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 Politics › Re: 21 Years Remembrance: Facts About Fela You Probably Didn't Know by budaatum: 11:18am On Aug 02, 2018 |
aribisala0:The Abami Eda, sun re o. Fela is god to me. But is it not true that "My people are us-e-less, My people are sens-i-less, My people are indiscipline"? 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 8:41am On Aug 02, 2018 |
Anas09: Anas09:Chapters missing? Good morning. Tried uploading but it's not having it. Try this link |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 8:58pm On Aug 01, 2018 |
Evangkatsoulis:I'll just ask people around what the date is or buy a newspaper or watch the telly, or whatever the equivalent for them are by then doh! It'll be like going to sleep in Japan and waking up in Nigeria after all. I might not know where I am, but I'd sure as hell know I'm not where I went to sleep. But that's all unnecessary when I think of it. God would tell me as part of convincing me or I'll just say, "You ain't God no jor! Get thee behind me!" |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 2:20pm On Aug 01, 2018 |
Evangkatsoulis:Another vaxx like question! vaxx:Is the "you" in the topic of the thread very small or something? I would like people to consider that perhaps the people you pose this question to are of very superior minds that the sort of evidence they claim they require is sufficient for them though it might not convince anyone else. It could also be that the responders are of inferior minds and that is the reasons that the evidence they request is what would do it. Either ways, that's the evidence the responders require, and to claim that God can't do what they request is a limitation of God, first for creating them with superior, or inferior minds; and second, in not being able to achieve what is being demanded as evidence, as absurd or ridiculous as those demands might be. God should not have created them in the way they are to begin with if it didn't want them to ask for such evidence. I am changing my mind. The evidence that I require is that God give me the entire land space on Mars and Jupiter and transport me to the year 9018! If God does that, please note everyone, There is God O. For me! And don't take my word for it. There are other planets. |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Nothing Will Serve As Evidence For Gods Existence To An Atheist by budaatum: 11:44am On Aug 01, 2018 |
Melvyn11:7 billion? Where you get that from? This judgement day is somewhere in like 9018AD or very long after, and going by the rate at which we breed, there's likely to be over 100 billion of us! Land for sale on Jupiter! Low rates available! |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 11:31am On Aug 01, 2018 |
vaxx:Mu'tazilah is the more rational arm of Islam. And if I were mentioning atheistic versions, it would be one of the first on my list (if I'd remembered it that is, which I didn't, so thanks for reminding me). As an atheist, I do have the tendency to strip away mystic and rituals which have a tendency to blind the sense in which they can be true. That's how I can see sense in religious texts. It all boils down to how one looks at things, one's subjective perception, and the objective meanings one derives from them. Below is an extract from a modern version of The Holy Book of Mu'tazilah Since the prophet Mohammed recognized the prophets before him, True Islam should quote not just from the Koran but also the Christian and Jewish books. The Golden Rule falls short of some people's desire to live in a more mystical world. And this is where Perennial Tradition comes in (in its atheist form), and its religious versions include Judaism (Kabbalah), Esoteric Christianity, Sufi Islam, Zen Buddhism and Taoism. It is this mystical version of Islam, Sufism, that was the glory days of Islam. To those interested in Ecumenism, this is the interpretation of the Koran that needs to be revived. That should then cover the whole world. The mystical version of religion is maintained via Sufism, but we still have our brain above even Sufism, as per Mu'tazilah, as it is important that we don't assume God did something-or-other when the more likely explanation is science-based. Regarding Gnosticism, every tiny scrap of paper in existence is like gold. You just see the gods in every single word sometimes and any writing can be read gnostically, even Alice Through the Looking Glass. After all, everything was created by words. Very good training for the mind, I daresay. But its not the texts that really matter, not in any religion, since they are just desires, the finger, and not the moon. Thanks for the education. Do you see how much better it is than quibbling over different sorts of desires. |
| Politics › Re: See How Nigerian States Rank In Terms Of Progress by budaatum: 11:26pm On Jul 31, 2018 |
Agilscent:Tell dem o. In our blessed Nigeria, food should be free, everyone should be given the biggest Mercedes Benz, even private jet self and free petrol plus free admission to heaven! Useless Buhari! 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 10:35pm On Jul 31, 2018 |
