₦airaland Forum

WinsomeX: @mbaemeka
Thank you for the response. I will respond to it when I grab the opportunity. I want to believe this was an oversight: you forgot to respond to why no one is called a man of God in the NT. Jesus himself was simply Son of Man. Your bid to convert Son of Man to Man of God is ingenious indeed. But we will stick to the text: Son of Man. The question again:
Why is there not one person referred to as a Man of God in the New Testament?
Following your answer, I will provide my response later.

You flatter yourself too much. A Son of Man was not translated to mean Man of God and I made no allusions to that regardless of how ingenious they may appear to you. There has been only 2 Son of men in scripture- Adam and Jesus. But there have been many Men of God and Jesus was a Man of God even as he was the Son of Man.


1 Timothy 6:11New King James Version (NKJV)

11 But you, O man of God, flee these things and pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, gentleness.

Here Paul is referring to his protege, Timothy as a Man of God because Paul himself was a Man of God. Even Peter testified of this, calling Paul's writings scripture already because he knew Paul heard from God and we know not just "any" Christian can claim so:


2 Peter 3:15-16New King James Version (NKJV)

15 and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, 16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

So if you are looking for the phrase "Man of God" as used in the OT in the new you would be amiss except you follow the principles and criteria that made anyone a "Man of God".

trustman: You must certainly have time yourself to be here to make posts. 

SirJohn spoke giving an insider position. 
researchQ gave his personal experience. 
We have other people's experiences not related here yet. 
And what do we find you guys do? Attempt to 'fight' back and fight dirty using all kinds of underhand tactics - including repeated posting of videos hoping they will be talisman to get your blessing for being 'HIS MASTER'S VOICE', and accusing those who didn't get healed of not being able heal themselves when they were 'partners'
What you need to do is sit down and digest all these info. 
Meditate on them - you may mumble or mutter the words if you like. 
BTW, if a person was 'opposed' for claiming healing and then 'supported' for saying it was not so who shifted grounds - the claimant or the others?

SirJohn is a liar and his "9-post's-on-NL" accomplice was cut from the same stock. Please bring the other people's experiences or better still go and get your own. I can show you 1001 contradictions in the super-story of SirJohn but it will not convince you because you are blinded to truth.

The healing school has had more than 30,000 physical visitors since it started and has spread from Nigeria to SA to Canada. Nobody is charged a fee to attend and the richest of men have gone there and received healings. So what do they stand to gain in being associated with the scam that occurs there in?

Be objective and let truth rule you. Then re-read SirJohn's lies and you will see them for what they are.

As per who changed position between the claimant and the others it is easy to tell. First of all, tell me how that someone suffered HIV symptoms for 8 years and got tested 13 times in that time frame and all tested positive. Then she visits the HS and doesn't even meet with the Pastor there but somehow she just believes she is healed and then goes to get a test from a hospital that hates the man and would love to prove him a fraud yet she tests negative and lives symptom free for more than a year (without even taking her drugs). Then she disobeys the instructions she is given (she had disobeyed just after getting healed), acts otherwise, gets re-afflicted with the HIV and then comes back to blame the same people she claimed didn't heal her when she should have blamed Jesus.

In all this the "others" asked her for proof of her healing until she said she wasn't healed then they needed to proof again.

You will see that both the claimant and the others switched more positions than a contortionist will. Their testimonies cannot therefore count.

WinsomeX: mbaemeka,
PASTOR CHRIS RE-DEFINES WHO A "MAN OF GOD" IS.
Those who have followed the happenings at the Christ Embassy Church (CEC) in recent times have reasons to be concerned. For one thing, the scandals do not cease. For another, being the church that can boast of the largest number of young folks in this country, we should be concerned with what the future holds for both our country and these young people.

The youth that you are concerned about are doing great exploits for God. Many of them are teaching the word with power in their respective places of assignment, be it schools, homes or in their neighborhoods. They are graduating as the best students, they are receiving laurels for administering help to the poor and sick, they are the one's who stand out as well-behaved in the universities and they are growing up to be employers of labor, captains of industry, inventors as well as Doctors and Engineers with a difference. I can tell you because I am one of them.

Scandals followed Jesus every where he went. No matter how much good he did many still found those willing to bear false witness on him. Some even said he was a "charlatan" and deceiving the public while others who had at one time or the other received healings, bread and fish from him still asked that he be crucified. Jesus said "it is sufficient for a servant to be like his master; if they criticize me, they will criticize you". So the controversies are expected after all "woe unto you if all men speak well of you for so will they treat the false prophets".

Of all that Chris will have us learn from his below par speech at his church's communion service yesterday, it was his unsuccessful effort to redefine who a man of God should be that miffed me the most. Chris will have us believe that a man of God need not be a preacher. Chris will have us believe that a man of God has a different set of rules from those of us ordinary children of God. Chris will have us believe that men of God do no wrong in the bible except for two occasions. [s]Chris will have us understand that when a man of God does something seemingly wrong from the public's perspective, before God it is OK[/s]. Chris wants us to know that his wife is wrong and she, not him, is the one that needs prayers. In other words, Christian Oyakhilome has redefined a new standard for Christian men of God.

I listened to the same video and in no way did he say or insinuate to the emboldened. He simply said he was not a preacher but a Man of God; that Men of God cannot do anything against God or to disobey him, and I believe him because it is clearly written in scripture.

Of all the misconceptions of scripture prevalent in Pentecostal churches, it is this false belief of who a man of God truly is that is most worrisome. Under the guise of being men of God all sorts of atrocities are being committed. If you question them, they point you to Moses, Aaron and Mariam. They tell us that though Moses was wrong in marrying an Ethiopian woman, no one should have pointed this wrong out to him. It was in the bid to do this that Mariam and Aaron incurred God's wrath. So in other words men of God can do anything. You should only do as they say but do not do as they do.

Whereas a preacher could just believe the word of God so strongly that he goes about teaching and preaching to people a Man of God is one who has gotten a direct call from God himself and only does that which God has asked him to do. He lives for God, hears the voice of God and when he speaks it is as though God was speaking. As a result such a one does not live an ordinary life and the evidence of his calling is usually clear to see. For example, Elijah was a Man of God in spite of being a prophet (which other prophets within then Israel were). Paul, was a Man of God as well.

These men could not afford to be careless. The anointing upon them that causes miracles to happen through them could in an instant kill them if they misbehave.

Interestingly no one is called a man of God in the New Testament. When Paul used the term "man of God" in 1 Timothy 6:11 and 2 Timothy 3:17, he was referring to Christians generally and not to their leaders or a few special folks in church. Jesus himself was called "Son of Man" and if the master himself was Son of Man, who should dare be a "man of God" before him. So what is the biblical basis of its use today?

Jesus "was" a man of God (even though he was the son of God). The phrase "son of Man" as he was called means that he was man's representative to God but as a man of God he was sent from God; heard from God; and functioned only in what he was called to do. So when other men were allowed to get married and have children he wasn't allowed to. God gives these men of God very specific instructions that may appear crazy to the fleshly man.

John the Baptist was another man of God and Jesus said so in words that would appear nebulous to the uninitiated. And just like other men of God he had a specific function that he followed to the letter. Timothy was called of God but not in the way that Paul was- he was called to follow Paul. Same way Christians are called of God but many times God calls them to follow others.

