₦airaland Forum

Joagbaje: Christians are not tithing based on the law . Christians tithe based on the fact that it's a principle in the kingdom of God. Tithes and offerings are eternal principles . Like every other spiritual principle . Regardless of the law. Such as prayer ,worship, fasting. Honoring your parents. Etc.

Your G.O doesn't think so. Maybe you should correct his thinking before you attempt to correct us online. He's a disciple of Moses and Malachi when it comes to tithing. He proved that himself in his devotional.

If you say otherwise, you will be a LIAR. Incase you didn't see the particular devotional, i can repost it for your benefit.

Image123: BTW, some of God's blessings are still premised on obedience. There are blessings premised on mercy, some on faith, some on divine goodness etc. We ought to teach the whole truth, in love too and meekness, not in bitterness and pride. There is no truth you've stated that i do not speak about on this forum, and i'm almost certain that same can be stated for all those men you're frustrated with.

1 John 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, BECAUSE we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.

Maybe Oyaks didn't get the memo. I just read through his write up again and the condition he gave for your tithe to stand out is for you to keep on giving. Nothing on keeping any other command of God.

Pls Oyaks doesn't need you to defend him. He knew perfectly what he wanted to write and he wrote it. He knows where he gets his tithe inspiration from and he quoted it. Stop trying to twist his words. You look ridiculous so doing. Even his members have refused to dabble into it.

God's blessings are already with us believers. Even if the world doesn't see it or refuse to acknowledge it. Im blessed because i have a sure hope. Not because you're promising money doubling in the name of seed sowing.

Quit the lies and the twisting of scriptures.

Image123: It is your blindness, pride and newfound zeal to cause strife that prevents you from seeing the facts i stated from the man's devotional.

Luke 11:53 And as he said these things unto them, the scribes and the Pharisees began to urge him vehemently, and to provoke him to speak of many things: 11:54 Laying wait for him, and seeking to catch something out of his mouth, that they might accuse him.

Dont get worked up. The lies you've been peddling have found you out and they'll keep finding you out. The strife is inside your mind vacillating between Abraham's tithe that you lie you practice and Mosaic tithe that you bent to practice. Make up your mind on which of them you want to defend so you can have peace. A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.

Speak the truth to yourself so you can be free. At least in your mind

In addition, you can see they couldnt catch Jesus because he spoke the truth. Try be truthful, and you wont be like Peter when he denied Jesus. His own words and manner of speech gave him away like yours do to you.

Don't mind those guys o. They are hustlers trying to make quick bucks and they evidently succeeded from your account. Its not their fault. Its the fault of the greedy people refuse to study their bibles. Theyve been made to see God as a money doubler by conmen in suits and were rightly fleeced of their money.

God gives freely. He's promised to meet our needs. He also brings rain on the just and the unjust. If he feeds and clothes the sparrows and the lilies of the field, why should his children pay him first before he meets their needs?

We are enjoined to trust him and he will never leave nor forsake us.

Image123: Tithe works and the Word of God works, stop striving to catch me at my words. Here is the point where i simply ignore you. If you have useful statements or questions to make, i'm around. Thanks

Your words will always catch and trip you up because they are founded on lies. I warned you earlier not to try to defend Oyaks devotional because its indefensible except you have a pedigree in lying. Even his members have kept mum on it: a very wise move if you ask me.

Gods word on the other hand cannot be faulted. When God spoke in Malachi, he meant every word there. However, no matter how you twist it, he wasn't talking to us the Church. Hence any allusion to it will not work. God blesses us today simply on the basis of his love, not on any fraudulent tithe or seed sowing devised by cunning men. So me that doesn't tithe even rescues some fervent tithers because its simply by Gods favour that I can put food on my table. Not by works.

I'm not interested in this discussion too any more. However, Oyaks devotional will be waiting whenever any twister of the word of God shows up again with lies.

Image123: There is no play on words anywhere. It is a comprehensible fact to any literate that pastor Chris says in that article that tithes is not a fix it all. He says "the Bible lets us know these aren’t enough... you have to go the extra mile". He also says that tithing is not the giving that stands you out. Does he not say these? What words are you accusing me of playing with?
Did God give a condition when He said that nothing shall by any means hurt you, or that you shall drink any deadly thing and it will not hurt you? Why, for the sake of winning an argument are you asking questions like an unbeliever. You are a better bible student than what you are asking.
The Word of God works, i am not saying that it doesn't. I am saying that it is conditional on other factors, also seen in scriptures. Promises are not in isolation. i already explained this when i talked of a preacher preaching on righteousness, or prayer, or faith, or hardwork/diligence etc. Or on tithes as in this case.[s] BTW, blessings are not primarily measured in materialistic terms in the new testament. That's a whole world of questions already, forget it.[/s]

Really so tithe is not a fix all and your friends were inundating us with Rockefeller and all the other rich men that tithe worked for? Were you not on planet earth then?

