₦airaland Forum

spongeisback:
SIX bible verses and NON did Jacob redeem the 10 Percent vow he made. Please how is building an altar performing his vow? Come on you can do better than this.
1) he promised to give a tenth
2) God said anoint the pillar where thou vowest to me as a reminder.
3) go to bethel and make an altar
4) he went to bethel and made an altar
5) he built an altar

So where was it written that he gave the tenth he promised.

He fulfilled all together. Are you insinuating he didn't fulfill his vow

javakind:
first of all i will like to say that Daddy Freeze has a point about tithe and other Issues etc

Daddy freez has no point . He played on the intelligence of those who don't know their bible .

Tithe is given to God . For the welfare of workers and ministers

Leviticus 27:30
And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the Lord's: it is holy unto the Lord.

You can see from the verse above that this has nothing to do with eating or drinking or giving the poor . It is exclusively for the use in Gods house.

But God also ask the people to use another 10% for the poor every 3 years and another 10% for feast and . Now Daddy freeze omitted this verse of the exclusive one for God and manipulated the scripture as though tithe is for the poor

plainbibletruth:
You just keep quoting Bible verses one after the other without showing how they relate to tithing.

How can you say that? Any open EYED person should see the relationship except deliberately ignored or seeing from different color

I pointed out to you that, 1 Corinthians 9:13-14 talks about the administration of what is received from givers and NOT about HOW TO GIVE and that you apply scriptures properly.

Jesus instructed Paul that the way the priests receive sustainsnce should be the way ministers should be sustained . How did the priests get welfare . Tithes and offering

That's one such passages you just quote as if quoting a scripture portion amounts to it being relevant.

VERY DID

particularly the 'spiritual principles' thing?

Why would Paul quote the law for saints

The priesthood of Christ is not the priesthood of Melchizedek. The priesthood of Christ is not the CONTINUATION of that of Melchizedek. The priesthood of Christ stands alone as superior and over and above every other priesthood that has ever existed. Take time to STUDY the book of Hebrews CAREFULLY

Prove it . Christ dies t have his own order . Christ is priest in the order of Melchizedek. Many bible scholars even believe and teach that Christ was Melchizedek.The encounter with Abraham was seen as one of the christophany of the Old Testament

Did the NT not talk about prayer, sexual immorality, etc? Common, man!

Did the NT not talk about minister welfare just like the Old Testament parallel etc common man!

You're looking for the word tithe , I'm looking fir the word incest . On what ground can you counsel a brother not to marry his younger sister ?

For example, was every believer a priest under the Mosaic Law? Is every believer a priest under the Church Age?

It's not a New teaching . He was only quoting from the law . These are eternal principles

Exodus 19:6
And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

When you now begin to talk of MISSING MANUSCRIPTS then I'm AFRAID you're treading on VERY SLIPPERY GROUNDS! I do hope you know that.

I agree . But you know many manuscripts are minsding . Just supposing a manuscript is found and such is there What will you say . But you're right let's make do with what is available .

Could it be that some anti-tithers made those manuscripts disappear? Lol!!

It's part of Collateral Damage . Let's forget I said it

spongeisback:
You're always littering this section with biblical verses.

I deserve commendation . Bible verse is better than abuses

Now is the time I need that your purple colored comments more

Show me where Jacob redeemed his vow in the bible.

you don't need purple verses to know that Jacob did his vow Except you want to get legalistic . Every bible scholar knows God doesn't joke with vows and covenant . The sentence of such is death. Moses almost got killed by God for not fulfilling circumcusion of his son as God and Abraham agreed.


Ecclesiastes 5:6
Suffer not thy mouth to cause thy flesh to sin; neither say thou before the angel, that it was an error: wherefore should God be angry at thy voice, and destroy the work of thine hands?


JACOB VOWED "

Genesis 28:21-22
So that I come again to my father's house in peace; then shall the Lord be my God: And this stone, which I have set for a pillar, shall be God's house: and of all that thou shalt give me I will surely give the tenth unto thee.

