₦airaland Forum

ikezuora4689:
Me.......... thinking.............. still thinking........am sorry I eat every thing as long as it taste nice.....bt I hate pear

Me, it's a drink...kunu.

Can't stand the stuff....yet up north where I live, I see Northerners, Southerners, maybe even some foreigners drink the stuff like it is some wonder drink.

Then there is palm wine...as a rule I don't touch alcohol...but if i was a drinking man, I won't touch that stuff, it has one funny smell.

Parada:
Did your father pay me to come teach you senseless Igbos what you can google or do I look like punch newspaper or vanguard to you ? Abi crazy de worry you. I should be providing prove to Igbo liar on NL ?!

You are free to believe his lies like many of brainwashed Biafrans. Those that need prove can already see the prove in the comment you quoted but delusional won’t allow you see it just like many other Igbo. Buhari did not pay any subsidy when crude sold for below $40. Prove that he did, only then wil I counter that claim so get to work I don’t waste time digging out prove for Ipob.

CheapHomes:
Some of u lack simple basic manners. An inquiry was made. If u have d answers 2d inquiry, provide it. If u dont, let d issue b. U need 2 grow up&b civil. From d look of things, it was just a simple question that got u so emotional 2d point were u lost control of ur emotions. U need 2do get a hold of urself. Learn 2 control ur emotions.

Gentlemen, if I may...

1.In 2016...landing costs of fuel were N132, fuel prices were below N87 'officially' and oil was selling less than $30 per liter.

2.Bubu and is government had an issue...the issue being that there were no funds for subsidy due to low oil prices (we need oil to be $139 at least before we can run a budget sans debt and loans)

3.So Bubu raised prices to N145, subsidy paymets stopped (except for the debt we had left over from GEJ's regime...which GEj tried to avoid by raising prices to N140 in 2012...but which Nigerians sabotaged by protests which forced it to the N97 and then the N87)

4.The subsidy payments started again when as oil prices increased, landing costs increased , forcing the resumption of subsidies to keep the price at N145 BECAUSE landing costs were now above N150.

5.Subsidy costs only pay for the difference between the landing cost and the pump price. As at now, NNPC imports fuel at N165, and retails it at N145. Govt pays the N20 difference as 'subsidy' or underrecovery'.

6.Under the arrangement...NNPC is not making a profit, and neither are marketers. Government loses money too.

ejimatic:
In their days there would be fuel scarcity now.they would make millions of naira st this time.this they did for 16 years stealing our money making masses poorer. The educated Nigerians like us cannot be deceived. The uneducated Nigerians will not follow them.If umbrella carriers are unrepentant thieves we will use our brooms to clean our rooms always.

Actually marketers were losing money under both the umbrella and the broom

Subsides means that marketers find it diffiuclt to sell fuel in Nigeria and make a profit. Under the subsidy, a marketer would import fuel, and sell it below the price he or she imported it at and the government pays the difference.

And eventually, such practice becomes unsustainable.

That's why there were scarcities, and why sharp rpactices like importing fuel and smuggling it to Benin republic or Niger to sell at the higher prices over there was going on.It was the only way marketers would survive.

What Bubu has done is made NNPC the sole importer of fuel. NNPC imports fuel at N165, sells at N145 per liter to marketers, and government pays NNPC the N20 difference per liter. Meanwhile marketers are expected to sell at N145(some majors like Mobil and Conoil sell at N142)and neither marketers nor NNPC make a profit.

And then there is corruption.

dingbang:
When atiku becomes president, sharp practices will halt to zero

Atiku proposed to reduce fuel price to N90 per liter.

Big mistake for the following reasons....

1.Landing cost of fuel is N165....meanwhile selling it at N90 means government would be PAYING FAR MORE in 'underrecovery costs(n70 per liter) for fuel importaiton to NNPC...and NNPC STILL wont be making a profit. Nor would marketers.

2.Eventually it would become unsustainable, NNPC would run into debts...and long queues would return.

3.And no one would want to build new refineries, and those who build refineries would focus on exporting the fuel/refined products abroad.Because selling in Nigeria means they sell at a massive loss.

