₦airaland Forum

ow11:
The people in Guantanamo Bay were arrested by Policemen abi? The coup plotters (1990 and 1976) were arrested by policemen abi? What are you talking about?

Soldiers killing any man between 18 and 40 found in the villages of the ND can not be justified under any circumstance. Besides, Bonny where the murder took place is miles away from Gbaramatu where JTF is supposed to stop the incessant pipeline attacks by MEND.

Dont even bother with Mr Admin. This is someone who openly stated that Niger Deltans didn't plant the oil so they have no right to it. He wouldn't put a page like this on the front page, but he would put an empty threat by MEND on the front page as well as some nonsense taking shots at Saro-Wiwa. Anyway, make I no talk too much before I get banned.  

debosky:
So you be brummie masquerading as West londoner?

Hitzlsperger played his early days at Villa, remember that was FOUR years ago. He's gone on to win a Bundesliga title and now captains his side. Do you know much about his current performances?

nah, I grew up in those areas. I've probably been to Villa Park more times than Stamford Bridge.

I dont know much about his current performance except what I see with German National team. He doesn't have the speed of thought or quickness of passing to blend with Arsenal. BTW, what position are you looking for for him? I hope not DM?

debosky:
Na wa o - what do you have against Hitzlsberger?

Since you claim to have encyclopedic knowledge of footie, kindly identify the player's shortcomings.

I would actually appreciate DK giving his opinion on the player, since he is the resident Bundesliga expert.

You seem to forget that Hitzlsberger used to play at Villa Park which is my defacto home ground. I went to a couple of Villa matches back then and I never rated Der Hammer. Apart from an ability to bulala shots, his passing game leaves a lot to be desired. Very un-Arsenal like.

Hitzlsberger abi Shitzlsberger?

Myles P is an idiot.

If Arsenal wanna regress into a Europa League team, they can go for Shitzlsberger. Na only bullet we go chop, what about quality?

texazzpete:
It can also be called dialogue, retard! Without any proof all you can offer is hearsay. Aren't the Israelis talking to the Palestinians these days?

Dont be an idiot. . . .thay can talk to all those parastatals all they like. . . . just don't call Saro's name when the people perceive it as treachery. . . . especially when these people are rich beyond their means. . .

texazzpete:
Kindly point to the contradiction in my post. Do i really have to refer you to Dictionary.com before you know what that word means?
My comment is clearly meant to make you see that even great men are only human, and was a direct counter to your fanatical attempts to reject any suggestion of human failings in him, including tacitly justifying the deaths of four men. Making stupid reference to the 'Jerry Rawlings solution' is a shining example.

Stop being an idiot again. Saro has many failings as we all know and stated, for example he's a hothead. Igbos also beleive he's a traitor, as well as many other failings, real or perceived. Trying to imply that these failings include 'incitemement' to murder is what makes you a doofus.

texazzpete:
Ken praising the Ogoni 4 after their deaths was to show up your comments that they were 'traitors'. And if you people insist that the 4 elders should have read the prevailing mood in Ogoniland, why criticise the writer for believing that  Ken should have read the same mood swing and done more to calm tensions?

I never said they were traitors. People perceive them to be traitors. Big difference. The peoples perception is what led to their murder. How can Ken calm tensions when he didn't inflame them? What rubbish.

As well as Ken praising the men, he also criticised them - but never in a violent manner. If you care to read the whole document and not cherry-pick words to suit your argument, then you will have a better understanding. If Ken was praising them all the time, how can you use the same twisted mouth to say Ken was flaming the tensions. Its highly contradictory. If you must know, since you are making stupid arguments with no background knowledge - Ken enacted a successful program to disarm the Ogoni militia! The same person is flaming tensions? You are a brainless bovine.


Why do you worry yourself on N-Delta issues so much? Do you have an itch to scratch?

Sagamite:
Sorry, but can you explain how he incited the mob?

