₦airaland Forum

I think this discussion is wrongly placed. The topic is inquiring about development and use of cast iron by Africans, it is preemptive to conclude that cast iron, or any alloy of iron for that matter, is only useful in the manufacture of guns.

How about cauldrons, arrow tips, spears, hoes, cutlass, fish hooks, ....so many household implements were made of iron.

Yes, the African had preknowledge and utility of iron before encounter with Europeans. I know Yorubas, and few other cultures as well, had ironsmiths proficient in iron smelting and moulding and it is a cultural craft practiced for centuries.

Tony Spike: Yeah, I've started reading Amor4ce's hypothesis. It is well loaded but I think a lot of distractions exist therein that needs to be modified or excised. I agree with Mandarin's position that it should be more of an intellectual article also.

Oga Metaphysical, sorry I've been a little bit busy from work. I should drop you a mail one of these days. I've been digging into the YORUBA-EUROPA lexicon and I think you've perhaps unlocked the mystery of the word YORUBA. This is very ground-breaking...

EUROPA (R-P) was coined by Phoenicians and was later used to described the whole of EUROPE as it is today. It is also pronounced as YORUPA (R-P) as EU and YO are virtually the same. I simply wonder why the people of the ancient OYO axis were described by such foreign name.

There is a movie titled "300". It is a screenplay of an attack by Spartan and Greece against Persia. Leonidas was the Spartan King leading the campaign against Xerxes the Persian King.

At one point Xerxes threatened to call for a league of formidable fighters and their immortals to join the war if Leonidas refuses to surrender. Here he called the name of this nation of immortals, The Yorubas.

It sounded like he said The Europas, until you realize that Spartan and Greece back then were the Europas and so that could not be it. The movie script is rendered in American English and Ive had Black and White Americans listen to it and give opinion on what they heard. It ranged - Eurubas, Eurobas, Europas, Yurobas, Urobas, Yourrubas...

The congenity of the Yoruba, Greek/Latin lexicons and the co-occultic practices of Yoruba and Cannan is a definte hit placing the three axis (North Meditarranean, Mediterranean and Yoruba) in the same cultural spot in ancient geoposition. Canaan is the template.

Tony, Thanks for bringing that up.

macof: The Phoenicians are more or less Canaanites, Europa was a Goddess equivalent of Astarte that the Greeks adopted into their spirituality.
Historical Europa was a Phoenician princess and priestess of Asterte who later became Queen of Crete and mother of King Minos.
The worship of Astarte became modified as Europa

The name "yoruba" was derived from a word used to describe Oyo by Hausa speaking Fulani

What was the Hausa word from which the Oyo descriptor, Yoruba, derived?

macof: Ok. Now there's few questions
1. Are you saying Ancient Hebrew- that is starting from Abraham; used Oracles to Communicate with primordial forces?

In a metaphysical sense, the cosmic world is a flooded dimension. We are carried in a vessel safely through the unseen but perceived deluge. Those that fail to board the vessel are drowned. The vessel is what OPON IFA is. In it you have TWO of every animal (possible permutations of events or ODU).

All the numbers and dimensions given to Noah are all cryptic messages for the ORACLE.

Divination started with Noah, Abraham spread it across the land. Moses canonized it.

2. If your answer to 1 is Yes- are you saying the oracle is the same as Ifa

Thats a YES!

3. Are you saying Ephod is the original clogging style of the Yoruba

Ephod is just a bag or a sack or container in which must be kept the tools of divination. The tools as well as the bag are sacred and at all times must be maintained in a purified state.

Actually Yoruba priests carry two bags, the other one is called LABA - the bag of secrets!

Mandarin,

I read your post and I add backing to your call for a clean up. More on that later.

macof: Metaphysical Can I know your basis for referring Ifa as an Abrahamic religion?

And why you even refer Ifa as a religion?

Ifa to me is a spirituality, that was a slip, and i should correctly say that it was the spirituality of Noah, Abraham and the tribes.

Why do I make this reference?

I can only share publicly what i feel is safe and favorable to share, i cannot divulge everything in that regard.

First, Do you doubt that Ephod is the same thing as Ifa Odu? Looking at the images of the Ephod around the neck and the image of the pouches sitting in the Shango altar, would you say these two objects are the same instruments of worship attributed to Aaron?

When a person suffers from terminal disease or a severe ailment and a Babalawo is consulted for help, a specific livestock is often the offering that will be recommended in divination. The slaughtered animal is patted or touched with contact on different parts of the patient with some incantations. The objective is to wake the body back up, give it renewal.

See this quote from the Quran, Musa is Moses.

Al Baqarah (Chapter of The Cow 2.67-2.73)

"And when Musa said to his people: Surely Allah commands you that you should sacrifice a cow; they said: Do you ridicule us?

He said: I seek the protection of Allah from being one of the ignorant.

They said: Call on your Lord for our sake to make it plain to us what she is.

Musa said: He says, Surely she is a cow neither advanced in age nor too young, of middle age between that (and this); do therefore what you are commanded.

