₦airaland Forum

johnw47:
Does the Watchtower organization control the
Jehovah's Witnesses' thinking?
written by a christian


Following are quotes from the literature of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society--better known
as the Jehovah's Witnesses organization. After reading the quotes below, it is obvious that the
Watchtower discourages individual thinking among the Jehovah's Witnesses and requires them to
submit to the teaching of the Watchtower organization.

Romans 14:5 says, "One man regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Let
each man be fully convinced in his own mind." The Bible wants us to think and to be convinced in
our own minds about issues that are debatable (Rom. 14:1-12). However, the Watchtower does not
want its people to be convinced in their own minds. It wants them to submit to the Watchtower.

1./ The Bible can only be understood via the Watchtower organization.

1. Quote: "Only this organization functions for Jehovah's purpose and to his praise. To it alone God's
Sacred Word, the Bible, is not a sealed book," (Watchtower, July 1, 1973, p. 402).
2. Comment: This is an amazing quote. Only the Watchtower organization can properly interpret the
Bible. It is saying that the Lord Jesus, through the Holy Spirit, cannot give a Christian a proper
understanding of the Bible even though it is Jesus who opens the mind to understand Scripture
(Luke 24:45). This effectively prevents the Jehovah's Witness from thinking and interpreting the
Bible for himself apart from the Watchtower organization's guidance.

2./ Individuals are not able to rightly interpret the Bible apart from the Watchtower organization.

1. Quote: "Thus the Bible is an organizational book and belongs to the Christian congregation as an
organization, not to individuals, regardless of how sincerely they may believe that they can interpret
the Bible," (Watchtower, Oct. 1, 1967, p. 587).
2. Comment: The Watchtower restricts its followers from looking at the Bible by itself without the
guidance of the organization's input. This is not freedom to think for oneself, and it is a sure way to
keep the Jehovah's Witnesses intellectually in line with Watchtower teachings.
3. Also, contrast the quote above with the following quote from the Watchtower: "The Vatican belittles
Bible study by claiming it is the only organization authorized and qualified to interpret the Bible,"
(Watchtower, July 1, 1943, p. 201). The funny thing is that that is exactly what the Watchtower does.
It claims to be the only source of true spiritual knowledge.

3./ If you don't understand something, meekly wait for the Watchtower to tell you what the truth is;
otherwise, you are foolish.

1. Quote: "We should eat and digest and assimilate what is set before us, without shying away from
parts of the food because it may not suit the fancy of our mental taste . . .We should meekly go
along with the Lord's theocratic organization and wait for further clarification, rather than balk at
the first mention of a thought unpalatable to us and proceed to quibble and mouth our criticisms and
opinions as though they were worth more than the slave's provision of spiritual food. Theocratic
ones will appreciate the Lord's visible organization and not be so foolish as to put against Jehovah's
channel their own human reasoning and sentiment and personal feelings," (Watchtower, Feb. 1,
1952, p. 79-80).
2. Comment: Here, the Watchtower tells us that submission is to God's "theocratic organization," the
Watchtower organization, and that submission must be complete and meek. Undoubtedly, this is
clearly teaching that independent thought is not welcome in the Watchtower Organization.

4./ The Watchtower magazine is the means of God's communication.

1. Quote: "It should be expected that the Lord would have a means of communication to his people on
the earth, and he has clearly shown that the magazine called The Watchtower is used for that
purpose," (1939 Yearbook of Jehovah's Witnesses, p. 85).
2. Comment: This says that the Jehovah's Witness organization is the means God uses to communicate
on earth today, but the Bible says that God speaks to us through His Son: Heb. 1:1-2 says it is Jesus:
"God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2in
these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom
also He made the world."

5./ Cannot understand the Bible outside of the Watchtower organization.

1. Quote: "We all need help to understand the Bible, and we cannot find the Scriptural guidance we
need outside the 'faithful and discreet slave' organization," (Watchtower, Feb. 15, 1981).
2. Comment: The Jehovah's Witness organization has set itself up as the sole means of understanding
the Bible. In contrast to this, Jesus opens the mind to understand the scriptures (Luke 24:45). It isn't
the Watchtower organization that does this but God. Admittedly, we have denominational
differences, but the differences are not in the essentials; and we certainly are able to understand
those essentials apart from the Watchtower.
3. See CARM's article on the "Faithful and Discreet Slave," for clarification on this issue.

6./ Those who think apart from the Watchtower's guidance are like Satan.

1. Quote: "From time to time, there have arisen from among the ranks of Jehovah's people those, who,
like the original Satan, have adopted an independent, faultfinding attitude...They say that it is
sufficient to read the Bible exclusively, either alone or in small groups at home. But, strangely,
through such 'Bible reading,' they have reverted right back to the apostate doctrines that
commentaries by Christendom's clergy were teaching 100 years ago . . " (Watchtower, Aug. 15,
1981).
2. Comment: So, if you think independently, find fault with something the Watchtower says, then you
are like Satan. Is this freedom of thought? Is this how Christ works in the church? Hardly.
3. Also, what are the apostate doctrines spoken of in the above quote? Of course, that would be the
Trinity, the deity of Christ and the Holy Spirit, the physical resurrection of Christ, etc.,--all things
the Watchtower organization denies. So, if you read the Bible by itself, reading it for what it says
and without the Watchtower guiding you, you will adopt these doctrines--which the Watchtower
says are not true!

7./ If you love God, then you accept the Watchtower.

1. Quote: "We cannot claim to love God, yet deny his word and channel of communication,"
(Watchtower, Oct. 1, 1967, p. 591).
2. Comment: In other words, if you love God, then you will be "in" the Watchtower organization. If
you reject the organization, then you reject God. Amazing! So, the Jehovah's Witness is urged to not
leave the organization lest they end up rejecting God. Is this encouraging freedom of thought? No.

8./ The truth of God can be known only through the Watchtower organization.

1. Quote: "All who want to understand the Bible should appreciate that the "greatly diversified
wisdom of God" can become known only through Jehovah's channel of communication, the faithful
and discreet slave," (Watchtower, Oct. 1, 1994, p. 8].
2. Comment: Here, the Watchtower states that the only way to understand God's word is through the
Watchtower organization. In other words, your thinking must be in submission to the teaching of the
Watchtower.

