₦airaland Forum

Miscellanous: Toshmann you guys should stop insulting people with different views

And where did I insult you?

biolabee: I heard about the woman that spoke for ten hours
Wat exactly was the issue n this 20 week limit
Is it Good thing or a bad thing

Bc unborn babies no fit talk na, they can't form their own movement.

Heheeeee

Miscellaneous lol, just registered to nairaland, jumped into the thread
Yawa don gas

99cent is truly entertaining

davidylan: i couldnt even respond to her post. I had no idea what she was talking about. She just seems to be posting sha... no regard for logical flow.

Haha
She say you follow for those anti feminists wey go burn some women for Kenya

FBI is coming!
Get ready

[quote author=I.Joan]Feminism lost its meaning along the way!...
If I was an adult in the 60's I would have fought for women's rights because it made sense then and it was a just cause with a well defined meaning!
But now, what exactly are you fighting for?
... It's all garbage!!!
Nothing is stopping any woman from doing anything she wants to do now! So, what are you actually fighting for?[/quote]Your answer is loading. . . . . . . . .!

99cent: ok. good for you. what do u mean by "our silence"?
I don't see u being silent here. you are as anti-feminist as they come. I bet you could have been one of those men burning the old women in Kenya for being "witches". *puke*

Lolololol
Davidylan FBI is coming after you

davidylan: you mean we are going to be herding women to gas chambers next? Now this thread has devolved into desperate mudslinging.

Lol

[quote author=I.Joan]Why associate with something that is unnecessary?
Most people are indifferent to feminism (and not necessarily anti-feminists) because what you claim to fight for is not necessary here...
Both men and women have equal rights in my environment!

I will respect you guys if you move to India, Saudi Arabia..etc and fight for women instead of fighting men online![/quote]Saudi Arabia

Now that is where feminists are needed
Abeg make una no go there o.

[quote author=I.Joan]Sis...
You've to do away with the name-calling to be taken seriously!!![/quote]I wish you luck

99cent:
also, are men supposed to dress 'ugly'? all people, male or female, should dress neatly.
besides the emphasis that women should spend a lot of time looking good wasn't always that way. there are periods in history when men put more focus on their looks than women. in fact, men in the 16th century europe are known to wear heels and fashionable clothes and wigs. u can see the remnants of this tradition in the wigs judges wear in courts and even in renaissance oil paintings.

the point is that women should be able to decide for themselves how they want to look. In puritan societies, in fact, women are banned from wearing make-up, jewelry or looking "good". they are forced to dress very plainly and drab.
this is also a way of repressing women by enforcing societal code of dressing or appearance on them. there are many ways to repress women.
else, how would u explain that in some societies women are pressured to look good. whereas in other societies, women have to look plain. keep in mind, no rule whatsoever applies to men who can look however they want!

gender roles are social constructs (man made) NOT biological.

Toshmann
Girl you know there's no law against dressing how you want to dress. So quit complaining and go shopping, pick anything you want and wear it. Nothing stops you. Stop complaining, that's all I'm saying. If you hate lipsticks, there is no law that says you must wear lipstick. Haba!

99cent
this is the same argument pro-rapists make. when a girl is Molested, they blame it on the girl and say things like "why weren't you covering up in a burqa" or "why were you walking down the street by yourself without a chaperone" etc. the Molester or intimate abuser goes scot free in Africa and may be even praised by other males .society condones intimate exploits by males and condemns women for the same. Africa as a continent has the highest rate of sexua.l violence in the world.
Molesting a woman is against the law. If anyone is found guilty he's going to jail regardless of whether the victim was wearing seductive clothes or not.

Toshmann
You want to be a man yet you can separate laws from talk. As far as the law is concerned if anyone is guilty of molestation he's a goner. Don't bother yourself with what bystanders say about the victim's clothes. It's called freedom of speech. Deal with it.

