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LET EVERYONE ON NAIRALAND CHECK OUT POST #97, dated June 28, 2009 at 10.34 PM. THE TRUTH ABOUT THAT POST SHOLUD BE KNOWN.

noetic2
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 Re: Why I Am Not A Muslim
« #97 on: June 28, 2009, 10:34 PM »  

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what a shame . . . .  .no one could state why they are not a muslim.


why worship allah when u dont know him? why emulate mohammed when u dont condone his inhuman atrocities?

why EXACTLY are u a muslim?

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knowledge is profitable

This is what was said by he same people who are saying that the Muslims are confused! Not that they are saying that it is shameful that "no one can say why they are not Muslim!" Would muslim be the one who should be ashamed y the written statement, above?

You see, Allah reveals the inner feeling, the truth about a person when He wills it for it to be known.

Am not here to argue about this. I am only making observation(s).

@Bindex:

Nice to know that you have a very loving and caring mum. What is this "spiritual focus" you are talking about? Any special promises in islam that attracted you to it?

The fact that I do not have to have three masters and roll them into One is very attractive to me. It allows my heart to have a very simple and single focus. Paradise as a reward for obedience, responsibility while on earth.



[Quote]
What is it specifically that attracted you to islam?[/quote]Everyday's remembrance of compulsory duties; Salah for one, the weekly Jumuah prayer, the one month in a year fast and other voluntary fasts, the once in a life time hajj, the Zakat and Sadaqah and daily remembrance of Allah are part of what attracted me to it. It was not feasible for me to abandone this for Christianity of my mom.



[Quote]
Beside the physical processes like salah, what message in the koran stands out that keeps you in the islamic faith?[/quote]The admonition that one should fear Allah's punishment by coming to Him. The fact that I do not carry a sin committed by somebody else, like Adam and his wife Eve. The fact that there is no asking of my great grandfather's sin from me and all the way to great greatgrand son who have nothing to do with the man, but me their great great grand father, in a very remote way. I could do without feeling guilty for the shortcoming of another man who iI hardly knew. Can you imagine my great great grandson takingup the gult as well?

Any thing about Allah that separates him from the other Gods?

While the Jewish God, Yahweh, Jehovah, Eloi, Elohim, etc is called by Jews as father and they themselves called themselves Lords and Gods, and the Christians call their Gods, Father God, Son God, and Ghost God, both have said that their Gods have partlially or wholly been seen with naked eyes, humans and remained alive. Allah on the other hand, is not been represented like the Hindus andd their idols, etc, and He is no father nor son to any one. He is the All knower, while Jesus did not know the time of the hour and had to refer the knower to Father. he is capable to do all things, alone, while father hadto consult and the christian insinuating that that will be permission from Jesus, He Allah creates everything, while the Christian says that Jesus was not created by any god; father or ghost, and He Allah does not die, always alive, while Jesus, a 3rd of the Christian Triun died, according to te Bible of the Christians. Ican give you a trilion specic and unique qualities, but Allah in a nutshell, is the Lord God Creator that whateverthe heart makes up that He looks like, that will not be Him!

Do you have any evidence to show that Allah indeed exist?

Humans are always so quick to dismiss as unreal what they can not experience through the senses that they know. But these senses are not that humans have. There is the mind/soul that is intangible. Its different from the heart, which is a muscle, a flesh y meat, part of the body.Your soul/mind guides your morality which your heart is able to feel as it interpretes it. Just like the skin does not feel burns except until the nervous system interpretes the pain that will register as burns from fire, etc.  If the nervous system does not entertain the message from the conduit of nerves that carries this message of skin being burn, to the brain, and the brain in turn interpreting it, the burning victim would have become as a burnt charcoal amber, dead, yet no one will hear a cry of pain.

Allah on theability to know that He exists does not have to be by site. Afterall you have never seen the heavens, yet you know that above the layers of galaxies, etc, there is an envelope that is known as heaven. You do not even see its effect. Yet on earth, the wind is blowing, not seen but the effect is felt. Allah is theCreator of both, hence His presence is not seen but felt, like that of the wind. You know that He is there if you believe that the chances of all of these hings known as what makes up the earth, and the space bodies, and the heavens can not happen by chance. If it had we human beings would not have been completely different from say Elephant. Elephant different from Giraffe, etc. Hence Allah's presence is known and some of His Superior effects can not be felt like that of the heavens to us now. Humans will fell this effect or these effets at the time of death and day of ressurrection.

Finally, if a baby in the womb were to be asked if there is a place called earth, his answer will show his neivetes. Since his limited knowledge does not let him recognized that Mom who is carrying him is on earth and he under the control of mom. This can be the similitude of a person who ask, how can one be sure that Allah exists. What is the purpose of all of these on earth and ourselves, if there is no Allah?

There are so many books that are similar to the koran(christian and hebrew bible) What is it about the koran that makes it different. These are they kinds of things I want to know so that we can discuss further.

Similar and thats the only thing that they have, just the statement that they are all books of religions. Both so is the HIndu books, since that is a book of religion, too. The uniqueness of Quran (not K) is that it is primarily an oral recital. It was that in the very moment it was being revealed. Remember that Muhammad (AS) was not able to read, so his reading of the Quran was simply by oral recitation an not reading from the Book! It is an unchanging recitation. Those who read or recite in Warsh, when they recite in a region that Hafs is common, the listener hears and understands his recitation as correct! Quran is never changing. Thought the Muslims may change, that will be their own faults. Allah promised to keep the Quran safe from the hands and influence and generational thoughts and tampering of humans, which plagued Torah of the Jews and Injil of the Christians.

What makes the islamic destination better than say the jewish or christian destination?

If the Jews had remained had remained as they were in theological purityunder Prophet Moses (AS), they would not have adopted the name Jew. And their religion would never have been Jewish. In the days of Moses, what they practiced was Islam of its day! This Islam would have naturally lead them, the one who were alive, to follow Jesus (AS) as he became a prophet, practicing and preaching his own Islam of his day! Thes people, the reminants would have just in the same way follow Muhammad (AS) the one sent to all mankind, not just Arabs. Though he started with the arabs, his own people, since no prophet ever started with anyone but his own people. ut Muhammad (AS) was the only one who said I am sent to all mankind and supports his claims by having companions outside his own people; He has for black Africans and black people, Bilal ibn Rabah (RA), and others. This african was a slave and the first caller to prayer, a position even covetted by Ali bin AbiTalib.

He had for the white people, the Europeans, Shuaib AL Roma, and for Asiatic and Persian people Salman Al Farsi. Quran is still preserved orally, just the same way it was in the time of Muhammad (AS). If anyone were to critically looked at Islam, the name means willingly submission. Or peacefully submitting. The name was used in the Quran by Ibrahm (AS) in Surah An Am (Chapter 6), when he was making this prayer to his Creator. Neither Moses used the name Jewish as his religion, nor did Jesus used the name Christianity for his own religion. Muhammad used the name Islam for his own religion and called himself a muslim along with his followers.Promised, you asked: Paradise altimately in the day of Judgement. Forgiveness on this earth of my sins. I do not carry the Original sin overload as the Christians do carry. I am responsible for my own happiness, because Allah says I will not change the condition of a people unil they begin the change themselves. So my Lord knows my heart and knows my soul longs for Him, so I have all the ingredients to make me have the changes, and this is His Mercy!

The destination has things that are familiar to me on earth, the things that make this life enjoyable; the enjoyment of life, in a purest and highest grade that can always be the best. Am sure that some people will criticise the sex part, who among man or woman that doo not long for it. When a man or woman reaches the sexual age, the homones kicks in and everyone is restless to experience it. Even if they do, it is a raging fight (Jihad; struggle) internally that stops him or her. Who does not like the best of what he /she loves to eat; fruits, good drinks, the best of meals and oh the comfort of relaxation, a rest from hardship! These and more is in Paradise. When Tyra banks was a 19 years old new model in the late 1980s, she was very pretty then. People like me wanted her, a a wife. Today she is not as attractive. Just imagine that a husband sees his wife as pretty and desirable as the very first time he say her. That is even inferior to the relationship in paradise.