So blessings are not measured in materialistic terms yet your friends scream about Oyedepo's 4 jets etc? Yet Oyedepo's wife was exulting it during her message at last years Shiloh? So you know this life is more than things yet your pastors threaten non tithers with poverty? So material blessings are not a true measure yet Joagbaje opened a thread to share the blessings associated with tithing? Keep deceiving yourself dear friend.

The wicked condition Oyaks gave is to bring more money. Or you didn't read it?

When Christ promised the apostles that, he said they were signs. Signs just like the signs Moses used to prove he came from God to the Israelites and Pharaoh. If a viper climbs your hand today like it climbed Paul's hand, you will not survive it without an antidote.

Image123: Oga, do not speak ignorantly. Deut 14 has been talked about. i've shown Gosh, Kunle and co how there were at least three types of tithe given from those passages. As far back as maybe four or so years ago, when Kunle was trying to mix it all up as the same tithe, i did an explanation on it. It is not you that will just come to tell us what scripture to teach from and not to teach from. thanks.

OK o. I hear you Mr Oga.

Did you not discuss Mal 3 that same four years ago? Did you not also discuss Abraham 4 years ago? Yet You still talk about both today, so what stops you from discussing Deutoronomy today? Are you now scared of it?

Which of the 3 do you practice today? We are been honest here you know?

nlMediator: It’s not just deliverance from sin; it’s also deliverance from the effects of sin, which include separation from God, sickness and lack of prosperity. Until Adam sinned, he had fellowship with God. Until Adam sinned, he was never sick. Until Adam sinned, he was a prosperous man. When he sinned, the Lord cursed the ground, thus affecting his ability to prosper. Jesus’ sacrifice took care of all these problems. That’s why the word used for salvation is soteria. Look it up in the original language and it means deliverance, preservation, safety, health. It is the word in Acts 27.34 when Paul was in a ship wreck. There it is translated as health (KJV), survival (NIV), preservation (NASB), safety and strength (Amp.).

I believe you agree that physical death is also a consequence of the curse Christ came to redeem us from. So how come you and I will still die whether by sickness or old age and irrespective of our faith level or anointing?

It is interesting that you’re exalting the experience of others – Christians and non-christians alike – to determine the validity of God’s Word. Were you not the person rejecting the same practice in the eating-in-the-dream discussion? I assume you agree that Jesus rescued us from the nature of sin, thus enabling us to have dominion over sin. With that we should lead a more sin-free life. I’m sure that you know that many non-christians lead more moral lives than Christians. Can we then assert that there was no point to Jesus saving us from sin, as far as life on earth is concerned, because many people are doing a better job taking care of sin that Christians? No. Likewise, non-christians walking in health or wealth does nothing to undermine the purpose of the Lord’s sacrifice.

I'm not exalting experience my bro. I'm just letting you know that this body of flesh is still subject to corruption which includes sickness and sin. A Christian saved does not immediately become free from sin. Any one who claims that is a liar. However we are sanctified by the word as we fellowship with the lord and allow the spirit free reign in our lives. A lot of atheists are morally better than Christians but you know even that morality is filthy rags before God. He judges us based on Christ's righteousness not ours. That is the difference grace makes. However I always preach that grace isn't license. We've been redeemed to show good works. We must allow the Christ like life manifest through us.

Moreover, some sicknesses and diseases are directly traceable to the devil. No other power or person can fully deliver from such but Jesus. That’s why Jesus came. The Bible makes clear in Matt 8 that Jesus was fulfilling the prophecy in Isaiah 53 which says that part of the Messiah’s mission when He comes on earth is to take away our infirmities, sicknesses and diseases. And Peter lets us know that Jesus demonstrated that when He went about doing good and healing all those oppressed of the devil (Acts. 10.38). Perhaps He came to heal but only before He died, meaning that people that experienced Him before His death experienced a ‘better’ Jesus than those that are experiencing Him today?

My bro, you'll have to tell me if they had a better Jesus then than now because we don't see such miracles again. Even Epaphras, an associate of Paul was sick nigh unto death. Was it a lack of faith? Or he too didn't know the better Jesus? Jesus miracles were a sign to tell Isreal who he was my bro. Until he returns to take us home, the flesh will always be subject to corruption and your spirit that has been redeemed is housed in that body of flesh.

