₦airaland Forum

Peace!

Aren't there Muslim officials or officers among WAEC council administrator board? What have they done about it?

nowal:
Salam Alaykun Brothers and Sisters in Islam,
I very worried about an attitude and I would like to know the Islamic judgement of it.
I live in a very far place and I work on Lagos Island. For me to get to work at the appropriate time (8am), I have to leave my house by 5:10am and once I get into the bus, I can only get to Island some between 8am - 8:30 depending on traffic situations. Because of this, I have always observe my Subhi prayer by 5am before leaving home. I cant afford to wait to get to work around 8:30am to observe it and I would like to know which of the options is allowed and if none is allowed in Islam, what are my options?
Ma Salaam

Peace!

U have this problem because you don't believe you have performed salat unless you stand facing Qibla, bow and prostrate on the ground. And this is borne out of our culture as Muslims. Too much emphasis is laid on form with little or non on substance.

As per Quran 2:239, you should pray while sitting in the bus if your ride must begin at 5:00 a.m. Alternatively, you may consider starting off as early as 4:30 a.m so that you can stop midway and and hold your salat before proceeding. In the long run, you might have to relocate closer to your place of work or get your personal vehicle.

Salaam!

More on the right time to break the fast

I know that Ramadhan is long gone and I talked this matter several weeks ago. But we keep learning daily and the worst mistake a Muslim can make is to assume that Islamic knowledge is all confined to one era, school, denomination or sect.

I emphasisized last time on the need to delay Iftaar till full night instead of rushing to break it at sunset, because the Quran 2:187 rules that fasting must be completed into the night. A major argument against this position is that night begin at sunset and the breaking of fast by sunset is still in line with the verse above. I have already presented argument that night begin later than sunset and as dawn marks the end of the night instead of sunrise, dusk mark the start of night instead if sunset. To bolster this viewpoint, here is something worth pondering upon:

Traditional Muslim scholars teach that the Asr salat is the middle salat, thus if there are 5 daily salat, Fajr salat is the first and Isha is last of these salat. Traditionalists claim the night comes before day, that is, each day begin with a period of night that starts at sunset, followed and completed by a period of daylight. The vital question is this; IF THE NIGHT AND A NEW DAY BEGIN AT SUNSET, HOW DOES ISHA SALAT BECOME THE LAST OF THE DAILY SALAT INSTEAD OF THE FIRST?

Peace!

Salaam!
I will be introducing other questions regarding the authority of hadith books. For now, I choose to disregard any one bent on personal attack and disrespect emanating from religious zealotry. When you grant religious zealots opportunity to express themselves, they never fail to disappoint you.

Do traditions precede over the Scripture?

By "traditions", I mean the so called Hadith and sunnah. It is a known fact that in orthodox, mainstream Islamic jurisprudence, hadith take precedence over Qur'an. This result in traditional Muslims violating many laws and doctrines in the Quran, in order to keep their traditions which often negate the Quran. Here are two good examples:

1. The Quran(2:190, 60:8-9) explicitly forbid aggression against peaceful disbelievers. Peaceful disbelievers have a right to live and interact in Muslim societies.

But here is what Hadith books state about Jews and Christians in Arabia;

Sunan Abu Dawud》Tribute, Spoils and Rulership:::

ِJabir bin ‘Abd Allah said that he was told by ‘Umar bin Al Khattab that he heard the Apostle of Allaah( ﷺ ) say “I will certainly expel the Jews and the Christians from Arabia and I shall leave only Muslims in it.”

While this ban is not enforce all over Saudi Arabia today, non-Muslim are banned from entering Makkah or Madinah whether for a relative "s funeral or visit of a sick relative. If a non-Muslim in either cities reverts from Islam, he must leave the city, abandoning his home, family and job or will be thrown out by Shari'ah authorities in the city. This clearly contradict the peaceful and just teachings of the Quran, but regardless majority of orthodox Muslims accept it.


2. Over and over, the Quran explains the futility of taking intercessors and hoping for their intercession on the day of judgement.

