₦airaland Forum

Donspicey:

You mean The woman is Holy mary
But it was Still Jesus christ that gave John the Revelations...How come

All what you’re seeing in the book of Revelations had never happened before John’s era because as Revelation 1:10 put it, those events were to take place in the “Lord’s day”, which from John’s perspective was sometime in the future so the woman cannot possibly be Mary.

Janosky:

Isaiah 6:6-8, Jehovah said "whom shall I send?"
"I" in Isaiah 6:6-8 is how many spirits?
Did Isaiah 6:6-8 tell Iyambz that 'I' means "us"?
Jehovah addressed the legions of spirits with him in heaven, is Job 38:4-7 in your Bible?
John 4:24, Bros, you know Bible pass Jesus Christ, answer this question: God is how many spirits?
Bros, @John 4:24, did Jesus Christ & Isaiah 6:6-8
God is Spirit, "I", reject your claim?
Bros, is "I" Triune?
Bros, your Trinity mentors says "the Father God is not the Son, the Father God is not holy spirit" @ 2Cor 3:17,18, you shortchanged your Trinity GIBBERISH ,
Jehovah is not a ghost
@ Psalms 83:18, you no know the meaning of "Most High", @ John 17:3, "the ONLY"

Exodus 31:18
When He had finished speaking with him upon Mount Sinai, He gave Moses the two tablets of the testimony, tablets of stone, written by the finger of God.
Exodus 31:18, "He" is how many spirits?
Exodus 24:12
Now Jehovah said to Moses, “Come up to Me on the mountain and remain there, and I will give you the stone tablets with the law and the commandment which I have written for their instruction.”
Exodus 24:12, "Me"/"I" is how many spirits?
Exodus 32:16
The tablets were God’s work, and the writing was God’s writing engraved on the tablets.
Exodus 34:1
Now Jehovah said to Moses, “Cut out for yourself two stone tablets like the former ones, and I will write on the tablets the words that were on the former tablets which you shattered.
Luke 11:20
But if I cast out demons by the finger of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.
Matthew 12:28
But if I cast out demons by the spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.
* Luke 11:20 & Matthew 12:28, Jesus says you twisted Hebrews 3:7-12 & Psa 95:7-11.
Bros, is Acts 1:8 is missing in your Bible?
You speak through your phone, you speak through this forum, God spoke through his holy spirit

He forgot Hebrews 4:7 where Paul said it was David who said and recorded those words at Psalm 95. That means David is also Jehovah nah?

iyambz:

Nah, no need because the Bible is not in your heart. I have already exposed the watch tower society. It will do you no harm if you let the Bible stand independent, and speak to you.

And yet how many Watchtower did I quote for you in the last discussion? 100% of the Watchtower from the 1900s till date are all based on the Scriptures that’s why you’ll never see me quote any Watchtower for you.
You can find excuses for everything after all it’s not by force to listen to me or for me to listen to you. Each one has his or her choice to make voluntarily. Joshua 24:15

So whether you create 1billion threads about JWs this and JWs that, thousands of new disciples will still stream into Jehovah’s holy mountain each week around the globe. Isaiah 2:2
So be rest assured that your threads are reaping zero results because no one—not even you—can snatch a honesthearted and potential disciple out of the hands of my Master. John 10:28

iyambz:
I never wanted to post anything about the JWs, but one of the JWs last night kinda threatened to school me on sound doctrine he knows nothing about.

Threatened or you chickened out from the discussion?

freshboi88:

Let's say I'm more interested in seeing that more souls don't perish in the lake of fire. And I don't see a group that deceives people and twist scriptures more than JW so do not be surprised when I get fired up when I see a JW thread.

---

Self acclaimed victory u say. I am your tormentor. I remember how I finished DappaD and Janosky on Holy Spirit till they ran away.
For u when I finish u scripturally u will run and hide behind that your losers quote "show me how the Holy Spirit is working in your church"

---

something like that.
Hahahaha........reading this I can imagine your face....hahahahahahah

Back then in school when we performed science/engineering experiments, the project usually had two aspects—theory, which is gradually developed from hypothesis and the heuristics[practical] aspect which I remember carried more points though it was usually based on small-scale prototypical projects.