vaxx:Buddhism itself is a brain exercise and some. If you think it impossible for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, try Zen for a complete head fuq. The only comparable understanding in Christianity is Gnosticism ("out of Egypt I called my Son" ), and Sufism in Islam. But it would appear our current Nigerian understanding is rather fundamental - the form that places 'belief' above all else, and which leads to ignorance. I guess it is as Christ said in response to the query from John, "the lame walk, the lepers are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and to the poor the Gift of God is given". bav While many might claim the Spiritual is meant, they have not had spat on mud rubbed in their eyes so they cannot see and receive the Gift, despite their claim to have been born again. Perhaps there's just no 'poor' amongst us. There is, indeed, hope for us yet. The Kingdom of God full of people with power and grace is being built one mind at a time. |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Christianity Is Crap! by budaatum: 8:42pm On Jul 31, 2018 |
Dantedasz:I happen to agree with Butterflyleo on his views on Buhari! I in fact wish he'd be as objective with his view here in the religious section. The allegations against Buhari sound pretty much like those the far right have against Obama, disregarding the rubbish situation he took over from that Bush guy just like they wish to disregard the ineptitude of Jonathan. One might as well blame Joseph for hunger and starvation in Egypt if they had not listened to his advise during the seven years of plenty! 2 Likes |
| Christianity Etc › Re: A Short Course In Intellectual Self Defence by budaatum(op): 7:58pm On Jul 31, 2018 |
MuttleyLaff:The following is close: 94. Paternalism: A serious fallacy of ethos, arbitrarily tut-tutting, dismissing or ignoring another's arguments or concerns as "childish" or "immature;" taking a condescending attitude of superiority toward opposing standpoints or toward opponents themselves. E.g., "Your argument against the war is so infantile. Try approaching the issue like an adult for a change," "I don't argue with children," or "Somebody has to be the grownup in the room, and it might as well be me. Here's why you're wrong..." Also refers to the sexist fallacy of dismissing a woman's argument because she is a woman, e.g., "Oh, it must be that time of the month, eh?" See also "Ad Hominem Argument" and "Tone Policing." |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Nothing Will Serve As Evidence For Gods Existence To An Atheist by budaatum: 7:48pm On Jul 31, 2018 |
winner01:Tanhā, as explained here. winner01:Even I get worked up when I see that nonsense! Just by mere virtue of the fact that religion has been in existence far longer than atheism, is sufficient evidence to debunk that claim, but it seems Christians believe on here otherwise and refuse to acknowledge that fact. It is not "evidence", winner01, but plain ignorance presented as if it was. Any sane person knows more wars and more killings have been done in the name of god than not. And if they don't know, I strongly suggest they read some history! winner01:There is mockery and ridicule on this thread winner01. To start with, any post by the ape is mockery and ridicule and he has been all over this thread!. He can't help himself. And........ winner01:We are not all ape men. Some have been breathed into by God and evolved. Some don't seem to have been breathed into and remain muddy apes! winner01:Really! None? Well instead of "believing", an ability that is shared by the devil, how about "knowing". Or would you say "to know", is not superior to "believing", systems or otherwise? The devil ran 'believe' past Jesus Christ when he tempted him on the mountain. But Jesus Christ, filled with knowledge, dealt with the devils ignorant ass in a rather very convincing way. Nations that we say have developed did not do so on 'beliefs', winner01. They did go through long periods when 'beliefs' reigned supreme, but it was a period of stagnation, and in Europe, was called the dark ages, when many died because of the ignorance that they believed in. And then it was said that "Let there be light", and the Age of Enlightenment came about. Please read up on this so you understand what we Nigerian atheists are fighting for in our Nigerian society and minds. We are very tired of relying on the unreliable NEPA! winner01:There's a fallacy for what you've done here. When others have gone through the list of fallacies that I posted, they'd find some that describes it. I presume it is based on the false information you quoted at the beginning of this post that atheists have killed more people than have been killed by people who profess a religion. I'm afraid it is your belief. And there is nothing true about it. Let, me just reiterate the point that more wars have been fought in the name of gods in the entire history of time, and more people have been killed because of fights over gods than over just about anything else, ever. But as I mentioned in my initial post on this thread, no amount of evidence would make another change their beliefs unless God itself tells them otherwise, so I wouldn't expect you to not continue parroting that nonsense. I, will pray for you for you though. You can be saved! winner01:I don't believe that! Is it not written, that "he was crucified, died, and was buried, and he descended into hell. And on the third day he rose again; and ascended into heaven, and he is seated at the right hand of the Father, judging the living and the dead". And also, "Know ye not that ye are gods?, who "will do even more than He has done"? You need to stop with the believing, winner01, and understand so you too would know! |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 6:08pm On Jul 31, 2018 |
