₦airaland Forum

@OP,

Both GuitarLlife and YellowPawPaw have spoken the truth to you out of the reality of the situation. The real-life application of love - sacrificial if need be - humility and foresight concerning the longer-term welfare and harmony of your family. Because your BIL is family - even if not immediate - and who knows what the future holds?

Others have weighed in with useful workarounds to ameliorate the situation, consider these and tailor to suit your particular circumstances. I would only suggest trying to carve out clear times when that space is sacrosanct to you and hubby, ensuring those boundaries are known to all. Your hubby should ensure compliance here.

As to coming to nl to seek counsel; aspirationally, we would that everyone possesses the tools and support to resolve family issues in-house. Wouldn't it be ideal if no one ever had issues or any that they couldn't resolve themselves?

But where that is not the case, nl is a good resource if used correctly. If one can sift and learn. We even have a library of issues for reference.

Someone mentioned the matrimonial bed is "sacred". Really? In which religion, faith or philosophy is that? I for one would be interested to hear.

If you are a Christian, be wise, understand that men are not made for beds and that beds are made for sleeping. It is the act on the bed, not the bed itself. That should be made clear when setting those boundaries I mentioned earlier.

I also mentioned sifting earlier. One must learn to sift out those who willfully or ignorantly exchange the holy for the profane, are appallingly inconsistent in their positions, plain hypocritical, or just posting to project.

I wish you and your family well and a near-term improvement in your circumstances.

TV

bellong: Divorce is not the solution sir. Nobody is irredeemable, it only requires conscious and consistent effort in correcting someone. If you divorce her, how sure are you that you wouldn't end up marrying the same calibre (if not worse) of woman since you failed to figure out that aspect of her during courtship.

If you are sure she is spending all her money on her relatives, why not talk to a respected member of the relative to speak sense to her in making her responsible to her children and some other pertinent issues that deserve her attention.

The above can only be done after exhausting communication option with your wife. Sit her down, make her see where she is deficient and how she can balance between helping her family and taking care of her home front. Most times, the reason why the other party seems not to cooperate is because we normally fail in presenting points in a convincing and appropriate way to the other party. You know and understand your wife, find a way of getting her involve in the discussion and buying into your idea. Sell your conviction to her and do not push it down her throat.

Decent enough advice Bellong, but this doesn't appear to be a question of the wife misunderstanding or failing to appreciate things. As you alluded to in your opening paragraph, it seems to be more character (calibre) related.

They've been married for 8 whole years. A woman born yesterday, married today and with child on the 3rd day would instinctively know her responsibilities towards her children.

Willful neglect of children and a callous disregard for her spouse? I'm not sure a quick sit-down will resolve this one. Doubly hard if as you pointed out he failed to spot this prior, what other deficiencies does he himself have.

Were he is seeing "nagging wife", she may be seeing "weak, unauthoritative" husband! This is about the both of them. It's why I cannot stress the foundations enough.

To make this work, OP will have to make some real changes and set expectations of same from Mrs OP. So communicating not just what he expects from her, but how they could both be better and enhance their family. And yes a third party may have to be involved. Counselling perhaps?

This is a high stakes one if they both can't or will not step up to meet this challenge.

TV

I'm back...I see that my fans haters, jealousiers (and sometimes there is no difference between them )are all eagerly awaiting my comments. Sincerest apologies for not making an appearance late yesterday, I was ever so busy living a real - as opposed to a vicarious - family life, real experiences, that can be shared if I choose too.

So many to respond to so many to answer. So I'll free form.

I've been a lander for a while now, longer than most. I know of only a few that have been here longer, even more so if I limit it to my two regular stomping grounds, initially religion, but now mostly family.

It's hard not to build up "profiles" of posters, based either on what the reveal about themselves or the positions they take. Again, especially when this is concentrated, think 80/20, not everyone is equally prominent or prolific.

Further, like I suspect others do, I read more than I post and oft times follow threads without posting. A good example would be Serubawon' thread. I followed it from day one. I had concerns but Analytical and others were advising and I was sure they'd be sound counsel outside nl.

So following with a bit of reasoning and modicum of discernment brings insight. And of course some facts are clearly stated. Indeed, it's not that much harder to suss out people that are evasive, avoid certain topics, always adopt certain approaches or positions and studiously refuse to disclose anything. It only takes one post to gain insight.

So far example a few days ago Uju - whom I have never spoken to but am very much aware of - was pilloried shamelessly due to a personal fact she revealed a while back. Which I clearly remember. Later she actively discouraged a relationship between a sibling and a Yoruba boy, so the reasons for some of her comments - appropriate or not - are clear.

But there is nothing new here. There are 2 "older" Ujus who have dropped that exact same fact - one case in which I can even remember the name of the guy one of them dated.Indeed, the argy-bargy there is an exact replica of a feud that happened in earlier times. Is there anything new on nl?

Would I ever bring that up? not at all - and I regularly cross swords with one of them. But does that mean I won't refer to things I remember from peoples posting histories? If it's relevant to a serious point, you can bet on it. A more pertinent observation is the responses, especially by those close to the warring parties.