GOD REMINDED HIM

Genesis 31:13
I am the God of Bethel, where thou anointedst the pillar, and where thou vowedst a vow unto me: now arise, get thee out from this land, and return unto the land of thy kindred.

GOD COMMADED HIM TO GO AND PERFORM IT

Genesis 35:1-4
And God said unto Jacob, Arise, go up to Bethel, and dwell there: and make there an altar unto God, that appeared unto thee when thou fleddest from the face of Esau thy

JACOB INFORMED HIS HOUSEHOLD HIS INTENTION

Genesis 35:3
And let us arise, and go up to Bethel; and I will make there an altar unto God, who answered me in the day of my distress, and was with me in the way which I went.

JACOB PERFORMED HIS VOW

Genesis 35:6-7
So Jacob came to Luz, which is in the land of Canaan, that is, Bethel, he and all the people that were with him. And he built there an altar, and called the place Elbethel: because there God appeared unto him, when he fled from the face of his brother.

Goshen360:
Smh....do you people just enjoy just quoting scriptures or what? do you ask the holy spirit questions when you study scriptures?

What those scriptures mean? The law is holy....does it make you or us holy? The law is spiritual....does it make you or us spiritual? You have to question what you read in order to understand it. Read from verse 1 and see how Paul completely dismissed the law.

He can't dismiss the law for its content . You can only dismiss the law on the ground of righteousness and justification. the law isn powerless to regenerate . But the law reveals the mind of God on what is right and wrong. without the knowledge of the law we will not know what offend God. sin is transgression of the law of God. Paul would not have a bases to condemn homosexuality if it were not spelt out in the law. we should not demonise the law of God.every area the law is condemned it has to do with the wrong use to be made righteous by it

Joshbillionz:
��������� You will not kill me lol .. Wait please repeat what you said about loveworld ���� Please interprete christ embassy tooo���... You see i got healed by what you call fake ..

tpls kindly tell them

spongeisback:
evidence that Jacob redeem his vow.

He did

Wrong ! Principles of faith are from genesis to revelation

Goshen360:
No, Petra1 is confused,

Wrong THOU ART!

jumping from levitical tithe to Abraham just whenever it's okay and convenient as long as he can win an argument. He will make reckless statement like "tithe is tithe". Ask him is Abraham tithe same as Levitical tithe? He goes....it's the same principles ....lmbo � � �

Because the principle cut Accross . You can if we should give offering according to Levi or Abel . The process may differ . The point is OFFERING GOES WITH WORSHIP . Don’t be legalistic. Looking for for comas and colon . But the big picture

Satan gradualism is on . He only starts with tithe, very soon offering , church Service , one world religion

Awesome write up

Tithes and offerings are eternal principles . Anyone who feels 10% is too legalistic should give more

menxer:
You want to follow the law? you don't cherry pick

You don’t believe in the content of the law ? Don’t cherry pick

asuustrike2009:
Did the Bible say we shouldn't pay tithe? How can you use Hebrew 7 to end to validate a point were nothing of such was clearly stated there

The message of Hebrew 7 is simple . To let us know that the priest hood of christ is higher than levitical priesthood . Priesthood of christ is in the order of Melchizedek who initiated tithing . And it unending priesthood . Eternal priesthood . Tithing priesthood .

Goshen360:
Ok.....give me time and lemme put it together for you.

Vs 5....commandment to take tithe was GIVEN TO LEVITES ONLY....right?

Vs 16...... Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, .....

Vs 18.....

18For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof. 19For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God. 20And inasmuch as not without an oath he was made priest:

You can argue that....I'm not making this up but showing you scripture context....

What commandment is vs 18 talking about? well, go back to the context because he already mentioned TWO "commandments" GOING BEFORE....those are the commandment disannulling ACCORDINGTO THE LAW

Romans 7:12
12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

Romans 7:14
14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.


There is difference between the law as an institution and the content of the law . There are content done away in christ and there are content that are spiritual principles .

plainbibletruth:
The New Testament had different occasions when Christians gave. The Apostles gave INSTRUCTIONS at different times on giving.

Kindly back it up with scripture . I’m only aware of the major project of raising money for saints in Judea.

