₦airaland Forum

logicboy: 1) Everybody has witnessed evolution. The very fact that your wisdom teeth is useless and your jaw is smaller compared to the bones or fossils of men that lived in the early centuries is proof of evolution.

2) The are scans and Xrays and dead human bodies. We know that the professor has a brain

3) The student was not Einstein. That is a hoax

Can you tell me how come you believe "the bones are fossils of men who lived in the early centuries"? Did you see them? Have you touched them?? Why do U [b]believe [/b]in something that could be discovered to be a fairy tale? Someone just thought up the idea of fossils and you [b]believe [/b]it just like that?? For someone that [b]believes [/b]only in things he has sensed, I'm really at a loss as to how you came about [b]believing [/b]in Fossils.


About scans and Xrays, its amazing that you actually [b]believe [/b]that a piece of glass with light shinning through could actually tell you whats inside the human body. It takes a lot of faith to believe that! Because, it could actually be that what you thought were pictures from the human body were just lateral designs embedded in the glass.

logicboy: Are you defending a hoax?

You christians are pathetic

Doesn't matter if its a hoax. The article simply mirrors the inadequacy of science as much of it depends on faith. It takes more faith to believe in the Big Bang Theory than it takes to believe in the creation story.

Many atheists would ask why you believe in a God you've never seen, but if you check, you'll find that much of all what we base of everyday judgements upon are actually dependent faith rather than on senses.

logicboy: This should serve as evidence that christianity is a foolish religion. This article has been debunked so many times that it should have its own grave by now.

I like intelligence. I can engage intelligent folks. You said nothing, so I don't know how to respond to you! Soorry!

Professor : You are a Christian, aren’t you, son ?

Student : Yes, sir.

Professor: So, you believe in GOD ?

Student : Absolutely, sir.

Professor : Is GOD good ?

Student : Sure.

Professor: Is GOD all powerful ?

Student : Yes.

Professor: My brother died of cancer even though he prayed to GOD to heal him. Most of us would attempt to help others who are ill. But GOD didn’t. How is this GOD good then? Hmm?

(Student was silent.)

Professor: You can’t answer, can you ? Let’s start again, young fella. Is GOD good?

Student : Yes.

Professor: Is satan good ?

Student : No.

Professor: Where does satan come from ?

Student : From … GOD …

Professor: That’s right. Tell me son, is there evil in this world?

Student : Yes.

Professor: Evil is everywhere, isn’t it ? And GOD did make everything. Correct?

Student : Yes.

Professor: So who created evil ?

(Student did not answer.)

Professor: Is there sickness? Immorality? Hatred? Ugliness? All these terrible things exist in the world, don’t they?

Student : Yes, sir.

Professor: So, who created them ?

(Student had no answer.)

Professor: Science says you have 5 Senses you use to identify and observe the world around you. Tell me, son, have you ever seen GOD?

Student : No, sir.

Professor: Tell us if you have ever heard your GOD?

Student : No , sir.

Professor: Have you ever felt your GOD, tasted your GOD, smelt your GOD? Have you ever had any sensory perception of GOD for that matter?

Student : No, sir. I’m afraid I haven’t.

Professor: Yet you still believe in Him?

Student : Yes.

Professor : According to Empirical, Testable, Demonstrable Protocol, Science says your GOD doesn’t exist. What do you say to that, son?

Student : Nothing. I only have my faith.

Professor: Yes, faith. And that is the problem Science has.

Student : Professor, is there such a thing as heat?

Professor: Yes.

Student : And is there such a thing as cold?

Professor: Yes.

Student : No, sir. There isn’t.

(The lecture theater became very quiet with this turn of events.)

Student : Sir, you can have lots of heat, even more heat, superheat, mega heat, white heat, a little heat or no heat. But we don’t have anything called cold. We can hit 458 degrees below zero which is no heat, but we can’t go any further after that. There is no such thing as cold. Cold is only a word we use to describe the absence of heat. We cannot measure cold. Heat is energy. Cold is not the opposite of heat, sir, just the absence of it.

(There was pin-drop silence in the lecture theater.)

Student : What about darkness, Professor? Is there such a thing as darkness?

Professor: Yes. What is night if there isn’t darkness?

Student : You’re wrong again, sir. Darkness is the absence of something. You can have low light, normal light, bright light, flashing light. But if you have no light constantly, you have nothing and its called darkness, isn’t it? In reality, darkness isn’t. If it is, well you would be able to make darkness darker, wouldn’t you?

Professor: So what is the point you are making, young man ?

Student : Sir, my point is your philosophical premise is flawed.

Professor: Flawed ? Can you explain how?

Student : Sir, you are working on the premise of duality. You argue there is life and then there is death, a good GOD and a bad GOD. You are viewing the concept of GOD as something finite, something we can measure. Sir, Science can’t even explain a thought. It uses electricity and magnetism, but has never seen, much less fully understood either one. To view death as the opposite of life is to be ignorant of the fact that death cannot exist as a substantive thing.