Don't even bother with the idiot. Some people need to check the dictionary for the meaning of incitement before writing rubbish. How can a man who never used any violent rhetoric be called an instigator? Even the bungled-up trial that led to his political killing wouldn't dare try him for incitement because there is nothing on record to show he was an instigator. They tried him on 'directly ordering' the death of those 4 men. Ledum Mitee, the new leader of MOSOP was supposed to stand trial as well but the Nigerian Bar Association said they would go on strike if Ledum was tried, hence Abacha let him off.

OW11 said it right - if you were not in Rivers State between 1992 - 1995, likelihood is you no know wetin dey ground. That 4 men who were hobnobbing with the peoples killers and oppressors (check the role of RSVG in Ogoni killings with regards to arming Andoni and Okrika Bush Boys to kill Ogonis, check the slaughter of Ogonis by the military task force, check the role of Shell and Chevron in hiring Helicopters and Boats to the Army which were used in the slaughter of hundreds of Ogonis). Now if these 4 men were openly hobnobbing with these enemies of the people, what more cause do you need to look for for the mob action? This is not in any way justifying the mob action, but the history of the men who were killed should inform any seasoned observer that you do not need to look to Saro-Wiwa to know why these men were regarded as traitors. 4 men of Gokhana origin, killed by Gokhanas in Gokhana land, then blamed on a Khana man? What a laugh!

Abeg make una no bring any civil war nonsense enter this thread. Saro had already made peace with Ohanaeze Ndigbo before he went to the great beyond, so I see no reason for internet warriors to avenge what their elders have already forgiven.

texazzpete:
Every hero has some level of taint in them. it doesn't make them evil, merely human. For example, for all her past corrupt activities, Benazir Bhutto is still revered as a heroine by many in Pakistan.

texazzpete:
I just read the link provided by Ibime, only to see the 'forgotten four' described in glowing terms by Saro Wiwa. He even goes as far as calling them 'great ogoni patriots'.

So much for the 'evil traitors' you guys are desperately trying to paint them as to justify their deaths.

I wonder when you will stop speaking out of the side of your mouth. . . .

Now, both your posts above are highly contradictory, and even a man with the brain of a peanut would notice it. . . . . it is either Saro-Wiwa was 'tainted' - implying his incitement led to the deaths of the 4. . . . or he praised the 4 as Ogoni patriots. . . . which one?. . . . pick one and stop this stupid charade.

Why would Saro not praise the 4? Are they not brothers and in-laws? They have been friends and compadres since the 1960's. That doesn't mean that Saro would not criticise them when need be - but never in a violent way!

At the same time, we dont need to paint them as traitors. Their people know what it is and why they took mob action against them.

Now, its time to drop this silly argument. If you repeat it long enough, it will start to gain some traction. The writer totally lost credibility by failing to disclose that her father was a prosecution witness. Instead of arguing whether Saro was complicit in the death of the 4, we should be asking whether her father was complicit in Saro's murder.

This is a regular occurence. Thats why I dont mourn when Nigerian soldiers are killed. Those justifying JTF's bombing in Gbaramatu know that the press reports JTF give is not what is happening on the ground. When they say they have killed a militant, it just means that they shot any able bodied man they found in the town. Meanwhile the real militants are still bombing the oil flows. I cannot blame Oga Seun for not wanting to watch the video for I know where he stands on this issue. . . . but if it some thread disparaging Saro-Wiwa, we will see it on the front page.

ow11:
Why didn't the police look for the mob coordinators instead they went to pick up Ken that was under house arrest at that time. These Ogoni 4 with strong links to the RVSG were perceived by the general Ogoni populace as traitors and should have been aware of their position in the scheme of things in Ogoni land.

Is it not Shell that used to bulldoze farms and lay pipelines in Ogoni without any concession?

Thank you my brother. . . . I dont know why some people choose to make presumptions with knowing the background to the story. . . . anybody who was in Rivers State at the time know wetin dey shele. . . . infact, I am surprised at this laughable attempt to tarnish Saro's reputation. . . . we all know Saro was an idealist, but he was never violent or used violent rhetoric. . . . the people know their leaders. . . . the leaders were not ready for the pace of change and misjudged the mood of their people. . . . they thought they could propagate their old ways of doing business. . . . many of these guys are ex-ministers and commissioners. . . . it is hard to embrace real change when you have been used to a certain way of doing things and the status quo is in your favour. . .

ono:
Her father was?? Now, that's news. Pardon me, but do you have any link to backup your statement up there?