99cent
when there is a government and rule of law, males that impregnate women will be forced to bear responsibility in form of child support and other means. this is enforced in western countries. that's why women can wear whatever clothes they want and there is no intimate repression for women in western countries. they are not made to feel ashamed of their sex. men are held to the same level of responsibility.

toshmann
There's no law that stops you from seducing, sleeping with and getting pregnant for whichever man you like. Obviously you don't know the effect a woman's body has on a man. Because you are a woman. But since you feminists just want trouble, there is no law that stops you from seducing men.

also there is such thing as condoms, birth control pills, and abortions.

Toshmann
now I love condoms , dont like abortions though. It's the killing of unborn babies. I'm sorry but it's illegal to do that in Nigeria. You want feminism, I want human rights. Those unborn babies have the right to life too.

99cent
why are girls under pressure to get married? again you use the word girls and men on the same level.
are we still living in a world where 50yr old men marry 15yr old girls?
also, fertility rate and sexism have high correlation just so you know. if you visit a society where women are giving birth to 4-10 kids per woman, the level of sexism and horrible treatment of women will be much higher than societies where average number of kids per woman in around 2 kids (western countries!). that says a LOT.

Toshmann
again there's no law that forces women to get married. Stop worrying about what society expects from you and start worrying about what you want to do with yourself if its not illegal. No law says you must have 20kids. You decide with your husbands. Stop complaining.

99cent
can you post that statistic for me to see?
and who told you men "lead" in relationships? behind closed doors, at least 50% of relationships are led by women (all things being equal ex finances) leadership is mostly a personality trait. not a gender trait. Maybe in Africa where women are repressed and forced to act "meek" but if we went by nature, leadership will show in equal rates between men and women. ex. men who show leadership seen as leaders. whereas women who show leadership seen as "bitchy"
again, sexism at play.

Toshmann
Okay, there's no law that says men must lead in a relationship. When you meet your man, you can lead. If it works, hallelujah. The most important thing is what works, not what society expects or what Toshmann says. Quit complaining and start living

99cent
again, this is the pro-Molester argument you are making. a man is allowed to sit comfortably while a woman is made to assume contortions that very uncomfortable just to "protect" herself from men.
if urinating upwards is the most comfortable position for a woman to urinate. then YES women should urinate upwards. This is not about women becoming men. but about women gaining basic common sense rights that are withheld from them in sexist societies.

Toshmann
I hope you know there's no law that stops women from urinating upwards. I, Toshmann the great, will love to see women legs up trying to pee upwards

99cent
true. no one is asking that women become men. just challenging sexism which exists in our society.
may men don't want it. why should they? they are benefiting from the system and they will fight to protect the status quo.

toshmann
There's no law that establishes all you are complaining about. It's like me complaining that I'm in New York but I want to be in New Jersey. When all I could do was cross the Hudson River. Quit complaining and start living. Emancipate yourself from mental incarceration.

Nothing you complained about is established by any law. Yes, society has expectations. But if you don't like the expectation of the society all you need to do is do your own thing. As a young black man d'you know this society expects me to be a bad person? But I'm not bad and I'm not complaining. All I did was be good, go to school, be a great guy and hammer my girlfriends

Why don't you join us to fight for human rights. There issues like racism, domestic violence, equal protection under the law are addressed.

I rest my case. God bless y'all
(Modify) (Quote) (Report) 3 Likes
truth hurts

A piece from page 3. Interesting piece

[quote author=I.Joan]What sane rights are you actually clamoring for that the law has not taken care of?[/quote]I promise you wil NEVER get any straight answer for this question.

You were the one who actually did the name-calling(a female misogynist)just because I didn't support your views!
I am not a Feminist because it has been taken to the extreme and so, does not make sense anymore! They seem lost and don't know what they are fighting for!

Lolololol

You sound like the atheists I argue with 'I am a christian because i don't read books'
Reading is not my favorite hobby because I prefer to code

I actually tried to read Chimamanda's books but like you I got bored and couldn't finish it!

I've never read any of her books bc I'm more in love with history than any other thing. But I admire chimamanda anyways, I like her confidence but I don't always agree with her.
I don't think chimamanda resorts to name calling to make her points

fellis: So davidylan are you saying cancer cells have the same DNA as the carrier or are you saying their DNA is different? Which is it?
Because I have never in my life heard that cancer cells have the same DNA as the carrier, this is very fantastic information indeed.

