hypothesis. . . .And amongst the attributes of these god/gods were the promise to protect people from evil if they believe. . .So the question is of what use is a god that promises to protect people but fails? Even your bible makes a taller claim by promising people protection. . . .It even says that people that believe shall drink poison and not be hurt, snakes shall bite people and nothing will happen to them. . .That is not what we see around? No? So of what use are all these promise of protection believers bandy about when the evidence seen around contradicts their claims and hypothesis?. . . .

davidylan:
this argument is worthless because it assumes that God can be easily rationalized by flawed human reasoning.

I laugh . . . .Flawed human reasoning eh? And your evidence to show that your god has a superior reasoning capability that is greater than that of humans is?. . . . .Human's have flawed reasoning capabilities yet it is ONLY humans and their flawed reasoning capabilities that this god uses all the time to execute his perfect will that is flawless? This all-powerful god who is alleged to be the creator of flawed human is also TOTALLY dependent upon flawed, puny humans and their flawed reasoning to carry out its every wish. It is they who burned heretics and killed infidels and persecuted unbelievers on its behalf, who conducted its "holy wars" to spread its worship or tell others about his will, who convert pagans, build churches or place of worship, hospitals and schools, use their flawed reasoning to find out everything they can about the earth and universe, Use their flawed reasoning to explain to each other how this god supposedly created the earth and the universe and try to explain it to themselves. This all-powerful creator god can do absolutely nothing except work inside people's heads and on their minds which is full of flawed reasoning to execute its wishes. We have never seen it do anything else on its own beside relying on the flawed humans are their flawed reasoning to do everything for it.

“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent. - that makes no sense . . . we know God is perfectly capable of preventing evil.

And your evidence to show that this god is capable of preventing evil is?. . . . . .

Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent. - Again makes no sense. If i wish to teach my son a lesson by refusing to slap his hands off as he tries to stick them to a hot pot . . . does that make me malevolent? Its impossible to teach someone a lesson by refusing to let him face the consequences of his own foolish decisions.

What about Natural evil like Volcano, earth quakes, diseases, tsunamis, mudslides etc? How were they created by men? As a father its good to teach your son lessons about decorum but will you stand and watch a building collapse on your child even when you have the ability to stop it? Will you stand and watch a stray bullet kill your child even when you have the ability to stop it?

Is he both able and willing?
Then whence cometh evil? - I struggle to figure out what Epicurus meant by this. If God is both able and willing to prevent evil but makes a conscious choice NOT TO . . . how does that become an argument against evil?

Ok so your god made a consious choice not to prevent the evil that befall on his beloved children eh? Interesting. . . .

Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God?” - Am i neither able nor willing to prevent evil if i refuse to intervene if my child is flogged in school for not turning in his assignments on time? Perhaps you could ask why call me father?

Dense.

Your child will definitely wonder why he should call you father if he truly knows that you have the ability to stop a stray bullet from hitting him as a result of a shooting that has nothing to do with him or stop a building from collapsing on his head but refused to do so despite you claming that you love him and will always protect him. . . .Dense indeed. . . . .

Horus:
The name Annu or Anu is the Cuneiform, also the Akkadian and Babylonian name for the heavenly father who to the ancient Egyptians, was a physical being with wives and children, and whose other name was An or En. The Arabs call him “El Ali” the 36th attribute, meaning “the Most High.” However, when you put these two words together “Ali + En” you get “alien.”

And the second award for conspiracy theory goes to?. . . .Horus. . . .

KunleOshob:
Oledepo jus made a windfall in the last shiloh, i am sure he would be to settle the bereaved parents without barthing an eye lid.

You just have to give it to the guy. . .The guy is very intelligent. . . .I listened to one of his preaching during the Shiloh jamboree and all I can say is that the guy is truly a talented motivational speaker that has a lot of impudence. . . .Imagine Oyedepo telling the people that he does not need their offering because his wealth comes from a place that is over flowing with abundance and the people were clapping after he made the statement. . . . The guy is a well educated, well informed  individual who knows the basics of human psychology and how to press the buttons of desperate people that are in need of help. . . .He even said that he spent over 9000$ on books. . . Its clear that those books have really helped him to understand the emotional conditions and situations of the down trodden and how to reap them off. . .

aletheia:
@mazaje, wirinet & all others of their ilk,
We could be at this, hammer and tongs, till Jesus returns and you will not be convinced even if the evidence is placed right before your eyes and your nose rubbed in it. The reasons for that sad state of affairs are quite clear:

Stop talking about evidence because you have NON to support your fables. . . .About the coming of Jesus Christ to establish his kingdom. . Matthew 10:23  Says that when Jesus was giving instructions to his apostles as to just how they are to go about spreading his message Jesus says. . . . He said unto them "for truly I say unto you, you shall not finish going through the cities of Israel until the Son of Man comes.". . . . . That was 2000 years ago. . . .Matthew 26:64 - When brought before Caiaphas, the Chief Priest, Jesus said to him, "I tell you, hereafter you shall see the Son of Man . . . coming on the clouds of heaven." According to this the second coming was to happen during Caiaphas' lifetime. . . .That also was 2000 years ago. . .Keep on waiting. . . . For Jesus to come and give you guys swords and magic wings so that you can cut off the neck's of all the unbelievers and kill them all. . . .