Finally, what is your answer to the point that Jesus can give health like no other – like a brand new heart – or do you know of any religion or earthly system that can do something similar?

There is no God like our God. He does his things without recourse to anybody. However I've seen a pagan experience a remission of cancer like I've heard of a believer too.

God does his things miraculously and believe it when I say he does for unbelievers too.

Malala the Pakistani girl is an example of a miracle and you know she's Muslim.

God works things according to his will.

Behold an explanation of tithe that Pastors will not have you see. Ask a bible teacher to explain it to you if they can. This is the practice Malachi was trying to remind Israelites of in Mal 3:8-11

Deut 14:22-29
'Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed, that the field bringeth forth year by year. [23] And thou shalt eat before the Lord thy God, in the place which he shall choose to place his name there, the tithe of thy corn, of thy wine, and of thine oil, and the firstlings of thy herds and of thy flocks; that thou mayest learn to fear the Lord thy God always. [24] And if the way be too long for thee, so that thou art not able to carry it; or if the place be too far from thee, which the Lord thy God shall choose to set his name there, when the Lord thy God hath blessed thee: [25] Then shalt thou turn it into money, and bind up the money in thine hand, and shalt go unto the place which the Lord thy God shall choose: [26] And thou shalt bestow that money for whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, for oxen, or for sheep, or for wine, or for strong drink, or for whatsoever thy soul desireth: and thou shalt eat there before the Lord thy God, and thou shalt rejoice, thou, and thine household, [27] And the Levite that is within thy gates; thou shalt not forsake him; for he hath no part nor inheritance with thee. [28] At the end of three years thou shalt bring forth all the tithe of thine increase the same year, and shalt lay it up within thy gates: [29] And the Levite, (because he hath no part nor inheritance with thee,) and the stranger, and the fatherless, and the widow, which are within thy gates, shall come, and shall eat and be satisfied; that the Lord thy God may bless thee in all the work of thine hand which thou doest.

Behold a preaching on tithes by a much beloved and respected pastor. It proves unequivocally that tithe is of the law laid down in Deut 14:22-29. Any assertion to the contrary is outright dishonesty and calculated to misleading innocent and naive Christians.

https://www.nairaland.com/393253/rhapsody-realities-daily-devotional/9#8071513

The Giving That Stands You Out – Thursday April 7, 2011 – Pastor Chris

And Joses, who by the apostles was surnamed Barnabas, (which is, being interpreted, The son of consolation,) a Levite, and of the country of Cyprus, Having land sold it, and brought the money, and laid it at the apostles’ feet (Acts 4:36-37).

It’s impossible for a Christian who only gives his tithes and offerings to feel like an accomplished giver, but the Bible lets us know these aren’t enough. Your tithes for example belong to God, and He expects you to give them to Him anyway. The man who does otherwise is a robber: “Will a man rob God: Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings” (Malachi 3:8 ).

God is not a man (Numbers 23:19); He’s God. So you MUST give Him your tithes and your offerings, as God. Actually, you pay your tithe; you don’t give it, as you would your free-will offering. So your tithe is not a gift, because you don’t pay a gift. Your offering on the other hand isnt just a donation made to the Church, but a sacrifice offered to a divine being. God actually demanded for it in Exodus 23:15: “…None shall appear before Me empty-handed” (AMP).

So, beyond your tithes and giving your offerings, which are compulsory for every believer, you have to go the extra mile by getting financially involved in the spread of the Gospel. This type of giving is special because it isn’t a compulsion, but is done out of your love and commitment to the Gospel. 2 Corinthians 9:7 (AMP) says, “Let each one [give] as he has made up his own mind and purposed in his heart, not reluctantly or sorrowfully or under compulsion, for God loves (He takes pleasure in, prizes above other things, and is unwilling to abandon or to do without) a cheerful (joyous, “prompt to do it”) giver [whose heart is in his giving]. This is the giving that stands you out.”

Remember it’s in your interest and in your favour when you give to the Lord, for He has promised great returns and mighty harvest of blessings for the giver. So be sure to be counted among those who give financially towards the things of God. In our Ministry, we have several platforms through which we reach millions of souls around the world every day with the Gospel. Locate such opportunities and participate big-time. That’s how to get relevant in the Kingdom and make your life count.

