₦airaland Forum

agaugust:
[color=#000099]

a) Proforce ARA MRAP under construction - only a computer model
b) DICON tracked 4K 4FA APC - you dont make that
c) DICON tracked self propelled 81mm Mortar carrier - you dont make that
d) DICON sniper rifle - you dont make that
e) DICON 12.7mm BMG heavy machine gun - you dont make that
f) DICON 9mm Beretta pistol - you dont make that
g) Proforce Leopard LAV - only a computer model
h) NACE Igirigi IFV 23mm x 2 cannon - you dont make that
i) Proforce PF 2 APV - wtf??
j) Proforce HCMPAV heavy troop carrier - only a computer model
k) DICON FN General purpose machine gun 5.56mm - you dont make that
l) DICON FN FAL - you dont make that
m) AFIT NAF Frawa light aircraft under development - we have a medium aircraft under development
n) NAF bömb disposal robot - a childs design
o) NN Dockyard Andoni class MPV - So what? We built the drakensburg
.

And, we still win:

1. Nigerian made MRAP under development.
2. Nigerian made artillery
3. Nigerian made SPG
4. Nigerian made MRLS
5. Nigerian made AFV with gun of 76mm or above
6. Nigerian made IFV
7. Nigerian made APC
8. Nigerian made Attack helicopter
9. Nigerian made helicopter
10.Nigerian made SAM
11. Nigerian made AAM
12 Nigerian made ASM
13 Nigerian made PGM (glide)
14 Nigerian made harkill system
15 Nigerian made Fire Controll System (Tank)
16 Nigerian made HMD
17 Nigerian made 30mm cannon
18 Nigerian made 35mm cannon
19 Nigerian made 12.5mm RCS
20 Nigerian made Artillery observation system
21. Nigerian made armed drone
22. Nigerian made Data-Link
23. Nigerian made Combat managment system
24. Nigerian made BLUEFOR tracker
25. Nigerian made 20mm sniper rifle
26. Nigerian made AGL (40mm)
27. Nigerian made MGL (40mm)
28. Nigerian made light tactical vehicle (armored)
29. Nigerian made light tactical vehicle (heavy)
30. Nigerian made pistol
31. Nigerian made SMG
32. Nigerian made general purpose machine gun
33. Rifle grenades
34. Nigerian made AT (unguided)
35. Nigerian made military trucks
36. Nigerian made mine clearance vehicle
37. Nigerian made LOCATS[

africaken:
does it matter the mags or the bullets one can carry !

Yes, very much

africaken:
are this the same mercenaries who have faired very badly in yemen !

Executive Outcomes aka Saracen Group aka STTEP

Not involved in Yemen... thats Blackwater aka Academi

agaugust:
Dummy, it there two different drones. The proforce REMOEYE is not a man portable infantry drone, its a normal MALE UAV.

The drone in the air force and pesidents photo is ICHOKU drone built by Nigerian airforce engineers like the Gulma. The Ichoku is an infantry man portable UAV 100% made in Nigeria by our soldiers NOT a private company you dummy !

Now show us South African made infantry man portable drone for battlefield surveillance.....we bëat you again...8 points now, 8 defense equipment Nigeria produces but South Africa does NOT produce....LOL
.

I will

When you prove you have built it

agaugust:
Nigerian navy has confirmed for 2016

1. New incoming guided missile fast attack crafts, 2 to 4 vessels

Those are the old ones under re-fit

agaugust:
[s]
South Africa does NOT produce army infantry man portable drones, Nigeria makes them and its called ICHOKU drone for battlefield surveillance and targeting

Show us your own SA made man portable drone like our Ichoku UAV that is launched by one infantry man for battlefield operations....show us your own now !!!!

www.nairaland.com/attachments/3347224_2477490474jpeg4a43f0feae6e226d14dae7d7778f8066_jpege1a58a6ec993d834a9c25df24321036e[/s]

Stop talking to us about korean drones

agaugust:
[s]Bwahahaha.....you have lost man.

REMOEYE is likely a joint project between a Korea company and Nigerian Proforce. Both companies have the right to print the company names on the drone. However, REMOEYE UAV will be produced by Proforce in Nigeria.[/s]

No proof to back your claims.

REMOEYE is Korean, end of story

agaugust:
South Africans are cheating, A-Darter is proudly made in Brazil


Bwaahahaha...

.

Citation please

Also - you just got busted with your Korean drone

agaugust:
[s]Lies !!! Lies !!! Lies !!!

South Africa does NOT make aircraft rocket pods, infantry portable drones, armoured IPV, etc. Nigeria produces them aplenty.

LOL....South African school girls produce satellite? Why did South Africa go import satellite from Russia then ? Fool !

Did you read your source? What is the size of that school girls satellite? Your report says it was NOT launched into space, it was launched into the sky and had no rocket, LOL....it was carried by a balloon, does balloon launch satellite into space orbit ? Zulu-Bantu fool !