These few quotes should be more than adequate to demonstrate that the Watchtower not only
maintains a control over the thinking of its adherents but also actually discourages independent
thought. This is definitely one of the signs of a cult.

Trashy hogwash !
Fictional tale of johnw ,eminent plagiarist & Pharisee.
Copy copy thief thief

achorladey:
Your own LIES start from even spelling my moniker ACHORLADEY wrongly.

Oga Janosky is it only on CHRISTMAS day people practice hedonism, wild parties, loose conduct e.t.c. Do JWs give in to commercialism and Materialism just like other religious organizations? Jehovah's day is fast approaching yet leaders of the Organization are building SOPHISTICATED NEW HEAD QUARTERS after making HUGE PROFIT on the previous one SOLD to the TRUMP Family. What that tells me is COMMERCIALISM AND MATERIALISM. It is not by celebrating CHRISTMAS that leads people to such things.

Pls I'm sorry for wrong spelling of your name .
Achorladey dey find excuses to justify wetin Jesus no approve (Galatians 4:9-11) .
Which pagan celebration wey Jesus do with pagans or change the name so as to convert them (pagans) to become his followers?
The early Christians sold land & properties & used the proceeds for the congregation, likewise JWs . Your analogy is off point.

@Anchorladey sophisticated LIES .
How is hedonism, wild parties & loose conduct of the pagan celebration of the Sun god, replicated at Christmas ( Santa Claus, unrivalled commercialism & materialism) connected to Jehovah's worship in his holy temple?

True worship of Jehovah was desecrated by pagans & later restored.

Christmas today is merely a change of label from the celebration of the pagan sun god to "Christmas" with all the imprints of paganism now disguised as Christianity.

Remove the Panadol logo on a pack of Panadol imprinted tablets & label it. "Christiandol", it is still Panadol .
Likewise the celebration of the pagan Sun god on December 25th now labeled Christmas.
Jesus the perfect man never sought to convert pagans by blending his righteous ways with their paganism . Imperfect men now deviously abrogate & dictate to Christ &
what he (jesus) would never approve .(Galatians 4:9-11).
Hhmmm!!!

johnw47:
matt 24:13 is not about being saved by works
in fact God makes it very clear that believers are saved by grace through faith, and not works:

Eph 2:8  For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 
Eph 2:9  Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Johnw Pharisee dey do cover up.
Jesus debunked your satanic doctrine of once saved, always saved (Matt 24:13. Rev 3:14-16)
"Saved Christian just does little, not much works" Pharisee

johnw47:
ha ha poor tormented false jw jano

matt 24:13 is not about being saved by works
in fact God makes it very clear that believers are saved by grace through faith, and not works:

Eph 2:8  For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 
Eph 2:9  Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Johnw Pharisee dey do cover up.
Jesus debunked your satanic doctrine of once saved, always saved (Matt 24:13. Rev 3:14-16)
"Saved Christian just does little, not much works" Pharisee

johnw47:
Is the Jehovah's Witness religion Christian?
written by a christian

The answer to the question is, "No. It is not Christian." Like all non-Christian cults, the Jehovah's Witness' organization distorts the essential doctrines of Christianity. It denies the deity of Christ, His physical resurrection, and salvation by grace. These make it non-Christian. In addition, to support its erring doctrines, the Watchtower organization (which is the author and teacher of all official Jehovah's Witness' theology) has altered the Bible to make it agree with its changing and non-Christian teachings.

Typical with cults that use the Bible to support its position is a host of interpretive errors:

Taking verses out of their immediate context.
Refusing to read verses in the entire biblical context.
Inserting their theological presuppositions into the text.
Altering the Biblical text to suit their needs.
Latching onto one verse to interpret a host of others.
Changing the meanings of words.
Proclaiming some passages to be figurative when they contradict their doctrines.
Adding to the Word of God.

Additionally, the Jehovah's Witness' organization requires of its member's regular weekly attendance at their "Bible Study" meetings where they are repeatedly indoctrinated with anti-Christian teachings. This is done by reading the Watchtower magazine, following along with what it says, reading the questions it asks, and reciting the answers it gives. In other words, the Watchtower Organization carefully trains its members to let the Organization do their thinking for them. For confirmation of this, please read Does the Watchtower organization control the JW's thinking?

The Witnesses are told they will be persecuted when they go door-to-door teaching their doctrines. They are further told that this is simply the enemy fighting against God's organization because they are in "the truth." So, when someone disagrees with them, they are conditioned to reflect on what the Watchtower has told them. They then feel confirmed in being in God's true organization on earth (like all cults claim). They are strongly encouraged to have friends and acquaintances that are only JW's, thereby keeping outside examination to a minimum. They are told to shun those who leave their group, for in this way there is no way to see why someone has left and no way to find out that they are in error from those who have found the truth in Christ. They are conditioned to shy away from any real biblically knowledgeable person. An example of this is frequently found on the Internet. I was once banned from a Jehovah's Witness' chat room after I not only answered their objections to the Trinity and deity of Christ but also challenged them in return. Subsequently, my name was passed around to all other Jehovah's Witness' rooms where I was banned from them as well. This is a frequent occurrence on the Internet where the Jehovah's Witnesses are alive and well. It is obvious that critical examination of their doctrines is not encouraged by the Watchtower Organization.

The Jehovah's Witnesses consider themselves to be Christians because they believe they are serving the true and living God. Like many cults, they think they are the only true church on earth. Yet, they deny the Trinity, the deity of Christ, the personhood of the Holy Spirit, Jesus' physical resurrection, and salvation by grace through faith.

The Jehovah's Witnesses are discouraged from looking into Jehovah's Witness' history or old Watchtower literature which is replete with contradictions, altered doctrines, and false prophecies. Instead, they are indoctrinated repeatedly against basic Christian doctrines (Trinity, deity of Christ, etc.,) and into the notion that they alone are the true servants of God and that all others are either in "Christendom" or simply unbelievers.