You see there is a lot of inconsistency here, particularly amongst the female posters, but again it's instructive. It's quite obvious that some of the women here place alliances ahead of truth and would rather be partisan than factual. It often leads to inconsistencies in their positions. It resulted in the whole cabal thing, which I watched with some amusement and it is still very much present today - albeit more fractured, but probably further reaching.

The men - and I speak for myself here - tend to be more stand alone and hold positions more consistently. I do need anyone to ride shotgun. I don't instinctively "like" or "GBAM" posts from my "cohorts". Why, because I believe I post truthfully and factually. And my worldview is consistently applied, neither is it self-derived. Can I be called out for my tone at times? possibly, but when it comes to fact or insight, I'm still waiting.

And that is what many simply can't deal with. Another point; there is not gender-bashing on this board as much as there is male-bashing. Lets be clear about that. On this thread alone, no one has mentioned the failings of naija mothers - or are they perfect? If the reverse thread had been started, there would have been howls of "your mother", "your sisters" - and in abusive tones. Here men simply stood up and said it's not true. The real truth is that were there are "stereotypically regressive norms" amongst men, women in the form of mothers/sisters have been equally culpable of inculcating and re-inforcing them by their actions or choices.

As for this thread, debrief clearly introduced a toxic element. I was reading from the off and didn't like it, but held off. When it was pointed out she accepted her error - on the face of it - only to backtrack when "the one with no provenance", entered to stir. It was a particularly odious move given the fact there had been agreement and generic as well as thread specific progress.

And to note, debrief was called out for this same thing barely a day previously. She rushed in to coruscate men without even reading properly. She was called out there also, she apologised. Then what? Jide rode in, doing pretty much what was done on this thread. Did I mention partisanship and alliances as opposed to facts and truth. Funnily enough debrief is often mistaken for a man !

If I can break myself away from bonding, I may be back here to respond to debriefs post.


TV

Nashville: You would have done a lot better to just tell us how your own relationship with your dad was and how your husband relates to your children.

Simple kweshun 0! See diversionary non-response by a seemingly virtual person!!!

Sisi_Kill: Rotflmao! Tee Veee...Deep Breath son, deep breath.

Gosh! How long have you been waiting to put that out there?!

I hope twas worth the wait. Lmao!!!!!


Moving on. ..Nashville, it is because I have seen the good ones (which are really a handful) and how well they handle it which makes it perplexing that some men think it's beneath them to be fathers to their kids. Like I said I work for an organization where majority of the kids are from African....Nigerian descent and I can count on one hand how many times their dads come to any events. I've seen up close and personal what their disinterest do to these kids.

Nash, my man...I don't hate Nigerian, I just dislike badly behaved Nigerian men and I'm not gonna pat ALL Nigerian men on the head just because....for one thing it does a great disservice to the few. ..very few good ones.

So once again instead of getting haughty about people talking about the badly behaved majority, how's about we find a way to make them the minority?!

On a side note
Will a thread ever be complete if the pipsqueak does not make an appearance? I think not. Lol. ..Eejit!!

You, yours...geddit??

TV

_{And for those of you viewing the preceeding post, please stop ogling my lovely bod, it's for Mrs TV only !}

...hmmm.... Where to start?


Here! Your garden variety psychopathic naija husband...obviously not bonding with his offspring. Brute!


TV

biolabee: Seems this tv is the new pick on guy by the family section e-bullies matriarchs

Pick on? Who? I scratch my butt in Urdu! Dem no reesh, dem no fit. Lies, deception and misinformation cannot pick on the truth.

Matri-wetin? For where? Please don't rubbish that word. If they like let them form cabal, cohort, club, constituency, caucus or even corporation. I will continue to uphold and celebrate the family and harmonious relationships in truth.

In fact, I'm upping the ante, spew any contrary nonsense and I will pointedly draw your attention to it - if I choose. Don't particularly care if you respond or not or how you choose to do so. It's not for you, but for the impressionable/vulnerable reading.

If you besmirch Christianity, denigrate our families, try to normalise divorce, bash our men, promulgate sodomy or push radical feminism, I may well have something to say.

When I have time sha - gotta take JR swimming !

I'll be back - like a wrecking ball amongst derelict houses.

See them tremble !


TV

Nashville: You would have done a lot better to just tell us how your own relationship with your dad was and how your husband relates to your children. Most people that have done that already actually revealed they had a good relationship with their fathers. Someone had earlier posted how a typical Nigerian family is - A perfect wife (an angel) who could do no wrong and worked tirelessly (and unappreciated) for her family but who is unfortunate to be married to a maniac. Just sounds like super story. If Nigerian women were that "angelic" and the men demons, I think our women should start marrying Italian and French men. Abi, why would an angel marry a devil.

And to think of it, who are the ones bringing up these boys to be maniacs? The solution lies in how we all bring up our children. These "Nigerian men" are not a special breed. They are your fathers, your brothers and in some cases your children. The solution is to bring up your own children the right way so they do not become maniacs. We all come from the same society. I wonder how a family will train the girl child to be an angel as described and the boy child to be a demon!

There will always be bad eggs in any society. If there are 100 families on a street and 20 families are like the ones you described, it does not make most Nigerian men that way. There are still good ones out there. As mothers and fathers we should try and bring up your children with the right family values! I am still waiting to hear how your own relationship with dad was and how your husband relates with your kids.