Good night men. David, your assignment awaits you. Get to it.

@Davidylan: Ask your Pastor to produce "Original Bible" from the Time of Jesus and look at his facial expression! The dude will almost crawl under a rock!

Now, I have asked to perform a simple experiment about Murky look of large water, not even see water. You have failed and I wonder what is scaring you so much? Is it that you believe that the truth wil shatter your ego and you rather live in a lie? This evening just to shut you up, I simply asked on google; can water surface look Murky at sunset? Simple question, with tons of answers, all point to the affirmative! Do the research or I will just below give you the finding and you check it out on your own.


The Sun CANNOT shine through the waves!To a fish, or a diver, the water surface looks like a perfect mirror, except for the , So the Sun's rays can't shine through waves, and can't get out of the water to be , Sea water isn't a clear green filter; it's murky, and when you see through , you find they run through the hues of the spectrum: at sunset, ,
mintaka.sdsu.edu/GF/explain/waves/waves.html - Cached - Similar -



o look ye all at the murky depths where the purple fish lurksPlace in a non-metallic bowl and cover with 3 x the amount of water to fruit by weight. , Sunset Song, Lewis Grassic Gibbon 164. The Shipping News, Annie Proulx , So I am posting, plus that way i can look at this list again and again! , as you may have to cover with foil to stop the surface burning. ,
kalchaino.livejournal.com/ - Cached - Similar -


HD 189733b: A 'Murky' Extrasolar PlanetAstronomers have found that the sunset on HD 189733b would look similar to a hazy red , to see the fingerprints of sodium, potassium and water there were none. , In this image we can see the asterism of the 'Summer Triangle' a giant , be about 1000 degrees Celsius cooler than the rest of HD 189733's surface. ,
www.scientificblogging.com/, /hd_189733b_a_murky_extrasolar_planet - Cached - Similar -


Honokowai Sea Turtles--Summer of 2005--Week 4May 8, 2006 , It's reassuring to look up and see our air bubbles weave gently up instead of , Murky water makes the honu edgy, and even old friends used to being , Either way, the honu's ability to see while foraging pre-sunset certainly , the eel into submission using the water's surface as the "club. ,
www.turtles.org/05week4.htm - Similar -


Swimming with Sharks: Whale Sharks of MexicoI put my snorkel in and look under the surface to see what is ahead. The water is murky and visibility is not more than a few meters, but I know the shark must be very close by now. , I can do nothing except stare at this huge fish as it sucks in whatever comes between its , A beautiful sunset over Isla Holbox ,
www.goworldtravel.com/ex/aspx/articleGuid, /print.htm - Cached - Similar -



River Books & Programs -> by Jerry HayAs we are cruising on a river we can actually look well ahead of our position and , possible shallow water, there are also surface water reactions that can act as a warning. , Even murky waters will have a lighter appearance in shallow areas because , Sounds are especially important when boating after sunset. ,
www.indianawaterways.com/readingtheriver.htm - Cached - Similar -



The Phantom Country: Watery, grave: exploring the murky depths of , It's the traumatic image that everything in Carnival of Souls (1962) can , rising up out of murky waters, streaked with the earth that's under the water, ,
thephantomcountry..com/, /watery-grave-carnival-of-souls-and-dont.html - Cached - Similar -



Kristine and the big blue - errr, I mean, big murky sea, BCD - you can be sure I double checked everything before I put this on , Then you go to the steps into the water, put on your fins and mask and put your , look up, 1, 2, 3, and a big step into the water and you experience the weird , and holds all the hoses and gauges in place) pulls you up to the surface, ,
www.travelblog.org/Asia/Thailand/, /blog-367913.html - Cached - Similar -



Free rippling water Download - rippling water SoftwareOf course the water surface is undulating in both N/S and E/W directions, , water, animated bubbles & even sunlight streaming down the murky waters of your , The Irene Sunset Splendor Screensaver with rippling water, flying birds , add water rippling effects,make it look like your desktop is filled with water ,
wareseeker.com/free-rippling-water/ - Cached - Similar -



[PDF] W2 color odor temp3File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - View as HTML
For instance, the water in surface mining strip pits can be affected by acid and be clear but not , tan, or brown to the water. There is a murky look to the water, in , to sunrise and sunset) when doing repeated measurements. ,
www.oznet.k-state.edu/kswater/, /W2%20color%20odor%20temp3.pdf - Similar -

@No2Atheism: On your ID, it says Uk. UK is England. No? And read #23 entry posted yesterday by me on this same thread. I addresed the Satanic Verses on it. Now let me propose something to you:

Say you deal in Gold bars. When a person brought a gold bar that you have initially sold to a primary buyer, in past to one of your workers for you to buy, what your man did was to bring it to your attention. When you saw the gold, you noticed that the Hallmark marking of your company's refinery or organization is not on it but something else is now in its place.

You dont have to even touch it for you to know that it as been tampered with! Only that is enough to tell your officer that this new product is not what you sold initially and this product does not have the qualification of your original certificate issued against it.

So will your officer go back to the "customer" waiting at the counter no tell him the truth that the Product is not the original? If he said anything else, he has lied and had not obeyed your statement to him.


Your Bible now is the new Gold bar, different from the Original Gold which had the highest refinery quality and hallmark markings. The original gold where in 12.5Kg bars, while the new gold is doric at say 50kg block!

In this doric block, one finds all types of metals, and of course some gold. So the reminant of truth in the Bible, is like the fraction of gold in the doric bar. The other metals in it are the lies in the Bible to make it look rich and full and romantic stories. Pyrites (fool's gold) looks exactly gold to an untrained eyes.

The Quran is the Secured Gold bar that is protected and locked in the vault that is keyed and guarded. This is the Gold bar that our doric can be measured by. It is the Quran that can confirm what truth that still remain in your Bible. Definately, nothing from the acts all the way to the end!

@No2Atheist: I laugh at you. I wished that you were telling the truth. You live in England. There are bodies of waters near you; ponds, lakes, seas/ocean, rivers, wharf/marina. Go at the time of sunset, look at the surface of the water as the sun sets. You see the clear water of the afternoon's summer clear day turning dark, unclear. Thats murky, man.

Alll muslim women wished they could have been from the household of Muhammad (AS) by marriage, because the prayer made: Allahumma sali ala ali Muhammad (AS) would have covered them! As a child in Yoruba land, there was a song that went like this;

Ko ma solo lufe mi laiye mo. Ko solo lufe mi laiye mo. Iku doro o pa Muhammad (AS) ko solo lu fe mi laiye mo.

Rpeat the above and now say: Iku doro o opapa babab Fatima (RA) ko ma solo lu femi laiye mo!

The other accusations are so weak that I will be wasting my time responding to any.

when Jesus was saying this things, above about birth, death and ressurrection, he was a baby miraculously defending his mother, by being able to speak about himself and his duties, etc. was he born when he said these words? Yes. Was he dead? No. Was he ressurrected? No.

Allah related this situation to His Prophet, Muhammad (AS) who came in the future after the speech of Jesus (AS). There is no place in the Quran that Allah says that Jesus died! Rather Allah says that Jesus was not killed (meaning did not died). Was not Crucified (meaning did not die on the cross).

However, Allah says every soul (creation) shall taste death. So Jesus will have to come back on earth to taste the "death" that Allah promised! Of course it is stated in the Quran that Jesus is part of creation, so there!

Allah says in Quran that they neither killed him nor crucified him, but it was made to appear so unto them. In many places in Quran, it has been mentioned that Jews used to kill the prophets unjustly. But in the case of Jesus (pbuh) it vehemently denies that they killed him or that they crucified him. This is because Quran will not contain anything except truth.