Primarily, the Jehovah's Witness' organization is a mind-control organization that uses its people to pass out literature and send in "donations" to the headquarters in Brooklyn, New York.

"Thus the Bible is an organizational book and belongs to the Christian congregation as an organization and not to individuals, regardless of how sincerely they may believe that they can interpret the Bible."(The Watchtower, Oct. 1, 1967, p. 587.)

Conclusion
The Watchtower organization of the Jehovah's Witnesses is a non-Christian organization that uses its people to promulgate false doctrines, collects "contributions" for distribution of a multitudinous amount of literature, and expands its grip into the lives of its members and their families.

It is a non-Christian cult.

Tales by moon light, rooster & bull TRASH by Johnw Pharisee.

johnw47:
, the church in laodicea didn't pass the test, their works showed them to not have that true living faith needed to be saved



those verses are not to do with being saved by works, in fact one of them says:
Heb 10:38  Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

and the just are also saved through faith:

Eph 2:8  For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 
Eph 2:9  Not of works, lest any man should boast. 

i say exactly what scripture says, and you call it satanic doctrine,

Johnw lying Pharisee dey shift goal post. Lol
Why would already "saved christians" need to pass any tests again since U claimed that their salvation is already guaranteed?

zodiakzax:
..how exactly is " your divine throne endures forever" synonymous to " God is your throne forever and ever" ... explain Mr Pagan... stop being stupid and a fool... Nwt is full of shiit... how in the hell is God even his throne..


kis·'a·cha, e·lo·him.... your throne,God.... psalm 45:6...

https://biblehub.com/lexicon/psalms/45-6.htm


Stop being stupid..

Educated illiterate ....
A half baked illiterate like zodiakzax lacks comprehension skills.
That Janosky post pass your level.
Get outta here

VICOiheaka:
then explain 1 john 5:8 your misunderstanding and foul foundation in Christianity is the reason why you will never hear from God, and you talk of his word being corrupt hmm lack of fear of God

https://biblehub.com/1_John/5-8.htm
"The spirit the water and the blood- these three are in agreement" 1 John 5:8
U can see the transliterated manuscript texts on biblehub

"...A textual controversy exists between the end of verse 7 and the beginning of verse 8(kJV).
The Textus Receptus which was used in translating the KJV adds a reference to a witness on earth...
this reading is not found in the earliest manuscripts"
https://www.bibleref.com/1-John/5/1-john-5-8.html

U can now see for yourself that the verse U referred me to has nothing to do with Trinity.
Of a truth, the counterfeit version of 1John 5:7,8 in your KJV is not in the earliest manuscripts of the Bible except the corrupted textus receptus manuscript.

The series of forgeries and lies added to the holy scriptures are the foundation of Trinity .


The fact is Trinity doctrine depicts "your misunderstanding and foul foundation in Christianity" Yes !

TATIME:
It's baffling how creatures made in God's image couldn't figure out a common misinterpretation of a single verse even while it's contradicts other scriptural texts!
How can Jesus be the same person that sent Himself message?
*He prayed several times to God.Matthew 26:39
He CRIED unto the one who can SAVE Him. Matthew 27:46
*He told them there are certain things He DOES not know only His father knows.Matthew 24:36
*He told Mary "I'm returning to my father and your father, to my God and your God" John 20:17
*He said the position to rule with Him in heaven is not to be determined by Him but His father. Matthew 20:20
*David said God told Jesus (in heaven) "sit at my right hand" Psalms 110:1/Act 2:34
*Stephen saw TWO persons in heaven, God and Jesus by the side. Act 7:56
*Jesus Himself said Everlasting life could be attained by gaining the ACCURATE knowledge of TWO persons(God and Himself) John 17:3
With all of this and many more,supposedly intelligent beings will still argue that He is the same person sending Himself.
But if it's a case that's not biblical, they'll open all their brains to fish out mistakes! And they can't just see that it's the translators that made that single mistake!

My bro, there stupidity is simply absurd. Trinity doctrine shuts down their power to reason.
Solite3 & Anas09 said their Trinity is now a hierarchy , no more co-equals.
Trinitarians are Confused.

major466:
Jehovah witness for example do not believe that Jesus Christ is GOD. To them Jesus Christ is a created being just like arch Angel Micheal. This belief is contrary to John1:1.

The popular corruption of John 1:1 contradicts the truth revealed by Jesus & the holy scriptures.
John 20;17,30,31. 1cor 11:3. & 15:24,27. Matt 16:13-17. Rev3:12,14,21. John 17:3

cc: VICOiheaka

johnw47:
false jw jano

of course you reject the truth shown about your false jw org.
and of course you reject the scriptures given
you are false jw of course you reject truth

Shut up there !

"But he who endures to the end will be saved" Matt 24:13.

God's word they burst johnw bubble of falsehood & knock out him lies. Oya Gerroutta here...

VICOiheaka:
keep quite my friend accept that jesus christ is the word of God made flesh read john 1:1

U need deliverance from that popular man made invention in John 1:1 that is holding millions in bondage.
pls shine your eyes, Seriously!

solite3:
are you aware that Christ had about 120 followers but only choose 12 disciples even in the twelve Jesus called three sons of bonerges. So Christ established hierarchy withing his followers even Jesus said his father is greater than him which means even within the trinity there is hierarchy acording to the function.

So, your 3 "Gods" are no longer co- equals?
Oturugbeke !!!!!!!

Your man made invention goes with contradictory versions.
Confused bunch of LIARS !!

johnw47:
faith without works is dead, means that once saved we do good works, we do not do good works to be saved, we do good works because we are saved....
saved christians have a living faith, doing good works whether much or little

Johnw satanic doctrine.

"I know your works and what you are doing, you are neither hot nor cold!
So,because you are lukewarm and neither cold nor hot, I will spew you out of my mouth" Rev 3:14-16,21.

"But he who endures to the end will be saved" Matt 24:13.
Hebr 10:26,27,36-39
Carry una satanic doctrine comot from here jare.

