₦airaland Forum

pauladonis:
Sir, I would implore you to go through the origin of tithing in the book of Genesis, Abraham, the father of Israel started the paying of tithes, He divided his spoils of war into 10 parts and gave tithe to Melchizedek, remember?
Jesus accused the pharisees when they claimed to be children of Abraham, Jesus said, "If ye were sons of Abraham, ye would do his works" Paul further said it in the new testament that "THE LAW WAS NOT MADE FOR THE RIGHTEOUS MAN" if the children of Israel were righteous, they would pay tithes without it being stipulated by law or commandments. The priesthood of Jesus is after the order of Melchizedek who recieved tithes of Abraham (the bearer of the promises of Israel) as "A priest of Righteousness"... Read more in Hebrews chapter 7 and pay your tithes as an exercise of Jesus' righteousness which is now in you as a born again Christian. Happy Sunday.

olumide4christ:
Thanks Bro for pointing out Hebrews Chapter 7 to him. I have also mentioned it earlier when someone was asking for verses of scripture that support tithing.

Unfortunately, a major proportion of the people speaking against tithing have not read the bible completely or even the entire new testament which they claim does not talk about tithing.
Now someone who has not read extensively about a subject, what right does he have to make assertions about that subject? You can only speak about what you know or have heard somebody talk about that. Unfortunately that's the status of many church goers in Nigeria today...the bible they know is only what the pastor preaches on the altar...they never have time to study & understand the bible on their own & as such, people like Daddy freeze shows up & says something unbiblical that is pleasing to them & like magic, they accept it without doing their own research.
Some say pastors force people to pay tithe...is it in all churches that happens? Of course not! The church where I worship for 22 years now does not force anybody to pay tithe or give...people do so because they know its biblical & we are answerable to God not the pastor. But many churchgoers (don't want to call them Christians) believe we give to the pastor not to God. If they aren't comfortable in a church where they feel they are forced to give, they should change church to a sincere church (BTW there are many of them around but they are not fanciful like the others) but give & tithe willing in the new church because its biblical & we shall all give account to God.

As far as I am concerned, there is nothing wrong with paying tithes; it's an act of love and honour for God and God definitely rewards faithful givers who make such sacrifices. The only area where there is a problem however is how some preachers teach that paying a tenth of ones earning is mandatory commandment of God given to Christians (i.e. new covenant believers including Gentiles); I'm yet to come across any scriptural backing for that message. Some preachers have also gone to the extent of saying a non-tither can't make heaven irrespective of what else the person does right. Should we actually believe this? How exactly is that scriptural?

Of course Abraham paid a tithe of his spoils to King Melchizedek and Jesus' priesthood is in the order of King Melchizedek. But then, there's nowhere the bible ever mentions or infers that the tithe Abraham gave was a commandment from God, Abraham gave it out of his own freewill and out of love and gratitude to God. Also, neither was it documented anywhere that Abraham did that more than once. It's on record that only the Mosaic tithing Law was mandatory for the Jews; and we all agree the Mosaic laws were never passed down to Gentile believers after the great commission.

So the real question is, for those preachers (a lot but not all) who teach about tithing on a regular basis being a mandatory command of God to all believers today, where exactly did that come from?

Glink2018:
Check the meaning of 'force'in your dictionary before you start using your stunted fingers and wasped brain be typing nonsense...
At your age, If you can adjudicate fews words or comments like this, how do you want to master your future...
Things fall apart...

You haven't said anything here, just empty words as expected from one who is frustrated. If you have anything meaningful to say, say it in a civilised manner.

Opelwonder:
lol. yahoo yahoo is not forced but the victims are deceived, so please delete that comment. some good churches do not deceive their members because the testimonies are real. e.g living faith, salvation ministries. dunamis. etc

OF course not all churches preach half-truths to psychologically coerce, deceive or better still, psychologically blackmail members to give. There are still many good preachers and churches out there who don't do that. But unfortunately, we're in the last days, so the culprit preachers seem to be more in number these days, just as Christ warned.

payloader:
No my brother. Quoting the bible to back up a doctrine still based on the bible is not psychological blackmail. Keep following Daddy Freeze and attacking the church and her pastors, but don't come online to defend it because no need.