Quran 2:48:::
And guard yourselves against a day when no soul will in aught avail another, nor will intercession be accepted from it, nor will compensation be received from it, nor will they be helped.

Quran 6:51::
And warn by it(Qur'an) those who fear that they will be gathered before their Lord - for them besides Him will be no protector and no intercessor - that they might become righteous

Yet, Orthodox Muslims at the expense of Quranic teachings keep traditions hailing Muhammad as an intercessor and promising them his intercession.


Suffice to add that the same Muslims who insist on ablution before holding Quran and who read hundreds of it verses daily, do not abide by its teachings. As the Qur'an(25:30) foretell, Muslims have deserted the Qur'an. Traditional Muslim jurists have abrogated, annulled or circumvented most of Quranic teachings with hearsay dubbed as "Hadith and Sunnah". The Books of hadith and fiqh now form the law of traditional Muslims and by allowing this, Muslims have disregarded the exclusivity of the authority of Quran for Islamic law.

We conclude here by pondering on the following verses:

Quran 68:35-38:::
Then will We treat the Muslims like the criminals?
What is [the matter] with you? How do you judge?
Or do you have a book in which you learn
That you have surely therein what you choose?

By accepting other books like Hadith and Fiqh to dictate their religion, Muslims answer affirmatively to the third of the above questions of God! Yes, these orthodox Muslims aside the Quran have books which they learn, in which they have everything they choose; from circumcision to stoning adulterers, from beards to hijab, from aggressive military invasion of non-Muslim land to slavery.

The Quran alone stipulates law in Islam, any law that cannot be confirmed by the Quran is not Islam. Nothing precede over the Quran!
Peace!

I will repost my last word and clarify my stand that Hadith books are filled with inconsistent description of salat which imply that different readers of Hadith books will reach different conclusion of salat depending on the Hadith the readers find. Below, I will list 4 Hadith that sharply contrast from the orthodox conception of salat:

Sahih Bukhari》Oath and Vows

Narrated by Abu Huraira:
A man entered the mosque and started praying while Allah's Apostle was sitting somewhere in the mosque . Then (after finishing the prayer ) the man came to the Prophet and greeted him. The Prophet said to him, "Go back and pray, for you have not prayed. The man went back, and having prayed, he came and greeted the Prophet. The Prophet after returning his greetings said, "Go back and pray, for you did not pray." On the third time the man said, "(O Allah's Apostle!) teach me (how to pray)." The Prophet said, z "When you get up for the prayer , perform the ablution properly and then face the Qibla and say Takbir (Allahu Akbar), and then recite of what you know of the Qur'an , and then bow, and remain in this state till you feel at rest in bowing, and then raise your head and stand straight; and then prostrate till you feel at rest in prostration, and then sit up till you feel at rest while sitting; and then prostrate again till you feel at rest in prostration; and then get up and stand straight, and do all this in all your prayers."

We find Hadith that imply Iqama must be done prior to taking and Fatiah must be said in all salat. The above Hadith teaches salat. Note that there is no mention of Iqama here, neither is Al Fatiah implied as compulsory but any chapter at all may be recited.

Sahih Bukhari》Friday Prayer

Narrated Abu Hazim bin Dinar:

The people went to Sahl bin Sa`d As-Sa`idi and told him that they had different opinions regarding the wood of the pulpit . They asked him about it and he said, "By Allah, I know of what wood the pulpit was made, and no doubt I saw it on the very first day when Allah's Apostle took his seat on it. Allah's Apostle sent for such and such an Ansari woman (and Sahl mentioned her name) and said to her, 'Order your slave -carpenter to prepare for me some pieces of wood (i.e. pulpit ) on which I may sit at the time of addressing the people.' So she ordered her slave -carpenter and he made it from the tamarisk of the forest and brought it (to the woman). The woman sent that ( pulpit ) to Allah's Apostle who ordered it to be placed here. Then I saw Allah's Apostle praying on it and then bowed on it. Then he stepped back, got down and prostrated on the ground near the foot of the pulpit and again ascended the pulpit. After finishing the prayer he faced the people and said, 'I have done this so that you may follow me and learn the way I pray.