Falsehood na johnw DNA

johnw47:
false jw jano

we (christians that is) are saved by grace through faith:
Eph 2:8  For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

we are not saved by works:
Eph 2:9  Not of works, lest any man should boast.

faith without works is dead, means that once saved we do good works, we do not do good works to be saved, we do good works because we are saved:
Jas_2:20  But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

faith without works is dead, meaning it is not doing anything:
Jas_2:17  Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

saved christians have a living faith, doing good works whether much or little


even if false jw's were preaching the true gospel it wouldn't save them, salvation is by God's grace through faith,
but the works you false jw's do of preaching a false gospel where Jesus body was not raised and where
there are two gods, almighty god father, and mighty god son, of course only saves you for the lake of fire

Another junk "gospel " from a confirmed fraud.
Be not deceived !

The word of God can not be broken, says Jesus, the son of his Father,(John 10:34-36)

"But do you care to know, O empty man, that faith with out works is useless ?" James 2;20
You see that man is to be declared righteous by works and not by faith alone" James 2:24

"However become doers of the word and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves with false reasoning" James 1:22

The rich young man did lots of good works but never had the faith to follow Christ .Matt19:16-21.

johnw47:
Who are the Jehovah's Witnesses and what are their beliefs?
written by a christian

The sect known today as the Jehovah’s Witnesses started out in Pennsylvania in 1870 as a Bible class led by Charles Taze Russell. Russell named his group the “Millennial Dawn Bible Study,” and those who followed him were called “Bible students.” Charles T. Russell began writing a series of books he called “The Millennial Dawn,” which stretched to six volumes before his death and contained much of the theology Jehovah’s Witnesses now hold. The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society was founded in 1886 and quickly became the vehicle through which the “Millennial Dawn” movement began distributing their views. Group members were sometimes disparagingly called “Russellites.” After Russell’s death in 1916, Judge J. F. Rutherford, Russell’s friend and successor, wrote the seventh and final volume of the “Millennial Dawn” series, “The Finished Mystery,” in 1917. That was also the year that the organization split. Those who followed Rutherford began calling themselves “Jehovah’s Witnesses.”

What do Jehovah’s Witnesses believe? Close scrutiny of their doctrinal position on such subjects as the deity of Christ, salvation, the Trinity, the Holy Spirit, and the atonement shows beyond a doubt that they do not hold to orthodox Christian positions on these subjects. Jehovah’s Witnesses believe Jesus is Michael the archangel, the highest created being. This contradicts many Scriptures which clearly declare Jesus to be God (John 1:1,14, 8:58, 10:30). Jehovah’s Witnesses believe salvation is obtained by a combination of faith, good works, and obedience. This contradicts countless scriptures which declare salvation to be received by grace through faith (John 3:16; Ephesians 2:8-9; Titus 3:5). Jehovah’s Witnesses reject the Trinity, believing Jesus to be a created being and the Holy Spirit to essentially be the inanimate power of God. Jehovah’s Witnesses reject the concept of Christ’s substitutionary atonement and instead hold to a ransom theory, that Jesus’ death was a ransom payment for Adam’s sin.

How do the Jehovah’s Witnesses justify these unbiblical doctrines? First, they claim that the church has corrupted the Bible over the centuries; thus, they have re-translated the Bible into what they call the New World Translation. The Watchtower Bible and Tract Society altered the text of the Bible to make it fit their false doctrine, rather than basing their doctrine on what the Bible actually teaches. The New World Translation has gone through numerous editions, as the Jehovah’s Witnesses discover more and more Scriptures that contradict their doctrines.

The Watchtower bases its beliefs and doctrines on the original and expanded teachings of Charles Taze Russell, Judge Joseph Franklin Rutherford, and their successors. The governing body of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society is the only body in the cult that claims authority to interpret Scripture. In other words, what the governing body says concerning any scriptural passage is viewed as the last word, and independent thinking is strongly discouraged. This is in direct opposition to Paul's admonition to Timothy (and to us as well) to study to be approved by God, so that we need not be ashamed as we correctly handle the Word of God. This admonition, found in 2 Timothy 2:15, is a clear instruction from God to each of His children to be like the Berean Christians, who searched the Scriptures daily to see if the things they were being taught lined up with the Word.

There is probably no religious group that is more faithful than the Jehovah’s Witnesses at getting their message out. Unfortunately, the message is full of distortions, deceptions, and false doctrine. May God open the eyes of the Jehovah’s Witnesses to the truth of the gospel and the true teaching of God’s Word.

Johnw brew of. TRASH .
"Jehovah's witnesses reject the concept of Christ's substitutionary atonement and instead hold to a ransom theory, that Jesus death was a ransom payment for Adam's sins"
Falsehood is in scripted in your DNA.

"... but that he (God) loved us and sent his son as an atoning sacrifice for our sins" 1 John 4:10.

"For as in Adam all die ,so in Christ all will be made alive"
1 for 15:22. ROM 5:12-21.

"No man can redeem the life of another or give to God a ransom for him" Psalms 49:7 .
No man is perfect to redeem the perfect sinless life that Adam lost through disobedience.
Christ stepped in & atoned for Adam's loss & gave his perfect life to ransom Adam's offsprings.

Your 3 Gods paganism removed your sense & stamped falsehood into your DNA.
Kpele

johnw47:
yep insanity reigns in false jw's

"Written by a fake ,johnw lying Christian" U dey thief another person fake write up & u no wan give am credit. Your fraud done open your y**sh make everyone dey see am.

johnw47:
know nothing jano, you are as confused as like a drunkard tatime
but then you are false jw's

i neither know or care about daddy go and pentecostal churches
you satans mob are paranoid, of course, that's from your daddy too

tat is still running

Johnw lies & fraud.
Him dey deny him Daddy !!
Oturugbeke !!!!!!
Lol

johnw47:
truly any group is a better group than false jw's who preach there are two gods and that Jesus body was not raised yes any group is better than a group preaching lies

johnw lie nus! God the Father is God God the son is God. God the holy ghost. How many Gods? That's johnw 3 Gods of fake Christianity & your triune disguised paganism

johnw47:
oh duh," cannot stop lying jano 

i acknowledged: "written by a christian", that's enough for me,
too bad that it's not enough for false accuser jano

the writer showed that "Your Throne O God" is the right translation,
but of course you jano lie and say it isn't, you are false jw, of course you would lie:

Joh

johnw47:
Heb. 1:8 and Psalm 45:6, "God is thy throne."
written by a christian

Your Throne O God "But with reference to the Son: 'God is your throne forever and ever, and [the] scepter of your kingdom is the scepter of uprightness'" The New World Translation.