Two students can be debating and arguing over the already laid down principles[theory] which in the past had been proved to work but instead of sticking to the principles, one of the students now feels that his own surmise is the best. Of what further use is debates? The whole issue will be settled when real-life experiments are conducted so as to find out which of the proposed theories are actually functional.


The Pharisees and Jesus were both making use of the Law of Moses. Jesus was following the Law diligently[Matthew 5:17] because he knew that the Law was to lead the Israelites to him[Messiah].
Deuteronomy 18:15, Galatians 3:24

But the Pharisees felt they knew better and contaminated the Law with countless traditions. Matthew 15:3. They weren’t following the already laid down principles given by Moses that would have led them to the Messiah and so they often sneered at him, abused and rejected him.
John 5:46

Does Jesus still have to contend with the Pharisees? The Law and Prophets would be fulfilled in Jesus Christ because not even one portion of the Law would go unfulfilled.
Matthew 5:18, Luke 16:17
All that’s left for honest spectators is to observe the fruits/works of both Jesus and the Pharisees and conclude which of them originates with God.
Matthew 11:19


Jehovah’s Witnesses claim that holy spirit is not a person but God’s active force for accomplishing his will and purpose which is in the line with the Scriptures. Psalm 33:6, Luke 11:20

You on the other hand claim that holy spirit is a person, because of a misunderstanding of some Scriptures like John 14:26, Acts 13:2 etc and so you feel yours is the most correct even though it’s out of line with the laid down principles[Bible].

Is there any need of debates? Because arguments are not useful to anybody. It only makes what is discussed look like a fable if there’s no real life experimentation on it.

Jesus already stated at Matthew 7:15-20, that we should be careful of false prophets[wolves] in sheep clothing who would turn everything upside down by presenting good as bad and bad as good[compare Isaiah 5:20]. He also said that we can know who truly is for him when we recognize the fruits[works] of all those who claim to be for him. So rather than argue and argue with no end in sight, why not show through real-life implementation that the proposed theories are actually functional and profitable? Because that’s the only way in which true wisdom can be distinguished from the erroneous one. Luke 7:35

iyambz:

1. A JW is a lost mam because he doesn't believe that Jesus is God, and he doesn't believe in the blood atonement.
2. A lost man does not know true doctrine. Why? (1 Cor 2:14 kjv) "But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned."
3. The Bible is not in the heart of a JW, but the watch tower society. So quoting a Bible verse to JW is a waste of time. Pay attention to my previous response, I didn1t use Bible verses, except (1 Cor 15).
4. The religious groups which i mentioned on this thread was a reference about the JWs and SDA.
5. You should know by now that I know JWs inside and outside. Why? Because the Bible says it all.

Mr iyambz, you called the Catholic Church a cult yet it was them who handed down the false doctrines of Trinity and Hellfire to your various churches which you blindly swallowed. It means you’re also a debased cultist.

As for the Bible, you should know by now that only JW’s are especially qualified to handle to the Bible[2Timothy 3:16-17] that’s why you couldn’t debunk any of the earlier points I stated and you kept on making blunders which has no basis in the Scriptures.

That one is your headache. We both know where liars and deceitful men are headed—destruction.
Revelation 21:8

At least when you want to put up another identity, try to change your vocabulary and the way you articulate your words so that I won’t catch you off guard.

BassReeves:
It is no slur. What is a slur is you repeatedly addressing me other BassReeves. You've just proven to me you are behaving just as like a stubborn goat by its nature does
There is no monopoly of knowledge. The more the merrier, who have also come to the knowledge, that the four-lettered alphabets, YHWH, otherwise known as, theTetragrammaton, verbalised as Yahweh, and even Jehovah, the artificial Latinized contraption hybrid formed from combining the Latin letters JHVH with the vowels of Adonai, is not God's real name.So, now you want to know what scripture please, that states that God's real name cannot be told because it is too incomprehensibleIt might be a MuttleyLaff opinion, but fortunately, I dont peddle opinions, I trade with cast iron facts
You seem to be slow on the up take, and not getting it that the four-lettered alphabets, YHWH, otherwise known as, the Tetragrammaton, verbalised as Yahweh, and even JEHOVAH, the artificial Latinized contraption hybrid formed from combining the Latin letters JHVH with the vowels of Adonai, is not God's real name. When will this biblical fact sink in your brain?
What one man takes as garbage, another man sees as culinary delicacy truffleIt is a really big shame that inspire of knowing all about Deuteronomy 6:4, John 4:24, Galatians 3:20 etc you still have a problem understanding the dynamics of the trinity. You have a big fat bone to pick with the concept of trinity. You even are unable to wrap round your puny brain cell, how possible it is, for God, that is ONE, to become whatsoever it is necessary for Him to become.Do you know what your stumbling block is? It is your lack of awareness what the four-lettered alphabets, YHWH, otherwise known as, the Tetragrammaton, verbalised as Yahweh, and even Jehovah, the artificial Latinized contraption hybrid formed from combining the Latin letters JHVH with the vowels of Adonai, means. What it is articulating and what purpose eternally it is serving that has got you blindsided.You're only arming me with more ammunition and reinforcement, by bringing up here any posts of MuttleyLaff. MuttleyLaff must have watered ground and being a scourge to you and others to extent, that a simple sight of an archetype of MuttleyLaff is causing you worries, fidgetiness and alarms