Although we find hadith implying sitting between prostrations to be major act of salat. In contrary, the above Hadith Muhammad supposedly teaches salat. Note that all the physical acts including standing, bowing and prostration are mentioned but sitting between prostration is not.

Sahih Bukhari》Book of Salat

Narrated by Abu Qatada:

The Messenger of Allah ( ﷺ) led us in prayer and recited in the first two rak'ahs of the noon and afternoon prayers Surat al-Fitiha and two (other) surahs. And he would sometimes recite loud enough for us the verses. He would prolong the first rak'ah more than the second. And he acted similarly in the morning

Today Muslims recite their dhuhr and Asr silently. Of course there are hadith confirming this, but on the reverse, some hadith like the above relate that Muhammad did recite aloud in his dhuhur and asr salat.

Sahih Muslim》Book of salat, Number 1515:

“Ibn 'Abbas reported: The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) observed the noon and afternoon prayers together, and the sunset and Isha' prayers together without being in a state of fear or in a state of journey."

Several hadith list 5 periods for daily salat. This is contrary to the above hadith which reveal that Muhammad recognized 3 periods daily instead of 5 separate periods for salat. One period for morning salat, another for noon or afternoon and the third for sunset or night salat.

There you have it. In the midst of these contradictory hadith, one is left to cherrypick in order to perform salat. This is exactly what the Imams of fiqh have done. And hence orthodox Muslims learnt their salat from their Imams not the Hadith books and definitely not the Quran.

Salaam OneOpinion, I didn't learn salat from Hadith. I learnt it from my parent who also learnt it from their parents, not Hadith. 99% of Muslims did not learn salat from Hadith book but from communal practice of salat. And the reason for this being that Hadith books do not give a consistent, comprehensive methodology for salat. In some Hadith, Al Fatiah is not compulsory, in some Muhammad recite aloud in Dhuhur and Asr, in others sitting between sajda is not mentioned at all and in a few, Muhammad perform salat 3 periods daily, not 5. In short, you could study salat from Hadith and come up with a form that is different from what is orthodox.

Sahih Bukhari》Book of Oath and Vows
Narrated by Abu Huraira:
A man entered the mosque and started praying while
Allah's Apostle was sitting somewhere in the mosque .
Then (after finishing the prayer ) the man came to the
Prophet and greeted him. The Prophet said to him, "Go
back and pray, for you have not prayed. The man went
back, and having prayed, he came and greeted the
Prophet. The Prophet after returning his greetings said,
"Go back and pray, for you did not pray." On the third
time the man said, "(O Allah's Apostle!) teach me (how
to pray)." The Prophet said, "When you get up for the
prayer , perform the ablution properly and then face the
Qibla and say Takbir (Allahu Akbar), and then recite of
what you know of the Qur'an , and then bow, and remain
in this state till you feel at rest in bowing, and then
raise your head and stand straight; and then prostrate
till you feel at rest in prostration, and then sit up till you
feel at rest while sitting; and then prostrate again till
you feel at rest in prostration; and then get up and stand straight and do this all in your prayer

In the above, Muhammad supposedly teach a man to pray. There is no mention of Iqama and just any verse one knows may be recited, not necessarily Al fatiah. See below for other Hadith confirming 3 periods for salat and recitation of Dhuhur and Asr salat aloud and a description of Muhammad salat acts without sitting between prostration.


If the Quran did not give a predefined format for salat, it mean there is no defined format of holding salat; a flexible ritual not fixed. It doesn't mean the Quran alone is insufficient guide to Islam. God mention standing, invocation, prostration for salat (Quran 17:110, 4:101-103), regardless of how these are done, this is salat in its basic form. Even before Islam, the Arabs understood this.

grownaira:
It is either you are lying and by extension covering the truth, or you are ignorant (in the real sense of the word) of Islamic history. if the first is the case, then i feel sorry for you, and I pray to Allah to guide yo aright. If the second is the case, then i will enlighten you a bit;