It's the same DNA that just underwent some distortion but its basically the same DNA.

The fetus on the other hand has completely different DNA from the mother, different blood cells that don't mix.
It's a completely different individual.

99cent: you keep mentioning prevention as if u are trying to say something but ashamed to say. say what is on your mind. what do you mean by "prevention"
who should prevent rap.e? the ra.ped woman?
say it loud and proud what you mean by "PREVENTION" blame the woman outfront rather than trying to use lame codes.

again, refer to the republican rap.e advisory list.

Prevention of unwanted pregnancy

1. Abstinence, if that fails
2.use a condom, if that fails
3. Use OCPs, if that fails
4. Go to an expert after unprotected se-x

If ra.pe.d ; abuse; inc-est;
1.Seek immediate medical attention
2. Ask for help.

Is this difficult?

fellis: So is cancer. It also has different DNA.
The fetus is physically and biologically connected to the mother with her own blood and food circulating through it. If you swallow a tablet full of DNA that is different than yours it won't mean there's another human inside of your stomach now.
If you catch a flu, will you not take medicine to essenitally kill it? After all, the virus has different DNA.
What about roundworms which are parasites living inside your body? They have different DNA and living systems too

Okay, now you compare a healthy God made fetus to cancer! Viruses! And Parasites!
Ebelebe!

What's the weather like in Utopia?

Kinda cloudy

Seriously anyone who cares could donate to orphanages and life in some orphanages are better than life in some hoods or some african or 3rd world countries.

We are not sure of anything but the possibilty of the child getting an excellent upbringing is definitely lower than the possibility of their having a rough life in future. Children who are given up for adoption or put in motherless babies homes (especially in nigeria), more often than not, have poor upbringing and they usually live a life of lack.
Some people even look for such children to use for their disgusting fetish rituals.
I would rather women had abortions than brought unwanted children into the world to be abused and neglected.

You can't use pessimism as an excuse for murder. I appreciate that it's a difficult situation but ill take it instead of aborting the baby.

Like I said, the keyword is PREVENTION!!!
But if I emphasize that now, feminists would say I'm being unfair to women. If I'm a woman( thank God I'm not) but if I were a woman, I would take measures to prevent unwanted pregnancy. Fact is, if you do the right thing, there's a 99% chance that you will NOT get pregnant when you don't want it.

ckkris: 99.5% of Nigerians support more than 14 years jail for any man wey abandon our sweet and delicious babes go de carry fellow man.
And African women generally don't have time for liberated feminists. Africa man de enjoy that one pass oyinbo them.
I am surprised that a whole you, the grandson of elewe ukwu, has time to argue with women that are no longer women. Our African babes won't take it from you. They have the correct features of womanness, the temperament, and the spirit.
Those that are no longer women please tell me what they have become. FRUSTRATED?

Somebody here knows me o

My brother I'm idle and stuck in my hotel room in New York, I have an early morning flight tomorow back to Ohio so I decided to relax this evening and pass time online instead of stepping out to find free babes around to come rub my back

Oahray: lmao!

So good to find something funny here

Abi o, it's been heated argument and vituperation for pages on end

[quote author=I.Joan]For real? ? ? ?

So, anyone who is not a feminist is a misogynist? ? ?
You seem lonely... Get a dog![/quote]Lol

Smh

Idowuogbo: Lmaooo! Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaga!

My Dindy-Dandi-Handy-Candy gal
Howdy? Been looking for ya

@topic
Guy leave that babe. She no like you.

fellis: A three week old foetus and a one week old foetus cannot even respond to stimulus or feel anything at that stage. I don't know what makes you think their very poorly developed features is what makes them full human beings that should not be killed. besides the baby is still inside the mother's womb, it is actually part of the mother's body and not an individual on its own because it depends on the mother completely for survival.

Depending on the mother for complete survival doesn't mean it's part of the mothers body. It's not. It's a separate individual with its own body systems. Their blood don't mix. Their DNA sample is different.

