₦airaland Forum

I hope this is not true. If it is, it would mean that Intels sabotaged Nigerian economy.

OP,
What is funding the grant? Is this a scholarship or a social welfare program? Please shed light on the spirit behind the grant.

Anambralstson:
As political parties strategise for 2019 general election, the Yoruba Council of Youths Worldwide has called on Alhaji Atiku Abubakar, Presidential Candidate of the Peoples Democratic Party (PDP), to prioritise his programme if he emerged president in 2019. Aremo Oladotun Hassan, the President of the group, who made the call on Thursday in Lagos, said Nigerians would not stop complaining until the economy, fiscal federation, security, education and infrastructure were repositioned.

Hassan, a lawyer, said that the PDP candidate must set out as an advocate for rule of law if he wins the 2019 Presidential Election.

The youth leader said that the restructuring agenda must be faced head on with setting up of A National Restructuring Affairs Commission with an Executive Bill.

“He (Atiku Abubakar) must be able to summon a greater patriotic will towards building and reviving our dying nation from economic stagnation and social insecurity. “He must be able to implement the 26 per cent UN Budgetary standard allocation to the Education sector with a view to postulating and establishing a statutory principle of law by enacting the Education Right Bill into law.

“He must be able to have a master plan for transportation development from roads network development programmes,” he said. According to him, the establishment of a National Transport Park and Fares Management Authority is expected to regulate the amount spent daily on transport fares by Nigerians.

He added that Abubakar also needed to quickly review the Land Use Act laws into Land Licensing and Allotment Law via an Executive Bill, wherein all lands right must revert back to the land owners and communities. [b]Hassan said that the government would only regulate its operations and management, while the Certificate of Occupancy and Consent should be replaced with Land Certificate of Ownership License.

“Also, the government must be ready to equip youths by granting 40 per cent youth affirmative action plan on appointment and involving the Nigerian youths in his government. “There must be a robust vocational training programme in information technology, Agriculture and other ancillary training, which will place and rank Nigeria as first world nation via economic revolution plan.

“Security architecture needs a total overhaul and ensure absolute neutrality in the discharge of their statutory duties,” he said. The youth leader said that more emphasis should be placed on rebuilding peace and national orientation on patriotism. He said that Atiku must choose a South-West youth with intellectual acumen for economy and law as the Secretary to the Government of the Federation since the zone lost the position of running mate.

According to him, paying attention to above issues and adequate representation of youths will galvanise support for PDP come 2019
[/b]

https://www.vanguardngr.com/2018/10/2019-yoruba-youths-set-agenda-for-atiku/
Lalasticlala

It is a dangerous thing when learned persons in society propose solutions that are illogical and betray ignorance.

This lawyer called Aremo Hassan is ignorant.

Atiku used priviledged access in government to alter the quality of education negatively in this country where he cannibalized public education and redirected resources to establishing his American University through illegal backdoor dealing.

Aremo is asking that when Atiku regains access in government he should exercise similar privilege to internationalize his selfish interest under legitimacy of the UN global program for Education. This way he can do unethical things under legal coverage of the UN charter.

Aremo should be jailed for this suggestion.

Further along in his inept submission, he wants Atiku as President to set up a Restructuring Act. He doesn't know that this is not a responsibility of the Executive to set up Acts. The twist is highlighted where he wants Atiku to change the Land Use laws. Really? Aremo on one hand is asking Atiku to decentralize power...but then gave him central authority over Land Use.

What a Yoruba id1ot!

Awon oponu amukun meko!

To All,
I believe we have had great conversations and made new push forward on the quest of origin. Nonetheless, the focus has been overtaken by other discussions, pertinent and important on account of family historical record keeping...but which invariably is not adding value to the broad discuss on Yoruba beginning. If by end of this week progression on the target topic remains stagnant I will unfollow as a participant and downgrade myself to guest status on the thread.

0balufonlll:
Iba o. Ogbon inu yin o ni doba. I was just surprised you called me out for responding to what was started by him. I guess it got personal for him too & had to descend into curses. It is all love here. Oodua a gbe wa.

There were two issues in my response. 1) is the threat, which i think went too far. I addressed that to you. You are correct that offensive post can get one hot under the collar and call for unconventional ways in response. 2) is the digression from Yoruba origin to individual pedigree discoveries. I addressed my plea to both of you to desist and refocus. Again, I am not targeting you or being biased. If I offended I apologize.

Thanks.

0balufonlll:
O ma ga o. Did you see where your boy started raining curses on himself & his family?