The situation at the Christ Embassy church is becoming desperate and before they hurt themselves, someone needs to halt this. The hundreds of dead folks that lay dead from Rev Jimmy Jones stupidity is still fresh in mind. Unfortunately, Oyakhilome and his church do not belong to the the umbrella body of Pentecostals (PFN) and so are simply a ship left to drift without direction... Who will save us.

The PFN should take cue from CE by first dropping the "scriptureless" pentecostal word from their appellation, as well as some of their wrong teachings and maybe they would learn to respect constituted authority within their midst. It is in so doing that all the internal wranglings for power and money. . .even those for political offices will cease. And then maybe they would be able to come together in putting forward their first successful christian outreach programme as they are yet to have one.

As per your reference to desperation and hurt, it is unsurprising that you make would such an assertion given how well-known you are on NL as one who would not recognize truth even if HE slapped you on the face with a bible. CE have gone through greater persecutions than the present and we came out unhurt- in fact, more prosperous and influential than ever before. It is those who prophe[i]lied[/i] by letting themselves to be used by demons that, time and the word have proven to be desperate, hurt, misled and liars.

It is important to note that while some of them have repented, some others have fostered on (though unsuccessfully) and are now broke of the anointing they once had even as their destruction awaits them, while a few others have gone to chase political offices, failed blogs and even relevance on NL as they are trying to get by themselves what God has refused to give them.

shdemidemi: My friend, I understand the progressive nature of the letter of Paul but chapter 8 does not nullify who we are in chapter 7. Chapter 8 does not tell us what to do or how to do it either, it only expand on the administration of the Holy Spirit and who we are in Christ.
Chapter 7 explains the conflict in every christian-
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
An easier version puts it this way-
21 So I find it to be a law (rule of action of my being) that when I want to do what is right and good, evil is ever present with me and I am subject to its insistent demands.
22 For I endorse and delight in the Law of God in my inmost self [with my new nature].
23 But I discern in my bodily members [[d]in the sensitive appetites and wills of the flesh] a different law (rule of action) at war against the law of my mind (my reason) and making me a prisoner to the law of sin that dwells in my bodily organs [[e]in the sensitive appetites and wills of the flesh].
Every christian goes through this war between their new man and their old man. Pastors like Chris deny the old man, they live in pretense as though they do not have the sinful nature present in them.

I am a slave to sin; I am carnal; I am sold under sin; I am evil; I am under the law etc. These are a few of the statements he made in the Chapter 7.

Paul is not a slave to sin, neither is he carnal, under sin, under the law or evil.

Paul was describing the wretchedness of the SINFUL man that he USED to be but in present tense language to elucidate the struggle that sinners go through.

Sometimes they want to stop doing drugs, fornicating, stealing, lying and so on but they can't because they're carnal- body ruled; sense ruled; fleshly etc. They will to do what is right but they can't because their minds are dominated by the actions of their bodies.

Who will save them from that wretchedness? Jesus Christ. So that when they come into Christ they receive a NEW Spirit that is now able to win the flesh (as long as they yield to the Spirit) because the flesh is ALREADY dead in Christ.

That's clear enough from both chapters above. I rest my case.

Dragonking: So it is appropriate for men to protect men of God and not the power of God himself?
Elijah, elisah, Paul, Peter and all the disciples of jesus christ went about preaching and healing according to the bible yet they didnt move around with heavy armed security men despite the dangers waiting for them.
They were ready to die for the mission of christ. So why is our own MOG always different?
Are they not willing to die for the mission of christ since the soul is what that matters and they know they will make heaven?
you guys always baffle me with your shallow mindedness, hypocrisy and man worship.

You don't want to discuss scriptures with me. Trust me, you don't want to.

Even as they were ready to die for Christ on how many occasions did they flee from people who sought to kill them? On how many occasions did they have to hide to escape death? Where did Peter get the notion to use a knife to try to ward off those who came to arrest Jesus? Why did Jesus at times run when Jews tried to kill him? Didn't he know he came to die for the world?

Dying for the mission of Christ means that even if they ask me for my life I will not deny my relationship with him. And that man has more than done that: indeed he has already died for what he believes. That's why when you insult him you are insulting yourself. He doesn't care about what you think of him (for he is dead). The only thing that matters now is Jesus- the one who called him.

What matters to you? So far other people's private lives, which goes to show how base you are.

shdemidemi: My haughty friend is here again..

Romans 7

24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?

25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.l

I have explained to you that Paul was speaking of two natures present in himself and by extension every believer.. The spirit and the flesh. His flesh remains his flesh subject to its members and the sinful nature. That verse is self explanatory enough if you will open your mind to study and not just to read.


If I am an emotional person before becoming a Christian, I will be emotional even after becoming a Christian. If my self consciousness is high before becoming a Christian, that does not change even after a regenerated spirit becomes present. A Christian continually need a renewing of the mind to gradually break down and mortify the flesh by feeding his new spirit with the word of God.

Though I am dead to sin and won't be condemned by it anymore by God, I need to make a conscious effort to live for my new master by reprogramming my mind by the word of God. Get it?

As you are, there are two forces that tries to dominate you... The spirit and the flesh. If you don't feed your spirit man enough by studying God's word, the flesh will take preeminence even if you are a pastor. Every Christian has these two natures my friend and that includes apostle Paul.

Chapter 7:25 didn't end Paul's teaching here. Remember it was the translators that apportioned verses into numbers et al. Continue the teaching into Chapter 8. He said we have been set free from the law of sin and death. He also said the FLESH was dead while the Spirit is alive.

People who don't know this will make mistakes because they will think they have 2 natures. The only nature that should be alive is the New man- the Spirit. That new man is created in righteousness and true holiness. He is not wretched!!!!

Dragonking: ^^^Guy shut up abeg..you just keep on saying trash and exposing your ignorance just because you are trying so hard to justify the wrongs of your master and saviour, pastor Chris. The picture says it all.. the write up and link is there for everyone to read and see.
Even his name sake carries armed men to the alter of god and there is nothing wrong too? but these same men want us to rely on God for divine protection meanwhile they themselves move around with protection from men not God.
Anyways, you can run away as you did the last time when i exposed your lies and that of Chris..
Bloody hypocritical liars.

He preaches in the open view of millions during the higher life conferences that he has held in many states in Nigeria. The security men didn't stand close to him then. So lets not muddle these things up because of hypocrisy.

The church Authorities know their MOG is a gift to the body of Christ so they protect him at all cost (just like Jesus, his masters disciples did him).

There was a time in the airport (in the past) when some demon-infested lawyer charged towards him and was hurling insults as if he wanted to strike the MOG. The security men became handy in such a situation. Same way President Obama, David Cameron and the Pope all have hired security (even more than this MOG).

STOP the hypocrisy.

researchQ: I see you are one of them. You must be plain stupid for saying I changed my monicker cos I never did. Why don't you try and go up there yourself and see what is happening there instead of vomiting trash. God will punish all of you using other people's misfortunes and deceive them. It may take time but one day the whole thing will be exposed if not in this world on judgement day the whole world will see it.

It may shock you to know that I may have sent people there who all came back healed.

I think if we were trying to decide who was Inane between me and you we would ask you why you kept giving your money for "years" to a project you could not tell was a fraud. If anyone can deceive you for that long then you are not worth my time.

As per 'one day' this thing will be exposed, it depends on how you look at it. We didn't start healing people yesterday. There are people who have been healed since the eighties and most of them are still alive and hearty. Which makes it over 30years and yet the exposure is yet to come.