In the year of 10 Hijri the Muslims opened the land of Bahrain and conquered it. The Prophet appointed Sayyidina Amr bin Hazam Al Ansari as the governor of Yemen. Upon that occasion, the Prophet had Sayyidina Ubay ibn Ka’b write a booklet in relation to the orders of Shariah. This booklet was given to Amr bin Hazam Al Ansari. In the booklet, apart from general advices, orders pertaining to the following matters were detailed: Purity, Salah, Zakat, Hajj, Umrah, Jihad Fi Sabilillah, Booty, Governmental administration and Educational organisation etc. The Companion of the Prophet Amr bin Hazam acted in accordance with the advice and orders detailed in this booklet.

After his death, it went into the ownership of his grandson Abu Bakr, Imam Zahri (died 125AH) stated: ‘I have seen this booklet with my own eyes.

It is also from this very book that Imam Zahri رحمه الله used to teach his students. The very Ahadith that were found in the booklet of Sayyidina Amr bin Hazam can be found in many of the great books of Ahadith today (Sahih Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, Muwatta Imam Malik, Sunan Abu Dawood, Nasai, Ibn Majah, Jami Tirmidhi, Sunan Baihaqi, Ibn Abi Shaibah, Sahih Ibn Habban, etc).

The written accounts and manuscripts of the Companions of the Prophet have been preserved and presented in the form of a book to this present day. Even after the time of the Companions of the Prophet the knowledge of writing, memorising and teaching the Ahadith of the Prophet has been continuously flourishing and carried from generation to generation. Sayyidina Umar bin Abdul Aziz made a great effort upon the Scholars of Islam to preserve the sayings and teachings of the Prophet , through writing, memorising and teaching the masses. It was the very time of Umar bin Abdul Aziz that we find such Imams as Abu Bakr bin Hazam (died 120AH) and Imam Ibn Shahab Zahri (died 125AH).

Imam Malik (born 93AH – died 179AH) resided in Madinah Munawarah and taught the Hadith of the Prophet from the pulpit in the Masjid of the Prophet . The book that has been recorded with the very Ahadith that Imam Malik would relate in his Hadith classes in the Masjid of the Prophet can be found even today in the book known as Muwatta Imam Malik, in the same form of Hadith, as it was recorded in the lifetime of Prophet

Well, no one will dispute Muhammad wrote instructions on varying issues even beyond Islam for his people, after all Muhammad was also a political leader of a multi-religious, multi-cultural society. The question is, are these instructions revelations as the Qur'an or just Muhammad 's personal instruction?
If the booklet on shariah you mentioned above covered divine revelation not covered in Qur'an, how come the book is extant and what necessitated Umar ibn Abdul Aziz to call for collection of Hadith 85 years after? If Hadith were compiled as divine revelation at the time of Muhammmad, like the Qur'an, we will have only one consistent book by one writer containing all Hadith of Muhammad, instead of multiple books with varying Hadith by multiple authors who lived at different times after Muhammad.

The first official attempt to collect Hadith as Qur'an was by Umar ibn Khattab. But Umar is reported to have reversed his decision burnt the unofficial writings of Hadith and called Muslims to Qur'an Alone. Umar ibn Abdul Aziz(717-720) attempted compiling the Hadith about 80 years after this, no Hadith book dating that era can be accessed today. The oldest Hadith book(Malik Muwatta) date no earlier than 754 AD, over 100 years after Muhammad.

I recommend you see this; https://flamesoftruth./2014/11/08/look-again-in-those-books/

Your knowledge of the interpretation of the Qur'an is not only ridiculous, but also pathetic. so i am not gona say much on this. Allah azza wa jal sent the Prophet with the Qur'an, and He commanded the Prophet to explain to mankind the Qur'an which was sent to them. This is simply because the Qur'an needs to be understood as Allah wants it to be understood, and not the way we choose to understand it.

