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https://s13.postimg.org/9kv4r28ir/Berean.jpg If one is given tea stirred with just a teeny weeny dash of poison, it then becomes impossible to drink just tea! Have nothing to do with the useless works that darkness produces. Instead, expose them for what they are - Ephesians 5:11 GOD'S WORD Translation |
[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F2: GUARANTEED HEALTH[/size] God never promised or guaranteed a problem free life on earth but rather said to them to subdue it, overcome it or bring it under control (i.e. God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it - Genesis 1:28) In like manner, God never dangled the prospect of guaranteed health to/for anyone on earth The only time God guarantees health is in heaven, where there are no or will not be disease, sickness etc (i.e. Revelation 21:4) And he shall wipe away every tear from their eyes, and from now on there shall not be death, neither grieving, nor clamor, neither shall there be disease again, for His sake. - Revelation 21:4 Aramaic Bible in Plain English WoF likes to band about Isaiah 53:5, which is about atonement of sin at the cross (i.e. the hanging and death of Jesus on the cross, is how we got redeemed from the law of sin and death) But he was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was upon him, it is a place of defeat and failure and by his wounds we are healed. - Isaiah 53:5 NIV This is actually laughable, especially when one considers how WoF proponents perceive the cross (i.e. asserting that the cross is a place of defeat and failure etc) and now, watch them here, clinging on the cross with Isaiah 53:5 for guaranteed health. What insincerity. Pfttt. SMH. When Isaiah 53:5 is read in context, it is glaring that, what we are healed of at the cross, is sin Jesus was pierced for our sins, crushed for our sins and by His wounds we are healed of sin so in effect, the healing that took place at the cross is not healing over sickness or disease that WoF would like the church to believe Yes, we have been healed of sin but we are still living in a fallen world and so would have to contend with occurrence of sickness, diseases, evil and even death, until when Jesus returns. Another scripture, used or thrown about by WoF to support this sham guaranteed healing theology is 3 John 2 Dear friend, I pray that you may enjoy good health and that all may go well with you, even as your soul is getting along well - 3 John 2 NIV Beloved, I wish above all things that you may prosper and be in health, even as your soul prospers - 3 John 2 King James 2000 Bible When 3 John 2 is read objectively, just like we did with Isaiah 53:5 earlier above, it is easily noticed that, 3 John 2 is not a guaranteed health promise nor is it anything remotely like guaranteed health 3 John 2 is just a wishful thought, it is just as it were, nothing more than a prayer. Now, audience, do not read this or take it wrongly, no one is implying that God does not heal No one is implying that God does not grant healing. No one in their right mind will for any moment imply the above last two sentences or doubt God heals, whether in the past, now or future. Never, not especially when one of the names of God is Jehovah Rapha - The LORD our Healer (i.e. Exodus 15:26) As He says, in Exodus 15:26, God is the healer of all diseases, sickness etc He said, "If you will listen carefully to the LORD your God and do what he considers right, if you pay attention to his commands and obey all his laws, I will never make you suffer any of the diseases I made the Egyptians suffer, because I am the LORD, who heals you." - Exodus 15:26 GOD'S WORD® Translation Let's cut to the chase, as we are not going to dwell too much, so as not to overwhelm ourselves Most people are looked for healing(s) in the wrong place or from the wrong people Most healing(s) people are expecting, will never be obtained from the pulpit, crusades or healing schools and the WoF movement (e.g. Benny Hill etc) know this This is why WoF movement ushers beforehand play safe they first screen people looking and hoping for healing before allowing them to approach the WoF faith healers. Anyone that looks iffy or challenging for the healer, gets relegated and not given the time of day anymore or any further Hagin, the father of WoF movement, started the whole WoF movement with "health" teaching and later incorporated "name it...claim it" which were backed up with outlandish claims or statements about visiting hell etc and