vaxx:I'm going to come over there and bhikkhu your butt vaxx! You set up these strawman arguments just so you can attempt to trap me in a "Thousand Flowers Fallacy", then you accuse me of having pain? Of course I have pain when you refuse to use the intelligent brain I know resides inside that skull of yours! Or do you not see how I hardly bother with the ape?! It's good though. Like I said, you get me to learn and relearn stuff, and as I've said in response to winner01, it's how we move forward and evolve. I just wish you'd be more intellectually honest, but I know I can't always get what I want. We should be mindful that other people read what we write and not misrepresent ourselves because of our egotistical tanhaic desire to seem right when we are wrong. As you yourself said, "people are not stupid". They see right through the rhetoric. Anyway, I found a comprehensive list of fallacies worth considering and posted a link to them here. It seems logical fallacies have some stupid in them all. 2 Likes 1 Share |
| Christianity Etc › A Short Course In Intellectual Self Defence by budaatum(op): 6:02pm On Jul 31, 2018 |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 5:28pm On Jul 31, 2018 |
vaxx:Doesn't quite get the sentiment I'm after but thanks all the same. 1 Like 1 Share |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 5:25pm On Jul 31, 2018*. Modified: 7:35pm On Jan 17, 2019 |
Thank you, whoever it was who liked this and by so doing, reminded me where I had said what I seem to be repeating often! budaatum: |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 5:20pm On Jul 31, 2018 |
vaxx:You really are funny. Go through our last, and in fact, every discussion you and I have ever had to see who could not resist putting emotion into the discussion! Or would you claim the following are not clear enough examples of emotive arguing, rather pointlessly, and not discussing? vaxx: vaxx:I'm not smart vaxx. O but for the grace of God go I. 1 Like 1 Share |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 4:36pm On Jul 31, 2018 |
johnydon22:Is there anything like an Argumentum ad stupidity? I come across it often but never know the Latin with which to describe it. 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 4:33pm On Jul 31, 2018 |
johnydon22:Heaven and Hell is the common English title of a book written by Emanuel Swedenborg in Latin, published in 1758. The full title is Heaven and its Wonders and Hell From Things Heard and Seen, or, in Latin: De Caelo et Eius Mirabilibus et de inferno, ex Auditis et Visis. It gives a detailed description of the afterlife, how people live after the death of the physical body. The book owes its appeal to that subject matter. Some of the things he claims to have experienced are that there are Jews, Muslims and people of pre-Christian times ("pagans" such as Romans and Greeks) in Heaven. He says he spoke to married angel couples from the Golden Age who had been happy in heaven for thousands of years. The fundamental issue of life, he says, is that love of self or of the world drives one towards Hell, and love of God and of fellow beings drives one towards Heaven. [url=https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaven_and_Hell_%28Swedenborg%29?wprov=sfla1]Wiki[/url] Note that last sentence 22. Doesn't it sound like the Four Noble Truths? |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Nothing Will Serve As Evidence For Gods Existence To An Atheist by budaatum: 4:24pm On Jul 31, 2018 |
winner01:  |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Nothing Will Serve As Evidence For Gods Existence To An Atheist by budaatum: 4:19pm On Jul 31, 2018*. Modified: 12:55pm On Sep 24, 2018 |
winner01:It really does not matter whether Christians bother about the beliefs of atheist, though they do! The first question many Christians ask on meeting one is, "Are you born again?" Then they judge one by making out one is no good unless one 'accepts Jesus Christ into one's life!' But it matters not to an atheist that they do. Beliefs must be scrutinised regardless, by oneself or by others, as that is how society learns moves forward and evolves. winner01:Ok. Then let those who can, or wish to, be humble. It would be a suitable chanda to replace the tanhā of arrogance. I myself would keep wiping a mirror on this one. winner01:Then there must be a fault in your ability to notice! Atheists are not the only ones who are hostile and rage, winner01. Your first response to me on this thread was hostile, and I said so. But atheists also start threads to ridicule Christians who are hostile and rage in return. Some even threaten others with their imaginary hell and damnation. We taunt one another, winner01. We both open threads to mock and ridicule one another. I accused you of that in this thread, and you have proved me right in numerous posts of yours! There's even an ape amongst you who's sole purpose is