iyambz:
Of course, JWs are earthly people. According to my Bible, the earthly people are the Jews, not JWs. My home is the New Jerusalem.

Sorry what do you even know you typed up there? Do you need a lecture this night, iyambz?

iyambz:
[s]
The tribulation is because the Jews rejected Christ. It's called the time of Jacob's trouble. Our gospel is not the gospel of the kingdom, but the gospel of the grace of God according to (1 Cor 15:1-4). That gospel of the kingdom will be preached again to the Jews during the tribulation, and everlasting gospel will be preached to the Gentiles. During the tribulation, the law will come back again, no more grace. That's why you have to endure to the end.[/s]

That’s what happens when you mix unscriptural belief with conspiracy theories.

iyambz:

We are in the last days, no doubt about that. My point is that it's not known by world events, but by personality traits listed in (2 Tim 3:1-5). Those personality traits are Christians of today. A Christian should not be worried about getting the mark because he won't be here during the tribulation anyways. His focus should be his relationship with Jesus Christ. I'm pre-trib by the way.

“We are in the last days” is supported by world events too. Such that are listed out at Matthew 24:3-14 and Luke 21:9-11
Wars, famines, natural disasters, pestilences[diseases] such as the COVID-19 we are currently facing, even the worldwide preaching of God’s Kingdom by Jehovah’s Witnesses[Matthew 24:14] are acting as a prelude to when the great tribulation comes.

Because notice what Jesus said at Matthew 24:21 concerning this. He said “Then” meaning next or afterwards, that is, after those world events at Matthew 24:3-14 have taken place before a great tribulation/distress will begin.

So if you won’t be here during the great tribulation, how come Revelation 7:14 mentions a great crowd who survive the great tribulation?
Because if those in Revelation 7:14 were never in the tribulation, then they cannot be said to coming out of it now, can they?

You people are too funny. When Jesus said that his disciples must endure through tribulations[Matthew 24:13], you want to run away to where exactly?

It’s just a pity that these things have been hidden from the eyes of many like you.
Matthew 13:13-15, 2Cor 4:4

Mr iyambz there is enough Biblical and historical evidence that we are actually living in the “last days” according to Matthew 24. I would have loved to expatiate more on that but since you have already concluded that “Jehovah’s Witnesses are a cult”, I’ll keep my mouth shut and not give precious pearls/gems to swine. Matthew 7:6

So be serious, you’re really waiting for somebody to come and imprint a literal mark on your forehead abi? Or as you people have modernized it—implanted chip or whatever.
Did you forget that Revelation was written in signs? Revelation 1:1
Do those who have the name of the Father in their foreheads, literally have it inscribed?
Revelation 7:3?

MaxInDHouse:
Don't mind him jare, he wants you to define your god that's a MYSTERY to all it's worshipers unlike his own God that he can PREACH and TEACH all about anytime, anywhere.
Haddeylium be careful o!
I have warned him for you, he won't try it again!

I told PeaceLoveJoy earlier on that his Trinity was a mystery and if he tried explaining it using clear logic, he would only land himself in more trouble since the Trinity dogma is completely illogical and worthless. He didn’t disappoint me when he still made the attempt.
LOL.

haddeylium:
wait, is that mutteylaff?

The evidence points to it being him.