On the otherhand, we cannot wait to be exposed. We need the whole world to know that the name of Jesus is the only name that can save a man- nothing else. Many Pastors from other ministries have gone to the same HS and they came back with testimonies: People from other nations and races-all far more intelligent than you.

You don't have a case, you are just confused.

SirJohn: I really wish I could stay silent on this one, but on a second thought, I wish to speak.

First of all, Kenyan28 is alive and currently living a healthy life with her husband and daughter who presently does not have any trace of the virus anymore. She acted on my advice to explore every available treatment and so far it has been impressive.

Back to your post and special ref to the statement in bold, Kenyan28 reliably informed me that after the healing school session she attended, she and several other folks who came with HIV+ issue were directed by a pastor or leader (I cant remember which one exactly) to a hospital in SA to be tested. According to her, everyone that tested in that hospital came out with a negative result; others however that went elsewhere tested positive.
As to why and how she had temporary symptomatic relief has already been dealt with on the original thread.

@Gombs
Posting videos will not help your argument, they are all edited clips showing only what Chris wants you to see and hear. I have been behind the scenes before so I can tell. I already re-posted one of my earlier posts from 2008 on one of the videos you posted ie the story of Ama Aponsah

Save your lies for someone that knows less. She said the nurses in the hospital hated Pastor Chris and the healing school and that they called him a fraud. When I have the time I will give you the exact link and quote.

As per her living in health via medicine, I am very happy for her. I hope she never relapses and that she rediscovers the higher life in Christ Jesus.

Gombs,

What I can gather is that Satan re-afflicted her but because she had stayed away from faith she caved and changed her confessions.

Whenever anyone goes to the HS and receives a healing they usually advice them to join a CEC for at least one month before going back to their own church (as most of the folks who go there are not CEC members QED)

They give such piece of advice because imagine if someone that attends Drummaboy's rebelious house fellowship gets healed in the HS and returns to his fellowship. Drum, will immediately tell the person that they were never healed and that healing is not for today. He will even bring other ignorant Pseudo-intellectuals like himself to say so.

There's one of them who has a PHD in the USA in something medically inclined. He claimed that a person who has suffered a HIV positive status for long could still fall into remissive phases in which the symptoms will cease and the status will test negative. Then he claimed that was what happened to Kenya28. Can you imagine the load of tosh emanating from a PHD holder o?

Anyways, Kenya28 went back to Kenya and visited a CEC church as she was advised to but then she let satan deceive her because not too long after she visited the church once, she then vowed never to go there again (because she claimed they were worshipping Pastor Chris). That was her first mistake.

Then next thing even though she kept talking faith (as she claimed) she started getting critical of healings and started imbibing the words of some of these confused fellows even on this thread. She used to be overly peevish and irked about little things. She stopped reading any ministry material she was given and she stopped picking the calls of those who tried to encourage her. Maybe her 4 friends were like her, so they went back to faithless and sense-ruled fellowships and just like Jesus said: satan stole the words from their hearts.

Then disaster struck and she had no faith to combat it. She refused to listen to those who wanted to help. Then she took vengeance on the HS and CEC as a whole (the same people she wanted nothing to do with after she got healed). She sided with the naysayers and even voiced out her regrets for ever testifying. Very sad stuff.

But the lady in Kenya that had cancer and was healed (and remained in CE) remained healed till date. The daughter of omopastor, Strive Masiwa etc even those from other good churches were faith in the word of God is taught all remained healed. There are actually more testimonies of those who simply received healings via TV than even those that go to the HS. So all the stories about stage-managing healings don't make any iota of sense.

But if badbelle dominates your life (like it does you know who and who). Then all you will see is all the nonsense that the few miscreants have said.

Gombs: Hillarious right?

Man, I wish you would go through her posts (Kenya28s) on that thread. She came of her own volition to give testimonies of the healings she saw with her very eyes. She said she used to think that the healing lines were short but to her surprise they had more than 1000 people at each session and that well more than half that number tried to testify but that the queues were too long and they could not even take all the testimonies.

She said she didn't get ministered to by Pastor Chris. That she had received her healing before he even got there by just applying her faith in the word of God. Then she left the HS and went to a hospital in SA to get another HIV test and it tested Negative. She even admitted that the nurses in the hospital despised the MOG and even said they didn't believe in the HS. This definitely means they would have done their test extra judiciously so that they could prove to her that she wasn't healed- they were wrong. She testified in that hospital and she said nobody could refute her because they could very well see that she had just tested negative.

Then she went back to Kenya and she said immediately all the symptoms she used to have as a result of being positive for 8years had all ceased. Even when Sir John argued with her, she was giving him many many instances of how sure she was.

Now more than a year passed after going to the HS and she got married and had a child. The hospital that usually does a test for pregnant women didn't tell her anything about her status. She even said she was feeling weak from time to time during the pregnancy but she attributed the feeling to the pregnancy. It was only after she had given birth (and about 3 months had passed) that she started re-seeing the same symptoms then she was re-tested and found to be positive.

Immediately, she ran back to NL to blame Pastor Chris and the healing school- yet she had already said he didn't minister to her and that she got healed by her own faith. Then Joagbaje was trying to get her to keep talking faith (he even wanted to pray for her via phone) but she stopped picking his calls.

Her testimony kept changing the angrier she felt. From I was healed to I was healed temporarily to I was never healed. Then the so-called testimonies of cancer-dying people (as if all her friends in the world were sick people). When Joagbaje asked her about a lady she knew in Kenya that she said got healed of cancer she refused to admit that the lady was still alive and kicking. She started insinuating that the lady will soon realise she was never healed and would die and later she said the lady was a member of CE so....

What is even funny is that when she started complaining about symptoms and Joagbaje recommended a CEC pastor in Kenya she said "even if I go there and get healed it would only last a year and I would have to go back again and again" (I am paraphrasing her). Now she's admitting she would be healed but is afraid she will not be able to maintain it- and this is not even the HS we are talking about.

I have many posers to raise on the issue but didn't think the liars and hypocrites are worth it. There is now a HS in Canada to add to the SA and Nigeria one (6 years after that thread was started). So of course, Sir John's mission failed miserably.

researchQ: I have been hoping and praying that all this high end deciet happening in healing will be exposed one day. I have been there myself and I swear everything posted here by the op is 100% true. Before I went to healing school I have been a healing school partner for years. But when I was sick and needed surgery I decided to make use of the healing from my then dear Pastor Chris. I was shocked that from all the huge millions of money healing school receives there was no accommodation or feeding put in place. All who came for Healing school (HS) especially from other states were stranded. We had to pay for hotel, feeding, transportation etc from our pockets from the 3 weeks we stayed there. The pastors were sent to use human psychology on us. They tell u when Chris comes to you jump shout and say am healed whether you feel it or not. The real people who were on wheelchair, the blind, deaf were taken to another hall where Chris didn't minister to them. I saw able bodied people given wheel chair to sit on. Even the woman who claimed she was healed in one of the hs couldn't climb the stairs to the stage herself. The camera didn't show when she was aided but it was a live program. In short anyone that doubts any of this should enrol there and see for yourself. I later had my surgery and my healing school friend also had his surgery in India. Healing school is just a fiasco

You were a partner for years and you could not heal yourself? You couldn't apply God's word for yourself? Ok.