Death is not the opposite of life: just the absence of it. Now tell me, Professor, do you teach your students that they evolved from a monkey?

Professor: If you are referring to the natural evolutionary process, yes, of course, I do.

Student : Have you ever observed evolution with your own eyes, sir?

(The Professor shook his head with a smile, beginning to realize where the argument was going.)

Student : Since no one has ever observed the process of evolution at work and cannot even prove that this process is an on-going endeavor. Are you not teaching your opinion, sir? Are you not a scientist but a preacher?

(The class was in uproar.)

Student : Is there anyone in the class who has ever seen the Professor’s brain?

(The class broke out into laughter. )

Student : Is there anyone here who has ever heard the Professor’s brain, felt it, touched or smelt it? No one appears to have done so. So, according to the established Rules of Empirical, Stable, Demonstrable Protocol, Science says that you have no brain, sir. With all due respect, sir, how do we then trust your lectures, sir?

(The room was silent. The Professor stared at the student, his face unfathomable.)

Professor: I guess you’ll have to take them on faith, son.

Student : That is it sir … Exactly ! The link between man & GOD is FAITH. That is all that keeps things alive and moving.

By the way, that student was EINSTEIN.

An assemblage of Dogs and Baboons!!!
When the violence starts, the only reason you would be spared is if your have an Islamic name!

Someone that has no political sagacity is talking about rigging. In the freest and fairest election, even if PDP fields Ibori for President he would trounce Buhari for the simple fact that people prefer thieves to terrorists!!

I would choose a thief over a terrorist.
I will choose Ibori over Buhari!

[size=16pt]We now challenge Major General Buhari (rtd) to tell Nigerians what he has done, whether in his capacity as the head of a military junta or in his private capacity, to bring education to vulnerable children.[/size] If he cannot live up to this challenge, perhaps he has to reassess who really is Boko Haram.

I am waiting patiently for this!!


What has Buhari done in his capacity to bring Education to the vulnerable children of Northern Nigeria.

Even Ibori, the supposed king of Corruption established a Private University in his Village, Atiku established University in his village, Igbinedion and the rest of the thieves can boast of contributing to Education in Nigeria.

I want Buhari and the Dogs and Baboons to show me just one school that he has painted or one science laboratory or any school he has donated books to. Just one.

[quote author=ndu_chucks]The above commentary reeks of naivity and complete ignorance of the Nigerian condition. Let me remind you that, when GEJ and his cohorts broke the power sharing agreement which called for power rotation between North and South, we warned of the dangers which would result. It goes without saying that those dangers remain with us as we speak. If you believe that a power sharing agreement existed, ask yourself why CAN could not find a presidential candidate from the SW and had to bring Ribadu in.

Let those who have ears listen – PDP has done enough damage to our country. The final straw should be the inaction of the federal government given the massive corruption and outright theft exposed during the fuel subsidy probe. Nigerians should be in the streets, revolting and demanding action from the federal government, but as expected, cowardice has been chosen by the youths and others.

PDP must go, that party has had enough!!! Indeed if a free and fair election were held in 2015, this party has no chance of winning. Any outcome, short of expunging PDP from office is tantamount to massive election rigging. Insha Allah, if that happens in 2015, the Dog and baboon will be soaked indeed. A word is enough for the wise.[/quote]Maybe in the North West and North East , People are tired of PDP. But In the rest of the four regions, what people are tired of is the likes Buhari and the rest of the ilk that give tacit support to Boko Harm with comments like this. Many folks I know that liked the BB TEAM IN 2011, have vowed never to vote Buhari nor a Core Northerner any longer. Ibori in Prison without campaigning would trounce Buhari in many states in the south and middle belt and thats because people prefer the impact of corruption than the impact of terrorism. [/b]I will choose corruption over terrorism anyday anytime.

[b]You promised that Nigeria would be ungovernable. . . . no you missed it. It is not Nigeria who is ungovernable, it is the core North. Things are improving at an alarming pace in the rest of the country. New businesses are being opened, jobs are being created, new universities are coming up, massive projects are in the works, malls are opening up in major cities, some infrastructure development happening here and there, the economy is doing pretty well in the south. It might not be perfect but things are improving even in states dominated by the PDP Governors.
Southern Nigeria is beginning to look more like Brazil, Turkey, Indonesia and the rest of the massive emerging markets. Northern Nigeria on the other hand is looking more like Afghanistan, Somalia, Yemen and the like!
Keep making the north ungovernable, its the North that would suffer as when the dust settles, rebuilding would take decades by which time Southern Nigeria would have joined the comity of advancing Nations!

He is calling his fellow vampires to sharpen their tooth for Bloodbath 2015! May his blood be the first!!