BassReeves:
[s]If you insist on addressing me other than BassReeves, well then, its your prerogative. Goats are one of the animals I know that are headstrong and stubborn enough like that in refusing to change an attitude.[/s]

What’s with the slur if you strongly believe I’m wrong about your real identity? You just about prove me right.

You have my duck rolled out in the wrong order.
I maintain that God's real name is unknown. I also maintain that the four-lettered alphabets, YHWH, otherwise known as, the Tetragrammaton, verbalised as Yahweh, and even Jehovah, the artificial Latinized contraption hybrid formed from combining the Latin letters JHVH with the vowels of Adonai, is not God's real name.

You’ve asserted with your other moniker that YHWH is just a descriptor name since it means “He Causes to Become” or “He Brings into Existence What Exists” and that’s okay. But that’s the beauty and significance of it because many more in the Bible bore descriptor names such as Abraham, Esau, Moses, Solomon etc.

Now when it comes to matter of “the name is too incomprehensible” yada yada, that is not quoting me, but that is quoting what the bible says.

In what Scripture please?

No expects you to know everything about God. What you are being made to understand, is that you are not privileged to know God's real name because God's real name is and has always been a closed book.

That has always been your opinion, MuttleyLaff.
When ever Scriptures like Exodus 3:15 and Isaiah 42:8 were rolled out, you’d always fine a way to construe.

Nowhere in Psalm 115:1-8 or Jeremiah 10:10-12, is God's real name stated or mentioned. Point out where in Psalm 115:1-8 or Jeremiah 10:10-12, is God's real name stated or mentioned. Or say what you think God's real name is.

Seems you need to be spoonfed.

Psalm 115:1 [ASV]
“Not unto us, O JEHOVAH, not unto us, But unto thy name give glory, For thy lovingkindness, and for thy truth’s sake.”

Jeremiah 10:10 [ASV]
“But JEHOVAH is the true God; he is the living God, and an everlasting King: at his wrath the earth trembleth, and the nations are not able to abide his indignation.”

[s]
God has chosen the foolish, absurd and illogical things of the world to confound the wise in their eyes DappaD and God has chosen the weak things of the world that He may confound the kind of people like you DappaD[/s]

Garbage as usual. 1Corinthians 1:27 has nothing to do with the rubbish you’re typing now. Imagine trying to explain the nature of God wrt three states of water and rays of light. And as if the faulty Trinitarian’s view wasn’t bad enough, you went ahead to claim that God existed as infinite number of persons even though the Bible specifically says that God is just ONE[Deuteronomy 6:4, John 4:24, Galatians 3:20].
For shame, MuttleyLaff, for shame.

MuttleyLaff:
With all due respect my dear highly esteemed loving brother, please just answer the "are you putting limitation on God by suggesting that: It is hard, difficult, impossible and beyond God to send Himself on an errand as a Son to earth?" and "are you putting limitation on God by suggesting that: It is hard, difficult, impossible and beyond God to project out from Himself to then after, concurrently exist in two places?" questions first with a binary Yes or No, then it would have been alright to write your explanations and defences.
Anyway, I have to quickly dash out for a few good hours and so will have to come back to all this, when I am back in. When I do, I will respond properly to your post and shine more light on that will give more illumination on why God, though is infinite/infinity, presents the Godhead three dimensionally (i.e. trinity) lmso
Wish you an all rounder all year long blessed 2021

BassReeves:
If you are serious, you should at least have the decency to address me correctly.
You honourably have admitted that the J-consonant doesn’t exist in Hebrew alphabet and accepted this to be is true, so whats with your alleging that goalposts were shifted. Why not do a check to see that I challenged that God's real name is unknown, that the Tetragrammaton, verbalised as Yahweh, or even Jehovah, the artificial Latinized contraption hybrid formed from combining the Latin letters JHVH with the vowels of Adonai, is not God's real name,

MuttleyLaff, we’ve gone over this before and you know it. First you claimed that the J-consonant doesn’t exist in Hebrew but when you gradually saw that the tables turned, you resorted to your usual “the name is too incomprehensible” yada yada.

BassReeves:
Water will have to freeze in the Lake of Fire first, before you'll ever stand a chance of knowing what God's real name is.
Your brain hasn't the computing power to understand it because its a name it is potent, powerful, wonderful, incomprehensible and overwhelming.

It was for a reason why, I asked you to give an answer to 'what your name is, who you are and what you are' questions, but to start your replying statements or answers, with: I am ...