Have you heard of the Berean Christians? Go and read the book of Acts 17; the reason Apostle Paul singled out the people of Berea as special people was because whenever he preached to them, they went back home and searched the scriptures to confirm if what Paul said was true or not.

Unfortunately a lot of Christians today (including myself) am sorry to say are just LAZY. We go to church, listen to whatever a preacher says and swallow it without making any attempt to independently confirm its correctness. In fact even when we accidentally discover that it isn't true, we're so awe struck by the god-like aura of the preacher that we just decide to still go ahead to take his word as truth irrespective of what we found in scripture.

Daddy Freeze might have made some needless personal attacks to preachers and might have blabbed over some issues, but be he a believer or not, he has also raised some valid scripture-backed points especially in pointing out some half-truths and contradictions in the popular tithing doctrines of several churches today. If I Obailala re-echoes a scripturally backed argument, I'm sorry, I do not see how that amounts to attacking the church; if I think a pastor has said something not scripturally correct on the pulpit and I point out the error, I do not see how that amounts to attacking a pastor. We need to wake up, that something has been preached for so long does not necessarily make it true.

olumide4christ:
Sorry to say...only preachers who do not know the bible will stoop low to begin to argue with people like Daddy Freeze...that's the reason for the silence. They know where he is coming from.

You dont have to argue with Daddy Freeze, we all know he's so little and unimportant for the 'big preachers' to belittle themselves to respond to. But you cannot wish away the fact that he has raised some valid questions which are crying for answers. So if Freeze is too unworthy of a response, there are currently a lot of others now asking the same questions; or have all preachers now become too big for everyone to anser scripture based questions?

Silence cannot be supreme on this one, for a scripturally sound preacher, silence only means you do not have any scripture backed response to a pressing accusation.

Rebuke:
The sixteen year old boy Op is far more intelligent than you. Sorry, but that's the truth.

If you have the capacity, then maybe you can try to break it down so we can have an intellectual debate. It's not enough to just drop subtle insults and then run away.

dancewith:
This is a wrong analogy. The fraudsters decieve their victims often the victims assume they are sending money to someone they aren't. In some cases they're fooled into paying for non existent goods. That a fraud

What the boy is saying is the tithers pay out of their faith, beliefs and generosity. Many supported a cause they believed in just like many supports their candidates in an election because they believe in them. They pay cos they are toeing a biblical path. Their faith. It's like asking a Moslem why he must pray 5 times a day or spend huge resources to go to Mecca where he might die

Let he or she practise in peace what they believed in. There is no emotional blackmail here. This is biblical and if they believe it to be so, it is entirely their act.

The bolded part of your statement above is not completely true, infact it's rarely every the case. Whilst a lot of people will not admit to it, the truth is that 90% of tithers do so out of FEAR of a divine punishment, and not necessarily out of love. I'm sure you've heard these sort of messages:

If you don't pay your tithe, you are robbing God.
If you don't pay your tithe, things would be tight for you
If you don't pay your tithe, you risk been consumed by the devourer
If you don't pay your tithe, you cannot make heaven and will be condemned to hell for eternity.

A biblically proven truth is that the commandment of tithing was never passed down to gentile believers; it was strictly a Jewish/Mosaic law. Current day Nigerian Christians fall under the category of Gentile believers. In the early church, when the church council wanted to force down the Mosaic laws to Gentile believers, the apostles stood against it and declared that the burden of the Mosaic laws shouldn't be extended to Gentile believers. So how come we now have bishops in 2018 doing the exact opposite of what the Apostle preached against in Acts 15:5-10?

When you put FEAR in the heart of a person in order for the person to part with their cash, especially when the message you serve to arouse this fear isn't completely true, then I'm sorry to say, but that is blackmail, spiritual blackmail; and it isn't much different from what yahoo boys do.