Even Babangida doesn't preach as much violence as this reef!!
How can anybody desire leadership from a man who never says anything about Nigeria's progress. This guy only talks about elections and nothing more. We have some good years before the elections. He can talk about how to move this nation forward. He can talk about solving the education deficit in the north. He can talk about extremism fueled by wrong interpretation of Islam. He can talk about a whole lot other things, but no... in 2012 he is talking about blood in 2015. The man is pathetic.

[b]Reality Check
[/b]In the presence of Boko Haram, no voting can take place in the core north- the only region where Buhari has any hopes of scoring. So where does the man want to win a free and fair election. In many parts of the south, an Ibori Presidency with an Alamieseigha Vice would trump a Buhari Ticket anyday. The man is very unaware of the geography of this country. Things are not in his favour.

^^^^^
Looks like you are living in the past!! Its you ilk that would prefer Nigeria stays poor so you can feel ok with yourself that you are outside Nigeria.
Americans own the factories in China yet, America is getting poorer and owing China over 2 Trillion dollars!! That means every American owes China 6600 USD. Get your facts right man. America was, China is!! The world has changed.

The way you are going about defending America is appalling. 5 years ago, this report would have had America on top of the list.
Wake up already, the report signifies a global capital shift. 5 years ago, Americans were forking out $30 Million daily go buy Nigerian oil, it is now ovcer $ 100 million daily. The result is massive shift in capital and in turn more Nigerians shopping in UK over Americans!! Its simple economics, man. Learn it.

AjanleKoko: The story is a bit of a daft one.
First off, Americans wouldn't shop much in the UK, would they? I'd have thought that was pretty obvious.

Secondly, some people on here seem to have forgotten that we don't have much locally by way of formal retail. There are many finished-good products that nobody is importing into Nigeria. That plus the cultural ties to the UK that Nigerians have. Of course, there will be a one-way flow of wholesale and retail goods to Nigeria from the UK. It's pretty normal. Add that to the fact that we are 160 million people . . . abi we are not supposed to buy anything just because we are Nigerian?

Everybody calm yourselves jare.

Totally disagree! The reports says Americans were number 6 on the list of shoppers. That means Americans shop a lot in the UK.
About not having much in form of retail, how about the Chinese and the Middle Easterners? They have some of the craziest retail centres in the world.

I think this reports shows one thing- Increasing disposable income! Period.
It isn't by coincidence that the countries with the fastest growing economies and excessive oil wealth happen to be the top spenders in the UK.

LOOKS LIKE MANY DIDN'T READ THE FULL REPORT.

[size=16pt]Britain's Surprise Shopaholics: Nigerians[/size]


Nigerian businessman Godwin Patrick took a three-week holiday to the U.K. this month to visit cousins. It wasn’t the only reason. “I’m here to shop,” the 38-year-old says as he strolls down London’s Oxford Street, clutching bags from Marks & Spencer (MKS) and Associated British Foods’ (ABF) Primark containing trousers for himself and dresses for his family in Lagos.

London retailers are big fans of Nigerian shoppers such as Patrick. [b]The African country was the fourth-biggest contributor to overseas tax-free shopping in the U.K. last year, behind only China, Russia, and the Middle East, [/b]according to Global Blue U.K., a company that helps foreign shoppers claim a refund of Britain’s 20 percent value-added tax. (Foreigners get the break on most purchases if they take them outside the European Union.) A growing Nigerian population in the U.K. and more frequent direct flights between the countries has led to an influx of visitors who have more to spend because of the former British colony’s booming oil-driven economy.

“Nigerian travelers are very particular to the U.K.; you’d never see them as a top 10 nationality in other markets,” says Global Blue Vice President Richard Brown. As a group, Nigerians spend more than Americans do, he says. (Visitors from the U.S. are the sixth-largest shopping contingent.) Foreigners account for a third of spending in London’s high-end shopping district of Bond Street, Oxford Street, and Regent Street and will spend more than £2 billion ($3.2 billion) this year, according to the New West End, an organization of 600 retailers in the area. [b]Spending by Nigerians in British shops rose 32 percent last year, [/b]according to Global Blue.

Russian and Middle Eastern tourists mostly seek luxury goods in Britain, like those sold at tony merchants such as Harrods or Burberry (BRBY). Nigerian visitors also spend heavily at mass-market chains such as Marks & Spencer and Debenhams (DEB) that have more selection, higher-quality products, and better prices than stores back home. “In Nigeria, there is very little formal retail,” says Siemon Scamell-Katz, global consulting director at researcher TNS. “So in terms of retail, Primark and Marks & Spencer is quite something if you haven’t come across much retail before.” Patrick agrees. “We don’t have the same standard of retailing,” he says.

Nigerian visitors spend an average of about £450 per individual transaction, compared with more than £1,000 by Middle Eastern customers, Global Blue says. At a Debenhams store on London’s Oxford Street, Nigerians provide the biggest source of overseas spending as they seek out perfume and moisturizer gift sets, British-themed products such as a Union Jack-printed teapot for £20, clothing, and shoes, according to company spokeswoman Ruth Attridge. One sign of how important the African shoppers have become: Multilingual signs advertising discounts at Debenhams are printed not only in Chinese and Arabic but also Hausa, a language spoken in Nigeria.