They said: Call on your Lord for our sake to make it plain to us what her color is.

Musa said: He says, Surely she is a yellow cow; her color is intensely yellow, giving delight to the beholders.

They said: Call on your Lord for our sake to make it plain to us what she is, for surely to us the cows are all alike, and if Allah please we shall surely be guided aright.

Musa said: He says, Surely she is a cow not made submissive that she should plow the land, nor does she irrigate the tilth; sound, without a blemish in her.

They said: Now you have brought the truth; so they sacrificed her, though they had not the mind to do (it).

So We said: Strike the (dead body) with part of the (Sacrificed cow), thus Allah brings the dead to life, and He shows you His signs so that you may understand."

Look at the last sentence - "So We said". Moses was communicating God's commandment, but when God revealed Himself He said "We". Who is in company of God and in witness of these interchange?


Lets go to something else. Yoruba has traditional clothing and colors - heirlooms.
We commonly call them Aso Oke, but customarily the name is " ofi". What is the history of this clothing in our culture? They have been commercialized now beyond our culture and land and you see them made in all kind of colors that broke their cultural meaning. Traditionally in Yorubaland they come in three colors, a plain natural in khaki or sand color (sanyan); a deep blue almost indigo color (etu) and a crimson or red color (alaari). They are woven in strips using blue thread or plain or crimson to produce each type and then the strips are joined together to make a spread. Here is a quote from the Old Testament. What is the history of our ofi?

Moreover you shall make the tabernacle with ten curtains of fine woven linen and blue, purple, and scarlet thread; with artistic designs of cherubim you shall weave them." Exod 26:1"..

When we turn away from these we will also come in contact with precise acts of worship and rituals (most of which I shared in old discussions already) that have correspondence, whether its in the manner of rituals at the altar or the instruments of priesthood or the acts of prayer or the stages of purification and renewal.

ladionline: I always know you have good information strapped somewhere meta, thank God for this homecoming, I really am delighted that you come home, though I don't know how long you will stay with us on the Hebrew homeland. But what you have shared is remarkably perfect for situation, brother.

That was what Aron was wearing in MY BOOK OF BIBLE STORY by JEHOVAH WITNESS back as a kid. I remember drawing all these picture or watch other skillful kids do the same when I was 10 in primary school, i think i can relate easily with the picture!

I know those people did good research and even modern bible with back page concordance often show this as ephod, well I use to think its bones and so on usually cast to find the path of scriptural "Odu" or something. But you have reveal a great secret.

Now check page 8 of the link you share where ori Olokun was position in exhibition, the cloth that is hanging there is of especial significance, that is the shawl I called Shaki at the Gele thread.

I saw it, the white shawl draped over a door or some upright structure.

Tony Spike: My Dad mentioned to me a few days ago that Leki was actually known as Oju-Leke back in those days. Lecce seems more appropriate.

Ibadariki (I think) became Badagry

Exactly! How does one go from Ibadariki to Badagry? It has been 100yrs and future generations may never know Ibadariki is the original. If we can correct for these errors im sure we will discover that most of these place names in Yorubaland are a match with similar correspondences in AfroAsia. Names like Ado, Eredu, Edomite, Ijebusite, Amalekite, Sumeria, Nineveh and so on.

I heard Badagry was Agbadaigi. Ladi can clarify, he is more familiar with the history of that area.

Here it is

Ladi,

Share what you know about these three miracles.

1. The serpent - as in Eden and Moses' staff.
What is a Yoruba reference, if any?

2. The fish - as in parting of Red Sea.
What reference can you share?

3. The rat - as in the journey through the wilderness.
What do you know?

Im beginning to think, and quite convincingly, that these miracles were actually rituals and offerings prescribed by divination. In other words, in a time of tribulation a divination was cast to obtain guidance on what to do to avert the malevolent energy. These three animals were the offerings that Orunmila prescribed for that situation. The three of them appear in various odus in Ifa.

The serpent is a symbol of the earth, of fertility, of renewal, of life. In times of distress and opression one craves relief and change. Offering the serpent will ease the way for a new beginning, a new journey, a deliverance from a burden and start of new cycle of life.

The mystery of the serpent in Pharaoh's palace would indicate that Moses' miracle with the rod was in fact a offering.

Fish is a very interesting one, it lives in water. Fish symbolizes a breakthrough, an awakening, a phenomenon. Water symbolizes subconscious and depth of knowledge and the sustainer for life whether in form of amniotic fluid or a flowing river or stream. It is the abode of fish.

When one is faced with a daunting situation and in moment of monumental and overpowering force an offering of fish would help to guide a rescue. An inspirational breakthrough will provide a guided way forward just as the fish glides forward and easily through the voluminous deep sea.

This offering is what is suggested in the parting of the Red Sea for the Israelites to cross safely and away from the pursuing danger.

