₦airaland Forum

voxpopp: The more reason why I said it was a bloody revolution. It was like a war back then and in a war, there is always casualties on both sides. Am not in anyway in support of the protestants and some of their actions back then that's why I tried to emphasize the difference between protestantism and its off shoots after the revolution. Mind you, no one practices protestantism again...(Who are they protesting against).

protestanism still exist, mainstream protestants are lutherians(as the name implies it was formed by martin luther), the various "reformed" churches like the presbyterians(these took their teaching from calvin), the children include the fundamentalist, the evangelicals. They are classified as protestants.

JMAN05: If you are sincere their are questions you should not be asking. You should know it happened. Unless Pastorolut has time for this circle dance.

i think the exact opposite. If you are sincere you will answer the question. If the catholic church is a direct extension of the apostolic church as i think pastor olu says, then it is only right he show us exactly when the church diverge from teaching the gospel.


I'm sure he can tell italo about the dark ages untill italo is blue in the face but the truth s that exactly the gospel preached before the dark ages were the same thing taught after the dark ages. The christian doctrines never changed. If you think they changed then the onus is on you to show us when or give us a time frame of when it occured.

This isn't the time to make sentimental arguement like you did above.

TheBigUrban2: Personal attack? Are you insane?


You tried to put Eugenics on atheists and now you are claiming attacks on religion?

Not only that, you assume that atheism has something to do with the origin of life.....whereas, no one knows the origin of life- what we know is the origin of species. Atheism exists with or without evolution.



Guy, go and sleep

get serious man, atheist have been smashing the evolution theory on creationist since the theory had any sort of circumstantial evidence, they thought that if if can be proved that man was a product of some wasteful sequence of adaptation then it will prove God false. I know this because atheist have tried to embarass me in discussions by bringing up the inconclusive theory of evolution. So my dear i do find it interesting that you "don't know" about the origin of the human specie yet your favourite pastime is to insult those believe man has a cause. If you don't know then it is only right that you keep quite until you know.

Secondly, i tried to be charitable when talking of eugenic and euthanasia even though in most cases they repulse me. The arguement i propose that says an atheist will be more open to eugenics wasn't an attempt to insult you. Infact i took the atheist arguement for eugenics from a popular atheist; dawkins.

He argues that man is just another animal and since there is no God or objective morality according to him, then if falls to man to breed the most healthy human race.

So tell me again, do you share dawkins idea that mans opinion is the decider of right and wrong? Do you reject objective morality? And if you do then sorry, i see no basis for which atheist claim "all men are born equal" i see no basis for human rights because if morality is subjective then it follows then anyone is right to treat another human anyhow he like, it follows that one man can decide to kill everybody because he is the decider of right and wrong.

Woe to the man without power! He will die before he lives. That is the picture you paint.

It isn't bigotry, it is critical thinking.

Have a nice evening.

Ok, i can define worship as honour, veneration, adoration admiration....

So yes we worship many things, even those who are monotheistic worship their parents, their friends...etc.

I differ from your position in some points, i'm sure you know i don't consider the universe and situations to be conscious. Thus i don't believe in orisha. Secondly i don't believe all worship is "godful" worship. Adoration is the worship reserved for God, and while i believe we all worship plenty things, monotheist only adores the one God.

We are not all aborisha because we do no all believe in the orisha, we all worship some things but adoration reserved honour. But i have say it completely makes sense if you believe universe is conscious.

italo: Please patiently read this page

http://www.catholiceducation.org/articles/religion/re0129.html

this is more complete.

striktlymi: The above does support the belief that every man is equal either from the Atheist stand point or that of Religion.



If indeed human intelligence is a characteristic that is 'acquired' from birth then it necessarily follows that inequality in human intelligence means inequality of humans themselves.



I agree that his argument, in my opinion, does not support equality from an Atheist point of view but neither does yours support it from the 'Religious' angle.

the aim of my arguement isn't to show the equality of man from the religious angle but to show the problem with the arguement in the op.