Prayer
Dear Father, thank you for the available opportunities I have to give towards the work of the Kingdom today, realizing that they’ve been put in place for me to make my relevance and impact in world evangelism felt through my giving. Thank you Lord, for continuously increasing my capacity to give, in Jesus’ Name. Amen,

Further Study
Luke 8:2-3
And certain women, which had been healed of evil spirits and infirmities, Mary called Magdalene, out of whom went seven devils, And Joanna the wife of Chuza Herod's steward, and Susanna, and many others, which ministered unto him of their substance.

Daily Scripture Reading
1 Year Bible Luke 11:14-36
Reading plan Judges 3-4

2 Year Bible Matthew 27:55-66
Reading Plan Leviticus 7

Rhapsody of Realities Pastor Chris Oyakhilome
----------------------------------------------------

Be not deceived. Start reading your bibles.

Image123: Hope you noticed in that quote you gave that Oyakhilome teaches that tithing is not a fix it all? He says "the Bible lets us know these aren’t enough... you have to go the extra mile". He also says that tithing is not the giving that stands you out. This is contrary to what antitithers want us to believe. Antitithers want us to believe that churches always teach tithing. they want us to believe that pastors tell members that if and once they tithe, that is all they need to do to be 'blessed'. Hopefully, we can at least get and correct that point from this quote as well.

Image pls stop this play on words. Oyaks does not have to tell you before you know what God said in that reference. Are you calling God a liar? Did God give a condition in that Malachi verse? Is standing out the same thing as windows of heaven?

I was in LFC for 3 years and without fail I heard from the pulpit that the word works. Is Mal 3:8-11 no longer a word in the bible? You always hear if you don't tithe, things will be tight for you or you've not heard this line before?

Pls tell us you're in agreement with Oyaks who will have folks bring everything they earn so they can stand out then God can finally look down with mercy and grudgingly open the windows and pour the blessings out. Even then, Christians still lack behind atheists and Muslims on the rich list.

Its this type of teaching that make atheists say God is cruel. ThankGod I and others know better, It would have been difficult not to agree with them.

Image123: But this was my stance na, it was people like Candour that would not allow me to rest. he still said it recently that i am avoiding certain scriptures like a plague. The whole tithe issue, i tried to avoid. But my people were hell bent on making sure that i must to be involved.

Haba image!! You said I didn't allow you rest? Is it a lie that you and others avoid some scriptures?

If you don't avoid scriptures dear brother, try preach tithe from Deut 14:22-29 like Pastor Chris did with Malachi. At least you've said you see nothing wrong in his use of the favourite Malachi so go ahead and teach us from Deuteronomy after all its even more detailed than Malachi.

This will really show that you don't deliberately avoid some scriptures like a plague.

Enigma: ^^ Bros, it is well known that the basis of the prevalent modern teaching of "tithing" is Malachi 3. The only reason some of them are now trying to take refuge in Abram and Genesis 14 is because deep within they know that using Malachi in that way is un-Christian and unbiblical!

Even the leading 'Daddy GO' has repeatedly said the same thing as above and arguably even worse because of the suggestion or argument which goes as follows:

- Robbers are going to "hell"
- Non-tithers are robbers
- Non-tithers are going to "hell"

This is one of the reasons I am grateful for that old post of the poster who used to defend tithing where these matters are brought to the fore.

In the past, there were also a number of posters who like to use the line that non-tithers are going to "hell"; now we don't see many of them --- maybe some of them have had a rethink!

I agree with you my brother. I can't thank you enough for bringing that devotional to remembrance. I used to believe that they were honest when they harped about Abraham but with Adeboye's devotional and this one by Oyakhilome, its obvious they are knowingly peddling falsehood.

I have therefore decided not to engage them too much on this issue henceforth. Anybody who wishes to know the truth on Naira land has enough threads to visit to learn.

However, these devotionals will be waiting for them whenever they start with their lies again anytime and on any thread on this forum.

Don't let anybody deceive you with Abraham's tithe. See the true face of the tithe they preach. Even though its totally wrong, at least this pastor is honest about the reason for his tithing unlike the twisting and battery of scriptures we have been subjected to here.

https://www.nairaland.com/393253/rhapsody-realities-daily-devotional/9#8071513

The Giving That Stands You Out – Thursday April 7, 2011 – Pastor Chris

And Joses, who by the apostles was surnamed Barnabas, (which is, being interpreted, The son of consolation,) a Levite, and of the country of Cyprus, Having land sold it, and brought the money, and laid it at the apostles’ feet (Acts 4:36-37).

It’s impossible for a Christian who only gives his tithes and offerings to feel like an accomplished giver, but the Bible lets us know these aren’t enough. Your tithes for example belong to God, and He expects you to give them to Him anyway. The man who does otherwise is a robber: “Will a man rob God: Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings” (Malachi 3:8 ).