also supported with books such as "How To Write Your Own Ticket with God" Now, this was way before the "too many (e.g. Kenneth Copeland, Leroy Thompson, faith healer Benny Hinn etc) came on scene to add financial prosperity teachings, healing school scams etc to the fold People are waiting on God for healing when God is waiting on the people God is waiting on people, to birth out all the technological or medical breakthrough(s) medical discoveries, medical advances giftings He's desposited in them The gifts He deposited in them for the benefit, well being and good health of His people Some people are not called to be preachers or pastors some are not even called to be near the pulpit, talkless of be in the pulpit but rather, were called to be in the medical fields, in the frontiers of medical research etc Someone's healing is lying dormant in a cemetery somewhere because someone insisted on being a pastor etc and refused their original calling and so thereby allowed the gifting (i.e. discoveries, answers etc for the healings) to die with them, untapped and unexploited The body is a complex system and structure Thank you for making me so wonderfully complex! Your workmanship is marvelous --how well I know it. - Psalm 139.14 NLT Except Jesus is on Earth again, one won't see a sliced off ear or cut off leg put back on Putting back limbs, recreating limbs etc will happen as miracles in the medical arenas The body is so fearfully and wonderfully made that God grants divine healing for sickness or diseases Bottom line is that some healing, God will play His part and grant it and as for the other healings, God has already blessed certain people with the knowledge to succeed in achieving these healings for the benefit of mankind and all On closing, this is not meant to dampen anyone’s faith in healing because of course, cancer etc gets healed with faith by God just like that and without medical interferences Now it must be said that, it is God's prerogative to heal It is God that gives faith for healing or to receive healing Faith for healing needs to be used, the right way, the right moment or time and used at right standing with God I sense I've left gaps in this post, this can be put down to not having enough time right now to dwell too much on this submission Exodus 15:26 however sums the submission up. I REST MY CASE ON F2, FOR NOW. [size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F2: GUARANTEED HEALTH[/size] |
datalossvictim1: I hate receiving closed mentionsdatalossvictim1, sorry, before I got banned by the pesky antispamBot I typed about antibiotics, probiotics and dental dams The antispamBot also hid the post but it is as you can see, now un-hidden PS: Thanks Mods |
[quote author=Doc. Adray]I don't use intimate washes! It is only essential that one 'cleans' her womanliness, a couple of times a day, with warm water only (no need for soap), because the womanliness is already 'self-cleansing' with the presence of its own micro-flora (and fauna), which need not to be destabilized by the use of soap...[/quote] Ishilove: So even the mildest soaps are not needed for washing? Will just mere water just be enough?[quote author=Doc. Adray]Yes, mere water will just be enough. If odour arises, it could be due to infections which can be taken care of by certain antibiotics (administered through tablets, injections, suppositories, etc) ...and not by washing the 'V' with any kinda soap whatsoever![/quote] datalossvictim1: I think that is what is termed as douching. Ishilove: Ha, lailai o. Mba, I no go gree that one o. Dannylux: Not exactly. Some of the microbes in the mouth and genitals exhibit symbiotic association naturally Ishilove: Hmm. This serves as a lesson to men who like sticking their mouth down women's nether regions. lynpetra: Sweery please don't preach that. Ishilove: Lmao! Lyyyyyn... Babe! lynpetra: To whom much is given...It is so prevalent to recommend or administer antibiotics without heeding to the post-administration advice As babies, our first probiotic inoculation (i.e. Bifidus Infantis) comes from the vaginaaa Hence the importance of a regime of probiotics to repopulate, this is because antibiotics indiscriminately kills off all good and bad bacteria (Note: sources of probiotic could be from kefir, yakult, fermented sauerkraut, fermented pickles home made yogurt, fermented kombucha, fermented cabbage juice, probiotic tablets like Multibionta etc) As babies, after getting our first dose of probiotics from vaginaaal birth, we get more probiotic inoculation from consumption of brreast milk. - In fact, brreast milk gives us more as it has up to 40% probiotic content. And as for the last bit, well, to each his own, but then isn't this what tongue condoms are made for |