In this particularly interesting verse, God is addressing the Son. The Greek construction of Hebrews 1:8 allows the text to be translated in two legitimate ways:

"God is your throne forever and ever . . .
and
"Thy Throne O God, is forever and ever . . . "

First, Heb. 1:8 is a quote from Psalm 45:6 "
The RSV translates it as "Your divine throne endures for ever and ever," "but this is a highly unlikely translation because it requires understanding the Hebrew noun for "throne" in construct state, something extremely unusual when a noun has a pronominal suffix, as this one does . . .

When we look at the Hebrew, we see that there is no grammatical requirement for this translation though it is considered to be the best translation by most translators.

" . .Written by a Christian " is Hogwash ! That "Christian" no get name or website ?

Johnw47 is a fraud.
NL is a public forum and as result, whatever quote that U post on this forum ,the original source must be accessible & verifiable to everyone here .

Your so-called "Christian" source said "To say 'God is your throne' does not make sense" confirmed that Johnw47 & his "christian" source speaks with both side of their mouth, they are fraudulent.
Their post said :
"The RSV translates it as "Your divine throne endures forever .." which he wrote is the "best translation" in the opinion of "most Bible theologians!'

NWT : "God is your throne forever and ever"

Is the RSV translation synonymous with NWT ?
Yes of course !
Johnw47 is a confirmed fraud.
Trinity doctrine & johnw47 na 5&6

johnw47:
false jw tatime
see where all your lying has gotten you,
you have been reduced to a babbling fool

johnw47 lie nus !
The term "Daddy GO" is popular & common to Nigeria's 'pentecostal' churches & their adherents,true or false ?

johnw47:
Heb. 1:8 and Psalm 45:6, "God is thy throne."
written by a christian

Your Throne O God "But with reference to the Son: 'God is your throne forever and ever, and [the] scepter of your kingdom is the scepter of uprightness'" The New World Translation.

In this particularly interesting verse, God is addressing the Son. The Greek construction of Hebrews 1:8 allows the text to be translated in two legitimate ways:

"God is your throne forever and ever . . .
and
"Thy Throne O God, is forever and ever . . . "

Because of the Watchtower presupposition that Jesus is not God, they choose the first version; otherwise, the Father would be calling Jesus God, and that goes against Jehovah's Witness theology. Yet, most Bibles do not translate it the way the New World Translation does. They choose the other way. Why? Two reasons.

First, Heb. 1:8 is a quote from Psalm 45:6, which says,

"Thy Throne, O God, is forever and ever; a scepter of uprightness is the scepter of Thy Kingdom" (All Bible quotes are from the NASB).

In fact, the ASV, KJV, NIV, and NKJV all translated it as "Your throne, O God . . . " The RSV translates it as "Your divine throne endures for ever and ever," "but this is a highly unlikely translation because it requires understanding the Hebrew noun for "throne" in construct state, something extremely unusual when a noun has a pronominal suffix, as this one does . . . The KJV, NIV, and NASB all take the verse in its plain, straightforward sense, as do the ancient translations . . . "1

When we look at the Hebrew, we see that there is no grammatical requirement for this translation though it is considered to be the best translation by most translators. In and of itself, this is not conclusive because the context of this verse in Psalm 45 is dealing with a king which would make one wonder why he would be addressed as God; but, it is not uncommon for NT writers to take a verse in the OT that seemingly deals with one subject and apply it to another. They knew something we didn't. In fact, in Ezekiel 28:12-17 is a section that deals with the fall of the devil. Verse 13 describes how he was in the garden of Eden. Verse 14 says he was the anointed cherub, (v. 15), etc., but the context of this section begins with an address to the king of Tyre (v. 12). Yet, right after Ezekiel is told to write to the King of Tyre, he then goes on to describe what the great majority of theologians agree with--a description of the devil's fall. So, we need to look at the context into which the writer of Hebrews put Psalm 45:6. He addressed it to Jesus. Therefore, Psalm 45 is a Messianic Psalm and must in interpreted in light of the NT not the other way around.

Nevertheless, the context of this verse follows:

"For to which of the angels did He ever say, "Thou are My son, Today I have begotten Thee"? And again, "I will be a Father to Him, and He shall be a Son to Me"? 6And when he again brings the first-born into the world, He says, "And let all the angels of God worship Him." 7And of the angels He says "Who makes His angels winds, and His ministers a flame of fire." 8But of the Son He says, "Thy Throne, O God, is forever and ever, and the righteous scepter is the scepter of His kingdom, 9Thou hast loved righteousness and hated lawlessness; therefore God, Thy God, hath anointed Thee with the oil of gladness above Thy companions. 10And, "Thou, Lord, in the beginning didst lay the foundation of the earth, And the heavens are the works of Thy hands; 11They will perish, but though remainest . . . " (Heb. 1:5-11).

To say "God is your throne" doesn't make sense. What does it mean to say, "But to which of the angels did he say, God is your throne." What would that mean?

Also worth noting here is verse 10: "Thou, Lord, in the beginning didst lay the foundation of the earth, And the heavens are the works of Thy hands . . . " This is a quote from Psalm 102:24-25 which says, "I say, 'O my God, do not take me away in the midst of my days, Thy years are throughout all generations. 25Of old Thou didst found the earth; And the heavens are the work of Thy hands.'" Clearly, God is the one being addressed in Psalm 102. It is God who laid the foundations of the earth. Yet, in Heb. 1:10, Jesus is called 'Lord' and is said to be the one who laid the foundation of the earth. This becomes even more interesting when we note that in Isaiah 44:24 it says, "Thus says the Lord, your Redeemer, and the one who formed you from the womb, "I, the Lord, am the maker of all things, Stretching out the heavens by Myself, And spreading out the earth all alone." If God was laying the foundations of the earth alone, that would mean that either Jesus has to be God, second person of the Trinity, who laid the foundation the same as YHWH did; or we have a contradiction in the Bible. Clearly, this section of Hebrews is proclaiming that Jesus is God. Therefore, contextually, it is best to translate Heb. 1:8 as, "Thy Throne, O God. . ." and the Father call Jesus God.