The popularity of Britain as a shopping destination for Nigerians partly reflects the growth in the number of people from the country living in the U.K. About two-thirds of shoppers are on holiday or visiting family and friends, while a third are traveling for business, according to Global Blue. The U.K. Office for National Statistics estimates that 174,000 Nigerians lived in the U.K. from July 2010 to June 2011, the ninth-largest nationality. That’s an increase of 34,000 compared with three years earlier.

Daily flights from the capital, Lagos, to London on British Airways and starting on May 16 on Air Nigeria are also fueling shopper journeys. The carriers know their customers: BA allows Nigeria-bound passengers to check an additional 23-kilogram suitcase gratis unlike the majority of its flights, leaving plenty of extra space for all those purchases.

[b]The bottom line: Thanks to their nation’s oil wealth, Nigerians are the fourth-largest group of foreign shoppers in Britain. Each spends $725 on average.[/b]

Shannon is a reporter for Bloomberg News in London.

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2012-05-10/britains-surprise-shopaholics-nigerians

https://images.businessweek.com/cms/2012-05-10/comp_nigerians20__01__630x420.jpg

Princek12: Can you read? I have gave you a reason why Americans do not shop in the U.K. I also gave you a reason why Nigerians outshop Americans in the U.K. The article is not talking about spending; it is talking about shopping. Everything is cheap in America. It will be insane to leave America to go and shop in the U.K. Why will I leave America to buy Dell, Ipad, HP, Iphone, etc when they are cheap in America. Even mobile phones are free or heavily discounted in America when you sign a contract with your mobile phone company.

You obviously have never been to America, so you won't get it. You have never lived in America.

Your thinking is funny. I'm appalled at your worship towards a country you contributed nothing towards its development and you act like its yours. FYI, I schooled in the US and I'm frequent there.
You gave me a reason why Americans do not shop in the UK, but the report says Americans are number 6 on the list with Nigerians at number 4. That says Americans shop in the UK, just not as much as Nigerians. Also, China is number 1 on the list. Everything in America is made in China and much cheaper too, so why are the Chinese still outspending the Americans. Middle Easterners have some of the craziest malls in the world with all the goods you can get in the UK, yet they are number 3 on the list.
Any reasonable person would see that the list is representative of excessive disposable income amongst the nouveaux riche countries. The order makes it even more obvious. China, Russia, Middle East, Nigeria. Look up the world's fastest growing economies and you'll educate yourself a bit.
Its more about character. If you are newly exposed to wealth, you tend to have a more flippant hand. Its that simple.
And by the way, the electronics you mentioned are as cheap in Nigeria as they are in the UK or at worse just a minuscule difference.

Princek12: Some people just don't think. If you have ever been to America, you will know that there is no reason to shop in the U.K., as most things in America are cheaper than the U.K. In addition, most things in America (and even in the U.K.) are either owned by American companies (Apple products, laptops, Dell, HP, Ipad, etc) and therefore there is no reason to buy such things in the U.K. Most Americans go to U.K. just for vacation and to sight see.

Moreover, U.K.'s voltage is 220 while America's 110, so you already know that Americans won't buy most electronics in the U.K. Clothes in America are extremely cheaper than the U.K. And as a Nigerian who lives in America, I feel sorry for Brits who have to pay expensive prices for everything. Nigerians who usually frequent U.K. to shop usually the ones who have ties to the U.K., cannot get an American visa, or a combination thereof. [/b]Any person who wants a bargain knows that it is cheaper to shop for, for example, clothes and electronics and cars in America. Most of the imported Tokunbo cars to Nigeria (and even brand new ones) are imported from America.

In sum, [b]Americans have an economy in which they can buy almost anything they want for a bargain, both online and in-store and have no reason to buy anything in the U.K. Americans also know that products in the U.K. are quadruple the price in America. Nigerians cannot buy anything imported in Nigeria for a bargain, and it is still cheaper for them to buy it in the U.K. But any Nigerian who has shopped in America knows that it is way cheaper to buy things in America than the U.K., especially clothes and mobile electronics, most of which are made by American companies anyway. So for an American to leave the shores of America to shop in the U.K, hell nah! I am a Nigerian living in America, and I will never buy anything in the U.K. Even food is expensive in the U.K. Go to McDonalds and they want to charge you for ketchup and napkins.

Pathetic conclusion. If that were the case, how come they are 6th on the list of countries?? Since they can purchase whatever they want in America, then they should be amongst the least spenders in UK. But no, they still get to spend, but just not as much as Nigerians do. And you know why, because Americans are a sucker for cheapos and ridiculous discounts!! The earlier you get it in that Americans are not superhuman, the better for you!! I've lived in America and I see no reason why you would go all out to defend America in this case as if the facts or wrong. Nigerians outspent Americans, period!!