@bold, I cannot believe that you think subjecting a woman to perpetual pain is actually better than aborting an unborn child. I just cannot wrap my head around your logic. We are talking of a life time of trauma here, the mother takes the child out everyday and people are reminded that she was rayped whenever they see the child, the mother has to raise a child that will be called a bastard by his peers, a child that will always feel inferior to other children because he knows he is just the product of raype that his mother never wanted or planned for.
You honestly believe that ending a pregnancy at 7 months is worse than decades of trauma and stigmatization of both mother and child?

I believe both are terrible situations. But I believe human life is sacrosanct. I also believe that there is a possibility that a woman may find some peace even after a rappe child is born.

And be raised in a neglectful environment where he lives a life of lack and low self esteem?

better than loosing his life. He may also be adopted by a family and grow up in a home. There are many possibilities. I know the odds are bad but I STRONGLY believe it is better than being killed.

True, but in some situations it can't be prevented so pregnancies from raype should be aborted.

I disagree

Who is 'we' exactly?

Anybody that cares

and what makes you so sure those people will raise the child properly in a healthy environment?

We can at least try. We live in a harsh world but we must not fail to try. Nobody is sure of anything.
What makes one sure that the girl/man he/she married will be a nice partner

What makes one sure that the career one chose will work out fine

What makes one sure that things will work out fine in the college one chose to go

We can go on and on

99cent: When Black Feminism Faces The Music, and the Music Is Rap

At present there is only a small platform for black women to address the problems of sexism in rap and in their community. Feminist criticism, like many other forms of social analysis, is widely considered part of a hostile white culture. For a black feminist to chastise misogyny in rap publicly would be viewed as divisive and counterproductive. There is a widespread perception in the black community that public criticism of black men constitutes collaborating with a racist society.

The charge is hardly new. Such a reaction greeted Ntozake Shange's play ''For Colored Girls Who Have Considered Suicide When the Rainbow Is Enuf,'' my own essays, ''Black Macho and the Myth of the Superwoman,'' and Alice Walker's novel ''The Color Purple,'' all of which were perceived as critical of black men. After the release of the film version of ''The Color Purple,'' feminists were lambasted in the press for their supposed lack of support for black men; such critical analysis by black women has all but disappeared. In its place is ''A Black Man's Guide to the Black Woman,'' a vanity-press book by Shahrazad Ali, which has sold more than 80,000 copies by insisting that black women are neurotic, insecure and competitive with black men.

Though misogynist lyrics seem to represent the opposite of Ms. Ali's world view, these are, in fact, just two extremes on the same theme: Ms. Ali's prescription for what ails the black community is that women should not question men about their sexual philandering, and should be firmly slapped across the mouth when they do. Rap lyrics suggest just about the same: women should be silent and prone.

http://www.nytimes.com/1990/07/29/arts/pop-view-when-black-feminism-faces-the-music-and-the-music-is-rap.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm

Why would the black race be the only ones to wash their dirty linen in public. This madness must stop. I don't want to know of the origin of this black vs black war. It is horrible. Enough!

If a black man comes out in public to eviscerate the black woman, and he is ignored, the shame will be his to feed on.
And vice versa. It's enough.
It's hard already being black in America, don't make it worse by beating up on each other.

Oahray: Ok, why is this thread trending after such a long time?

I take credit for reviving the thread. But some other peeps here jointly will take credit for making the thread a trending one

99cent: and then I remember that you are republican. u've sure been listening to what ur fellow republican males have to say about ra.pe:
https://www.alternet.org/files/story_images/gop_rape_advisory_megachart-1.gif

This doesn't mean I agree with them. If you've been reading my posts in this thread you'll know what I feel about rappe and you won't need to bring me this chart.
Just bc I'm republican doesn't mean glen beck or Sarah Palin are my heroes.

