₦airaland Forum

LadyT:
4him if your wonderful girls were so lowkey you wouldnt have seen their pictures or have any other commnication with them

who told u?

LadyT:
@4him just because I put my picture and my email means I'm advertising What century do we live in.  
Yes I know I will get bullshit emails thats you men all over what I don't expect is you guys not to understand the meaning of FRIENDSHIP.

Madam T, its just like putting up ur picture on a billboard in Oshodi and expressing surprise that you are getting snide comments.

morenike09:
no david, there's attention and then there's too much attention.

I don't like attention . . . u wont see me hanging dollar notes on the door of my apt.

morenike09:
this is not mainly about the pix, but that the dude can't understand the meaning of friendship. yes, you're right that not all african men can't understand the meaning of friendship, but the majority that do is very low.

then keep your contact addresses out of sight.

morenike09:
and this guys wonder why some of us dnt bother to put our pix on our Nairaland profile . . .

face it, most women don't have their pictures on Nairaland because they are not presentable . . . period.

morenike09:
i gave up on that, i can't risk heart attack every time someone saves my pix and them tried to image-edit it. . .

its just a picture . . . frankly less than 0.1% of those who see pictures will take a second look at it.

morenike09:
@NLers
just because a lady shines her teeth at you and jokes with you does not give any indication that she "likes" you. . .she's just JOKING with you. c'mon guys, grab the idea of friendship, dnt go too deep under the surface

We already know . . . the funny thing is most of the really cute chics here never put their pictures and contact addresses online. You'd be surprised at the number of wonderful girls here who simply keep a low profile. I'll keep my lips sealed on that.
Spare us the complaints o jare.

bish2001:
I am yet to see a member of Christ Embassy attacking any other christian group; why, because we are too busy decorating the church for Christ's coming.

I doubt if u are truly waiting for Christ's coming. If you knew u'd be aware that Christ is coming NOT for a physical building but for u and me. Decorate ur lives first with Holiness before u start putting balloons on the walls of ur local church.

Not all guys do that, maybe u were just unlucky to have a conversation with a weirdo.

Anyway . . . when you put up your picture (a very large one if i may add) and left your email address did you expect not to recieve unsolicited mail?
I find it bizare that women put up their pictures on this site and then complain when they start getting attention they claim not to be interested in. You cant have it both ways . . . if u have a fiance then you have no busines putting ur email address and picture out there were others can access it.

Salvation 101

Salvation is like being born anew into a new family - 1 Peter 2:2 As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:

But an important component of being a baby is that he/she grows. No parent wants to carry a baby forever . . . they long that the newborn will grow into a strong child and then into an adult.

But how does this baby grow? By sleeping all day and drinking milk alone? Lets have Paul's perspective . . . Heb 5:13 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe

uh oh . . . so we are required to become skilled in the word of righteousness? But how? By going to bed and listening to "motivational" sermons every sunday?

What on earth is Paul talking about? Heb 5:12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.

Paul's made this even worse . . . so at some stage the born again baby shld become a teacher/skilled in the word of righteousness? I thot we werent supposed to work again after being born again?

Heb 5:14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

Strong meat? So God is expecting this baby to have grown strong enough to develop powerful molars to chew meat and a well developed digestive system to handle meat . . . wow.

How does this baby grow if he isnt expecting to put in any work after his salvation?

Tayo-D:
@4Him,
I didn't know that people have to earn their salvation like they earn their A1s and C4s in an exam, as if Christ's work wasn't enough. You are yet to tell me how much work it takes to earn salvation. A little or a lot? What is the benchmark? I just can't believe what i am seeing here on nairaland. Do you know what happens when you seek to be justified by your works? Hear Paul: Galatians 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace. Please spend time tonight and try and study or read through the book of Galatians. Maybe we can study from there.

You totally misinterpreted my analogy.
I never intended to say that you EARN your salvation like you would earn a placement in a secondary school via a common entrance.

