₦airaland Forum

craziebone:
is this simmons town? Are they your colleague? Are you among them?

Yes to all three. I am in the first pic the guy with put a cap on.

Centrifude:
Ohhh, thanx for the clarification, I've always assumed that the mission was in South Sudan because of all of the instability there no Sudan.

Now I'm just confused why we're in the north and not in the South.
Why deploy forces in a Country that has an army instead of country that is completely engulfed in civil war?

We where there before people ever thought there would be a south sudan. We actualy have deplyed to south sudan but on very rare occasions.

https://www.navy.mil.za/archive/1510/151019_MCM_AUV_experiment/pic01.JPG
https://www.navy.mil.za/archive/1510/151019_MCM_AUV_experiment/pic02.JPG

https://www.navy.mil.za/archive/1510/151019_MCM_AUV_experiment/pic04.JPG
https://www.navy.mil.za/archive/1510/151009_imt_mcm_experiment/pic02.JPG


Mine hunting drone.

agaugust:
SAN Super Lynx helicopter has NO sonar NO torpedo, it is NOT ASW.

ATR-42 has more than radar, it's too good to compare to your any helicopter MPA in this world.

Same as your helcopters.


"more radar"? We all ready had this debate before, i post both aircrafts radars and they prety close combinded withbthe versitlty the lynx as it could be argued it is better.

agaugust:
Your navy does NOT even have any ASW helicopter at all, your Super Lynx is a mere search and rescue chopper you bought for the price of an ATR-42 Surveyor......poor thinking
.

For SAR it carries some rather powerful radar, wepaons opstions and comuncastion sytems. It all so still better at ASW than any thing you have and a better MPA than your ATR42.

jln115:
R21 billion = $ 2 billion mate !! Which would mean the entire budget of the SANDF must have increased by 50%, which doesn't sound entirely plausible given the current economic situation!!

But hey! I could be wrong!!

Bit less than 2 billion actually. But it is not that hard. The best run government department in SA is SARS. They really good at getting money. This is why our tressury dwarfs that of Nigeria even though the GDPs are not that far of.


Still i have not looked at our mini budget but its not farfetched.

agaugust:
Sure you are referring to SAAF Super Lynx search-rescue helicopters with ZERO ASW capabilities.

South Africa has NEVER owned an ASW helicopter in your 300 year national history.
,

I see you left out your chopper in the pics. You know, the one that could be mistaken for a business helicopter.


And yes we dont have the best ASW helcopter, nore have we. Its still better than yours and we actually have submarines unlike some countries.

agaugust:
@andrewza thinks otherwise, he felt safer to run 50 km away from Nigerian coastline so that all his four Valour frigates will not be sank by NA Bofors in one day.

It was hyperthetical. You could not hit the broadcside of a barn 30km away with your guns. Never mideva moveing target.

agaugust:
Prove it.


What is their Lynx Mk.89 designation on SIPRI ? ASW or not?

Andrewza has learnt his bitter lesson here.

Its not ASW. I showed thos to upu many times. It is clearly used asca utilty chopper.

agaugust:
France has frontline and back up equipment.

Rafale is their frontline jet and obsolete Mirage 2000 is back up.

France still operates Sagaie armoured vehicle but it's obsolete. They won't throw it away.

FREMM frigate is one of the new ships of France and is 100% modern. La Fayette is obsolete and won't lead France into battle.

SAN Valour frigate carries obsolete combat suite and ancient gun AND ZERO TORPEDOES in the ship's tubes !
.

The FREMM frigate (actually destroyers in weight and ability) are replacing the French ASW ships. Mainly the D'Estienne d'Orves-class aviso, Georges Leygues-class frigate and Tourville-class frigate. The La Fayette will remain part of the French front line fighting force till the mid 2020s when France will begin to replace them.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_French_White_Paper_on_Defence_and_National_Security


For a ancient gun the 76mm is in use with a lot of navies.

Who we going to shoot with torpedoes. We the only group to use them for thousands of killomters. We included torpedoes and the ASW suit in case some one decides to buy them.

agaugust:
The French and Saudi ships with those old combat suites have been replaced in front line role by ships like FREMM frigate, only Sourh Africa has 30 year old equipment and 40 year old second hand gun on your front line warships.
.

The FREMM replaced the Georges Leygues class only.

Henry120:
Which are the 3 IPVs been replaced. So in actual fact, your Biro did begin in 1991.

The river class mine hunters.


It began in 1991 the same way the F22 and F35 project began in the 1980s.

Henry120:
Let me just save this for reference purposes.

Don't need to. Just mention my name and I will back you up. But I will say project Biro was not started 1991 just the navy decided to look in to replacing the strike craft.

Henry120:
Why don't you tell us how many years Project Biro has lasted for, from inception till date? Andrewza said it was from 1996 - till date, however i have evidence that is an Apartheid Era program.


Every year is a Project Biro for the Nigerian Navy, we don't need to wait 23 years to procure 6 vessels.