I did not even pursue any retaliation. I just wanted him to know he could get it but I’m not built like that.

E ma gba ejo eni kan da.

No, I will never take a side on this issue, it descended into personal and it would be unlike me, as an observer, to side with one. The best I can do is either stay out of it or plead for eero, which is what I did and addressed to both of you to calm and refocus. If it appeared I was one sided, I apologize, I didnt mean to and would never do that. I was shocked though...that it even came to surface. Please lock it back up.

My brother, let us return to the discussion proper.

Oodua a gbe wa o!

Olu317:
Semitic, ‘Ur' as a cognate with Yoruba Orún

Ur is a settlement in the Middle East, with which has different date of foundation of the city/country. But working with the cuneiform that had been interpreted, the city developed around 900BC ,with different people who lived in it. Among them were the founder who were the Sumerians, who were later joined by the, Chaldean. Thus, Ur of the Chaldees, refers to the Chaldeans, who settled in the area about 900 BC . And from here the Biblical narratives of the footprints of the family of the Abraham migrated westward to Palestine around 1900BC.

Yoruba's Oru/Orún:-
Oru/Orún,has always been a name traditionally attached to the lips of all of Yoruba ancestors land.This is because,oral account, claims,this land had been inhabited by Yoruba ancestors in the past.

Etymology of ‘Ur'
The root word is ORR and it is a descriptive of the heat of  the sun in this region in the middle East

Yoruba's Oorú
Oorú means heat. This heat is the descriptive situation of the rise in degrees of the sun which can be during the daytime or when there is seizure of the air at night hour.

There is a ruling dynasty in Oman today called "Yaruba". Their ancestral root is placed in the Kahtani patriarchy. They were a pre-Islamic people in origin. When Islam came to Arabia it was punishable for scribes to retain, record or exchange archived history, arts and cults. They were seen as unIslamic and forbidden. In similar manner that public dancing or music and merriment is viewed as anti-Sharia in North of Nigeria. Therefore the dance steps of the Hausa ancestors are lost, their music and folklore is wiped out, replaced by Islamic folklores. Anything in North that does not have Allah or Muhammad invoked in it is viewed as unbelief. All these shift happened in late 1700, early 1800 when Fulani entered Hausaland. Similarly the Arabs in time of Islam coming to places like Midian, Aramea, Saba, and so on... punished anyone found to glorify or praise the pre-Islamic ancestry and history. This contributed to why Arab writings and records are devoid of Yoruba mention. Even the land we call Arabia today is a rename from indigenous names in the pre-Islamic era.

Nonetheless, we find traces of Yoruba is still in Quran and in Islamic worship and an Arabian dynasty till today called Yaruba who traced roots to Midian....the same Mondiana that features prominently in Yoruba oral history of origin.

In addition to many word cognates between Yoruba and its beginning in AfroAsia, ther are cognates in arts, in dress mode and symbolism, in cults and social organization, as well in worship and cosmic principles.


See the following artworks.
The first is a mineral rock carving from Pre-Islamic Arabia.
Compare with the second and third one, Esie Soapstone carving in Yorubaland.
The fourth is a recreation to depict an Assyrian King with crown on head, staff in right hand and sword in left hand.

How is this King different from the depiction of Oduduwa?

Mehhn!

ObalufonIII, you have no shame at all. On a public forum, over debate and disagreement on point of history you want to use atare. O de beru Olorun. What is that you brought out ...? Make the two of you calm down abeg and return to the topic. This is getting too far if you had to bring that out. Serious!

The parties zoned their presidential tickets to North, not to Yorubaland. The issue between the candidacy of Buhari and Atiku should be spearheaded by Northerners. We can take side based on our interest in the VP position and its succession but we should not be at the forefront of the debate on who between Buhari and Atiku to rally behind, at least not at this point when we don't even know who Atiku will pick as VP.

Where are the Fulanis in Nairaland, does it matter to them who wins? Of all people that should be worried about the outcome of election Yoruba should not even be in the list. Look at our region, everywhere is APC. Compare with other regions. We have a political heirarchy in place that is more successful than the political success in the center. No one can win Presidency without seeking our favor, therefore we ought to sit back and relax, not agitated and in front of a war. The North and the East should be the ones at each other throat over whether Buhari succeed or Atiku succeed, not Yoruba at all.

Please heed and chill out. Allow Ibo to put anything and everything they want on the internet. If it bothers Fulani they should respond, if not they should allow it. Wetin concern us? Anyone between Buhari and Atiku that is interested in winning must show to us why we should support them. Let's stop behaving like Ibos, they don't have the numbers and therefore must make noise to be noticed. We have the numbers and no need to be noticed with noisemaking.

slivertongue:
WHAT IS TINUBU's POSITION ON THIS MATTER?