Well said sir, but asking that particular poster to "tell" puts you on a "long thing". After you've been here a while you get to know who's who and who stands for what. Even if collaterally - or whilst sharing experiences - people reveal insights into their own situations and worldviews.

There's has been nothing about a spouse, partner, be that past, present or future tense. As to children, never more than indirectly and only in passing and nothing to suggest there are or are to come in this regard either. Don't be misled by the self-congratulatory spiel above. Rather, it's threads denying that marriage and children are the source of blessing and fulfillment that many of us know and celebrate. What of faith or other leanings? Other than a spiteful feminism, nada!

Simply can't resist bashing men. Even as dialogue progresses on this board and people begin to realise that we all have a vested interest in fostering strong marriages and harmonious relations between our men and women for our communities to flourish, true to form, she dives in to drag the conversation backwards and spread rancour.

Dripping sarcasm from thread to thread, never leading but always inciting. What is the agenda of such a one? what is she agitating for exactly?

One may well have good reason for being "closeted", but this is the "Family" board. Why anyone would come here with an insidious mission to rail against families is pause for thought?


TV

Efemena_xy: See as religious freaks full ground for here.

*** Disclaimer: This post isn't intended to slight anyone here. I'm merely stating an observation. ***

Slight ke? Is it not you? Busy pointing out hypocrites, when you wear that particular crown unchallenged.

Efemena_xy: I stand firmly for what I believe in: Justice, Fairness AND Equality for all, irrespective of gender, creed, disability, religious affiliation or sex.ua.lity.

@OP,

If you believe, pray with your spouse. Alone if you will, but feel free to invite MIL, other relatives or friends. You don't need to go anywhere, pay anyone or undertake any rituals.

God hears, God answers.

Enjoy your marriage and may God fill your quiver with arrows.


TV

...I said no!

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/2-convicted-adopted-son-porn-article-1.1385895
http://rt.com/news/pedophile-syndicate-russian-boy-481/

This child was molested - some reports say from as early as weeks old - quite early by his "birth" father and partner and was "procured" for that very purpose.

The child was then passed around a ring of pederasts/paedophiles. The act of procuring children for sex is not uncommon by pederasts and is in some part the reason for some of Russias draconian new laws regards sodomites.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2043345/The-California-boy-11-undergoing-hormone-blocking-treatment.html#ixzz2XdzTKkEE

TV

Ibhamen: What i would disagree with this post is the part of 'intelligence'. Giving birth or wanting children is not a criteria to judge one's IQ Or intelligence. Everybody fulfillment differs.

I totally agree here.

This kind of poser makes it sound like the "intelligence bar" for women is very low. It does them no favours and at best is slightly patronising.

TV

I see I'm not the only one not quite at ease with this story.

The flat belongs to the pet shop owner, who was a "friend" of the their mothers.

Where was she? Where was he?
Why would a "pet" of over 10 years - especially if it was well fed, need to hunt? And why hunt - twice - and not eat?
There is no way it would have felt threatened - they would have been oblivious to it's presence
There were no reports of cries, screams, or the noise from a ceiling caving in - nothing until he came across the "scene".

Tragic whatever the case. But still.

TV

Efemena_xy: My opinion on this is that you need to get off your high moral horse and quit being judgemental of people. Without having to read the comments of other posters here, it's obvious that your argument is flawed and lacks substance.

The homosexuals you're so quick to crucify without knowing a dime about their backgrounds...were they not born of heterosexual parents??

~ The multitude of thieving politicians ruling your country, Nigeria, are they not born of heteroxexual parents?

~ Your average runz girl who carries her pregnancy for nine months and dumps her new born baby in the gutters, public toilet, road side, rubbish heap, or in a carton in the middle of some godforsaken bush - is she not born of heterosexual parents? Are these sick, cold hard b!.tche.s not born of heterosexual parents??

~ Your so called evil madam-de-madams that have loads of underaged, vulnerable, young, prepubescent girls as house helps or maids, that she abuses at will at the slightest reason... are those wicked, women not born of heterosexual parents? Does the wickedness these maids / housegirls have to suffer day in and day out at the hands of their employers not cause serious psychological problems for them? So what are you talking about??

~ The child you see on the road hawking goods at a pittance, denied attending school because they must sell mama's goods and forced to contribute financially to the upkeep of their face-me-I-face-you flat...are these kids not born of heterosexual parents?

Now give me one example, just 1 example of a gay couple in Naija you know of, that does a fraction of the crimes I've listed up there.

Until you do so, you haven't got a leg to stand on with those weak arguments of yours. Now quit the gay bashing abeg. Learn to remove the speck from your eyes before judging and condemning others.

So, the fact that some "heterosexuals" have children who do bad things or treat their children badly proves s a cast-iron case for sodomites to raise children?

And you called her arguments weak?
Classic

TV

Hezron Lorraine: I'll leave this to the heterosexuals to decide.wouldn't want to get too defensive in a such heated arguement.

You leave it to heterosexuals to decide on the basis of the deceitful sodomitic propoganda you posted here? Are you having a laugh? You will know heated.