I do not agree. Some Christians support that dreadful act. Some Atheists are against abortion too.

i've never really heard of any atheist against abortion.

TheBigUrban2: The bold is a lie that you have been corrected on. We dont know that much the origins of life and the universe to be sure that it is from chance.


Furthermore, man is only better than animals because man can reason. Without reasoning, we are just another ape-like primate.


Eugenics is not science. To even put Eugenics on atheists shows how bigoted you are. Sicko.



And please, we are waiting for the figures

this is just another personal attack, so you guys nolonger know the origin of life, you don't even know if evolution is true. But you feel justified to attack whatsoever religion says about the origin of man, tell me again who is a bigot?

Pr0ton: Bro.. You r a stranger to the gospel of grace. You jst don't wan2 accept the truth and be saved, neither do you understand the gospel because if you do you wouldn't have deemed the grace of God as a license to keep on sinning. If you understand the gospel you will know exactly what 1John 4:19 is trying to say that, "we love him, becaused he first LOVED us." It's 4rm ur understandn ov his unconditional love towards u dat d eagerness 2 serve Him will naturally flow.

oh please!
The true gospel of grace was taught by the apostles and has been in the christian church for abt 2000yrs, the so called "new gospel of grace" is a man made invention. God's unconditional love isn't an excuse to sin, telling people lies about their salvation will only put both you and them in spiritual troubles. Go back and make research on the stuff you believe.

But u stil insist 2 live in ur filthy rag(self righteousness)
I'm afraid dt ur type myt b d 1s saying "but Lord didnt we do disNdat?"

that is the problem, you don't even understand what grace does.

When you try to be righteous by yourself that is filthy rags. When you have Christ living in you, when you live according to grace that isn't filthy rags, that is living right. And the word of God is fulfilled where it says "he who does right is righteous".

It is impossible to live right by our own power, that is why we've gat grace.

And if i still remember that parable correctly, those who were accepted by God are those were those who feed the hungry, home the homeless, clothes the clothless, and do good to their neighbours, those were those accepted by God, those who moved mountains in his name didn't get it, those who lived right by grace were counted righteous.

It seems you missed that part in the parable, grace enables the Christian to live right, and a christian who isn't living right isn't really in grace.

Once saved always saved is a sham.

SalC: damerry don suffer for ya hand smh

hey! Don't insult me dear, i don't make people suffer, i hate suffering in others, how would i wish suffering for our very own boygirl damerry?

jnrbayano: Please I have a question.

Why does the sign of the cross follow a definite pattern?

To the forehead, to the centre of the chest, to the left side of the chest/shoulder and to the right side of the chest/shoulder

My question is on the enbolden line. Why is it 1st on the left before the right?

Happy Sunday all

i think it is more covenient that way, besides i think there is a little symbolism to it....

The sign of the cross is what you do when you receive a blessing, give a blessing, hear of the holy trinity or the awesome saving power of God on the cross. The sign of the cross is a symbol of grace.
Grace brings us from the left side of God to his right side, from sin to sanctity, from death to life, from unrighteousness to righteousness, from children of damnation to sons of God. It brings us from left to right, i think that is the symbol behind the left to right.

Eastern catholics do it from right to left...there is another symbolism to that, they also join the thumb, first finger and their tall finger together to sybolise the trinity and the ring finger and the small finger rest on the insider palm to symbolise the two natures of Christ.
There is a similar one used in pictures of christ and used to be used by popes and bishops.

Anyway that is by the way.

The symbol is that of grace and its effect.

SalC: I already know dear, I just wonder where they got the boy-girl thing.

Well Goodluck in our bacca wetin wetin wetin

i talk am say damerry na girl, u no hear say e get bacca?

TheBigUrban2: We are all humans at the end of the day....so the same human rights should apply to all


Science says that we are the same species, despite our varying levels of intelligence or physical strenghts

that is interesting!