I think we have shocked you guys so much with Nigeria's own defence products which are exactly the ones South Africa dos NOT produce....so shocked that you guys have your brains disoriented....
.[/s]

You asked he provided

Dont try to argue technicalities now.

agaugust:
1. Show us South African made AIRCRAFT ROCKET POD

2. Show us South African made FOLDING FIN AIR TO GROUND ROCKET

3.Show us South African made INFANTRY PORTABLE UAV/DRONE

4.Show us South African made SPY BALLOON

6. Show us South African made ARMOURED FAST PATROL BOAT

7. Show us South African made 32 TROOP PLATOON CARRIER ARMOURED VEHICLE

8.Show us South African made SPACE SATELLITE

Each country produces what it needs or wants to produce at home, ALL countries import the rest
.

1. Why? We make more advanced stuff.

2. Why? We make more advanced stuff.

3. Show us a Nigerian made one

4. Show us a Nigerian made one.

5. T-Craft

6. Why? We make IFVs, MRAPs, APCs etc... why would we make something no one wants and no one uses.

7. We have made 2 jackass


Now show us:

1. Nigerian made MRAP
2. Nigerian made artillery
3. Nigerian made SPG
4. Nigerian made MRLS
5. Nigerian made AFV with gun of 76mm or above
6. Nigerian made IFV
7. Nigerian made APC
8. Nigerian made Attack helicopter
9. Nigerian made helicopter
10.Nigerian made SAM
11. Nigerian made AAM
12 Nigerian made ASM
13 Nigerian made PGM (glide)
14 Nigerian made harkill system
15 Nigerian made Fire Controll System (Tank)
16 Nigerian made HMD
17 Nigerian made 30mm cannon
18 Nigerian made 35mm cannon
19 Nigerian made 12.5mm RCS
20 Nigerian made Artillery observation system
21. Nigerian made armed drone
22. Nigerian made Data-Link
23. Nigerian made Combat managment system
24. Nigerian made BLUEFOR tracker
25. Nigerian made 20mm sniper rifle
26. Nigerian made AGL (40mm)
27. Nigerian made MGL (40mm)
28. Nigerian made light tactical vehicle (armored)
29. Nigerian made light tactical vehicle (heavy)
30. Nigerian made pistol
31. Nigerian made SMG
32. Nigerian made general purpose machine gun
33. Rifle grenades
34. Nigerian made AT (unguided)
35. Nigerian made military trucks
36. Nigerian made mine clearance vehicle
37. Nigerian made LOCATS[

Yeah, we win, every single day of the week

agaugust:
Yes, seriously.

So we can make guided missiles, advanced artillery, MRAPs, periscopes, Rooikats, Tanks, Attack Helicopters and Data links

But we cannot make a rocket pod?

Is this what you consider state of the art? Something that has been around since WW2?

agaugust:
[s]
Hey liar, we all know apartheid era SADF special forces when we see them, old retired FN-FAL rifles and NO body armour protection.....1970s vintage white man special forces.

Show us current Zulu Bantu special forces IN A BATTLEFIELD FIGHTING REAL WAR like Nigerian SF, not your hoywood demo photos[/s]
.

They still use them for selection and training purposes


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eFU_r_H_gg

Our SF have operated in: Angola, Lesotho, Burundi, DRC Congo, Haiti, Liberia, CAR

agaugust:
And your army is so useless it CANNOT defeat Rhino poachers and CANNOT secure your own homeland borders from invading gunmen, robbers, assasins, weapons smugglers, etc in a modern day 2016, your army CANNOT defeat the simplest threats in your own backyard.....and your army is so useless that Tanzania had to command SANDF in battle in Congo DRC.

Shame !!!!

1. Consult the 80 000 illigals captured in 6 months, or the 500 Mozambiqueans killed in Kruger

2. And the UN was so impressed with us they gave us command of the whole of MONUSCO

agaugust:
SAAF uses unguided rocket pods on your Rooivalk helicopter and Oryx helicopter....You have NOT moved beyond rocket pods....you still import them from Belgium, but Nigeria manufactures them and we will export to you if you have money to pay
.

We used to build them and stopped building them because only the Rooivalk uses rockets.

Our jets have moved into the era of PGMs

agaugust:
1. Nigerian navy does NOT have any made in South Africa vessel. You sold an unarmed boat to a private commercial company.

2. South Africa does NOT produce armoured sea IPV , Nigeria makes them at Proforce and other companies.

We beäting you on another defence product
.

1. Paramount group sold some

2. Paramount group makes them

agaugust:
Nope.

Guided missiles can be jammed by counter measures or deceived by decoys and chaff.

Rocket pods CANNOT be jammed, stopped, or deceived by anything....and Nigeria produces this unstoppable rocket pods.

We beät yöu on this one, and its hurting every South African
.

Guided missiles are harder to make dumbass

Follow the argument

agaugust:
Of what? Your A-Darter missle that Brazil built for you after DENEL got stuck for 5 years unable to do it because you lack such level of missile technology?

Jealous of what?/A country that CANNOT produce rocket pods for its air force?

Bullshïït !!!

Citations needed

MikeCZAR:
Yes, I meant tracking every soldier with the Impi device.