MuttleyLaff:
No one on the Religion forum knows your personal name, we know you as Blabbermouth, but Blabbermouth defo isnt your personal name, lmso. Yhwh is not God's personal name. It also is a descriptor. Of course, I am sure you are aware its the four Hebrew alphabets Y, H, W and H, that when vocalised you end up with Yahweh.
The Bible politely gives the reason for not saying what God's personal name is, and the reason for not disclosing the personal name is because the name is wonderful, meaning it is impossible to understand, is not able to be understood and/or it is incomprehensible.

Hearing what the name is, will render the hearer, dumbfounded, lost for words and effectively speechless. So the personal name of God is unknown.

Nobody is saying that we know everything about God because we can only know a fragment[1/10^infinity] of his ways through the Bible[Job 26:14] and his wisdom is unsearchable.
Isaiah 40:28, Romans 11:33

But concerning the name of the God of the Bible, that one is clearly stated so that the true God can be distinguished from the all other false gods.
Psalm 115:1-8, Jeremiah 10:10-12

just as haddeylium, PeaceLoveJoy, DappaD, BassReeves etc, are not our real names. Or is DappaD your real name then?

The reason, if you’ve not realised, why I didn‘t respond to this earlier is because the analogy is totally weak, absurd and illogical.

BassReeves:
The real clown here and a dishonest one for that matter is actually you, who couldn't correct DappaD that I never said anything about nobody knows how God’s name is supposed to be pronounced et cetera et cetera, but what I posited was that the four-lettered alphabets, YHWH, otherwise known as the Tetragrammaton, is not God's real name

MuttleyLaff, so after making the claim that the J-consonant doesn’t exist in Hebrew[which is true], you then went ahead to shift goalposts?
Honestly, I expected more from you.

BassReeves sounds more and more like MuttleyLaff to me. I just figured it out.

PeaceLoveJoy:

I will allow the underlined sentence to slide slightly, but you will still receive your dose in part
Read the underlined part here What is JWs? Does it not mean Jehovah Witnesses? Then who brought about my continuation with "my friends". What does he meant by the phrase? Am I the one who brought the denomination here into play?
I have told you,.... you are a mu..mu. 1st class one. This is a simple case (just now oooo) you should search well above, but because you are so desperate to choke down on me your real truth, you refused to train yourself on how to not react spontaneously. I see that you are really sick.


It's time for me to not respond to you and your fellow JW who came here to continue writing "Your god/God". Fine it means your god/God is different from mine. No problem. Since it is the case, I have nothing to say again.


Goodluck to you. No more response to you and the other guy in particular here. But if I get to anywhere you choke your own truth down the throat of others, I will blast you seriously. I assure you.
Keep to your denomination, and best of luck with what you are taught there. Bye!

As for the highlighted, It’s not about writing or claiming, it’s a reality that Jehovah’s Witnesses have their own God. Isaiah 43:10-12, Micah 4:5

I don’t think I ever rained insults on you personally so whether you respond to me or not, that’s your own problem because this is a public forum. After all you were the one who quoted me on the first page. Even after all the slur you lashed out on iyambz because he slandered your Church(god), you now mentioned me and became tame and expected what in the end?
Please move jare.

PeaceLoveJoy:

I pray you do not cross the line and turn to be an atheist cos it is a dangerous line you are about to launch into. A very dangerous path. This is why I refused to lead the discussion and make any new revelation because I know atheists are ready to flood this thread at any opportunity they see. Lol. I came in fast when Tetragrammaton was mentioned. Just look at how I put forward variants of the same original Hebrew word and where Adonai, Elohi, and some other came into the picture. It is deep sir. You may disprove them, but before you do, search first. This is my point.

Yes nah I will become an atheist because I don’t believe in the Trinity forged by your Catholic Church abi? I saw how you quickly dismissed the clear evidence of the ruthlessness of your Church during the Dark Ages. Continue.
You’re always yelling that one shouldn’t force one’s opinions down the throats of others, did your own Church take the same approach? If not for religious freedom today, we would still be tied up in the same net of forced belief.
Faith(trust), according to Hebrews 11:1 has to be based on convincing evidence and is not based on mere blind faith or credulity so if your Church began forcing their beliefs of Trinity and Hellfire on people, then what’s left for you is to investigate for yourself and be noble minded like the Boreoans. Acts 17:11

MaxInDHouse:
I don't get you Sir!