Then you left surgery you were supposed to do and you went to the healing school instead? The Pastors used human psychology on you? Hahahahahaha.

I don't even know where to begin from. Your story is too funny. You talk as if 10 people go to the HS at a time. There are wellover 90 times that number at each session so we expect your type of testimony to be in drones.

And you don't need to keep changing monikers if your testimony is true. Call others to come and share them.

Bro Joagbaje and co. You guys have time o. I didn't believe people who see themselves as intellectuals will believe such poorly prepared stories ridden with contradictions.

The only thing worthy of note was the switch in Kenya28s testimony which if carefully understudied one can determine what happened.

It is funny that the people who kept calling her a liar for saying she was healed immediately believed her when she said she had lost it without asking to see any evidence.

Even Kenya28s stories of how 4 people died didn't even require this 'truth seekers' to ask for any names or contacts. They swallowed the whole thing.

Now watch them asking stupid questions. Yet these same ignoramuses will tell you how brainwashed you are for believing what you have seen in the bible.

I feel for some of them including the one's that need a miracle to have children. As for the liars since time immemorial, the clock is ticking and the time is near.

shdemidemi: Seeing the faces of the gullible saying hallelujah after every sentence was pitiful. The bible says if anyone says he isn't a sinner, he isn't only a liar, he also calls God a liar.
The man should take off the mask and stop acting like he is above error, mistakes and sinful acts. The word of God does not only challenge the congregation, it challenges the teacher as well. No one should sit as though he/she is an epitome of righteousness outside God's grace and mercy.
The clock is ticking, tell the truth and be free mr chris.
If Apostle Paul can embrace his sinful self, saying, 'O wretched man that I am', why is chris acting like he is better. I am sure chris will dare not pick a stone if Christ should ask any man without sin to cast a stone.

Paul had no sinful self. The sinful self was dead with Christ. The only one that existed was the righteous man in Christ. Stop insulting the man's knowledge of spiritual truth. God had already warned Peter never to call anything that he had cleansed "common, worthless or unclean" let alone "sinful".

Please read that book of Romans 7 well and understand the man.

WinsomeX: Now is that not what we are saying?

The man was old, his heart was failing, he had had a couple of surgeries prior to his death; medical information that are conveniently hidden from his followers who had been sold the dummy of perfect health forever?

HA HA HA ha ha ha, Information hidden from his son and daughter but made privy to you from the worthless corner of a rock that you reside.

I won't argue that with you any further than this. You people who would still proclaim a Chris Oyakhilome a saint after his own wife has accused him of "inappropriate relationship" with women only recently; will certainly turn a blind eye at your "heroes of faith" who died in ill health years ago.

hahahahaha, show us where she made such an accusation or be a liar forever. We are waiting.

Old age has never killed anyone. What causes people death are failing body organs which arise from old age. And that is the point we are making: man is fallen. This body is dying daily. If we are in health we should thank God. If we are sick, we should beg God. But to say there is one divine health somewhere that is the exclusive preserve of a people of faith is to preach rank heresy.

Genesis 25:8Amplified Bible (AMP)
8 Then Abraham’s spirit was released, and he died at a good (ample, full) old age, an old man, satisfied and satiated, and [a]was gathered to his people.

Deuteronomy 34:7Amplified Bible (AMP)
7 Moses was 120 years old when he died; his eye was not dim nor his natural force abated.

When you are there rotting away due to badbelle and ignorance some people are using the faith they have developed from studying the word of God to live in perpetual health.

The cross of Christ redeemed our souls. That's all. We however trust him concerning bodily and life needs. They are not exclusives rights.

Matthew 8:17Amplified Bible (AMP)
17 And thus He fulfilled what was spoken by the prophet Isaiah, He Himself took [[a]in order to carry away] our weaknesses and infirmities and bore [b]away our diseases.

Don't let anyone deceive you.

You are the one spreading the deception and lies.

loveroftruth: I see!
This is the msg you use to extort and exploit the hopeless.
Smh.
Is this what Jesus ask you to preach as a christian ? (If Jesus sent you that is).
Matt. 24:14:
And this good news of the 'kingdom' must be preach as a witness to all nations , and then the end will come.

The verses he quoted, who made them- Jesus or him?

Gombs: no mind the joor

E. W. Kenyon own funny pass.. then Idahosa

I didn't even see those one's. I just saw Hagin and started laughing.

Yooguyz: I thought was the only one who noticed that lie, hagin died at 86 cause of death was old age.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_E._Hagin

Bro, I hope they see it and repent from such desperate lies.

Elijah78: I mean you are a novice in those teachings that i said i am familiar with. Note the miracles i have witness were all a scam and it was very clear. I can assure you that it is better for me to join a different religion or become agnostic or atheist etc, than to mingle with what i told you i left for good, or to follow your teachings. first and famous, you don't teach in humility and i wonder which of the many gods you represent.
Note and i repeat i will always update on this thread about my journey, and nothing, even you can stop me. Keep praying that i should never see God (It makes me know that your god is like that, he answers such prayers but not over me).

Address issues in the appropriate threads and continue to dream that you have an impact.

I asked you to assist us, and share with us your experience with God, you go around throwing insults on people who do not agree with your logos and talk talk. Anointing doesn't guarantee me heaven. I have given you scripture as to why i do what i am doing, instead of you enlightening me, you go around like your father.

You have to humble yourself. That is the advice i am giving you.

You call yourself a christian yet you address people like some one who has never known God. Read Johns letters, you will know that ""if you say to love God and still hate your brother, then you don't know God''

You don't seem to read posts well or maybe you don't understand what you read.

You are not a Christian. You are not Saved. You do not have the Holy Spirit of God in you. You WILL NEVER hear the voice of God.

You didn't leave anywhere to come here. You were never part of where you were. Demas saw all the miracles Paul did and heard all the teachings yet he still abandoned Paul because of his fear of persecution. Judas betrayed Jesus.

There's nothing hidden under the sun. The only way has been revealed to men over 2000 years ago. Any other way without the Holy Spirit is from thieves and Robbers. But God's sheep will know his voice and will refuse the one's from strangers. But those who do not have God's Spirit will be misled and we be 'being' misled till God has mercy on them.

Keep striving bro. When you have entered let me know.

Hahahahahahaha Kenneth Hagin died from complications arising from a bad heart? Hahahahahahahahahaha.

Just like when someone told me that Paul may have gotten infected from the wounds sustained from some of the beatings he received. Then I had to ask him "if a snake bite (with venom) could not infect him why should a mere wound now infect him?"

These guys are funny and yet they want to have you believe that they believe God's words more than you. Hahahahahaha.

Elijah78,

Before I made a post directed at you I could already discern that all was not right and you have confirmed it. No wonder you are so confused about the basic teachings concerning the gospel- the one you want to have us believe that you are so grounded in.

I put it to you today that you are not saved and as such have no part in the gospel of Jesus Christ. Which explains why you are striving to enter; trying to go to God's presence; and wanting to hear from God's voice both still and audible. Or how do I explain the situation were a supposed Christian impetuously asserts that he doesn't have the Holy Spirit in him. That is not just hapless, it is actually worrisome how you would then expect to drink daily from that fresh anointing that comes from on high.

I have made it a personal mission of mine to intensify my efforts towards praying for you as yours may not be a case of sheer ignorance (which I once suspected), it might just be that you are pandering to the whims of seducing spirits from the darkness that surrounds this present world that you and I still live in.