1
[b]1. Jer 17:9  
The heart is deceitful above all things, And desperately wicked; Who can know it?

I agree with this statement, Who can really know the heart of man. . . .You think you truly know what was in the hearts of the Men that founded the religion that you are blindly following? I laugh in greek. . . .

2. 2Co 4:3-4  
But even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, whose minds the god of this age has blinded, who do not believe, lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them.

You think that the people that wrote the bible did not know that a lot of other people knew that they jokers and liars?. . .How else will they keep people in line if they don't provide passages like these were those that believe in their stories can run to and and find solace? Of course they need to  specially assure those that believe in their myths that they alone can see while while all those that do not subscribe to their stories are blind or are blinded and can never see the "truth'. . . .These mantra is found in all religious books. . .Go read the Koran it is full of special pleadings like these where those that subscribe to the lies of mohammed are told that they alone can see while others that do not sunscribe to his myths have been blinded by allah not to see. . . . .So you see you are not the only one that has such drivel written in your scriptures. . .How else can people subscribe to these things if they are not made to feel special above every body else and assured that they alone can see while all other are blind? Keep on keeping on. . . .

viaro:
Hehehe. . you're wasting your time on OLAADEGBU et al. I was long finished with his tenuous repetitions that address nothing other than blame everything and everyone on 'evolution' even when the thread is not about Evolution.

He has every right to point to the flaws of the evolution theory, but pretending that his own flawed and completely irrelevant theory(Young earth/Universe creationism) is a scientific fact is really pathetic because as long as science is concerned his YEC/YUCnist theory is a waste of time.

Are you asking for his funeral?    The guy does not know what science is - it's a catchword he uses to lie when reason escapes through the back door. The guy obviously does not know what a volcano is, and it is one of his favourite terms that peppers his mythos.

So do those who he keeps repeating their talking points all the time. Kent Hovind does not even have a degree in any science discipline yet he keeps crying that he is a scientist that has taught science for 15 years   .

From wikipedia

In 1971 he(Kent Hovind) graduated from East Peoria Community High School in East Peoria, Illinois. From 1972 until 1974 Hovind attended the non-accredited Midwestern Baptist College and received a Bachelor of Religious Education (B.R.E.).[3] In 1988 and 1991 respectively, Hovind was awarded a master's degree and doctorate in Christian Education through correspondence from the non-accredited Patriot University in Colorado Springs, Colorado (now Patriot Bible University in Del Norte, Colorado which no longer offers this program).

This guy went to non accredited universities  and obtained degrees in religious studies yet he is all over the place shouting and crying that scientist and their dating methods are wrong and that the earth and the universe are truly 6000 years old according to his own scientific methods. . . .The scientific methods he is yet to put forward. . .This is the same person that OLAADEGBU is copying and pasting from his website to show that there are scientific evidence for the global flood and that there is scientific evidence to show that the earth and the universe are 6000 years old. Some one that does not even know what a Volcano is. I laugh in greek. . .  

Ken Ham too is not a scientist. I doubt if he has ever attended any science class, Yet he knows that all the scientific method oppose the flood theory and the YECnist theory are all wrong. . .   . . . .

noetic15:
can a modern cargo hold 522 railroad box cars?

You don start abi? . . . What's up my man haven't been seeing you on the blog these past days. . . Hope you are good?

noetic15:
The measurements provided in Genesis are in cubits rather than feet or meters. A cubit in the Old Testament is approximately 17.5 inches long. Another measurement to consider is the Egyptian Royal cubit which is 20.65 inches. As mentioned earlier, Moses is credited as being the author of Genesis. Since Moses was educated in Egypt we should consider the Egyptian cubit, as well as the Hebrew cubit. Hebrew common cubit = 17.5 in. Egyptian Royal cubit = 20.65 in.

Ark Measurements    Cubits    Hebrew Cubits to ft/m    Royal Cubits to ft/m
Length    300    437.5 ft (133.35 m)    516.25 ft (157.35 m)
Width (Beam)    50    72.9 ft (22.2 m)    86 ft (26.2 m)
Height    30    43.75 (13.3 m)    51.6 ft (15.7 m)

The ark has the same cargo capacity of a modern cargo ship. The above figure shows a comparison with a 550 ft long cargo ship. The ark had a volume of 1.4 million cubic feet and a gross tonnage of 14,000 tons. This is the equivalent of 522 railroad box cars. The ark could have carried over 125,000 sheep-sized animals. Interestingly, there are less than 18,000 species of land animals alive today. Also, the average size of most animals is less than that of a sheep.
source: http://www.genesisfiles.com/NoahsArk.htm

The statement highlighted above is very false. . .The modern Cargo ship measures between 275 and 335 m there is a very great difference between 275/335 to 157(Alleged size of the Noah's ark). How exactly can 125,000 sheep size animal fit into a ship of that size? . . . .By the way some one tried to make a ship the size of the Ark described in the bible and with the same dimensions but the problem is that it did not float. . . . 

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