NOT ONCE did the issue of tithes or mandatory giving in any other form come up or was mentioned. If there were no mentions of giving at all then it may be possible to assume that the Christian could fall back on any old system. But giving was mentioned in different places. Direction as to how give was also given.

Why will they be raising issues about tithe when there was never a scripture that condemns it . Same as incest or offering . It’s a life style . Maybe I was wrong but the only giving project in the epistles that I’m aware of was collection for saints . Of course I know that there would be other giving not stated

In Galatians 2:10 Paul said: "All they asked was that we should continue to remember the poor, the very thing I had been eager to do all along." How come when the other Apostles raised this with Paul he never once wrote, in all he wrote about raising money and administering it either for the poor or others, about tithing?

How come they didn’t tell him about fornicatuon and adultery ? Prayer and fasting ? Does it mean they are not important . The fact that such weren’t mentioned nullifies them ? We are trying to condemn tithe on the ground of being legalistic we are doing the same by being legalistic in argument Demanding irrelevant comas and semi colons .Somebody will soon say water baptism is legality , inward change is what counts .or Going to church is legality

It should be rather strange that in the midst of instructions about raising money whether for 'special projects' like you put it or for " saints in Jerusalem during the economic crisis" like you said, no mention of "TITHES" came up at all. Not once!

It shouldn’t be a ground . There are many things that didn’t show up ether . The kingdom of God is still one and As long they are not shadow that is fulfilled in christ the principle applies . There is only one scripture . The Torah . That’s what the early church had.. Why would paul be quoting the law for the church in his epistle . Have you asked ?

The only conclusion that a Bible student can come to is that we have sufficient information in the New Testament which shows that the Christian is not obligated to pay tithe

There is no scripture to back this claim . We could have said the church can marry siblings . If we keep taking advantage of silent areas. Supposing such were mentioned in some missing manuscript ? Only the shadows of christ were done away .

BTW, 1 Corinthians 9:13-14 talks about the administration of what is received from givers NOT about HOW TO GIVE. Please apply scriptures properly.

The giving the Bible teaches us is tithes and offerings which are given in worship of God for the work of Ministry . There is no replacement for them ever mentioned inscriptures

wolesmile:
For your mind, you've defended your pastor now o, abi? Continue being the mugu...

e don pain you well well, sorry. . .

2 Timothy 2:3
Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ *()*

In Christianity, we have a solid front in Christ. The Spirit of God, through the Apostle Paul, referenced this in Colossians 2:5 (AMPC). It says,

“For though I am away from you in body, yet I am with you in spirit, delighted at the sight of your [standing shoulder to shoulder in such] orderly array and the firmness and the SOLID FRONT AND STEADFASTNESS OF YOUR FAITH IN CHRIST [that leaning of the entire human personality on Him in absolute trust and confidence in His power, wisdom, and goodness].” In the face of daunting challenges and oppositions, we don’t chicken out or give in; rather, we face them head-on, because we’re bold and courageous. We’re victors in Christ Jesus.

It baffles the spiritually unlearned how we’re able to face challenges, dire crises in life and still be aglow in the spirit, full of joy and exuberant with praise to the Lord. It’s because we’ve come to know that, come what may, our victory is inevitable. We’re destined to always win. We’re never disadvantaged. Jesus said, “These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world” (John 16:33).

Those who don’t stand their ground, with a solid front in the midst of trouble have ignored the Word and walk in fear and unbelief. But that’s not God’s will for you. The real Christian life isn’t one of struggle, failure or defeat; it’s a life of ever-increasing glory, and our challenges are as bread. The Bible calls the crises we face a “light affliction,” because we’re born to overcome: “For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory” (2 Corinthians 4:17).

Nothing, in life or death, was designed to defeat you. Therefore, be strong. Be tough. Endure hardness as a good soldier of Jesus Christ. Keep your head high; square your shoulders. No matter what’s going on in your life or around you, maintain your faith in the Word of God and win.

wolesmile:
Wait o!
Shebi that is the sea of Galilee. Why don't they just step unto the sea and walk on water to show us what great powers lie in whatever name they believe in.