So all men are "equal" based on the fact that they are of the same species! Not because they are socially, physically or intellectually equal but because they are of the same specie.

Is that the best and only reason why humans are equal?

TheBigUrban2: We are all born with equal potential. No one is born intelligent. One might have the intelligent genes but they are useless if not harnessed with quality education

People born with deformities are usually a result of parents' negligence or ignorance towards childbirth

Down syndrome is a result of having children at old age and also an extra chromosome....there is testing from down syndrome before the baby is born.

Anyhoo, we are all the same specie, according to science. We are equal in that sense.

actually every one is not born intellectually or even physically equal.
All you explanations about "how it happened" only proves it.

italo: This is in response to your statement that you're always sincere in your discussions with me.

Well, this is my own way of testing if you can actually be consistently sincere.

1. What is your opinion of the Catholic Church, its doctrine... and actively practising Catholics?

following.

TheBigUrban2: Any figures to back up the bold? Or are you just telling us your bigoted opinion?

i could get the figures, but i can't multi task on my phone.

Beside by opinion isn't based on bigotry. You guys believe man is a product of some universal chance, in essence, man is not essentially better than animals, he just has a bigger and better brain.

It is science that one of the best ways to keep a population healthy (whether animal or human) is to make sure that the most healthy mates with the most healthy and the sick are left to die of. Eugenics make more sense from an atheistic perspective.

A guy who believes he is a product of chance is probably gonna support the killing of the sick and deformed than the guy who believes human life is sacred.

Besides you demostrated in the euthanasia thread that you don't care injecting a lethal substance in a living person, put simply you don't care killing him because pain trumps life.

Hitler alone is an exception to the bold

exceptions don't break the rule,
...besides it is posible that hitler was a closet atheistic with a religious pr.

Secular nations that have a lot of atheists tend to be more peaceful and developed than religious ones.

oh tell me about it!

FOLYKAZE: Ina Gejia (sorry I dont know if the spelling is correct o).

Good and thanks for your contribution.

Would like to see views of other like italo, BabaGnoni, mcfynest, Ubenedictus, Weah96, PAGAN9JA, macof, Ghostofsparta, TheBigUrban2, Apatheist, Kay17, Reyginus, rationalmind, mazaje, plaetton, qstar and PASTORAIO.

you called me,

give me some time to read the original post.

TheBigUrban2: lol....I understand. I exposed your flawed thinking.

rather you exposed your flawed thinking, there is a difference between accepting inevitable death, and actually causing death.


But in your flawed thinking you don't see the difference.

The bible is very clear, "he who refuses to bear fruits will be cut off".
There is no room for once saved always saved. No christian believed such in the first 1500yrs of christianity. This is the newly invented doctrine of men, made to tell Christians that they can sin all they want and insult God's mercy and then expect to go to heaven. Hehehe. That is a doctrine of damnation.

TheBigUrban2: I just watched a video where a christian claimed that it is only a belief in God that can truly cement that belief that all men are equal. The christian claimed that men have their differences in size, intelligence, strength and contributions to society.The only solution to these differences is to believe that God created all men equal.


This same argument was propounded by Anony, who then went forward to assert that atheism or atheists can not hold that all men are equal due to a lack of belief in God.


However, I want to rebut this argument. Logic alone can show us that all men are equal-

First of all, science tells us that all humans have the same basic make up, the same basic body parts and we are the same species. The differences in men mostly come from the effects of the environment. Furthermore, all humans come from the same mother- the mitrochondrial Eve.

All men have equal potential. The problem is that our environment, our experiences and upbringing are thing the things that make us unique. We were all foolish from the womb as babies. I am yet to see any human being that was intelligent as a baby. The inequality starts with the environment; breastfeeding as a baby, your teachings as a child, the prosperity of your society, the wealth of your parents, guardian etc.