"With clear signs and Books (We sent the Messengers). And We have also sent down unto you (O Muhammad SAW) the reminder and the advice (the Qur'an), that you may explain clearly to men what is sent down to them, and that they may give thought".[Qur'an 16:44]

Verses of Qur'an attest that it is a self explanatory and fully detailed book(Qur'an 6:114, 7:52, 10:37, 12:111, 16:89). The phrase(bayyinah) you translated in 16:44 as "explain clearly" is more appropriately translated as make known/manifest/plain. Muhammad alone receives the revelation. He make the revelation known/manifest/plain(bayyinah) to the people. This is the implication of the verse.

No wonder you and your likes always interpret the Qur'an in a pathetic manner. You don't accept the hadith which shades more light to the Ummah towards better understanding the divine Book from Allah, but you choose to interpret and explain the Qur'an yourselves in a way that best suits your whims and caprices. The funny thing is that you expect people to accept your interpretations. of course some of the ignorant and gullible will.

Suit yourself. You follow traditions of men instead of keeping the book of God. There is nothing of the Qur'an you keep today. You 've distorted the Islamic principles of monotheism, peace and justice in order to keep the traditions of your elders(Hadith). How ever deviant we are, we are tolerant and never shove our teachings down any one 's throat. You can't boast of that. Despite your population relative to ours, your petrol dollars, your institutions including universities, organisations, banks, Mosques, websites, bookstores and seminars worldwide, you rely heavily on censorship, force and double dealing to propagate your creed.

grownaira:
This thread was opened based on the request of the brother usermane, who apparently seems not to accept the hadith/sunnah of the Prophet Muhammad (upon whom be peace).

The brother was asked to explain what the bolded in the ayaat below stands for, so let's await his response.

''Do not make [your] calling of the Messenger among yourselves as the call of one of you to another. Already Allah knows those of you who slip away, concealed by others. So let those beware who dissent from the Prophet's order, lest fitnah strike them or a painful punishment.''{Qur'an 24:63}.

"No, by your Lord, they do not believe until they submit to your adjudication in all disputes between them, then they do not find themselves oppressed with your decisions and they completely submit." {Qur'an 4:65}

We pray that Allah in His infinite mercy guide us to the straight and right path.

I did tell you, didn't I? Unless you can explain why for over 100 years of Muhammad Prophethood & early Islam, there was no official collection of Hadith, you are wasting our time.

As for Qur'an 24:63 which you pointed, it has no relevance to the hearsay about Muhammad compiled by Bukhari, Muslim or Malik no earlier than 120 years after Muhammad 's death. No Muslim can be confronted of dissenting from the Prophet order for rejecting these hearsay. Whatever Muhammad ordered have to be backed by the Qur'an. If it isn't backed by the Qur'an, then evidently it cannot be Muhammad 's order, so it isn't Islamic. This lead us the other verse you cited.

To best understand Qur'an 4:65, it is essential realize what Muhammad was required to judge or abjure by. Does Muhammad judge by his reason, wishes or what? We look at the 40th verse from this verse:

Qur'an 4:105
Lo! We reveal unto thee the Scripture
with the truth, that thou mayst judge between
mankind by that which Allah showeth thee. And be
not thou a pleader for the treacherous

As the above and several verses confirm, Muhammad is bound by the Qur'an and cannot pass judgements outside it on Islam. Hadith books are filled with laws that aren't backed by Qur'an, such cannot be Muhammad 's traditions.

Peace!

I will list 2 more myths or lies about Khawarij and then list out references.

D. Khawarij killed Uthman bin Affan on accusation of disbeleif

This is highly disputable claim. For one, the word "Khawarij" was first used to define the group from Ali bin Talib 's faction who withdrew their support for Ali. This was after Uthman 's death & thus it stand to reason that Uthman 's killer's were never identified as Khawarij. Uthman 's killers could been of shiis, sunnis or any group fed up with Uthman 's regime. In fact Abu Bakr As Sadik 's son, Muhammad ibn Abu Bakr is cited by historians as one of the slayers of Uthman. He was not a Khawarij.

For two, Uthman was not killed on charges of disbelief. Like Ali, Uthman 's opponents initially demanded Uthman abdicate. Uthman 's refusal to abdicate promoted the killers to strike.