Salvation (it is a free gift but pls look at the analogy instead of reading literal meanings) is like a common entrance exam . . . now after getting into secondary school you dont just go home and sit down waiting for ur SSCE certificate after 6 yrs . . . u advance with each exam to even higher classes getting to learn more advanced stuff than you were required to know when u were writing the common entrance.

So is the same with salvation . . . all you needed was to believe in your heart and confess with ur mouth and Christ in His mercy made the blood He shed on the cross to avail for our unworthy souls.

But is salvation the end of the story? Are we once saved forever saved? NO! That is why Paul kept telling the brethren to work out their salvation with fear and trembling . . . he wasnt telling them to work for their salvation rather he was telling them that there was yet more work to do.
The bible says be ye therefore perfect even as my Father who is in heaven is perfect . . . you will agree with me that only saved people can be even talk about aspiring to be perfect (just like only a bonafide secondary school student can study for SS1 exams).
How do we grow to perfection? How do we live a Holy life? Are these not part of working out ur salvation?

What about trials and temptations that are like advanced classes for believers? What about the strong meat and bones Paul encouraged his followers to desire? Will you remain on the milk of salvation forever?

you dont earn ur salvation, you recieve it as a free gift HOWEVER that is never the end of the story. There is a lot of growing to do after that and that is what everyone else is trying to make you see!

Tayo-D:
@jokepearl,
If I understand you clearly based on the context with which you quoted this scripture, you are trying to say our salvation wasn't guaranteed in Christ; and that we are to do some work to make sure it doesn't slip away. If that is the case, then Hebrews 10:29 aptly describes your position: Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? You have largely said the blood of Christ wasn't enough to pay for your salvation.

Uncle . . . this is another case of reading the bible upside down. Take a deep breath and read that chapter all over again. What was Paul describing in verse 29 of Hebrews 10?

Read contextually . . . go a step or two ahead and read from verse 26:For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

First we need to be clear that Paul was talking to SAVED believers in this chapter . . . 2. Paul was warning them . . . that you are saved is NOT a guarantee that you can go back to sin WILFULLY (knowingly) thinking that ur earlier salvation would cover for ur sins . . . no. Verse 29 simply says it is a graver offence for you to sin AFTER you have come to the knowledge of Christ's saving grace. Once saved is never a guarantee that you are forever saved . . . if u sin again you go to hell straight as that blood will not avail for subsequent sins if you fail to repent.

Tayo-D:
Please tell me, how much work have you done today to guarantee that you don't lose your salvation? How much sin have you avoided to guarantee that God will consider you righteous? How much more do you need to do to earn God's favour and salvation? Please let us know.

The bible encourages believers to GROW IN THE FAITH . . . is this work too?

Tayo-D:
The scripture you quoted doesn't in anyway say you have to work to make your salvation sure. The guarantee of your salvation is Christ's blood, not your own righteousness. What the Bible says in Phillipians 2:12 is that you should allow an outworking of your inward salvation. The word "work" in that verse isn't in the original greek manuscripts. the translators put it there for a better understanding of the verse, but in this case, it threw it off. Here are some translations that'll help you understand what I am saying better.

NLT- Dearest friends, you were always so careful to follow my instructions when I was with you. And now that I am away you must be even more careful to put into action God's saving work in your lives, obeying God with deep reverence and fear.

Young's Literal Translation - So that, my beloved, as ye always obey, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, with fear and trembling your own salvation work out,

Basic English - So then, my loved ones, as you have at all times done what I say, not only when I am present, but now much more when I am not with you, give yourselves to working out your salvation with fear in your hearts;

What new light has ur translations shed on this contentious verse? I dont see any difference at all.

stillwater:
_{I can't even think of an annoying response to slice your ego into bits Damn it!!!!!!!!}

awww now why would u want to slice my ego into pieces?
I'd gladly help u push if i could.

stillwater:
I'm glad to have been born a woman. Father you are wonderful

its not like you have much of a choice. Now go practice pushing.

Just my imagination (promo video) Boyz II Men

[flash=425,355]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-_v6iBYxzc&rel=1[/flash]

Enjoy.

I'm glad to have been born a man. Father you are wonderful.