Are you saying DappaD undermines as in rule out the importance of the name of our God?

The guy’s hypocrisy is actually stinking really bad. For someone who said he doesn’t bring up denomination into a discussion, look how far he let himself go.

PeaceLoveJoy:
Thank you for knocking this off. Read below what your fellow Jehovah witness wrote before I took him on it.
Lol. You see how a fellow Witness knocked out another. Your fellow witness brought out the importance of his name. And here you are knocking it out. Good in-house knockout. This is Mayweather at work. Thanks bro!

Quote me or him out of context that’s your cup of tea. The importance of God’s name entails knowing the real meaning that’s why so far we’ve been talking about the root words[etymology] of the Tetragrammaton which is hawah[“to become”]. Following that, then what would be considered next is why we should consider the name in the first place, why there’s much controversy about this name, how this name relates to salvation and most importantly, why the name has to be cleared[sanctified] off all the reproach heaped on it. So please stop quibbling over semantics and let’s focus on the main issue here. Apart from MaxInDHouse, there are still several Witnesses I can call and we will all still speak in agreement(1Corinthians 1:10) so what point are you trying to make?

PeaceLoveJoy:
The importance of His name should be used to disprove Trinity if it is so important to you. This is your job. If you cannot do it, I accept your permission to leave. This is what a Christian should do. It shows your level of revelation or faith. And I am not fighting you. I allow you to believe what you want to believe without attacking you or your denomination. You and your fellow DappaD should learn this too. Do not choke your faith or truth down the throats of others.
I do not have enemies. Everyone is my friend. The onus is on you to disprove it successfully. And pro Trinity should support it successfully. I am saying both parties cannot successfully defend their positions. So, may the good LORD bless you for not getting angry after you have been unable to convince us successfully.
Let me you the words of Jesus as my final words to you: Be it unto you according to the level of your faith. AMEN!

As for the highlighted, that’s a different thing altogether because we’ve only been talking about the etymology of God’s name.

MaxInDHouse:
In that case i tender an apology, my only interest is to buttress the point my brother DappaD made on the importance of our God's name.
Please you can continue with your friends, JWs have what interests us in threads and since we don't see that here i suppose it's OK if we take our leave.
Thanks!

Unfortunately for them, their double-standard approach doesn’t apply here so if they’re to be taken seriously, then they must write and pronounce all those Hebrew names in their original form since vowels do not exist in those Hebrew names.

BassReeves, what do you mean by nobody knows the name of God according to the Bible? I don’t think you expunged Exodus 3:15, Psalm 83:18, Isaiah 42:8, 54:5 out from your Bible though?

BassReeves & PeaceLoveJoy, yes if you choose to use God’s name as Yahweh that’s okay and fine, but why not also use Jesus’ name in the proper Hebrew which is Yehoshua? Jesus[Joshua] is just the Latinized form of Iesous[Greek] and Yeshua or Yehoshua[Hebrew]


BassReeves claims that there is no J in the Hebrew tongue, that is true, but how then did the following Biblical names come about? Jehoshaphat, John, James, Josiah, Jeremiah, Jonathan, Jehu, Jehoachin, Jonadab? These are just the Latinized forms of the Greek equivalent of those names so if you want me to take you seriously, please start using all those names in their original Hebrew.

PeaceLoveJoy, as for the Aramaic rendering of the Tetragrammaton, it’s not stated in the Bible because only small portions of Ezra, Daniel and one verse from Jeremiah used the original Aramaic and the word ‘YHWH’ wasn’t rendered in any but Aramaic is like the sister language of Hebrew so the rendering would have turned out quite the same.

Ἰαω or Ἰαουέ or Iao/Iaho/Jaho/Jahve is the Greek equivalent of the Hebrew יהוה‎ or Yhwh/Jhvh and this appeared in the Greek Septuagint translation of the Hebrew Scriptures.

Where I find BassReeves funny is where he claims nobody knows how God’s name is supposed to be pronounced et cetera et cetera. Please who REALLY knows how the other names in the Old Testament are supposed to be pronounced since the proper names of men in Hebrew actually contained no vowels? It was the Greek rendering that really shed light to how those names in Hebrew should be pronounced otherwise we’d be left at a standstill.

PeaceLoveJoy:
...