Surah 4, Verses 157 & 158:

Soonu Bindex. Yoowaa. Sorry my Hausa writting is worse and my spoken Hausa is just a shade better.

Good question. I hope the derailers of threads will not derail this one, to argue about this and that and not the Topic!

I am a muslim, after being raised by a mother is a former Christian, because Islam naturally appeal to me, to be a means or process of "Spiritual focus," even before I knew what islam stands for. Of course mothers are the single most the part parental entity that Offspring see in the matters of nurture and moral example. My mother was a good mother to me with much far for me, as a baby and all through my life, till today. I remember as a baby that she would do everything to please me. In my early days, say from age 3 upward, I still can remember her giving me smoked Salmon, piece with some biscuits and warm tea before bed.

In the afternoon, my choice of beverage was Crola, and I always get a tall glass, enough for my stomach, and even share with my peers who I play with. With all this special care, and with the fact that my mother was a devoted Christian, now a Muslim, Alhamdulillah, you can see that Islam must have attrected me so much that I never at anytime practiced Christianity. Yet my father (ra) was a man that little babies like me will have to consider to be grandfather, at least, so his influence on me, even though I saw him often and quite enough, was very minimal. My older brothers were old enough to be my parents, some have children 5 to 10 years older than me. And by the way I was not the last child!


If you consider all of these, above, you will see that my love for the physical process of Salah, the standing, bending and prostrating attracted me and I enjoyed it. I hear the call of prayer and my heart gets excited. The fasting was very special to me and I have been observing the full 30 days as early when I was before 7 years old.

Now, when i became older to even begin to discriminate between right and wrong and my belief in what is known as God (Allah) begins to take shape, I knew that there was ONLY ONE SINGULAR ENITITY that can be THIS HOLDER OF THE HONOR! His name to me was and still Allah.

I could not fathom the though that this GOD is at anytime powerless and can be overcome or not be needed by any. Infact I believed then as I believe now that all beings need HIm, subcontiously, even even some deny that He is not in existence. Their hearts and their souls know they are lying and He does exist! And all through this period of my life, I did not know how to read the Quran. Infact not even a letter of the the arabic language I could point out to anyone.Not even Alif! But my heart was drawn to Allah and never waivered!

Now that I am over 40 years old, the age which no one can claim to be orphan still,I have learnt how to read the arabic Quran, and from the Mercy of this Merciful Allah the Almighty, the Quran comes alive in my heart when I read it, and when I read it in English I understand it and knows that the world did not just exist all of a sudden, except there is a planner and the Planner is Allah, who created me as a human for a purpose. My purpose is to worship Him and He will amke ways for the rest; my life and my death and my worship is for His Pleasure. I seek Mercy from Him and I am in Submisssion to Him, willingly.


Again, why am I a Muslim. I find a clear and the only successful destination in it.

no.

@Nezam: I didn't quote your Bible. Unless your Bible confirmed that it was waswas of Shaitan that made Moses killed the Egyptian, or it was waswas of Shaitan that made Jonah not attend to his duty right away.

And no muslim ever said that we the muslim keep the "Uncorrupted Bible", anywhere! What will be its use? We do know though that when the Books, that consist of what you call Bible were revealed, each to his receiving messenger and or propphet (AS), it must have been pure. Or do you think it was exactly like it is now?

If you are a Protestant, tell me which one of these is 100% pure since they are not exactly the same, letter by letter, word for word, sentence by sentence, etc; KJV, NIV, ASV, just to name a few? When you pick one, then know that the rest are corrupted! Then which ever you pick, then consider the 2000 years of that same Bible type that you chose, tell me which revision or which print of it at what period is the pure uncorrupted Bible? You will see that you would have thrown 99% of the people in Christianity to confusion, mayhem and Schizm. heck, Schizm occurs in Christianity.


Check the issue with the Catholics; the Catholic must be hopping mad if you say their Bible is corrupted, because you are a protestant. Or do you read the Catholic Bible if you are a proptestant? Considering the many six or seven books it has and the Protestant's are devoid of them, so who is correct among all of you?

So that you know, the Muslims, Shia, Sunni, etc all read the same Quran! Research it out!

I always love the issue of the "Satanic Verses." I wished the situation occurred, even though it didn't. It would have been another way to confirm the Authenticity of the Quran and Muhammad (AS)! Muhammad would not have planned that he be whispered to by the Satan, especially when he was trying to rid his people off all types of unholy relationships and worships!

He could not have written the Satanic Verses and then abrogated it and expunge it completely. He could not have left some verses that say that every prophet are assigned enemies, shaitan, demons to be their enemy! The Quran says that mankind sohould consider Shaitan as an open enemy. Muhammad, Jesus, Job, Jonah, Moses to name a few were humans and prophets of their Lord, according to the Muslims.

We see that Moses was overcame with rage and killed the Egyptian, the reason he ran away to Midian. Rage is the work of Shaitan.
We see that Jonah did not initilly deliver the message to those people in the town he was sent, so he was swallowed by the whale. His not immediately going to do his assigned duty was the work of Shaitan.
Job was made sick by Shaitan's evil efforts, too.
Jesus received the whispering of Shaitan, which took him to the top of the hill and asked him to Jump. He was also whispered to many other times; at least two other times.

In each of these cases, the prophet initially faltered. But was in the end did not crumbled under the control of Shaitan. They were helped by their Lord, in the way He halped each of them. Is there any surprise, if it had happened that Muhammad (AS) had the same temporary experience which was immediately corrected?!


The Muslims, nor the Jews do not call any of these men God or son of God, in the way Christian lionized Jesus. Yet, in the Quran Allah says that Jesus is no more than an apostle. A human being. He then supported this argument, making it abundantly clear that Jesus and his mother both eat and do things of humans!

You know Jesus experience fatigue and tiredness, like every human. But in the ahadith of Jibril (AS) when he came as human to Muhammad (AS) and the Companions (RA) in Madina, in the masjid, he was no in anyway have the sign of traveller. In that dusty desert over 1400 years ago, he did not have anything but cleaningness, in body (Shiny face) and cloth (White and unstained new like cloth). This is an angel. No ne ever recorded that angels ate!

So we see that Jesus had less of spiritual appearance than an angel, who was not fatigued an did not eat! How then is this possible that this man, Jesus who ate, slept, deficated, hungered, tired out, etc can be considered a god? This is unbelieveable!

@Ndipe: If the read, by the Children of Israel who actually are the benefiary of OT, is not referring to Isiah, the Speaker who addressed his people, then we can not exclude any prophet who came after him from the possible person he was talking about, if you think it is a speech for the thing to happen later. My opinion is that you can never know the Book of the Children better than them, because it is not in your language. They the Children of Israel dream in that language or should be dreaming in that language if they had kept their language still in its original form.

It will be impossible for a non-igbo speaker to know more igbo than you. You do speak igbo. no? You do dream in igbo, sometimes. no?

Therefore when you put Jesus in this possible position, then do not forget more successful prophets who ministered within the Children of Israel's bloodline; Solmon, David his father and others to be included, yes, John as well as Jesus. You see there is always the murkiness that comes with, always the Bible! The verses are for the most part not clear in meaning and this lend to self wish meanings or interpretations!

The speech of Isiah may actually be refering to some past prophet, since all human souls were removed from the body of Adam, it may actually be he, Adam. We are called his children, hence he was there alive on earth when we were being created! No wonder that Jesus was refering only to Abraham as the one he "was". He was there in a soul form before Abraham came on earth body and soul as a human. But Jesus never went back to make that reference to Adam, because he will be incorrect, since soul occurred in heaven before body and soul on earth as human. Heck I was before Abraham, too. I definitely was before Jesus, who came later!

thanks. and there was no israel, and many others. only one african country. no south american and latin american etc.