And people were laughing at APC's N45 per liter promise.

sirfemoz:
Was subsidy removed or introduced? How's it the cause or solution?

Well...

1.Now...NNPC imports fuel at N165 per liter...and sells at N145 per liter.

2.The subsidy government calls underrecovery....just pays the N20 difference.

3.NNPC thus does not make a net profit. As a result....NNPC cannot build new refineries, nor invest in exisiting ones.(NNPC is a business, not the government bureau itis run as).

4.On subsidy removal...what Bubu did in 2015 was raise the price of fuel from N87 to N145. At the time, landing costs of fuel was N132..so truly subsidy paying stopped (except for the debts left over in subsidy claims from the GEJ government which were high..more on that, and why it was not GEJ's fault)..BUT....when landing costs went above N145 a year later...government had to start paying subsides to avoid a price raise.

5.Still on no 4....what Bubu did was a PARTIAL removal....which is what governments since IBB in 1986 have done.(IBB's partial removal even led to some economic recovery that lasted two years)

6.Under GEJ...in 2012...GEJ raised fuel prices to N140 from N65.At the time, landing costs were N99.

7.Nigerians protested, GEJ reduced it to N97....meanwhile due to high oil prices...landing costs shot up above N100 in 2013...leading to scarcity galore., and the subsidy claims debts, as well as maekters engaging in scams like smuggling and selling fuel on the black market to survive as well as making claims for fuel not imported(That's why blaming GEJ for fuel scarcity is wrong...he tried to solve the problem...Nigerians dont want to pay for fuel).

sirfemoz:
We always fail to ask vital questions, that why government can deceive us easily. What causes the scarcity? What has been done to stop it? We won't ask, instead most of us will be shouting PMB, PDP 16 years.

Subsidy answer man here...
Theme music....!

1.For many years, marketers have been selling fuel at a price below the import price for fuel in the name of subsidy. So, in order to balance their books, they hoard fuel...and sell to black marketers, and smuggle to neighbouring countries, as well as make fradulent subsidy claims too

And they do all that to make sure they don't have to sack workers, and to make profits too.

As at now...under subsidy landing cost is N165, fuel price is N145.NNPC now imports most of the fuel....but loses money as a result. Subsidy payments just pay the extra N20 per liter...they don't let NNPC make a profit.

2.Because NNPC is not making profits, they cannot invest in new refineries, or imporve the old ones.

3.Because fuel is subsidized, investors are not building refineries, because who wants to refine fuel at a cost above N145 and sell at a loss?

4.And speaking of refineries...the last new one (apart from Dangote 1)...was built in 1988. Since then the number of cars and generators in this country has increased . Meaning our needs have increased. Meaning if the refineries were operating at full capacity, we would still NOT BE PRODUCING ENOUGH.

5.Solution is to remove subsidy, and use the billions spent on subsidy for something else. Like railways. Meanwhile prices go up, we pay over N200 for fuel...BUT...investment flows in, more people woould get into the refining business...and things get better.

6.Past governments have been warning us about the problems with subsidy since 1993. The problem is Nigerians prefer the subsidy because they don't want to pay more for fuel. So the problems continue...

greatman247:
I guess what Buhari govt needs to do since they still pay subsidy like GEJ govt then they should go back to N97/ Ltr like during GEJ era, there's no justification for that N145/ Ltr that is been charged now, no justification for it at all. Go back to the old price in 2015 or even lower and continue importing fuel and subsidy until that time that we have working Refinery, period! That is what a sensible government will do, simple.

If Buhari did that

1.They would be spending billions more on subsidy....more money for the scams AND less money for other things like salaries, infrastructture, education, etc.

2.NNPC and the marketers would be running at a loss....and would lose more money.

3.Scarcity would be an ever present in Nigeria.And we would lose investors, since most of them would be selling fuel at a loss. Job losses would hit the roof.

4.Because GEJ kept prices at N97(due to protests)....we ended up with a debt called subsidy claims that we are still paying.

5.In short...things would get worse.

6. We wont be able to build new refineries becauseif we do that..subsidise fuel at N97...they would all be running at a loss. It costs more than N100 to produce one liter of fuel. So, you want someone to build a modular refinery and be losing at least N3 (at most N40-50) PER LITER OF FUEL he or she sells ?