Only a fraudulent person copies another man's work with out acknowledgement of the source.
This OP ,johnw47 is a fraud .

Your Source says "God is your throne" (NWT) is a legitimate translation of the Greek texts.
Their further attempts to discredit their own statement reeks of double standard , fraud and bias.

The new testament says
The God of Jesus ( "that is why God, your God anointed you" heb1:9) anointed Jesus to occupy his ("my) Father's throne" Rev3:21. Luke 1:30-33. 1chro28:5
That is the Messianic Prophecy of throne of David which is the throne of the kingdom of Jehovah.

johnw47:
Heb. 1:8 and Psalm 45:6, "God is thy throne."
written by a christian

Your Throne O God "But with reference to the Son: 'God is your throne forever and ever, and [the] scepter of your kingdom is the scepter of uprightness'" The New World Translation.

In this particularly interesting verse, God is addressing the Son. The Greek construction of Hebrews 1:8 allows the text to be translated in two legitimate ways:

"God is your throne forever and ever . . .
and
"Thy Throne O God, is forever and ever . . . "

Because of the Watchtower presupposition that Jesus is not God, they choose the first version; otherwise, the Father would be calling Jesus God, and that goes against Jehovah's Witness theology. Yet, most Bibles do not translate it the way the New World Translation does. They choose the other way. Why? Two reasons.

First, Heb. 1:8 is a quote from Psalm 45:6, which says,

"Thy Throne, O God, is forever and ever; a scepter of uprightness is the scepter of Thy Kingdom" (All Bible quotes are from the NASB).

In fact, the ASV, KJV, NIV, and NKJV all translated it as "Your throne, O God . . . " The RSV translates it as "Your divine throne endures for ever and ever," "but this is a highly unlikely translation because it requires understanding the Hebrew noun for "throne" in construct state, something extremely unusual when a noun has a pronominal suffix, as this one does . . . The KJV, NIV, and NASB all take the verse in its plain, straightforward sense, as do the ancient translations . . . "1

When we look at the Hebrew, we see that there is no grammatical requirement for this translation though it is considered to be the best translation by most translators. In and of itself, this is not conclusive because the context of this verse in Psalm 45 is dealing with a king which would make one wonder why he would be addressed as God; but, it is not uncommon for NT writers to take a verse in the OT that seemingly deals with one subject and apply it to another. They knew something we didn't. In fact, in Ezekiel 28:12-17 is a section that deals with the fall of the devil. Verse 13 describes how he was in the garden of Eden. Verse 14 says he was the anointed cherub, (v. 15), etc., but the context of this section begins with an address to the king of Tyre (v. 12). Yet, right after Ezekiel is told to write to the King of Tyre, he then goes on to describe what the great majority of theologians agree with--a description of the devil's fall. So, we need to look at the context into which the writer of Hebrews put Psalm 45:6. He addressed it to Jesus. Therefore, Psalm 45 is a Messianic Psalm and must in interpreted in light of the NT not the other way around.

Nevertheless, the context of this verse follows:

"For to which of the angels did He ever say, "Thou are My son, Today I have begotten Thee"? And again, "I will be a Father to Him, and He shall be a Son to Me"? 6And when he again brings the first-born into the world, He says, "And let all the angels of God worship Him." 7And of the angels He says "Who makes His angels winds, and His ministers a flame of fire." 8But of the Son He says, "Thy Throne, O God, is forever and ever, and the righteous scepter is the scepter of His kingdom, 9Thou hast loved righteousness and hated lawlessness; therefore God, Thy God, hath anointed Thee with the oil of gladness above Thy companions. 10And, "Thou, Lord, in the beginning didst lay the foundation of the earth, And the heavens are the works of Thy hands; 11They will perish, but though remainest . . . " (Heb. 1:5-11).

To say "God is your throne" doesn't make sense. What does it mean to say, "But to which of the angels did he say, God is your throne." What would that mean?

Also worth noting here is verse 10: "Thou, Lord, in the beginning didst lay the foundation of the earth, And the heavens are the works of Thy hands . . . " This is a quote from Psalm 102:24-25 which says, "I say, 'O my God, do not take me away in the midst of my days, Thy years are throughout all generations. 25Of old Thou didst found the earth; And the heavens are the work of Thy hands.'" Clearly, God is the one being addressed in Psalm 102. It is God who laid the foundations of the earth. Yet, in Heb. 1:10, Jesus is called 'Lord' and is said to be the one who laid the foundation of the earth. This becomes even more interesting when we note that in Isaiah 44:24 it says, "Thus says the Lord, your Redeemer, and the one who formed you from the womb, "I, the Lord, am the maker of all things, Stretching out the heavens by Myself, And spreading out the earth all alone." If God was laying the foundations of the earth alone, that would mean that either Jesus has to be God, second person of the Trinity, who laid the foundation the same as YHWH did; or we have a contradiction in the Bible. Clearly, this section of Hebrews is proclaiming that Jesus is God. Therefore, contextually, it is best to translate Heb. 1:8 as, "Thy Throne, O God. . ." and the Father call Jesus God.

Only a fraudulent person copies another man's work with out acknowledgement of the source.
This OP ,johnw47 is a fraud .

Your Source says "God is your throne" (NWT) is a legitimate translation of the Greek texts.
Their further attempts to discredit their own statement reeks of double standard , fraud and bias.

brocab:
Where in the scriptures does it say Jesus said; knock on every door? No where do we find in the scriptures Jesus ever saying go out unto all the nations and preach from House to House without an invitation.