1991 not 1996. Any case there where several apartheid projects that took place. 1 led to the construction of 2 corvettes that due to arms embargoes we never got. They where sold to Argentina.

The reason the projects take so long in SA is that they not rushed in to. Many of the early years of a project it is just to see if there is even a need for it there are countless projects in the SANDF. Many unfunded and some never ending. What changed for project biro is it one got a budget and 2 it is now in finale stages. Companies have been told to submit there opstions.

You see unlike Nigeria we don't rush head long in and just buy stuff. We first come up with a set of requirements then we act.


And 1991 was when we decided we going to need to replace the strike craft. That's all. A few years ago they decided we going to need to replace the Oryx. They will only start 2020 to begin setting up the requirements.

africaken:
i am of the opinion that nigeria military shouldn't be in the league buyers but of manufacturers of such devices.if vietnam can why not nigeria,for God sake your representing us in the global community

 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCJ4pmkGXIM

They very costly to make. Thermal sights are. not cheap and Nigeria as very limited experience in makeing any thing but small arms and APCs.

Vietnam as beaten France, America, Cambodia and China in wars. Don't knock them. They care far more about there military than with SA or Nigeria.

ddami:
. Chai!!!
FROM FRY PAN TO FIRE,,,
SILENCE PLEASE,, NIGERIANS LISTEN,,,,

A SOUTH AFRICAN WANTS TO TELL YOU NIGERIA'S POPULATION...,,,,

over to you MR ANDREWZA,,,
please tell us how many PEOPLE LIVE IN NIGERIA
please tell us what is NIGERIA'S POPULATION?

Unknown. That is your number. Best to say between 140 and 170 million.


Here is some reading on the matter.
https://africacheck.org/factsheets/factsheet-nigerias-population-figures/

MikeCZAR:
Not really.


Cause there was no contest for air superiority. What happened was that SAAF couldn't operate as they wished.

Due to the all aspects missiles that Russia provided to Cuba and Angola. SA missiles of the time where early 1st gen stuff. Unreliable and needing a shot up the Ass. The more modern AAMs like the python and daters came to late for the war. The 1989 SAAF would have easily wiped the floor with the opostion

agaugust:
UN posted data for Nigeria along with data for South Africa, so what proof do you have that the data on Nigeria is wrong? It's the same UN report you dummy !

Where did the UN get there numbers from? Nigeria is the Answer. A country that does not know how many people live in it.

bidexiii:
Yeap u r right they very expensive, but not that every foot soldier is going to av one ! Even the most countries with modernized army can't afford it to all of there soldiers ! Mostly special force uses such eQuipment of special missions. About two years ago I came across a camerounian soldier with a "french famas" riffle mounted with an advance thermal imaging scope, these r countries that Nigeria his far richer than !

Nigeria's special forces very likely has them.

africaken:
dont get me wrong ,but lets stop assuming some of this tech is beyond our buying power.the only reason our troops dont have such gear its because of our greedy,oldschool,incompetent generals.

They all so cost a lot of money. A thermal imager costs more than the rifle and body armour of a basic solder. That's the big imager not a sight that is made small. They all so easily broken. So over all a poor choice for grunts. A 1000 foot rocket flare with parachute would be more useful to the grunts.

agaugust:
Has Iraqi oil money secured Iraq? Nope.

Security comes from good security forces. Nigeria has enough T-72 tanks to slaughter anything called Boko Haram.

Meanwhile, suicide bombing is going on all over the world, terrorists are now striking the capital of Canada, France, Belgium, etc....it's a global problem not peculiar to Nigeria alone, Europe and America are also victims, their money has not secured them from their own citizens attacking them at home.

I just proved to you that money is not the magic tool for securing a nation, so use your brain, or you don't have one?

Meanwhile, South Africa's money has not secured your people from daily murders and räpes that is more than what you find anywhere else in Africa....Pretoria's money keeps your country ranked number one in murder and räpe in Africa
.

Tanks are not good for fighting terrorists. Just like Grippens are not good for fighting poachers.

Most African countries have poor to zero data collection for crime. So it is impossible to Check that claim.

The problem with comparing crime statistics is that some countries Data collection is better than others. All so then there is some see diffrent crimes differently.

agaugust:
.
Patches and other Southies on nairaland have quicly signed up to comment of defenceweb and african defence....see them saying Augustine is from Nairaland....LOL...desperate Southies exposed....azz whipped and bleeding from Augustine's horse whip

Matthys Jacobs TO Pierre Aycard • 3 hours ago

I wouldn't bother Pierre. The young gentlemen is question is clearly over his depth in this topic.
On some further investigation it seems the gentleman is actually Nigerian. He seems to frequent various Nigerian Military Blogs and the one he frequents the most seems to be Who has the strongest military in Africa which is preposterous and juvenile.

http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=39861

# Frustrated South Africans

How is he frustrated. He is just making a accurate observations.