@Ndipe: I know you addressed your question to Abuzola. But am here to help your understanding until he returns, tomorrow. Please note that verse 32 was talking about his commanded duties and relationship with his mother. So verse33 was a continuation of this statement, in defense of his mother, as he spoke in the cradle; so he said peace is upon me in day of my birth, which had occurred. Then he moved to future, the immediate one will be death, so he said peace on me the day I die or I will die, which is obviously in the future a time yet to come and he does not know it at the time he was giving this speech. And the final situation is being ressurrected back to life for judgement day; so Jesus said peace on me the day this will occur to complete the circle of life death and judgement.

Verse34 is Allah's statement indicating that people dispute about this situation; the birth, some say from the Christians that he was God or Son of God, which is not true and there is no proof to its truth. Some say about him that he has experienced death, and Allah says not yet. Consider the fact that the Jews intended for him to die on the cross so that his soul can be accuursed based on their understandings, Allah saved him from this singular calamity. And no one can tell me that death by hanging can be peaceful, or can it?

And the ressurrection can not happen unless there is death, so his resurrection is stll in the future since his death has not occurred. By the way Verse 15 of the same Surah Mariam has exactly the same thing about birth, death and ressurrection days being peaceful too for Yahya, the cousin of Jesus. So Jesus is not unique in this situation.


19;33
Muhsin Khan: "And Salam (peace) be upon me the day I was born, and the day I die, and the day I shall be raised alive!"
Sahih International: And peace is on me the day I was born and the day I will die and the day I am raised alive."
Pickthall: Peace on me the day I was born, and the day I die, and the day I shall be raised alive!
Yusuf Ali: "So peace is on me the day I was born, the day that I die, and the day that I shall be raised up to life (again)"!



19:34
to topMuhsin Khan: Such is 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary). (it is) a statement of truth, about which they doubt (or dispute).
Sahih International: That is Jesus, the son of Mary - the word of truth about which they are in dispute.
Pickthall: Such was Jesus, son of Mary: (this is) a statement of the truth concerning which they doubt.
Yusuf Ali: Such (was) Jesus the son of Mary: (it is) a statement of truth, about which they (vainly) dispute.

@Flancey: « #109 on: Today at 10:57:49 PM »

Olabowale wirtes the way he understands.

Correct. It is straight forward and i do not interprete anything especially when it is as straight forward like a straight line between two points.

The things of God cant be understood by a carnal and natural mind. It takes a regenerated mind to know the import of what Jesus did and why hHe did it.

I am gonna assume that you are one of the regerated minds. So tell us please what he did, without bending it out of shape too much that it becomes unrecognizable.

When satan commanded Jesus to turn stone into bread, dont you think he could have done it?

I dont know. And I actually dont think so, since he was not in command, according to your statement that Satan commanded him. You see if he was in command he easily could have told satan I will not follow your command, since you cant command me. However, just to show you I have conrol over things, I will leave the stone alone, but bring wheat or something else out, something he can eat. And my argument is correct considering the fact that he could not even command a Figtree to bear fruit to quench his hunger! That would have been a great miracle and a benefit to the tree, instead he performed a worse miracl by ripping havoc on the tree causing it to die! Is this the working of God? I think not!

In Surah Mariam, we read that Allah cause a palm date to fall down, full ripe and ready to eat for Mariam. Now thats a Miracle: Good Miracle for feeding a good woman in the time of her distress and keeping the tree alive, which onc was a dead stomp, chopped down!

But He didnt because Satan was not in command, Jesus was and is still is.
But a time came when there was only 5 loaves of bread and 2 fish. He was in command. He fed 5 thounsand men exclusive of children and women. Infact 12 baskets were used to collect the left overs.

He only made what was available plentiful. Prophets can do that by God's permission. Moses made water gush out of rock, 12 separate springs. Moses made the army of Egypt perished. Moses under his commandership, the Israelites eate Manna and Quaill. Under him, he pulverized the Golden Calf to nothingness. He united them. Since him, they have not listened to any prophets in significant number! Heck they rejected Biblical Jesus. And you said that they even killed him, Is that the hallmark of God, who is in command, that a mere human prophet outshines him in performance?

My dear islamic minded fellows. The Bible is not just a book, it is the mind of God, and who can know God;s mind except it is revealved by the spirit of God. You will NEVER with your muslim dark heartedness know God.

Thats some confused and revised and revisioned mind! Please mister stop saying this because I see that your Bible opposes itself by content, without any logical explanation. How do you explain that the Jews believe in Trinity. Yet Jesus one of the parties in the Triun is saying that his listeners and he have one God Lord. How is it that he Jesus said that by himself, he can't do anything?

I urge you to come to the kingdom of God so that your understanding can be open.
Islam is so confused that they have started night vigil, built alters,

The muslims who are doing these things because they are imitating the Christians may just as well be called Christians. There is no altar in Islam as far as I know. Night vigil is not a thing of Christians, alone. In the month of Ramadan, there is Lailatul Qadr. Everyone is supposed to pray, read and supplicate to seek Mercy, Forgiveness, Right Guidance, etc. People spend the last ten days of the Ramadan doing just that, too. People prayed Tahajjud, nigtly. Allah sent down ayah from Surah Taha to caution the Prophet (AS) from all night long everyday Prayer! What do you think Islam is? You guys wake up, everyday frand abandone the bed and the things that make bed enjoyable to Pray to God, daily? Tahajjud at least takes away almost 1 hour, then you have to make your Dawn Salah, too. What are you talking about, man?

and even started attending sunday gathering of their own.
Copy cats.

If I were living in Nigeria, I would not attend it every sunday. However, Sunday is just a day. Unfortunately, the Nigerian Government settles on this day as a no work day. So the muslims, with the concerns for themselves, and their youth are looking for a way to secure their hearts away from the alluring Christian gimmicks. I know what I went through in High School, in the days from the likes of Abayomi isijola, Comfort Oni, Janet Aje an many others! It was only by the Grace of Allah that my eyes wondered off from their short short blouse, miniskirts, etc. I hope you do know that african women have got assets which they can flaunt and give away for free for the sake of Jesus, when they are trying to convince "disbelievers" like me?

I pray that one day you shout hallelujah to the King of kings.
We are praying and watching.
God bless nairaland.

Pray and watch and wait! You will find that its all in vain, InshaAllah with a person like me. And if you relax enough and lets become friends, Allah will definitely guide your heart to islam. Keep safe man.

@Oyb: Salaamualeykum wa Rahamatullahi Taala wa barakatuh. I copied for my own personal use what you have written up. Maybe I will use it on a private email to $Osisi. I am sure she will read this above on this forum, in time. May Allah Almighty rewards you.

@ardent:« #103 on: Today at 04:45:25 PM »

@Abuzola,
You are not a christain and you want to start interpreting the bible. Just imagine how foolish and stupid it will be for me to start interpreting the quaran to muslims. It just doesnt make sense.

There is no need to interprete anything in the Qran. The words and sentences and Paragraphs and chapters are very direct. When Salah is mention as an obligation, you cant interprete it to mean something other than command. When Allah says no son, no parents, it means just that, existed alone without biological family, or any type of creation or something before Him or along with Him or escapes His creation Power.

Since you lack the understanding of what happened when Jesus cursed the fig tree, there is no point explaining the significance of what Jesus did as it will be too much for you to comprehend.

You tell us what happened then. Should he not have known the fig tree was fruitless and be able to command it to bear enough to feed him, at least instead of just killing it? By the way who knew that this thing happened? Were people following him and they were so greedy and miserly that they could not show kindness to him and feed a hungry man? Or was it the Bible Jesus that was showing off telling people what he did when no one was there to witness it?




@ilosiwaju

One thing though, Abuzola's publicity strategy is working for him so far. As for whether he is confused, he really is.

What would they not say to my brother, while they themselves can't offer any possible reasonable answer to any of his questions!



@mactao

Abuzola, you didn't answer my question. If Jesus was a muslim, why did he allow himself to get crucified?