[color=#990000]{Acts 5:42} Day after day, in the temple courts and from house to house, they never stopped teaching and proclaiming the good news that Jesus is the Messiah.
And if you were to have read the scriptures proper, you would find Paul preached in Houses from People He met in the court yards, after he was invited to go to their houses to eat and preach, some asked Paul to stay a couple of days..
Paul “sent to Ephesus, and called the elders of the Church,” saying to them, “I…have taught you publicly, and from house to house.”
He taught the Church leaders in their own homes. Paul did not go from house to house, teaching whomever answered his knock at the door.
Based on a quick reading and misinterpretation of {Acts 20:20} many believe that the apostle Paul preached the gospel of the kingdom from house to house, to those who were unconverted. But when the entire paragraph is read, starting in {verse 17} the proper meaning can be understood.
Even at his own hired house in Rome, Paul “received all that came in unto him, preaching the kingdom of God,” which Christ had commanded him to preach {Acts 28:30-31}
So Paul didn't have to go door knocking-because it was those who wanted the learn the gospel 'who knocked on Paul's door,
Christ had personally taught the gospel to Paul [color=#990000]{I Corinthians. 15:8, Galatians 1:11-2:2} One of Christ’s teachings was that we are not to force our beliefs on anyone {Matthew 7:6}
This makes clear that Paul did not try to convert people by preaching from house to house, nor should the JW's harass people house to house, Paul's public teachings were carried out mainly in the Jewish synagogues, all in the temple court yards!

.

Hhmmm!
Acts 5:42 u quoted knocks out your fictitious post above .
What would Paul achieve by "proclaiming the good news" to an Ephesian christian in the house of that christian?
Wetin Paul wan preach to another believer?
In Acts 20:17-20 Paul trained the Ephesians Christians on the art of preaching.
He taught them to preach publicly & from house to house, they learned the ropes while preaching with Paul from house to house.
Matt 10:8,11-14 reinforced it.
The early Christians did not deviate from their Master's instructions


Jesus used every opportunity to preach, John chapter 4, Paul copied Christ example too.
From house to house, in the market place, his rented apartment, - all na him preaching territory. Acts28;17-30

OLAADEGBU:
www.livingwaters.com

"How can one witness to a Jehovah's Witness? They know so much about the bible and even revered Jesus but they don't believe that Jesus is God." Rocio Soto

I make it a habit not to try and convince a Jehovah's Witness that Jesus is God in human form. There are two reasons for this.

The first is that they have their own version of the Bible that removes references to the true nature of Jesus.

Second, when Jesus asked Peter "Who do you say that I am?" Jesus said to him that flesh and blood hadn't revealed that truth to him, but "my Father who is in Heaven." God is the one who reveals who Jesus is, so I leave that up to Him.

So you have two insurmountable hurdles if you argue doctrine with a JW. They move the goalposts, and they are spiritually blind.

The key to unlocking the door to them is to identify the real issue.

That issue is that JW's are a works righteousness religion. You can uncover this by saying, "There's a knife in my back and I have three minutes to live. What should I do to enter the Kingdom?" It's then that you will discover that they are trusting in works for their salvation rather than in the grace of God through Jesus Christ.

So you have to put them up the River Niagara without a paddle.

Strip them of their false hope. No one will be saved through good works or by being religious. The way to do that is to take them through the spiritual nature of God's Law (the Ten Commandments). Then share the biblical gospel with them--that we are saved by grace through faith alone (without works), and pray that God opens their eyes to the truth.

Once they are truly born again they will leave the Jehovah's Witnesses and become witness of Jesus Christ:

"But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and YOU SHALL BE WITNESS TO ME in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth" Acts 1:8, caps added)

If you don't know how to go through God's Law watch www.NoahTheMovie.com (1.2 million views).

Source: https://www.facebook.com/official.Ray.Comfort 11 May 2014

Olaadegbu junk gospel.
Stop deceiving yourself .

Faith with out works is dead
James 2:26.

John 20:17,30,31 . 1 Cor 11:3,
Mark 1:9-11,14,15. Matt10:8 ,John 7:16 , why U no fit clean am comot from your Bible na.... ?

Hairyrapunzel:
The council in Jerusalem is the council in Jerusalem.
You just think you can assume the council in Jerusalem is called governing body when bible didn't say so ?
Do you think we are daft?
OK show me where bible called council in Jerusalem governing body?


At the end of the day you still cannot find where governing body is written in the Bible. If is to open your wide mouth to shout how Trinity isn't mentioned in the Bible they will see you now mention where governing body is is mentioned in the Bible you cannot you are busy cursing. Well, na normal Jw way. If you guys see that your beliefs are not in the Bible you start cursing. Lol

Bible didn't tell you the council in Jerusalem are known as the governing body and bible also didn't tell you that the council in Jerusalem were responsible for making rules and regulations for the early Christians. Bible also didn't tell you that the council in Jerusalem will give early Christians their spiritual food and these Christians should unquestionably obey them. Bible never gave a name or gave functions of the council in Jerusalem.

Watchtower gave council in Jerusalem governing body and developed a function for them from their assumptions. Are we clear now?

Of a truth Hairyrapunzel is definitely insane...
.Uselu/Yaba gubernatorial candidate

Hairyrapunzel:
You can't quote the passage? OK let me quote it for you


The Council at Jerusalem
15 Certain people came down from Judea to Antioch and were teaching the believers: “Unless you are circumcised, according to the custom taught by Moses, you cannot be saved.” 2 This brought Paul and Barnabas into sharp dispute and debate with them. So Paul and Barnabas were appointed, along with some other believers, to go up to Jerusalem to see the apostles and elders about this question. 3 The church sent them on their way, and as they traveled through Phoenicia and Samaria, they told how the Gentiles had been converted. This news made all the believers very glad. 4 When they came to Jerusalem, they were welcomed by the church and the apostles and elders, to whom they reported everything God had done through them.

