₦airaland Forum

superior1: I said i understood the direction of your question (I knew you were trying to pin Jude 1:14 to the so called book of Enoch) but have you wondered why the book of Enoch was not canonized?? because the authorship wasn't confirmed (there was many attempt to smuggle many books into the Bible), it was even said that the book of Enoch (which no jewish record show to be from Enoch) actually quoted Jude 1:14 so as to gain acceptance by her author and not Jude quoting it. If i write a book and copied from another book which has been in existence before mine and gave it a name traced to century before the book i copied, it doesn't make the book i copied from the copier.

There are many writings on this position online

So you believed that the bible is God's word because the early church fathers said so?

superior1: I believe in the epistles of Paul and I believe his teachings are fully revealed in the totality of his epistles. I also believe what ever he has written are to be adopted by Christians (He commanded it read to the assembly and in a case to be given to another church). If we deviate to Luther, then we will have to address all the heresy he pointed out in the Roman Catholic Church.

You are still yet to sign the deal i proposed, if you sign it, then why not?

If you believe in his epistle, then you'll believe in 2Thess2:15. There are Oral and written traditions handed down by Paul and the apostles to their own disciples and they were expected to hold on to that as well.

The question I ask you should really make you think, tell me why you think it is the sole authority.

superior1: Galatians 1:8
King James Bible
But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

2 Timothy 3:16
King James Bible
All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Romans 15:4 For everything that was written in the past was written to teach us, so that through the endurance taught in the Scriptures and the encouragement they provide we might have hope.

These are bible passages, what are they meant to show me? I do not dispute them like you do 2Thess2:15.

superior1: Switched opinions already?

Jude 1:14
King James Bible
And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints.

Whereas i perfectly understand the direction of your question, there is no reason to believe this was a quoting from the scriptures but rather a revelation.

You understood the direction of my question and you still claim I've switched opinion. Na wa for you o. Dear brother, in case you do not know, Jude1:14 is a direct quote from 1Enoch1:9 . (but i cant find it in the bible o...yet jude used it to preach).

superior1: This is the truth, ok?.

2Timothy 15-17
…15and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16[b]All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness[/b]; 17[b]so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work.[/b]

Do you agree with Paul or not in 2Thess2:15, or are you going to behave like martin Luther that called the epistle of James "the epistle of straw" just because it contains what contradicts his position?

Remember you still owe me "why do you believe in the bible and not other books as the inspired word of God".

superior1: Where?

You said:

superior1: The Bible is the inspired word of God and basis of doctrine of Christian faith, any teaching outside of it and not found in the bible should be discarded

but the bible said:

2Thess2:15:
"Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

You can spot the contradiction yourself.

superior1: non-biblical books are not recognized as scriptures

Read Jude1:14 bro and tell me if the apostle was quoting, scripture or not.

superior1: The Bible is the inspired word of God and basis of doctrine of Christian faith, any teaching outside of it and not found in the bible should be discarded

This is not only absent from the bible but a direct contradiction to what it says.

superior1: Syncan, we will start repeating our talk all over again. If he said things by word of mouth relevant to doctrine, what are they?, who documented it, at which of the churches?, when was it scriptured? and when was it adopted, was it accepted by the Churches at the east, asia manor, syria, rome like the new testament?

Even if such words existed, they must have a basis in the scripture, somebody cant come with a supposed word of mouth that contradicts what is written, no?

You see my friend, let's not be jittery here. Why use "If he said" when you can read very well that he said. The moment we start being economical with truth, the moment we cannot comprehend freely. So do you believe paul or not? then I can take on the rest issues you raised.

Note that you still have not told me Why the bible and not other books as mentioned.

superior1: True, Christ wrote down nothing and what we have as scriptures today are what the Apostles are inspired to write (plus the old testament). The ministry of Holy Spirit is to direct us in these truths.

Galatians 1:8
New International Version
But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God's curse!


So we know what ever teaching we get must be consistent to what is already revealed and in the scriptures. Paul placed a curse on any gospel which do not confirm with the scriptures.

You keep avoiding the truth, Paul placed a curse on any gospel contrary to what he and the rest disciples were teaching, both in words and epistles. Never only what he wrote!

DrummaBoy: Ok bross. I think I get your drift. With FluorishG and others taking the apology maybe it was Spirit led after all. I apologies for calling this hypocrite.

Cheers.

Oh you do believe it could be spirit led after all? Remember you said it was like what the Catholics do too, so I guess same applies to them. We are too quick to condemn what we do not understand. Humility is a virtue any day,willingness to forgive is its reciprocation,a virtue too.

May divine light guide your path Alex.

'

superior1: Popes do teach Catholics right?, not all teaching are dogma, right? But all Dogma are documented and binding on Catholics, right?.

Scriptures has to be documented to be referred so.

Dear Friend, Every single teaching of Christ is a dogma. What the church does today is to affirm any teaching that the Holy Spirit has revealed as truth beyond doubt.

(Jn16:12-13) I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.
"Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come".

The apostles went about preaching what they've heard or seen, Jesus never wrote down a thing for them, yet all he taught is dogma.

.

superior1: No, you are only trying to make a point for your arguments. Paul's instructions are from God's inspiration and those he wrote are scriptures.

You are getting confused now, Paul's "instructions are from Gods Inspiration and those he wrote are scripture". So what do you propose about those God's Inspiration he taught by word? Trash them?

Lets not forget that you are yet to tell me why you believe the bible as solely Inspired and not the other books I mentioned earlier.

superior1: . There is no doubt he gave direct instruction to many but what we have on record is scripture

So we truncate as waste the rest He taught, right?

superior1: He told Thessalonians to hold to his verbal and written instructions. I said it is the written instructions that became scriptures (look at the definition of what a scripture is again)

And what happens to the verbal?

superior1: The bolded is your additions

That's why it is in bracket, an explanation.

superior1: Really?, but you saw for 'some of the doctrines, teachings there?'.