99cent: last time I checked, senator wendy williams was a feminist white. not black.
besides, the discussion on this topic is sort of a carryover from another tread created by a misogynist to bash black women and accuse them of raising children out of wedlock as if it was a criminal act to be a single mother. if u click on the politics forum and scroll down, u will see it.
also, black feminism is interesting in the sense that black males assume that its ok for them to be misogynistic since racism is supposedly "bigger" than sexism. therefore women should be fighting against racism for all rather than looking at the sexism in black community. many women fall for this trap hence the reason why nothing has yet been done to, for example, attack and bring down the misogynist attitudes that define what we know as "black music"
and music is just one example. sexism can be found in every single aspect of the culture.

First of all I don't know of the former thread you're talking about. It seems you have a beef with them. I regurgitated this thread which was dead by early June bc I saw my friends itsmodella and Adaobi there. Also I like chimamanda. But looks like you're on a revenge mission

Anyways, I hate it when black guys and black girls fight each other. Other races laugh. I know bc iv been with friends who take me as foriegn and say things about black Americans in front of me that they won't say in front of african Americans but they don't know that my skin color somehow generates a psychological link with african Americans.

They laugh at us when black men and women embarrass themselves online.

You guys should stop it. And I've been guilty of this too. Bc where I am, I've seen more educated black women rising up to marry white men while bashing black men and poor black women boasting of how they manhandle men. I was appalled until I started seeing what black men do to black women online too. It's a shame. We just embarrass ourselves and the whites and Indians and Asians and Latinos just sit back and laugh.

Enough!

fellis: So when exactly does the unborn baby become a 'numan being' that shouldn't be aborted? at what stage of gestation does that happen? two months? three? four?

I don't think anybody has that answer. But there has to be a line somewhere. I know from medical school that at 8weeks the embryo forms, the heart starts forming at 5 weeks!?! (hope I still know my embryology ) so I'll rather put my line somewhere before 3 weeks. Preferably one week. 72hrs safest

I see. So you would rather have the woman bear a child that was a product of rape than for her to abort it? Do you even have any idea how traumatizing raising such a child would be for the woman?
What will she tell her child when he asks who his father is?
Everyday of her life when she goes out with her child, she is stigmatised because people around her know that she was rayped and they are constantly reminded of it whenever they see the child. The memory never goes away, the child acts as a lifelong reminder that the woman was molested.

I cannot pretend that I know exactly how the woman feels but I'm sure it ain't pretty. Now who will speak for the child? This is not a decision I take with joy. It's a hard choice between two evils;
1.destroy the life of the child or
2. Subject the woman into perpetual pain.

You know, either way it's going to be painful but I chose the lesser evil. The woman's pain can be alleviated with time. The child may grow to be a source of joy( who knows tomorow). I've seen documentary on some young adults who were products of rappe in Balkan war bonding well with their mothers. The mother may alas recieve emotional care. There are a lot of options even though I'm no expert in psychiatry or mental health I know there are options that can be tried to help the woman deal with it.
But I do know it will be painful, yes I know, I'm sympathetic. But I'm sympathetic to the child too. If the child is killed there's no remedy. Life lost. I'm pro life.

Also, children borne of raype are not planned for, the mother is likely to not be financially ready to raise that child or take care of it, so what happens then?
Toshmann, are you going to provide money for the mother to care for her child because you believe that pregnacies above 7 months should not be aborted?

The child may be given up for adoption.

Listen, rappe is a terrible situation. There's no good news when one is rapped. The best thing to do here is prevention.

But if it happens, first of all catch the criminal if we can, lock him up and throw away the keys.

Take the woman to hospital to get treatment which included STD treatment and contraception.

If that fails then we must plan to take care of the mother and child.

I don't know what else you want me to say. But PREVENTION is the key

99cent: hahaha @ your first sentence.
all I can picture is a old white male republican looking at herman cain and saying "Now that's my ni*gger talking"

anyway to respond to your post:
marriages break down because some men have not gotten the memo that traditional gender roles are no longer relevant in 2013. women are working just as much as men. yet they are expected to play tradtional roles in the home. this doesn't work. In marriages where men are more supportive and recognize the need of redefined roles, marriages are more successful. of course this is taking place, like I said, among upper middle class whites. marriage rates are going up for them. and as usual, blacks are always the least to catch up. which is ironic because black males have the least ability of any other race to be financially supportive in the family, yet they also choose to be unsupportive domestically. and u wonder why such marriage won't work.