As per exposing the unfruitful works of darkness as taught by Paul, we thank God he said exposing 1) Unfruitful works; meaning they produce no results and 2) that the works and not the person's teaching the works were to be exposed. The question we would now ask you is what are those unfruitful works of darkness?

Do you mean that a woman who got her femur smashed to virtual pieces during an accident yet was able to walk out after the anointing was administered by the word of God is an unfruitful work of darkness?

Do you mean that unstopping deaf ears, blind eyes, making the lame to walk and dematerializing tumours by the name of Jesus are unfruitful works of darkness?

Then what are the fruitful works of light as stipulated in the scriptures and what were Paul and all the other apostles known for? How could you also corroborate their testimonies and yet deny the one's that happen before your very eyes?

The answer is already clear to me. You do not have the Holy one of God resident in you and as such you have believed in vain. Christ is not lord of your life and your sins are still in tact. And as such you are sin conscious and dead in your sins and will never hear the 'still' voice of God.

You also called me a novice and that should be the funniest thing I have heard all year. Your Pastor (if you had one) cannot call me that let alone you who is still rambling between ignorance and Agnostism. You are still waiting to be delivered when Paul has already told us by the Holy Spirit that we have already been delivered from the power of darkness and have been made to sit in the Kingdom of God's dear son in light.

Keep waiting to be delivered and striving to come into zion. When you get there let us know. But while at it keep your new revelations of Paul being sick and God testing Abrahams faith as possible signs of affliction to yourself. Because someone who hasn't entered the kingdom will not be able to bring others in (and I pray to God that this statement doesn't pass you by).

This might be my last post to you on this regard.

Elijah78,

It was a challenge reading through your post because you made alot of pleonastic references not pertaining to me or the subject matter in discuss.

I asked you that question to prove to you that your beliefs were inconsistent. You cannot in one breath say you are waiting on God to speak to you audibly and in another breath say that someone who healed a sick person by the power of God is a false prophet or whatnot and I told you why: because the Holy Spirit, who makes the voice of God manifest to you is the same person who causes miracles of healings to happen. So if you tell him his miracles are wrought by evil spirits and then kneel from now till eternity asking him to speak to you, you will be waiting in futility because you would not hear him.

Another point you made which is laughable really is the one about saying you don't want any manifestations of his person and yet you are on this thread talking about seeking him. Brother, hearing from him is one of the ways he manifests himself to those who have a relationship. So quit the contradictions and understand my points well.

Moreso, you talked about defending what you call sinful acts by Christians. I should ask you to add unsubstantiated media-inspired sinful acts when you talk and then I will ask you how you could confirm it before you passed judgment. You see, because you cannot confirm anything and by so doing pass wrong judgment you are advised to shut up and let God be the real judge. He didn't send you to do it.

Have you studied Jesus' response to John the Baptists disciples when they came to ask him if he was the Messiah that was expected? What did Jesus do? Did he not direct them to his works and then whisper to them to tell John not to be offended by him.

Jesus secretly scolded John but when he Praised John, he did so openly and I take my cue from Jesus. I know I am a member of his body; flesh and bones and I don't take it for granted. I don't glory in the 'purported' shortcomings of others, instead I go on my knees making prayerful intercessions for them because of our union in Christ.

The people we ought to be circumspect of are those who take joy in trying to bring other christians down for that is against the Spirit of Christ. We ought to have natural love for anyone who calls upon the name of the lord. That was my own Christian upbringing. Maybe yours was different and I can tell you plainly that I do not envy you.

If you understood a whiff of the salvation you say you are "striving" on to get then you would throw away the striving part and just rest in the rest that God has already provided through christ. You talked about going to God's presence everyday and I heard the Spirit say "that's why many of my children live like I don't exist. They think they come and go away from my presence but they don't, for I am in them and they are in me always".

We don't go and come into the presence of God- No, we live there. We aren't matching into Zion, we are already there. That gospel of trying to enter through the narrow way is not from God. Many have already entered into God and are living there presently. If you could understand this it would revolutionize your walk with God.

I saw what you said about if God wills it I will defeat the devil and if he doesn't I will be tormented by the devil and again the Spirit spoke "it's a lie, it's a lie, it's a lie". God has already defeated the devil on our behalf and then he gave us his name to enforce his victory over the devil. That teaching about being tormented by the devil is a lie from the very one who was cast down from heaven who would like to make himself appear powerful-Not to those who know who they are in Christ.

Of course, Christian maturity is about surrendering your personal ambitions and letting God's take preeminence but we are not ignorant of Satan's devices. He will attack you with sickness and have you believe that God is "humbling" you and that is a big lie! For God has already taken away sicknesses from us by Jesus' death on the Cross. So we cannot lump all of them together. We must learn to hear from God himself in all situations which is what I agree with.

As for the rest of your drivelling about seeking and what not, again I say to you that I am not against desiring to hear from God and waiting on him. I only told you some of the things that can hinder you and blasphemy is a major one. Ignorance is another and inability to pray in the Spirit is another.

Ignorance, for example someone says God's ways are not our ways, his thoughts and not our thoughts etc. Ok. Jesus said he is THE way. If you know Jesus you know God's way. Paul said let this mind be in you which was also in Christ. If you know Christs thoughts you can know God's too. Afterall the essence of relationship is so that we can get to know whoever it is we desire a relationship with and the person who we are taught by scripture to have a relationship with is the Holy Spirit.

It is when we learn to understand him through fellowship that we can distinguish his voice from that of our minds or the devil's as the case may be.

Elijah78,

First off this is not a response to my question neither is it in anyway related to anything I know or stand for. I never said I didn't believe in hearing from God. I said you won't hear from God and I told you why: the Person of the Godhead who makes it possible for someone to hear the voice of God is the Holy Spirit and you cannot blaspheme him and expect him to speak.

He is a gentle person- if he is grieved he would not abandon you but he would not manifest himself to you till you repent from your actions and ask him for forgiveness. So you might as well add that to your programme on hearing from or seeking the face of God.

On another note, please study indepth and with the help of God's Spirit. He never told you that Salvation was difficult or requiring much effort for it doesn't depend on anything you have to do or achieve for him. He already came in the flesh to make salvation possible without your even asking for his help- indeed when you were still very dead in sin.

So don't miss it. You get saved first (you receive his salvation) then you develop your relationship with him. You receive eternal life and then you use it to suppress the flesh. You don't follow Christ so he can defeat the devil for you; You are in him already and therefore above Satan and his cohorts because he has already defeated them. That's the gospel I know and yes I have a personal relationship with God that I continue to foster as I await his appearing.

^^^

You think he cares about truth? No way Sir. He is somewhere monitoring if any new guest bar himself has visited his failed blog while he silently (silently because he doesn't pray out or believe in the spoken word) prays to God that the man of God is guilty. In his own words "Oh God please let this man be an adulterer or else I am finished for spreading a false story all because of my badbelle for this man".

Of course, such a prayer will not be heard in Heaven let alone answered so He will then deactivate the many accounts his has and will open a new one with the moniker "Dumberboy" which will only be apposite for who he has over time proven to be.

But what do I know? #Siddonlookmode activated.

Elijah78: Okay thank you sir! Should i wait on you to answer the question you asked me?
How can you prove the message you believe is right and what others believe is wrong?? Thanks
Note i have also gone through some of your posts and realize how you call people demon infested etc. Is that what God is teaching you? You are advising me to follow that? Any time i read a post from you, i see some bitterness, why?