The rat is a survivor, it lives and adapts to all conditions. Symbolically the rat is a pathfinder through a wilderness. It represents endurance and foresight. When lost and we need our way to the right path, the pathfinder is the proper offering to ward off confusion and negative energy fighting to keep us distracted and diverted from our destination.

After the crossing of Red Sea the Israelites camped and spent time in Mount Sinai when Moses took time to approach and communicate with God. After he was gone the Israelites cast a cow image out of molten metals and started worshipping it - the earth cult. Moses came down with the ten commandments and established a new law for them. Thereafter they left heading Eastward and spent time through the wilderness camping and awaiting guidance for settlement. Aaron became the priest in charge of divinations and the keeping of shrine and altar. Part of the sacrifices and offering made to the altar was rat, some other time dove.

This offering of rat is to provide foresight and endurance through the many difficulties of the hardship in that stage of their being; it will find for them a path through the maze of obstacles and get them finally to their destination.

These parallels of the Biblical miracles and the various Ifa verses in which they are cryptically described in the animal symbolisms and offerings is an eye opener for me.

I also believe the ephod that the Rabbis wear is a divination plate.

Download the pdf on this link below, you go to this page and scroll to where they illustrate a Shango Shrine in Ibadan. I want you to zoom in on the instruments of office in the interior and you see two or three ephod pouches sitting in there. This is what L. Frobenius witnessed and documented in 1920s although he did not call it an ephod. The Jewish ephod consists of two parts, a "urim" and a "thumim" sitting in a pouch. The pouch is the beautiful decorated fabric we see, we dont see the contents inside. Arab divination tool is also called "ruml". Yoruba divines to "orunmila". This I believe nails the quest on whether or not Ifa is older than Judaism. If urim and thumim predated Judaism, then Ifa should correctly be called the OLDEST OF THE ABRAHAMAIC FAITHS.

http://www.frobenius-institut.de/images/stories/Ausstellungen/Nigeria/yorubaland.pdf

On Sumaria and Osumare, are we sure that the people that translated and rewrote these names on maps and in books actually got them right? In other words, Osunmare could be the original from which they got Sumaria; handiccaped in the tongue amd lexicon of the original they gave the best approximation they could. Yoruba tongue has not been colonized, we are speaking the same tongue for centuries. The same cannot be said of AfroAsia. They have experienced many colonizations and had their tongues suppressed in favor of the colonizing tongue. This word and many like it suffer from this noted handicap.

Lets look at some words in our own land that suffered similar handicaps.

Ebute Meta is often written as Ebute Metta.
Ido is wrongly written as Iddo.
Dosunmu was changed to Docemo.
Ota is on some maps written as Otta
Oto is written as Otto
Leki is documented as Lekki. On some old maps its spelled Lecce.

ladionline: You aint seen anything yet eeti ri nkenken. My own abracadabra is a child's play compare to my two friends. Meanwhile on a serious note, abiri means a.bi.ri. meaning 'having to do with river'. (biri is the root for hebrew according to wiki, check it out). abiri is equal to Obiri. The Yoruba would say obiri laye. Ebora means 'Sacrifice vanish', an ifa precept (omo Odu) is termed ejilaesebora, that is the twelve that emanated from Ebora. The verse was about an ancient Yoruba couple set at discord by divided favouritism to their twins children. This shows that Ebora used to be human back in time. Then when someone dies, the Yoruba says 'o ti deni Ebora' (abraham bosom). Odu Obara meji says baba Abiriyamu lo bi Abiriyamu, baba Abiriyamu lo bi Abiriyamu...

Wassup pardner!

amor4ce: OJODEL10, my essay on Yoruba history has been updated/overhauled (100 pages of font size 11.5, minus the images).

ladionline, there's more coming; I'm only waiting for you and the others to identify the necessary pieces of the puzzle. Who will enlighten us on the Sumerians and Eredo?

Amor4ce,

Thanks for what you do on that blogsite, great research and representatiin. God Bless you and give you strength and light to do much more.

ladionline: Agbo malu, cattle fold; Agbo eran, ram fold; Agbo Ile, family or kinsfolks. Oju Agbo, event or feasting place. Agbo, ram, seekers, olden folks. <>The 'pastoral chord' that binds. Thanks metaphisical.

My pleasure Sir, and thank you for your contributions.

ladionline: Omo iwaju Oloko tii sowo, eyin oloko tii s'ejigba ileke. Ogedegede Oloko tii mi yebeyebe lori omi.

Ka f'owo wa, ka f'aje wa
Ka so aje nu
Ka wa f'ogedegede owo w'oko lo Iseri.

Omo Olofin O k'are o, Aye a ye o!

Happy New Year Everyone, whether you are contributing or reading.

Thank you guys for responses. Let me touch on macof's quick.

My brother, the 24 hr clock is segmented into periods. Between sundown and sunrise alone we have 7 segmentations. These are approximates.

Ale - 8pm
Ash'ale - 10pm
Oru - 12mdnight
Oganjo -2am
Owuro - 4am
Kutu - 5am
Idaji - 6am

Morning is too generic a term and I should not have used that to mean Owuro. Thanks for pointing out.