I wanna know too.

Alhaji Tunde Balogun appears not to be a man of procedural guidelines. Either that or he is willfully displacing standing rule, to be replaced with his own unilateral decisions for process. If Osinowo was not cleared to run, it means clearly he went against party rule to even join the contest. His victory or not is immaterial, he was pre-screened and disqualified, any votes for him is unqualified for credit, much more acknowledged as winner.

Johnnyessence:
when is looter oshiomole going to impeach omo babaoloye? i just dey smile. after oshiomole is flexing his muscle on social media, what next?

Bizibi:
some of you are still sleeping,and if you think buhari's clamp down on the PDP senators will bring his image back on track after the primaries then you are on a long walk......the man can't even put things in control in his party so that there won't be a protest vote next year, you are talking about the leadership of the house that should be of less concern to the presidency.

When it happens the first thing guys like you do is cry to international organizations and the NGOs to come and see how APC is treating Saraki with impunity. We know your brand, nothing new. You brag that nothing can happen, but when it does happen instead of responding with your DONship, you realize your weakness and then reach to UN to come to the rescue. This is your trademark.

Saraki had lasted this long as Senate President, and in the opposition party, because of Buhari's outlook on doing things right. Saraki's way of winning victories is through wuruwuru. Nigeria is so messed up that integrity has been displaced and wuruwuru has become the default platform for advancement. Until we get Nigeria back, under leadership of integrity, people like Saraki should be matched with those who are veterans of wuruwuru politics. People like Tinubu, Oshiomhole, El Rufai.....people who slay first and apologize later.

Baba Buhari should step back and allow Oshiomhole to come down heavily on Saraki. Buhari himself must be charged with anti-party conduct if he continues to be nice and allow opposition to lead the Legislature that APC won. It is time to clean PDP out of leadership in both chambers. If he does not act on it quick Atiku will repeat with him, and possibly succeed, in what he attempted and failed with OBJ. True word!

I would like to see the speech from other contestants. There is a thread opened to question the cause of long faces in the Rivers delegates' stand. I think I would be upset too if I was there as a delegate from Rivers and I hear this from Saraki. Where is the acknowledgement to your hosts? I am dissapointed that Saraki, of all people, an Omoluabi, did not open with recognition for Rivers people.

FarahAideed:
Everybody has become a wise analyst over Ambode , if Ambode had won this useless writer would still write to applaud him

Exactly! Quite a turnoff!

What kind of nonsense article is this? Abeg tear this rubbish! Very repulsive.

Maheeda should share the picture that gave that guy erection. Let's see if the guy is right or not.

Pr0cter:
No offence, but Sophia Momodu isn't fine

She is captivating! Women that turn heads in a gathering are simply captivating, not fine. True women want to turn on their magic and capture attention. True men want to devour her ecstacy, not her fineness. Men will leave a fine woman but no man leaves an ecstatic woman.

The hat is a quick gimmick to line up at the Kwankwasiyya money distribution point and get paid. Once they pocke the money they swarm away and remove hat to go line up at Atiku money distribution point and show their back to get money.

Money distribution point is nothing but a facilitation of corruption - vote buying, and is criminal. When we at the grassroot participate in it we endorse those at top to continue corruption and crime against treasury.

I believe Secondus would be wishing now that he had laid down a more stringent requisites for the aspirants from get-go. It is a waste and unacceptable that defectors should be at parity with those who stayed the course and struggled to keep the boat going in its challenging times. People like Atiku, Saraki, Tambuwal, Kwankwaso, and so on should never have been accepted to contend with Lamido, Mark, Makarfi and rest. Secondus failed to act in capacity of party Chairman and foresee this day.

On another issue, he also failed to consider the choice of venue properly and to lead with strength. The convention almost failed as a result.

Responding to the OP.