God is not a man (Numbers 23:19); He’s God. So you MUST give Him your tithes and your offerings, as God. Actually, you pay your tithe; you don’t give it, as you would your free-will offering. So your tithe is not a gift, because you don’t pay a gift. Your offering on the other hand isnt just a donation made to the Church, but a sacrifice offered to a divine being. God actually demanded for it in Exodus 23:15: “…None shall appear before Me empty-handed” (AMP).

So, beyond your tithes and giving your offerings, which are compulsory for every believer, you have to go the extra mile by getting financially involved in the spread of the Gospel. This type of giving is special because it isn’t a compulsion, but is done out of your love and commitment to the Gospel. 2 Corinthians 9:7 (AMP) says, “Let each one [give] as he has made up his own mind and purposed in his heart, not reluctantly or sorrowfully or under compulsion, for God loves (He takes pleasure in, prizes above other things, and is unwilling to abandon or to do without) a cheerful (joyous, “prompt to do it”) giver [whose heart is in his giving]. This is the giving that stands you out.”

Remember it’s in your interest and in your favour when you give to the Lord, for He has promised great returns and mighty harvest of blessings for the giver. So be sure to be counted among those who give financially towards the things of God. In our Ministry, we have several platforms through which we reach millions of souls around the world every day with the Gospel. Locate such opportunities and participate big-time. That’s how to get relevant in the Kingdom and make your life count.

Prayer
Dear Father, thank you for the available opportunities I have to give towards the work of the Kingdom today, realizing that they’ve been put in place for me to make my relevance and impact in world evangelism felt through my giving. Thank you Lord, for continuously increasing my capacity to give, in Jesus’ Name. Amen,

Further Study
Luke 8:2-3
And certain women, which had been healed of evil spirits and infirmities, Mary called Magdalene, out of whom went seven devils, And Joanna the wife of Chuza Herod's steward, and Susanna, and many others, which ministered unto him of their substance.

Daily Scripture Reading
1 Year Bible Luke 11:14-36
Reading plan Judges 3-4

2 Year Bible Matthew 27:55-66
Reading Plan Leviticus 7

Rhapsody of Realities Pastor Chris Oyakhilome
----------------------------------------------------

Be not deceived, every honest person knows tithing is of the law of Moses. Use of Abraham is an after thought.

Thanks for this piece. I'll go and do more study on it. I'd not seeing it in this light before though I'd always being concerned why we have to repeat the binding process everyday as if God is in a struggle with the devil.

God bless you bro

nlMediator: My brother, I used 'camp' in a loose sense. And even started with a laugh. Certainly, I endorse your approach of sticking to the issues and vindicating your stance without forging unhelpful alliances.

My sincere apologies for not seeing the humour in your post my bro.

Oya, let me laugh

nlMediator: I disagree that the blood of Jesus bought only salvation and that other benefits such as healing and prosperity are available to all without Jesus. There is nothing extra-biblical about my reading of Eph. 1:7. This is how it reads in the Amplified version: "In Him we have redemption (deliverance and salvation) through His blood . . . ." The word translated salvation in the English carries with a wider meaning than just salvation and includes heath, prosperity, etc. The health and prosperity that Jesus gives cannot be found anywhere else. Jesus can give a brand new heart (or other organ) while a doctor can only give a tokunbo or artificial heart. Even if what Jesus gives were to be the same as what is available in the world, it does not mean that Jesus would not make them available to His people. While He was on earth, He healed the sick and fed multitudes even whe there were physicians and food markets around.

My bro, the deliverance the amplified version talks about is from the power of sin. We were under the bondage of sin because of the adamic nature and that is what we are delivered from. Our die by fire movement has made every reference to deliverance as being associated with demonic oppression.

As long as you're in this corruptible body of flesh, you are subject to its failings. Sickness comes because body tissues, immune system become weak and people experience this at random. See examples, Kumuyi's wife died of throat cancer, Oral Roberts had a pacemaker inserted in his heart after experiencing 2 dangerous heart problems, Obadare was blind till the day of his death. Are these not the heroes of faith we look up to? Do we say God failed because of these instances?

The problem is the horrible and perverted explanation of ROM 8:18-24 that we have in pentecostal circles today. I don't want to derail this thread further by delving into it now.

Pls bro, the blood bought salvation. We will get the glorious new body free of every corruption when Christ returns. Until then, some pagans will enjoy better health, prosperity etc than most fervent Christians and it won't be because God abandoned his children. Its just that the flesh will always remain corruptible flesh.