Ms Kogbara did put up a strong defence up there.

http://www.ratical.org/corporations/KSWstmt.html


"Throughout the war, I found that I was almost the only one, of the entire Ogoni elite, who stood by Nigeria. The men of my age group and beyond who have given evidence at this Tribunal or who were listed as prosecution witnesses in the proof of evidence -- Dr. G. B. Leton, Mr. I. S. Kogbara, Kemte Giadom as well as the men who were sadly murdered on May 21, 1994 were all on the opposite side of the argument."

texazzpete:
I second ono's request for proof.

However, if it turns out to be true, i can't say i'd blame him completely. If he narrowly escaped death from a mob loyal to Saro-Wiwa, stands to reason he'd be pretty aggrieved.

All 4 were Gokhanas, killed by Gokhanas in Gokhana land. Saro is a Khana. No mob would kill their kin on the behest or prompting of an outsider. I don't like speaking about the dead, but these guys had held public meetings in the town square petitioning the people to allow Shell restart work on a pipeline, even after they had been slaughtered in their thousands in a peaceful protest. The people do not need any incitement from Saro-Wiwa to form opinions on these guys. Its the same leaders they've had since Independence. Even during the court case, GB Leton whilst giving evidence against Saro said: "He has never used any violent language". The transcripts are there for all to see.

I dont need to defend myself against baseless accusations. Im just nice!

debosky:
Ibime before you go foaming at the mouth, does Song lack pace? Yes. I personally think Mikel is faster than Song, but that is debatable.
Let's compare like with like looking at previous Arsenal DM's is Song slow? Song is slower than Flamini, Gilberto, Edu and Petit (let's leave Vieira out because it is debatable whether he was more defensive or attacking)

hehehehehehe. . . . wait lemme laugh again. . . . . 

How can Mikel be faster than Song? Mikel is one of the slowest players in the prem.

The only two boys there faster than Song are Gilberto and Flamini. Song is faster than Edu and Petit hands down.

Song is fast enough. Even when playing centre-back, he has never been done for pace.

debosky:
Positional awareness alone is not good enough. Go watch the CL semi-final against UTD - the pace of the breakaway could have been remedied if we had a slightly faster DM a la Flamini.

Nonsense - no DM would have kept up with that counter attack. Only Mascherano would even come close. You cant open up like an Amsterdam LovePeddler and expect your DM to plug gaps for you.

debosky:
Pressing ability is linked with pace though not the sole determining factor. Flamini was all over the pitch, moving fast and pressing hard all over the place. His high tempo, high energy style is obviously what is most suited to the Arsenal side as currently set up.

I can see the problem. . . .you are following Flamini's blue print, but Song is not that kind of DM. Flamini is a high-pressing DM, whilst Song is a half-pressing DM (ie the DM who only presses when you enter his half). Besides, with Fabregas feeling like a King and Nasri the weakling prancing around like a prima-donna - Is pressing only the job of a DM?. At least you had Hleb doing his thing last year. This year, Song is totally exposed.

[quote author=~Sauron~ link=topic=200489.msg4032110#msg4032110 date=1245083898]This shit is played!!! Stop jacking ma stylez.
Lookie gay, you never even came near-a-career, you had to go and blow ya start?
Nairalanders would think I’m a “chiropractor for Napoleon”, the way I’ll pull ya “Bone-a-parte
https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-38921.352.html#msg3345737[/quote]my friend sharrap!!!

Who dey look your verse? I mention Bonaparte cos I was talking about Field Marshalls. It so happens to rhyme with Bone apart. I wasnt even using it as a punch, just a builder. Besides, that shit is played. How can you 'own' that? How many emcees up and down the land have used Bonaparte lyrics before? Bush man

FBS:
Alves is pure rubbish.