Pretty much everything that needs to be said has been, so just some very brief comments:
1. The argument that Gripens without BVR capability should stay on the ground if the opposition has it, that came from experienced fighter pilots in the first instance. Give the Gripen a good BVR missile and its smaller size and agility will make it a formidable adversary for any Sukhoi. Add a first rate pilot and it will be difficult for any but an F-22 to beat. Remember what the SAAF did with its grossly under-powered Cheetah Cs to visiting F-16Cs, F-15Es, Mirage 2000s, MiG-29s and Su-27s.
2. Another factor in favour of the Gripen was its low maintenance requirement when compared to older (I will be polite and not say antique) types. Not only did the SAAF have to consider the possibility of distant deployments (as to Kinshasa), but it also had to accept that it would lose technical personnel.
3. As to cost, the AT-2000 was cheaper but was still just a concept with no guarantee that it would stay cheaper. The Mirage 2000 was more expensive, and the F-16s that were potentially on offer were not in good shape and would have cost a lot to restore:
Bidders (price for 28 aircraft)
Saab (Sweden) - Gripen $ 2 234 million
Dassault (France) - Mirage 2000 $ 2 314 million
DASA (Germany) - AT-2000 $ 2 157 million
4. Weapons: The original concept was to integrate the V3C and V3R (BVR) with the Gripen pending the A-Darter and a new BVR missile. But when General Gagiano took over and looked at the sums, he decided against that - both missiles (and the smart air-to-ground weapons) needed a mid-life upgrade and were on hand only in small numbers. To upgrade them and integrate them would have cost a lot and used up a much of half the stock in the case of the AAMs. That made no sense given the budget situation then pertaining, so the decision to retire them with the Cheetahs.
And, finally, let's dream a bit: The 1998 defence review said two medium fighter squadrons and one light fighter squadron, and that was approved by Parliament. So we now have the light fighter in service; let's ask for the money to buy two squadrons of Rafale......


That's from our Jane's defence expert to.

Angola as no BVRMs

agaugust:
Angola is master over South Africa, now confirmed by Janes Defense expert.

When it suits you he is a Jane's defence expert. Any case SAAF was out classed in the 1980s in terms of aircraft and missiles. As in truly out classed. They still flew combat ops.

agaugust:
There is piracy in your SADC region.....or your navy has surrendered to pirates too ?

SANDF surrenders to Sudanese Toyota boys.

SAAF surrenders to Angolan Su-30 jets.

SAN surrenders to SADC regional pirates.

Nothing remains of South African national pride o !

I actually know some one who was in that Ambush. She is a navy chef. There was zero chance that they could drive of the attackers with out losses. And most of them where non combat types.

SAAF flies along side Angolan jets.

Never been a successful pirate attack any waters SAN as pledged to protect. There are no regional SADC pirates. No save areas on land.

agaugust:
.
[size=13pt]We shall ground our air force like dead anytime Angolan air force is in the air !

- Source South African military expert.

"Military analyst Helmoed Heitman's blunt assessment is to keep the Gripens on the ground, he says : The Sukhois have more tiger in the tank to get away speedily and their missiles and radar to me say ground the Gripens while they are around."

South African military experts have warned the SAAF to ground all Gripen jets when Angolan Su-30 is ruling the air !

As usual, South Africa surrenders before the battle begins, total surrender to the will of Angola, their new master.


http://www.defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=39861
[/size]
.

Not all experts agree. And fact is Angola is our ally. Those SU30s are more likely to fly with us than against us.

agaugust:
Northern Angola ? Citation needed to prove that.

Well, the pirates who did not fear our navy got arrested and busted by our navy.....now they now who to fear.....so next time they will go in the direction of South Africa.....it's safer to do piracy in your waters because you have never arrested one
.

There has not been a pirate attack near our borders.

agaugust:
SAAF has 9 pilots for 26 Gripen jets.....world record pilots shortage

.

This as been refuted for years now. The fact you still believe it is making me doubt your mental state

[img]http://rs1215.pbsrc.com/albums/cc513/sobza/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_158901596488109_zpsgas2htqz.jpeg~320x480[/img]

SA navy. We no fare weather navy.

Yes I was foxsile party. Eg in front.

agaugust:
Glide is a fall, it loses height, anything dropping to the ground is falling down.....or is it heading up to the moon ?

Nobody is interested in jet speed or helicopter speed. Argument is strictly about guided bomb speed.

@Ssaengine's video has shown us the speed of Umbani guided bomb Vs Maverick missile.

Your bomb flies at the speed of a snail, even a shilka gun will s.hoot down Al-Tariq/Umbani....case closed by video evidence.

Thank you @Saengine, may God deliver you from gay spirit...that's my prayer for you as reward for the Al-Tariq slow speed video you posted


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwbTabCqNsI
.

The bombs glided fast enough to stay above a Hawks stall speed. The final phase showed it moveing at a rather high speed. Before that phase it was rather high.