Hezron Lorraine: 1•)research shows that about 87-90% of kids raised by heterosexuals end up gay.the union of two homosexual parents doesn't have a direct effect on their child's s.exuality.just the way the s.exuality of heterosexual parents doesn't determine if their kids too will be str8.same-sex union marriage doesn't make the children in that union potential gays,they are still subject to the laws of nature on what their s.exual orientation would be.

This is so nonsensical, it can only be an error. Please correct or show sources.

And nature at best plays a part in same-sex attraction, it's not the whole story - probably not even most of it. And if you appeal to nature to justify your acts why contrary to nature do you insist on children?

Hezron Lorraine: 2•)Couples in a same-sex union have the same or better bearing at parent ability same as their heterosexual counterparts.research as shown that kids raised in homosexual unions perform intellectually high.their gay parents lifestyle is not detrimental to their personal abilities.

Are you serious? Do you think we are fools here, or is this just a "spew lies long and persistently enough and people will believe it ploy?" Studies can be made to show just about anything - especially if there is a pre-determined outcome in view. Sources please. Let me guess, some "gay lobby" backed/funded research!

Which empirical or longitudinal studies demonstrate this? What sample sizes are we talking here? How long has sodomitic parenting even been in view to make a direct comparison with natural/normal parenting, which has been the norm pretty much for ever.

Hezron Lorraine: 3•)Gay couples may be unable to procreate the natural way,but that isn't a full stop for them to have a family.it may be wrong,but they are no less than the str8.

They are absolutely and incontrovertibly less than straight. A sodomitic union can never provide the balance that the natural - male/female - family provides and even worse, it always denies a child one of it's biological parents. Wilful pre-meditated child abuse.

Please, have as much rectal penetration and fecal pre-intimacy as you like, but don't force normal people to pervert truth and decency to validate your abominable lifestyles.

TV

A number of perspectives here;

Mentioning marriage the first date is not necessarily a bad thing. However, I think mentioning marriage "to the person" on the first date is a little hasty - even if you have divine revelation.

A girl I had known for a while dropped the word marriage in our first phone convo. I quite appreciated her forthrightness and if anything it scored her points.

Even my wife mention "our babies" on the second phone call - we'd had just one date after meeting for the first time. I actually think it just slipped out, as she didn't even recall at first. Again, I didn't break stride, just let her speak freely and kept the discussion going.

It's good in a way, as the unserious and the unready typically flake. See OP talking about not being "psychologically ready" . Although it won't necessarily deter serious players.

I think the OP is on shaky ground here. If she is desperate, why hasten towards intimacy? There are a whole range of negative outcomes, especially if the desperation is driven by something sinister. Make ready for your unpreparedness to be a moot point if this goes horribly wrong.

Best - as always - to take your time getting to know her. With time the real driver behind her comments will be clear. At the very least she's somewhat innocent/immature.

And where are our dearly beloved feminist hordes railing against the double standards when it's a man - romantic, jovial - proposing marriage on the first date, as against a woman - desperate, scheming?

I'll take feminists seriously when they learn to pee standing up (note there are no real male feminists, that's just game )

TV

TV01: [Quote author=chaircover]

pele Mr "I always think before posting and I always read with a little more understanding"

Ive told you before!!!! . . . remove the speck from you eye first

Morning CC,

Point taken. I could have been more generous in response - and will be in future. Heartfelt apologies. Please put it down to my zeal for solid marriages and happy families - which I believe you share. Let's rather focus on this common cause.

Once again, I'm sorry. Please, no vex.

TV

slimyem: A lot of unmarried people are getting the message wrongly. Entering into marriages with the mindset that,if it doesn't work, divorce is the way out.

Basic.

Entering knowing it's a life-long commitment and that there is no second chance - for professed Christians - if you opt out will mean the correct emphasis is given to the foundation.

I'm working the like button today.

TV

Nashville: When I read posts like this, it just sends a very wrong signal about marriage. Next month, my parents will celebrate 40 years of marriage. My grandparents were married for 62 years before my grandfather passed on and I am almost 8 years in marriage and I do not regret getting married. My wife as well has no regrets. My brother and sister are also very happily married. There are lots of people out there enjoying their marriages and may be you need to learn one or two things from them if this is truly your view.

No marriage is perfect just like no one is perfect but I dare say the scenarios you paint are far from the norm. I am a Christian and I know I can only have something I believe in. I can only have a happy marriage if I believe it is possible and if I can see it. This is not about men vs women. I have a friend whose wife is dating an ED in her bank, and she is threagthening him with divorce etc. There are bad men and women out there and there are good men too. Your responsibility is to marry a good man. This is just a cheap way of absolving oneself from blame.

If you sincerely ask people in bad marriage how they got themselves into the mess they are in, they themselves would tell you where they made mistakes. Most mistakes were made before marriage and what I am preaching is that divorce should not be seen as an easy escape route. Someone commented earlier that people that are no longer connecting should get a divorce. I actually laughed, like seriously, is that what marriage has turned into? Most people marry for the wrong reasons. Some women will marry guys who abused and beat them up even before marriage, some will still marry guys that cheated on them 10 times before marriage. Some will marry a guy over the internet? Some will marry guys they dont even know what he does for a living.

Marriage can be lovely but you must first believe it can be!

TV also liked this post and it gave him a warm feeling inside .

God bless you for this piece. If only they knew.

