₦airaland Forum

Mirallas:
Like seun and johnnydon said, if you are a good actor just go to church and give testimony of how you met with Jesus personally and how he arrested your soul and how you will serve him to the end. It will be fun

I am an atheist. People in the Church I used to and sometimes still go to know this. I tell them when asked, and they do ask since I draw the line at eating the body of Christ or drinking his blood. One does not have to act loving others, and being an atheist does not make it impossible to love others. If they do not understand that in as much as they love me they have loved their God in heaven whom they see not, then so may it be.

EVarn:
Jesus kept the company of Zacchius, he kept the company of Mary Madgalene, who he encountered as a renown harlot. Jesus took Matthew, a tax collector(who were known to be very corrupt in those days), as a disciple. He promised a hanged thief paradise at Golgotha. He healed the children and servants of Roman pagans. He even had a cordial debate with Nicodemus, a great scholar in the sanhedrin council, the same sanhedrin that sought his arrest.




So if you want to justify your bigotry, don't use jesus, he just doesn't fit into your petulant narrative.

PS: Jesus said "love your enemies", how can you love your enemies and still shy away from their company?, that makes no sense.

Oh, thank you for this. I posted mine above before seeing it. There is Christ in you indeed!

godisgood200:
Ah, this Oga na wao? You just dey wriggle around. Answer the question already. E no hard.

The Master says, ' Love your enemies, He did. But does love your enemies means keep their company?


And, i thought you knew scriptures, how did you not know He was called a Beelzebub?

My good friend. The stories about Jesus are replete with him spending time with those whom he was not supposed or expected to spend time with (Tax collectors, prostitutes, Samaritans, Gentiles, and so on). "Love one another", the words read, and not, "Only those who believe as one does". It is specifically the lesson of the Parable of the Good Samaritan. You do know that they, Samaritans, were going straight to hell according to the understanding of the Jews of his day, and Gentiles never stood a chance in a million years and some, nor did tax collectors?

And, we are not talking about what Jesus, who it is written, as the "head of the house" was called Beelzebub, and was said to have "a demon in him". I doubt you would get your head around it if I were to ask you, "how much more the members of his household!”, since an atheist cannot dwell in the same house as your sort, I assume, according to your understanding of the individual you call God, perhaps.

From my reading, he set extremely high standards and demands on those who would know of him and wasn't one to turn his back on people who do not believe as he did. He would not be a hypocrite who condemns others for what he himself would do. You, however, may understand as you wish.

And note please, I have never said I, "know Scripture"!

shadeyinka:
Nevertheless, it is an incontrovertible fact that miracles do occur after ministrations

Just 2 years ago, I was paralysed from the waist down having caught a bug that had worked its way into my nervous system and was on the way to my brain where it would have resulted in me being brain dead. I lost 30kg and was in a wheelchair and could not move my toes when the doctors at King's Hospital asked me to. They gave me some drug that cost £750 a dose thinking I had a disease that it would cure only to find out after 3 doses that that wasn't the illness I had. I had to finish the dose however, so had 2 more while the doctors kept ministering to me.

There was a 3d picture of purple flowers on the wall in front of my bed, which since I could not move, I kept starring at. One day, the picture said, "buda, pay attention". Then it brought this massive building crane in through the window and moved my toes a tiny fraction in line with the perceived movement of the flowers in the picture. It took 4 days of this moving my toes with the crane in line with the movement of the flowers in the picture, and one day the picture said, "buda, get up and walk", and I was eventually back on my feet and skipping and dancing through the ward. Even the surgeons said, "it is a miracle". I am still amazed that they knew to put that picture on the wall - it was afteral put there with intent - and the massive building crane coming in to move my toes. A miracle indeed!