7. NNPC and marketers would be smuggling fuel to neighbouring countries(where fuel sells above N200 per liter) to survive economically. And the black market would flourish.


Venezuela pays a hefty sum in money to keep fuel at N45 per liter in that country. They also have fuel scarcity, long queues, and their petroleum industry is in an even worse state than Nigeria.

There is a reason why GEJ wanted to raise prices to N140 in 2012....and it wasn't because of bad reasoning...


Also, right now we are importing fuel at N165. Redcuing it to N97 would mean a loss of N68 per liter for NNPC.

Zico5:
With what I'm reading here only the ungrateful heart will fail to appreciate GEJ. If increasing the price of fuel to 145 naira could not sustain the price of fuel then kudos should be directed to him for maintaining the price at 87 naira with no complaints from his government. We are all watching Apc, 3 years have gone already and blame game is still on. let's see how far they can go in few months to come

By 2013, the 97Naira price was no longer sustainable. ,as landing costs had jumped up to 100 and above..

Outside Lagos and Abuja, marketers were selling fuel above 100 naira.

And the government was running into debts on subsidy claims, debts we still pay today.

And there was frequent worsening scarcity. In 2014 I must have queued a lot just to keep the old car running


Of course all these problems won't have happened if GEJ had been allowed to raise prices to 140 naira per liter in 2012 as originally planned.

alsudaes1:
What's up with the refineries (and modular refineries)?

1.Refineries owned by NNPC have been in a bad state because they are government owned and have not been productive because subsidies prevent them making a profit.

That.is why.privatizing Nnpc and removing subsidy might help make the refineries much better.

2.Even at full capacity, the refineries cannot sustain all our needs. The last one opened in 1988. Our needs have drastically increased since then

3..We need 4 new big Dangote type refineries as well as dozens of modular refineries to fix the problem

tit:
do you have sense ni?

God bless and good morning.

Parada:
This happens because as an Igbo PDP fraudster your brain as been wired not to believe the truth. How much subsidy did Buhari pay in his first year when crude prices were as low as $30/barrel ? Was subsidy paid or money was being generated ? The answer is why many of you Igbos hate the truth because your soul is sold to the devil n you’d rather make hopelessly foolish comment to disparage the Buhari led government.

Totally uncalled for please.

Don't be a bigot

obaataaokpaewu:
This was because when price of crude oil rises, the under-recovery on product price also rises.

I need someone to educate me on the emboldened, when price of crude oil rose up-to $100+, price of PMS was below #100 but now the price of crude oil is below $100, the price of PMS is #145. And I read that the price of subsidy (under recovery) keeps going up every year/budget. Is it that the current admin is importing more volumes of PMS compared to the previous admin or what? Isn't that an indictment on/of the current Minister of Petroleum?

1.The value of the naira was higher when oil price was $100 because the dollars flowing in were enough to keep the naira well buffered hence the naira value was good.

2.In 2015 the oil price fell, dollars flowing in fell and the value of the naira fell.

3.Yes , our population is growing, and we are still paying subsidy because if it is removed, marketers would raise the price to 250 and above to protect their profit margins and to stay ahead of the price fluctuations.

4.Growing population.means growing needs.


The only solution to the scam is simple. Allow marketers to sell at the price they want. Stop subsidy payments. Stop govt paying subsidy.

But people like you will protest, and the shady subsidies continue

ignant:
Until two weeks ago, these animals adamantly maintained that they are not paying fuel subsidy, rather "under recovery", which they claimed is not subsidy.

Until two weeks ago, Osibanjo in his typical criminal falsehood had always maintained since 2016 that Nigeria had stopped fuel subsidy and that billions had been saved.

This government is paying 200%-250% fuel subsidy for a product that costs 30% less.

The disturbing problem with this criminality is that since 2016, fuel subsidy payments have been done without appraisal, audit and approval by the national assembly via appropriation.

What this simply means is that this government has been spending hundreds of billions on fuel subsidy without statutory approval by the national assembly.

The implication of this criminality would have been alarming to any other nation, but no, Nigeria is just a shameful product of British criminality.