Jesus walked on water because he couldn’t get a boat. THEY HAVE A BOAT!

plainbibletruth:
I believe when the Apostles wrote they were CONVINCED that they were communicating the MIND OF CHRIST.

Their APOSTOLIC OFFICE and the special ministry of the Holy Spirit in their lives guaranteed that INSPIRATION.

For example, when Apostle John wrote the book of Revelations did he think was 'simply' writing his vision or did he believe he was communicating the message of Christ? When Paul emphatically declared that if anyone preached a different gospel other than the one the Apostles presented that such a one be accursed, was he merely expressing his opinion or was he CERTAIN that he was declaring the mind of Christ?

The principle of GIVING handed down to the New Testament believer is this:
"Each of you should give what you have decided in your heart to give, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver." 2 Corinthians 9: 7.

Freewill giving, in whatever proportion the individual believer decides is the PRINCIPLE of giving under the New Covenant.

The scripture you quoted has to do with vows made for saints in Jerusalem during the economic crisis . Of course it’s a feee will giving but Free will is not a New Testament giving . It’s part of the different givings in the Old Testament as well.

Deuteronomy 23:23
23 That which is gone out of thy lips thou shalt keep and perform; even a freewill offering, according as thou hast vowed unto the Lord thy God, which thou hast promised with thy mouth.

So the verse you quoted 2cor 9:7 was just a special offering raised for a specific project . To gather money for saints in Jerusalem . It’s only a kind of giving . There are different giving in God’s kingdom . Such as alm , tithe , offering etc . Free will offering was from the Old Testament as well as other giving .

From what has been FREELY given the needs of full time ministers can be met as well as others' needs in within the Body of Christ e.g. the poor.

As explained above that was for a specific project just like under the law. God gave the parallel principle of tithe for the Church .

1 Corinthians 9:13-14
Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar? Elhven so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

spongeisback:
I am a child of Abraham. Dear pastors wait till I win a war then I will pay tithe like my father Abraham did. Amen. Genesis 14:18-20.....

Jacob was a child of Abraham also but still gave tithes .without going to battle

nicemuyoo:
From the defination of tithe of you read your bible very well tithe are agricultural produce specifically from land of Isreal. They are not wages as in money paid workers. Even the scribes and Pharisees only tithe agricultural produce. Fish produce is not acceptable as tithe.

analize701:
Is the bone of contention here Tithe Paying or the token? If i pay Tithe with Yams will i be doing the right thing?

Nice question. Besides God gave room for money to be given in place of unacceptable things . Also people still have option for cash

plainbibletruth:
The What About So and So Argument

An argument tithers bring up is:
What about so and so; where does the New Testament say we should not do it?

Petra1 is one of the proponents of this position.

The reasoning is that if the NT does not CLEARLY speak against it then why should anyone say it's no longer applicable to the Christian.

For example; where does the New Testament talk about incest.

I love you for this . At least somebody understands my point . At least admits to .

The answer is actually simple. The EPISTLES will give us clear direction that will enable the Christian KNOW which issues are KEY for his spiritual life under the New Covenant.

Epistles only address issues they had problem with. Epistles was not a new bible . The Bible they had which psul told Timothy to study is the Old Testament .

The essential elements of God’s law and the issue of sin nature have been there from the beginning. So, it should not be strange for something in a past system to be included in the New. Nevertheless, the prerogative to do so rests ONLY on the Law-giver who is God.

Good .

God had his law for Adam. God had his law for Israel. The details must have differed, particularly as regards some REGULATIONS. Some essential things may remain but there were areas of differences. God EXPECTED Adam to STICK to what he PRESCRIBED for him. The same with Israel. If any Israelite, during the age of Israel, decided that he was ignoring the Mosaic Law to go back to what obtained during the previous age he would be walking in DISOBEDIENCE.

Beautiful

God's CONTRACT for today, tenable in the Supreme Court of heaven for today's Christian is THE NEW COVENANT IN CHRIST JESUS. It is NOT the Mosaic Law or anything before it.