I can prove the message I believe is right because I can (first of all) show you the scripture that teaches it and then I can demonstrate to you that it works. My style is different from those who talk, talk and. . .talk more. Those who can quote logos (albeit misappropriated) but then will shy away from showing us that what they believe works or will altogether say it is not supposed to work. No No No!

Paul said: "my preaching wasn't done with just mere persuasive words of man's wisdom. It was backed up with demonstration of the Spirit's power in what I believe. I did this so that your faith will not rely on the wisdom of men but in the power of God" (Paraphrasing 1 Corinthians 2:4-5)

If Paul needed to brother, then it is good for every Christian. Do you think I would like to believe in something that doesn't work? I am just like you too- I never want to put my trust in something that doesn't work and God's word works!!

As per me calling some people demon-infested, brother it is because they are. If you are full of the Spirit and can discern spiritually this will not be new to you. Many times I don't even write of my own volition, he gives me the words and I type it down. Sometimes I use the word to judge and the word is a wise judge- He judges rightly.

Don't get me wrong I know the difference between sheer ignorance and when someone is possessed. For the former just show them the word and they will refrain from doing what they have been doing (The entrance of God's word brings light and understanding the Psalmist says), while for the latter, no amount of clear scriptures will convince them because they are controlled by a spirit whose soul aim is to destroy them. Don't be mistaken.

The urge to bring another Christian down (for example) can never be from God no matter how we try to dress it. So when I see "supposed" Christians writing lies about a fellow or even bearing false witness I know it cannot be from God. Jesus told the Jews (who thought they were Children of God) that they were of their father the devil and his acts they must do. He was a murderer from the beginning and when he talks he speaks only lies because he is the father of lies (not the father of liars).

So when people believe lies and start reposting it everywhere they are unwittingly taking in seeds of Satan. That type of thing will only grow into full time demons and that's what I am addressing.

Hope you understand.

Elijah78: @mbaemeka, i am very happy to know that you have been diligently following me on the other thread. Please address your question on the other thread and i will give you an ''accurate'' answer. Please do not shy away.
shdemidemi gave accurate answers to the questions you asked me, and didn't see anything that i could question. If he had done so, i will ask him questions and he will respond as we have done on other threads. I take nairaland as a learning platform. I grap what i ''think'' is good for my spiritual growth and drop the rest. just as i disagree with gombs, you, Jo etc doesn't mean that i have not learn positively from your postings.
The fact that you have sported me out on the other thread and concluded that i do not agree with shdemidemi doesn't mean that in the near future we can agree.
Looking forward to seeing you on the said thread for an ''accurate'' answer.
Food for thought ''How then could you ever find the real God amid the religions of the world that portray Him in so many different ways?''
''Religion is a man-made institution. It consists of man’s concept of who he wants God to be, what he wants Him to do and how he wants Him to do it. And when you look at all the different denominations and groups, it’s clear that opinions vary. It’s a result of man’s rational, selfish thought and has little or nothing to do with the invisible, yet real, Sovereign of the Universe''.
Thanks

Don't get your hopes up, I don't follow you on any thread. Just as I read through someone's post on a thread many times I go back to other threads to see some consistency in his beliefs. If I see inconsistencies in his beliefs it helps me understand his person and the quality of information he listens to and believes as truth.

In your case, you believe you will hear God's voice. So you are waiting patiently on him but you disbelieve he will heal people or you endorse the posts of those who say that healings have stopped. You try. The same miracle that makes you listen to and hear God's audible voice is the same one responsible for healing people because they are achieved by the same Holy Spirit. So if you disbelieve his ability to heal you might as well disbelieve his ability to speak to you.

This reminds me of some Pentecostal pastors in Nigeria years back who criticised miracles in their country but then went to invite Benny Hinn and Reinhard Bonnke to come to Nigeria to administer the anointing of God on the sick. (These men are real men of God, I have no doubts) but the meetings didn't produce as much healings as was anticipated and I will tell you why. The Nigerian Pastors that invited them had insulted the Holy Spirit yet expected him to perform mighty miracles. It doesn't work that way. You cannot insult the Holy Spirit in Nigeria and then expect the 'one' in America to come and do mighty works-as if they are different.

So you can keep waiting on God. I can assure you, you would not hear from him until you go on your knees and ask him to forgive you for blaspheming his works and disbelieving his words. When you do this he will make the grey areas in your studies clearer for you and then some of your questions will be answered.

If you are of the Spirit, you will be able to tell that I don't discuss religion with men that's why I back what I say from the scriptures with the power that should follow. There are many Atheists I would never be able to convince with mere words but just a simple demonstration and they will cower under God's power. That's what Paul said.

For instance, if I tell you the name of Jesus is the only name given amongst men by which anyone can be saved and you are calling Buddha or any other name I will walk up to a sick person or one afflicted of the devil and command that devil to check out In Jesus' name and then I will ask you to do so in the name of whatever deity you say you believe in. I have no doubts that your deity will be put to shame afterall Jesus told us that Satan cannot cast out satan and I believe Jesus.

So instead of arguing nonsense and shielding it with misappropriated scriptures you better meditate on God's word and believe it. Then go on to apply it and see with your very eyes that the word works.

I do love you in the right way, that's why I am advising you.

Cheers.

Gombs: i believe this is rhetorical, but let me watch him deny it...then i'd set to work on proving it (if it's even worth proving)! if they not same fine, but if they are (which am 92% sure)... hmmmm
#ComputerScientist

I already let him know in my rebuttal of his conjectures. He was responding to me on another thread and he used virtually the same words he had used in that failed thread he tried to start that mutated into different topics. I spotted him out in a heartbeat.

I will just let the Pseudo-intellectual continue with his Multiple Personality Disorder.

WinsomeX: Time will tell what is true or false. I am ready to wait. And when it happens, we would be here to publish it on this thread. Stay tuned.

The rest of what you wrote is not worth responding to.

I hope you would have the confidence to post the "truth" when it becomes available to you. I know you would have egg on your face by then- Most failed bloggers usually do (I mean the one's with a conscience).

Elijah78: How can you prove the message you believe is right and what others believe is wrong?

When you hear from God I will respond to your question even if you avoided mine. While at it ask shdemidemi if it is possible to hear from God. I will like to see his "accurate" response to that question.

shdemidemi: Experience based christianity is the reason for the countless denominations we have in the body of Christ today. Unfortunately, experiences come and go, they are temporal, they are unique to individuals thus cannot be used as a standard for measuring biblical truth.

Many have started ministries based on personal convictions, experiences and revelations which have no precedence in scripture. People have been fooled and deceived to join such ministers because of what they see seem more real than what they can only read through scripture.

Are we in a position to actually test scriptures? I believe the only thing that needs testing is the so called miracles men ostentatiously display.

Misplaced response given that the experience I am asking for is the one that shows that what is in scripture is true. What virtue is man's faith in God if he will never know if God exists till a certain time? If that is what Paul them had to go through they would have been most miserable of all men. This is a practical verse, have you applied it? Did it work?


John 14:14King James Version (KJV)

14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.

Now if you have any experiences where you tested this verse and proved it true there would be no claims that the instruction wasn't to us or that someone is trying to squeeze his experience into the word of God. It will be the other way around which God expects from us.