Many Nigerians have a pathetically negative mentality!!

Nigeria is the 3rd fastest growing economy in the world!! No, no, no! How can that be? GEJ is too clueless.

Nigerians out-shop Americans in the UK by 32%. No, no no, how can that be! We are too poor to shop.

Nigerians are the 3rd biggest spenders in the UK. Never, never. Not with all the poverty going on in that country.

Malls are springing up in Nigeria. Its a lie. Is it only the thieving politicians that would shop there??

Nigeria projected to be the fastest growing construction market. How can?? With all the slums I see everywhere?

Nigerians are the happiest people. The report is fake. Nigerians are poor. No no, never never.Bla, Bla, Bla!!

Haba people!! Why all the negativity. The world is saying Nigerians are getting more bouyant by the day and by any calculation, its a huge fact. Use any economic indices to measure and you'll find that we have a burgeoning middle class with increasing disposable income. To put things in perspective, even if its only 10% of Nigerians that could be termed affluent, that would amount to 17 Million people- A huge population by any measure. If that were country in Europe we would be the 8th Largest country out of 47. Almost the same size as Sweden, Norway and Denmark combined.

What we should be discussing is how to take advantage of the massive opportunities these facts present. How can I as an entrepreneur improve the Nigerian retail environment? How can I take position in the travel industry, since lots of fellows are travelling? How can I offer improved services in Cargo delivery? What products and services can I create to dispose the affluent folks of their increasing disposable income. When we start asking these questions and in turn create solutions we would by so doing grow our economy and create new jobs. The responsibility belongs to all of us, not just the Government.


One big secret: Investment in improved retail services is the biggest opportunity existing in Nigeria today. Anybody that would take advantage is in for some serious money!!

[quote author=ekt_bear]Sigh...I assumed too much I guess.

The point of that picture I posted is that "more should be better" is not always the best strategy. That one can argue for a common region of 40 million (say the point (0,4) on my plot) doesn't mean that 160 million is an improvement (the point (1,3)).

Increasing doesn't necessarily lead to better results...[/quote]On point!!!

Kobojunkie: It is really sad that more than 50 years into the mess we have created, there are still so many people out there who cannot see past the party politicians whose arses their faces are stuck on.

We are talking of using of very limited resources available to a state with a population well over a million, in such a way that at least half of the very poor citizens(many of whom cannot even afford cars to play any tarred roads that may exists)benefit, some are posting pictures of cracks in the roads and SHINY tar roads as achievements. The last administration spent billions on fixing roads, And 2 years after, the new Governor is still spending Bilions of state money on road construction. Is that all infrastructure that the state needs?

For once, I sooo agree with you. There is much more to development than just building roads.

[quote author=tayo_tee]Nice one.... but do some of this "shops" use self checkout machines ?[/quote]Why does anyone need that!! Abeg we need the jobs that come with such development.

Nice. Funnily there many other malls nearing construction currently especially in Lagos, Abuja and South South where oil money has bred a massive middle class.

yinkhar: Dnt mind the liars,was he there in 2006,2008,2010?mayb his ghost did I then and as for rossikk,where is that in unad?will u pls take me there tommorow?let's say the truth he's nt working.am not a supporter of any party,let's call a spade a spade

Thank you. What we want is development not party this, party that. Most of the people in ACN today were all once PDP members. Give me a Donald Duke in PDP anyday and I will take him over the nepotistic Tinubu in ACN who has chosen to own every project in Lagos from the Eko Atlantic City to Oriental Hotel to the new Ikeja Mall to the First Nation Airline et al. Things he would never have had if he didn't have access to the treasury of lagos state.

So Gbawe, two years out of a Governor's existence have passed and the pictures you have in those links are proof of performance?? I cry!!
Two years is half a Governor's tenure for crying out loud!! With these pictures in defence of Fayemi, you have totally lost your moral validation on critiquing Jonathan's performance in anyway!!
Go to Edo state and see Oshiomole's works!. Go to Akpabio's Akwa Ibom and see his good works. Even Chime's Enugu with very minuscule FG allocation did so much in a short while. If after two year in office we have no pictures of commissioned projects, then I sympathize with Ekiti.

I'm embarrased at what you've termed "huge construction site". I always knew ACN's reputation ended with Fashola and Oshiomaole and that as soon as more entrants join them, the true colors would begin to appear.It wasn't about the party, it was about the persons. Fashola and Oshiomole have great capacity and their performance has nothing to do with the party they belong in the same way the performance of Donald Duke, Amaechi, Akpabio, Chime and the likes have nothing to do with the party they belong in.

So please stop all these partisanship. Don't come here to talk about "huge construction site" and show us works even a LGA chairman would be ashamed of.

Gbawe: I think this is a fluid demonstration of how diasporan Nigerians egotistically ruin threads with diversionary and , frankly, unhelpful talk. If you people don't live in Nigeria, don't you visit enough to know why, very obviously, some can get very excited at the thought of vastly improved motorable roads? Do you guys appreciate what is on ground currently , as first hand users, to be able to put issues in perspective? You guys should get over yourselves and stop talking about caviar to a man who cannot even afford bread.