5 Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”

6 The apostles and elders met to consider this question. 7 After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8 God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9 He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”

12 The whole assembly became silent as they listened to Barnabas and Paul telling about the signs and wonders God had done among the Gentiles through them. 13 When they finished, James spoke up. “Brothers,” he said, “listen to me. 14 Simon[a] has described to us how God first intervened to choose a people for his name from the Gentiles. 15 The words of the prophets are in agreement with this, as it is written:

16 “‘After this I will return
and rebuild David’s fallen tent.
Its ruins I will rebuild,
and I will restore it,
17 that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,
even all the Gentiles who bear my name,
says the Lord, who does these things’[b]—
18 things known from long ago.[c]

19 “It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. 20 Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. 21 For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.”

The Council’s Letter to Gentile Believers
22 Then the apostles and elders, with the whole church, decided to choose some of their own men and send them to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas. They chose Judas (called Barsabbas) and Silas, men who were leaders among the believers. 23 With them they sent the following letter:

The apostles and elders, your brothers,

To the Gentile believers in Antioch, Syria and Cilicia:

Greetings.

24 We have heard that some went out from us without our authorization and disturbed you, troubling your minds by what they said. 25 So we all agreed to choose some men and send them to you with our dear friends Barnabas and Paul— 26 men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. 27 Therefore we are sending Judas and Silas to confirm by word of mouth what we are writing. 28 It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements: 29 You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality. You will do well to avoid these things.

Farewell.

30 So the men were sent off and went down to Antioch, where they gathered the church together and delivered the letter. 31 The people read it and were glad for its encouraging message. 32 Judas and Silas, who themselves were prophets, said much to encourage and strengthen the believers. 33 After spending some time there, they were sent off by the believers with the blessing of peace to return to those who had sent them. [34] [d] 35 But Paul and Barnabas remained in Antioch, where they and many others taught and preached the word of the Lord.

Disagreement Between Paul and Barnabas
36 Some time later Paul said to Barnabas, “Let us go back and visit the believers in all the towns where we preached the word of the Lord and see how they are doing.” 37 Barnabas wanted to take John, also called Mark, with them, 38 but Paul did not think it wise to take him, because he had deserted them in Pamphylia and had not continued with them in the work. 39 They had such a sharp disagreement that they parted company. Barnabas took Mark and sailed for Cyprus, 40 but Paul chose Silas and left, commended by the believers to the grace of the Lord. 41 He went through Syria and Cilicia, strengthening the churches.


Did you see anything like governing body written in acts 15?
You are just assuming. The governing body is only in your imagination. In real life nothing like governing body is ever mentioned in the Bible.

Still waiting for the bible passage where governing body appears. Lol

See someone that's calling another person brain dead. He can't even provide a bible verse that governing body appears. Lol

I think when people point out that certain phrases you use are never mentioned in the Bible you begin to curse the people. It's a normal phenomenon. When you realise that everything you have ever been taught in your magazines and everything you've ever believed in life from your magazines are never mentioned in bible you become aggressive and confused so the only way you know how to console yourself is by cursing.

God wants to expose u ..
v2,4,6,22-29 explained what everyone needs to know .
If you are not brain dead,
Who is the Council in Jerusalem?
What are their functions?
From Genesis to Revelation,mention where " bible" is found in the holy scriptures? must hairy Rapunzel come to NL to display his "insanity"?

Hairyrapunzel:
Show us where they mentioned governing body in the Bible? Don't give us assumption o.

Shame did not allow you quote the verses you mentioned because governing body is never mentioned not even once.

You just think people are daft like you are.

You be brain dead idiot.
Show us where they mentioned "Bible" from Genesis to Revelation in your copy of the holy scriptures ( that is, if you have one).

Yeah !!!!! Acts chapter 15 dey your bible & the phrase " Governing Body" dey give u frightmare & cold sweat.
A mere speck of dust wey u be no fit fight Jehovah at all.
NEVER !!!

TATIME:
The Trinity traditional religion has been in existence for almost two thousand years now so it's very difficult for them to agree that it's untrue.
What baffles me is the fact that they've all turned against those who initiated the TRINITY doctrine (Catholics) but why is it that they're sticking to the doctrine taught by their former religious Fathers is the question.

Gbam . very true.

brocab:
{Matthew 10:5-15} 5 These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: “Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans.
6 Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel.
7 As you go, proclaim this message: ‘The kingdom of heaven has come near.’

11 WHATEVER TOWN OR VILLAGE YOU ENTER, search there for some worthy person and stay at their house until you leave.
12 As you enter the home, give it your greeting.
13 If the home is deserving, let your peace rest on it; if it is not, let your peace return to you.
14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet.
15 Truly I tell you, it will be more bearable for Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than for that town.
I can't seem to find where you believe Jesus said: knock on every door? Plus it would be pointless for me to knock on your door-you can't accept the Word of God on this page now, so what difference would it make if I was to knock on a door that is so unwelcoming..

Brocab quoted v11-14 , so your brain shut down too?
if they are not knocking on every door & preaching , how would Jesus disciples "search
there for some worthy person and stay at their house?"

After your initial denial, u come dey speak with both sides of your mouth.

Your closing comments gives u away & exposes U to be a liar

johnw47:
the two Spirit beings God and the Word are indeed two persons and the one God:


Father and the Word are two beings and they are both God,


Jesus is Father God's Son, He is also God the Word, He is both man and God

Thomas calling Jesus my Lord and my God is very plain and clear,

of course they walk together in agreement, they are also the one spirit which is God.

.

Johnw47 brain done shut down because your first sentence is a CONTRADICTION of your last sentence.

"The two spirit beings God and the word are indeed two persons.. "

" ..of course they walk together in agreement, they are also the one spirit which is God."

johnw47 talk say two persons (two Gods) who walk together are one person ..
In other words , (1cor6:15) the man & the harlot who "walk together in agreement" are one person
(Proof that your john1;1 is fake) .
Guy that substance wey U dey sniff is doing justice to your brain.

Thomas talk say Jesus na him Oga.
Jesus come still talk say him own Oga na the Oga of Thomas sake of say Jesus & Thomas dey serve that same Oga. (John 20:17,30,31).
.But Johnw47 no get brain to see am.
Welcome to johnw47's junk doctrine of Trinity