Isnt it funny that Richy Black accuses Isreal of being an apartheid state - a state where 20% of its population is arab.

What is the population of Jews in Gaza or Lebanon, Jordan or Egypt?

Some pple need to return to school or maybe they are even beyond help.

Alphazee:
Assuming I agree that Adam, created by God had committed sin on my behalf and the same God (who created Adam, the sinner) had sent someone (Jesus) to die for me because I unjustly inherited Adam's sin, is the equation not balanced? Why then would I need to pray?

the christian doctrine does not apply to you. By all means continue as al'lah's slave.

Tayo-D:
What more do you do after accepting Christ to obtain salvation? Please share this "another" Gospel with us.

what else do you do after passing common entrance?

Snake tastes a bit like chicken necks.

Try squids.

Tornadoz:
Say the word Israel and up pop's 4him/davidylan. Its a shame a Nigerian would get so mired in other people's conflict. The Jews themselves don't give a flying f*ck if you existed. Seriously dude Israel should be the least of your worries I tell you that.

Seriously dude Davidylan's preferences should be the least of your worries i tell you that.

Ibime's post is so full of rubbish you dont know where to start.

Alright . . . having read the last few experiences i think i would personally rush my wife in for a CS if she stays in labour for more than 1hr.
Rather that than pronounced limps, debilitating pains and bad pelvises.

Tayo-D:
@4Him,
In other words, salvation is a process for you. So have you obtained oit or still wsorking towards it. How holy must you become before God kicks in Christ's sacrifice? Do you even realise what you are saying?

My dear . . . how else do i explain this? You seem to take my words out of context!
The bible says . . . Work out your salvation with fear and trembling . . . maybe you can ask Paul what he meant.

the gods are hungry . . .
Sacrifice a red cock and sprinkle its blood around your basement.
Put some porridge and gin around the nearest T-junction to your house.

Chew some alligator pepper thoroughly and spew it under into some vodka . . . make a paste with it and spread it on your door.

Hang a 4 day old frog by its left leg around your gate.

You shld be safe.

Tayo-D:
@4Him,
How many of these live under the dispensation where Jesus said the Holy Spirit will only convict them of the sin of not believing in Jesus Christ? Is it yur option A, B or C?

that is not the question at all . . . and i'm tired of running in unproductive circles . . .

Tayo-D:
Message of salvation is for Unbels. This is my focus on this topic, and not the Believers. Salvation is all about believing in Christ. It has nothing to do with a personal righteous lifestyle. Have we been addressing different issues here?

Please we are even assuming that those people who sit in awe in 30000 capacity churches are even saved in the first place. Most are not.
Salvation is not ONLY about believing in Christ . . . it includes repentance from sin, living a Holy life and being an example of the believers!

Passing common entrance is the only way to secondary school but it is NOT the begining and end of secondary school education. You need to study and pass other exams too.

almondjoy:
All I need to mention is Israel and you show up. The very reason I will not discuss that topic. We have dealt with that at length on Nairaland and really cannot afford the serious headache of revisiting that topic. Obviously you missed the analogy to Nigeria and Bakassi. Too bad! That is only as a result of your one track mind! Couldn't have expected less from you.

Your attempt to use Bakassi as an analogy fell flat and exposed your ignorance. Do you know how Bakassi got to Camerounian hands from the Gowon government? Of course not, go and play in the family section.

almondjoy:
We are only saying to remove the log in your eye before you see the speck in others! We have had worse leaders than Castro all over the world. He should not get preferencial treatment by being demonized.

Puhlease. We've had worse leaders so Castro shld go on and die a saint?

Tayo-D:
My reference to Christ and the OT is in reference to salvation. Salvation as we know it is a NT thingy, and Jesus only lived in the OT. As for Stephen, I learnt from him how not to preach the message of salvation. Peter did a better job, and we all know that even Peter is not always right in the head even though his heart is always right.

My brother . . . i will not be hasty to thrash Stephen at all! Neither you nor I are worthy to touch the lapels of his coat.

