₦airaland Forum

« #26 on: Today at 09:13:28 PM »
1), He was there obviously
He even sang about love
what has Jermaine got to do with what I wrote

« #27 on: Today at 09:15:12 PM »
2). Stop crying
what's with all the incoherence?

3). « #28 on: Today at 09:17:43 PM »
-Hopefully the king of pop was in right standing with the King of Kings and Lord of Lords before death snatched him away.

!). It shows his knowledge of Islam! There is no americanized or nigerianized or arabinized islam. There is a single Book; The Quran. A single prophetic sayings and deeds; the authentic sunnahs and ahadiths. When a believer participates in the funeral of a disbeliever, he lacks knowledge about his deen (WAY)!

2). I am not crying, baby. I don't cry for disbelievers, especially when such a person had a whole half a century to get it right! Or can you see me all the way from "down south (lol; village people), to know that am crying? I know I could be incoherent, sometimes when talking to you! The self adulation does not work with me. Lol.

3). Where was the throne of the King of Kings? Sorry i the metaphor that it has, like the king of pop! No throne, but just a name. I wonder what they want those Royal Eze of igboland to do: like Eze Ezearo of Arochukwu who ruled as the longest Nigerian Monarch for 72 years?

Thanks $Osisi, you allowed me to use this information today, since I got it from her grand daughter Ezinne! LOL. I am having the last laugh. Alhamdulillah.

did jermaine participated, too? Did he say amen when they mentioned Jesus name?

so he goes to jahannam. thats his callingand he had answered it by his own free will. i hope you dont answer the same calling; jahannam is greedy. it is fire you know. as much as i like you, i cant help you. i have warned you and you cant deny others have not tried.


i do not pray from my mother's father and neither do i pray for my cousin who i named my second son, after. my ribute to both was just that; empty tributes. this reality is why i prayed hard for my mother's convertion and my Lord Allah Al Qahar accepted it from me. Alhamdulillah.

@Folami86: Could just turning one's back to a person who was trying to interrupt your conversation be considered a sin? If so what happens to a one who curse a people, or cursed a tree or received the whispering of devil as in three temptations, or the one who did not show mercy to an agonizing theif on a cross, etc?

Be reasonable. Tell us whats noble about these things and tell us whats not noble about mere turning of back? If turning of back deserves seeking forgiveness, then know that the whispering of shaitan must deserve an equal or greater among of forgiveness to be sort!

@Sleek29: Does it make sense, that you say if there is any good in Islam? Look around Nigeria: the wealthiest among the Yorubas are mostly muslims! Late Abiola showed so much kindness, that it almost became a disease about him. And its all based on his Islam, because the Egba people (and indeed the Ijebus; I am one) are not that naturally generous!

If islam has no visible goodness; I wonder why none of you individually have not copied Biblical Jesus as to marriage and never get married, and we will see where your name ends? Or is it unnatural to be single at 33?

And no nation has ever been docile and never took up arms to fight those who provoked them or wished them harm: this is what each and every powerful chrsitian nation have done! There is no exception!

I guess you guys, individuallyy and and nationally see Muhammad (AS) as the one to follow, when it is really a matter of practically than the theoretical and never practical ways that you devised for your Biblical icon! Whats the use of his advice to his followers to buy swords by selling their few cloths, then?

Be real, man!

I dont want you t copy Jesus when it comes to haing a happily married life, okay David? Ijebu Ode needs a lot of new crops of Children!

Who is Jesus between Mark 12 verse 29 and whatever verse you wish to use to oppose this very famous verse?

I tink you do know, and if you dont, I am now telling you that Ahadith is classified from daif (weak and unreliable) all to the sahih/ ihsan (strong), based on its isnad and riwaya (chain(s) of narration(s) and the possibility that it may be in the character of the prophet (AS), etc!

If a man says for example that Salah is not compulsory, we will have to look at what the Quran says about and what did Muhammad (AS) did or said about salah before his death! Thats how you know that a ahadith is sound and strong than weak and remote in its possibility! Well I do not expect you to understand until you can open your reasoning mind up!

I gave you a simple experiment to perform you have waffled on it, whil it cost you nothing, except a leisurely stroll to the bank of a large body of water and just enjoy the sunsetting on its surface!

And you people should copy Jesus your god, if you are sincere and never get married! Marriage and you don't belong together! I don't know why you are doing it, when your god didnt, and you still claim that you follow him when you are doing exactly and completely opposite of what he did, said and commanded?

I wanna see you guys happy by following yourgod's example, unless you want to overshadow some one, or be overshadowed by someone, yet not sexual contact. No? You can now see that you are never sincere to Jesus, at all, except by lip service. No wonder he will say that he never knew ythee to you because of your hypocracy!

@Purelogic: I read the below quote from your entry yetserdayon rhighing in a locked thread.

And then, read this:

"THIGHING" - SEXUAL PERVERSION STARTED MY MUHAMMED AND SUPPORTED BY ISLAMIC CLERICS


"Thighing" is an Islamic practice still followed today even in Muslim communities in the U.S. and Britain

"Thighing" is the act of masturbating between the legs of a female infant or actually sodomizing her. Islamic clerics had this to say when a question was forwarded to them at the permanent committee for scientific research and fatwahs.

Do you live in the US, man?And are you in touch with the muslim community in America? Tell me where you live and what masjid you ever been to or the Muslim community you have seen seen this practiced? And can you please bring a weak ahadith, rather an irrefutably strong ahadith that Muhammad (AS) practiced anything this remote? Otherwise, you and Noetic and $Osisi, etc are the liars and the biggest jokes!