The diaphragm, the rib bones form what is called rib-cage. They act as flexible frame to aid the heart and the lungs in their functions pumping blood and air respectively through the body organs. There are valves that control flow of fluid and as the valves open and close, expansion and contraction takes place, and the rib-cage expand or collapse in response. Speech is controlled by the brain cells sending signals to valves to open or close in response to the words that needs to be vocalized. If the valves open too short or too long, the effect is repetition of letters or words. The action is involuntary. In other words, the speaker only has control of the vocal chord but zero control over how long the air valve open or closes. The air valves are stimulated by brain cell. This is why mute persons can activate their vocal chords voluntarily, but they produce no speech because the brain involuntarily refuses to activate the air pipe. So in a stammering person, the air vavles open and closes but their timing is out of synch with vocal chord, so they must be assisted by an aid. That assistance is provided by changing the shape of the diaphragm and manipulate the rate at which it contract and expand. In other words, you reduce the air volume in the chest. To do that tie a band around the chest (rib-cage) to squeeze air up the chest into the lower end of the voice box. Tie an oja (Yoruba) or a wide band belt, or even a wrapper around the chest. Tell the child to raise up their arms in the air....this will give you good room under their armpit and around the upper chest.

Monitor on a daily basis and see if the wrap or band is too tight and need adjustment, or if too low or too high and need adjustment. By end of first week you will know exactly what amount of pressure is needed. Within a month you should notice stability and improvement in the child's ability to control their vocalization better. Good luck.

Olu317:
Kindly SHARE and let's see what you have as a theory on the following :

Aramean(Iram,Aram)being Oranmiyan

Just the use of pre- and post-fix alone have led to many losses in word sense and meaning. Similar damage is done with the addition of vowels and consonants to root letters and words.

Look at
R-M-Y-N (Yrb from Oranmiyan)
R-M-N (Smt from Aramean)

I believe Aramaic is derived as a language spoken by people of origin in Aramea. So if your origin is Aramea I can call you Aramean. If you speak Aramea language I will say you speak Aramaic.

Now, in Yorubaland names are unique but they have a structure.

Akin+tunde
Akin+ola
Akin_ade
Akin+wunmi
Akin+wale

Ifa+dare
Ifa+yemi
Ifa+dayo

Ola+itan
Ola+wale
Ola+dele
Ola+lekan_
Ola+kunle

Ade+remi
Ade+yemi
Ade+wunmi


Bus+Ayo
Omot+Ayo
Funmil+Ayo
Omol+Ayo


Jokot+Ade
Iyun+Ade
Tiwal+Ade


Pre-fix, post-fix...pre-fix, post-fix...pre-fix, post-fix....Yoruba naming structure! So in the name Oranmiyan the structure is missing. Was he named in Yoruba language or a foreign language? Assuming this is an ancient naming style, do we have examples of similar styles to review?


There are certain things with Oranmiyan as principal authority that has not been outlined.
1- What did he know, and how did he know it?
2- What did he do with what he knew?
3- What legacy/ies or knowledge do we have from his deeds?

Oranmiyan is a standalone subject on his own.


I will be responding to rest later I have been very busy and unable to focus on this writing. I will post what I have here for now.

Later bro.

---------------------------------------------------------------

Oduduwa

Obatala

Obalufon

Sango

*Ogun*

Midian being Mondiana

Addud (Haddud) being Oduduwa

*Haddud* son of Ad , being Oduduwa son of Adimula

*Jerusalem* being Ijebu-Isale

*Adimula*


The Yoruba pronunciations were and are near perfect of the original Semitic people of Hebrew origin,even if they don't recognise it. This is the reason, I don't doubt the native information that claimed, Yoruba are the ancestors of the world e'en if there is no accurate information to back this up . But gradually, scientific revolution will support the Oral, and the unknown 8% DNA found in Yorubas .

Certainly ,the foreigners are trying to resuscitate the language from its original form. Although,you must take cognizance of the language intermixing through migration of the Hebrews and other people from their foundational home to new world . And through this, part of their language slowly decline to give way to new found ones in their new home.


Cheers.

Obalufon:
Human civilization started from ile ife ..land of expansion. I don't doubt backward migration into the region again .Yoruba culture is so unique...Because there is Oral history to back it up.

There is a reason Yorubas bear the name "Tokunbo". If what you say up there is true there would have been some identifier in past history to label the returnees.

There is also a reason Yorubas have towns like "Ado". Ile-Ife itself is an Ado. The origin of this civilization you talk about is in Nineveh. The Ile Ife we have now has always been in existence with human life and had an indigenous name that is now lost. Oduduwa tedo to the aboriginal land and instituted new orders. Part of the order is a re-christening of the name of the land to Ile-Ife.

Now, is Nineveh an original name? NO! Ile-Ife is the authentic and original name. Those who wrote history corrupted Ile-Ife to Nineveh.

In fact, I want to stretch imagination and submit that Adam is wrong spelling of Adimula, and Eve is wrong spelling of Ife/Efe.

Yoruba ties to Arabia, if any, would have been pre-Islamic and suffered the fate narrated here.