[quote author=Mr_Anony]Very interesting. Thanks Drummaboy for bringing up Napoleon Hill. It shows us how the WOF movement is more fluffy new age motivational speech than it is Christian. It is sad that many of our brethren have been deceived in this way. The one that annoys me are the con-men who promise people God's gift for a fee. The fact that these guys get away with this nonsense simply shows that many church goers are not reading their bibles.[/quote] tribeofdavid: pls keep this thread going, it has been revealing so far! the heretic TBN station is all about this movement. truthislight:^^^ This is another snippet of the father of WoF movement, Hagin's "History of Ministry", it shows how WoF movement's idea of God's gift for a fee came about and where the now widespread practice originated from - snippet of Hagin's "History of Ministry" - Year May 1966—Tape Ministry Begins For the first time, Rev. Hagin made sermon recordings available for purchase. Of course, they were available in both 5- and 7-inch reel-to-reel formats! http://www.rhema.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=9%3A..&showall=1 - /snippet of Hagin's "History of Ministry" - |
Profbrian: no i dont know it please were can i get the whole piece of it, HFOG: Awww...so sorry I do not have the link.[quote author=Lord_Reed]What is the hymn title and do you know the author?[/quote]@Profbrian, a link to the hymn is this: http://cyberhymnal.org/htm/i/d/idreamed.htm @HFOG, maybe when next time asked, one could consider using the phone to take a camera photo shot of the hymm book capturing the song and then paste the picture(s) here @Lord_Reed, the hymn title and author are: Hymn title: The Great Judgment Morning Author: Burt H. Shadduck or Bertram H. Shadduck (1894) 1 I dreamed that the great judgment morning Had dawned, and the trumpet had blown; I dreamed that the nations had gathered To judgment before the white throne; From the throne came a bright, shining angel, And he stood on the land and the sea, And he swore with his hand raised to Heaven, That time was no longer to be. Refrain: And, oh, what a weeping and wailing, As the lost were told of their fate; They cried for the rocks and the mountains, They prayed, but their prayer was too late. 2 The rich man was there, but his money Had melted and vanished away; A pauper he stood in the judgment, His debts were too heavy to pay; The great man was there, but his greatness, When death came, was left far behind! The angel that opened the records, Not a trace of his greatness could find. [Refrain] 3 The widow was there with the orphans, God heard and remembered their cries; No sorrow in heaven forever, God wiped all the tears from their eyes; The gambler was there and the drunkard, And the man that had sold them the drink, With the people who gave him the license, Together in hell they did sink. [Refrain] 4 The moral man came to the judgment, But self-righteous rags would not do; The men who had crucified Jesus Had passed off as moral men, too; The soul that had put off salvation, “Not tonight; I’ll get saved by and by, No time now to think of religion!” At last they had found time to die. [Refrain] |
ghostofsparta: @F0LYKAZE^^^ https://s11.postimg.org/nxknz4ob3/speechless_smiley_040.gif https://s11.postimg.org/nxknz4ob3/speechless_smiley_040.gif https://s11.postimg.org/nxknz4ob3/speechless_smiley_040.gif |
[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F2: GUARANTEED HEALTH[/size] From the first submission, we learned that the father of WoF movement received a revelation of faith and came across Mark 11:22–24 which he then used as the backbone verses of his Word of Faith ministry The secular world on the other hand are content to use just Mark 11:24 Like we previously established the scripture or verses used by WoF in regards to their "Faith in faith or Faith as a force" doctrine we now also need to establish the verses WoF uses to credit "Guaranteed health" doctrine with. We need to know their source. If from the bible, then what are the verse(s) used, what verses do they hinge or attribute their "Guaranteed health" doctrine to. PS: Hiya FOLYKAZE ah, kila ri, we are looking looking |