I don't like the APC, but it's opponents too also lie as well.
In 2016, landing cost of fuel was 132 naira. Fuel was 87 naira. Fuel prices were raised to N145.

Also, budgets for subsidies always go before the National Assembly.

ednut1:
But subsidy is a scam na. If diesel is 260 how would PMS be 165. Mr Baru u too dey lie. Since buhari came in private coys (that would provide jobs) have not imported fuel and laid off most of their staff cos of Buhari/NNPC scam subsidy

Because diesel and PMS are two different products with different costs of production.

Diesel has always been more expensive than PMS.

And diesel has been deregulated since 2012.

youngsahito:
repair our refineries and stop giving us subsidy headache...I tire for this govt.

Repairing the refineries won't solve the problem.

The last one was opened in 1988.Since then our needs have increased way beyond the capacity of the refineries to supply them.

And new investors who will build new refineries won't come in because they do not want to sell fuel below the cost of production a la subsidy.

1. Do a stool test. That is the only way to rule out typhoid.Widal test is not accurate...but because it takes 3 days to get a stool result...and we don't have time...

2.You probably don't have typhoid. Typhoid that isn't properly treated will probably leave you dead by 3 weeks...by which time you would be too weak to move around.

3.Malaria...is your enviroment mosquito proof? Any oper gutter, long grasses, open refuse dump around where you live.? Do you use a mosquito net?

4.Do a HIV test, check your blood levels., etc.

5.Eat properly, drink water well well, exercise. Make sure your food hygeine is good.

Should not be hard to follow the money....though it won't have been paid through the banks.

Police should also debrief the friend. Maybe something in his memory should lead to the killers.

I don't like Badeh, he was corrupt...but he did not deserve to be murdered. His murderers must be caught to prevent them from harming other people.

gypsey:
No problems, Jesus drank Beer too.

He turned water into wine, so I think He preferred wine.

chronique:
What does your point 2 under "now" tell you since we're still having same issues as it were when private marketers were importing? Nothing has changed. It means either the same fraud still exists now under nnpc, or it actually never happened under the previous government since we are still having same results.

So, you would support a fuel subsidies removal, with the antecedent incredible price?

Mind you, that is my solution to all the scam issues

abes:
You're ready to do it, maybe you can afford it, do you actually know the consequences, have you heard about something called inflation?
You are a typical self-centred, selfish Nigerian who only thinks about himself alone, sorry the government does not work like that.
Whatever goes up in Nigeria hardly comes down.

Until petrol importation is less than 0%, the real landing cost of petrol will always correlate to the value of dollar to naira no matter the number of your so called investors (your investors will still have to import).

So how do we stop the subsidy scams that everyone complains about?

How do we get more investment in the downstream sector when government is controlling prices making profit making and by extension job creation difficult?

And where do we get the money for new refineries if investors refuse to come since they cannot make money selling fuel at subsidizing prices?

And I am not rich by the way. Just realistic.

And, defending APC, it is the only way people would stop accusing govt of scams.

Plus other West African countries are just as poor as we are, but they pay more for fuel at the pump.

chronique:
What is evident here, is that there are some idiots amongst us who have been compromised and induced with cash or other material gifts, to come spin things around and deceive the public. FG is paying for subsidy of a product that sells at #145/ltr when the same government claimed that a previous government that was paying for subsidy when the same product was selling for #97/ltr, was committing fraud. It's sad to see people try to twist this around and try to defend this. These people are not talking about how a few individuals in this government are the ones who are deciding and appropriating the amount that is being paid as subsidy to marketers. This is something that should naturally go through the senate for approval. But because of the clandestine nature of the fraud involved, they are operating this covertly/codedly. Anybody who defends this nonsense, doesn't mean well for the country. Buhari is a failure and a worse failure when compared to Jonathan.

Understand that the frauds occurring under the previous govt related to

1.Paying for kerosene subsidy when it had been removed completely

2.Marketers making subsidy claims for fuel. Not imported.

Now

1.GEJ anticipated all that happening, which is why he removed subsidies partially on 2012.Nigerians said no.

2.Bubu ended importation by private marketers and imported the stuff via NNPC, thus ending the scam he referred to in 2014. But issues remain.