E. Khawarij wage war on Muslims while overlooking non-Muslims

The Khawarij never went attacking and looting properties of Muslims like the Wahhabis/ISIS/Boko Haram/Al Qaida do. Rather, the Khawarij in Muslim history rose several times against corrupt and oppressive regimes of the Ummayad and Abbasid caliphs. And even then, not all Khawarij resorted to insurgency or war against those regimes.

Khawarij rejected the Sunni tradition that a caliph is God 's representative on earth and all his transgression must be tolerated as long as he perform salat. This explains why Khawarij rose against regimes, resulting in Khawarij colliding with soldiers of the regimes who just happen to be Muslims.




References:
For a deeper and less subjective understanding of Khawarij and their history, try;
Essentials of Ibadi Islam, by Valarie J Hoffman
Modern Intellectual Reading of the Khawarij, by Hussam S Timani.

The following books discusses Islamic laws and rituals on broader perspective, making references to sects like Khawarij and their positions on issues like penalty for adultery;
A handbook of Islam: Abridged Edition of Religion of Islam, by Maulana Muhammad Ali
Body of Text: The Emergence of Sunni law of Ritual Purity, by Marion Holimes Katz.


These are historical books on early Muslims that also discussed events leading assassination of Uthman and Ali:
A Restatement of the History of Islam and Muslims, by Sayyid Ali Ashgar.
After the Prophet: The Epic Story of Shia-Sunni Split in Islam, by Lesley Hazleton

grownaira:
wikipaedia, britanic are what we saw on your post. you know about books from traditional Muslim scholars, so why referring us to wikipaedia and co?

To the best of my knowledge, you, wikipaedia, britanica, etc are no authority when it comes to discussing trivial issues pertaining Islam. Like i said, refer us to known acceptable books, and we take it from dia.

Well, this isn't an Islamic issue but an historical one. Britanicca and Wikipedia while not authorative as far as history is concerned can be a starting point for historical research on internet. I wont be refering you to any book because most likely you wont be able to access these books but you can search on Google Books and there are few pro-traditional Islamic sites I could refer you later on.

As for your claims as regards to hadith (which is the main reason why i responded to your post in the first place), tell us what the bolded means in the the ayaat below;

''Do not make [your] calling of the Messenger among yourselves as the call of one of you to another. Already Allah knows those of you who slip away, concealed by others. So let those beware who dissent from the Prophet's order, lest fitnah strike them or a painful punishment.''{Qur'an 24:63}.


"No, by your Lord, they do not believe until they submit to your adjudication in all disputes between them, then they do not find themselves oppressed with your decisions and they completely submit." {Qur'an 4:65}

Open a separate thread and let us discuss, so we don't derail this thread. And unless you can explain genuinely why Muhammad and his companions failed to compile Hadith Books, you may be wasting our time.

grownaira:
Sorry to say all that you wrote appears to be thrash. Backup your claims with known Islamic historic books and don't refer people to britannica, wikipaedia etc. Any dude that knows how to type and use the internet can upload anything.

"Thrash" is a relative term. Beleive what ever pleases you. Most of the claims in my last post are backed by books from traditional Muslim scholars. Perhaps if you develop stronger appetite for research study with history books instead of dwelling constantly on televangelists and lecturers, you won't react so poorly. I am not here to spoonfeed anyone, particularly Nigerians. I have left enough in my last post to motivate personal research and confirmation. Most people only appreaciate what they uncover from personal research, not what is laid bare before them. Am willing to provide references for the few who are open minded about Muslim history. I won't waste my time on the majority who are subjective and fanatical.

kennyosein, you have presented a very shallow historical overview about the khawarij, filled with preconceived notions. Most Muslims think of boko haram, ISIS or Al Qaida when khawarij is mentioned because they selectively study Muslim history from Muslim scholars, never study Muslim history from secular scholars like Benard Lewis or authors like Daniel Cook or Lesley Hazleton.

Here are a few myths or lies about the khawarij

A. The Khawarij were extremists, intolerant and blood thirsty Muslim sect who excommunicate and kill sinners and apostates.