TV

greatgod2012: If you had asked this question before, it won't surprise you now and you would have quit or continued the relationship, depending on whichever you can live with.

chaircover: As regards questions being asked before marriage, no one on the “things discussed before marriage” thread, mentioned which name will the wife take after marriage question which further buttresses my point that you cant possibly cover all eventualities no matter how many questions you ask before you get married.

In getting to know someone, questions are a great tool. Do they have to be exhaustive and cover every eventually? Can they? Of course not.

If people thought prior to posting or read with a little more understanding, they would wise up to the fact that "disclosure" is in view. Anything a courting person holds dear - especially which differs from the norm or on which they cannot compromise - should be disclosed post-haste.

Is courtship a guessing game?

TV

Nashville: I do not see how divorce can be worthy of celebration and divorce should be discouraged. One of the reasons why divorce is on the rise is because lots more people rush into marriage. They fall in love over facebook and go ahead and marry people they do not even know. Divorce is not the solution, the solution is that people should use their brains before getting married.

A happy home is essential for bringing up stable kids. The biggest losers in any divorce are the children. You may say you were married to a psycho but my question is that why would you marry a psycho? Didnt you choose yourself or someone brought the man to you? And you find some people divorcing upto three times, didnt you learn anything from the first one. All in all, divorce for me is never a good thing. It is allowed and there are clear instances where it is ok to divorce,(eg cheating and extreme violence) but I still cannot see it as something worth celebrating.

People now use it to just satisfy their own lusts. A woman is eyeing some rich alhaji will divorce her husband and marry the alhaji. She will always have many things to claim as her husband cant be perfect anyway. A middle aged man eyeing some sweet 16 will divorce his wife and marry the new bride. He can always come up with 100 reason why the wife is a witch. For me, we should not celebrate divorce.

I liked this post.

It would be great if the Christian context of divorce not pre-supposing re-marriage was also in view. This would focus people on the serious nature of the commitment and the soberness required to venture into marriage.

Contrary to popular opinion, most divorce is about selfish desire overcoming responsibility and commitment.

Our children and societies will reap this whirlwind.

TV

godello: Now how can one discover the hidden characters? coz this days pretence encapsulates many courtship.

stiiv: now, am even more scared than i use to be.

DarryOsh: bros, u are not alone. This marriage issue....it seems the more you try to understand, the more you are confused.
God knows if i am gonna make mistakes in my life, it mustnt b in marriage.

Guys, please be encouraged. Do not be moved by the naysayers and the bad testimonies that abound here. If anything, they are unrepresentative, as people only tend to bring problems to this forum.

I know there are lots of heart-rending stories beyond Nairaland too, but visualise, plan and prepare for your own marital bliss. It is really not as difficult as some would have you believe or as risky as others say - if done correctly!

I've written much to this end, feel free to take time to read and understand. There are others with good insight here, and many will willingly give advise. But read wide, beyond this forum. Real life models - across a range of ages, lifestyles etc - are also great. Use all this as a guide (not a template), but more importantly, build your understanding.

I have a truly blissful marriage and there are no downsides. God is truly good.

TV

AmberDelRio: Hi. My name is Amber. I recently got married to a Igbo man. I love my husband very much but I feel like he is hiding some things from me. I have been honest with him about the good bad and ugly with myself but I just can't shake this feeling of hidden things. I am now starting to question weather he loves me for me or if he would just like a green card. Should I go searching for information or just let it be?

You've left yourself with few options and not much hope here.

It's either there is nothing to this or there is.

If there is not, you may search not find anything and be satisfied. Or you may not find anything and still not be satisfied as the seed of suspicion continues to gnaw.

If there is, you may inquire, find something and be faced with hard choices. Or you may not find anything and in due course whatever it is rears its head. You will then be faced with those same choices, but with more water under the bridge, they may be that much harder and more complicated.

For your peace of mind and long term best interest the obvious thing to do would be to "go search" as you put it. That alone could put a great strain on the relationship.

Brace yourself.

I wish you all the best

TV

_{WannaWeds please take note!}

ileobatojo: First I'm a lesbian single mom and now I'm a militant feminist which is no different from being a gay activist. You're such a doll, aren't you?

Yeah, I'm not even a tiny fraction interested in helping you satisfy your 'curiosity'. Have a nice day.

If you read carefully, you'll see I labelled you non of those things. I was merely curious as to your situation, especially as it motivates your positions/postings. Hence the questions.

Like I said, feel free to decline.

Hope you had a pleasant day yourself.

TV
_{(God fearing Christian who is very happily married to a beautiful wife with an adorable son )}

honeric01: Hmmmm, thanks, pls share more, others are reading..

My pleasure.

If per my first post, you are individually mature (Spiritually, Educationally, Financially Physically, Emotionally, Socially – each of these require more detail, please ask if required), then you are ready for courtship.

I had my preferred way of meeting people, but whatever way/s you use, I always suggest you have a good idea of what you want in a spouse. It will save you a lot of time and hassle if you focus. If at all possible, learn a little about a person before you approach them or accept to get to know them better, let alone “date”. (More here also, but please ask, I’m trying to keep it short).