3.The solution to this problem is government stops setting prices and allows marketers set prices for the fuel they sell.

royalguy123:
thought subsidy of fuel is no more,when baba entered he said subsidy is a way of siphoning govt money,that was why he elected himself PETROLEUM MINISTER!!!! APC CHANGE,!

Yes, the whole subsidies process has a lot of corruption, which is why BUbu routed the whole thing via NNPC to cut the scams previously occurring.

All this scams would end if government removes subsidy completely. But you Nigerians don't want that that.

So the scams continue in the name of cheap fuel.

UncletC:
Subsidy, let them tell us how much subsidy was paid per litre of fuel in l999, 2009, 20l5 and 20l8. ..
give us data on the subsidy regime over past years.
It is appalling for a govt of APC who never believed in subsidy increased fuel price and is allocating more money than the previous govt for subsidy...the last subsidy they said they remove, no impact

We import fuel at 180 per liter.

The last of our refineries was built in the eighties. Our needs have jumped up since then. At full capacity they won't meet every need. And we need more than four new.ones, apart from Dangote refinery

We sell fuel at 145 naira

The 1 billion is to pay NNPC the loss it sustains in selling imported fuel so that you guys don't end up buying fuel at 250 and above.

Either way, better subsidy go so that we can use that 1bn for better things. Like railway

abes:
Are you ready to buy a litre of petrol above N250?

Yes, that's the fact. I am ready to do that though my salary go suffer.

Eventually, with more investment flowing in since there are no price controls, things like new jobs, new facilities etc including new refineries would come into place, and prices will fall.

We did that before with the GSM network. An MTN line used to cost 10000. Now it is less than 100. No price control, more investments, lower prices.

Or. Would you like it if government was the one setting the prices of the things you sell if you had a business?

chronique:
https://www.premiumtimesng.com/business/93664-government-resumes-subsidy-payment-to-petroleum-marketers.html


https://www.vanguardngr.com/2018/12/subsidy-debts-fg-to-pay-oil-marketers-n236bn-next-friday/amp/


Which importers did you say government doesn't pay subsidy to again?

Erm

Your first source is a report about payments when GEJ was in power.

The second report is about the separate issues of debts from the previous administration and the current one pre 2015 before Bubu stopped paying marketers and made NNPC the sole importer.

A debt which would have never been incurred if GEJ plan in 2012 to partially remove subsidy had been allowed to go ahead

PassingShot:
Atiku is an idiot to be playing this politics when he knows the truth.

To those who don't know, this govt, unlike the one before it, doesn't pay any subsidy to importers any longer. The govt invariably provides for the difference between what petrol sells and what it should sell. It's like selling below a profitable selling price. And who gets the payment? It's NNPC and not any marketer.

Yes that's true, but it would be better if we removed subsidies completely, attracting investment, and ending all these mysterious subsidies show

Ideally, one would vote for PDP in the next election, and if they don't do well...vote APC in 2023.

Eventually, the political class would wake up and start doing some real work if they see the people mean business.



OP., by the way, even if Atiku had not informed the USA....North Korea giving us missile tech would have been stopped by the US even without Atiku.

It is sad that the next choice is between corruption and corruption.....ah well, Nigeria needs change, not the sort politicans can bring tho.

1.Subsides may have to go.

2.Taxes have to go up.

3.Gandollars and company have to go to jail

4.Nigeria must diversify

JasonScoolari:
No need for the insult bro. Reno has spoken nothing but the truth.

He has spoken the truth, problem is

1.Gandollars case is different.

2.EFCC does not know where Gandollars kept the money, and even if they knew, they cannot freeze his accounts because

3.Gandollars has that backyard court ruling. And he is immune

In Gandollars case , the guy has probably whisked away the cash to a site beyond government reach.

The sad thing is that the State house of assembly is not willing to impeach him, then there is that backyard court ruling

Different from Union Bank

Well, the truth is, government better pay up, BUT, taking into account oil money is not too much, paying minimum wage means taking another big loan down the line.

Another reason to diversify our economy.

Just like TraderMoni...

Bribery.


And once the election is over...the free things stop.

I blame Nigerians. We are a country of free stuffawoof...not a country of hard working people.