If he had died by hanging/cricifixion, it showed as a muslim, that it was his time to die, and that was the way he had to go! There is no statement in the Quran that says a muslim could never be killed or dies by hanging or being crucified!

At that time, there were supposed to be fruits on that tree, but there werent. Aren't you the one that knows all about Jewish words and history? Ask your historians.

Abuzola is not concerned about the tree, but that a deity, according to you killed a tree, because it did not obey him by providing food for him? Should he not have proven his deityship by just commanding it to provide the food he needed and that would have been proof of his power? Should it not have been better if he had mercy on it? Or your belief is that only man should receive mercy and trees are excluded?

@Nezan: Lets just say in hell, all the womn are non Muslims! There are non Muslim men in there, too. This should settle you down on your confusion.

when you begin your wudu, you know that it will be used for Salah, which you can't make without it. that salah that comes first, after the wudu should at least comes to mind, at some point, before you enter it. your heart has made the intention, and there is no need for a lp and tongue intention.

may Allah accepts all our intentions, ibadah, and good deeds. Amin.

@Nezan: Man, you know nothing about nothing. All you do is just repeat the lines like a Cennery. Sorry a Parrot. You should know that if there is more than one, and there are versions, then at best, only one can be true. Definitely you cant have at best more than obeversion being 100% true. Or is this possible?

And when somthing is corrupt, it does simply means some truth have been removed from and or lies have been entered into it. Tell me which Bible version is free from this accusation, lacking 100% original truth and containing some % of lies? Think man.

If you make a mistake to say its the Protestant's many versions, I want the exact one, and I will pass it on to the Catholics to accept it or pass their "comments." If you think they will be kind, it is because they are biting ther tongue, since they know that its exactly their own copy, less the 6 or 7 Books!

If you say it is the Catholics, then wait for the likes of $Osisi, Davidylan, Pilgrm1 to tear you to into small pieces. You will soon found out from the fingers of pilgrim.1 horrid you are, if you claim Douwy is the way to go! Yet Douwy is alway ever changing under revisions and versions.

@TheSeeker: 90001 is LA, CA. So if you are correct, you must at least be aware of the the minority stats of the muslim, in tis land, the United States.
But there is no "Good Samaritan" syndrome or mindset, in Islam. Samaritan, good or otherwise is strange to the muslim. You may call him that, but he will not call himself that. The label he gives himself will be the correct one, since he and not you knew why he came to the defense of the Jewish man.

Remember that the Jewish mand and his women said thatthere were Jews and others who didn;t get involved. Those Jews and others knew the term good Samaritan from the Bible, they didn't take up the label for themselves and defend a victim from the hands of the Christian Mob. I am sure that you remembered the annual easter Judas Iscariot that the youth used to drag about shouting after murderer at it? That could be called a typical Christian behavior towards the Jews, if you think the Muslims are typically violent. But I wonder why the Muslim guy on the Q Train line in NYC got involved, especially that he is obvious that he can't take the Mob? You know he is a little and not heavily build man.

And if you live long in America yo will know that it is a beautiful country, that protects its interests. So she makes and keeps friends alliances that serves this purpose. America only have temporary friendship. Nothing permanent, I tell you. There was a time that Noriega was a friend. There will be a time israel will not be a friend!

Your conclusion about practising moderately, is the best and the injuctions of the Quran is an adverse outcome, meaning worse, bringing chaos, does kind of throw me! I theefore ask; those who are not folowing the Quranic commandments, will you then consider them as "good muslims?" Will the moderate muslims, by your definition be good muslims and will they agree with your either saying that they are good muslims, because they are moderate and it is because they do not obey what is in the Quran, or that anyone who obeys Quran is bad muslims, while they the good muslims are good because they do not obey what is in the Quran?

Your friends need to know how you feel about them, not follwoing Quran makes them moderate and good muslims!


Were you in America when Granada was invade in 1984 and deposed or killed Maurice Bishop? What defense was in play there?

Ozzycda


Friday, April 3, 2009
Women in Islam

NOTE TO ALL READERS THIS ARTICLES IS NOT WRITTEN BY ME, THIS IS THE PROPERTY OF ANSWERING-CHRISTIANITY.COM.(if there are any issues with this please let me know).

The Article:

www.answering-christianity.com presents:

Response to the lies and distortions of christian missionaries about the position of
women in islam

APart 3, Written by Kevin el-Karim
“The most perfect of believers are those most perfect of character; and the best of you are the best of you to
your spouses.” Tirmidhi, Ibn Hibban

"None but a noble man treats women in an honourable manner. And none but an ignoble treats women
disgracefully" At-Tirmithy

He wrote:

The collector of the so-called sound narrations, Imam al-Bukahri narrated:

Narrated Sahl bin Sad: While we were sitting in the company of the Prophet a woman came to him and presented
herself for marriage to him. The Prophet looked at her, lowering his eyes and raising them, but did not give a
reply. One of his companions said, " Marry her to me O Allah’s Apostle " The Prophet asked him, "Have you got
anything ? " He said, " I have got nothing." The Prophet said, " Not even an iron ring ? " He said, " Not even an
iron ring, but I will tear my garment into two halves and give her one half and keep the other half. " The Prophet;
said, " No. Do you know some of the Quran (by heart) ? " He said, " Yes." The Prophet said, " Go, I have agreed
to marry her to you with what you know of the Qur'an (as her Mahr)." 'And for those who have no courses (i.e.
they are still immature). (65.4) And the 'Iddat for the girl BEFORE PUBERTYis three months (in the above
Verse). (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 63; emphasis ours)

Response:

The christian missionary relies his opinion on an english translation of the heading of a chapter. The Sahl bin
Sa'd ahadith ends at: "Go, I have agreed to marry her to you with what you know of the Qur'an". What is
mentioned next , the fat quoted text by sham shamoun, is not a hadeeth but part of the title of the next chapter in
sahih al-bukhari:

باب إنكاح الرجل ولد الصغار لقول تعالى { واللائي لم يحضن } فجعل عدتا ثلاثة أشر قبل البلوغ

something like:
“Chapter on ( the permissibility of ) a man marrying off his underage daughter (which would be) in
accordance with the saying of Allah "And for –“those who do not menstruate" so the `iddah was set to
three months prior to buloogh."

In the context of this verse prior to ‘buloogh’ refers only to ‘prior to menstruation’, since the verse speaks about
those who have no courses yet. When a girl has her first menstrual period, she is general considered as having
reached ‘buloogh’ / puberty. Therefor the writer here in his chapter uses the words ‘underage’ and ‘prior to
buloogh’ as a reference to ‘prior to menstruation’. This can be clearly seen without doubt at the rest of the text
and it’s context in connection to the quranic ayah. A lot of writers used the term ‘buloogh’ only as a reference to
menstruation, since menstruation is the well known sign which shows that a girl has reached ‘buloogh’. Therefor
most writers use the the term ‘prior to buloogh’ and ‘underage’ as a synonym for ‘prior to menstruation’. This
can be confusing sometimes, since one could think that girls could consummate marriage before puberty, which
is actually not allowed in islam. Like we mentioned before there are also other things which are a sign of having
reached ‘majority’ in islam. These things are: wet dreams, breasts, public hair and the age of 15 years. Therefor a
girl can only consummate marriage prior to menstruation (which is general considered as buloogh for girls)
when she has already public hair, breasts or reached the age of 15 years or had a wet dream, which are also signs
that a girl has reached puberty in islam. So keep in mind that the heading of this chapter only refers to girls who
had not yet menstruated which can be clearly seen at the rest of the text and it’s connection to the quranic ayah.
Proof that girls can only consummate marriage on the onset of puberty can be found in the sunnah of our
prophet. The Prophet, peace be upon him, didn’t consummate his marriage with Aicha when she was six. He
consummated his marriage with her three years later. The reason for this was that they were waiting for her to
come of age, or in other words reached puberty.