False! In every sect; Sunni, Shiites, Sufis, Salafis there are extremists who excommunicate and kill apostates and sinners. These vices are not limited to the Khawarij. For instance, Sunni sect deem a Muslim who refuse to pray for 3 consecutive days to be an apostate to be executed.
Many Khawarij rejected stoning of adulterers. Whereas Sunnis, Shiites, Sufis and Salafis stone adulterers. So there were moderate, tolerant and peaceful Kharijites creed and practical wise.

B. The Khawarij forced Ali to arbitrate at the battle of siffin only to blame him for arbitration rebel and turn against him.

Wrong and misleading. The Khawarij opted for arbitration on ground that Ali and Muawiya resolve issues and restore peace to the war torn empire, unfortunately the duo failed. Fed up, khawarij withdrew to a neutral stand demanding Ali and Muawiya abdicate to allow the masses elect someone else. Both Ali and Muawiya turned down this demand, culminating in assasination attempts against them. Muawiya narrowly escaped but Ali wasn't as fortunate.

It is not true that the Khawarij killed Ali because he arbitrated in the battle of siffin rather than fight Muawiya 's forces till God decide fate.

C. Khawarij rejected Muhammad 's tradition (sunnah)

Another deception. Muhammad had no tradition aside the Qur'an which was compiled as early as his life time. Khawarij accepted the Qur'an. What Khawarij rejected were majority or all of Sunni and Shiites traditions(hadith) fabricated and ascribed to Muhammad.

If hadith books are authorative in Islamic law, why wasn't there an official collection till 8 decades after Muhammad 's death? How could Muhammad and his companions leave such a delicate task to their descendants if they recognized the authority of Hadith. The earliest hadith book in our possession(Malik Muwatta) date 15 decades after Muhammad.

You can read more on Khawarij from Britannica, Wikipedia and Google books. I will provide adequate link to webpages that seek a more objective and detailed explanation of Khawarij.

Why so offended, Empiree? You do this to others who do not share your discourse. You even go far to insult, demonize and mock them(including me). Had i posted names of some whom i respect as Muslim scholars or thinkers, you and several others would have aided the Wahabbis here in condemning them. Fortunately, i don't put scholars on a pedestal. I am far drawn to the message than the messenger. I neither blindly reject nor accept their words so i couldn't care less of you or anyone abusing my them.

So, enough. The traditional Muslim community is not wired towards Islamic pluralism and tolerance of counter religious viewpoints and this is the problem. This problem is not limited to kennyosein or the hardliners, but extends to the general orthodox Muslim community.

Sufi, hmm... It get clearer now, doesnt it? The discernible opposition towards Wahhabis, the relentless defence for invoking Muhammad in Salat and the cherry picking of Hadith whilst refusing to admit the spurious origins of Hadith books all add up.

Sissie:
@Kennyosein it's either you go back and edit your post or I edit it for you. If you cannot make your points without insults then you keep quiet.

This is unfair, kennyosein 's post might have been a bit impolite but there is nothing insultive in it. You and your friends are embittered simply because you admire these scholars and put them on a pedestal. There are persons calling other posters "hypocrite and dajjal" in this section and you don't mind. In one of my last threads, someone posted a silly gif mocking me and he wasn't even corrected by any of you. Those scholars kenny condemned couldn't care less about a Nairaland poster yet you are offended.

More Hadith prohibiting pictures:

(Sahih-Al- Bukhari, 7.833, Narrated by Abu Talha)

The Prophet said, 'Angels do not enter a house in which there are dogs or pictures'.

Sahih Muslim

We were with Masruq at the house of Yasar bin Numair. Masruq saw pictures on his terrace and said, "I heard 'Abdullah saying that he heard the Prophet saying, "The people who will receive the severest punishment from Allah will be the picture makers.'"

Hadith 7.844 (Al-Bukhari Hadith)

(Narrated by Salim's father: Once Gabriel promised to visit the Prophet but he delayed and the Prophet got worried about that. At last he came out and found Gabriel and complained to him of his grief (for his delay). Gabriel said to him, "We do not enter a place in which there is a picture or a dog."