Just as a contract that has LAPSED cannot be tendered in Court and stand before a Judge, the Christian cannot tender any good works based on the OLD CONTRACTS and receive God's approval for it.

Where anything that is ESSENTIAL from the old systems is INCLUDED in this new contract, the Christian is OBLIGATED to obey.

I agree with you still but we are looking at principles which cut across . For example we had had different constitutions but murder will always be a crime universally .

Jesus Christ summed the Law in love for God and love for others. This was again EMPHASISED in the epistles. This means then that because it is HIGHLIGHTED in the epistles it is CRITICAL and OBLIGATORY on the Christian.

So, let's say a sin is not SPECIFICALLY mentioned by name in the NT but there is a mention of its CATEGORY then it should be easy to then, by application, know that under the New Covenant such a thing is still applicable.

For example, if a particular sexual sin is not listed in the NT but sexual immorality is CONDEMNED, it should be clear then that the condemnation of sexual immorality applies to such sin.

The same way if tithe not not mentioned Specifically yet the principle is revealed .

1 Corinthians 9:13-14
Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar? Elhven so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

Biblical documentations:

Romans 13:8-10
8 Owe no one anything, except to love each other, for the one who loves another has fulfilled the law. 9 For the commandments, “You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not covet,” and any other commandment, are summed up in this word: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 10 Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Romans 7: 4
"So, my brothers and sisters, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, that you might belong to another, to him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God."

Romans 8: 12
"Therefore, brothers and sisters, we have an obligation—but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it."

If you say the new law is love . Firstly Jesus taught it under the law just as he said it tithe under the law. Secondly he said love God . Which includes giving to him .


Mark 12:17
And Jesus answering said unto them, Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's. And they marvelled at him.

I used to give 20% for tithe before . There are some others who even do more as tithe . But I reverted to 10% after listening to a preaching . If God says 10% make it 10% no more no less.

Jesusgirl92:
bolded... His house rent is more important than his love for the poor.... But when paying tithe is involved, you remember the poor...

Most people who criticize against others concerning the poor don’t really care the poor .
The people who care for the poor don’t really talk . They just do.

John 12:4-6 (NLT)
4 But Judas Iscariot, the disciple who would soon betray him, said, 5 “That perfume was worth a year’s wages. It should have been sold and the money given to the poor.” 6 Not that he cared for the poor—he was a thief, and since he was in charge of the disciples’ money, he often stole some for himself.

superior1:
That demon has already got you marked and wont back out without a fight, are you a Christian?

Such threatening spirits only want us to back down from the case . We only need to fortify ourselves to deal with it .

OkaiCorne:
Nice dodging there...so I guess tithing is of a weightier matter than where I'll put my head to sleep abi?

So you can’t sacrifice your house rent for a poor man in emergency ?.I thought you love the poor .

Can you please answer the question I asked you on tithing?

Which one? Kindly as again

Abi wisdom is no longer profitable to direct?

You don’t have to be silly

Is tithing your number 1 priority in life?

No it’s not . I give tithe , offerings , alms and seed unto God . All have to be done .
What about you ?

bloodofthelamb:
INCEST IS A SIN BECAUSE THE LAW OF GOD SAYS SO. BUT THE LAW CANNOT STOP US FROM SINNING.

At least one honest person speaks

Satan is so desperate. Hence all these attacks on the church .thats not a pastor and That picture was taken in a studio .

OkaiCorne:
Dear Tithers,

If I am to love both God and man, and I involve my earnings in sacrificial giving ( "tithes" included...) have I broken the basic requirements of the new covenant...which is to love God and Man?

Your statement not clear

Will anyone here claim he or she is serving God, and would see a dying Orphan or widow...and yet still pay tithes at the expense of saving the life of someone created in God's image?

If tithe payment and saving the Life of an Orphan is a mutually exclusive option...out of LOVE, what will you do?

Why is it tithe that is always used for such illustration ? Why not your house rent ?

plainbibletruth:
His new thrust is to ask about incest as if that equates with their mandatory tithing and appearing not to see how it's been dealt with for the Christian.

Why hasn’t someone answered me. I can assure you it will clear this mountain before us.