I am sick of your lies and you need to bury yur heads in shame! Don't you people have any scrupples and refrain from blatant lies? Where did Jesus teach you to boldfacely lie? And you are dong it with straight face, too. Am shocked at $Osisis the most because I expect better from her! I know she hates islam, but is there no limit to tactics?

simply Rubbish.
Are u disputing the words of allah? are u saying allah and his servants are lying? allah says she was six and so be it. I feel for you! Your mind is so underdevelopped that I wonder how you cope with life!? And you live in England? Wow! Is Ahadith the word of Allah, or the Quran?! Which is the word of Allah? Why is ahadith classified as weak, and all the way to strong and sound if it is Allah's word? And these are the leaders of Nigeria in the next generation? Nigeria has a tough road ahead. Seriously!


He was definitely thighing her during those three years. or what else was he doing, considering that he had a total of 11 wives? Give me een a wak ahadith, since you know it to be definite? Or should I believe your veracity? Your word is good enough for me, since you have been so obstinated to refuse too even write my name properly, and even produce a sound ahadith, with the issue of Aisha, and then with your thighing nt even a weak ahadith?

do u consider a 9 year old matured? would u marry off ur 9 year old daughter? abeg, stop all this tirade. If I live in the time and society that 9 year old is considered to be matured, yes! I do not have daughters. My nieces, I close my eyes and let their parents suffer the heartache of marrying their daughters off! Finally, I think you need to know that todays america, 35 years old woman is a grandmother! I am old enough to be her father, and am still struggling to be a daddy to a third child! Think man, and stop having your nose in the sky! How old is the youngest Yoruba woman who is married to any of your larger family man in your village?


This is ridiculous. please read that haddith again and the see the literal denotations. Aisha was a small and immature girl just waking up to the realities of life. playing with baby dolls with her friends. I asked if you know anything about women, you couldnt answer? Arent you a man? I didnt ask you if you had illicit sex, because I do not want to extrat any confession from you! Its summer time, and many grown women, wives do go to amusement parks and try their hands in winning "dolls!" You better be ready if when your ajebota iyawo asked you for a doll, instead of a car, since her father had bought her a Ferrari. She only needs simple things from you; dolls and more dolls and maybe chocolates, ad simply exquisite Jewelries, and long stemmed Rose flowers!


If u were aisha's father could u have challenged mohammed? mohammed was a legendary warrior who killed at the slightest provocation in the name of allah. Aisha's father had no choice than to show his resentment. his resentment was obvious in his response to mo that he felt that they were brothers. pity your mind! Where are you from in Yorubaland? There are no muslims in your village and you learnt about islam when you got to England? I blame the british who have no better standard of awarding their entry via! America has just turned to them with the lotery thing! Shame on these white people who are turnng the minds of black aricans upside down like this! Abu Bakr, while you think he could not challenge the warrior of the legend type, Muhammad (AS) had been his friends, before there was revelation! Muhammadlistened and accepted the opinions of this friend, even when he was later proven wrong later, more than once! Yet he nominated him to lead Salah in his dying days! Shio to you for not reading before you made bogus lies. Bigger shio to you for saying this things with staright face. United Negro College unds has a motto: A mind is a terrible thing to waste. In my mind, there is no wasted mind greater in wastage that the ind that have no boundary to its lies!


A paedophile is: an adult who is sexually attracted to children
mohammed was sexually attracted to a 6 year old child called aisha. he eventually had sex with her when she was 9 years old. mohammed is as such a paedophile. I hope that my wife, being a lot younger than me, almost like my daughter will consider me a pedophile, then according to your definition! Do pedophile marry their "sex little children first" before they commit the definitely insane act? When a man sleeps with his young wife, he is a pedophile? What about the woman who is married to a younger man? When Barbra Streisand was with Andre Agassi, was that pedophilia, because she could easily be his mother? And people can get pregnant, prior to 13 years old. No?

Christians identify Messiah with Jesus and define him as God incarnated as a man, and believe he died for the sins of humanity as a blood sacrifice. This means that one has to accept the idea that one person's death can atone for another person's sins. However, this is opposed to what the Bible says in Deuteronomy 24:26, "Every man shall be put to death for his own sin," which is also expressed in Exodus 32:30-35, and Ezekiel 18. The Christian idea of the messiah also assumes that God wants, and will accept, a human sacrifice. After all, it was either Jesus-the-god who died on the cross, or Jesus-the-human.


Jews believe that God cannot die, and so all that Christians are left with in the death of Jesus on the cross, is a human sacrifice. However, in Deuteronomy 12:30-31, God calls human sacrifice an abomination, and something He hates: "for every abomination to the Eternal, which he hateth, have they done unto their gods; for even their sons and their daughters they have burnt in the fire to their gods." All human beings are sons or daughters, and any sacrifice to God of any human being would be something that God would hate. The Christian idea of the messiah consists of ideas that are UnBiblical.
Fuente(s):
http://whatjewsbelieve.org/


Bloquear usuario

Jesus lived and died a practising Jew. So wherever it is you think WE'RE going, he's gonna be there right along with us!

And we don't need a 'second chance' because unlike you, we don't believe in original sin, or eternal hellfire and damnation.

Now, why don't you worry about your own spiritual welfare, 'cause frankly, we don't need your help!

Like my business partner said to her son; "Ugene, you are a lawyer, but you aint the boss of me". You do not determine my position. I determine that with reason.

#32 on: Today at 05:52:41 PM »  

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@ Olabs

It is Olabowale unless you are saying to me that this is the nickname that you gave me?