Another author, Karen Armstrong, has this to add:
Tabari says that she was so young that she stayed in her parents home and the marriage was consummated there
later when she had reached puberty.

( Karen Armstrong, Muhammad: A Biography of the Prophet, Harper San Francisco, 1992, page 157 )

Now if a marriage could be consummated at any age with a girl or prior to puberty, then certainly the prophet,
peace be upon him, would have consummated his marriage with Aicha when she was six. However he never did
this for a reason, he waited untill she reached puberty. From this we can already see, that girls priot to puberty
are not allowed to consummate marriage. But what about the ayah which says ‘and the waiting period for those
who have no courses yet is three months’ ? Like we have seen in the heading of the chapter of sahih bukhari is
that girls prior to menstruation can marry, which is by some writers described as ‘prior to buloogh’ or ‘underage’
since menstruation is general considered as having reached buloogh. However this does not mean that girls can
consummate marriage before pubery, which some people think. This confusion occurs because some writers
used the terms ‘prior to buloogh’ or ‘underage’ as a reference or synonym for ‘prior to menstruation’ since
menstruation is the well known aspect which shows that a girl has reached puberty / majority. However in islam
a girl has also reached puberty / majority when she had her first wet dream, or has already public hair, breasts or
reached the age of 15 years. These facts can be found in Ibn Kathirs famous tafsir on soerah 4

Qu’ran An-nisa 6:
Waibtaloo alyatama hatta itha balaghoo alnnikaha fa-in anastum minhum rushdan faidfaAAoo ilayhim
amwalahum wala ta/kulooha israfan wabidaran an yakbaroo waman kana ghaniyyan falyastaAAfif waman kana
faqeeran falya/kul bialmaAAroofi fa-itha dafaAAtum ilayhim amwalahum faashhidoo AAalayhim wakafa
biAllahi haseeban

Prove orphans till they reach the marriageable age; then, if ye find them of sound judgment, deliver over unto
them their fortune; and devour it not by squandering and in haste lest they should grow up Whoso (of the
guardians) is rich, let him abstain generously (from taking of the property of orphans); and whoso is poor let
him take thereof in reason (for his guardianship). And when ye deliver up their fortune unto orphans, have (the
transaction) witnessed in their presence. Allah sufficeth as a Reckoner.

Ibn Kathir in his tafsir comments:

The age of puberty, according to Mujahid. The age of puberty according to the majority of scholars comes when
the child has a wet dream. In his Sunan, Abu Dawud recorded that `Ali said, "I memorized these words from the
Messenger of Allah , “There is no orphan after the age of puberty nor vowing to be silent throughout the day to
the night” .

In another Hadith, `A'ishah and other Companions said that the Prophet said, “The pen does not record the
deeds of three persons: the child until the age of puberty, the sleeping person “until waking up, and the senile
until sane”

Or, the age of fifteen is considered the age of adolescence. In the Two Sahihs, it is recorded that Ibn Umar said,
I was presented in front of the Prophet on the eve of the battle of Uhud, while I was fourteen years of age, and he
did not allow me to take part in “that battle. But I was presented in front of him on the eve of the battle of Al-
Khandaq (The Trench) when I was fifteen years old, and he allowed “me (to join that battle).

Umar bin `Abdul-`Aziz commented when this Hadith reached him, “ This is the difference between a child and
an adult.” There is a difference of opinion over whether pubic hair is considered a sign of adulthood, and the
correct opinion is that it is. The Sunnah supports this view, according to a Hadith collected by Imam Ahmad
from `Atiyah Al-Qurazi who said, We were presented to the Prophet on the day of Qurizah, whoever had pubic
hair was killed, whoever did not was left free to go, I was one of those who did not, so I was left free.'' The Four
Sunan compilers also recorded similar to it. At-Tirmidhi said, "Hasan Sahih.'' Allah's statement, 1
We now clearly see and have enough proof to state that consummation of marriage in islam can only occur when
a girl has reached puberty. Therefor a girl who has not yet had her first menstrual period, can only consummate
marriage prior to menstruation when she has reached majority / puberty trough other ways. These others ways
are: having a wet dream, having already public hair, breasts or reaching the age of 15 years. These facts can be
found in Ibn Kathirs tafsir and the hadith.
Kkkkkkk

The Prophet, peace be upon him, never said that girls could consummate marriage prior to puberty. The christian
missionary based his attack on islam on the heading of a chapter in the hadith collection of bukhari, therefor the
christian missionary could not provide any hadith or quranic ayah to support his claim. On the contrary the
hadith and quran refute his false claims. Moreover i showed and pointed out that ‘prior to buloogh’ by some
writers is used as a synonym for ‘prior to menstruation’ , which was clearly the case with the heading of the
chapter in sahih bukhari, since the quranic ayah about menstruation was mentioned. Moreover Maulana
Muhammad Ali’s commentary on soerah 4:6 is enough proof to silent the lie of the christian missionary.

Maulana Muhammad Ali in his commentary of the qu’ran comments:
These words, moreover, show that marriage should be performed at the age when a person has attained majority,
for the age of marriage is spoken of as being the age of attaining majority. 2

The christian missionary moreover fails to realize that it was a normal custom for young people to marry at the
onset of their puberty or some years later, since the prophet, peace be upon him, recommended those who had
the means for it to marry. The christian missionary obvious only fantasizes that older men married with younger
girls, he obvious never realizes that young boys just married young girls back then, and only consummated
marriage with them when they had reached puberty. In those times and biblical times it was the custom of the
society, which nowadays many people fail to realize. Also puberty and adulthood in those societies back then
were reached at an earlier age then today. Also it’s important to know that in islam girls have free will to choose
a husband they want / like. They have the right to refuse a proposel from someone they don’t want to marry or
just don’t like. So a marriage can only happen in islam if both parties agree with each other, and are happy with
it. This can be found in the next hadith:


Sahih Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 67
The Prophet said: “A matron should not be given in marriage except after consulting her; and a virgin should not
be given in marriage except after her permission

Also the option that a girl can (not must) consummate marriage at the onset of her puberty, does not mean that
girls have to marry at this age. It’s only an option. Secondly even if she has reached the onset of puberty or
general age of puberty in islam, then she can only marry if she is able to. If she is not able / capable / or ready
to marry or consummate marriage, then she cannot and should not marry. This rule can be found in the next
hadith:

Sahih Bukhari , Volume 7, Book 62, Number 3

The prophet said: “ O young people ! Whoever among you is able to marry, should marry, and whoever is not
able to marry, is recommended to fast, as fasting diminishes his sexual power.



Thirdly she can only consummate her marriage at the onset of puberty, if she and her parents are sure that
there would be no harm in it for her to marry and consummate her marriage, since the prophet said:

Related by Al-Daraqutni, Ibn Majah and Ahmad.
The Prophet said: “There shall be no infliction of harm on oneself or others"


So if a girl on the onset of puberty by herself is not mentally or emotional ready for marriage, then she herself
and her parents should conclude and agree that it’s not the right time yet for her to marry and / or consummate
marriage. If they would do the opposite, then: k


A:

If the parents give their daughter permission to consummate her marriage, or letting her marry while they know
that their daughter is mentally and emotionally not ready for it, then they would harm their daughter. This would
be a violoation of the hadith which states ‘not to harm others’.



B:

If the girl herself at the onset of puberty agrees and or insists to consummate her marriage or to marry (and
forces her parents to give her permission, because for example she’s in love), while she herself is actualy not
ready for marriage, mentally and emotionally, then in this case she would harm herself. This would also be a
violation of the hadith ‘not to harm oneself’. k
In today’s society many girls would not be ready ( except some ) to marry on the onset of puberty or general
considered age of puberty in islam ( fifteen years old ). Most of them would certainly not have the means for it,
due to lack of education or qualifications for a job which are required nowadays to survive and live a good life.
We should also remember that back then in early islamic times and biblical times, females like Aicha were raised
in a society where womanhood was reached at a much earlier age than it is in many societies today. Therefor my
advise to young men and women is to marry at an age when they have finished their schools and are both are
sure that they have the means for marriage. This would mean that they are 100% sure that one is emotional and
mentally ready for marriage and consummation of marriage.