^^^ DrummaBoy: DrummaBoy among other things, wrote: trustman: trustman among other things wrote:We had earlier given a summary, that there are primarily, two main types of faith: 1) Faith based exclusively on the word of God (i.e. So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God - Romans 10:17 KJV) 2) Faith based on the word of man, on man's whim, or otherwise (i.e. ...everything that does not come from faith is sin - Romans 14:23 NIV) We also had earlier discussed that "What the mind of man can conceive and believe, it can achieve" is one of Napoleon Hill's regular expression. Now it is evident from earlier submissions and from the two above DrummaBoy and trustman quote snippets, that the second faith classification is ungodly, it is not approved by God, it does not resonate well with God, it is a sensual or carnal induced faith, God abhors it and God takes no pleasure whatsoever in it The second faith classification is: faith which is based on the word of man, faith based on anything the mind of man can imagine, faith based on what the mind of man can conceive and believe. Kenneth Copeland is right that "The force of faith is released by words" and that this kind of faith works to some extent in carnal circumstances (e.g. the tower of babel, Napoleon Hill etc) but because it is not godly faith, this is why God stopped the people in exercising their faith the way they went about doing. Why did God stop them? It is because the faith stirred up by the people was not from God or built on the word and/or revelation from God Let no one be deceived, the distinction or difference between the two classes of faith is clear The kind of faith, the WoF movement practice is, of the second classification and this class of faith, is not approved or recommended by God It is not spiritual at all (i.e. but is similar to the passage of the Tower of Babel etc, it bears no fruit of the Spirit) but it is 100% carnal, 100% self, 100% egocentric and is word of faith 100% abused, 100% misused and is disgusting to be associated with [size=16pt]SUBMISSION ON F1: FAITH IN FAITH OR FAITH AS A FORCE[/size] I REST MY CASE ON F1, FOR NOW. |
FOLYKAZE: You dont have answers. . . .^^^ Therefore do not be stewpid, but understanding what the will of God is - Ephesians 5:17 Aramaic Bible in Plain English So be careful how you live. Don't live like fools, but like those who are wise. - Ephesians 5:15 New Living Translation and don't fear what they fear, or live in terror - Isaiah 8:12b ISV Stewpidity is fun to the one without much sense, but a person who has understanding forges straight ahead - Proverbs 15:21 GOD'S WORD® Translation |
FOLYKAZE: Is that what 1 peter 3:15 asked you to do?Read 1 Peter 3:15 slowly but loudly out and tell if a defense(s) was given to you or not, who asked to give an account for the hope that's therein, also given to you with gentleness and reverence |
FOLYKAZE: Well you have refused to provide answer to my question.Read between the lines. Look for or discover the answer that is implied rather than explicitly stated |
FOLYKAZE: And how does this correlate with the historical fact I presented?^^^ Five of them were foolish and five were wise. - Matthew 25:2 Everyone has heard about your obedience, so I rejoice because of you; but I want you to be wise about what is good, and innocent about what is evil. - Romans 16:19 be therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves. - Matthew 10:16b |
FOLYKAZE: And boko haram cuts your men throat, pieced your childern flesh on your lords day?"The good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth what is good; and the evil man out of the evil treasure brings forth what is evil; for his mouth speaks from that which fills his heart. - Luke 6:45 New American Standard Bible |
DrummaBoy: Thank you trustman for that excellent submission. I was working on something as the above but slept off only to wake up and find the job done. Permit an addition.^^^ This is a snippet of Hagin's "History of Ministry", where it shows when Hagin received his revelation of faith - snippet of Hagin's "History of Ministry" - Year 1934—Kenneth E. Hagin receives a revelation of faith - Born again but still bedfast, Kenneth studied God’s Word. Finally, he came to the verses that would transform his life and become a cornerstone of his ministry: Mark 11:22–24. 