₦airaland Forum

Krayola:
Okay, I believe that God exists. But i do not believe that he is the God portrayed in the Bible. Prove to me that he is the real God, and not the other ones.

who is this God that exists?

cant answer ur question . . . .cos I aint got any experience.

can u share ur experience with us?

I analysed the basis of my assertion that atheism is a religion. The least u could have done was to make an analysis as to to why it is not. . . rather than reacting to my comments.

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=289288.msg4100130#msg4100130 date=1246132318]Your weak attempt to define atheism as religion is invalid.
Based on your twisted logic a belief in santa clause is religion,so is a belief in unicorns,dragons and aliens. Even a belief that 9/11 attacks were not caused by bin laden is religion. . . .the beliefs mentioned above have no scientific or intellectual basis hence they are religion.
Well done noetic![/quote]u did not make any point. . .did u?

landladies in nigeria or where?

Since the wife was paid out . . . . .the mom should hold custody.

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=289288.msg4099995#msg4099995 date=1246130137]The substance of belief isn't secondary,infact its the primary seperator of religion and other types of belief.
Belief in dragons and santa clause is quite different from belief in 'gods' {religion].
Religion is specifically ''belief in god or gods''[/quote]These religions are defined by the beliefs in the existence of God or gods.
why are they regarded as beliefs? This is because the evidence they give to support the basis of their sacred convictions (GOD) is considered unsatisfactory to both the scientific and intellectual community.

So a religion can be defined as sacred convictions that have no scientific or intellectual basis. This lack of basis is called a belief, since it relies on faith and hope to support its assertions.

what is the sacred conviction of atheism? . . . .  .There is no God.
Is there any scientific, intellectual or logical evidence to support this assertion . . .  , None till date.

Atheism is as such classified as a belief. . . .since it depends on the hope and faith that there is no GOD.
Atheism as a belief is a such a RELIGION.

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=289508.msg4099834#msg4099834 date=1246127376]My claim is based on the fact that christians have failed to provide substantial evidence to back up their god theory. . . [/quote]are christians the only ones who believe in God?

atheists are the only ones who belief that there is no God, so where is the evidence?

why dont u just define belief . . . . .

At this point, what they believe in is secondary. . . .u have identified them based on their belief. . . .so what do u understand by belief?

The key word of ur definition is "belief"

Religion is defined by belief. what do u understand by belief?

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=289339.msg4099903#msg4099903 date=1246128421]Are we safe? [/quote]well u are safe as long u dont mistakenly give abuzuola or any mohammedan ur contact details.

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=289288.msg4099893#msg4099893 date=1246128178]Give me your own definition of what you think is religion. The misconception seems to come from your end. . .[/quote]Pathetic. I made an assertion, u disagreed. I asked u to define "religion" to help u understand my assertion. . . .and here u are trying to turn it all on its head

what do u understand by religion?

fellis:
Sometimes after reading some of your posts, such as the one above, I just wonder about your level of IQ.

but u still havent answered my question.

Because they dont really subscribe to islamic malady.

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=289508.msg4099793#msg4099793 date=1246126596]You still have not provided ANY evidence to suggest he does exist. So your assertion is still classified wrong. [/quote]As far as this thread is concerned, u made the claim. . . so the burden of proof is on u.

where is ur evidence?

fellis:
Littleb, I understand that this was part of your post,
'. . . . . Islam holds that the purpose of punishment are three; RETRIBUTION, DETERRENTS AND REFORMATION. . . . . '. Not so?

why is FORGIVENESS not on the list?

PurestBoy:
I dislike islam because they stole my lovely pairs of shoes my brother sent from UK when my friend borrowed it to mosque one Friday and came back with a bathroom slippers

aha aha ahaa

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=289288.msg4099684#msg4099684 date=1246124199][b]Quote from:noetic[/b]It definately doesn't include atheism.[/quote]why dont u just define religion. . . . .then we shall see, if atheism is a religion or not.

RICHIE BOI:
I do imagine this question within myself as God is the creator of all things, I do imagine who created him?

are thou a christian or an atheist?

KAG:
I did. I'm so sorry about that.

what?

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=289508.msg4099739#msg4099739 date=1246125361]He's a creation of the imagination of selfish deluded and lazy men,in want of a higher power to attribute the mysteries surrounding them.[/quote]you still have not produced ANY evidence to suggest he does not exist. So ur assertion is still classified wrong.

I:
Assalamualaikum to my Muslim brothers, sisters and to my non Muslim friends, compliment of the day.

Let me start by apologizing for missing in action, this is due to the fact that am now somewhere pursuing my study which am finding it extremely difficult combining the two, even now i had to squeeze and post in some few lines. ?Hope you guys will forgive me.