PREFACE
Abu-al-Mundhir Hisham ibn-Muhammad ibn-al-Sa'ib ibn-Bishr al-Kalbi, better known as ibn-al-Kalbi (d. A.H. 206/ A.D. 821-822)[1], was a member of a distinguished family of scholars residing in al-Kufah, then one of the two intellectual capitals of the Muslim world. Like his father, abu-al-Nadr Muhammad[2], he addressed himself almost exclusively to historical and philosophical research in an age where the hadith was the science par excellence. Not only Muslim interest in the life and usage of the Prophet, but also the desire of official Islam to stamp out all that belonged to the pagan days of Arabia, discouraged learned men from the pursuit of studies which related to the so-called Jahiliyah days. According to the traditionists who were then in full control of the intellectual life of the community, Muhammad once said, "Islam destroys all that preceded it[3]". The Prophet, undoubtedly, had in mind the pagan religious of his country; but his followers, in their zeal to establish the new faith, set out to eradicate everything which had its roots in the old order. Consequently, the historians (akhbariyun), whose work was to record the past and preserve its glories, were without honor in the Muslim community, particularly during the early period of Islam.

The great Arab historians flourished during a later period. These, too, placed their emphasis on the Muslim era, and treated the pre-Islamic days in a cursory manner. What is more, the word historian (akhbari) acquired a bad meaning and became an epithet of near-contempt. It was applied to ibn-al-Kalbi[4] as well as to any learned man who dared dwell upon Arab history before the 'Am al-Fil[5].' But no historian was attacked more virulently than ibn-al-Kalbi, probably because he addressed himself to the study of those things which Islam was determined to obliterate, namely the pagan religions and practices of Arabia. Thus al-Baghdadi[6] preserves a saying current among the students of the hadith concerning ibn-al-Kalbi's alleged lack of veracity. To them he was but an amateur genealogist and a story-teller whose word no one would either accept or quote. Al-Isfahani, too, despite his dependence upon ibn-al-Kalbi, attacks him in at least two places[7], and asserts that everything which he had quoted in his authority was false. Al-Sam'ani is still more outspoken. In his Ansab[8] he dismisses ibn-al-Kalbi with the following sentence, "He ... used to relate odd and strange things, and events none of which had any foundation." Another Muslim writer who disparages ibn-al-Kalbi is al-Dhahabi. Besides calling him a rafidi[9], he says,
ix


"He was not reliable ... but merely an historian (akhbari)[10]". Ahmad ibn-Hanbal deemed it necessary to say of him, "I do not think anyone would quote him as an authority[11]".

Dhu-al-Khalasah

Among those idols, too, was dhu-al-Khalasah. It was a carved niece of white quartz with something in the form of a crown upon its head. It stood in Tahalah, between Mecca and San'a, at a distance of seven nights' journey from Mecca. Its custody was in the hands of the banu-Umamah of the Bahilah ihn-A'sur. The Khath'am, the Bajilah, and the Azd of al-Sarah, as well as those Arab sub-tribes of the Hawazin who lived in their vicinity and those Arabs residing in Tabalah, were wont to venerate it and come to it with sacrifice.

A certain man said:

"O dhu-al-Khalasah, wert the one wronged,
Thy father the one murdered and buried,
Thou wouldst not have forbidden the killing of the
enemy."

This he said when his father was murdered, and he sought to avenge him. He, therefore, went to dhu-al-Khalasah and shuffled the divination arrows, but they resulted in a negative message forbidding him to seek revenge. Thereupon he said those verses. Some people, however, ascribe the incident to Imru'-al Qays ibn-Hujr al-Kindi.

Khidash ibn-Zuhayr al-'Amiri refers to dhu-al-Khalasah in verses which he addressed to 'Ath'ath ibn-Wahshi al-Khatli'ami concerning a covenant contracted between them hut violated by the latter. He said:

"I reminded him of the covenant that existed between us twain,
And of the age-long friendship which both of us shared;

That our witness was God and the White Quartz Idol of Tabalah,
And the oath of al-Nu'man when he embraced the faith of Christ."