So, you are getting to know this person, what to discuss? Your aim is to gain sufficient insight into this persons character, worldview and aspirations to know if you should proceed to courtship proper and ultimately marriage.

In marriage, the possible combination and variety of situations you will face are so numerous, you simply cannot discuss them all, hence the emphasis on maturity & character. And a real God fearing nature if you believe.

So discuss pretty much everything and anything, being sure to learn about them as a person. Background, heritage, desires (especially for marriage), education, and any life experiences they are willing to share. At the early stages, don’t necessarily get too deep.

Talk lots. Be out together (in safe non-pressured, environments), in groups, assess how they are in public, their familial and social interaction if you have the opportunity

If it becomes more likely that they are looking like the one, the relationship should be made exclusive and then more intimate things like sex can be discussed as you become closer. I always counsel full disclosure of past relationships around this point. Be sure to meet family and close friends and assess further.

You can “plan”, some things quite clearly, but some things only generally. Man proposes....be flexible and willing to discuss further, compromise or make strategic changes. You’ll probably have too once married.

Overall, you want to be sure of your commitment to each other and your union. You should ideally know what that means before you start, only now you’ve found the one. A slight digression, but ensure you engage your support - family etc - before it gets too serious or any commitment is made. There should be discussion here also, and whoever it is should be presented - repeatedly.

If at any point you feel you cannot marry – spend the rest of your life with - this person, then diplomatically bow out.

As a Christian, I always counsel marrying someone of like faith and avoiding fornication. I may touch on intimacy more fully in a separate post , but that should suffice for now.

Look out for – deceit, anger, selfishness, caginess, inconsistency, lewdness, lack of focus or direction, any kind of impropriety. Set your standards high or you will likely compromise on calibre of person and personal qualities.

This is not a template or a roadmap, it’s general guidance. Your quest will and should be very personal. Your story, your marriage.

Apologies for the slightly disjointed order, I’m rushed. All the best as you proceed towards marital bliss.

TV

honeric01: Are there no married people on this family thread again?

Oh, because this is not a thread for lamentation abi?

Apologies, I saw your thread late and hoped I could find a piece I'd written but never posted which speaks to your question. Here it is;

Almost all potential problems within marriage can be dealt with – or one could say stem from a failure to “deal with issues” – foundationally.

By foundationally, I mean two things. 1. Proper preparation of an individual for marriage (nothing to do with potential partners here, this is about your development, correct understanding and proper expectation) and 2. Courtship

In fact, I’m personally yet to see a broken marriage where the issue was not apparent – even if ignored – during courtship (if there was one).

Noting that I mean a suitably ordered courtship and proper due diligence (with recourse to family, faith etc.). Indeed, then the only real issue (and still a relatively minor one at this point) is whether to proceed on the basis of any perceived problematic areas.

The decision to knowingly do so, even if you regret it later is your responsibility. If he/she is angry/immature/a drunkard/violent/abusive/spendthrift etc. but you “thought you could change him/her” or “he/she would mature”. But they didn’t/wouldn’t, and now after 9 years and 3 kids you are fed-up and want out, at least be honest about the root of the problem. Especially when signs are ignored or overlooked because he/she is wealthy/endowed/pretty/with an extra portion of booty or swag etc.

In short, if you are not prepared as in 1., courtship as in 2., may fail it’s full purpose. If both 1 and 2 are in place I can pretty much assure you, that your relationship will be all but devoid of any character related issues that are not fairly easily resolved. And if you are wise and have the third – and most important imho - part of this 3 fold knot – which is an abiding faith in God, you have the immutability of His word.

We can all drop our 2 cents worth of advice when a relationship is beset with problems, but in truth, any advice – no matter how good - is only as useful as the willingness & ability of the two individuals to grasp and implement it. Which ironically they would have, if they had the right foundation, which if they had, they probably wouldn’t have the problem in the first place or would be well equipped to deal with it.

If one person in a marital union is effectively “not fit for purpose” as per 1., above, and does not realise this and make the required adjustments, both of them – and any offspring - will suffer and at best endure – but for how long?

Listen carefully; Foundation! foundation!! foundation!!!

Happy to give more detail if required, but this is a starter for 10.

Do not fear. Marrying properly and marrying well makes marriage a joy.

Best
TV

ileobatojo: I'll be more than happy to answer your 'innocuous' question when I see some evidence that you routinely ask married Nigerians if they are married to people of the same gender or not.

Just curious. Like I said, most people reveal glimpses of their lives collaterally when posting. You don't - as far as I can see. Admittedly I don't see all your posts. I believe you mentioned a son, other than that nothing. So I wondered. Like I said, feel free to demure.

ileobatojo: Also please enlighten us more on the use of the word 'hubby' among lesbians to describe their partners since you seem knowledgable of that subject matter.

It is not about lesbians per se. There are moves afoot to allow same-sex couples to use either term regardless of the sex of the couple. So for example two men could legally be two husbands, a husband and wife or two wives. So terms like "maiden" name" or reference to a "husband" will no longer possess the same face-value. Part of the convolution required to make "marriage equal".

ileobatojo: As to what I likely support, this seems to be a favorite past time of the haters around here, isn't it? Assuming they know your opinion and putting words in your mouth?