I apologize for the outburst. But you’re actually not getting me. I don’t shy away from discussions such as these. I’m not saying you cannot ask auxiliary questions, but, when I make an assertion(claim), all that’s needed from you is to try and debunk it that’s how the discussion moves forward. Not to incessantly ask the same questions over and over again.

For example, I said the name of God according to the Bible is יהוה‎ in Hebrew. When transliterated to English consonants is YHWH i.e. Yod Heh Waw Heh and adding English vowels, it would then be rendered Yahweh and translated to modern English is Jehovah

The real meaning of the word יהוה‎ stays the same when translated in English to Jehovah.

Exodus 3:15

“And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, יהוה‎ God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations.”

Isaiah 42:8

“I am יהוה‎: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.”

Take note of the bolded in the above verses. That’s the original Hebrew word transliterated as YHWH in those verses which means “He Causes to Become” as most scholars agree too since the root word HWH[hawah] means “To Be”.

Remember I told you that the Bible was neither written in ancient nor modern English. So יהוה‎[YHWH] in Hebrew can never be translated as LORD because the Hebrew word for LORD is אָדוֹן which means ADONAI and this doesn’t appear in any of those verses I quoted in the onset but יהוה‎[YHWH] appears there instead.
Deuteronomy 6:4

@PeaceLoveJoy, please keep my name out of the same sentence with this nonsensical Trinity of yours. I’m one of Jehovah's Witnesses and I don’t believe in such garbage.
My own God JEHOVAH is ONE not a three-faced god. Deuteronomy 6:4
My own God JEHOVAH is not a mystery, we can KNOW him and his ways/standards through study of the Scriptures.
Psalm 103:8, Amos 3:7, John 17:3

So stop mentioning me to make it look as if me and you have an agreement on anything concerning your Trinity, we are on opposite sides here.
Luke 16:26

The reason why I ended the previous discussion was because, you kept on asking the same questions over and over again. The only thing left for you to do was to debunk my assertions, not to keep asking me the same thing when my answers are always from within the realm of the Scriptures.

PeaceLoveJoy:

It gets so exciting when the same KJV which Witnesses accused of Johnenine Comma is the same version which consistently use JEHOVAH in the references DappaD gave in support that God's name is ONLY Jehovah. Facts are what I am pulling out. And he has not yet given the reason why he accepted JEHOVAH written by KJV and he has refused till date to accept there might be strong reasons KJV added the phrases in Johnenine Comma he rejected. Can you see that I am not asking you to shred KJV.

Here are the standards we are to follow in the discussion: Let God[through the Bible] be found true and let every other man be a liar. Romans 3:4

Please I’ll have you know that the Bible was not written in either ancient or modern English. It was written in ancient Hebrew, Aramaic and Koine Greek. So if we are to consider the real meanings of the words in the Bible, we must take into account what the word actually means in the original language.


I used the KJV as a reference for the name “Jehovah” in those specific verses, which are Exodus 6:3, Psalm 83:18 and Isaiah 12:2 because the version is popular amongst many and the translators did not stamp the name out there. In the newer version however, they’ve changed the name “Jehovah” to “LORD” as usual.
There are other versions that render Jehovah’s name to some degree which is the American Standard Version. The New World Translation used by Jehovah’s Witnesses restores the original rendering of YHWH[Hebrew] in the Latinized form “Jehovah” to its rightful places which appear more 7,000times in both the Old and New Testaments. Several translators replaces God’s name with titles such as ADONAI[Hebrew] which translates to LORD[English]. By doing this, impetus was also given to the Trinity doctrine because it was assumed that Lord in both the OT and NT was referring to Jesus. On the contrary, Psalm 110:1 shows two Lords, one greater than the other.
In the original Hebrew and translated directly to English, it would read “Jehovah said to my Lord”.
Jesus applied those words to himself because he knew that he was the lesser Lord.
Matthew 22:42-45
“Lord”[Hebrew: Adonai, Greek: Kyrios] is just a title meaning “Master” and even several humans[Abraham,Moses,David] were called the same title but they also had personal names. Genesis 18:13, Exodus 32:22, 1Samuel 25:24, 1Corinthians 8:5
So in essence what I’ve been saying is that the Hebrew word YHWH does not translate to LORD in English but rather “Yahweh/Jehovah” and that is where the whole mix up is coming from.