Jesus said I am the way, truth and life but you said Jesus didnt say I am the only way, the only truth and the only life, abi?

Same Bible told me that there are some that are not written and I should hold on to them as well 2Thess2:15. You said no, only what is written. Now you contradict the Bible.

superior1: Jumping from Gospel and looking for backup in Epistles without a line of reference is a terrible way of interpreting the Bible. The account of Jesus life is adequately represented in the Gospel and whatever is not written there is not part of the scripture.

hehehehe, it is very clear the evangelist witnessed to more, but did not write all, at various times he must have taught more than what he wrote....in words. Hold on to those as well 2Thess2:15.

superior1: The Epistle written to Thessalonians is different from Corinthians and so others, all making and addressing different points. They all represented all Paul's teaching which he received from Jesus Christ. If it is verbal instruction and not written, it is not part of the scriptures.

Yet Paul said we should hold on to it as well, you said no.

Meanwhile: Scripture - any writing that is regarded as sacred by a religious group. (It does not end with the bible by this definition)

superior1: To make it easy on you, i will handle your points one at a time. These is 7 translations of that same verse and you should conclude if that leaves room for other materials for doctrine

New International Version
All Scripture is God-breathed [/b]and [b]is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,

New Living Translation
All Scripture is inspired by God and is useful to teach us what is true and to make us realize what is wrong in our lives. It corrects us when we are wrong and teaches us to do what is right.

English Standard Version
All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,

New American Standard Bible
All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;

King James Bible
All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is [/b]profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Holman Christian Standard Bible
[b]All Scripture is inspired by God [/b]and [b]is profitable for teaching, for rebuking, for correcting, for training in righteousness,

International Standard Version
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness,

scriptures plural of scrip·ture (Noun)
Noun

The sacred writings of Christianity contained in the Bible
The sacred writings of another religion. (wikipedia)

To be part of scriptures
1.It has to be inspired of God
2.It has to be written

I have searched through all you posted, and not even one version said "Only scripture is useful...". To support this it went further to say we should hold on to all that is taught, both written and non written.

superior1: Yes and much more, it says the bible is for doctrine, correction. Meaning when talking of doctrine the bible should be used

The bolded is Your Opinion only, not what it said. There is a difference between "could" and "should"

superior1: Exactly, he didnt mention any thing else apart from the bible, so why should we believe there is more?. You can read more in the following places

You should believe there is more because "And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen" (Jn21:25).

Add this to:

"Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.(2Thess2:15)

superior1: 2 Timothy 4
King James Version (KJV)
4 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;

2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all long suffering and doctrine. (that was the same doctrine he mentioned in 3:16 which should be from the scriptures, why looking for more)

3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

Irrelevant quotes cannot help your case, stick to the issue at hand. "Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

superior1: Which post?

15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

Those traditions has already been taught

Yes some were taught in words and not written, so not everything is written in the bible, the bible said so and not Syncan.

superior1: You have answer that question yourself, the Bible is the inspired word of God.

I answered nothing. How do you know it is the inspired word of God? The Jewish Tanakh also claims to be the word of God and it calls Jesus a false prophet. The quran also claims same and it calls Jesus "one of the messengers" from God. Why did you choose to believe the bible.

superior1: (I love your move, i was expecting it)

2 Timothy 3:16

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

1. That post says that everything in the bible is good for doctrine, correction, etc

2. That post did not say that nothing else is good for doctrine, correction etc.

3. That post says that 2thess2:15 is good for doctrine, correction etc..

4. I asked why bible? and you are answering with what the bible say.

superior1: I said all practice should be from the Bible

Why?

superior1: Whereas you can prove from the bible, how Mary got married to both Holy Spirit and Joseph, how he remain a virgin for life (afterall Jesus dropped from her mouth), how Joseph was just a helper, how Jesus brothers were is cousin

It is you who claimed that all you practice is written in the bible.

Maria-Goretti:
taken....have heard you.

Let him continue making claims he cannot prove. Thanks in advance anyway for the book details.

Maria-Goretti:
its a true life story about a man who was visited by angels......and brought messages from God concerning many happenings in this world. Those messages were actually lifted from the bible and explained thouroughly. That was where I came to know that God knew everything that was going to happen even before he created the world...its a nice one...will love more people to read it.

If you have the full title or the author, do try to post it.

superior1: Your opinion right?

Aha, He is now attaching himself.

Maria-Goretti:
my people ojare, who has read this book: Angels on Earth...?

What is it all about?

superior1: Thanks for coming sir

Seems you've forgotten the title of the thread,this is my home zone.You are the stranger, so have a nice journey back.

superior1: Then this my response to your question too

Then I stay with what I do, you stay with not knowing why I do what I do.

superior1: Did you read my response above atol especially that i gave nnatom??, now read it and get back to me with the deal

You cant make a jest of a question i asked, urging me to keep repeating it and expect me to answer your question just like that, that is not fairness, is it?

I read it and my response is fair enough. If you want to know, then be humble and follow my teaching method.

mamsong9: Interestingly blasphemous!, so ur god has mother? well I wul like to know who is grater, him or his mother?

"Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. (Isaiah7:14)

"For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace". (Isaiah9:6)

She is human, He is both God and human, She bore Him in her womb.

superior1: I was typing when you posted this, look at the response i gave up there, sign the deal and lets look at the Bible together, ok?

Your response does not hold, you asked a question about what i do, so I am the teacher and you are the learner, I should determine how to guide you through it. I want to start from the beginning. If someone ask me to prove with the book of Judaism one thing or the other, why should I be bound to do that?