Tony, based on some of the cultural similarities I believe there is a connection between Luwo/Luo and Yoruba. It would be nice to understand their myths and folk tales for comparison.

Random, I would like to go deep into what you wrote, I see your quest touching on the fundamental question of humanity itself and its essence to the environment, but unfortunately the topic on this thread will not do justice to the discussion.

On the cow/cattle cult, let me touch briefly on something even more peculiar; mother.

In the process of sustaining life of the baby a mother sacrifices her own life. That is a cult! A very beautiful and adorable maiden gives her blood every month, in the course of a pregnancy she goes from a slim and light to heavy and wide. At a risk to her own life she carries everyday for nine months a new life that stretches every part of her physical endurance. From her body milk flows to nurture and build the child strong against biological defects and immune attacks. The changes done to her body is irreversible after birth, she must carry the transformation the rest of her life. As her baby grows and blossoms her own body breaks down and dies; the once supple and full b.re.ast loose their elasticity, the tight and smooth radiant skin loose their shine and are replaced by unsightly cellulite. Then when her bloodflow stops completely she faces a new danger, that of depression and cancerous tumors.

The cow is an extension of the mother who in turn is an extension of the earth. There is a reason we bury the baby's placenta in the earth. Before learning about the cow, a child is taught his/her sorrounding first by the essence of motherhood. In Yorubaland of old insane persons are sent to pastures to go and tend to cows. Through this interaction and care they are slowly healed back into reality and sanity.

shagaribarau: fkaz. You need to go back and listen to d interview wit Kano gov kwankwaso and undstand it very well

Bring us the audio link

Merry Xmas bro.

This is a database of world knowledge, one needs a whole year to go through the whole thing link by link, and each sub link and sub menu in turn. You will love this site!

Have you ever wondered why opon Ifa is round and not square?

Do you know why Esu is always positioned on top of the board?

When you look on your wall clock why is the chronological reference of number 12 placed on top?

Have you thought about a possible connection between your wall clock and the Ifa board?

Are the variables y and x explained in Ifa binaries?

Can Ifa solve quadratic equations and provide its corresponding y,x plots or even complex equations with fractals?

For these and many other mysteries go here:

http://www.tony5m17h.net/VodouFA.html

macof: Point is This whole thread as been fused with BS

Edo= Edomites of the Bible
Ijebu= jebusites
Ekiti= amalakites


First u mention 'Ado' ur friend mentions Adonia
Then you both start Parading with certainty that middle east is where people came from and settled in yorubaland hence the name 'Ado'
Later Ado becomes Adam
Rebecca covering her face when she first met Isaac became part of Yoruba custom
Isaac is Isokun in Yoruba
A river in Ikorodu is mentioned in the Bible

Like seriously why won't I stop this from going to far?

If I come across a BS written by you I wont step into it, I will pass on by. Why do you enjoy stepping into othher people BS and then whine about your soiled shoes?

macof: It's not about me, it's about the entire Yoruba nation. And everyone has his right to research and learn but when I see People trying to distort history I jump in.

This is contradictory!

First you say its about the race, I dont see anyone here talking about their father, grandfather, greatgrandfather and lineage; we are all talking about Yoruba race. Are we not?

Then you say people are distorting history. Are you aware that Yoruba antiquity is recorded in arts, oratory, myth, rites and so on? History is one part of its many records. In fact, its written history is far younger than any of its other methods of records. To add further, Yoruba myth is much richer and authentic than its written history. Becareful throwing the word "history" around. I know its a popular phrase but it is nonetheless susceptible to biases and inaccuracies.

Lastly you say you respect people's right to find their path but you jump in when that path is out of synch with yours. There are different schools of thought on Yoruba roots, they fall into two broad areas. If you have a path ypu want to research and discuss on you only need to open a thread wih the subject and people will contribute; Im sure you are fully aware of this. So Im lost as to your interest in trying to change opinion on a quest path that is different from one you subscribe to.

I've given my stance on the Yoruba history and origin so many times that all I want to do know is watch those who dream for a middle east origin

Good! Sit and watch. This is a point for collecting info, sort of an exchange. It is not the portal or container for all the aggregated knowledge. I dont think anyone will be dumb as to place the building blocks and conclusive output of their research here in NL when publishing agents out there are hungry and steadily soliciting for materials to publish and earn fame. If I have anything to teach and change the discussion on Yoruba roots and presence in AfroAsia you will not read it here from Metaphysical, you will be buying a book to learn it. Im sure you share that feeling.

macof: And why should I tell u where I come from? Wats ur business?

So what if we say Yoruba is Semitic? Do you have any power to change our stance?

You are quick to say where Yoruba is not from but reluctant to say where you are from. Where is the home of your ancestry?

RandomAfricanAm: Fantastic post!