Utter trash.

debosky:
Secondly an established DM who can give Cesc the freedom to go forward knowing there's someone backing him fully - positionally aware and pacy. Our three current pretenders have either of these qualities but not both. Denilson is pacy, but not positionally aware. Song is positionally aware, but lacks pace.

Nonsense! How much pace does a DM need? Alex Song hasn't got pace? Well he's faster than most DMs I know. How much pace do Makelele, Deschamps, Mikel etc have? I never read such tosh in my life. If Song is positionally aware, and faster than most DM's, what is your point exactly? Song covers acres of ground. Another DM is needed to challenge him or put him on the bench but not for the reasons you have stated. Most DMs at Arsenal would get exposed. You need to focus closely on Arsenal's pressing in midfield. Thats where half the problem lies. Alex Hleb was a silky motherphocker, but could he press like an animal. I cannot say the same about the current crop.

What the writer fails to reveal is that her father was listed as a prosecution witness in the bungled-up court case against Saro-Wiwa that led to his death.

@ MrCrackles,

You thought I wasn't gonna reply that nonsense you wrote above? 

Here's something I concocted for you last nite. Its just a warning shot. Nothing fancy, just to make you measure your level. 



Ya getting too big for ya britches/ Im too big for you bitches!/
Skip the News and Sport. . . I’ma give you the Business. . .
What I spit is religious/ and with that wack ass verse?/
even a packed black church/ wouldn’t give you a witness/
I had to laugh at first/ that rhyme made me cringe/
Last time I ‘read bull’ like that. . . .it ‘gave me wings’/
Im designed to last/ withstanding fire like a fibre glass/
The man behind the iron mask/ crush you like a cycle crash/
You rap softer than pies and mash/ You need to retire fast/
Your rhymes are like LAWMA. . . cos you just recycle trash!/
I smoke your entire stash/ then decapitate a stranger/
You can’t back away from danger/. . . when the hammer hits the chamber/
The velocity’s fast and the trajectory precise/
I was sexing ya wife/ but she infected me with lice/
Next to me is Christ/ None other!/
You a dumb brother/ born to some mother . . .who’s a cum dumpster/ 
Bum f'ucker!/ Im a gun runner who run gunners/
And stun gunners/. . . you couldn’t be hot. . . for one summer!/
‘Flow for Rank’ is the title of the thread/
. . but Muswell Hill General. . . . is just a title in his head/
cos he’s a Major fool!/ He couldn’t climb the charts/
In an army of rappers, he’d be one of the Private parts/
He aint earning his stripes/ so I’ll disvirgin his wife/
Cos Field Marshalls battle hard while men turn into mice/
And I’m Napoleon Bonaparte/ so I’ll pick his bone apart/
And if  Sharon back him up. . . I’ll take em 2 by 2 like Noah’s Ark!/

naijaking1:
I'm not sure, but my assumption would be that like many so-called ethnic minorities of the former eastern Nigeria that felt "oppressed" by Igbos, that the Ogonis joined the Ijaws to sabotage Biafra. My personal experience is with the Ijaw, but while I research the Ogonis, I will be glad to be corrected.

Your personal experience? Which personal experience? How old are you?

Abeg stop yarning dust. . . . you have made another hasty assumption. I wonder when you guys will stop focusing on those who fought against you and start focusing on those who fought alongside you. The more you propagate these sentiments against your cousins, the more you create problems.


I shall quote from Saro-Wiwas testimony. He is speaking about the Ogoni leaders:


"Throughout the war, I found that I was almost the only one, of the entire Ogoni elite, who stood by Nigeria. The men of my age group and beyond who have given evidence at this Tribunal or who were listed as prosecution witnesses in the proof of evidence -- Dr. G. B. Leton, Mr. I. S. Kogbara, Kemte Giadom as well as the men who were sadly murdered on May 21, 1994 were all on the opposite side of the argument.

In spite of that, as soon as the war ended, I made absolutely sure that they were all rehabilitated, that their positions in Rivers State were promptly secured and that they could begin to make an Ogoni contribution to the development of the newly-created Rivers State."

http://www.ratical.org/corporations/KSWstmt.html

naijaking1:
Saying that Ijaws betrayed and fought against Biafra is indisputable. We know that 100% of no tribe ever joins a war fully, infact you have named some Igbos who fought for Nigeria, but the truth my friend is that most Igbos fought for Biafra, just like most Ijaws fought for Nigeria.