I made it clear I was curious, hence my question. It helps understand differing POV', if there is some colour. I hitherto had no real sense of your beliefs, relationship status, orientation or very much other than you appear to be a trained medic.

In the current cultural wars, there is little difference banner wise between militant feminists and gay activists. I have ascribed nothing to you, merely asked a question and wondered out loud.

If you decline to answer or simply tell, no problem at all.

So, do you support SSM?

TV

CNN80: And this is what I was making reference too. What is the big deal about ileobatojo keeping her maiden name? Why must people make cracks at her just because she is in no hurry to change her name? Has her husband complained?

I'll presume your misreading of my post was unintentional, but that was not the motivation for my question.

TV

ileobatojo: Are you "married" to a robot or a sheep?

Neither.

My question was a serious one. We are our posting histories and you happen to be one of the few who reveals very little. And perhaps for good reason? But you being a "contemporary feminist" and a likely supporter of SSM, I just wondered.

So my question stands?

TV

CC,

You posted something wrong and without context. I simply pointed that out. By all means query or rebut my point, but l histrionics and disingenuity do not speak well of you or serve viewers on this board. I'll respond for the sake of the more impressionable that may read.

chaircover: Which fear

Observe closely and you'll see the concern voiced by many - particularly those yet to wed - on this board. I feel that those that properly understand and/or enjoy marriage should do our utmost to allay those fears. Your statement was simply untrue and irresponsible.

chaircover: Dont bad things happen to good people and vice versa. Are all people in bad marriages bad choosers and bad people?

Has anyone said any different? I repeat "Marriage is not hit or miss" and is very much dependent on our understanding, preparation and choices. Correctly done, risk is quite minimal.

chaircover: How come I got a good man? Did I go to baba alawo to get mine or was I on Mountain of Fire fasting and praying for a whole year?

But you did do something didn't you? Thank God that our posting histories are before us. Do I need to remind you about the bad traits you found in previous suitors - that led to your ending relationships - prior to meeting your husband and the good qualities he possesses that made you proceed! All of that you posted on this board. And I dare say you probably involved your family at some point?

Or did you play the popular "hit or miss" husband lotto, perhaps just grab the first guy of the street? Why look beyond the bad for the good if it's makes no difference?

Prayer & fasting for a whole year? Mountain of fire? You sound like you're set on justifying your error, even if you have to sneakily resort to extremes to do so. If one believes in God, is He outside or uncaring of our marriages? Is He unable to perfect them and us. I only ever point to God in instances where posters make a point of faith. Is your self-professed Christianity a moot point?

chaircover: Am I any better than any of the poor women going through hell at the hands of their men. Is it not the grace of God. Next you will tell me that they didnt pray enough before getting married!

How pious of you - plus a dash of empathy - will definitely play well. Yes, it's always women, it's always hell.

Painfully contradictory. Which is it, "the grace of God" or "hit and miss"? Or is it Gods grace that is hit or miss? As to the needless "pray enough" remark, like I said, our posting histories are on record. Try and rise above slyness.

chaircover: Yes some of it is due diligence and some of it is pure hit and miss

Contradictory and erratic? You can't even agree with yourself. So far you've added grace and due dilligence to your "hit or miss". Let's dedicate a new category in your honour; there's right, wrong and now courtesy of CC there's "inconsistently wrong"

chaircover: and the Mr Right you choose 5 years ago can change to Mr Wrong.

Yes 0! Overnight he can go from loving and caring, to a trying to immolate you, dragging you across the floor by your hair and generally making Hannibal Lecter appear well-adjusted.

chaircover: Give some people some loose change in their pocket and see how they totally change. You can never fully know the person you live with . . NEVER!!! Why because we never really know ourselves until faces with certain situations.

But your husband is a good man yes? Or is that something you need to re-assess daily?

chaircover: Pls lets stop blaming people all the time when they find themselves in difficult situations.

We can do better than that. Let's not set any expectations, lets spread ill-considered and damaging clichés. Let's go even further. We can overlook destructive behaviour and ignore bad choices and simply toss any notions of responsibility or accountability out the window. After all, it's one chance? Counsel sef is pointless. It's just a gamble.

chaircover: I certainly didnt have those "before we get married 200 point project plan" meetings that so many people seem to endorse on this section and we are doing fine.

Of course not, you walked into it backwards, blindfolded and with your hands tied. And you still managed to pin the tail on the donkey. Are you Irish by any chance ?

chaircover: Most of us only matured in the marriage anyway. What did we know about life before we got married and started having responsibility ourselves and for other people?

Desperation sets in. Everyone "grows into marriage". Does that mean it is good to be married absent maturity? What on earth are you on about?

chaircover: It is Grace . . and not because we were super clever

Grace? Is that Gaelic? Whence cometh grace?

So once again, please be more considered when you post in future and considerate of the readership, some of whom are quite impressionable. Further, try and be humble enough to stand corrected. You are not averse to calling out error yourself. And believe me if it wasn't to encourage others, I wouldn't dignify this nonsense with a reply.

And finally, marriage is not "hit or miss". It's a God given institution which if entered into with a degree of maturity, understanding and the right preparation and support will be the most blessed, rewarding and fulfilling thing you ever do.

TV

ileobatojo: I am married and still use my maiden name. But, I plan to change it to my hubby's name.