Secondly, Am really sorry for what am going to write, Muslims are not against the teachings of Jesus Christ, in fact believing in Jesus and his teachings is one of the pillars of Islam, hope my christian friends will understand and reason with me.

The above question (who is Jesus) may be simple but if one ask Christians of different denominations, he will be amazed to hear different answers, some believe Jesus is God, some believe he is the only begotten son of God while others believe that he is one of the trio Gods (Waiyyazhubillah).

The answer to this question have been provided in the Holy Qur'an and the bible. I am starting by quoting a single verse from the holy Qur'an and compare it with what the bible is saying about the true personality of Jesus Christ.

"O people of the scripture( Christians)! do not exceed the limits in your religion,nor say Allah aught but the truth. The messiah Isa (Jesus), son of Mary, was a messenger of Allah and his word, which he bestowed on Mary and a spirit created by him, so believe in Allah and his messengers. Say not: Three (trinity) cease it is better for you. For Allah is only one, glory be to him above having a son. To him belongs all that is in the heavens and all that is in the earth. and Allah is all sufficient as a disposer of affairs."(Q 4 vs 171).

Let us now read what the bible is saying.

1.This is the way to have eternal life - to know you, the only true God and Jesus Christ the one you sent to earth.
(john 17:3)


2. Jesus said of my own self, I can do nothing as I hear I judged and my judgment is just because i do not seek my will but the will of the one that sent me. (john 5:30)

3. For I have come down from heaven to do the will of God who sent me, not to do what I want. (john 6:38).

The first question I want to ask here is that, can God sent another God?

From the above verses, it is indisputable biblically and qur'anically that Jesus Christ was a prophet and a messenger who was sent by God.

Some Christians believe in Jesus as God because of the miracles he performed forgetting that Elisha also performed miracles as stated in the following verses.

1. Then Elisha prayed, o lord, open his eyes and let him see! the lord open his servant's eyes and when he looked up, he saw that hillside around Elisha was filled with horses and chariots of fire. (2 kings 6:17).

2. And he (Elisha) stretched himself out over the child three times and cried out to the lord my god, please let this child's life return to him, the lord heard Elijas prayer and the life of the child returned to him and he came back to life. (1 kings 17:21-22).

For more details about Elija's miracles see 2 kings 5:14 and 2 kings 42-44.

My dear friends if performing miracles qualifies Jesus Christ to be God then Elija too should be considered as God, since he performed almost all the miracles Jesus did.

Now, let us examine the verses in the bible which Christians are basing their divinity of Jesus Christ.

1. In the beginning, was the word and the word was with God and he was God. (John 1:1).

The above verse is neither coming from God nor Jesus, it is coming from John, the historiographer who was trying to explain his understanding of the relationship between Jesus and God, unfortunately he contradicted the bible as pointed out in (John 17:3 and john 5:30). And if one examine the verse (john 1:1) he will understand that the word, with, is a conjunction, joining word and God.

The same Bible says in Isiah 44:6 and i quote, God says I am the first and the last, there is no any God besides me. (Isiah 44:6). If I may ask my dear friends, which statement is more authentic? is it the one from God or the one from John?

Another verse which christian hold as an evidence of Jesus divinity is (John 10:30) which states and i quote

The father and i are one. (john 10:30)

I want to ask my christian friends, in what context was Jesus saying they are one? there is still another verse in the bible where Jesus is saying and i quote

father is greater than i am (john 14:28).

Can any christian help me reconcile these two verses ( john 10:30 and john 14:28)? if at all Christians are reasoning well, they wouldn't have been using John 10:30 in establishing the divinity of Jesus Christ. If the oneness of Jesus according to john 10:30 qualified him to be God, the same oneness would have qualified his disciples to be God, since as stated in the same john 17:21-23, and i quote, That they may be one as we are one, i in you, they in me that we may all denote one. (John 17:21-23)

Is Jesus talking about oneness in knowledge, essence, or power? the answer is no!!! because he wouldn't have said in Mark 13:32 and i quote

However, no one knows the day or hour when these things will happen, not even the angels in heaven or son himself. Only the father knows. (Mark 13:32) and Jesus says in (john 5:30) and i quote

I of my own self can do nothing (john 5:30). Again ?Mathew 19:26 says and i quote, With God all things are possible (Mathew 19:26).

My friends, if one scrutinize these verses, he doesn't have to be told that Jesus is not God.