Meaning every soldier will appear on the Chaka C2, enhancing control.

But also putting huuuge pressure on the network

Henry240:
Plate carriers it is, for any mission. A combat bulletproof vests fits in seamlessly with any mission requirement.

Tell that to these guys

M14A1:
lives are worth more than 8kg. You already saddled up with 40kg, 8kg don't bite much.

And as we said, lives are saved through mobility and speed.

A soldier can only carry only so much ~ about 50kg. This weight has been standard since Roman Times.

8kg ammounts to 12% of what he can carry.

We choose to use that 8kg for other more important things.

Anyway, the debate started about tactical vests that can be seperated from BPV's - so lets not lose sight of that

M14A1:
As much as he weighs.

Thats a medical bag, essential

M14A1:
.

Exactly my point

Notice he has no BPV and i only wearing a tactical vest

Why? Because he has an assload of other stuff to move around so he got rid of the plate-carrier

M14A1:
But really not every man packs that much?

Tacticool
(take of those 9mm, you don't need those, better off with more ammo)

Again, designed for a different environment and doctrine

And yes they do, you have to remember that carrying all the gear you need and being as mobile and light as possible was so essential in the border war that most light and moto inf would leave their helmets back at base.

Again, I am talking about light and moto inf, not mech. Mech Inf wearing BPV's is a given.

I find it ironic that after all this talk of the errors of African militarys copying the West and not developing "African solutions to African problems" everyone is jumping on this... I suspect it is simply because it looks cool

M14A1:
Serious heat, for a patrol

When you dont have CAS on 5 min standby you need to be able to fight your way out of or into anything

M14A1:
Same loadout

Yes, however you can now carry an extra 7kgs of belt/grenades/60mm mortars

M14A1:
How many mags do you carry in your standard chest rigs??

6 + 1

M14A1:
You need more equipments like what?
Standard tacticool vest with plate carrier have molles for attaching shitloads of whatever you need. If it ain't enough get a sturdy backpack.
Train in armor so you can fight in armor, then again. This is just my opinion.

Just watch videos of NATO troops in Afghantistan... the second they actually have to walk around they are lumbering oafs and get tired quickly.

In the bush, speed and concealment provide all the cover you need.

Its a doctrinal thing, if you can give all your men MRAPS and your MRAPS can access the whole theater of operations with ease, and you can saturate the theater of operations so that there is a FOB every 50 km and patrol houses every 10km between and have CAS on 5 min standby across the whole AO, then you can issue plate.

But in the vast distances we are involved in, with limited resources you want mobility above everything.

M14A1:
Your opinion, I respect
Here's mine

I don't wanna track bandits in a bush and make contact, then I realize I'm feeling too delicate and need a plate.

I would rather be without plate than without ammo

M14A1:
Tactical vests vs tactical and plate carrier combo?
Do you guys argue for the fun of it?

I can't seem to understand how a tactical vest without any protection is better than a vest with a plate carrier.

Simple,

Say you are light/moto infantry

Say you are about to go on patrol for 5-6 days (up to 15)

If you drop the plate-carrier you save up to 8 kg's of weight

So, if all 12 guys in your section drop them as well that means you can all carry an extra 96kg of ammo/food/radio batteries etc

It also means you can cover more ground and dont get as hot, so you dont need to drink as much water.

Having someone get shot in a contact is bad, but having your whole section run out of ammo is worse

Like I said, RSA developed our current tactical vest and BPV at the same time. There is a reason that they designed them to be seperated, and that reason lies in experience in the bush wars.

NATO troops operate along a different doctrine and in circumstances that are completely different to what you would see in Africa. Trying to copy them will lead to failure.

BPV's are only essential for mech-inf or units that know they will be fighting in built up areas.

MikeCZAR:
The R4 with a 50 mag is used in the SAW role in the SANDF.

First aid can be carried in the vest. and it is.

And oh you forgot: Blue force tracker down to every infanteer.

Sorry, what I ment is more comprehensive med-aid bags - not just somma a plaster and bandage.

Henry240:
Tactical vests and bulletproof should be a single unit. Not two different items.

That limits versatility.

South Africa introduced the Pat84 and the BPV set-up at the same time... there is a reason they were designed to be separated.

NATO can get away with their heavy cumbersome set-ups because of their doctrine - infantry mobility is not something they place a high value on.

The job of their infantry is to roll around in MRAP/IFV until they hit contact... then dismount, pin the target with fire and bring in CAS or Arty to destroy the target.

If you watch hornets nest or Armadillo, those guys will fly straight into combat and dismount. In the doccie Battle for Marjha, the marines dismounted their helo's less than 10km from the target and they were exhausted by the time they got there.

You simply cannot operate like that all the time in Africa.

BPVs are essential for mech inf only. Light and moto rely on mobility so they need to be able to get rid of the heavy plate vests when they have to go out on 5 or 6 day foot patrols... or because in combat they may have to dismount and cover vast distances on foot

MikeCZAR:
Tactical vests?

He is talking about the PAT84