Men should be 100% sure that they can support and carry the burdens to support and protect their wifes and
family from any harm or / and danger. Also both men and women have to be sure that they are willing and open
to spend as much time as possible with their partner in marriage, in romance and happiness, since marriage in
islam has to be based on love, peace and rest (see soerah 30:21). If one fails or harms the other partner in
marriage all the time, one commits a major sin. Marriage in islam is something important and half one’s faith,
which means husband and wife must work together and offer themselves for each other to make their marriage
succesfull. Also man's treatment of his wife is a measure of the perfection of his faith as in the hadith where the
prophet, peace be upon him, said:

Riyad as-Salihin, Chapter 34, Nr. 278
The Prophet said: “The most perfect of the believers in their belief are those with the best manners, and the best
of you are those who are best with their wives.”

Sources:

1:
http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=4&tid=10463

2:
The Holy Qu’ran by Muhammad Maulana Ali , commentary soerah 4:6
Posted by Ozzycda at 1:59 AM
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@$Osisi: Balagh is the word used. And it also used in Srah Nisaa to talk about the properties/inheritance of an orphan relative to the ability of the orphan to mamage the inheritance. I am sure you know the signs of maturity; wet dream, pubic hair, breast for women and vioice for men, in addition to menstration for women. A friend of mine started graying n the head at 11. I at almost middle age, is just experiencing it here and there! It is not uniform that there is an age for everyone to be matured or reached puberty!

My friend reached his at about 11, while amjust fighting to reach it now, even though I thing I peaked at 15! When was yours? Puberty was the age of consumation of marriage, and not before. And she does not have to have menstration at that time!

i have Tafsir ibn Kathir ready for you and answeringchristianity excellent piece to debunk your "you see folks, they are marrying underage girl" shout! I have asked you to wager with me and yor refusal shows that you are certain that you will lose to me. I know that you will lose and thats why am pushing the challenge to you. Quran can definitely defend itself, so be ready to wave the white flag, without a cross when you surrender!

@$Osisi: Go on google, woman. I thought you know how to do research? Ask the right question. Direct question about your concerns. Say if I were to intend to go to the galeria residential neigborhood, in Houston, I will simpy ask, How can I get to The Houston Galleria residential neighborhood, from University of Houston, area Highway. I will not say, how large is the Galleria. You will find a leading away information by the later, while what you will get on the former will give you the meat and potato of the matter.

Listen, I simpy just now asked: who teach the other how to clean, Muslims or the Europeans?. The below is what I got, even though it does not quite address what I wanted to find out for your information, even though I already know the truth. It at least give me an ammunition to let you know that since the Muslim's Moors were in Europe as the elites for about 8 centuries I can safely say that the muslims carry their cleanliness and impacted it on the Europeans.



Hygiene in the Islamic world
Main article: Islamic hygienical jurisprudence
Further information: Islamic cleanliness, Wudu, Ghusl, Islamic dietary laws, and Islamic toilet etiquette
Since the 7th century, Islam has always placed a strong emphasis on hygiene. Other than the need to be ritually clean in time for the daily prayer (Arabic: Salat) through Wudu and Ghusl, there are a large number of other hygiene-related rules governing the lives of Muslims. Other issues include the Islamic dietary laws. In general, the Qur'an advises Muslims to uphold high standards of physical hygiene and to be ritually clean whenever possible.


[edit] Hygiene in Europe
Contrary to popular belief[5] and although the Early Christian leaders condemned bathing as unspiritual,[6] bathing and sanitation were not lost in Europe with the collapse of the Roman Empire.[7][8] As a matter of fact, soapmaking first became an established trade during the so-called "Dark Ages." The Romans used scented oils (mostly from Egypt), among other alternatives.


Bathing in fact did not fall out of fashion in Europe until shortly after the Renaissance, replaced by the heavy use of sweat-bathing and perfume, as it was thought in Europe that water could carry disease into the body through the skin. (Water, in fact, does carry disease, but more often if it is drunk than if one bathes in it; and water only carries disease if it is contaminated by pathogens.) Medieval church authorities believed that public bathing created an environment open to immorality and disease. Roman Catholic Church officials even banned public bathing in an unsuccessful effort to halt syphilis epidemics from sweeping Europe.[9] Modern sanitation as we know it was not widely adopted until the 19th and 20th centuries. According to medieval historian Lynn Thorndike, people in Medieval Europe probably bathed more than people did in the 19th century.[10]


The authority over the Christian populace was in the hand of the Church. So when the church says dont clean up, you better believe that the funk was that of the dog days of summer afternoon! Until the muslims say hey you cant do this: you got to clan up, people of the book! Dirty body dirty mind. Scratchy body scratchy mind. I cant help it woman. I am laughing already.


Am looking at Atlantic Ocean and its dark. Murky I mean. David, when will you perform the experiment? Oh, you to, $Osisi. Good night guys. I wish you well.

@$Osisi: I simply asked on gogle: Did Muslim teach the Europeans how to shower, bath? And below is what I got among thers, which I did not even look at. Do good research. I did not ask who built the first shower! I simply said muslim made europeans clean.

It follows that hygiene has always been a convenient stick with which to beat other peoples, who never seem to get it right. The outsiders usually err on the side of dirtiness. The ancient Egyptians thought that sitting a dusty body in still water, as the Greeks did, was a foul idea. Late 19th-century Americans were scandalised by the dirtiness of Europeans; the Nazis promoted the idea of Jewish uncleanliness. At least since the Middle Ages, European travellers have enjoyed nominating the continent's grubbiest country - the laurels usually went to France or Spain. Sometimes the other is, suspiciously, too clean, which is how the Muslims, who scoured their bodies and washed their genitals, struck Europeans for centuries. The Muslims returned the compliment, regarding Europeans as downright filthy.

@Davidylan: Sharrap Davidylan and go take a walk around lake Eerie. Please perform the experiment of weak and dying light from the sun hitting the water at sunset. Tell us how very clear colored it is or more opague, murky. I want to teach $Osisi some Islam. Please take the Londoner along with you. lol. He is like a pest, a stubborn roach. You spray the house, it will find a way to come back!

@$Osisi: Below is what Wkipedia presented under "Islamic Golden age," as I ased on Google; list any invention made by Islam. Let just say its a surprise as nothing short of good material to refute your above claim was written about islam in the field of medicine. You can can go to wikipedia and check it out. Am sure they will not be as thorough as the muslims whose heritage is the one being denied by the non-muslims.