Hadith 7.844 (Al-Bukhari Hadith)

(the wife of the Prophet) I bought a cushion having pictures on it. When Allah's Apostle saw it, he stopped at the gate and did not enter. I noticed the signs of hatred (for that) on his face! I said, "O Allah's Apostle! I turn to Allah and His Apostle in repentance! What sin have I committed?" He said, "What about this cushion?" I said, - I bought it for you to sit on and recline on." Allah's Apostle said, "The makers of these pictures will be punished (severely) on the Day of Resurrection and it will be said to them, 'Make alive what you have created.'" He added, "Angels do not enter a house in which there are pictures."(narrated by Ayesha).

kennyosein:
Bro you need to learn more about the deen especially the science of hadeeth.

I see, the man made "science of hadith" has become part of the deen. FYI, i am quite familiar with science of hadith, not a novice. Anyone who has taken time to study it can see it is subjective and the earlier scholars differed on the authenticity of reports or credibility of narrators. That explains why the Sunnis have their own sahih hadith collection, shiite have theirs, sufis and other sect that have gone extinct each have their distinct collection.

kennyosein: Bro a Muslim who violate rulings of Sahih hadith's can't be compared to a Muslim who rejects the rulings of a hadith's, the former is a sinner while the latter as disbeliever.

No kenny, rejecting hearsay attributed to Muhammad & compiled no earlier than 8 decades after Muhammad 's death is caution, not disbelief.

Been keeping my finger crossed here. Yes, there are sahih hadith clearly forbidding drawing or pictures of man or animals but most orthodox Muslims still take selfies and wouldn't mind photographs or video records of animals in their possession. The reason for this being that most Muslims are credulous followers of mainstream clerics and do not care for objective analysis on Islam. Tell these Muslims you reject hadith on Qur'anic, historical, rational ground and they 'll condemn you. Yet they violate the rulings of many of these 'sahih hadith' while championing Qur'an + Sunna defines Islam.

amaben2020:
with time they mostly come on PC

that will be when most gamers turn to PC and most parents wont mind dishing out huge amount of money to get their 12 years old a PC

PEACE!

In probably my last post on this thread for a while, i attempt to define night. What characterizes night, does it begin at sunset or ends at sunrise? It is essential to answer these questions in determining the time to break the fast, a subject i have been writing here.

Eating, drinking and sex is permitted during the nights of Ramadan, but all these cease when a white thread becomes distinguishable from a black thread as explained in Qur'an 2:187. This is when the first light appears in the horizon; dawn. Hence, the night ends here, as beyond here food, drinks and sex must be abstained from. Thus, anything from dawn is 'day'.

The day is characterized by presence of light in the horizon. The light appear and remain in the horizon at dawn, increasing through sunrise, noon and decreasing through afternoon, sunset. At sunset, it is the sun disc that disappears from the horizon, the light still remains after sunset, gradually fading till it disappear completely after a while. This is the end of day and onset of night. And thus, this is when fasting is complete, not just after sunset.

The period between darkness and sunset like the period between dawn and sunrise must be recognized as day, not night because it is characterized by presence of light in the horizon, how ever dim the light may be.

amaben2020:
yeah he's right, the only problem is that some PC have weak gpu and only play games in low settings, High end gaming beasts like Asus republic of gamers, Alienware etc would bring any gaming title to it's knees, when playing Ryse son of Rome on ps4, it would look like child's play when compared to an Alienware side by side

don't also forget that way many games are console exclusives. It could take time for PC version to be released, that is if it will. Untill this improves or excellent console emulators for PC are developed, console dominates PC in gaming.

I prefer console gaming. The technical issues with PC gaming can be frustrating. RAM size requirement, GPU requirement, video/audio card requirement of PC games vary and your PC may not be equipped enough for some of these games. I "ll rather get a console where i fully guarantees smooth gaming experience without having to worry about laggy gameplay or choppy sound. Away from home i may consider PC(laptop), but otherwise, it is console all the way.