I disagree on this point, those modern clocks are still synced with some agreed upon(by Europeans) natural phenomena it's simply phenomena that can only be clearly detected with some instrument used as a middle man as opposed to your unfiltered/assisted sight, smell, touch, taste, or hearing. (I.E something like the atomic decay of some random atom ...which obviously can't be seen by the unaided eye)

That said I was referring specifically to methods of detecting direction prior to said methodologies were imparted by Europeans. For most things a literal translation gives you a clear window into what you need to know to understand worldview prior to Europeans such as...
East = Ila oorun = riseing sun



Again, fantastic post! I'm going to look over the info/image and give it the reply it deserves.
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You just killed two or three birds with one stone right there. My background is software engineering and I've been looking at divinary systems in Africa that uses systems larger then binary(I.E "multi-Item & placement" divination systems) where you have 4 or 5 different "items" that each hold a value and you divine based on the "place" they fall along with if/what they touch or not.

That said it's nice to come back to the fundamentals laid down in IFA and see other possible traditional uses. It also gives me more resolve concerning the idea of searching what was left for future generations in order to build a better Africa based on it.

Lastly, I've been looking over spiritual systems and their concepts to get an idea of how the people described and thought about the phenomena they witnessed in the world around them. Spiritual systems are nice sources because they tend to deal with more complex concepts as opposed to simple thing like how much does it weigh & how many do you have.
There's a big difference between...

1.How many cows/much land do you have?
and
2.How has those cows/ that land helped your family survive throughout the generations?

Your commentary on pastoralist & agriculturalist reminded me to look at other expressions of the navigation of the related phenomena other then spirituality. Or maybe I should say before looking into a societies spirituality I should take a detailed look at the life they lead. it's the life the people lead that dictates the type of phenomena that people are exposed to cause it's through that exposure arises a unique spiritual view of the world. That's the point at which you can understand how they related to everything. I might've been a bit ahead of myself.

Thank you Random.

I believe I can help you clarify some ideas.

When you consider the cardinal points in Yoruba, three of them have to do with celestial bodies and the fourth one is terrestial.

Look at these terms.

Irawo - star
Owuro - morning
Orun - sun
Arewa - north

I would expect that a nomad society like Fulani or Ijaw would have a far more developed system of navigation than any of the agrarian society, considering they move both in daytime and at sunset. How do they find their direction in unfamiliar territories after sunset?

There is a brightly lit set of stars when you look up the night sky, if you connect a line joining all the star dots in that cluster you will end with what looks like the fork of a bicycle frame. This is the popular big dipper. Across and on opposite end of it is another cluster, similarly shaped but turned upwards down, this is small dipper. Almost equi distant between the two is a lone shining star, all by itself. This is the North Star. This is what Yoruba call Arewa. Arewa is not visible to naked eye in daytime.

All humans from beginning of our creation till now and into everlasting have depended on the North Star for direction. This is what nomads use after sunset. If you know where North is you can never get lost in the wilderness.

Soil cultivators depend on daytime sky for guidance, pastoralists, hunters, fishermen, depend on night sky for guidance.


In Yoruba, owuro (morning) occurs before sunrise. Owuro itself is a star - aurora. Aurora is spotted between cock crow and when the first glimpse of the radiant sun appear on the horizon.

So in summary, the Yoruba knowledge of cardinal points is far broader than just the sun rising in east and setting in west, it covers navigation on land and sea long after the sun has gone home and right before it rises again.

There is another content but we will talk about those later to explain the difference between ro (ojo n' ro; owuro; orun n'ran). Owuro in particular will interest you because it is the 360th phase of the night stars.

macof: As much as I enjoy this your discussions I just have to say It's a whole load of crab

Ikorodu is an Ijebu town, wat has Ado got to do with Ikorodu.

I asked the same question from Ladi. After his answer I followed his response and dug into more materials and found more things that were not initially related to my probe but from which arose new branches of knowledge.

Ogboroganda the 3rd king of ijebu came from Nubia territory of Waddai
He got to Ife and was incorporated, he adopted the Ife spirituality and left southwards on Ifa's advice.
He landed in a city called Iwa, there he was named Obanta and defeated the king who was later called Ijasi "Ija-Osi" No more battle.

Ijebu people formerly occupied the present day South Sudan which was at a time a colony of Ethiopia.
Queen of Sheba- Bilkis was from that area and the Ijebu's coming from their former home to Ijebuland still kept her in their memory. Sungbo is built in honor of Bilikisu, and the Ijebu people claim she was buried there.

Waddai, Wadi, Ouda, these are all synonymous names in the Sudan and Ethiopic lands, as well into the Sahara region for a river or valley.

It is also synonymous with Yoruba's name for a river - Odo.

Lets put the geography of Sudan in perspective. If I say I come from Kano, what comes to your mind? You will not ask if im from Hausaland because Kano and Hausaland are interchangeable. You will not ask if i speak hausa because thats the only official language, but you will want to know if im Fulani or Hausa. We should approach the discussion of Sudan with similar stereotypes. Sudan is like saying hausaland; egypt is like saying kano; semitic is like saying hausa language and semitic/hamitic is like saying hausa/fulani.