When the Apostle of God captured Mecca and the Arabs embraced Islam, among the delegates who came to pay their homage was Jarir ibn-'Abdullah. He came to the Apostle and embraced Islam before him. Thereupon the Apostle addressed him saying, "O Jarir! Wilt thou not rid me of dhu-al-Khalasah?" Jarir replied, "Yea." So the Apostle dispatched him to destroy it. He set out until he got to the banu-Abmas of the Bajilah [tribe] and with them he proceeded to dhu-al-Khalasah. There he was met by the Khath'am and the Bahilah, who resisted him and attempted to defend dhu-al-Khalasah. He, therefore, fought them and killed a hundred men of the Bahilah, its custodians, and many of the Khath'am; while of the banu-Qubafah ibn-'Amir ibn-Khath'am he killed two hundred. having defeated them and forced them into flight, he demolished the building which stood over dhu-al-Khalasah and set it on fire. A certain woman of the banu-Khath'am thereupon said:

"The banu-Umamah, each wielding his spear,
Were slaughtered at al-Wahyab, their abode;
They came to defend their shrine, only to find
Lions with brandished swords clamoring for blood.
The women of the Khath'am were, then, humiliated
By the men of the Abmas, and abased."
At the present time dhu-al-Khalassah constitutes the threshold of the gate of the mosque at Tabalab.

We have been told that the Apostle of God once said, "This world shall not pass away until the buttocks of the women of Daws wiggle [again] around dhu-al-Khalasah and they worship it as they were wont to do [before Islam]."

Twerking has been around a long time.

macof:
There are many ways I could address this but let me ask you a question..

What are the disadvantages of not having a standard in a given discipline?

I believe all faculties and discplines of progressing human evolution should have baselines. In fact, I am a advocate of using rules and procedures to displace chaos and confusion. Rules and procedures should be viewed as "taming". It tames "wildness", which happens to be the wellspring of creativity. The internet has progressed so fast and produced so much talents and turnovers in a very short time because many of the products upon which new-generation and emerging technologies subsist are derived from "open sourcing"....the wilderness! If the internet evolution is pegged to formalities of rules, it will still develop but not at the speed at which we have it, neither will it be this deep and rich in outputs. It is impossible to interact as we do here without some innate or unwritten knowledge of rules of engagement. In our case, each of us know what to expect of the other without it being explicitly demanded. This is the Omoluabi ethos. Within that concept is a package for respect, for truth, for moderation (no extremity or fanaticism), for acknowledgement, for character, for diversity, for enlightenement, and so on and so forth.

Olu317:
Yes, Arab literate culture had no record of Yoruba migration because Yoruba was not our ancestors name. Their names changed but their kingly pattern, language and IFA practice stood them out among all.

One of the major challenges in the ancient world was near absolute destruction of any civilisations that the new stronger ones subdued. Now , there was an account that was detailed of 100,000s Hebrew movement traced to the region of Sudan but the whereabouts of these Hebrews became unknown till today.

And ILE IFE of Nigeria has no archeology record over 15,000 years, even in Yoruba calender, it's 10,000+ years. And the only closely knitted record of fossil human was discovered in Iwo Eleru,whose bone didn't match Yoruba ancestors through test carried out by scientists in Germany is not up to15,000 years

According to archeological finding , three places have the highest fossil human as today, and ILEIFE Nigeria isn't even known. They are as follows:

1. Morroco = 300,000 years approximately

2. Ethiopia = 200,000+

3. Israel = 200,000 years approximately

As you can see, Nigeria was the foundational home of Yoruba through archeology.


Funny, enough, obalufonIII paid no significant attention to world history, as you can see . Instead, he want to use obalufon as a shield to distract you through his raised questions .

I have a strong theory on the following relationships:
Ad being Ado
Aramean (Iram, Aram) being Oranmiyan
Midian being Mondiana
Addud (Haddud) being Oduduwa
Haddud son of Ad, being Oduduwa son of Adimula
Jerusalem being Ijebu-Isale


If the Yoruba spelling and pronounciations are the authentic, then the foreigners got it wrong. They could not reproduce our tongue and thus mangled it into its Arabiced versions.

Aramean, Oduduwa, Obatala, Obalufon, Sango, Ogun.....and so on, are not proper names but titular of the position...just like the Greeks giving such names as Jupiter, Uranus, Venus, Thor, and so on.

0balufonlll:
Uncle Negro, Mr. Obalufon here is the one bound to act/speak like Obalufon & asides your banters about Eba/Amala, I see your point but:

1. The Torah/Bible’s historicity is inconclusive. In fact, the sources of Torah/Bible with its foundation in the Nicea council makes it an irrelevant thing in the face of history because no section agrees on what is what. In fact, apocryphal still debate the legitimacy of early books & Jesus. The Quran as far as its history from 500AD holds some credibility than the Bible/Torah. Hence, much of what is known of Egypt came from Greek & Roman records & not the Bible.