Peter did a better job? Because he managed to live longer than stephen? What about his frequent jailing? What about his eventual crucifiction? Did we learn how not to write a pastoral letter from him then?

Paul was also killed . . . what did we learn from him? How not to preach to kings?

James was beheaded by Herod . . . what did we learn? How not to preach the gospel?

John the baptist lost his head in a charger . . . what did we learn? How not to tell a king not to steal his brother's wife?

Christ was nearly stoned . . . flogged and eventually crucified . . . what did we learn? How not to be a Messiah?

Bro, be careful how you talk about biblical men of God.

nwando:
but I've read a whole lot of don't preach and mention  sin or you may aggravate folks and be stoned.
No wonder our churches are filled with "christians" cohabiting,fornicating and having Children out of wedlock afterall they have come to Christ.
They are now supposed to be merry and live the best life they can live.
Brother that is false theology when touted as the way to preach
There is time for reproof and chastisement.
There is time to tell people they reason like their father,the devil.
It is very scriptural .

My sister! This is EXACTLY what i have been trying to say all along. Thank you for capturing it in so very few words . . .

Unce Tayo-D, we now have pastors who are too afraid to speak with the boldness of Stephen . . . infact we even accuse him of wasting his life since no one was saved by his words.
Dear, we are too afraid to confront sin . . . our pastors all declare their divorce status like its some badge of honor, we have "fiance and fiancees" who live together, smile and shout praise God!

The people in our churches today would not hesitate to stone Bro Stephen shld he ever have cause to come back and speak to them for 30mins!
We play the lottery and give testimony of God's provision, all our lives and pastoral books are geared towards SELF GLORIFICATION couched in the name of Jesus, single moms and homosexuals have never felt more comfortable in the church, our political leaders are rewarded with the front pews in the house of Gawd . . . and yet we rubbish the words of Stephen and other apostles who gave their lives that they may be an example to us.

On that day . . . the blood of those faithful men will rise in judgement against this generation. May God spare us.

Tayo-D:
@4Him,
Okay, now you are going overboard. Me condemn Stephen? You need to use that word with some restraint please.

appologies there for the wrong use of words. Perhaps it was not ur intention to do so.

Tayo-D:
So what caused the people to get angry after they've silently listened to Stephen's preaching for probably close to 30 minutes or more? Let's try and be honest here and just cut to the chase. They only stoned him because they felt he blasphemed, but they were angry with him 'because of something else.

Acts 7: 54 When they heard these things, they were cut to the heart, and they gnashed on him with their teeth.
What made these men angry? What were the words that "cut to the heart"?
Was Stephen wrong to point them to the truth even though it stung so bad?

Why did they stop their ears (verse 57) and rush to stone him outside the city? What is this "something else" that made them angry? These same men where ready to stone Jesus Christ earlier on . . . why?

Tayo-D:
My dear, the word of God does not condemn you of sin. It convicts you.

thanks for the correction.

Tayo-D:
For the unbleivers, the only sin the Holy Spirit convicts them of is that of Jesus Christ.

This is not right. Why were the pple of Soddom and Gomorrah condemned?
Why were the jews forced into exile in Babylon?
Why was God angry with the people of Nineveh?

Tayo-D:
The only righteousness he encourages them to accept is that which is the gift from God, and not the self righteousness we are asking of them. If the world is convicted of some sin other than that of not believing in Jesus, believe me, that is not the Holy Spirit at work. It's probably just their conscience; or at worst a preacher's fiery demand of self roghteousness from them.

You're begining to get tied up in ur arguments. I doubt if anyone is saying anything about self-righteousness. The key grouse in this debate has been the reluctance of men of Gawd in the WOFM to boldly declare the truth about salvation, to confront the sinful lifestyle of their flock and teach them what Christ taught - he that believeth not is CONDEMNED ALREADY.

Tayo-D:
The repentance required of an Unbel is that towards Christ. An Unbel who repents of fornication is still an unbel. The only time an Unbel is saved is when he repents of his unbelief in Jesus Christ.

So pls how does an unbel sitting under mushy messages of "hope", encouragement, motivation e.t.c. repent of his unbelief?
How does a man get saved if his pastor says the message of heaven and hell is "just not me"?