This is not particularly pertinent to my point, but one day, while I was in hospital, ma came with her friends from church. She'd come when I was admitted and on seeing me, 30kg less my normal weight and unable to walk, she burst into tears. So I sent her away asking her not to distress me, "and if you can't not do this weeping sorrow thing", I told her, "don't come back please!" Mothers, eh, and the love they have for their children. But I had enough to deal with and didn't want her distress added to it. Besides, she had brought me up well enough to deal with adversity. This was as adverse as it had ever been for me. Buda must deal with it!

Anyway, these women came intending to rain the Blood of Jesus down on my head but I wasn't having it. So when they were prepared to pray, I said, I would pray. "We are grateful for all we have", I said, "and would continue to be grateful. Amen". They too said, "amen", and left. Apparently, according to them, I had been arrogant. But my retort to them was, "Where is your faith?" And in case you wonder, not once did I think to call on God, not being that way inclined anyway.

I just knew all along that while there was life, there is hope, even if it was life in a wheelchair. This was the sort of hope I expected to find in Church going people, or what good is the Blood of Jesus if not to give hope when most needed? Yet, here were God people telling me my faith was arrogance! Its a pity that what they mistake blessed assurance based on my faith that all would be well as arrogance.

My point is, there is something we can call miraculous, and doctors, for one, do them everyday. And we, Nigerians would be better served if we could try to understand this instead of shipping our miracle working doctors to where they are better appreciated.

Incidentally, one of my doctors was a young and amazingly beautiful conscientious angelic Nigerian. Every time she came to see me in the ward, sometimes 3-4 times a day, and at night, all I could hear from her presence was, "I am going to heal this buda". And she did, peace and infinite mercy on her and hers always!

Martinez19:
it seems you were very sensible right from time.

I was lucky. Neither of my parents had much time for religion when I was a child. Ma was a nurse so relied much on evidence, and pa was a lawyer and would lawyer you to death. One dared not make a claim one could not justify. "Dad, please give me money to buy a book", and all you'd get was, "Why?' And you'd better come up with much better than, "Because you wouldn't want your child to be stupid', or else, "Why?"

It was tedious at the time, but I'm glad for it now.

butterflyl1on:
Value is everything! How valuable and weighty are these views you hold and how far reaching are they?

And if you mean, valuing people, regardless of their beliefs, I will agree. It's why I find people, on the whole, amusing.

I once had a Jehova Witness, a friend of my mum, ask me if I Believed. I said I didn't, and he refused to talk to me for months. He was in his 90s and eventually was placed in a home and ma and I used to visit him every week. He got so touched one day and said, "You may say you don't believe, but deep down God belief is in you". I guess he just couldn't understand that one could be kind without a belief in God making one so. Says something about him, in my book.

That reminds me of my darling SC. How he finds himself loving that atheist buda so much must trouble him!

butterflyl1on:
1) What is truth!

Truth, as in the floor exists, and I will not fall into a void if I take steps on it?

Experience, basically, or what you call empiricism, and logic.

butterflyl1on:
2) How do you know that the world you are seeing is actually how it is?

Experience, basically, and reason. It pretty soon shows me if my assumptions are incorrect. And if they are, I better adjust my assumptions, or I would not get very far at all.

Martinez19:
lucky you bro. At least you started early but I started at 20 as an atheist. Wasted my teenage years reading and memorising the bible, couldn't date my dream girl because of church doctrines and being too spiritual. If only I had sat down earlier to think. All I needed was to sit down and think. It is well bro, seeing the world as it is and knowing the truth brings freedom.

It's sad that people have to be put through what you were put through. It's like being convinced that father Christmas really exists, except one soon finds out the grownups don't believe in such stuff and one grows out of such beliefs.

I used to go to Church as a child, as it was the only reason I could get out the house on a Sunday. There was once this beautiful woman from Four Square Gospel Church who used to come and get us kids in the neighbourhood, and there'd be about a thousand of us worshipping in a huge hall. They would ask us to pray for our parents, because "they are going to hell", and lots of kids will be crying their little hearts out, "O Lord Jesus, save my mummy and daddy. Don't let them burn in hell". I used to just look at them thinking, "Whao, they must have really bad parents! My nice parents are not going to any hell".