OK. . . . answer a quick question. . . . who did the Ogonis fight for?

hehehehe. . . . Naijaking is a funny guy. . . . wetin concern Igbo with this one? 

BTW, I am not attacking Texazzpete or claiming the article is his. I just find it funny that he should pick this article to detract from Ken. I also wholly disagree with Pres-elect statement that violence marred Ken's protest because Ken's protest was a completely peaceful one. The International community agree as much. The 4 chiefs who were killed were murdered at a time when Ogonis in Gokhana had just been murdered in their thousands during a peaceful protest and the mood was hardened against those Chiefs who wanted to seek a solution through the old political means that they were used to.

I can understand the writers feelings because it is a filial issue for her, but as for me, I cannot blame Ken for saying the same things that Nigerians say everyday up and down the country. Some came on the thread with the idea that Ken had a group of thugs behind him, but that is not the case. If you want some background knowledge on the issue, you can read the link below, and not rely on your suppositions.


http://www.ratical.org/corporations/KSWstmt.html

@ Afam,

Stop being funny.

What does my post on there have to do with what we are discussing here?

I say bollocks because Saro-Wiwa's accusations were not different to the allegations you and I make on Nairaland everyday. It wasn't like he was banging a drum that these Chiefs need to be eradicated. Tensions were very high in Ogoniland at the time. Saro did not keep armed thugs and as everyone knows all his demonstrations were peaceful ones. He never used violent rhetoric and never expressly ordered anyone to exterminate anyone. All his writings and speeches were highly intellectual, not rabble rousing. How can you compare that to Abacha who gives orders that someone be shot?

Afam:
Put differently, you cannot accuse Sani Abacha of the murders people usually attribute to him because chances are he never fired any shots and he was never at the scene of the crimes.


Those 4 men died because some people believed the allegations of Saro Wiwa, allegations that were never proved and for all I care may be completely wrong.

Bollocks.

texazzpete:
I speak against millitancy and MEND, not 'the Niger Delta Cause' in general. Please note the difference.

Yeah, I start noticing the difference when you justify the shelling of villages and start pulling up bullshit on Saro-Wiwa.

texazzpete:
In summary, the writer's uncle among others were killed brutally by mobs she feels were somewhat incited by Ken Saro-Wiwa et al. She's never indicated that Ken ordered their deaths in any way but feels he has to be held responsible in some way for inflaming the mob.

What you fail to realise is that any mob justice is illegal, and all allegations that these 4 men were involved in corrupt acts are merely allegations, nothing more. They had never been proven. Whatever the result, four men were killed that day, four men who had families that depended on them to come home that night and they never did. These four men have never been remembered. Is it so wrong for her to push for their remembrance? Or for her to place some of the blame where she feels it must be placed?

Her father almost died that day. Her uncle died that day. How then can we condemn her for her bitterness?

I am not condemning her for her bitterness. I took utter care not to directly state that these guys were corrupt. I only said, that is how the Ogoni people perceived them to be. I can not accuse any of these guys cos I am not EFCC and because there is a fine line. GB Letons sons are my compadres so I wouldn't yarn anyhow without evidence. As well as the four that died, there were 4 others who survived as they were warned by villagers on their way to the meeting, including GB Leton. Saro-Wiwa himself expressed regret at the actions of the mob. Like I said, the fault lies with the mob, not because Ken incited them to do anything. Infact Ken was not even in town when they were killed. He simply accused some of them of corruption. Is that a sin? It was not an accusation he repeated often and it was no Hitler-esque style incitation.

Whats the point of this thread? I would think nothing of the thread if it wasn't coming from Texazzpete, a well-known detractor of the Niger Delta cause. Whilst I can handle his opposition to more militant forms of opposition, he is hardly assuaging any of my fears by pulling up dirt on Ken Saro-Wiwa.