Now to those who consider Jesus as the only begotten son of God, they accept the word 'Son' literally, which is not so, because son of God signifies love and affection, nearness to God, which according to the bible, is not applied to Jesus alone. We find such term used in reference to many others besides Jesus, examples are giving below.

1.Blessed are the peace-makers, for they shall be called the children of God. (Mathew 5:9)
2. For all who are led by the spirit of God, are sons of God.(Romans 8:14).
See also Genesis 6:1-2 and Mathew 5:45. for more verses.

Moses told his people that, our lord is God and is alone. (Deuteronomy 6:4). Jesus also said the lord our God is the one and only Lord. ( mark 12:29) and the prophet Muhammad (S.A.W) also said, He is Allah, the one, the self sufficient. Master, whom all creatures need, he begets not, nor was he begotten, and there is none co-equal or comparable unto him. (Qur'an 112:1-4).

Allah Subhanahu wata'ala is telling us and I quote.

We did not send any messenger before you, Oh Muhammad (S.A.W) but we revealed to him saying none has the right to be worshiped but i (Allah) (Lailaha illa ana), so worship me (alone and none else). (Qur'an 21:25).

Moses told his people that, our lord is God and is alone. (Deuteronomy 6:4). Jesus also said the lord our God is the one and only Lord. ( mark 12:29) and the prophet Muhammad (S.A.W) also said, He is Allah, the one, the self sufficient. Master, whom all creatures need, he begets not, nor was he begotten, and there is none co-equal or comparable unto him. (Qur'an 112:1-4)

My dear friends, the truth is always obvious from the falsehood, so it is left for you to choose between the two. As I always say my doors are open for comments and observation because am a human being destined to make mistakes.

Bissalam

Another misguided and uninformed ignoramus. u actually think u made ANY sense . . .right?

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=289288.msg4099524#msg4099524 date=1246120945]Atheism is NOT a religion. Why would anyone think otherwise? [/quote]what is a religion?

manmustwac:
And he'll be convinced that he's going to Heaven when he dies

and just like u are convinced that u are going to hell

I dont think that atheists should have their own forum. In fact the muslim forum should be deleted, and every one should return here.

Cos this is a religion section and as far as I am concerned, atheism is a religion, since it relies on hope and faith that there is NO God.
There is something called the freedom of speech, no matter how ignorant, deluded, uninformed and ridiculous an atheist or muslim's opinion is, they still have their right to be heard.

Abuzola:
I wonder why u are acting like good and decent person whereas u are the opposite or are u a changed person, if so i congratulate u

u are entitled to ur opinion. I am not defined by ur opinion.

littleb:
Narrated Anas(rz):
Allah's Apostle (s.a.s) said: 1.
"From among the portents of the Hour are (the following):
−1. Religious knowledge will be taken away (by the death of Religious learned men).
−2. (Religious) ignorance will prevail.
−3. Drinking of Alcoholic drinks (will be very common).
−4. There will be prevalence of open illegal sexual intercourse. (bukhari)

2:
Women will increase in number and men will decrease in number so much so that fifty women will be looked after by one man. (bukhari)

3. Narrated `Abdullah bin `Amr bin Al−`As(rz): I heard Allah's Apostle (s.a.s) saying, "Allah does not take away the knowledge, by taking it away from (the hearts of) the people, but takes it away by the death of the religious learned men till when none of the (religious learned men) remains, people will take as their leaders ignorant persons who when consulted will give their verdict without knowledge. So they will go astray and will lead the people astray." (bukhari)

Littleb, I love this haddeth u posted. can I ask u some questions?

littleb:
You only keep on extending the conversation. There has not been any meaningful response from you. The subject of your question is centered on punishment, which I explained and I asked if you have similar thing in christianity. I don't know which response you want again. If I may put you straight, you asked:
why amputation? Amputation is for thief
why killing ? A retribution for whoever killed or hardened criminal e.g armed robbers
why husband will beat his wife and not forgiven? On matrimonial relation, beating shouldn't occur except if all other methods have been tried and it shouldn't be heavy.
why contradiction? There is no contradiction
why Allah decree muslims hellfire? Allah never decree all muslims hellfire

did u read the title of this thread at all? whats the meaning of all these u are stating here?

why cant allah forgive all these people? why does he choose to kill, amputate, behead and flog them?
which if these questions is too difficult for u to answer?

So, now answer my questions:
Is there penal codes according to christianity? What is it essence? How should it be carried out?

This thread is not about christian beliefs. But no, there is no penal code for anyone any more in christianity. it is called FORGIVENESS. He also asked us to pray for our enemies, apostates e.t.c. and not to kill them.