Egypt was one of the states under Sudan, there were other states. Nobody says much about Bauchi state because Kano has remained the principal hausa city state and in political and cultural talks it is always at fore front.

Axum (Kush) was the principal parent dynasty to the Sudan. Similarly, Kano was never the origin of hausa states, their origin came from Daura city (Hausa).

There was the Egyptian civilization which later overtook its parent civilization, Kush; just as Fulani overtook its overlords, the Hausas.

There were two capitals in the Egyptian Empire, an upper Egypt with capital in Djebe and lower Egypt with capital in Memphis. Similarly, Fulani sultanate have two capitals, Sokoto and Wurno.

Now, Abuja is a Gwari town, they are not Hausas or Fulanis and they are majority muslims. If we should find a town in Abuja , for example, called Wurno, should this not be understood as the effect of migration and political attrition? By the way, Wurno, the Fulani capital, is not in Nigeria.

Its a waste of time to use this method to give a breakdown of how, if on admission Ijebu is from waddai, then it is perfectly okay to theorize that majidun is a copy of magiddo..moreso that waddai is synonymous with odo in yoruba. The waddai in the Ijebu history will also give credence to the question of their penchant for monopolizing and tolling waterways.
We now know where that trait came from, they were historically valley and waterbed dwellers.

Edomites have nothing to do with Edo.
Edo is the name of the bini people.

Edo people are different from Bini. The difference between the two can also be seen in Lagos between the Idejo Chiefs on one hand and the Akarigbere/Ogalade/Oluwo/Abagbon Chiefs on the other.

The Akarigbere/Ogalade/Oluwoand Abagbon are the attendant chiefs of the Bini dynasty whereas the Idejo chiefs are the attendants of the Olofin dynasty. Olofin and his chiefs are the land barons. Oba of Lagos and his chiefs are the throne owners.

Similarly Edo is the Ogiso culture and land owner, Bini is the Ife settler and throne owner.

On whether Edo is Edomite or not, Im following a path and building my own theory. It is not set in stone and definitely not designed for anyone's consumption. When I have precise facts that support these theories I will not bother bringing it to nl..i can make good money going to press.

Oranmiyan left Igodomigodo in anger and called their land "ile-binu“

I think its a great insult to keep referring to a land steeped in greatness and centuries of civilization as "a land of anger". Our ancestors give reflection and deep thought to naming standards. When naming a town they invite their ancestors and call on the cosmic forces to bear witness as they sanctify and baptize the land on which they are settling into, they pour libation and ask for all the four corners of earth to bring in prosperity to their settlement and its community and homesteads. Can you imagine them going through all that trouble only to give it a name attributing negative emotions?

C'mon! I suspect one of the earlier European writers on African history must have enquired from someone ill informed and the answer given found its way into print and has never been debunked by Bini scholars because they would have to use a semitic term to properly define it, a very unpopular position.

Think for a moment what the title of the Oba of Bini is - Omo n' Oba. The only civilization in Nigeria or anywhere in West Africa for that matter that uses Oba is Yoruba. Omo n' Oba would be in this case heir to the throne. We need to know whivh throne he is heir to. This is his legitimacy to Ife. Ife on the other hand acknowledges a positive paternal link in saying Bini. Have you heard Yoruba used the word Omo abinibi? Bibi, bini, bi, are all synonymous Yoruba words for child or one reproduced.

On the mother side of that is Iye, iya, aye..all synonymous for mother or sustainer of life.

Similarly we have Abba, baba, ba..for seeder or authority of manifest.

An Oba of Bini from the 18th century was saved by a servant called "Edo" while he was still a prince, Edo lost his life for his future king and When The prince became Oba he changed the nations name to "Edo" in honor of his dead friend/servant. The name "Edo" didn't exist until the 18th century, so get ur facts right before u start making silly assumptions.

This is new to me. I guess this must be your theory, I will read up on it.

As much as I won't like to dismiss one of the Orunmila's having "Ado" as his real name. I think there's a confusion
Orunmila left Ile and settled in Ilesun, one of his children was Ewi. Later on in history, A Benin prince came and overtook ilesun, renamed it "Ado". Ado-Ekiti

Which brings me back to beginning. Who is Ado and whats his connection with Ado Ekiti or any Ado township in Yorubaland?

tonychristopher: THIS IS MADNESS...PAYING HOMAGE TO A LIVING MAN IS WRONG NOT TO TALK OF DEAD MAN....MEN PEOPLE CAN BE BAckward. YOU ONLY RESPECT HUMANS AND NOT EVERYBODY DESERVE THE RESPECT COS RESPECT IS RECIPROCAL.


THANK LORD THAT AM IGBO....WHAT IF RIGOR MORTIS SETS IN. WILL THIS DEJI JOINT BE BROKEN OR WHAT

Dont be quick to comment negatively about other people culture. In igboland when a man dies the corpse is washed and the wife has to drink the waste water, in addition to other fetish that she is made to go through.