Now that I think of it, quite a lot of the believers on here fear that hell, which in my opinion, is some imaginary place cooked up by some to control others. I'm just glad that I always spent the 20 kobo my parents gave me for offerings, on sweets, and dundu, and kulikuli!

butterflyl1on:
Freethinking is a gamblers approach to personal enlightenment. They have no foundations. Just personal opinions (logic, reason, and empiricism) which on it's own can be hugely flawed as logic, reason and Co are not universally acceptable to all but self imposed.

Yet, no human operates without "logic, reason, and empiricism". Even one's religion is based on these things, or would you claim they do not underpin your belief, though, flawed?

Most people ask if their thoughts, and beliefs, are logical, rational, and if they are based on empirical evidence. Those who don't are the sort who would cross the road without checking they would not get run down by their unfounded belief that the car approaching is not approaching or that some spirit would make sure they don't get run over by it. Stupid, dead, or soon to die people, basically.

superhumanist:
Lol....what is the main point of going to church if not to worship God? Intelligence is lacking mennnn.

One can go to church to see what they do there. To understand what is said there and to acquire knowledge about what people worship there. That's why I went, and to see if what is done there is catching.

What I found though, was different to what they read, say, and by most, even believe, and that, it was not catching me.

We know a lot of them do lie, or at least, I know. And they do so for advertising purposes. It's proven to attract members who will contribute money to the cause.

Reinhard Bonnke and Maurice Cerrulo both lost income when they were stopped from advertising claims of healings that they could not prove. BBC asked them to provide the names of 10 people they had healed on previous visits, but they refused, so BBC traced people from videos of people being healed. A woman had jumped out of the wheelchair she had been in and walked, only for it to be found that she developed multiple fractures from the effort.

I have also heard of a man who was healed 3 times of Aids by TBJ, and had stopped using his retroviral drugs as a consequence. He gave away all his property in gratitude and I got to hear about it when he died and the Catholic Church he attended had to find accommodation for his wife and two kids whom he left homeless.

shadeyinka:
I don't have any problem with a person being skeptical about a miracle. I am also critical and skeptical BUT, the difference is that I don't switch off completely.

I don't believe in "Chris Angel- the magician" but I am willing to give it to him that I don't understand how he does some of what he does. Are these things all tricks? Honestly I don't know but there exist a high probability that some of what he does are real.

Glad that you have some experience with bone specialists. Your 2 year estimate is a fair assessment. However, when you look at the tip of the exposed tibia, you will find out that it was dead. The only way out is to have a bone and marrow transplant (If the bone succeeded in grafting).

Why would they come to lie for what they paid 100s of thousands for. When grafts like that happen, there usually is a limp. Comparing the ages of the boy before and after does not show more than a year difference. Except the boy has a twin brother.

Miracles do happen.

A skeptics Job is to ask questions which force out the TRUTH. Some times ago one Pastor in South Africa Bushri was busted with a fake miracle. I love that! When fake MOGs are busted on camera.

The bone in question is beyond redemption by antibiotics. Ask any doctor

shadeyinka:
We simple Christians see a miracle. Those who see a grand deception should prove their case intelligently and without any doubt.

Please be aware that I have no problem with what anyone sees and how they see it.

I however have serious problems when I am asked to disregard what I see and accept what I am told to see by others. I just have way too much regard for myself you see.

If you did learn at all, you might understand what a "rhetorical question" is.

I am not assuming you have information I don't have. They are question I consider in coming to my conclusion, and are questions some ask and some ignore when forming opinions about the video.

One can almost see how those questions form a dividing line between those who believe in the healing and those who don't.