We should be looking at this issue purely from the perspective of how planned works will improve transport in Ekiti State vis-a-vis an agenda of overall development. All I see here is just pompous pontifications from folks far removed from the hell Nigeria to the extent they don't appreciate what substantial development of road infrastructure can do for most Nigerian State. The only contribution I have found useful and pertinent here are those that confirm that work is indeed going on. I would also welcome the input of Ekiti folks on the ground who know what the planned work will portend for the amelioration of the transport woes in the State.

Go away!! You brought out a thread screaming "huge construction site" and you didn't put up a single picture. I told you "we" would not read it. So "we" didn't read it. Sowee, "we" have taken over the thread and "we" are discussing more important issues that cut across party lines. ACN this, ACN that! What we want is development whether it is from ACN or the republican party, we want development. So go away with your partisanship!

^^^^
You are right sha.
I only just tried to prove the correlation between geography and industrialization.

Well, as long as we continue to depend 100% on Federal allocaton for everything, then we should be contented with being unproductive and poor. I was miffed by your reference to geography as a barrier to industrialization in Ekiti. Do you really believe that?

Look at the map below. That is China with all its major cities. They are all clustered around the coast.
Coastal areas tend to favor investments more than the hinterland. 80% of the world's top cities are coastal. Mention all the major cities in U.S, you'll find that geography is a major determining factor in industrailization.

Industries becomes more expensive as they move further than down the coast. Industrialization means more than just manufacturing. You would need to have a very reliable logistic base to have effective industrialization. For Instance, You can't build an effective Free Trade zone in the hinterland.


https://www.mychinatours.com/image/new/map/china-city-map.jpg

Nice effort Bro. I like the enthusiasm. But have mercy, if that is Ekiti state, then wooooow!! Whoever ruled that state in the past was mean!
These pictures have harmed my impressions of the State of Ekiti. Very rural!!
And after almost 2 years in office, this is all Fayemi has to show?? Naaaaah!! Not good!! Not Good!!

Aigbofa: You talk as if these things are ordained by God and cannot be changed. The amount of money wasted on corruption, even in poor states like Ekiti is enough for any serious government to transform their states and built the necessary infrastructures to support businesses and development. If other countries are getting serious and lifting their poeple out of poverty, why are we always finding one reason and another to remain the same!

We would remain in the same place if we keep being emotional about issues. Even if corruption stops abruptly today, Ekiti doesn't have enough money to build adequate infrastructure. A simple rail project would consume the entire Ekiti allocation for 2 years! Ekiti has a monthly allocation of about 3 Billion. That is less than Dangote's daily turnover.
The reason other countries are getting results is because they have a practical economy where income is generated through taxes and other innovative methods. Lets build that practical economy first, other things would follow suit.
We need to get practical and focus on areas where we have competitive advatage.

Incase you don't know, Milk(Dairy) built Denmark. From milk, they built a host of other industries. They had to export their excess milk, so a shipping industry was built. They had to package the milk in tins, so an industry was built around aluminium. They developed enzymes, butter, yoghurt, and a host of other more sophisticated industries around milk. Today Denmark exports $2.5 Billion worth of Dairy products yearly. Thats a country of barely 6 million people.

[quote author=ekt_bear]1. First of all, the trend is what is important. I can guarantee you that most of the job growth in those countries has not been in agric. It is a bit silly to say that because 49% of China's current employment is in agriculture, that their best bet would be to focus on that. Instead, they've been focusing on something else since the 90s..

Why don't you pull up the statistics for what fraction of employment those sectors contributed to China's economy in 1990 versus today. Why not also display growth across sectors as well...that tells the direction of growth rather than your snapshot.

2. OK, so you want agribusiness, not agric. You want "the entire value chain." Of the part of the value chain you mentioned, the only part which will create lots of jobs is light manufacturing. Now, as you know, it is impossible to manufacture anything at competitive prices w/o access to affordable electricity. So your argument is nonsensical...you are shouting "agric", but the only part which will actually create mass employment is the one that requires electricity, as I said.


3. Services are fine for post-industrial countries like the USA and many European countries. Where labor is extremely expensive. But it absolute folly to advocate that a third world country somehow skip over industrialization into services.

4. Why on earth would you bring up heavy industry? Who in this thread is mentioning it? Look, we don't need to (nor is it realistic) be manufacturing aircraft carriers in Ekiti State tomorrow. However, it is quite realistic for to for example get into textiles. Peanut butter factories. Rice mills. Chocolate factories. Taiwan and Singapore started from relatively low-tech light industry/manufacturing, and we can do the same.[/quote]The interesting ish about the four things you've used as examples(bolded in red) is that they are all Agribusiness or related if you like. Now, if you don't farm these things you've mentioned, then you will have to be buying raw materials for these(you don't even have a port) and that effectively knocks out any comparative advantage you sought. Your products would be more expensive than those from Ghana so your factories would close down in a second. Practicalities,Practicalities, Practicalities. Focus today on AgriBusiness, in the middle term on Light Manufacturing and Support Services, provide basic infrastructure, develop local entreprenuership and prime them for regional expansion, before thinking about industrialization.
With globalization, you really can't compete with unestablished guys talkless of the well established guys!