The writer is definitely correct to say that people will react indignantly to this cos he is opening up a can of worms. . .

Whilst Ken was hotheaded and idealistic, there is absolutely no fault to be placed at his door for the slaying of those Chiefs. Suggesting that Ken's rhetoric was responsible for their deaths is no different from Abacha's verdict.

Ken openly accused GB Leton and one other Chief of promising to 'deliver Ogoni' for the Social Democratic Party. If that amounts to complicity, then we are all equally guilty for the sturvs we say on Nairaland everyday. Ken did not tolerate corruption in any form, and openly spoke against it whilst his fellow Chiefs were trying to conduct backyard deals in the stained and corrupt corridors of power. Sometimes it is hard to know where these Chiefs personal interests ended and Ogoni interests started. The writer is completely wrong to state that Ken's "left wing cabal left-wing cabal that has grave reservations about the very notion of Big Business." Without pointing fingers, many Ogonis were also suspicious of these Chiefs notion of big business. To them, these Chiefs big business meant big pockets.

Gani would not be defending Ken in court if he thought Ken's rhetoric was responsible for those deaths. Truth be told, Ken only ever spoke the truth. The brutish mob who killed those Chiefs are the ones who should be held responsible for handing out summary justice to whom they view as their corrupt leaders - or as they say, the Jerry Rawlings treatment.

Eziachi:
I find it strange that people still find it palatable to equate Biafra secession to war. Secession of a confederate state in a federation is not synonymous to declaration of war against it. It’s in the right a part of that federation to secede if they wants to just like any marriage.

When the old Eastern house of parliament (Not Emeka Ojukwu) passes the law to secede from Nigerian federation, that does not equals declaration of war and Biafra never declared war on Nigeria but their fight was in defence and that is why 99% of the war itself was fought on the Biafra soil.

Those mischievous people always going on about how Ojukwu knew he cannot win the war or his ambition never stop to think that (1) Ojukwu did not declare Biafra secession but the Old Eastern House of parliament and council of Chief did, but his position as the most senior Biafra officer and at the time, the administrative governor of the East allow them to ask him to lead.

People often forget that Nigeria waited for months before responding with war over the secession and had been to Aburi in Ghana where they agreed with the East that they should maintained confederation with little power at the centre to be headed by the most senior military officer then (Ogundipe/Adeyinka Adebayo) only for Nigerian delegation to return from Ghana and renegade on the Aburi accord and handed a junior officer Gowon power and start calling the short from Lagos which suppose to be weaker than Ibadan, Enugu, Kaduna and Benin as the confederate capitals as agreed/signed in Aburi (pls read the Aburi accord).

And those too young to know or to ignorant to learn has kept equating the secession with war but forgot that Southern Cameroon (now Kumba, Baminda, Ekondo Titi, Boya, Victoria (now Limbe), Attabong etc) actually use to be part of the old Eastern region (i.e. Eastern Nigeria) but they decided to secede in late 1961 to join Cameroon. Nobody declared war on them then and they had oil too. If the Biafra/Nigeria war was because of oil, then it must had been for Nigeria and not for Biafra’s especially the Igbo’s as they had oil themselves if that if the case.

Its Nigerian leaders taste for blood and hatred of the Igbo’s that sparked the war and Ijaw’s unnecessary historic loggerhead with their cousins, the Igbo’s despite their close ancestral heritage. Igbo’s has always got on well till this day with the Ibibio’s, the Efiks and the Annang. Ijaws fought tooth and nail to kill Biafra and they had succeeded in getting one Nigeria and today they are seeing and enjoying the reality it brought.