22 And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God. 23 For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith. 24 Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them. - Mark 11:22–24 - /snippet of Hagin's "History of Ministry" - Just like Napoleon Hill, notice Hagin too, jumping on the bandwagon of Mark 11:24 along with using other ancillary verses (i.e. Mark 11:22 and 23) The incomplete revelation that Hagin had and what Napolean Hill or any other WoF will not admit is that the passage is not talking of receiving just like that or receiving on the face of it Obviously because of not studying God’s Word properly, they all reference Mark 11:24 and also stop short of acknowledging the main and relevant fact that, what Jesus was saying or teaching in the passage was primarily about fruits (i.e. fig tree and it's fruits) What is a fig tree? Fig trees grows wild in dry and sunny areas, with deep and fresh soil, they also grow in rocky areas. They have soft pear-shaped fruit with sweet dark flesh and many small seeds, they are eaten fresh or dried. Sorry for the above "What is a fig tree" digression - It needed to be done to get things in perspective Now let's move on and make the rest, short and simple. The run up to the event in Mark 11:24 was that the fig tree was not bearing fruit then followed by the disciples being surprised that, truly the fig tree really was withering at Jesus' command then Jesus responding by saying the following in Matthew 21:21-22 21Jesus replied, "Truly I tell you, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and it will be done 22If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer.” - Matthew 21:21-22 NIV The passage (i.e. Matthew 21:21-22 or Mark 11:22–24) was all about fruits In essence, the passage means whatever you ask that will bear fruits (i.e. fruits of the Spirit), it shall be given to you. This is about fruits of the Spirit (i.e. Galatians 5:22 NLT) and mind you, not fruits or acts of the flesh (i.e. Galatians 5:19 NLT) Whatever we ask, that will produces the love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, and faithfulness kind of fruit in our lives, we will receive, is what that passage is all about That scripture, Mark 11:24, has being turned into an invaluable resource by the WoF movement or ministry WoF have used Mark 11:24 to bamboozle the church, they've used it with flattery to deceive the body of Christ and they have completely reversed the principles and/or interpretation of that passage to something completely off the chart PS. I am yet to see "testimony" faith in the bible Faith is personal, you travel the path of faith by self and cant piggy back on someone's testimony to have faith Faith comes from God and it comes via the word of God and not by anyone's testimony The strength of someone's else testimony (i.e. test-ti-moni) is like a shaken up coca-cola bottle when the effervesce or gas that's gives off the bubbles settles down, one is back to square one and reality. This is why FAITH, has to be faith based on the revelation or word of God (i.e. faith, first is personal, and if at all it needs to, later become mutual or corporate faith) and not based on testimonies An example of faith been personal and built up based on the revelation or word of God is the familiar passage about the woman with the issue of blood (i.e. Malachi 4:2; Matthew 9:20-22 or Mark 5:25-34 and or Luke 8:43-48) [size=16pt]SUBMISSION ON F1: FAITH IN FAITH OR FAITH AS A FORCE[/size] |
^^^ The summary of the above is: There are primarily, two main types of faith: 1) Faith based exclusively on the word of God (i.e. So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God - Romans 10:17 KJV) 2) Faith based on the word of man or otherwise (i.e. ...everything that does not come from faith is sin - Romans 14:23 NIV) Apparently "What the mind of man can conceive and believe, it can achieve" is one of Napoleon Hill's regular expression. Writing about how achievement actually occurs, and penning a formula for success in reach of the average Joe or Fred Bloggs, were the USP of Napoleon Hill books. Writing formulas, is a similar trait adopted or used in WoF books such as Hagin's "How to Write Your Own Ticket With God" and other WoF authors out there. [size=16pt]SUBMISSION ON F1: FAITH IN FAITH OR FAITH AS A FORCE[/size] |
^^^ If anyone needs protection, that is already paid for then God's hedge of protection in addition to taking up the whole armor of God which also is free, are what's needed They will cost you nought, as the price for the protection & armor have already been paid for No fanfare, no ceremonies etc You do nothing, except ask, and you shall receive For the free protection and armor: call God and Job 1:10, Ephesians 6:13-17 & Psalm 34:7 |