In theory we are all equal as men and women. Unfortunately our environment makes it for some men to be more equal than others.




God is not necessary for a belief in equality. In fact, if we were to be honest, the Abrahamic God of Jews, Christians and Muslims advocates the inequality of man. For instance, Yaweh puts isreal as his chosen people- Isrealites are more important than other humans. Allah is best understood in Arabic and focuses mostly on the Middle Eastern men.

hehehe, i think intelligence is actually a inherited ability, it depends on the chromosomes you received not on the enviroment.

How come some are born more intelligent, some are born deformed and yet an atheist who claims to be reason only think that all men are created/born equal.

Your conclusion doesn't necessary follow your lack of faith, and i seem to agree with anony that the sure truth of human equality is most defended by religion not by "the atheist mind".

An atheist is more likely to support the killing of the deformed and suffering than a christian.

brownideye: but i dont know how?
They ask me to learn about lady of lourdes, apparition, grottos , rosary etc
please i need your help
catholics in the house, non-catholics too

i think the first question should be, why do you want to be a catholic?

Lourdes is an apparation, the rosary is a vocal-cum-meditative prayer.

TheBigUrban2: The main reason for removing life support is cost.


It makes no difference if you give the vegetable patient a lethal injection or remove life support- you are killing him with both actions

i disagree on both count.

The isrealis and the arab, both people are so war loving!

Yay, the manichaens are the projenitors of protestants! Why am i not suprised. You are so desperate to be historically relevant that you associate with the followers of mani. Oya clap for yourself.

Alphafrank: my friend......jst as the earth is far from the heaven so are our thoughts different from Gods thoughts,u can't use your tiny feeble mind to try and get a glimpse of Gods thought,was there any charge in the bible for u to honour mary ?,i guess u skipped the part of God being a jealous God...u say u honour mary but in reality you serve her,i don't put it on you cos you don't understand it,you just follow watever your infallible pope sayz,wich includes that it is only the pope and the council that are allowed to interprete the bible,the very same bible that virtualy all catholics call "a dead letter",if not by words then by deeds,what pains me the most is that Jesus clearly declared that all power here on earth and on heaven is given to him,wich he then proceeded to share with his disciples,ask anythin in MY NAME....catholics u realy can't understand bt how can u understand what u do not knw,start reading ur bible urself allowing the spirit to enlighten u..then and only then can anything be clear to you

now i see why the letter lead to death but the spirit gives life.

You have manage to read the letter without understanding.

Vin2014: When you make someone's image and pray to them instead of praying directly to God through his son Jesus Christ ,you are comitting idolatry.For scriptures clearly teach that the only intercessor between mankind and God is Jesus Christ/Messiah.When you are not confident to approach God it means sin is blocking you as Adam and Eve hid from God in the garden.If you really believe Lord Jesus Christ set you free from all sins by his death on the cross,shedding his sinless blood for the sins of all mankind,so that all who believe in him will be saved,then you can confidently approach the throne of God in the name of his son Jesus Christ.

This idolatrous practice of intercession/veneration of saints corrupted God's Church in 4th century AD during the rule of Constantine,when he made Christianity a royal religion.Many pagans of Roman empire converted to 'christianity' without any repentence only to obtain state benefits.Since these unrepented souls couldn't forgo of their old idolatry the just changed the names of old idols to christian names and continued to use them in prayer/worship which came to be known as "intercession/veneration of saints aka repackaged idolatry.Evidences for this idolatrous transmutation is evident in history and archeology.The Serapis-pagan God resemble Jesus,Venus resemble Mary and many others are there.