Eziachi, whilst I commend you for your post and agree with your first point that Biafra never declared war on Naija but vice-versa, I must take umbrage with the propaganda contained toward the end of your post and the false labelling of Ijaws as Biafra-saboteurs. I have stressed this point many a time that Ijaw is not a unitary body and 'some Ijaws fought for Naija' does not equate to 'all Ijaws fought for Naija'. Infact, most Ijaws were just civilians minding their own business, caught up in a war and being buffeted from both sides. It is wholly disingenuine to keep singling out the Ijaw masses for reproach, as they are disconnected from the political class. It is also insidious to keep tarring Ijaws with a false brush when most political leaders in the former Rivers State were pro-Nigerian including Ngwa-Ikwerre, Umu-Etche, Umu-Rebisi, Ngwa-Ndoni as well as leaders in the Ogoni and Ijaw factions. However, this does not mean that the denizens of Rivers State supported their leaders or heeded any call to arms against Biafra, at least not the vast majority who remembered the progroms.

Dembele is a player after my heart. He reminds me of Ronaldo Lima when he first came out, being able to combine quick dribbling with strong running. . . . my only issue is that he is very selfish and no dey pass ball

[quote author=~Sauron~ link=topic=268431.msg4026817#msg4026817 date=1244997883]You are a retard. . . . Only stark illiterates class CWC and ICC together.
An event organised by CONMEBOL/UEFA involving 2 teams is different from an event organised by FIFA representing more teams from the other continents. It is technically and morally wrong to say Bayern Munich have won FIFA club world cup!!!
They have not, they only won the champions of the South American continent.

It seems someone farted on your brain cells. . . . .Who gives a sugar?
In England, Football league and the Premier League are still the same football body.
The name only changed. . . . . .Ibime will soon tell us NFA is different to NFF.
FIFA(world footballing body), UEFA(European Football body), CONMEBOL(South American football body). . . . .There's a universe of difference between them unless your name is an IDIOTIC Ibime.
Did u pass through the 4 walls of a school in ur miserable life?

What an idiot you are. . . . .In other words, Ibime is saying Onze d'Or and Ballon d'Or are the same!!!!
The money spent on your education should be refunded.
BBC African Player Of The Year is quite different to CAF bullshit which is also different to the ones organised by France Football.
Are FIFPro and FIFA World Player Of The Year the same thang? Are u a retard?



On United's official website. . . . .It says United have won 1 Intercontinental Cup and 1 FIFA club world cup.
It did not say United have won 2 FIFA club world cups or 2 Intercontinental Cups.
Tell the people classing ICC and CWC as the same thing to stop. . . . . .It's sheer ILLITERACY.[/quote]Somebody needs to put this retard in his place. . .how many arguments can one man sustain at the same time?


This idiot is telling me that France Football's African Player of the Year award pre-1992 is not the same as CAF player of the year award post 1992. . . . . who the flip is talking about BBC here. . . . Sauron, who was African Player of the year in 1985 and who bestowed the award upon him?

Like I have said, there is no reason to argue endlessly about ICC and WCC and bla bla bla. . . .everybody knows they are one and the same. . . . . . . UEFA and COMNEBAL knew that by shutting out Africa, Asia and North America, its gonna cost em votes at FIFA elections. . . . hence they handed over to FIFA to organise it for the whole world. . . . . the wikipedia entry clearly states: "From 2005 the Intercontinental Cup was replaced by the FIFA Club World Cup, which also includes North American, Asian, African and Oceanian winners."

The Fairs Cup was replaced by the UEFA Cup. . . . now you gonna tell Newcastle fans they have no UEFA Cup history?. . .

this guy is a dolt. . . . the idiot doesn't even know that Football League and Premier League are two different corporations with two different constitutions. . . .

oya, carry your endless argument go. . . . a man cannot argue with a woman at the market square lest he bring himself down to the level of a market woman. 

Sauron, stop being an idiot.

Everybody classes WCC and ICC together. If they ran concurrently, then you may have a point, but as soon as WCC started, ICC ended, meaning that WCC directly replaced ICC.

Now this ya bullshit about the organisers being FIFA or COMNEBOL or UEFA bla bla bla. . . .who gives a sugar?. . . . before 1992, the top league in England was organised by the Football League, now it is organised by the Premier League. . . . African Player of the Year award was organised by France Football, now it is orgainsed by CAF. . . . you cannot tell Roger Milla he didn't win African player of the year just because the organising body changed and the voting structure changed. . . . nor can you tell Liverpool that their 18 EPL titles are on the backburner because the name of the league and the organiser changed. . . . now stop being a poof, today is a Sunday.