For your information, I literally grew up in Igbobi Orthopaedic Hospital, Lagos, Nigeria and have seen Nigerian doctors perform 'miracles' much greater than these, given sufficient time. The video shows a simple fracture, with an untreated wound around it. Setting the bone will fix it in no time and a dressing and a dose of antibiotics would heal the wound. We are talking about a year or more though with about 2 - 4 months in a cast.

Oh, and when I call Scoan, I expect someone like you, or worst, my darling SC, to pick up the phone. The first words out of your mouths would be "Praise Jesus", except SC would add, "And the most Holy TBJ". I'd hardly expect objectivity since their daily bread depends on it.

shadeyinka:
You are so funny.
The two of us has the same text nook and exam question, yet you ask me for answers to some questions! Is that how you passed your exams in school?

I didn't make the video.
You know those who made the video (scoan)
You know their address (lagos)
The people in question are Nigerians and probably lives in Nigeria.

You can do your intelligence work and become a multimillionaire in the process.

Oh!
You are insinuating that a doctor did this: In Nigeria!? With dead bone tissues!? Even if it takes 10years (at least you can estimate from the video), this boy is not limping: the Nigerian Doctor must be incredible! He grew an almost 4 inches NEW tibia.

Ask Medical Doctors questions now!

This one is also for you. I believe you can see where doctors performed skin grafting

https://m.youtube.com/results?q=healing%20scoan&sm=3

Another


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KbSCqIlNns


For your entertainment
https://m.youtube.com/results?q=deliverance%20scoan%20man&sm=3

Lets be grateful aliens don't come to Nigeria, or has anyone heard of alien sightings there? Guess our alien retardation device scares them off or perhaps the fact we don't have enough light to be seen from outerspace means they can't see us from so far off. Those things creating crop circles, thereby wasting our much laboured after crops! Let us be very grateful indeed!

Hear! Hear!

Bethor:
I laugh again at your ignorance when you say i do not believe in the almighty creator and also laugh at your ignorance when you say witches are responsible for African backwardness, the fact remains that it is people like you with same mentality as you that is keeping this great continent backward.
The trash they indoctrinate you in church is what you are displaying here, you can never be more christian that the European who own their religion.
Yes, African history and growth pattern was distorted by the Europeans and if you must know this was achieved heavily using religion as vehicle and tool, same Christianity you are professing..

I just wish Africans learn and accept whole heatedly more of their history, there religion and heritage instead of demonizing it and calling it satanic,demonic and pagan, all thanks to the European Christianity..

And as a reminder, our forefathers, call them anything you want to, idol worshipers/pagans, know the almighty creator and acknowledge his supremeness long before the whites ever set foot on African soil.

The church only just succeeded in indoctrinating you with "Anything that is not Churchy is evil and of the devil" and trust me even at this the church have apologize countless times to the great scientists of old whom they once demonize due to their experiment, same would be a hundred years from now and if you are alive would still benefit from the great God particle experiments which you are demonizing today.
Peace..!!!

salvation101:
so ur wives are also permitted to have more than one husbands isn't it? There is polyandry too you know?

Was waiting for that, thanks.

So, how long after was it? Like a year maybe? Long enough for the bone to be set by a doctor perhaps, and for the wound to heal?

shadeyinka:
But you know that's a wrong conjecture. Not all healings are instantaneous. Most healings are progressive.

However, the truth be said:
Something not of the ordinary happened to the boy.

Its either a sophisticated deception or a miracle.

We simple Christians see a miracle. Those who see a grand deception should prove their case intelligently and without any doubt.

godisgood200:
Pls answer me, you implied that Cbristians don't follow the teachings of Jesus, so i ask you again, did Jesus keep the company of those who called Him Beelzebub because He loved them?