Medicine
Main article: Islamic medicine
Further information: Islamic psychology, Bimaristan, and Ophthalmology in medieval Islam
Islamic medicine was a genre of medical writing that was influenced by several different medical systems. The works of ancient Greek and Roman physicians Hippocrates, Dioscorides, Soranus, Celsus and Galen had a lasting impact on Islamic medicine.[132][133][134]


Muslim physicians made many significant contributions to medicine, including anatomy, experimental medicine, ophthalmology, pathology, the pharmaceutical sciences, physiology, surgery, etc. They also set up some of the earliest dedicated hospitals,[135] including the first medical schools[136] and psychiatric hospitals.[137] Al-Kindi wrote the De Gradibus, in which he first demonstrated the application of quantification and mathematics to medicine and pharmacology, such as a mathematical scale to quantify the strength of drugs and the determination in advance of the most critical days of a patient's illness.[138] Al-Razi (Rhazes) discovered measles and smallpox, and in his Doubts about Galen, proved Galen's humorism false.[126]


Abu al-Qasim (Abulcasis) helped lay the foudations for modern surgery,[139] with his Kitab al-Tasrif, in which he invented numerous surgical instruments, including the first instruments unique to women,[140] as well as the surgical uses of catgut and forceps, the ligature, surgical needle, scalpel, curette, retractor, surgical spoon, sound, surgical hook, surgical rod, and specula,[141] and bone saw.[74] Ibn al-Haytham (Alhacen) made important advances in eye surgery, as he correctly explained the process of sight and visual perception for the first time in his Book of Optics.[140]



The Persian scientist Avicenna introduced experimental medicine, discovered contagious diseases, introduced quarantine and clinical trials, and described many anaesthetics and medical and therapeutic drugs, in The Canon of Medicine.Ibn Sina (Avicenna) helped lay the foundations for modern medicine,[142] with The Canon of Medicine, which was responsible for introducing systematic experimentation and quantification in physiology,[143] the discovery of contagious disease, introduction of quarantine to limit their spread, introduction of experimental medicine, evidence-based medicine, clinical trials,[144] randomized controlled trials,[145][146] efficacy tests,[147][148] and clinical pharmacology,[149] the first descriptions on bacteria and viral organisms,[150] distinction of mediastinitis from pleurisy, contagious nature of tuberculosis, distribution of diseases by water and soil, skin troubles, sexually transmitted diseases, perversions, nervous ailments,[135] use of ice to treat fevers, and separation of medicine from pharmacology.[140]


Ibn Zuhr (Avenzoar) was the earliest known experimental surgeon.[151] In the 12th century, he was responsible for introducing the experimental method into surgery, as he was the first to employ animal testing in order to experiment with surgical procedures before applying them to human patients.[152] He also performed the first dissections and postmortem autopsies on humans as well as animals.[153]


Ibn al-Nafis laid the foundations for circulatory physiology,[154] as he was the first to describe the pulmonary circulation[155] and coronary circulation,[156][157] which form the basis of the circulatory system, for which he is considered "the greatest physiologist of the Middle Ages."[158] He also described the earliest concept of metabolism,[159] and developed new systems of physiology and psychology to replace the Avicennian and Galenic systems, while discrediting many of their erroneous theories on humorism, pulsation,[160] bones, muscles, intestines, sensory organs, bilious canals, esophagus, stomach, etc.[161]


Ibn al-Lubudi rejected the theory of humorism, and discovered that the body and its preservation depend exclusively upon blood, women cannot produce sperm, the movement of arteries are not dependent upon the movement of the heart, the heart is the first organ to form in a fetus' body, and the bones forming the skull can grow into tumors.[162] Ibn Khatima and Ibn al-Khatib discovered that infectious diseases are caused by microorganisms which enter the human body.[163] Mansur ibn Ilyas drew comprehensive diagrams of the body's structural, nervous and circulatory systems.[5]



[edit] Physics
Main article: Islamic physics
The study of experimental physics began with Ibn al-Haytham,[164] a pioneer of modern optics, who introduced the experimental scientific method and used it to drastically transform the understanding of light and vision in his Book of Optics, which has been ranked alongside Isaac Newton's Philosophiae Naturalis Principia Mathematica as one of the most influential books in the history of physics,[165] for initiating a scientific revolution in optics[166] and visual perception.[167]


The experimental scientific method was soon introduced into mechanics by Biruni,[168] and early precursors to Newton's laws of motion were discovered by several Muslim scientists. The law of inertia, known as Newton's first law of motion, and the concept of momentum were discovered by Ibn al-Haytham (Alhacen)[169][170] and Avicenna.[171][172] The proportionality between force and acceleration, considered "the fundamental law of classical mechanics" and foreshadowing Newton's second law of motion, was discovered by Hibat Allah Abu'l-Barakat al-Baghdaadi,[173] while the concept of reaction, foreshadowing Newton's third law of motion, was discovered by Ibn Bajjah (Avempace).[174] Theories foreshadowing Newton's law of universal gravitation were developed by Ja'far Muhammad ibn Mūsā ibn Shākir,[175] Ibn al-Haytham,[176] and al-Khazini.[177] Galileo Galilei's mathematical treatment of acceleration and his concept of impetus[178] was enriched by the commentaries of Avicenna[171] and Ibn Bajjah to Aristotle's Physics as well as the Neoplatonist tradition of Alexandria, represented by John Philoponus.[179]

I wish you had wagered with me. I would just simply ask that you wear Abaya, take shahada, make salah and send us the video on Nairaland.

@$Osisi: Just to play with the numbers: Read below;

"Then the men and women got up and left. The Messenger of God consummated his marriage with me in my house when I was nine years old. Neither a camel nor a sheep was slaughtered on behalf of me", (The Prophet) married her three years before the Emigration, when she was seven years old and consummated the marriage when she was nine years old, after he had emigrated to Medina in Shawwal. She was eighteen years old when he died.

7 + 3 + after (how many years) migration to Madina = 9? My lady, read your post, again.

I remember that I asked you many years ago to tell me if she was born before her father accepted Islam? That will give us the reality of her age. Muhammad (AS) was born in the year of the people of the Elephant attempt to invade the Precinct of Kaaba. Thats a land mark.

The beginning of Islam is another land mark, 40 years after the people of the Elephant. How old was Aisha when Islam began? Hijra/migration of her father in the company of the Prophet (AS) was another land mark. Was her marriage already consumated,then? Or when was irt consumated relative to Hijra of the Prophet (AS)?


Like for me, my birth, if there was not calender, the indepence of Nigeria away from the British, though partially by name only, is a land mark. It either I was befoer or after it and by how many years, so that you can calculate my age.


The Civil unrest of the '66 resulting the first military coup and take over is another. So those whose birth are around that period have their land mark.

Now my lady, argue with me with gusto, but find the time Aisha was born relative to the start of islam, since her father accept Islam in that same year, almost as immediately as it started! For sure he was the first male adult to accept islam, even before Abbass and hamzah who were Uncles of the prophet!

@Backslider:

Ok good who was with muhamd to make sure that he was not being deceived by a false spirit.

Who was with Moses for the same exact reason you quoted above? Now, since I know that you care less about Moses, anyway, and all your hope was on Jesus of the Bible, I ask you the same question as above that you asked about Muhammad (AS)?

Folks, watch how he is going to trip over himself. Then am gonna cream him! I hope he remembers about the Satan (bad jinn/Devil) whispering in the ear of Jesus, at least three times. Watch this dude or anyone, who have the gull to attempt this booby trap!

@$Osisi:

Olabowole,my only response to your defence of incest and pedophilia calling your hadith writers liars is this

I asked you to give us your professional description of the person who is a possible pedophile. Or give us the characteristics of a pedophile. You ave not done so. Yet i know you know its not in the character of Muhammad (AS)!

I ask you now that you throw incest into the mix, if Aam and Eve were incestious? Or their children who married from the pool of their brothers and sisters? Or their own children who defnitely married from the cousin pool?

I now asked if the Royal families of Europe are incestious since they are still marrying cousins, even now? How about Abraham and his half sister Sarah? How about somewhere in the blodlines of Isaac grandchildren? I gave you assortment of people and time to choose from, sandwiching the time of Muhammad (AS) between these periods?


Can you blame Muhammad and not blame at least one of the two periods; before or after his time? Are you an african woman more christian than the people of Europe who brought Christianity to ou? I hope you will say yes, because I am going to use it against you on the matter of God consciousness of the Muslims versus the Christians (Quran aversus Bible). You see, I want to set you up and trap you with your own words. lol.


What about the wager? Are you gonna take me up on it?

sleek29 calls every female girl. Mr. Ciility or civilization.

What is civilazation? Please define it and you will find the imprint of Islam. Europe did not take shower, until islam taught them. They did not know how to use cutleries, either until Islam educated them.


You sleek29, I am certain dont know how to wipe yourself clean. And your cloth; undergarments and pants can't be devoid of urine! You stand and you shake and you are unmindful of the remaining droplets that socked your pants. lol.

How civilized can you be, man.