The original message Daddy Freeze conveyed regarding the non-mandatory nature of tithing. And because Freeze actually spoke a biblical truth, not a single preacher globally has been able to counter that his original message. Instead we've actually had a couple of preacher agree with him that tithing isn't necessarily a mandatory command of God to new covenant believers. A lot of other preachers however refused to comment directly on the issue because they know the truth; rather they just waited for Freeze to keep talking and talking until he inevitably started scoring own goals.

cc: Reference, DAYOODS, 1StopRudeness

seunlly:
Seriously.
Probably you didn't wroted this yourself too

Son of a thousand father.

I knew this was going to happen.

Boboye4slim:
I wanna ask a question. My intentions are not to insult you in anyway, just curious.

I’ve learnt first hand that most of these pastors you talk about don't coerce or force the people to pay. They always out of generosity propel themselves to give to these pastors. Now, If you ask the churches or pastors not to receive supports or tithes from the congregation, how do you expect the church to grow and expand the teaching of Gods word?? Or are you saying the churches need not to be run at all?? Even if this big men of God suddenly run down, are the churches going to run down too??

I think what you should be agitating for is that pastors need to be accountable and properly use this money to help the needy. You fighting a full blown war against the church, I said this because of the way you attacked the experience program which isn’t a platform to extort tithe or funds from the people. At this rate, you come against anything that pertains to churches. There are tons of intelligent people in the USA, Canada, China, developed countries like that, still, their churches pay tithes and support the ministry.

The Catholic Church receives tithes and offerings, there’s no church in the world that doesn’t receive tithe and support from her congregation, if they don’t, how else will the gospel progress. If your fight is against the accountability of Nigerian pastors, that’d be so understandable and logical, but this spilled over outbursts against anything church in Nigeria is in my opinion needless.

I have never in my 16 years of existence heard where congregations are coerced to pay tithe or support the church. In winners chapel, there’s even a platform where money are lend to borrowers with no interest, There’s a platform where after every service, food , clothes etc are shared among people that need them. In the cell fellowship centers in Winners Chapel, you can talk to your cell ministers when you are in need and those needs would be met ranging from paying school fees to paying rents and so on, you can’t tell me that’s a lie cuz I am living testimony to that. The buses to and fro Canaanland used to be free until running them became hard, now it’s only free for new converts.

So this things aren’t run on leaves but money. And this congregation are always happy to give to the church. After all when people spend huge amount in clubs on liquor, on gamble, or on the needy, on relatives, for friends, on habits, on hubbies.....when people spend on these factors no one complains. So why is that you see giving to church as a waste?

You blame the church for our country being the world poverty capital of the world. Do you want winners chapel or redeemed or MFM to start running Nigeria with the contributions of its congregations? Contributions that you still bash them about? Imagine what Bishop Oyedepo has done with covenant University of 10 years, now imagine if he has access to a vast national resources that UI or OAU enjoys. Why are you blaming the church for the nations poverty?? Was Jesus in charge of the nation’s economy in his time? Was he in charge of military? In charge of public hospitals? If you want the church to take over the affairs of Nigeria, why don’t you implore the government to handover to the church?? There’s the government and there’s the church. Both have their functions. The church can only voice out and advise the government on what to do, it’s left for the government to do something about it.

I know of course that freeze would spin and spin and grammar everyone against his opinion down but I think at the end of the day he knows the truth.

A lot of people are ignorant of the meaning of the word 'force'.

Tell a person who reveres your words that if he doesnt give you a certain amount of your money, he would suffer misfortunes, die and be condemned to hell. When you're charged to court in a civilized society for psychological blackmail, go ahead and tell the judge you didnt force the person. I would love to see how that case turns out.

Meanwhile I wonder why 419 or Yahoo Yahoo is still regarded as a crime in Nigeria. After all, according to Nigeria's understanding of law, the victims weren't forced.

Omooba77:
We are in the era of social media that tells us most time what we want to hear and not the Truth.

For some time now, Daddy Freeze has been most time against the church leaders in Nigeria, especially payment of tithes.

I was shocked to the marrow fews days back I read daddy Freeze said he was paying tithes up till a month ago.