Did anyone call him beelzebub? Did he not say love those who hate you?

shadeyinka:
Before healing the Boy was putting on a caftan
After healing the boy was putting on a Shirt

And you claim the video gave an impression of INSTANTANEOUS healing?
Did you listen to the Mother of the boys testimony, she was using "PAST TENSES" that didn't insinuate an instantaneous occurrence

Someone got the impression from watching the video, is what I wrote. They made a comment saying so on here. And you are currently arguing that point with that individual!

godisgood200:
Did Jesus keep the company of those who called him Beelzebub? No. Shd i? No.

Atheists don't call you Beelzebub.

butterflylion:
disagree with them?

Such are the risks involved. They themselves want peace and would rather get it from people of like minds and like disposition.

He should blame nobody but himself. Same way he rejects their religious views as an atheist and rejects their God and probably silently mocks them in his heart. What he sows he reaps. Shikena

If only they accepted Christ into their hearts, souls and life, they would just love their neighbour. But since they could see into their neighbour's atheistic heart, "he should move ni! We don't want neighbours with minds and dispositions like his!"

Such is the mind of the people of this world.

ScienceWatch:
Dont tire O, you are only five steps away from smashing into a hidden truth beyond lowly intellect.

Think...... when you as Omo Basorun go to the sun for help for your people, are the believers not rejoicing? When you walk through the town after 2am at night, are the people not delighted. People are not fools, they know that something has always manifested as a consequence.

THE SPIRIT WORLD IS FAR SUPERIOR TO INTELLIGENCE.

Do you think "my people", the few who saw me, give a damn about my walking around town at 2am? Believe me, those who saw me at first thought, "who is this fool, daring the gods?" and even after I gave the proper responses, they came to my house in the morning to check if the spirits had whisked me away.

And if walking at 2am was all I did and then claimed, "there was light" I am sure I've trained you well enough to politely say, "hmm, buda, I no see light o", after all, you are not a fool and neither are 'my people, or did you not see light when I showed it to you? Did you not say, "it is good"?

Stop asking me to say "I see", when it is still dark. Show me light, and I too will say, "there is light, and it is good"!

MuttleyLaff:
And the shadeyinkas of this world will be telling budaatum:
"The boy is now healed. What's your problem?"

If the healing took the course they claim it took, I want to refer others to get cured too. But if its a scam, I want others to be sceptical about the claims made, at the very least.

Thing is, from the video, no timeframe is known. Bone fractures do heal once set properly, which was absent in the before, and it would take a considerable number of months for the scar to heal to the extent shown. The video is however giving some people the impression the healing was instantaneous!

You know what? I tire!

ProsperOkec:
you're not understanding my point. How did the boy started walking when the big bone holding his weight was outside.
The only way is that the bone grew instantly. if it didn't then what carried the boy's weight?
or was his bone floating in the air in his flesh.

Hmm, what a pity. The video shows the boy walking on his broken bone, and not the bone unbroken after the application of TBJMiracleHealingWater! By the way, If that boy were someone you know, would you take him to TBJ without going to see a doctor first? Why is there no cast on that broken protruding bone? Would the doctor not, at the very least, not place a dressing over the wound?

But, that aside, lets consider. You are that boy's age. Your leg broke. Your mother takes you TBJ. She shouts, "Man of God, heal my son's leg". She asks you too to shout, "Man of God, heal my leg". Man of God now approaches you, sprays TBJMiracleHealingWater on your broken leg, and says, "Walk". Have you not been indoctrinated to claim your miracle? Of course you still see your protruding bone, but, it's by faith, the evidence of things unseen, even if it means unseeing what you are looking at! Will you not think to yourself, "In the name of Jesus", and walk, even if the pain is killing you and least they say, "There is a demon in you"? If that boy's mother is anything like some, if you don't walk now now, she would probably beat that devil out of you!

My darling will provide a link of the boy playing football for SCOAN Football Club afterewards as soon as he finds it. He promises. In the mainwilie, and while we wait for him to find it, please Lord God, I only want a small miracle. A very tiny one please. Heal me of stupidity in Jesus name I pray. Amen.