I have produced the haddith that establishes that

(Not in Arabic, since you do not understand a word of it; looking like a 6 year old and being actually a 6 year old are two different thing. Late Tinuka Oshinnuga could have still be able to be mistaken for a 20 something year old, if she were alivetoday because of her small stature. Yet she woul be have been turning 50 years old, this year. Emmanuel Lewis the famous small statured actor of the 1980's still look more like a little boy, even up till today. I ask you; do you know how to read arabic, because the last time I know, so many people gave Fa as And, instead of its true meaning So! But my many submission above is better unless you can discredit it)!

a. mohammed courted a 6 year old aisha

If its was not accepted in their society where at that time the life expectance was propbably around 40 at best, I can not see Abu Bakr standing for it! Afterall, in many issues people like Umar had expressed different opinions. I wonder why he did not? By the way you are a Yoruba man; what age is maturity and women are ready for marriage? You live in England, what age is marriage, and what age did Diana marry the old man childlike character Prince Charles?


b. that he had sex with her at the age of 9

And he waited 3 years, and you think he was a pedophile? When have you seen a man who waited for his wife to mature , for a whole 3 years? Is that a pedophile? What is the significant of that waiting period, while her parent and the whole society said nothing about it? By the way it was in Makka, and the people who were his enemies, the disbelievers did not use that single condition to accuse him, holding it over his head? If it was bad and unacceptable in their society, would they not have said, "see what a man who wants us to abandone our better way for this filthy and shameless sexual thing he has just introduced? And where is his morals when he sleeps with a young underage child?"



c. aisha was still a small girl with dolls and play mates

Do you know anything about women?The best of women have dolls in their room; bedroom and private for her only place. A grown woman becomes a girl around the man she loves! You have a lot to learn, man. You should ask strong woman (is my term of endearmennt) $Osisi what she becomes when she gets home. She is no more a Dr., but a nurse! Talk about playing it down. My bride old enough to be your mother becomes a girl around me! Find out how man and woman behave, its unlike boy and girl!!



d. aisha father was uncomfortable with mohammed's inaction.

And throughout his life, Abu Bakr (RA) never raised objection and never complained to somebody about this objection. Yet he was called al sudik (the truth believer! Ask thiefofheart; when I psted the fact that I do not want to be a father of daughter(s), she had a feat. Every father who have Ghair (good shame; I hope you will experience it) do not feel comfortable, at the first time that somebody says to him that his daughter is who he wants. Zainab's father had to bite his lips when he knew his daughter is gone from his hand and she is putting in mine! Should Abu Bakr a muslim and an arab be different? Soon the father is happy when the daughter is gone! Learn about women and their father


I have also defined a paedophile and established that mohammed is indeed a paedophile.

I did not see your definition. Mine was up and you have a good sight, you couldn't have missed it, I think! Please present your definition, again and give me your qualification as to why you think you are accurate about your conclusion. will your pedophilia, adjective and pedophile, noun definitiion be okay say in Igo, or banbara or Pigmise, or napal or Yoruba lands? How about the native Americans, or the Mayans of southern America or the Amezonian people of remote Brasil (Brazil)?


As a child, in Nigeria, some people had to be admitted to primary school, until they can put their arm across their head and reach their ear! If they cant then they wait till the following year. Yet, some taller person in their age group or even a year or two younger will be admitted because their arms are all the way as it is supposed to be. I remember a young woman telling me how hard her father worked to be educated, being the first in their village! He started primary school about the age of 13 or even older. Now who will think this is possible, except that it happened?

Bad processing of argument I see from the Chrsitians.

@Tudor: I do have a life away from Nairaland.

Men should be 100% sure that they can support and carry the burdens to support and protect their wifes and
family from any harm or / and danger. Also both men and women have to be sure that they are willing and open
to spend as much time as possible with their partner in marriage, in romance and happiness, since marriage in
islam has to be based on love, peace and rest (see soerah 30:21). If one fails or harms the other partner in
marriage all the time, one commits a major sin. Marriage in islam is something important and half one’s faith,
which means husband and wife must work together and offer themselves for each other to make their marriage
succesfull. Also man's treatment of his wife is a measure of the perfection of his faith as in the hadith where the
prophet, peace be upon him, said:

Riyad as-Salihin, Chapter 34, Nr. 278
The Prophet said: “The most perfect of the believers in their belief are those with the best manners, and the best
of you are those who are best with their wives.”

Sources:

1:
http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=4&tid=10463

So I asked where are your proofs? What are te signs of maturity? Is big body the sign or what are the signs?

Also the option that a girl can (not must) consummate marriage at the onset of her puberty, does not mean that
girls have to marry at this age. It’s only an option. Secondly even if she has reached the onset of puberty or
general age of puberty in islam, then she can only marry if she is able to. If she is not able / capable / or ready
to marry or consummate marriage, then she cannot and should not marry. This rule can be found in the next
hadith:

Sahih Bukhari , Volume 7, Book 62, Number 3

The prophet said: “ O young people ! Whoever among you is able to marry, should marry, and whoever is not
able to marry, is recommended to fast, as fasting diminishes his sexual power.



Thirdly she can only consummate her marriage at the onset of puberty, if she and her parents are sure that
there would be no harm in it for her to marry and consummate her marriage, since the prophet said:

Related by Al-Daraqutni, Ibn Majah and Ahmad.
The Prophet said: “There shall be no infliction of harm on oneself or others"


So if a girl on the onset of puberty by herself is not mentally or emotional ready for marriage, then she herself
and her parents should conclude and agree that it’s not the right time yet for her to marry and / or consummate
marriage. If they would do the opposite, then: k


If the parents give their daughter permission to consummate her marriage, or letting her marry while they know
that their daughter is mentally and emotionally not ready for it, then they would harm their daughter. This would
be a violoation of the hadith which states ‘not to harm others’.