But I get your point though!! If you want people to work, you must have factories and to have factories, electricity is essential.

[quote author=ekt_bear]Ah. So the point is, we don't need them to build a power plant in Ekiti State. We just lay wire to the closest plant in a nearby state and purchase electricity from them.



Agriculture is the largest employer of labor in the third world, yes. But presumably people want to do more than subsistence farming, like their ancestors did

In industrialized and industrializing societies, agriculture [/b]employs a miniscule fraction of the work force. I doubt if even 0.1% of the US's population is involved in [b]agriculture [/b]directly..it is some tiny fraction.

More to the point, agric at a non-subsistence level doesn't create many jobs. So if Ekiti's goal is to create employment ([b]quality employment I should perhaps clarify, not subsistence farming), agric is not the path towards that objective.[/quote]There was a reason I used the word AgriBusiness as against Agriculture. They are two very different things. Agribusiness covers the entire value chain and is actually a very good way to improve light manufacturing. Agribusiness covers research, farming, leasing, supply chain management, light manufacturing and a host of other element.
Just to put things in perspective , let me give you employment figures by sector in countries we should aspire to emulate;
China: Agric-49%,Industry-22%, Services-29%
Brazil: Agric-20% Industry-22%, Services-66%
Turkey: Agric: 35%,Industry-22% Services-41%
India: Agric: 60%, Industry-17%, Services-23%.

Interestingly, even in the most developed countries, it is the services that carries the day and not industry. Industrialization is good, but as it stands today, we don't have comparative advantage. For light manufacturing, maybe yes. For big time industry we need know-how and we need steel and a developed petrochemical sector. Without these three factors, there is no possibility of industrialization. It would only remain a tall dream.

[quote author=ekt_bear]Agribusiness doesn't create enough jobs. So it isn't going to be very helpful.

Ekiti doesn't need to create its own electricity infrastructure...that is a task for the private sector.

Assuming that:
a) electricity is in place at prices not much more above that of competitors
b) transportation to the coast and within Nigeria is improved,

then the lower labor costs will give enough of an advantage, at least within the West Africa subsector.

It isn't hard to beat even China if (a) and (b) are in place, at least in certain sectors. Their costs are rapidly rising, mine would be rising less rapidly..

Anyway, agribusiness is a pretty poor answer for the issues at hand.[/quote]You've just painted a fatalistic situation because all the things you've mentioned- electricity and transportation aren't in the control capacity of Ekiti as a state. Investors always seeks areas with best ROI. Investors would rather build power stations in Lagos state for proximity to markets and in the Niger Delta for proximity to Gas. Its only when these areas have experienced saturation that investors would start thinking of areas like Ekiti. It is the reality. The cost of building electricity infrastructure is enormous, hence unless there is adequate economic incentive, no investor would expend a dime building power stations in Ekiti. The state Government on the other hand doesn't have the financila capacity to make that happen.

About transportation to the coast, that's under the purview of the Feds. So if the PDP led Govt in Abuja keeps messing up, then be sure that Ekiti is making no progress. Which makes the case a fatalistic one because none of the recommendations you've made are within the control of Ekiti as a State. So if you want something Ekiti has leverage over, Agribusiness is about the only option. And by the way, the two largest employers of labour in most societies are Agriculture and construction upon which you can build a viable services industry.

[quote author=ekt_bear]Agribusiness is not the way forward, if your goal is to have low unemployment.

Electricity and then industrialization are the ingredients necessary for that.[/quote]Totally disagree! Before you take on any developmental path, you must decide what comparative advantages you have. Electricity?? Ekiti would not have the money in decades to build its own electricity infrastructure such that can support industrialization.
Industrialization?? Have any idea who your competition is? We are talking China, Turkey Brazil and the likes. As it stands today, Ekiti doesn't even have a head-start in Nigeria, talkless Africa and the the globe. Industrialization is almost impossible in the next two decades. The nomenclature of the globe today doesn't support an argument for industrialization of Ekiti State in a while to come.
Industrialization is supported by Geography, Human Resources, Finance, support industries and a host of the factors
Lets focus on more realistic areas where we have reasonable competitive advantage. Thats why I mentioned AgriBusiness. Kilode mentioned Support Services and I think thats very much in order.
Does that mean we should ignore industralization? No, but it shouldn't be a priority because the geography, human capital and infrastructure and finance are non existent.

[quote author=Kilode?!]At this stage? with the poor infrastructure? I don't think tourism can help them. Infrastructures such as road, Water and Electricity together constitute the life blood of businesses like that.