Image123: Kindly go to this link nd read my comment on that. If you have questions on what i said, you can ask.
Short answer is YES by the way,

https://www.nairaland.com/1457950/matthew-23-message-lets-discuss

There are 613 laws that the Pharisees and scribes have derived from Moses. Here's just two of them

Lev 15:16
'And if any man's seed of copulation go out from him, then he shall wash all his flesh in water, and be unclean until the even'

The above law means if you have a seminal discharge, you're unclean until evening which means you can't enter the sanctuary until then among other prohibitions.

Deut 22:11
'Thou shalt not wear a garment of divers sorts, as of woollen and linen together.'

These are just 2 out of 613 laws. Do you obey them?

Image123: i've explained this already. If i may add, nobody has the right to remove from God's Word or tell another christian not to teach from it.
Rev 22:19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
Jo and Jo's pastor are free to teach from any scripture passage that they so desire. Wisdom is profitable to direct, kindly use it sir. We do not tithe because it is commanded under the law, tithe was given and accepted before Moses's father was born. Jesus said to give tithes.
Mat 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
Jesus NEVER condemned or restrained any one from giving tithe. He even commended a poor woman giving ALL her living to the treasury.
Mar 12:43 And he called unto him his disciples, and saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That this poor widow hath cast more in, than all they which have cast into the treasury:
Mar 12:44 For all they did cast in of their abundance; but she of her want did cast in all that she had, even all her living.

None of the apostles condemned or spoke against tithing. the Holy Ghost did not forget.

Matt 24:1-3
'Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples, [2] Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat: [3] All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.'

The holy ghost didn't forget the above scripture too. Particularly the bolded. Do you obey it?

Image, all you did up there is a pathetic attempt to gloss over the truth and its very unfortunate.

Does that look like an attack on Pastor Chris? You guys have been lying since a long time that you do not tithe according to the law. You personally told me on the 'tithes and offerings' thread that I should stop jumping to conclusions when I said I was sure your pastor preached tithe from Malachi. So also have others disowned Malachi because you know its tied to Deut 14:22-29 which you avoid like a plague.

This write up proves beyond doubt that you all have been lying through your teeth when you say that. If Pastor Chris who is said to preach unfettered grace can call a non tither a robber courtesy of Malachi, what other proof do we need that you are a Mosaic tither? If you can, tell us if you agree with that write up or not.

Joagbaje has wisely avoided discussing this issue because he knows its indefensible. Judging from this your attempt to explain it, I think it was a very wise decision indeed.

Image123: You're off tangent on this. i was clear about the title of the book. The name is "THE HIDDEN COVENANTS OF BLESSINGS". Dunno about all the adjectives y'all are giving the book. i was very clear. i never called the book a messiah of some sort or the epitome of tithe teaching. i simply gave a proof that a popular tithe preacher says that tithe does not work all the time, contrary to what zikky wanted us all to believe. And i have stated that neither does anything work all the time(on its own that is). You don't build a mountain on a single Bible verse without considering other Bible verses. We can pick any of the promises of God and put it to the same 'test'.
Mar 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
Mar 16:18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
Serious Bible students know that the promises of God are conditional. Theologists think it is like magic. i do not have the time to take each of you on kindergaten stuff, other men have the privilege of going through such labour. If you do not see this basic truth, well i pray God will show you light on it, thanks.

You see why your tithe mentors can't be trusted. In the book I mentioned, he stated that the principle works every time. Maybe he forgot what he wrote in the one I have. When was this one you're talking about published? The one I have was published in 1992. I'm sure this one you have is a more recent publication hence the revised promises.

Probably evidence has shown him that financial prosperity is not by tithing hence he has to remix it.

Anyway what about the devourer? Does it work all the time? Because Adeboye mentioned devourer can't be escaped. So what is your opinion on this?

Oluwatola5: No, that is why we need the Holy Spirit. There is this song that says ''I have no power of my own:......Holy Spirit, i look up to you, help me, I have no power of my own''.

Hi Oluwatola5, pardon my asking pls. My eyes just caught your signature. Are u a mayoress of the alpha club, OAU Ife?

nlMediator: The blood accomplished everything in our redemption package: salvation, healing, deliverance, prosperity, protection, etc. Eph. 1:7.

Don't add to the word pls.

Eph 1:7
'In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace:'

The blood redeemed you from the slave market of sin because that is the only thing we couldn't get by our efforts. Every other thing is gettable by human effort. Man has being equipped for that. You don't need to be a Christian to have the goodies of life.