If the girl herself at the onset of puberty agrees and or insists to consummate her marriage or to marry (and
forces her parents to give her permission, because for example she’s in love), while she herself is actualy not
ready for marriage, mentally and emotionally, then in this case she would harm herself. This would also be a
violation of the hadith ‘not to harm oneself’. k
In today’s society many girls would not be ready ( except some ) to marry on the onset of puberty or general
considered age of puberty in islam ( fifteen years old ). Most of them would certainly not have the means for it,
due to lack of education or qualifications for a job which are required nowadays to survive and live a good life.
We should also remember that back then in early islamic times and biblical times, females like Aicha were raised
in a society where womanhood was reached at a much earlier age than it is in many societies today. Therefor my
advise to young men and women is to marry at an age when they have finished their schools and are both are
sure that they have the means for marriage. This would mean that they are 100% sure that one is emotional and
mentally ready for marriage and consummation of marriage.

The Prophet, peace be upon him, never said that girls could consummate marriage prior to puberty. The christian
missionary based his attack on islam on the heading of a chapter in the hadith collection of bukhari, therefor the
christian missionary could not provide any hadith or quranic ayah to support his claim. On the contrary the
hadith and quran refute his false claims. Moreover i showed and pointed out that ‘prior to buloogh’ by some
writers is used as a synonym for ‘prior to menstruation’ , which was clearly the case with the heading of the
chapter in sahih bukhari, since the quranic ayah about menstruation was mentioned. Moreover Maulana
Muhammad Ali’s commentary on soerah 4:6 is enough proof to silent the lie of the christian missionary.

Maulana Muhammad Ali in his commentary of the qu’ran comments:
These words, moreover, show that marriage should be performed at the age when a person has attained majority,
for the age of marriage is spoken of as being the age of attaining majority. 2

The christian missionary moreover fails to realize that it was a normal custom for young people to marry at the
onset of their puberty or some years later, since the prophet, peace be upon him, recommended those who had
the means for it to marry. The christian missionary obvious only fantasizes that older men married with younger
girls, he obvious never realizes that young boys just married young girls back then, and only consummated
marriage with them when they had reached puberty. In those times and biblical times it was the custom of the
society, which nowadays many people fail to realize. Also puberty and adulthood in those societies back then
were reached at an earlier age then today. Also it’s important to know that in islam girls have free will to choose
a husband they want / like. They have the right to refuse a proposel from someone they don’t want to marry or
just don’t like. So a marriage can only happen in islam if both parties agree with each other, and are happy with
it. This can be found in the next hadith:


Sahih Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 67
The Prophet said: “A matron should not be given in marriage except after consulting her; and a virgin should not
be given in marriage except after her permission

Ibn Kathir in his tafsir comments:

The age of puberty, according to Mujahid. The age of puberty according to the majority of scholars comes when
the child has a wet dream. In his Sunan, Abu Dawud recorded that `Ali said, "I memorized these words from the
Messenger of Allah , “There is no orphan after the age of puberty nor vowing to be silent throughout the day to
the night” .

In another Hadith, `A'ishah and other Companions said that the Prophet said, “The pen does not record the
deeds of three persons: the child until the age of puberty, the sleeping person “until waking up, and the senile
until sane”

Or, the age of fifteen is considered the age of adolescence. In the Two Sahihs, it is recorded that Ibn Umar said,
I was presented in front of the Prophet on the eve of the battle of Uhud, while I was fourteen years of age, and he
did not allow me to take part in “that battle. But I was presented in front of him on the eve of the battle of Al-
Khandaq (The Trench) when I was fifteen years old, and he allowed “me (to join that battle).

Umar bin `Abdul-`Aziz commented when this Hadith reached him, “ This is the difference between a child and
an adult.” There is a difference of opinion over whether pubic hair is considered a sign of adulthood, and the
correct opinion is that it is. The Sunnah supports this view, according to a Hadith collected by Imam Ahmad
from `Atiyah Al-Qurazi who said, We were presented to the Prophet on the day of Qurizah, whoever had pubic
hair was killed, whoever did not was left free to go, I was one of those who did not, so I was left free.'' The Four
Sunan compilers also recorded similar to it. At-Tirmidhi said, "Hasan Sahih.'' Allah's statement, 1
We now clearly see and have enough proof to state that consummation of marriage in islam can only occur when
a girl has reached puberty. Therefor a girl who has not yet had her first menstrual period, can only consummate
marriage prior to menstruation when she has reached majority / puberty trough other ways. These others ways
are: having a wet dream, having already public hair, breasts or reaching the age of 15 years. These facts can be
found in Ibn Kathirs tafsir and the hadith.

( Karen Armstrong, Muhammad: A Biography of the Prophet, Harper San Francisco, 1992, page 157 )

Now if a marriage could be consummated at any age with a girl or prior to puberty, then certainly the prophet,
peace be upon him, would have consummated his marriage with Aicha when she was six. However he never did
this for a reason, he waited untill she reached puberty. From this we can already see, that girls priot to puberty
are not allowed to consummate marriage. But what about the ayah which says ‘and the waiting period for those
who have no courses yet is three months’ ? Like we have seen in the heading of the chapter of sahih bukhari is
that girls prior to menstruation can marry, which is by some writers described as ‘prior to buloogh’ or ‘underage’
since menstruation is general considered as having reached buloogh. However this does not mean that girls can
consummate marriage before pubery, which some people think. This confusion occurs because some writers
used the terms ‘prior to buloogh’ or ‘underage’ as a reference or synonym for ‘prior to menstruation’ since
menstruation is the well known aspect which shows that a girl has reached puberty / majority. However in islam
a girl has also reached puberty / majority when she had her first wet dream, or has already public hair, breasts or
reached the age of 15 years. These facts can be found in Ibn Kathirs famous tafsir on soerah 4

Qu’ran An-nisa 6:
Waibtaloo alyatama hatta itha balaghoo alnnikaha fa-in anastum minhum rushdan faidfaAAoo ilayhim
amwalahum wala ta/kulooha israfan wabidaran an yakbaroo waman kana ghaniyyan falyastaAAfif waman kana
faqeeran falya/kul bialmaAAroofi fa-itha dafaAAtum ilayhim amwalahum faashhidoo AAalayhim wakafa
biAllahi haseeban

Prove orphans till they reach the marriageable age; then, if ye find them of sound judgment, deliver over unto
them their fortune; and devour it not by squandering and in haste lest they should grow up Whoso (of the
guardians) is rich, let him abstain generously (from taking of the property of orphans); and whoso is poor let
him take thereof in reason (for his guardianship). And when ye deliver up their fortune unto orphans, have (the
transaction) witnessed in their presence. Allah sufficeth as a Reckoner.