2. Ifa/Ife’s myth holds relevance religion/spiriruality & that is where it stops. The myth & history clash greatly. If you doubt, examples abound & we can create a whole thread to treat this. The older folks only tried to separate what was history from what was myth. I am in no place to fault you if you choose to approach history differently. I may just get tempted to wade in if a topic I’m in the know of gets brought up.

3. It is OK if you think of Ife as the beginning. I do not think of Ife as the beginning of anything, not even monarchy. Ife may have been more popular but other Yoruba towns must have co-existed with Ife & added exchanged ideas/culture with Ife. E.G: Sango, Esu, Oya & so on that werent indegenous to Ife.

4. You spoke from the angle I thought of & asked Olu. That is, Yorubaland/Ife being the center Arab/Hebrew culture sprang from as opposed to Herew/Arab being the source for us Yoruba. The angle seems very interesting & compelling but to me, there are no sources to enhance such pursuit. What makes it worse is that there are oral traditions & festival re-enactments even that place that Oduduwa origins, life & times within Ife.

Addendum: I am not & can never be in that place to tell people how they choose to employ their intellect. My kini with this page is that the methods be subjected to questioning such that Yoruba does not sink into the Ibo pursuit of Hebrew/Jewish validation. Whatever style is employed be it linguitic or historic or whatever, can the methods stand scrutiny & not fall on its face? Yoruba is & has been the source of pride for Africans & the reason for return of AAs - it is a force to reckon with in Africa. Should we subject it to ridicule a la the ibo, a culture with a rich history, having an almost embarrassing struggle for Jewish affiliation?

Sir,
We have said several times on different topics that tie into the quest and they are all consistent with same theme, that this should be an open inquiry liberated from the formalities of academic and empirical proofing. Free-flow intellect and knowledge is what we need on this exploration, not conforming to some standards of academic rigour.

Since food has been introduced into discussion, let me use an illustration of my experience at a fastfood restaurant where I went for breakfast many months ago. I ordered sausage, egg and cheese on croissant from the menu and asked what the sausage meat was made from. She said it's pork sausage. I told I don't eat pork but would appreciate my order does not come with the sausage. She had to call the manager to ask how to enter that order and ring up my meal ticket. The manager instructed on what to do and turned around to tell me they just have to make the meal as it is on menu and when it is served to me I can throw the sausage away. Even when i insisted that I would pay the full price with the sausage but would prefer pork meat is not served with my breakfast, she did not know how not to serve the order without a pork sausage.
Both of them had been trained to follow process and regimen of their trade.....they do not know how to deviate from it. Their ingenuity had been silenced by the rigours of production.

This is an illustration of what I see in you guys. When asked to bring ingenuity into discussion you default to academic standards and tools of trade.

macof:
1. Mr. Olu, stop lying.. If you don't know something there is no shame in admitting you don't know.
Let me (attempt) to translate the gibberish you wrote
". t' ìbí t'íré ní Àdà ìlè Àyè"
To Birth, to *gibberish * at *gibberish* *gibberish* of Space

And you are still trying to defend this nonsense Yoruba you wrote?

There is a clear difference between "Ibì" (Evil) and "Ibí"(Birth). Ayé(life) and Àyè(Space)

2. Accent marks there again are wrong. Guy just stop using accents marks if you don't know how to use it, even I don't use it when I'm not sure of which goes with certain words

3. Well, just as it is suspected that there are more than one Ogun in history, maybe there are more than one historical Esu (Esu is not looked at much by historians)
So I don't know what Esu you are familiar with but it is essential to keep in mind that Esu has spiritual and historical sides

Macof,
You said Ibi is Evil. No, Ibi is not Evil. Ibi is Harzard. I'm going to share somethings with you that Olu has already communicated severally but does not appear to be sinking in.

Do you know what "IPARADA" is? Iparada is the transition from one manifest to the other, the contradiction of self. The phenomenon of Iparada is deeper than words can express in native Yoruba, much more in a foreign language full of ambigous sense and meanings like English language. Yet, the English word for it is PARADOX. It is more than a physical transformation, it is native to the spirit, it is a phenomenon.

Look at these two words my brother...
1 - Ibi - Harzard
2 - Ibi - Birth

E ku "ewu" Omo o! Ewu is the post-state of the harzardous (Ibi) transition from foetus to baby (Ibi). The two processes are anchored in the word IBI. The root word I-B-I manifested here through a paradox or Iparada.


We can do the same for the word you threw out ...Evil. Evil and Live are paradox. One is negative, the other is positive, yet both are exact reverse of the other in spelling. You cannot have one without the other, they are interwoven and co-exist.

There are many examples like this in Yoruba, no need to stretch the imagination here.