Why is there so much racism in your post. Your posts are just here to bash black men. If you are one of them girls ladies/women/females (I don't know what will offend you there, no vex) that love to bash black men in front of their white boyfriends I wish you luck. But I though we are discussing feminism here.

You've turned the thread into something else. Black males this, whites better, blacks this. Etc

Guess what, you're black. Deal with it. Your children will also be black, deal with it. White people didnt accept Michael Jackson as one of them with all his "white skin" na you dem go accept?

Best you can be is their . . . . .

fellis: @bold, there is no need to get defensive my friend, I actually went through the pages of this thread but I missed the part where you said the thing about therapeutic pregnancies, I didn't ask because I want to argue.

So you have agreed that abortion can be allowed when the women is rayped and when her life is at risk if she gives birth? What about in a situation where the mother is not financially equipped to take care of the child after birth?

Also, It doesn't make any difference if you support abortion of pregnancies due to raype and if you support abortion in any circumstance or situation at all.
Your reason for opposing abortion is because you think it is murder of an innocent life, but don't you also consider abortion by rayped women as murder? Why would you support the killing of innocent children that had nothing to do with the raype or their mother's therapeutic health problems?

In the case of rap-e, my opinion is contraception within 72hrs. At that point there is no fetus, no embryo. It may take the sperm up to 24-72 hrs to move from the cervix/ uterus to the Fallopian tube where fertilization occurs. And even if fertilization occurs, the zygote is not yet defined as a human being. It has no eyes, no respiratory system, no cardiovascular system, no heart, no ears etc. so contraception can be applied at that point.

However if the woman comes after 7months for instance, and starts talking of abprtion of a product of ra.pe I won't accept that.
Same for incest by the way.

[quote author=I.Joan]I really wish women would stop doing this!!! [/quote]Now that's some feminist talking.

But even here I disagree with it. Men and women are not supposed to be competing but complementing each other.

Many marriages breakdown bc there seems to be some sort of conflict from competition within.

99cent: well. go back to the first post on this thread. u will see that chimamanda is talking about black feminism.
whites have advanced to a large extent and still advancing. besides, I assume that we are all black on this topic so why not focus on the koko of the matter

I was obviously blind to the skin color of her argument. Na wa o

what is the link between black incarceration and feminism, you say?
well, u are the one who brought up the idea that black single parent hood is the result of feminism (VERY WRONG assumption by the way)

i did?
dyou mond showing me the post where i made the statement?

and then I countered the argument by saying that black incarceration affects single parenthood much much much more than feminism can even dream of impacting single parenthood
hope u get it now!

Obviously I don't get your point.

My argument against feminism has always been that women are always beefing about something that NO LAW is stopping them from doing!

99cent: i'm still trying to figure out in my head how a homophobic person can claim to be a supporter of gay rights.
hahaha. this is so funny and ironic at the same time.

Ok, I'll help your head figure it out.

Lets take the Jesus example.
A) Jesus hates sin. Right? But Jesus loved sinners that he died for them.

Now here;

I don't like homosexuality. I wouldn't want to be gay. I would t like any member of my family to be gay. BUT I would not block gay community from enjoying their rights as Americans which include eg, the right to serve in the US military, the right to equal opportunities etc. I will not support any discrimination against them. Neither do I support the Nigerian law that wants them locked up for 14yrs.

99cent: ok. so shouldn't we spend more time attacking abusive fathers than we spend attacking single mothers?

there is a high number of black males in jail and involved in criminal activity. don't you think this bears a correlation to why many black childen grow up in single parent household? do you think the women just intentionally decided that "oh I want my child to grow up in the worst possible environment possible"?

Now I see a lot of "black male" this "black man" that in your posts. Are we still discussing or trying to discuss feminism?

If you want to discuss black males and incarceration you can start a thread on it. The overwhelming incarceration of black males is no excuse to desire abprtion rights or cry out for feminism. What is the link between black make incarceration and feminism?
And I hope the feminism you talk about is the one I know bc you seem to be talking about race now. Your focused your aim at black men