الصغار لقول تعالى { واللائي لم يحضن } فجعل عدتا ثلاثة أشر قبل البلوغ

something like:
“Chapter on ( the permissibility of ) a man marrying off his underage daughter (which would be) in
accordance with the saying of Allah "And for –“those who do not menstruate" so the `iddah was set to
three months prior to buloogh."

In the context of this verse prior to ‘buloogh’ refers only to ‘prior to menstruation’, since the verse speaks about
those who have no courses yet. When a girl has her first menstrual period, she is general considered as having
reached ‘buloogh’ / puberty. Therefor the writer here in his chapter uses the words ‘underage’ and ‘prior to
buloogh’ as a reference to ‘prior to menstruation’. This can be clearly seen without doubt at the rest of the text
and it’s context in connection to the quranic ayah. A lot of writers used the term ‘buloogh’ only as a reference to
menstruation, since menstruation is the well known sign which shows that a girl has reached ‘buloogh’. Therefor
most writers use the the term ‘prior to buloogh’ and ‘underage’ as a synonym for ‘prior to menstruation’. This
can be confusing sometimes, since one could think that girls could consummate marriage before puberty, which
is actually not allowed in islam. Like we mentioned before there are also other things which are a sign of having
reached ‘majority’ in islam. These things are: wet dreams, breasts, public hair and the age of 15 years. Therefor a
girl can only consummate marriage prior to menstruation (which is general considered as buloogh for girls)
when she has already public hair, breasts or reached the age of 15 years or had a wet dream, which are also signs
that a girl has reached puberty in islam. So keep in mind that the heading of this chapter only refers to girls who
had not yet menstruated which can be clearly seen at the rest of the text and it’s connection to the quranic ayah.
Proof that girls can only consummate marriage on the onset of puberty can be found in the sunnah of our
prophet. The Prophet, peace be upon him, didn’t consummate his marriage with Aicha when she was six. He
consummated his marriage with her three years later. The reason for this was that they were waiting for her to
come of age, or in other words reached puberty.

Another author, Karen Armstrong, has this to add:
Tabari says that she was so young that she stayed in her parents home and the marriage was consummated there
later when she had reached puberty.

The most perfect of believers are those most perfect of character; and the best of you are the best of you to
your spouses.” Tirmidhi, Ibn Hibban

"None but a noble man treats women in an honourable manner. And none but an ignoble treats women
disgracefully" At-Tirmithy

He wrote:

The collector of the so-called sound narrations, Imam al-Bukahri narrated:

Narrated Sahl bin Sad: While we were sitting in the company of the Prophet a woman came to him and presented
herself for marriage to him. The Prophet looked at her, lowering his eyes and raising them, but did not give a
reply. One of his companions said, " Marry her to me O Allah’s Apostle " The Prophet asked him, "Have you got
anything ? " He said, " I have got nothing." The Prophet said, " Not even an iron ring ? " He said, " Not even an
iron ring, but I will tear my garment into two halves and give her one half and keep the other half. " The Prophet;
said, " No. Do you know some of the Quran (by heart) ? " He said, " Yes." The Prophet said, " Go, I have agreed
to marry her to you with what you know of the Qur'an (as her Mahr)." 'And for those who have no courses (i.e.
they are still immature). (65.4) And the 'Iddat for the girl BEFORE PUBERTYis three months (in the above
Verse). (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 63; emphasis ours)

Response:

The christian missionary relies his opinion on an english translation of the heading of a chapter. The Sahl bin
Sa'd ahadith ends at: "Go, I have agreed to marry her to you with what you know of the Qur'an". What is
mentioned next , the fat quoted text by sham shamoun, is not a hadeeth but part of the title of the next chapter in
sahih al-bukhari:

@JJYOU: Haha. I asked you or any of your scholars to define pedophile, you scooter libby away! And there was no place that I said my cousin Ms. Jagun is a man! I did not say that they were lovers! These were too females. Just like two males, one small framed and the other a bigger bodied person. they will obviously look different, in my world!

Finally, if a 16 year looking woman is actually 30 year old, what stops a man who wants her from marrying her? Is the look that determines the reason you marry her, or the fact that she is matured according to your societal value?

It is this type of misunderstanding that makes argument sometime difficult to have with those who are not prepared to show proofs! You are a nigerian, how many agneses, and victorias, and veronicas and virginia and kemis and rachaels and uzoomas and lyndas, that married at younger ages? Say age 15? And many people in the same nigeria will be shocked if they see what 13 years old girls do in america! babies and more babies!

@KunleOshob: Please where do the Christians draw their evil inspirations, if not from the Bible? Why would there be a need for sword, if it was not initially purposely meant to figt> And if I can drum up verses of the Bible that allows killing and actually show wars, killing and lost of lives and cutting down of trees and killing livestocks (lacking in agroeconomics), what will you do?

If I can also get to you from the new testament that the Jews are doomed when Jesus comes back what will you do for me? Did you forget the Eleshe Opa Jesus song in Yoruba land, during easter? And the story that happened on Q train Subway line in New York City the other day is a true indication of what your heart may harbor, not the peaceful in the face statement that does notreach up to your throat!

Lets wager man. Right there in your Bible, we can see it. Or you dont know the Bible that well?