The small boy in police uniform is underage but the man in nysc uniform is overage. What happened, did they swap uniform?

0balufonlll:
Katsumoto, Terracotta & a few others who dabbled into language & history of Yoruba people were not illiterates. They knew the framework for pursuing these things and did it within such bounds. A number of them brought up many scholars, reviewed their works and veered into several other disciplines to establish or negate their thoughts. In a nutshell, these people you spoke about knew what methodology was, they knew what theories were & their uses, they knew what cognates were, they knew etymology requires several procedures. They stuck with the rules as stated by those in the academia and didn’t make the foundation of their study a biblical prophecy. You insult those people by comparing them with what is being done by your ilks on this thread.



Uncle, nobody is interested in anybody’s credentials. Nobody is stupid either to be hoodwinked by unrelated but undulating tripe about Hebrew - sensible people are asking questions to know how the writer arrived at whatever is being pushed, they may want to test the theory before agreeing. Gone are the days when a certain class sold falsehood to the masses like Olumide Lucas did. Nigerians are now mostly awake and will query whatever anyone puts out. Don’t feel threatened, just put out your facts and answers when people ask questions. Abi do you not think Yoruba has suffered alot of distortions within & without already?



So the essence of this is what? While Frobenius & the likes interacted, got their data and wrote what they wrote. It was still the same educated Yoruba scholars who dissected the works of these people and pushed forward what was credible and what wasn’t. In the end, everyhing still rests of the training you have received to handle the data in your possession or the fantasy in our heads.



You should be honest enough to treat the Suzan/Leo as scholars & the locals/oralists as sources of data and leave them at that. The oralsts gave informations, it was not like these oralists tried to approach what they knew from an angle of particular disciplines. And if they did, they would be told to step to the side. And are you aware Yoruba scholars, at least in History, broke away from European methods decades ago & established African Historiography at Ibadan School of History, no? I can guess other fields in Humanities in Nigerian universities have similar experience with localization as opposed to pursuing African research with European methods.



1. You must hate being asked questions to sum up honest curiosity as ‘antagonism’. This dislike for questions usualky stems from inability to give answers.

2. The inability of you & yours to answer questions but rather keep up with wild claims & shift goal posts is what has derailed the focus of the thread. Answer questions, cite sources & everyone moves on. At least the early debaters or discussants of Yoruba history & language which you mentioned did so with a lot of references at hand. They weren’t posting comical screenshots, they were dropping books they have read by the chapers and pages.

No one is scared of your threats about challenges. Everyone is touchable. As long as what you put up looks like ‘magic’, people will ask questions and query what your background is for making such bold claims.

The moment you begin to metion authors, especially those with rubbished credentials and then subjectively bend their works to suit your goal, is the moment you invite those who know some of these books and what they said to set things straight.

Oh and by the way, this is a public forum, you may need to engage Olu privately if you want to sustain a private discourse because everyone is welcome to post on every thread sustained by the owner of the board.

From bottom up, question and answer is normal, debating points is normal, disputing a theory to get clarification is normal in the exercise to uncover what remains hidden. What is not normal is pushing a thought or even methodology as the only acceptable means by which hidden history can be uncovered, and when such assertion is opposed you guys resort to labels and antagonism. This is unacceptable.

Should Oyo Aremo commission a historian to come and tell him about the history of his land, or is the arokin sufficient to narrate the lores and deeds of his ancestors and their land to him? You guys almost at the point of ruling that no Yoruba can inquire about his ancestry without first consulting an historian. Ridiculous!

Katsumoto and Terra did not initiate these discussions on origin. They joined the discussion. My point is, where are the historians and linguists all along, how come you never take initiatives to open inquisition but you act as spoilers to the quest made by those you call non-professionals.

Even as we speak we cannot point to one thread any of you opened to act as the lighthouse to navigate us safely through the course to Yoruba roots. Thats a disservice to Yoruba.

The placement of Yoruba as an indigeneous is as unrooted as its placement as a migrant. Neither is IleIfe as the ancestral home more acceptable than Nineveh. You will have to give us air-tight scientific proof (excluding oral history) that shows Ile Ife is the first landing for mankind anywhere on the globe. While you are at it produce the genealogy of Obatala upward to the first being of creation. As linguists you all ought to know that language is dynamic and through attrition and territorial conflicts shifts in human population result in language displacements. There is no place of ancient origin today that speaks the original language it birthed with. IleIfe cannot be an exception. So what was the founding language in Ife on the day it was created? What was the society like, how did they worship?

A lot of questions...most of the answers to them accessible through oral examination.