Aremugangan:
@noetic2: u quote d Qur'an as if u're quotin ur bk. U're rily tryin, kip up d gd work. It ll b so rewardin if u cld try 2 corrects d errors in ur different version of d bible. D Qur'an remains a divine bk of no human revelation bt ws reveald 2man. W@ do we kno d bible 2b? A collection of books wt different stories lyk a season film where we av diff directors wt diff charactas takin d same role witout conformity n continuity. Dnt wori, u children ll rid anoda version of d bible. Dere's already old n new abi mayb dey ll rid a remix of both. Pls continue wt ur quest 4errors d@ re nt in d Qur'an. U myt 1dy c d truth den u'l b announcd d ultim8 man

What EXACTLY was ur point?

olabowale:
Whatever Alla allows, is with Justice, and Mercy. There is no single time that he allows injustices and outright mayhem. Even today, there was looting of the Iraqi treasury and artifact and honor by the coalition of the willing. Theis is what humans do. When a people is displaced, their properties, should not be left untouched! Let me ask you, if all the men in Seychelles were to have been killed by Nigerian Military, and you are the only man left ion he Island, are going to ignore the young child bearing aged women and let them do what, exactly? Leave the society to ruin? And let them die off, without making a new nation out of the remaining?

Blowingup, maiming, looting, killing, raping are not part of islam. If a man is not allowed to in normal situation have ilegal sex, how come is he going to rape? You know muslim are so conscious that people know that the maximum allowable of wives at a given time is 4. Others could have simply added 2 plus 3 plus 4 and plus 1 to arrive at 10! He and his society will know that he had lied or ignorant or intentionally ignoring the ruling.

please tell me the above is a joke.

denial and lying is not acceptable

prettycute:
@noetic, why is dat u like criticism.in the quran and bible everything we say or do we have to true knowledge and fact.if you are seek for truth and fact. i ve no trouble with u but guy,i pray you dnt get the rut of Almight Allah very soon.cos the way u re going, hmnnnnnnnnn, , am trying not to pity u.salam

the wrought of allah?
u honestly have no idea who allah is, if u do, u wouldnt say that which u just said.

All i do is just to asm questions and all i expect are answers . . . , when intelligent answers are not fortcoming, is it not safe for me to reach a conclusion?

muhsin:
@noetic2,

You really need to be more rational and logical. You mean Allah (SWT) should condone killers, thieves and other executors of grave offenses, and yet, He should NOT condone husbands beating their wives? What an illogic and, I don't wanna say; insanity?

A question to you: What is said in your bible regarding the killers, thieves, etc? Set free?

littleb:
@noetic
Is there penal codes according to christianity? What is it essence? How should it be carried out? I believe you are aware of that of Islam, though you may not be well informed about its details. Just compare it, if it is the same, then, your questions are no question at all. If otherwise or there is none in christianity? Then, how could you judge a criminal when adage says:"when there is no laws, there is no sins".

The laws are made to guide and promote peace, and they are accompanied with accorded punishment for the violators, though in some circumstances, the criminal maybe forgiven instead. Morover, Islam hold that the purpose of punishment are three, Retribution, deterrents and reformations. Retribution in the case of "eye for an eye". Deterrents for who might intending to commits such offence in future and reformation for the case of who still living amongst the criminals, for example, the release criminal from jail, at least might have changed his/her life for better. On the case of forgiveness, undoubtedly, any environment where the huge of criminals are leaving unpunish will be flourishing in corrupt practices, this is evidenced by what is happening in our country now. In contrary to your own objection on Islam, is it not safe to lose a criminal or a criminal lose a limb in order to save many life than to put the whole community in jeopardy by allowing free movement of criminals in the society! It is up to whoever want to adhere to the truth. Just be objective and respond according to Jesus teachings.

why do u two enjoy evading my questions? unless and until u at least attempt to answer my questions, u have said nothing.

@ Poster
You are simply insecure . . . , low self esteem.


what do I fear in a relationship? cant think of any.

@ Davidcares

You just FOOLISHLY sentenced ur self to HELL. The annoying thing is the children that would be born, who would be denied the chance of a loving CHILDHOOD.

Fhad:
Pls , brothers an in my early 30s and am suffering from a seriouse Pile, I encanter this abt 5years ago when i was doing my Industial tranning in lagos.There i was expose taking Beverages everynight which i was not use to in village. This cause a little fats that potruded fom my anus and since then ve being in pain whenever i want to his my self tru the anus.
pls this pain is severed, unnn i ve use many drugs both native and western, it always go and resurface
pls,, what prophetic medicine can cure this thing 4 Allah sake, May Allah reward u abundantly as u Respond,

there is a medical remedy for it. . . . .go to the hospital again.