to be apish, and not one of you tells it to evolve! A serious fault in noticing, if that's not noticed, I'd say. winner01:The alternative to "believing" is to skeptically check for evidence with a critical mind, and not just accept what one is told. Atheist give examples of this but as I said in my initial post on this thread, we would hardly accept the evidence of the other as conclusive proof of the their position. Whatever either of us says sounds like crap to the other person. Observe an example of the stubbornness involved where vaxx argues that Buddhism is self contradictory or self defeating despite it being pointed out to him that it is not contradictory to replace tanhā desires with chanda desires. Besides, atheism with is skeptical rationalism, stands directly opposed to "believing by faith in the unseen", so you can hardly not expect a war. They are distinct points on the evolutionary scale and observable in the history of more advanced nations. We are fortunate however, in that our weapons are words - be they full of rage and hostility - and not, imprisonment, torture to recant and burnings at stakes if we don't, that pepper the history of nations that went through the same arguments before us. I guess we cracking eggs to build powerful people! winner01:Lol! Are you looking for another label to pin on buda? How about "Atheist Pagan Christian Buddhist Muslim" - as I also do the Quran, and if one is to be defined by one's studies. And Atum, being the first in the Egyptian pantheon, does denote my pagan element. And maybe Philosophical Scientists too, if we could call it a religion. But that would be like defining an elephant by it's trunk. My studies influence me and my thinking, but I wouldn't claim I am more one or the other or limited to those mentioned, for even if one were to take all the trees and the water in the oceans, multiply them by seven then bake them into bread, one still should vary one's diet. I am a human being who has spent quite a lot of time studying the text of many religions in search of the "Kingdom of God" (and do have to be mindful of mixing my metaphors so it don't sound like meaningless crap, to some). I have found that once one finds, some do not just go off to heaven and sit on the right hand of God. They descend into hell and try to figure why the world is so fuqed up, despite all the baking of bread, and try to be the change they want to see. 1 Like 1 Share |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 8:05am On Jul 31, 2018 |
Anas09: budaatum: |
| Christianity Etc › Re: My Take On The Doctrine Of Trinity And Those Saying Jesus Is God Almighty! by budaatum: 12:00am On Jul 31, 2018 |
When they run out of facts to prove their point and resort to personal attacks and think they ridicule others they only end up showing how silly and pointless they actually are! 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 10:28pm On Jul 30, 2018 |
vaxx:It is amusing how you can't see yourself in your very own description of others. I do wonder what the source of your pains is. 2 Likes 1 Share |
| Christianity Etc › Re: Atheist, What Would You Consider Evidence Of God's Existence? by budaatum: 7:22pm On Jul 30, 2018 |
vaxx:It's not tenable for you! I, myself, gave what would convince me that God exists. And I went on to state how the evidence that would convince me would be mocked and ridiculed by others. But this would not be the first time you call what is subject to you, objective to everyone, I guess, so I shouldn't be surprised. 2 Likes 1 Share |
| Christianity Etc › Re: The Teaching Of Buddism Is Self Contradicting Or Self Defeating..... by budaatum: 7:12pm On Jul 30, 2018 |
vaxx:Yet, he said, quoting from you in the op: "2 The cause of suffering and misery is desire." I guess you see a O there somewhere. As to "Buddha's Lectures", it would appear you have a lot yet to learn. |
| Christianity Etc › Re: The Teaching Of Buddism Is Self Contradicting Or Self Defeating..... by budaatum: 6:52pm On Jul 30, 2018 |
vaxx:Show me where you got your Buddha's lectures from please. |
| Christianity Etc › Re: The Teaching Of Buddism Is Self Contradicting Or Self Defeating..... by budaatum: 6:47pm On Jul 30, 2018 |
johnydon22:He is good for one thing. He makes me have to be careful and precise when I respond to him! |
| Christianity Etc › Re: The Teaching Of Buddism Is Self Contradicting Or Self Defeating..... by budaatum: 6:45pm On Jul 30, 2018 |
vaxx:Really vaxx? The following is from your wiki link. Ajahn Sucitto states: Desire as an eagerness to offer, to commit, to apply oneself to meditation, is called chanda. It’s a psychological “yes,” a choice, not a pathology. In fact, you could summarize Dhamma training as the transformation of taṇhā into chanda. If they are the same, I would wonder why Dhamma training is the transformation of [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ta%E1%B9%87h%C4%81?wprov=sfla1]taṇhā[/url] into chanda! Are you sure you understand what you read? |
| Christianity Etc › Re: The Teaching Of Buddism Is Self Contradicting Or Self Defeating..... by budaatum: 6:34pm On Jul 30, 2018*. Modified: 5:33pm On Sep 02, 2018 |