ScienceWatch:
I don't know where I stored that link. You can search on Emmanuel TV website or YouTube.

I will knock your head you! I should troll through TBJTv like I have not got better things to do with my time!

When you remember, please post. We can't have we unbelieving atheists continuing in our unbelief if we can help us.

ScienceWatch:
Do your research. You will find that very soon after JESUS CHRIST healed that boy, he came to play soccer in the Holy SCOAN CHURCH.

VAXX would have given a wiser opinion on this miracle.

Medical science and other gods failed to heal that boy. Once again JESUS CHRIST did it.

I LOVE YOU JESUS !!

Couldn't find anything. Got a link?

Martinez19:
Oh, okay. At the beginning of mine, I felt shy to express myself.

I was never shy. One hell of a big mouth on me. And living amongst predominately traditional worshippers albeit in Lagos, you might imagine what it was like telling an Egungun, a supposed spirit from the dead, "Sikiru, if you dare touch me with that your whip, I will tear off you spirit dress! Spirit from the dead my ass!". A recipe for not having lots of friends I recall.

The adults were not much better with their constant beatings to try to make one believe as they do. I guess if I'd kept quiet I wouldn't have got beat up so much. But I was never lonely. I spent my time reading. You'd be amazed how one can invoke spirit into characters in a book.

I was fortunate in not having my mind polluted by my parents and was brought up to question. I became an atheist at 12, so I guess I have loads of practise.

TheArchangel:
and the child needs urgent care in an Orthopaedic hospital.

They will not listen. They prefer to believe that spraying TBJoshua Holy Water on broken bones will heal the boy!

The videos shows no change. Just the boy walking without crutches. Show me the boy a week later please!

tintingz:
You can let them know you're not that religious but telling them God does not exist, that's a tough task.

I agree. And do note that there is a huge difference in saying "Gods do not exist (for me)", and "Your God does not exist". We may do the latter on here, but most don't go about saying it to people they know.

(Imagine me telling my ma the her God, her rock and her staff, is a figment of her imagination!)



P.s. I do say that to my ma, but she's that sort of ma. Aghhh you know what I mean!

rinrin23:
Thank you Seun. I agree with the emboldened. I however dont think he will ever really understand, but will always accept me the way I am. I guess I should be content with acceptance.

As for the ratio and finding a match, haha it's highly unlikely (though maybe not impossible)

I would have said don't yoke unequally, but people are far more intelligent and one would see even Muslim/Christians relationships these days.

You should not be content with being accepted! You should be understood too, then loved. It does mean more than mere 'acceptance'! If he does not understand you, perhaps its because you have not explained yourself, and, I am of the impression that you hide who you really are from him. I wouldn't call that a good foundation for cohabitation.

The foundation of a good relationship is communication. Express yourself as you have done here. (Did you notice some want to be like you?) You will be very lonely if you go ahead without it! So, communicate.

MizMyColi:
Hi there @rinrin24.

I like the coherence with which you write.
I want to be like you when I grow up.
Lol.


Okay, I can quite relate with your position.
I was once there.
Tell you what...

You should not feel afraid to express your truth to the one you love, and whom you believe loves you.
It takes bravery and courage to do so, but trust me, in the end, you will be better for it.

I have struggled with feelings of being partially accepted because of my spiritual path and orientation. It was until I came "clean" that I found peace and such inexplicable freedom within and without. Again, I will say you should not feel fearful hesitation to express your truth and until you can do that, please do not get married to him just yet. You want to avoid being termed a pretender and names like that

You are grown up already!

vaxx:
ensure you wear undies so that the punana will not be exposed when your skirt is finally lifted... it is good to reply you back in your terminology, you understand it better

When I, lift up my skirt (for I sincerely doubt anyone would be so rude as to go lifting up my skirt for me!), it will be so that people see what is underneath it. There will be nothing underneath to hide the view!