Can any Christian defines a pedophile for us? Is it by age or by characteristics? That characteristic if it is, I will like to know. And does it stop at just one person, if actually that is her age, or his age?

A young woman in Ibadan, one of the Osinnuga's died many years ago. About two years ago, my cousin was telling me about her. Surprisingly, she said that she and this late girl were just a year apart. It was a surprise to me, because the girl was so small in those days that you would have thought that she was a mere 11 year old by 1975, and almost out of high school then! My cousin is now 50 years old, last September!

The young woman's tiny stature fooled even those who knew her at birth! She did not look her age at all, and for those reasons, she was overlooked by possible suitors, in England, in the 80s and died ever as a spinster!

Was Aisha not a sickly and frail woman, considering the circumstances, she might have looked like a six year old, which is what she meant rather than saying that she was sactually a six year old woman! This is my singular reason for asking people to tell us when she was born, relative to when the first revelation came down!

Can the Christian please do the research, before I present my case against your lies? We the muslims are happy at whatever age she is. She had benefitted us greately (RA)!

Copy Jesus and remain single please! And none of you is a true believer until you copy Jesus in his marital abstainance!


Is Wikipedia more reliable that ahadith? No, except if the ahadith is weak and there is no possibility for it to be an ahadith! I have many like that that does not fit the characteristics of the prophet!

Please provide us a character description of a pedophile. I already have one good and complete description, which none of its aspects does not fit Muhammad. Please get us your version that can fit him. Go to scotland yard, and see the MI5/6 for a good and comprehensive description. They aught to know better than you. No?

@Quadrey: I was responding to your "pedophilia/pedophile" thread, but they were locked at both Christian and muslim Forums. Take time to read and don't listen to the "Kafiruun" anywhere on earth. Alah had ordained what he had ordained. May Allah strengten your heart on Islam Amin.

Was a prophet capable of child abuse? No. Was Abu Bakr not a nobility of makka? Yes. Would he be party to his own daughter's abuse, after he has accepted islam? No. Is it in the Character of the noble Prophet to abuse anyone, including slave and servants even before Islam? No. Ask zaid his slave who he adopted because he prefered the Messenger over his own good father.

Is it then possible to then abuse a free born daughter of the wealthiest man in Makka at that a time? No! Now then, is sexual maturity an age thing? No. For those who say yes, please furnish me the age in Igbo land, versus the bemba land, versus the hausa land, versus the Yoruba land, Versus the tuareg land, Versus the Moors of Morocco, versus the Soyinkeh of Mali, versus the Julah of Mali, Vesus the Bambara of Guinea and versus the mandigo of gambia and versus the Phular of Mauretania, versus the Ashante of Ghana? Yet I have not even scratched the surface of the many african tribal people? What about the Massai, the many tribes of South Africa and napal?

Only an ignorant soul will make such a claim that you hear and read the Christians and Jews and their cohorts making about my beloved Messenger! I know how much I love women and through Muhammad (AS), my sexuality is limitted to who belong to be! There is no way that HIV/AIDS, InshaAllah can reach me! Thank Allah (SWA) for blessing me with His Idayah and making me follow Muhammad (AS) His beloved Messenger and Prophet!


@Pureloic: Where is your logic? Please copy Jesus who was a bachelor and see what becomes of your branch in the family tree, say 100 years from now! And if you can't copy Jesus in this very single matter, know that you are not true to Jesus!

@Sleek29:
1). Could you tell me if Aisha was born into her father's islam or before accepting islam in the very first few days after the first revelation? Then you will know how old she really was. By the way how do you classify the authenticity of ahadith, if you know what is strong and what is not possible to be ahadith? And is sexual maturity has an age bench mark, all over the world being exactly the same?

2). Show me the concubines stuff while I explain the 11 wives to you: He was a prophet, His condition was different. Read it in Azhab. While I canmary and divorce anytime, he was not allowed to do the same! He was commanded to pray nightly, while I make that choice to do it. He was able to fast round the clock, while it is forbiddenn for me to fast after sunset.

3). I wonder what you will do, if somebody is raping the women you love and they/she is calling you for help and you had a gun and when you wanted to help her, the man pulled a gun to pull the trigger to end your life so that he can go about raping her, and definitely will finish her off after he is finished? What will you do, Mr. tenderheart? I bet if you see your friend mounting your illicit lover, and she is cooperating with him, your heart will desire to end his life, along with hers! The many killers of lovers in America are Christians, not muslims, you know! Go and read before you try to hide your true violent nature by mere lip serve alone!


4). Tell me his sin, and I will tell you how it was blotted out, if he ever committed it!? And how do you abstain from sin uniquely to your new found religion, Christianity?

5). Did any Prophet get a Ph. D.? If an illiterate can have such a great memory like his and made his book simple enough to memorize in the original language he had it written by his companions, then he was a great Professor!

Muhammad Ali, the Boxer was a professor for a day or so in some major University in America, teaching them poetry!

6). And in America we see how people spend countless hours on just a single game, or even move! It could be a waste of time you know, which is the reason for its been "forbidden!"

7). Madonna the singer drinks it. Some women have swallowed male semen. Some men have put their mouth on female virgina. Tell me which is better; camel urine to cure stomach malady or the useless practice of mouth to private organs? I will not be surprised at your answer, since shame may be very remote in some cases with disbelieving!

. Three times, at least were recorded in the Bible that jesus got the whispering of the devil. Let me ask you, what is the difference here?

9). The bathroom duties have kept me cleaner than you and makes me not to spend time unnecessarily in this often badly perfumed place! I have not seen a person that says he/she can stand his own excrement and its odor for hours. Even fisheries and its fishy smell smells better. At least you know you can eat the fish, when prepared into a delicious dish. No? Or can anybody do that with their own waste?