Don't mean to be nosey - so feel free to demure - but are you "married" to a man or woman?

TV

White007: What Do You Do When Your Spouse/Loved One Doesn't Exercise.
I’ve been dating someone for the last year who has been talking about losing weight and has yet to do so. I would say she is easily 40 lbs overweight.

3 whole stone? That's a lot - whatever her optimum weight should be.

White007: I’ve tried working out with her with no success. She loves food and has a tendency to lay down and even nap after dinner. All she wants to do is lay down. It makes me crazy.

The good thing is that it sounds like it's solely down to her lifestyle, so should melt away if she takes it seriously

White007: We’ve tried talking about it and the only thing that happens is we argue and I get disgusted. If I encourage her to join me for walks or any activity she gives up right away.

But it sounds like she doesn't want too and to be honest "you can lead an overweight person to the gym/park....

White007: I want to see her get better because I know it will affect her health as she ages and I don’t know what to do. I care very much for her but I feel I’m fighting a losing battle.

Diplomatically couched and true. But physique and looks are also a consideration.

White007: I welcome all suggestions, please.

You;
- I question why you pursued the relationship in the first instance. Men are very "sensory" creatures - at least to begin. In fact I'll fault you on this, because you approached her as she was and she has every right to expect that you accept her as she is. It would have been more honest to make it clear pre-commitment that this was an issue and given her the choice. And even better, that you hadn't gone there seeing as how important this is too you. Having said that, she should still appreciate there is an issue here and try and work with you.

- This is clearly critical too you and I have no sense that the other qualities you saw adequately compensate here?

- Be very clear that this will not improve with age, child-birth and continued neglect, but steadily worsen. You cannot afford to get to a position of finding your wife physically unattractive or visually unappealing.

- I would honestly say this is a deal breaker.

Her;
- Coaching (not training per se) may help her do this. But only if she wants it, which it doesn't sound like she does.

- Women are very sensitive about looks and appearance and your continued run-ins over this will take their toll. Be careful, enuff self-esteem threads.

- Looks liker a deal breaker from this end as well.

I'm also a bit of a gym rat and it was something that I knew would factor for me. It was always going to be tough as at that point, our ladies did not "typically" have a health/exercise/nutrition mentality. I figured I'd marry someone at least ten years younger, so that it would be less of an issue for me as we both aged. And someone slightly smaller than ideal so that child-birth wouldn't make too much of a difference.

I even joined a regular gym, but what they made up in physique, they typically lacked in faith or we just didn't gel. Thank God, he answered me in my infirmities. I met someone who had a routine in place. And I think that's key, she wasn't doing it to please me, she got it. I still have to encourage her sometimes, but it's not a wholesale mindset change.

Everything else fell in place too. If you are looking for a wife, be more focused, it'll make for less hassle and time wasted.

I wish you all the best in your search.

TV

chaircover: This marriage thing is just hit and miss jare.

That is patently untrue, unless you proceed without due care and are reckless in your approach. Please try not to put fear into people with ill-considered statements.

honey86: Some men are just plain irresponsible.

Agreed.
Could we also agree that women should not marry such men?

Gaggi: Men like this might be irresponsible but they are usually running frm a nagging and difficult wife who makes d home inconvenient.

Men - especially husbands - do not "run". They address situations and deal with the circumstances that pertain to their marital homes. Whatever the case here, please do not make excuses for irresponsible behaviour.



@OP,

I would question the foundation of your union. Having said that, you are now in it, so play to win.

You;
Please stop feeling sorry for yourself. You are now a wife, not a whiny girlfriend. Conduct yourself as such - purposefully. From your point of view, you are last in the priority order of your own family. You should be most concerned about your childrens well-being, your husbands and then your own.

Buckle up. Find a fitting time and set the stage for a frank - not weepy/emotional - discussion with your husband. Be very clear about your expectations from the union and from him, emphasising the impact of his behaviour on the nurture of your offspring and you personally.

Have a clear idea of the actions you would like to see and have him commit to some immediately and make promises about others. Be tough and forthright - he will respect you for it - and give it thorough consideration before you sit down.

Be clear that you do not want to involve either family, but if things do not change you will be forced too. The asthma incident is case in point, he should be first to your side, not your family.

Him;
I can't say for sure, but your husband sounds immature - not outright wicked?. Perhaps he wasn't ready for the commitment of marriage or appreciative of the responsibilities? Whatever the case. It's in your - and your childrens - best interest for him to make the necessary adjustments.

I do not know who your support network are, but your immediate family should always occupy this role, and they should have been the ones to prepare you and approve of him. I am not aware of your situation prior to marriage, so cannot comment further. Your recourse after talking to your husband directly, should be a wise and trusted elder - preferably male, from your side, and one whom your husband respects - to mediate (not tell your husband off 0!) between you.

You mentioned church? On your knees.

Chin up and God be with you.

TV

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
Philippians 2:6 - Although he was in the form of God and equal with God, he did not take advantage of this equality.

The above is Christian equality in a nutshell.

_{And no philosophy or ideology can - or is required to - embellish Christianity. Attempting to do so will give you "another gospel". Let no one be deceived by reasoning and smooth words. I speak to those who may be unwittingly taken in by them.}

TV