Any body, whether good or bad, atheist or Muslim, sane or insane can get money, health etc. Even witch doctors claim to perform deliverance from powers of darkness for people but SALVATION CANNOT be obtained outside the blood of Christ.

My bro, that is what the blood is for. Remission of sins.

nlMediator: Ha ha, I hope you can already see dissension in your camp. Communion affords healing, as our brother correctly stated, contrary to your assertion that is all about remembrance. Why does the Bible want us to engage in a practice, simply for rememrance sake? Are our prayers, reading the Bible, calling ourselves christians not all in remembrance of the death of Christ? WOuld we engage in any of that if Jesus had not died?

My bro, you should know me by now from our engagements in time past. I don't do camps. I deal with issues, not persons. You and I agreed on something on the 'a fresh purchase' thread, does that mean you and I are forming an alliance? If I agree with you, I'll say it irrespective of whatever disagreement we've had in time past.

Check my posts, I HAVE NEVER subscribed to healing in the communion. Its part of the extra biblical revelations of the Pentecostal movement that has no biblical basis. I'm all for what is revealed in the new testament based on the cross if calvary and u can't find communion being used as a healing balm. Check the references I gave, you won't find such there. If any body tells you that or if you believe that, you'll have to prove it from scripture.

If my Lord say do it for remembrance sake, will you tell him he doesn't know what he's doing? If you can, I cannot. I take communion in line with what my Lord and apostle Paul said. Simply for remembrance.

Here I come again to sound a word of advice. This thread is about tithes. We might deviate a bit to get a clearer view of it but let us remember to stay in focus to avoid derailing completely.

Once again, let everyone remember that the thread is about tithes and the store house of Malachi chapter 3.

God bless you all

.

Image123: No need to throw words into the air. Be specific. One, i am not Mark's standard so forget the "Image123 is also guilty" line already. Trying to bring me or anybody down does not erase the fact that Mark has side-stepped the pertinent questions he was asked and is instead more interested in telling us that Abraham has 3 wives.
What are the errors pointed out to me? What is my error on Oyedepo's book? You told me that you keep some of the 613 laws, and i said since you do, then stop disturbing us(paraphrased). Mark has not told us if he obeys any of the 613 laws. i am waiting for him to tell us.

I'm not concerned whether Mark knows the number of Abraham's wives or not. I advised him to stay on topic and you asked why I didn't tell him to acknowledge your superior knowledge of Abraham's marital affairs. This made me remind you of your own hypocrisy in this regard. Whether he was right or wrong on the wife count is very immaterial to me or this thread. If you want to dissect his family life, open a thread for that and I'll willingly come and learn. Abraham's wife count is not pertinent to this discuss.

If you want to continue the 613 laws issue. I posted the thread there. Reawaking it and let's have fun. I mean fun because you know you lie about this tithe issue and have bluntly refused to admit it even with Pastor Chris devotional starring you in the face so any engagement with you on this issue is just a verbal exercise to me. All possible questions on the 613 laws have been answered on that thread.

If you are honest and want to display a little candour, say it here and now. What informs your adherence to tithing? Abraham's example or the law of Moses?

Image123: It's not a distraction but a correction. A child of God should learn to accept his mistakes and be quick to repent instead of defending the indefensible. Abraham was not married to Hagar, i expect that you know this? Sarah was his wife and so also was Keturah. It shows how wrong he can be on so many issues, when he is wrong in this obvious issue.
i recall asking the same Mark pertinent questions which he side-stepped and hoped it will go away. Here it is again

i asked three questions na.
Do you know all the 613 laws?
Let me be clear please. You are saying you disobey all the 613 laws, you do not obey anyone.

This was the issue i was discussing with him. His point is that anyone that gives tithes MUST obey a so called set of 613 laws. Is that your view too? If yes, please answer the questions in blue. thanks.

How many of your errors that were pointed out have you admitted to? Have you admitted to your error on Oyedepo's little book yet? Pls bro, stop this sanctimonious demeanor. Its not doing you any good.

Image, you and I have had extensive discussions on the 613 laws issue on a previous thread and you stylishly abandoned it. Heres the thread again

www.nairaland.com/1430102/old-vs-new-covenant-revelation/10

I am not interested in wasting time on that again. Believe what you will bro. My interest is on those who have genuine questions and doubts about tithes and I'm happy they are getting the answers they seek.

You and others lie when you say you don't look to Malachi for instructions on tithe. The devotional by Pastor Chris has blown that lie into the open. Pls deal with that and stop trying to deflect attention from it.

This thread is about tithes, not Abraham's marital indiscretions. Let's stick to the topic

Gombs: Candour this one wey you dey my mind ...your reply similar to mine, notice the time difference.