10). Are you not at least concerned with heavy wind? Where do you live man? Disaster happens in America in many places, yearly in the "Hurricane Alley" and many places! People loose their lives, and properties. Dont be unreasonable, man. You better come back to islam, before they dress you up for Hellfire party upon death!

@KunleOshob:

Haba Alhaji, common sense dictates that i would be almost humanly impossible to document every thing Jesus said or did whilst he was here with us physically on this planet even the bible states so in John 21:25 which says: 25 Jesus also did many other things.

That same common sense tells me that what you have is an incomplete work. Or you select what you think is good for reproof, preaching, repremind, etc, as you christians wish to portray your Bible! It is cheessy you know. That is the height of dishonesty!

If they were all written down, I suppose the whole world could not contain the books that would be written. so the fact thatit was not documented does not mean Jesus did not ell his disciples how he sarted his ministry.

I guess this is why you guys always have "personal" interpretations, since the work is incomplete anyways! Jesus only spent 3 years preaching! He was here for 33 years, according to you! He was contained by the world itself, and you are claiming that his saying can not be contained by the same world which contained him without any problem as the speaker himself? You know that no one in Nigeria and West of it, as an example knew about Jesus when he was here on earth, right? Let me ask you; which is greater? His words or him? If his presence was not even a burden for the earth, how can his words for a mere 33 years be an unbearable burden for that same earth?

Please proof to everyone that am shallow! I hate to drag you around like this! This earth carried Adam, Enoch, Noah whom mankind except those with him were killed, Abraham whom all of you clamor around and call "father", Moses whom God spoke to without an angel as carrier of the message, and the incidents were more than one time, and great miracles were done by him, including rendering useless the tyrannical Pharaoh, David who slaughtered Goliat, when David was just a 12 year old, not even bermitvahed yet at 13, Solomon who God subjected even genie to his command and the same earth will not be able to handle the mere words of Jesus when the same earth had fed him and matured his mother who gave birth to him, nourished him, etc and even nursed him to full health by mere oils or balm robbed on him by women (people from the earthand he was not married to any of those women who were massaging him. He did not tell them to stop, because he was too weak to resist or talk. Can we imagine if this was Muhammad (AS), the Christians will be using it as a weapon to show his sexual appetite), of the bodily wounds he suffered from the attempt on his life?

Finally the same earth that he ran to its safer side, in Egypt where black nubians and coptics lived, as the people bearing danger on his life lived on the otherside where the Children of Israel, his own lighter skin people lived, of a river or sea out of many that the earth also housed? Kunle, omo boy, don't disappoint me! Step to the plate, if you can. If you cant I understant, because it is a tall order that I put in front of you! Even your most learned cant get out of this one.



@Krayola: I am not condemning any religion here and now. But I think I want Kunle to know that Jesus (AS) was not unique in his preachings! Every prophet preached love and reverence to God. Everyone of them preached anger and dislikes (hate) of disobedients to God's commandents, rule and wishes on human.

@KunleOshob:

Whilst moses and muhammed preached you should love God they nver preached you should love your fellow man. Jesus made it clear that it is equally important to love our fellow men and that you can only demonstrate you love God if you show love to your fellow men.

If I show you verses from Quran and ahadith talking about love and forgiveness of fellow men, will you quit Christianity and upgrade yourself to Islam? I will only do that when you accept my challenge. The free ride is not to destruction, but to pure salvation without fakery o death and blood!

Unlike the message of hate which muhammed is notorious for which as inspired terrorists all over the world for generations.

I hear you, except that Jesus in his "parable" of the king, on the king's return said that those who advocated for his never to return to rule them should be brought before him and be slained! Let me ask you, is this parable not about Jesus, or some mythical king who is actng like a big gangster, and terrorist in that verse? I know you will deny it for Jesus. So therefore I will go to the revelation about his return.

Jesus is slated to return and kill those of his own; the people of the house of israel, who will not accept his rulership! The Jews are aware of this. So are the Evangelistic Christians. Please Kunle, help me out of my shallowness by explaining the dual and directly opposing verses here! One a Parable, the other a prediction. Both pointing to blood bath, but one is clearly Jesus at his return to do a number on the Jews!

It would be fool hardy and extemely very naive for a man to assume he can fight on God's behalf like you Jihadist disillusion your selves to believe, it is simply laughable. God is quite capable of delivering judgement without the help of any mis-guided/ overzealous terrorist.

And when Moses made God kill Pharaoh and his army by drowning them in the sea, just by Moses using his staff, or all the killings that Moses did all the way to the edge of the "promised land (i do not believe it is a promise that will include evil doers, even as they persist in doing evil)", the massacres of people of Cannine, the Amorites, the Hittatits, the jebusites, and the destruction of the city of Jericho are not fights for God? What about the destruction and slaying of Goliat by young david, not a fight in defense of God?

If none of these fights had oocurred, wuld Jesus who preached "peace for the first time (I winked)", even though he asked his people to sell their cloths and purchase with it Swords (what would a peaceful man and his cohorts need swords for over 2000 years ago, would not it be the same thing a man needs shoulder launcher for today, from outside the fringe of acceptable authority?) be born n Jerusalem or whereever he was born?

Finally I remember the many Crusades mounted by the christian Europeans to Middle East, to route out the Muslims and in the process killed Jews! What about the Conqistadors/Spanish Inquisitions? Muslims and Jews were killed, and the killers were Christians. What about the colonizations of darker skin people by the Christian lighter skin people? These ligher skin colonizers, all over the world were Christians, with the Jews and some muslims acting as supporters making monies along the way? What about the world wars, primarily fought as leaders by the Christians? I guess you are not using the Bible at that time?