1 Thessalonians 5:21New King James Version (NKJV)
21 Test all things; hold fast what is good.

I am not adding nothing for him. Apostle Paul went past sickness, he went for the jugular when he mentioned death. There is a slight hope in sickness and disease but the man picked death.

37 Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.

38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,

'In all these things'- Even at death, I am more than a conqueror.

Again isolated and distorted. Before getting to verse 37 he listed what he referred to as THESE things and they are persecution; beatings; unclothedness; peril etc. Then he said in all of them we are already more than conquerors through Christ. Then after saying that he brought out another teaching which is that apart from being more than conquerors nothing can separate us from Christ's love- including death! So I don't know how you jumped from verse 37 to use it to conclude the verse 38 and 39. That's disingenuous.

Again I ask where did Paul say in sickness we are more than conquerors or what not? There's no such verse because Sickness has been taken away by the death of Jesus. The only one Jesus said will always remain was persecution and tribulation for the gospel sake.

You did not answer the question-will a christian go through anything without God's knowledge?

Without God's permission, would it be possible for the devil to touch a man like Job?

God knows everything including the sufferings of sinners. God not only permitted Job's afflictions by the Devil he allowed the afflictions of the woman who was bent over by an evil spirit. Jesus came and commanded the evil spirit to leave, why? Didn't he know God "permitted" it too?

Jesus came, Jesus died, Jesus resurrected and he said he took away sicknesses too why should I then say to people (the one's Jesus died for) that they can still have what he died for? Am I not making the scriptures null and void through the traditions of men- the way men feel things should always be?

It is easy to get carried away by the stories hence turning our backs to the main substance and reason for the stories. God showed different dimensions of Himself in scripture that we might trust, believe and worship Him as God. But, through our selfie- me myself and I way of viewing things, we hold on to the wrong end of the stick.

We make a whole mess of the stories because of our lustful nature. These stories must be seen in the light of God and not in a way to put us in a position where we see God as a placebo and ourselves as the one who really matter. God said 'worry not about these things' meaning He is in control but we ignore the word only to misinterpret and misapply all tat was suppose to be a progressive revelation of the person of God.

Okay let us listen to Peter who had a revelation of God. When we say God is in control doesn't it mean he will do what he said he would do?

1 Peter 5:7Amplified Bible (AMP)

7 Casting the [a]whole of your care [all your anxieties, all your worries, all your concerns, once and for all] on Him, [b]for He cares for you affectionately and cares about you [c]watchfully.

The reason we cast our worries (all of them) on him is because he cares for us, watches over us, and will give us the desires of our heart-including healing.


Psalm 37:5Amplified Bible (AMP)
5 Commit your way to the Lord [roll and repose each care of your load on Him]; trust (lean on, rely on, and be confident) also in Him and He will bring it to pass.

Well, I see the understanding of Romans 8 as a chapter that adds at least ten to twenty years to ones life. Paul said amid all we are more than conquerors. That gives me the impression of hope even as I go through my daily challenges.

For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.

23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit(christians), even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

As far as this chapter and God is concerned, everyone on the face of the earth is suffering. No man has it all. I am not deceived by the luxury cars, houses and the bright smile.

18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.

The entire chapter did not say we should do a single thing, It is an indicative chapter that tells us who we are and what awaits us after our short journey through the present life.

What about the verse 11? What about the verse 26? You cannot speed-read the word of God and miss out on the vitalities. There is a glory now (in earthen vessels) and there is one to be revealed (at his coming). There is a healing of the mortal body now (Romans 8:11) and there is a new immortal body to be revealed at his appearance.

If this were not so, Paul, Peter, Phillip etc. had no right to heal anyone! They should have told them to keep suffering the ailments for at Christ's second coming they will get a new body!

30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Before we were born, He knew us, we didnt come by accident and our journey in life isn't by accident either. There is a purpose, there is a will, and there is a record. Only God sees all that will happen to us tomorrow clearly, we only have the present and that is as far as our senses can take us.

God's will and purpose cannot be changed by prayers.

Joseph will be incarcerated until the appointed time

No matter how much Mary prayed, the will of God concerning the slaughter of Jesus on the cross cannot be changed.

Job couldn't have prayed himself out of his ordeal...

Esau I hate.. even before Esau was born. He couldn't have prayed himself to be Jacob. It was already predestined.


Prayer isn't commanding God but a relationship with God.. Thy will of God shall be done os His will and purpose is far better than whatever conjectures we may gather.

Tell Hezekiah that prayer cannot change anything let me see you try.

5 Go, and say to Hezekiah, Thus says the Lord, the God of David your father: I have heard your prayer, I have seen your tears; behold, I will [a]add to your life fifteen years.

After he had said: Isaiah 38:1 . . .Thus says the Lord: Set your house in order, for you shall die and not live.

God said:

Matthew 7:7Amplified Bible (AMP)
7 [a]Keep on asking and it will be given you; keep on seeking and you will find; [c]keep on knocking [reverently] and [the door] will be opened to you

Jesus said "if it were not so I would have told you". Why do we talk as if the man lied or didn't know what he was saying?

The greek word used is diapthetiro meaning decaying

So what does it have to with sickness? It says though the outward man is disintegrating; getting old; fading away; losing some vigour and strength.

Can I not age without being sick?

Similarly, you might see me sick but if my sick bed is where I will discover God in His fullness, I will gladly embrace it.

If you were part of those boys, you would rather look for a jo or pray and fast to avoid the fire, not knowing God is mostly found where you least expect Him to be.

What is this?

Isaiah 43:2Amplified Bible (AMP)
2 ... [b]When you walk through the fire, you will not be burned or scorched, nor will the flame kindle upon you.

Did you see Jesus meet any sick person and tell them "Hold on, God can find you in your sickness?" Did he not know that Lazarus will get a new body at his coming? Why did he still raise him back to life?

There is no such teaching in the bible as God would find anybody in sickness. Not one. God sent Jesus to destroy all the works of the devil. Jesus said he only did that which he saw his father do, which means Jesus saw God heal people. So where is your revelation that God will meet a christian at his sickness (and not heal him) coming from? It is not in my own bible.

I never asked for other attributes. I only asked if He is a comforter and who needs such.

A pregnant woman that goes through the pangs and pains of child birth needs a comforter. Her comforter may be her husband, her other family members or the labor delivery nurse. None of these people can stop her from going through the pain, they can only encourage her by comforting her in whichever way or form to endure and persevere. That is exactly what the Holy Spirit does with us through God's word when we go through the pangs of life. He works on our mind like the anaesthetic does . We will hardly sob over anything even the sort of things that will naturally kill an unbeliever.

No, he is more than just a comforter. That's why I showed you his other attributes. Besides, his role in comforting is in persecution and not in illness. In illness he becomes the helper; the strengthener. We cannot hold unto one revelation of his person. He is the Spirit of might (miracle-working ability), wisdom, knowledge, understanding, counsel, fear of the lord and of dominion. He is the fullness of God and I am convinced you are not aware of this.

Candour: Paul perceived the man had faith to be healed. The scripture made it very clear the man made no confession of faith concerning it. The belief was in his heart and God honoured it.

If you have any experiences in using the name of Jesus to cause a healing to come to someone this would have been settled without much ado. The scripture didn't say Paul perceived that the man had faith in God or faith to be saved. It said faith to be healed. That's why Paul told him to act it.