Yet all the while he was shouting against it and many of us have bought into the erroneus teaching.

It reminded me of the story in1 Kings 13 of an old prophet that deceived a young prophet to die; but compelled his children to bury him in the grave of the young prophet because everything he said will come to pass.

A man of God preached one day and that message is helping me till now. He said some people will commit sin outside and when they get to the closet of their room; they will confess and yet some people will die in this ignorance and go to hell, because they will continue to fan the ember; unknown to them the originator has made 360 degree u turn.

Dont follow the multitude to do evil.

I hope we will all learn from Daddy Freeze's story and work out our salvation with fear and trembling.
Hve a glorious end to 2018!

I think a lot of people misunderstood that statement. Freeze's anti-tithe movement became popular when he had an interview on lindaikejiTV sometime in Sept 2017. I think what he meant from that statement was that even a month to that time in 2017, he was still tithing; I dont think he meant last month as in Nov 2018.

obaataaokpaewu:
Picture of the hospital?
27 general hospitals, how many of them are equipped? What is the essence of building hospitals that are empty inside?

Governance is about continuity.; if Rochas builds, the next governor should equip them. Rochas will not uproot the structures and dump them in a pit when his tenure ends... At the end, the people of Imo state are the sole beneficiaries.

But come to think of it, only a silly person would attack Buhari over the clone stories instead of attacking the actual buffoons who originated and keep spreading the story.

ogene007:
Buhari just confirmed that he is against free and fair elections, and the fact that his government has not done enough to deserve being re-elected. This is the time for the entire country to rally round the NA in vetoing the president on this bill.

Do you know what the bill is about and the conflict which is preventing its signing? How did you possibly come up with your above conclusion with scanty info?

Nobody has been able to clarify what the bill is about and the conflict which is delaying its signing. Nigerians in the usual directionless mob manner on this thread are just shouting buhari buhari.

Lazy journalists everywhere. Every report on this seems to just end at saying the president declines to sign the bill; why cant anyone repirt the reason?

But seriously, why is construction so expensive in Nigeria?... What exactly is in the 2nd Niger bridge thqt should cost N220billion?... a less than 2km long bridge?

genkins:
Pagan Christian.smh

And what exactly arr you talking about?

@Op,

There's nothing wrong with giving to the church of God. Oh yes, God is a spirit and doesnt need your physical money; but what God needs is your faith! God's hand can be moved in your life when he sees you do something difficult (a sacrifice) to gain his attention.

When God asked Abram to sacrifice Issac as a burnt offering, of course God isnt a cannibal so he wasnt going to come down and eat Isaac, he didnt need Isaac for anything. Likewise when God asks for animal sacrifices in the old testament, he doesnt come down to eat the lamb the people sacrifice, God doesnt eat or need your lamb meat. Also, when we fast to support our prayers, of course God doesnt come down and eat the food which we didnt eat, neither does He take pleasure in seeing you go hungry. But in all these things, God is simply moved when we deprive ourselves of something valuable to us in order to gain his attention. Depriving ourselves of something valuable or subjecting ourselves to distress is called 'sacrifice' if we do it to gain God's attention.

This isnt even restricted to God. Even juju spirits that ask for sacrifices in shrines for a native doctor to perform a charm, the juju spirits dont come down to eat the white spotless male chicken you bring. All the juju wants is for you to make an effort at something difficult, to deprive yourself of something valuable. At the end, it's the chief priest and his family that eats the chicken meat, but the juju god has seen your effort in providing such a difficult requirement (sacrifice) and that is the price you have to pay for the juju to grant your wishes.

So in essence, just the same way humans go on hunger strike when protesting and trying to gain attention of govt or whoever, that's the same way Christians fast or deprive themselves of money to gain God's attention. Both cases are called 'sacrifice'; but yeah, there is no doubt that the new generation religious movements have taken the money drive to a ridiculous level which even God can never be pleased with. It even gets worse when most churches now preach that giving to God must entail giving money to a church.