[size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F1: FAITH IN FAITH OR FAITH AS A FORCE[/size] I introduce to you another exhibit on the subject of force of faith (i.e. Word of Faith Tree of life) https://s1.postimg.org/a5yj6nsvj/word_of_faith_tree_of_life_new_ccc.jpg [size=16pt]MY SUBMISSION ON F1: FAITH IN FAITH OR FAITH AS A FORCE[/size] I introduce to you another exhibit on the subject of force of faith (i.e. Word of Faith Tree of life) |
Addendum to original post and/or original poster's. Other practices of Word of Faith Movement (i.e. WoF) are: F6: JDS (i.e Jesus Died Spiritually) F7: Holy Ghost Laughter along with slain in the spirit F8: Tithing F9: Name it.. Claim it... F10: Name-a-Seed or Seed Faith F11: Staged leg lengthening healing F12: Fake healing schools F13: Merchandising the Gospel F14: Personalising the Gospel F15: Fee paying crusades or seminars F16: Hyped up motivational hustling preaching F17: Obtaining pecuniary advantage(s) by deception |
^^^ What was it posted that got the post above hidden? |
Alfa Seltzer: Now we know who stole Seun's data.Has nothing to do with knowing or not knowing who stole Seun's data Your wish was a command... You wanted to be shown where you opened any thread claiming to be a Christian... You wanted concrete proof, didn't you? |
Alfa Seltzer: ^^^Shit.Don't %*£# with Christians I can see you, Alfa Seltzer viewing this https://s7.postimg.org/7s9l889hj/applause.gifhttps://s7.postimg.org/7s9l889hj/applause.gifhttps://s7.postimg.org/7s9l889hj/applause.gif |
alexleo: I knew you were joking when you claimed being a christian and I never took your claims seriously. Don famous: Satan is d father of all liars. You even opened a thread that you are now a Christian. Alfa Seltzer: This another hallucination in the head of xtians.https://s3.postimg.org/44fmvd6eb/Alfa_Seltzer.jpg ^^^ ...concrete proof |
Alfa Seltzer: This another hallucination in the head of xtians.^^^ https://s30.postimg.org/vllo1ckcx/Count_Chicken.jpg |
[quote author=lumeviews.com]After your rant above, I want to point out that by "Losing Battle", I was referring to the ability of Christians to defend theories like this. Not some evangelical war of the heavens between good and evil. God and Devil. Which brings us nicely into my next point. You speak about kindergaten theology but you believe there's a fire bus stop waiting to consume people. Ironic! From a Christian's perspective, one would tend to think his Father in heaven will have even more compassion than the biological father on earth here. But still, such a caring Father in heaven will throw his beloveth children into a lake of fire as punishment. Can your real father on earth throw you in a pit of fire over the worst thing you have ever done in your life? I truly find this baffling and do not mean to come across as aggressive[/quote]@lumeviews.com Rant? rant? You call less than 5 sentences a rant? C'mon now lumeviews.com you can do better than that Who mentioned fire bus stop? When or where was fire bus stop mentioned? If you want to quote, better learn to quote correctly Reiterating, hell is a bus stop, lake of fire is the terminus. Liken or refer hell to a transit, transit to the lake of fire as it were. Ah and by the way, so it is OK to let one bad apple(s) ruin the whole bunch then. No be so? Theology has it's fair share of mystery You're not alone. You aren't the first and wont be the last truly finding this baffling. Are you coming across as aggressive? Nah, mba, point the finger at impetuous emotion(s) Mind you, it is God's privilege to conceal things and the king's privilege to discover them. |
[quote author=lumeviews.com]With due respect, I find this explanation unconvincing. The devil is chained where? Temporary resident where? I do not mean to sound ignorant but a critical look at religion never hurts if Christians can defend certain doctrines or theories if you wish. A losing battle?[/quote]@lumeviews.com Respect reciprocated I understand (i.e. meaning understand you finding the explanation unconvincing) Your question in real sense, actually warranted binary responses (e.g. Yes and No, No and Yes, Yes to both accounts or No to both) Theology has a lot to with blind faith (i.e. believing) first afterwards convincing comes into play as needed. If the odds are stacked against the devil as glaring as it is, I wouldn't wager on losing battle(s) Hell is a bus stop, lake of fire is the terminus lumeviews.com, that is kindergarten theology for crying out loud ![]() Brush up on your theology lumeviews.com |
Babagnoni what did you type?


ah, kila ri, we are looking looking