[quote author=~Sauron~ link=topic=268431.msg4024743#msg4024743 date=1244932360]@ Ibime,

STUPIDITY runs in ur blood platelets like the Naigara falls if u think Intercontinental cup and FIFA club world cup are the same thing.
Firstly, Intercontinental cup is not a FIFA-organised tournament. the football federation of Europe and South America were the organisers.
Secondly, Intercontinental cup never played clubs outside the continents of Europe and South America.
How u made your grades in school should be questioned.
To be honest, i don't care about the sex-lives of you and Dayo shagging each other but PLEASE. . . . .READ A BOOK and gather some knowledge.
Intercontinental Cup and FIFA world cup are 2 different competitions, y'all are plastic RETARDS.[/quote]You are a brainless twerp for trying to tar me with the flimsy evidence you hold on Dayokanu. . . . whilst your parents had locked the TV and sent you to your room, I was busy watching Man Utd get totally outclassed in a 0-0 draw with Necaxa in the inaugural version of the World Club Cup. . . . only a pedantic bore like yourself would try to draw a distinction between both tournaments. . . . granted there are technical differences, but in general footie parlance, the World Club Cup is seen as the successor to the Intercontinental Cup and it is not a cardinal offence to class them together. . . . just like it is not a cardinal offence to class France Footballs APOY award with CAF's APOY award. . .

dayokanu:
Who was the African representative in 1930 and 1938 to make this a "world cup" who was the Asian representative in 1934?

Tell us about qualifiers for the 1930 event that you watched Where you went to get autographs for the 1930 qualifiers.

Your footie knowledge tells you
Wenger nurtured Henry in Monaco,
that Leeds won champions league,
More goals are scored in England,
Told us how clubs cant win league with 69points in EPL,
Sani Kaita played U-17,
Figo captained Guordiola in Barca,
Liverpool was seeded in 2004/2005 CL
Man Utd beat Inter Milan in 2002/2003

GUFFANTI what do you have for us today

Dont let me add my own to the utter bollocks that Sauron has spewed on this forum. . .


Another disgraceful comment he made was that Ikpeba >>>> Sonny Anderson at Monaco. . .


If I was keeping tabs on his footie faux-pas, there would be enough evidence for Mukina2 to ban him from Nairaland for good.

@ Debo and Sauron,


Crizzle told me to unquote you bastards cos you were chatting so much bollocks, she had to send it into cyberspace



What can you two arse-wipes tell me about footie?

The footie knowledge I gain in my sleep would inform both of y'all's waking thoughts.  

Where can it be said that Ibime made a footie faux-pas on Nairaland? I dare one of you punks to produce such evidence.

I don't talk shit like you two arse-wipes, colouring it with fancy language.  

Only a pedantic bore such as Sauron would fastidiously hammer on about the Intercontinental Cup/ World Club Cup dichotomy as he has done for the past few months. . . if that is the only thing you got on Dayokanu, then your argument is flimsy to say the least. . . . the World Club Cup simply replaced the Intercontinental Cup and both are generally seen as having the same end - crowning the best club side in the world. . . . I guess the closest parallel one can draw is that between the Fairs Cup and UEFA Cup. . . . despite the endless footie arguments you have had with Dayokanu on Nairaland, this is all you can use to hit him with?

. . . . as for me, you can NEVER pull up anything on my humble self   . . . . on the other hand, in a single argument I had with Sharon a long time ago, I pointed out 8 mistakes in his recantation of history . .

Debo is another story altogether. . . . his analyses are based on such shaky background knowledge that any surface probing of his analysis would expose him so thoroughly, that you would think the job was done by Hercule Poirot. . .  

This is why I respect Dayo on footie issues. Dayo and I could start chatting footie here to such an extent that you punks would be too reticent to contribute, just like I am reticent to talk about NPL from the 1980's with Akolawole et al  

hehehehehe. . . . .Sauron is a JJC to footie. . . . in the eyes of the discerning, he is the proverbial emperor in new clothes. . .