Okay south africa's afrikaan's apartheid tyranny over the blacks; they used the Bible without any question. What about the USA that I know well? Slavery and even now KKK still use the Bible to make claims about their white Supremacy's mumbo jumbo. Just the other day whites were arrested for plotting to kill the President. He is a white supremacy guy. The other day an abortion clinic Doctor was gunned down by a Bible thumping man.

Now who is very shallow, Kunle? Is the shallower person not you? Please defend your honor and excuse my ignorance! I want you to address each of these points, otherwise the label will stick!

@KunleOshob:

Wow i never knew you were this shallow, what is so difficult in Jesus telling a isciple who was close to him and worked with him for three years how he started his ministry

Yes am that shallow. I do not read to anything that can not be inferred, directly. Show me a verse, since there are many that deals with mondane thing, like aimless walking, etc, house in the Bible! Jesus telling his disciples how he satrted, if they were not present at his first preaching: the kingdom of God is at hand, ", must be equal to mere walking along (transit) in the Bible! No?

Help this shallow man, Kunle and don't dock the question!

@KunleOshob: My last entry here since I believe I have established the reality that Jesus was no different from other prophets (AS). Any comment?

Matthew 25:35-40:
35 For I was hungry, and you fed me. I was thirsty, and you gave me a drink. I was a stranger, and you invited me into your home. 36 I was naked, and you gave me clothing. I was sick, and you cared for me. I was in prison, and you visited me.’
  37 “Then these righteous ones will reply, ‘Lord, when did we ever see you hungry and feed you? Or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 Or a stranger and show you hospitality? Or naked and give you clothing? 39 When did we ever see you sick or in prison and visit you?’

Was the above "Lord" in verse 37, Jesus or Lord God that Jesus told his disciples and the crowd about in Mark 12 verse 29 (not hold me on this verse, but the content, the same as the statement of Isiah of old Testament); Hear, oh Israel, your Lord and my Lord is but one Lord God?

40 “And the King will say, ‘I tell you the truth, when you did it to one of the least of these my brothers and sisters, you were doing it to me!’

I am assuming that the king here is now Jesus, right? Lets examine this statement; will this be given on this earth or in the day of Judgement? If it is ion this earth, it is acceptable since 'the words "my brothers and sisters", are there to qualify his humanness. But all prophets advocated this same virtue!

If it is in the day of Judgement, it is worth noting Jesus himself did not know when that time will be! Further, he expressed that he will tell some chrsitians in the day of Judgement that he did not know them even as they informed him that they had performed great miracles in his name, yet he will allow them to be herded to lake of fire. This is not a virtue of a king, and surprisingly, the great miracles performed by this lake of fire dwellers are even more viruous than what is  quoted above! Those who perform miracles, must not be selfish that they do not perform the lesser 'deeds' above, that cant qualify for miracles! Heck, even all human beings, atheists included will do these things above, without any problem, as long as the doer has the means.

Homosexuals will do the same things. they are some of the most cash in hand groups! Will these above deeds alone qulaify anyone to receive Christian heaven? And what is the quantification, theessence of 'love your God?" How do you love God? What are His exact description of how to worship Him? What are his commandments and what is the reward of those who obey every last one of them, versus the one who breaks all of them or the majority of them or the most important of them; worship?How do you worship Him? Give us the descriptions from a to z of every act of worship that you know that is commanded by God, from the mouth of Jesus? Will they be exactly or similar to what Moses commanded?

What will be the difference? Which one will be similar to how Abraham worshipped and commanded is families to worship?

if there are differences, how and when and why did each variant occur? And could two happen side by side and both are accepted or only one is accepted and which is the latest and last and still current way of worshipping God? Do you know, because I want you to tell me this bit of great information!

@JJYOU: Good morning to you, too. Look I have no control over the conscience of any human being! I guess NL has its rule follow it or complain to anyone over the individual who deleted your post!

@KunleOshob:

The Golden Rule
12 “Do to others whatever you would like them to do to you. This is the essence of all that is taught in the law and the prophets.

Every prophet taught this. Moses who was the most warringprophet (AS) practiced this. He never led a war against people who are not disbelievers! And the greatest sin, according to you is not to love God! Those who hate men who are not lovers of God are great people! The love of God is a higher presidence! No? Hence Jesus do to other as you will like them do to you, is in line with what Moses and every prophet, including Muhammad (AS)! There is nothing more dramatic about Jesus here.

Matthew 22:37-39:
The great commandment
37 Jesus replied, “‘You must love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, and all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 A second is equally important: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’

As I have said above, this does not make Jesus christ unique over and above other previous prophets! They were lovers of God. And they did not hate anyone who loved God! I wonder why deitified the simple completely in line human being Prophet Jesus?

@KunleOshob:

Matthew 4:17:

17 From then on Jesus began to preach, “Repent of your sins and turn to God, for the Kingdom of Heaven is near.”

Was matthew the author of this verse, or somebody else who accorded it to him? Lets assume he was the author, we shall have two problems to solve;
1). Did Matthew knew Jesus well enough prior to "the beginning of his preaching", for him to write this verse as if he knew the exact time he started preaching, or did Jesus tell him this afterall?

2). Was Matthew the first recruit/disciple before Jesus was swampped by the 12 who surrounded him constantly, hence he was able to tell Matthew before then, when exactly he started his preaching and what led to it?

If one of these situations did not happen, or if there is no proof that Jesus sat Matthew down or another person who told Matthew this time lime of Jesus "starting his preaching", we hardly can believe the accounts of Matthew about the life of Jesus christ of the Bible!

Am Hamzah, Sefullah, Abbass! Can any of you Christians scare me, when we are all under the Heavens of the Al Qadri, Al Wadud, Al Batin, Al Matin, Al Jalal wal Iqram, Al Qahar, Al Alim, Al Ayy? It is not possible. I am a Big Male lion with the biggest mane you can ever see. I have gut, by Allah!

Except, sometimes I have to get busy away from Nairaland!