While it is agreed that Nigeria has some of the smartest people on earth, it's also true that Nigeria has somr of the dullest people on earth.

In 2015, instead of focusing on how to campaign or srll the qualities of their candidate to Nigerians, PDP and its supporters spent their whole yimr searching for Buhari's certificate; and that's how they lost the election.

4 years later, when you think they should have learnt a thing or two, they've started in the same agenda; this time claiming that the president is dead.

Whether dead or alivr or cloned or replaced, I'm still wondering how this their obsession on this issue will stop APC from fielding the same candidate, or how it will prevent or dissuade apc supporters from voting apc in the coming elections. Some clowns still keep posting pictures of Buhari Ear circled in RED, talk of a confused generation!

People dull shaa...

Mbaka's statements are embarrassing to say the least.

Hmmm... this is strange!

new2012:
Which leakage got blocked? Subsidy? That's so massive that they've threaten to go on strike.

Ghost workers? All proposed scholarships in CECC were shared by Ministers.

CBN and NNPC job recruitment are now classified.

Which leakage please?
Job loss initial cause was d president.. The economy appreciated when he took over, lots of high expectations but he crushed all when it took 6months to get minister to pilot the country.

Oil price contributed greatly, I agree.. But remember the price was under 25 when Obj took over.

Let's not defend our politicians who earn in tens of millions.. They are the cause of the country's downfall.. PDP,APC, there is no difference when they have same cause.

Ghost workers still exist, but progress has been made in reducing their numbers.

Subsidy is still being paid, but the fact that only the nnpc now imports fuel (no longer every Tom, Dick amd Harry), that means the leakages in subsidy payment must be less (not eliminated though).

Employment scams, if you actually think employment scams where employment is driven by who-you-know in govt started in 2015, then you're as naive as they come. The fact is that with the level of whistleblowing and info circulated via the social media these days, the level of employment scams has now reduced massively compared to the past.

Comparing the oil price in 1999 to the oil price sudden drop in 2014/2015 is very illogical. A boy who earned N3000 in 1999 may not survive on N50,000 in 2015, especially when you consider that he now has a higher taste, now has a wife and children, has a car to fuel and has his a bigger apartment where he pays higher rent. Moreover, in 1999, oil price didnt drop suddenly. A man struggles to feed his family with N100k salary, and then you suddenly reduce that salary to 30k; the excruciating effect of this sudden income drop on his family cannot be overemphasised; and its illogical to make a comparison with 16-20 years ago when he earned only 25k but was comfortable. Back then, his demands were much much lower. For example, Nigeria's forex demand since 1999 to date has increased by over 1000%.

No doubt though, the incompetence, diabolic greed and sheer wickedness of our political leaders is the reason Nigeria is still a third world shithole.

Buterflyle0:
The United Young Christians Forum [UYCF] under the leadership of Pastor Andrew John Enenche has taken a position ahead of the 2019 general.



The group after a crucial meeting on Saturday endorsed President Muhammadu Buhari and his Vice President Professor Yemi Osinbajo for second term.



The Christian group described the duo of Buhari and Osinbajo as friends of the church who deserved every support to push the nation forward.

A statement signed by Enenche at the end of the meeting hinted that the reason for adopting Buhari was further informed by the premise that many other candidates that are wooing Nigerians have not by their acts shown sufficient of God.


They, therefore, warned Nigerians against accepting those that would take them back to square one.

The statement below:

“Permit us to start with a disclaimer. President Muhammadu Buhari had categorically stated that clergymen should eschew politics or lose credibility and this is a reality that we are well aware of particularly as it relate to those that turned their pulpit into soap boxes to support candidates that are known to be corrupt. So irrespective of President Buhari’s assertion Proverbs 12:17 “When you tell the truth, justice is done, but lies lead to injustice” is our guide in this matter. We want justice to be done so we will say it as it is.



“We have watched development in our body polity for the past four years and we can categorically declare that the administration has favoured Christendom and advanced the propagation of the gospel, which, gentlemen, is our ultimate goal.