Praise God

In fact I'm worried. How come u and I are thinking alike this morning? Infact since yesterday. Good times must be here

The truth is I agree with you and in the spirit of candour, I had to be open about it.

Cheers

nlMediator: That's not what the Bible says. Jesus told His disciples to drink His blood continually and Paul affirmed and elaborated on that. Neither was speaking in terms of using the blood in that context exclusively for the remission of sins. The Blood is of service to us today, as the communion illustrates.

Hear Christ himself

Luke 22:19-20
'And he took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is my body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of me.20.Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood, which is shed for you'

He said to take communion in remembrance of him and said it was for remission of sins, nothing about mouthing it to kill demons. This is repeated in Matt 26:26-28 and Mark 14:22-24

Hear Paul

1Cor 11:23-26
'For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, that the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:24.And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.25.After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, this cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as off as ye drink it, in remembrance of me.26.For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do show the Lord's death till he come

See all the bolded. Communion is strictly for remembrance of what Christ went through to obtain salvation for us. Nothing more, nothing less.

Christ said so, Paul repeated it.

nlMediator: Pleading the Blood to receive the manifestation of what the Blood accomplished is completely scriptural.

My bro, if I may ask. What did the blood accomplish?

@Gombs

I agree largely with your post and had no choice but to click like.

The blood of Christ is powerful but its basically for remmision of sins. Satan has been defeated. We only need to affirm it through the word and renew our minds to line up with the truth that the cross truly and completely emptied Satan of any power over Christians.

May God gives his children the grace to internalise this truth.

God bless you

In case anybody forgets, here's the tithe practice, format and reason practiced by Tithing Christians today thankfully written by a well known G.O

We need to be clear about it.

The Giving That Stands You Out – Thursday April 7, 2011 – Pastor Chris

And Joses, who by the apostles was surnamed Barnabas, (which is, being interpreted, The son of consolation,) a Levite, and of the country of Cyprus, Having land sold it, and brought the money, and laid it at the apostles’ feet (Acts 4:36-37).

It’s impossible for a Christian who only gives his tithes and offerings to feel like an accomplished giver, but the Bible lets us know these aren’t enough. Your tithes for example belong to God, and He expects you to give them to Him anyway. The man who does otherwise is a robber: “Will a man rob God: Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings” (Malachi 3:.

God is not a man (Numbers 23:19); He’s God. So you MUST give Him your tithes and your offerings, as God. Actually, you pay your tithe; you don’t give it, as you would your free-will offering. So your tithe is not a gift, because you don’t pay a gift. Your offering on the other hand isnt just a donation made to the Church, but a sacrifice offered to a divine being. God actually demanded for it in Exodus 23:15: “…None shall appear before Me empty-handed” (AMP).

So, beyond your tithes and giving your offerings, which are compulsory for every believer, you have to go the extra mile by getting financially involved in the spread of the Gospel. This type of giving is special because it isn’t a compulsion, but is done out of your love and commitment to the Gospel. 2 Corinthians 9:7 (AMP) says, “Let each one [give] as he has made up his own mind and purposed in his heart, not reluctantly or sorrowfully or under compulsion, for God loves (He takes pleasure in, prizes above other things, and is unwilling to abandon or to do without) a cheerful (joyous, “prompt to do it”) giver [whose heart is in his giving]. This is the giving that stands you out.”

Remember it’s in your interest and in your favour when you give to the Lord, for He has promised great returns and mighty harvest of blessings for the giver. So be sure to be counted among those who give financially towards the things of God. In our Ministry, we have several platforms through which we reach millions of souls around the world every day with the Gospel. Locate such opportunities and participate big-time. That’s how to get relevant in the Kingdom and make your life count.

Prayer
Dear Father, thank you for the available opportunities I have to give towards the work of the Kingdom today, realizing that they’ve been put in place for me to make my relevance and impact in world evangelism felt through my giving. Thank you Lord, for continuously increasing my capacity to give, in Jesus’ Name. Amen,

Further Study
Luke 8:2-3
And certain women, which had been healed of evil spirits and infirmities, Mary called Magdalene, out of whom went seven devils, And Joanna the wife of Chuza Herod's steward, and Susanna, and many others, which ministered unto him of their substance.

Daily Scripture Reading
1 Year Bible Luke 11:14-36
Reading plan Judges 3-4

2 Year Bible Matthew 27:55-66
Reading Plan Leviticus 7

Rhapsody of Realities Pastor Chris Oyakhilome

Let us all know what we actually believe and practice.