How is such a horrific experience better than one corpse sitting in a chair and his subjects come in to salute and pay last respect?

ladionline: To me, Ado was the person who organise the southward journey from the 'alausa' camp that led to the discovery of Yorubaland. He was the youth leader while Odu'a was the Mother superior. Adimu is identical with Adamu Orisha, Eyo ile Ola. Look at Eyo dresscode. Thats Adimu, someone spotting 'hijab' like Rebekah, wife of Isaac. Thats how or why Yoruba bride often cover their face on the day of their espousal, like Rebekah. [IKO, CA] Laba [ekun] resonates with Laban, the brother of Rebekah. (Gen 24)*. Ekun maa fara sinko, Iwaju ekun ina, eyin ekun oorun, aboju wo, abese wo. A ri gini, a rin gini. Arin gini-gini w'oja. - 'E-suwa!

I have a theory for you and I want you to disprove this theory.

I pieced together the many things you have said so far and here is my line of thought on Ado.

1. Ado/Adam/Adimu
This is a divinity.
Ado is one of the orunmilas.
Adam is an idol molded out of clay in the likeness of Ado.
Adimu is the occult of Adam

2. Adimu Orisa
This is the occult of Adam, a veneration to Ado (an Orunmila).

The custodians of Adimu Orisa in Yorubaland are two brothers called Ejilu and Malaki.

Could Ejilu be "Angel"?
Could Malaki be "Malachi"?

3.
You mentioned Ikorodu. I don't know its relevance but I followed some of your dissections into the Bible and there is a river in Ikorodu called Majidun. That river is as old as Yorubaland itself.

You have heard of the term Armageddon!

Armageddon came from Mageddo.

Mageddo was the land of Ad (Ado?) who was the leader of the Amalekites (Ekitis?).

His land was destroyed and occupied by the Edomites (Edos?)


Humans are like rocks, in our sub-conscience there is a memory stamp of past civilizations that is lived through ancestry and from time to time the clock reawakens itself . We can appreciate this better in science where archeologists use rock sediments and fossils to date events in past centuries - radio carbon dating.

Naming in Yoruba, whether its for a person, a domestic pet or even town is never done spontaneously; there is a much thought given to it. Particularly the name of a person and that of a town actually carry some rituals with them and a libation to the ancestors. So the Yoruba ancestors that settled the land and named these places were the equivalent rocks from which the memory of their ancestral lands was reawakened and remanifested to duplicate the Amalekites of Ad (Ado Ekiti); the Edomites (Edo); the Jebusites (Ijebu); the Mageddo (Majidun); Malachi (Malaki).

This of course is my theory.

There is something else I want to discuss on Moses' mythical journey across the Red Sea and through the bush/woods and wilderness. This will come much later.

ladionline: I'm happy to have you back. I was wandering 'where has meta been?' Of course Crowder was as agitated for true Yoruba history as we do, but Yoruba scholarship of his time was just being born. He was codependent on contemporary missionaries and also frequents Muslim Yorubas who were at the forefront of staging the rebirth of their fatherland as they thought is best suited. But most of all, as a scholar, he wanted a theocentric, civilized Yorubaland to reckon with as an advance African culture.

This is true in all aspects, our scholarship is a advocacy for dogmatic principles and not necessarily the truth as we find it.

May his soul rest in peace!

Modula: How comes his eyes are open

So he can read what you write about him. Be nice and say good things.

Just kidding!

RandomAfrican,

This is a followup to your discussion with Ladionline.

Humanity moved away from phenomenal living long time ago.

Have you ever wondered why we have different almanacs even though all of humanity see the same sun, moon and stars? We have Roman or Western calendar (the Christian calendar), Jewish calendar, Muslim calendar, Chinese calendar, Persian calendar, Indian calendar, Ethiopian calendar..and so on. So why all these calendars?

There was a time in Africa when people told time of day by looking at their shadow on the ground or by listening to nature like birds, frogs, insects or if they live near water by observing the tide. The dependence on chronological instruments like clocks, wrist watches and other mechanical timepiece has deprived us of our phenomenal greatness. We are dependent on machines that can fail; when they do we are left helpless.

Humanity is divided broadly into two societies -
1. Agricultural - soil cultivators
2. Pastoral - animal herders, nomads

Agricultural societies are often mechanical and innovative and naturally settle nearby a body of water. What the elements (heat, cold, moisture, dryness) do matter a lot to soil cultivators. They are weather forecasters. In this society we might also find fishermen and hunters.

The fishermen use tidal rhythym and fish migration to tell the season. The hunters use animal migration and mating season to tell the season. The soil cultivators use the elements to tell the season. Together the egalitarian society construct its almanac from which to tell when to prepare the soil, when to plant, when to tend and when to harvest.

Yoruba society is an agricultural one, with fishermen and hunters but no nomadic group. So how do we tell the cardinal directions and their phenomenal meaning? Ladi has mentioned the translations but my followup here is on the phenomenal depth.