vaxx:What you have written above is the Four Noble Truths vaxx! Or can you not even understand what you yourself are writing? Once you understand what your desires are and how pointless they are you stop pursuing them, and even the desire for enlightenment and entering Nirvana disappears, because you can now see and understand. And instead of fulfilling the ultimate desire of becoming a Buddha and entering Nirvana, you settle as a Bodhisattva, the Sanskrit term for anyone who has generated Bodhicitta, the spontaneous wish and compassionate mind to attain Buddhahood for the benefit of all sentient beings and not just for yourself, which is the desire you began with, and why you followed the Eightfold Path, not knowing when you began that this was it's aim. The only desire left over is that of eliminating the suffering of others, and you understand that it's not some external desire, but something you constantly strive to bring about yourself. It is what is explained in the [url=https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%205:3-12&version=KJV]Beatitudes[/url], "Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God." And in the phrase, "Be the change you want to see" . Buddhism is indeed mind bending. Shen Hsiu who thought he was enlightened said: The body is the wisdom-tree, The mind is a bright mirror in a stand; Take care to wipe it all the time, And allow no dust to cling. From this, the Fifth Patriarch knew Shen Hsiu had not yet found his original nature, but was still wiping dust off a mirror hoping to attain Buddhahood. Hui Neng who couldn't even write, had someone write down his poem, which read: Fundamentally no wisdom-tree exists, Nor the stand of a mirror bright. Since all is empty from the beginning, Where can the dust alight. And the Fifth Patriarch gave him the insignia of his office, the Patriarch's robe and bowl, and Hui Neng became the Sixth Patriarch. Until your mind bends, vaxx, you will not hear the sound of one hand clapping! 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: The Teaching Of Buddism Is Self Contradicting Or Self Defeating..... by budaatum: 4:53pm On Jul 30, 2018 |
vaxx:Are you completely disregarding the difference between the two types of desires called Tanhā and Chanda as stated, or do you just not understand the concept of duality? For the Christians who reads this, Paul, in a letter to the Galatians expressed the same concept of Tanhā when he said: The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God. And Chanda when he said: But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. And the same sentiment as Tanhā is expressed by the seven deadly sins of pride, greed, lust, envy, gluttony, wrath and sloth; and Chanda as the seven virtues of prudence, justice, temperance and courage (or fortitude), faith, hope and charity. I am certain I have stated my objection to your "you don't even understand the argument" in previous threads, vaxx, where you and I have engaged. It is after all the standard phrase you constantly utter whenever you are disagreed with. It is not self contradicting or self-defeating to say that the wrong desires will only be removed by continuously having the right and proper desires. 1 Like |
| Christianity Etc › Re: The Teaching Of Buddism Is Self Contradicting Or Self Defeating..... by budaatum: 2:49pm On Jul 30, 2018 |
donwhit:Thank you donwhit for pointing out the difference in the desires that are meant and that cause suffering. 1 Like 1 Share |
| Christianity Etc › Re: The Teaching Of Buddism Is Self Contradicting Or Self Defeating..... by budaatum: 2:45pm On Jul 30, 2018 |
vaxx:One of the most debilitating causes of argument in the religious section is the misrepresentation of the position or meaning of the other. Sometimes its done intentionally. We call it strawmanism. But sometimes its in error, perhaps because our understanding of what is being said is wrong. "Seek ye first Understanding", therefore, say some. It is quite a lot of work you are asked to do there for the promise that follows to be fulfilled. Buda would simply advise that one not mistake the pointing finger for the moon it points to. The root of all suffering is desire, tanhā. This is the second Noble Truth. Tanhā is a term in Pali, the language of the Buddhist scriptures, that specifically means craving or misplaced desire and it comes in three forms: * Greed and desire * Ignorance or delusion * Hatred and destructive urges. These are the three ultimate causes of suffering. The Buddha taught that the way to extinguish desire, which causes suffering, is to liberate oneself from attachment to Tanhā. This is the third Noble Truth - the possibility of liberation from Tanhā. Buddhists recognise that there can be positive desires, such as desire for enlightenment and good wishes for others and even to enter Nirvana. A neutral term for such desires is chanda, and they differ to Tanhā. A reading for the Eightfold Path would show that they are full of desires of the chanda type. Effectively, the Four Noble Truths could be written as follows: 1. Suffering (Dukkha), exists. 2. The origin of suffering is Tanhā, the having of wrong desires. 3. To cease suffering is to remove Tanhā. 4. And the way to remove Tanhā is to replace it with chanda, positive desires. A mantra depicting the above would be Chanda good, Tanhā bad And where, pray, is the contradiction in vaxx? 4 Likes 4 Shares |
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