Thread number what now are we on?

Tayo-D:
Does anyone agree with me that obdience to the law is not a prerequisite to salvation? If anyone does, why then do we require unbelievers to obey the law when we are trying to get them saved? Please provide cogent answers to this without trying to assasinate my character. I'll be more than willing to learn.

1. Obedience to the law is not a prerequisite to salvation. To the natural man, unsaved, it is impossible to keep the law.
2. Unbelievers are not being forced to obey the law BEFORE as a prerequisite to salvation.

Now comes the real issue: The first part of salvation is that you acknowledge that you are a sinner . . . (pls read the publican's prayer).
The next part is that you confess and genuinely repent of sin.
In other words the message of salvation CLEARLY includes the fact that ALL have sinned and come short of the glory of God. There are no two ways around it, you cant cajole a sinner to repentance by glossing over his sinful nature.
Godly sorrow worketh repentance.

Tayo-D:
There is a lot to learn from Stephen's message. The people listened to Him all the while he was preaching about God's deliverance of His people up until that point in history. However, he started accusing the people, and the focus went from Christ to man, and they became angry. he lost them at that point.

Shocking!
John 8: 58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

So going by your wholesale condemnation of Stephen . . . we can conclude that Christ also started accusing the people, the focus went from Christ to man, they became angry, he lost them at that point . . . they wanted to stone Him.

Uncle Tayo . . . the word of God does 2 things . . . either condemns you of your sins unto righteousness or makes you hate the word the more. There is no sitting on the fence.
Just like Stephen . . . Christ was crucified by those who accused Him of blasphemy, Paul was killed, ditto for Peter who was crucified upside down, James was beheaded by Herod because he convicted him of sin in his heart, John the baptist had his head in a charger . . .

Where all these heroes of faith killed because their messages turned from Jesus to man?

To say i'm shocked is an understatement at this point.

Tayo-D:
Compare to Peter's message and every other message leading to salvation in the Book of Acts, and you will see that no one got saved from focusing on themselves but Christ.

Where did Stephen focus on Himself? Pls show me.

Tayo-D:
It absolutely aswers the question. The place of the law with regards to salvation is NIL. Paul made that clear from the passage in Phillipians. Please read it over again.

Matthew 5: 17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

olabowale:
@4Him: Cattle; sheep will have to be from this specie. There is a chapter cattle "the Cattle," in the Qur'an. There is also a verse where the Almighty regarded the disbelievers to be worse than cattles: all the species of Cattles. Then there is a verse where the Almighty says that disbelievers will be herded into the fire of hell like how the herder drives the cattles (sheep), to drinking place or pasture.

Olabowale, your hypocrisy is a disgrace. Is a cow the same as a sheep? Pls spare me this deciet!
there is a chapter called cattle in the qur'an, al'lah regards disbelievers worse than cattle, all disbelievers will be herded into fire like cattle . . . where did you answer my question . . .

When did al'lah refer to his slaves as sheep?

Tayo-D:
@stillwater,
Paul can explain better.

Phillipians 3:[/b]4 Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more: 5 Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee; 6 Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; [b]touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless. 7 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ. 8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ, 9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith: Paul mentioned he was blameless when it came to the righteousness of the law. In other words, he didn't fornicate, steal or kill, and yet he was absolutely lost. I'm ashamed to say so, but there are unblievers who live a better moralistic life than some Christians, and yet all that good stuff won't take them to heaven. their fate is the same as the unbels who are mired in those sins.

In verse 9, he mentioned not having a righteousness of his own. This is what Jesus mentioned in John 16 that I stated earlier. The Holy Spirit's job is to let the unbels know that all those righteousness in themselves isn't acceptable to God. And yet, we find believers telling unbels that they will be pleasing God by becoming more righteous in themselves. Something isn't right.

to be honest . . . you did not answer stillwater's question and you have everything completely mixed up. This quote in phillipians has nothing to do with the discussion.
Read my last post and let me know if i still need to explain myself better.