Those who objected to this idolatrous corruption were branded as heretics and massacred by Roman military of Catholicism.
Some of this true christians who were persecuted and killed by heretic idolatrous catholicism were.
1-Early Jewish Christians,Celtic church,Gothic arians,Donatists,Manichaens((1st-7th century AD)
2-Paulicians,Bogomils(6-12th century AD)
3-Waldensians,Cathars,Hussites,Strigolnikis,Anabaptists and finally Protestants(11th century AD till today).
Thus we can see true Christianity forms an uncorrupted continous chain from the day of Pentecost some 2000 years ago.This true Christianity aka God's Church is built on the rock foundation which is the revelation given to Apostle Peter by the most high God that Jesus is the son of God and is the Christ/Messiah and gates of hell (catholicism and other idolatrous false religions)hall not prevail over it.(Mathew16:16-18)Catholics claim this "rock foundation" is Apostle Peter himself and his mortal body is buried under Vatican.They claim the "authority of keys " given by Lord Jesus to apostle Peter is given only to Peter and those that come in his lineage-Papal lineage-which itself is broken lineage as evidenced by history and archeology.But they are unaware that this "authority of keys" is given to all believers/followers of Lord Jesus Christ in Mathew18:18.

Thus Scripture,History ,archeology and all other real evidence prove that catholicism is an idolatrous fake sect that claims to be christian but in reality leads people to eternal hell fire through their idolatrous practice of intercession/veneration of saints(Revelations21:.Scriptures asks us to flee from idolatry-1Corinthians10:14 ,for it will lead to eternal hell fire-Revelations21:8

which planent did you come from?

The protestants are descended from the arians and the donatist and the followers of mani?


Hahahaha.....i can't stop laughing do you even have an idea what those sects believed?

I see you debbie, i thank God with you, i pray for your sustained health.

Emm, just to be sure, i advise you do an xray to make sure they didn't leave anything inside you, we can't trust our doctors enuf.

Woky weytin u find reach awka?

I see say all the bobos just respect themselves...could it be because of the new beautiful lady in our midst?


Nne welcome o!

TheBigUrban2: Wait, what does your comment imply;




What makes a medical procedure burdensome or extraordinary? The cost of money and labour (especially when the patient isnt getting better).


So let us be honest- you support Euthanasia on the basis of money. If a terminal patient is too costly, kill the vegetable!!

read the comment in it context it is extraordinary, burdensome and even dangerous when the expected outcome of the procedure is death. When some one is brain dead and his organs are shutting down, it is considered extraordinary to put him on life support. It is not based on cost, but on the context of the medical procedure.

To inject a lethal substance into a patient because his care is costly is still immoral and consider murder in catholicism. So it isn't about cost.

plaetton: Correction sir,
The catholic is an institution. It is a powerful, old and well entrenched religious , political, economic and administrative institution with a heirachy of leadership and bureaucracy.
Therefore, the catholic church is wholly responsible for all and every act of evil committed by it's agents.
The fact that the church can and has been sued and fined in various jurisdictions is proof that they are deemed responsible both for the acts, and their failure over the many millenia to protect the children.

It would serve the church greater if they can face the facts that the priesthood seem to either induce or attract mainly homosexual pedophiles.

clap for yourself.

When a catholic steals meat, the whole "catholic church" should be blamed, because "the catholic church is an institution".

TheBigUrban2: Sleep dey my eye.....I will reply you later on that thread

slip tight.

TheBigUrban2: Bros...no vex...


kai...this guy finish me

i never vex, at least not yet.

E b like say u reari no like this catholic church. I think i see u for d euthanasia thread.

Image123: Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

all you need to do is add vs 30 it.

"and those whom he predestined he also called; and those whom he called he also justified; and those whom he justified he also glorified".

That my dear is predestination unto glory, he foreknew and predestined some to be conformed to the image of his son, vs 30 goes futher and tells us that those who he predestined he called, he then justified and glorified. That is predestination unto glory.

Romans 11:2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel, saying,

Brother, like stated earlier, being predestined don't guarantee destination. God foreknew Israel but they all didn't attain or get there.

vs 30 disagrees with you! Those he predestined he called, those he called he justified and those he justified he glorified. For those presdestination to glory, clearly leads to glory.