Now you're creating a dichotomy. So what about the ruler of the synagogue? Jesus a greater than Paul was the one in charge there so why are you insisting the man had to have verbalised his faith? Could Christ words alone not save him without him speaking it like this lame man?

There's no dichotomy as such. Jesus didn't heal people with his faith all the time. Some like the woman with the issue of blood used her faith in Jesus to heal herself. To the ruler of the synagogue the man expressed faith in Jesus and then Jesus healed the girl. The woman with the Issue of blood didn't get healed because she thought of it in her heart. She got healed because she acted on what she believed in her heart.

Are you trying to limit God? Can you dictate to God how he runs his show? So a dumb man can't get any touch from God except he first gets his tongue loosed first? You think he isn't allowed to get answers to prayers he said in his heart?

Nobody can limit God "per se". I say per se because if we step outside the ambit of his word he would do nothing for us. For example, Peter would have drowned while Jesus was looking at and present with him because he acted in doubt.

So I didn't say a dumb man can't get a touch from God except his tongue his loosed. God can do as he pleases but he usually acts in line with his word for he is his word. He told Moses to speak to the rock yet Moses struck it but the water still came out. Then he told Moses he wouldn't get to the promised land for going against his word. That's why we are to follow his word to the letter (and Spirit!). John the Baptist's dad Zechariah was struck dumb by an angel so that he wouldn't use his mouth to distort the miracle of his son's birth. Our speaking is important. I can't stress it enough.

So how does someone get right with God and stay unsaved? You have any examples in scriptures? If Cornelius moved his lips but spoke in his heart like Hannah did without peter and others hearing him, would he not be saved?

Hannah spoke but Eli didn't hear what she said. Everyone in scripture who believed spoke the word. Christianity according to church history used to be called "the great confession". Cornelius is one who was right with God but was unsaved.

34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:

35 But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him

The preceding verses said God already sent an angel to tell Cornelius to send for Peter because God told him he had heard his prayers and seen his good works. This corresponds with verse 35 above. But in Acts 11 Peter says exactly what the Angel told Cornelius:

14 Who shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved.

Peter had to tell him words by which he was to be saved. Which he wasn't saved but he was already right with God.

God wasn't concerned with Hannah's lips, that was Eli's problem to worry about. God had already heard the words in her heart. See the scripture again

1 Samuel 1:13 KJV
Now Hannah, she spake in her heart; only her lips moved, but her voice was not heard: therefore Eli thought she had been drunken.

The bible was very clear. Her speaking was in her heart. Not a word came from her lips, her voice was not heard but God heard the speech in her heart and he answered

Her lips moved but her voice was not heard therefore Eli thought she was drunk. Have you seen a drunk person act? They may be mumbling inaudible words. You would know they are saying something but you may not understand it because of how inaudible it was. That's what happened here. Of course, God hears everyone's heart but she spoke out to his hearing alone. She didn't want Eli to know she was asking for a child or making a vow. He was trying to read her lips. Look at verses 11 and 12 of the same chapter:

11 And she vowed a vow, and said, O Lord of hosts, if thou wilt indeed look on the affliction of thine handmaid, and remember me, and not forget thine handmaid, but wilt give unto thine handmaid a man child, then I will give him unto the Lord all the days of his life, and there shall no razor come upon his head.

12 And it came to pass, as she continued praying before the Lord, that Eli marked her mouth.

Do you agree a man that hears or reads the gospel, believes it and falls down on his knees in his room asking God to save him is saved whether anybody was there with him and heard him or not?

100%

@the bolded, Thank God almighty. This is where God is sovereign. He can decide to break protocols for the dumb and can decide to break it for whomsoever he will. There's no searching out of his wisdom, mercy or power.

I agree in this context.

WinsomeX: I find it intriguing that in the bid to play devils advocate you didn't find any other example that those in the world of music and Hollywood. Not even biblical references but Jayz and Beyonce. What a pity. Your problem apparently not limited to false doctrine, you also have idols in the world you worship. I am sorry to burst your bubble they are not examples for the saints. And could it be that their Hollywood sort of lifestyle is what you and Chris covet that your marriages end up in divorce. at least, now we see




Is it news to you that Christian Oyakhilome was not living with his wife? Is it news to you that his leading pastors have also separated from their wives to pursue "ministry"? Is it news yo you that adultery, se-xual sins and all sorts of uncleanness is the order of the day at CEC? If it is, then you got to get updated. Open your eyes and stop being deceived. Your idols are being stripped down for all to see their unclothedness to their shame and those who have all believed a lie.



Please check well O. The OP is not from Linda Ikeji. Its Punch, a reputable national paper that published it. The second fact is that the matter of the divorce has been in the news since last year. When Chris was served his divorce papers that carried clear documentary numbering, it became obvious yo the randy Pastor that all was up. So shove that aspect of false news. Nothing can be truer except the gospel.



I can assure you he will respond to the court summons and then we would know who the demoniac is.



Pls don't go there because you scare no one. If anyone should understand God's vengeance and ability to settle scores, it will be Chris' wife he has been cheating on all this while. Its Gods patience that these men of God take advantage of to reap off God's people. But their time is up! First it was Biodun Fatoyinbo, now it's Chris. God knows who is next.



You should never had bothered coming to these thread if you are really a man of your own words.



He could not do any less in spite of all he receives through seed offerings.



The joke is on you and others who follow chalartans like Chris. They are ones being laughed at now.

Let me make it again abundantly clear, the aim of the thread is not yo ridicule Chris and his church but to again point us to their beliefs; their doctrine.

How come a strong doctrine of faith, confession, success, motivation and breakthroughs, cannot be balanced with a life of holiness and consecration? Shall we call such a gathering of Gods people?

Until Chris' wife came out with the revelation of adultery, the news was rife about how sex, money and power where the pursuits of CEC leaders while they sold a dummy of holiness to their followers.

Also, how do we hold the much publicized miracles against these allegations? Shall not this whole church be founded upon falsehood and lies?

I maintain that anyone can sin. But scripture maintains that a child of God does not make practice of sinning. What Is going on in Christ Embassy is an org_y. A culture of sin. That church has become a den of thieves; a place where demons hold sway. And all the fault should be laid at the feet of their doctrine.

That's my contention here.

You spent so much of your time merely regurgitating words of Satan-infested fellows such as yourself trying to tell us things you would have really wished were true. I already have an inkling as to who this is but to be a true Sport I will let your bi-polar disorder be the only challenge that you have (which is as a result of demon-infestation if you have seen the one's similar to what you have in you being cast out you would know what I am saying).

I couldn't even go past the second paragraph of your hogwash without laughing my head off. Are you sure you are not a v.oyeur? I have not spent this much time reading about anyone's life from the Horses own side let alone venturing to failed bloggers like yourself who are always looking for that quick buck no matter how dishonestly got it is.

Calm down. Nobody knows you and nobody will care. You are a nonentity and even if you left us with your real name we would not even know it. So carry the frustrations you have of being a nobody and fly a kite with it or something. The news about JayZ and Beyoncé was all over the News to those of us who don't live under a rock. If better News avenues like CNN and co were scandalously wrong what do you think will be the case of Punch or any such mediocre news outlet?

If you are as caring as you pretend why not go to the MOG to ask him questions or better still get on your knees and pray for him as should be the natural christian response? You can carry your primo sappy write-up and feigned piety together with your fake stories and get a life as you clearly do not have one.

Pastors separated ni, adultery ko. Jobless fellow.