In the period preceding the inauguration of President Buhari, Christianity was being contaminated with the evil of corruption. Christians in Nigeria were beginning to evolve into what the Gospels did not intend.

“The truth is that we entered into competition with the world and even challenged those in the world to a context in material acquisition; it was not unusual in those days for the testimony of brethren to be measured by the volume of wealth or material things they were able to acquire in record time without giving thoughts to how much sin has been committed to attain such worldly goods.

“Corruption even influenced the faith to the point where sermons were tailored to suit the expediency of supporting corrupt people in clear violation of our mandates. We became unwilling witnesses to men delivering their own verdicts as prophecies.

“May we also point out that one thing that is becoming extinct under the leadership of President Muhammadu Buhari is laziness. We are instructed in 2 Thessalonians 3:10 “For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.”

“/”People had become addicted to slush money, which perhaps explains the cry of hardship and anguish as the anti-corruption war takes hold. We are pleased that more Nigerians today have found the joy of working for their earnings, which enables them to sleep in peace.


“Beyond these, we have seen that the government of President Buhari did not neglect the needy. As opposed to the past when the poor were food for the rich, this government has through various social welfare intervention programmes comply with God’s injunction not to neglect the needy and less privileged. Children who would otherwise have gone hungry are fed under the school feeding programme. Women, some of them widows, have benefitted under the Trade Moni. The conditional cash transfer scheme is helping beneficiaries reduce the impact of poverty on their life.

“We have also seen the projects ongoing across the country, which gives hope that Nigeria will be built into a great nation, like the rebuilding of Jerusalem as recorded in the Book of Nehemiah. As stated in Nehemiah 2:17 we are inclined to tell Nigerians “You see the bad situation we are in, that Jerusalem (Nigeria) is desolate and its gates burned by fire (previous bad leaders). Come, let us rebuild the wall of Jerusalem so that we will no longer be a reproach.”

“We have confidence that it is President Buhari that can carry out this rebuilding. We therefore endorse President Buhari/Vice President Yemi Osinbajo whose performance has confirmed as friends of the Church and Youths of Nigeria for a second term in office.”

https://www.tribuneonlineng.com/176440/?fbclid=IwAR3cprWSkbenWQPpE3TBMJNebK8LqOzPfoIkNDNjQLWLI0_ZBLkPwBdzl9g

Very dubious report; even had to use Dr Enenche's picture.

$160 million?... If this is true, then it's the best news ever for Nigeria's import dependent economy; it will only be a matter of yime before the dollar rate inevitably drops. But then, something doesnt just seem to add up here. How much does Nigeria spend importing petroleum products alone? Except I really dont understand what this figure means, but Nigeria at the moment even pays more than $160 million per month for just fuel subsidy alone.

Atiku may be arrested if he steps foot on US soil without diplomatic immunity. It would be stupid of him to even attempt that now cos that would just mean handing over the 2019 election to APC without a sweat. Atiku can't be that silly.

Confused fellow!... A church has over 5000 pastors, you claim to leave the church because you dont like the political leaning of 1 of the pastors. Attention seekers!

Aieboocaar:
Having stayed in onitsha for quite a while i laugh anytime the APC Online propaganda agent come here to scream "BUHARI HAS COMPLETED ONITSHA/ENUGU EXPRESSWAY WITH FROM SUKUK ABI SKUKI BOND"

I Can authoritatively tell you that the Onitsha to Amawbia end of that road is a total mess!![/b]

I don't think I've ever seen any single person since 2015 to date who claimed that that road has been COMPLETED. Can you please point out any examples of these people so we can flog them together?

The last I checked, it was prior to 2015 elections that some clowns were circulating lies about how that road and several others had been completed by GEJ.

Nigerians and fake news!

Deji, human rights activist!

But I thought the case of the Catholic priests were already confirmed not to be related to the fulani massacres?... What did Amaechi say which is new or wrong?

$9 billion compensation to 1 single unknown company?... And here we have several comments on this thread instantly taking sides against their country?... Perhaps Buhari should have just paid the almost N3 trillion, maybe that would have gotten some people in this thread happy.