An agricultural society must have tools and implements, hence ironsmiths and blacksmiths. The Yoruba deity of iron is Ogun. Likewise, for soil cultivators that work in the open field and depend on moisture from rain, thunder and lightning strike must be a concern. The Yoruba deity of thunder is Sango.

Look at the following diagram, this is very revealing. I took this from the post titled Short History of Yorubaland in Pictures.

Onlytruth: Any keen political observer would agree that the body languages of known coup plotters in Nigeria in the past few weeks indicate that something is going on behind closed doors. I would like to believe that those known coup plotters are only delusional to think that they will EVER again be allowed to dictate the fate of millions of Africans in their own land.
So, they can be carelessly led to believe that they can come back to relevance; it changes nothing on the ground! They will soon learn that Nigeria is not the land, and that the peoples that make up Nigeria will NEVER AGAIN allow them to dictate their futures.
I have always maintained that Nigeria is NOT the LAND, but the PEOPLE living there. Already, a sizable chunk of Nigerians are tired of the Nigerian experiment and want to end it. All they need is a very good reason to end it... like a coup.

The President is his own enemy.

The President of anything, naturally, is the apex of an organizational structure and attracts competition and envy and plenty of venomous attacks from those who aspire to sit in that position. This outpour of human emotion is normal and healthy for competitive advantage and survivability in a physical sense. This is a position that demands selfishness, bruteness and insensitivity. Those with sensitive nature and altruistic views are usually natural born leaders but their ledership is more desirable in a supportive capacity where they work in the background and toil selflessly in support of the egomania installed in the Presidency. Here are few examples of Presidencies..debate club; sports club; student union; residential organization; labour union; professional organization; political caucus. These are all structural systems to help order our society and the person in charge of this orderliness is the President of that organization. To top it all, the President of a sovereign nation is the one person who must at all times bring orderliness to the nation's multi-structures - economic, politics, culture, finance, diplomatic and so on and so forth.

In a complex country like Nigeria, we deserve and must have a President that posesses the attributes of a Alpha dog - brutally self centered, insensitive, highly competitive and aspiring, very toxic and venomous. Equally, we deserve and must have around him and supporting him a pack of very sensitive and society friendly leaders who think of others first.

This balance in arrangement allows the president to think less of a threat within but also makes him vulnerable knowing that the people sorrounding him are not power hungry and therefore are indispensable. If he gets rid of them he risks bringing in power hungry and egomania like himself and therefore increase acts of insurbordination and divided allegiance within his advisers. The President in this arrangement and with all his might and brute thus becomes a softie in the hands of his advisers.

The advisers on the other hand, too accomodating and sensitive to the populace are also vulnerable, in the sense that they are powerless to see their dream of a great society manifest unless they are yielding to the desires of the President.

This paradoxical leanings work together to move a society forward and improve orderliness.

Here is a brief analysis of past Presidents and their close advisers and the impact to society.

1.
Tafawa Balewa - Sensitive and altruistic
Cabinet - Full of egomanias eyeing his post.
Impact - Disaster, breakdown of order!

2.
Aguiyi Ironsi - Sensitive and altruistic
Cabinet - Full of egomaniacs out for vengeance
Impact - Total disaster, war!

3.
Yakubu Gowon - Brutal, egomaniac, competitive
Cabinet - Sensitive, altruistic, socialists
Impact - Growth, orderliness

4.
Murtala Muhammed - Brutal, egomaniac, competitive
Cabinet - Mixed (brutal, egos and sensitive socialists)
Impact - Growth and orderliness

5.
Olusegun Obasanjo - Brutal, egomaniac, competitive
Cabinet - sensitive, altruistic, socialists
Impact - Growth and orderliness

6.
Shehu Shagari - Sensitive, altruistic
Cabinet - sensitive, altruistic
Impact - Disorder, chaos

7.
Muhammed Buhari - Sensitive, altruistic
Cabinet - mixed
Impact - Growth and orderliness

8.
Ibrahim Babangida - Brutal, egomaniac, selfish
Cabinet - brutal, egomaniacs, competitive
Impact - Disorder, chaos

9.
Ernest Shonekan - Sensitive, altruistic
Cabinet - brutal, egomaniacs, competitive
Impact - Growth, order

10.
Sanni Abacha - Brutal, egomaniac, competitive
Cabinet - Brutal, egomaniac, competitive
Impact - Disorder, chaos

11.
Abubakar Abdulsalami - Brutal, egomaniac
Cabinet - Sensitive, socialists
Impact- Growth, order

12.
Olusegun Obasanjo - Brutal, egomaniac
Cabinet - Sensitive, altruistic
Impact - Growth, order

13.
Umaru Yaradua - Sensitive, altruistic
Cabinet - mixed
Impact - Disorder, chaos

14.
Goodluck Jonathan - Sensitive, altruistic
Cabinet - Brutal, egomaniac, competitive
Impact - Disorder, chaos.

Looking at the pattern President Jonathan's administration should be bringing growth and order..but it is not! Why so? The President is his own enemy!

More later..