Yes. Agribusiness can help Ekiti in the medium term. On the long run, I think Ekiti Private business sector will have to take a good look at services too. Tech support services, Education support businesses, [/b]but still, capital investments in infrastructure is key to these things.

This is another reason why [b]states with close proximity to Lagos need that SW regional agenda to work and help jump-start their development. Lagos is probably Africa's 4th Largest Economy as a standalone country, Huge market for businesses, agric produce and services originating from states like Ekiti for example.




I wonder why Fayemi has not hired you for his PR job [/quote]Very very apt. I believe strongly that regional integration would do a lot of good. The current trend that sees Lagos sapping all the economic activities and investments that should have been spread across the region would be reversed. Every area would focus on its comparative advantage and harness the resources of the common pool for its development. I so believe that Regional Intergration is about the only way forward for this country right now.
You asked in another thread why Oga GEJ hasn't made any move to push the regional thingy- my answer- the small thing he has done by simply defying the so called zoning formula has resulted in bombs from the previous owners of Nigeria, so you can imagine what would happen if he makes any attempt to officially regionalize Nigeria. Remember, there is something called "doctrines of settled issues" Babangida said we should never attempt to touch those issues.

Back to topic, there really isn't enough money for a state like Ekiti to develop adequate infrastructure. It has to look for innovative ways to attract capital if it must engage in any form of development. I think the answer lies in this question, if a single person like Dangote can amass wealth running in tens of billions of dollars, what stops a state with all its resources from doing same. Until states start thinking like businesses, we would remain where we are in a while to come.

PR job? Naaah. Ado Ekiti can't pay na!! They don't have oil money!!

Gbawe: My friend, the article is on the official website of Ekiti State. You are just showing ignorance if you do not know that even in the West no Government department is obligated to supply any pictures to anyone. They will however provide regular updates of work being done .

This is , for example, why you won't find any pictures of the superb drainage project carried out in the Bode-Thomas-Eric-Moore axis of Lagos by Julius Berger recently. Of course fellow haters like you came here to say Fashola [/b]is a "liar" who has not carried out one single drainage project in Lagos till I supplied my own personal pictures to prove otherwise. Djustice, a known hater of [b]Fashola [/b]who claimed the [b]Lagos Governor was just "chopping", was stunned . See the pictures yourself and trawl the net to see if you can find them anywhere else proving my point that no one is obligated to supply pictures to prove anything to mischief makers like you. The drainage is built for me as a [b]Lagosian [/b]living in that area. I therefore don't need any silly pictures when I have my eyes same as Ekiti folks lose nothing over your biased cynicism:

https://www.nairaland.com/826649/what-big-deal-about-fashola/1

What has Fashola got to do with Fayemi or Ekiti State? Fashola is Fashola and Fayemi is Fayemi. The fact that they are both of ACN doesn't in anyway make Fashola and Fayemi the same, neither does it make Lagos and Ekiti the same.
Lari03 has provided a pretty embarrassing set of pictures that serve only to do damage to your article. So if you have better pictures to support your article I would gladly erase the assumption I already have that this is just another attempt, albeit unprofessionally, at misinforming the very gullible public!!




In Nigeria, the style is to make vague allusions to work carried out. Administrators never mention specific names because , even if not obvious to you, the silly example you give of proliferation of smartphones makes you look very dull. If SW PDP can resort to wild fabrication and outright lies, would the ACN not be playing into their hands mentioning actual roads if indeed there is no construction going on and everything is a "big fat lie" as you conclude? Oni, smarting from Fayemi ousting him, and lying through his teeth daily will miss the chance to mobilise a camera crew to ridicule Fayemi? You are not very smart.

In any case, why is it that you guys not from the SW are keen to ruin every thread with your silly demand for pictures these days? Why don't you let indigenes speak before you open your mouth to begin yapping nonsensically? It works both ways because if you live in Ekiti you can simply go to many of the sites and prove no work is ongoing. If you don't feel obligated to do that in proving your case why , inversely, should the onus fall on anyone to provide you with pictures when, ultimately, you don't matter at all since you are not from Ekiti State?

Go and check Fayemi's history to see he is no conman like many of your political heroes. Anyway, we have heard you. Can you now go and face your own issues abeg. They are talking of roads and you are showing an elevated picture of a town. What confirms your mischief, driven by bias, more than that?

http://ekitistate.gov.ng/2012/05/fayemi-turning-ekiti-into-huge-construction-site/

What has Fashola got to do with Fayemi or Ekiti State? Fashola is Fashola and Fayemi is Fayemi. The fact that they are both of ACN doesn't in anyway make Fashola and Fayemi the same, neither does it make Lagos and Ekiti the same.
Lari03 has provided a pretty embarrassing set of pictures that serve only to do damage to your article. So if you have better pictures to support your article I would gladly erase the assumption I already have that this is just another attempt, albeit unprofessionally, at misinforming the very gullible public!!