Satan is also doing his best to blind the eyes of many people so that the truth will not come out.
2Corinthians 4:4

@PeaceLoveJoy, whatever rocks your boat. Carry on.

@PeaceLoveJoy
Go and search about your Church’s history nobody is forging anything. That’s what the Vatican have tried to hide for years in their secret vaults. Unfortunately for them, the history books do not lie.

The translators of the KJV and the others took it upon themselves to remove God’s personal name[JEHOVAH] and replaced it with Lord/Adonai. They thought what they were doing was right, meanwhile they were only blindly following Jewish tradition.

Exodus 3:15&Isaiah 42:8 states that YHWH[Hebrew] i.e. JEHOVAH[English] is God’s name forever and anyone who tries to stamp it out is only being mischievous. So do not bring up the whole “Lord” issue because it simply means “Master” or “Owner” and is not the personal name of God. “El-Shaddai” simply means “God Almighty” and not the name of God.
Genesis 17:1, Revelation 15:3

The “Trinity” doctrine is a mystery as you guys always say, so when you try to explain it you’ll only put yourself in more trouble. After all I’ve encountered many as in many of your kind who have their own versions and definitions about this “Trinity”.

Concerning the destruction of all forms of life in Noah’s day and the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah, God’s Word the Bible makes it clear that the ungodly men underwent everlasting destruction/annihilation. They did not suffer in any “hellfire” after they were destroyed. 2Peter 2:5-6, Jude 7

Go and look at Isaiah 66:24, the carcasses of wicked men are thrown into the fire. Not living humans. I’m not the one who said it. It parallels Mark 9:48 because Jesus drew his words from that Bible verse.

The Pharisees in Luke 16 were listening to Jesus Christ[Luke 16:14] these self righteous men saw the common Jew as nothing and they expected the Messiah to align with them, but when he didn’t, they often sneered, abused and maligned he and his works, so Jesus said that a significant change was going to occur between the self righteous persons and the common man in Judea[Luke 16:16] and that’s what set the pace for the parable that Jesus told in Luke 16:19-31.

sonmvayina:

Funny, what was the name of the pharaoh?..
Its like "story story..story, there lived a king who had 3 wives.......
At the end of it, they ask you " what did you learn from the story? And you answer...that we should be humble...
Life is about the journey..journey from egypt(ignorance ) to promise land(spiritual enlightenment)
Not a history text book..

If the Pentateuch[Torah] is just a mere STORY, then why are you expecting a REAL LIFE Messiah?

PeaceLoveJoy:

I looked into it, and it is talking about omission of comas, and I got hooked. It is saying something special, and I want to know. At times, when I see new stuff, I just beat my head why I didnt see them earlier. Bro, in a short sentence, what are you saying so as I am looking deep, I can take note of your position. What exactly is the conclusion of Comma Johannine? Saying what exactly? Personally, I don't rely only KJV again. The story behind the version is political, and there are stunts King James performed. He was not even a Christian. A beg, leave that guy alone, and let us read your thought. Not saying I have accepted your position, but kindly drop your thought in details. Just ignore that guy.

PeaceLoveJoy:

Ok. You gave a reference - Comma Johannine for Trinity that I have asked you questions above. Nice! Please, could you state your position on hellfire? And kindly give references to support your position again here.
If you have evidences about your position on Trinity, kindly drop them too. Not arguing with you. I just want to get facts from you.

Good morning. I’ll like to state my position first that I’m one of Jehovah’s Witnesses.

As for the “Comma Johannine” issue, it’s already well documented that the words “the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.” that appear in the KJV translation of 1John 5:7-8 do not appear in the original Greek manuscripts. Erasmus[a 16th century Dutch scholar] corrected the errors that were spuriously added in the Latin Vulgate that’s why the Roman Catholic Church pressured him to include it in his translation.
Those spurious words have been used for so long to purport the Trinity doctrine but that’s already old news that has been debunked severally.

The Bible clearly states that the God of the Bible has a name—Jehovah.
Exodus 6:3, Psalm 83:18, Isaiah 12:2
So rather than talking about a three-faced god, the Bible asserts that Jehovah is one God.
Deuteronomy 6:4, Galatians 3:20

Now, Jehovah has several spirit sons[angels], including Gabriel [Job 38:7, Daniel 7:10]
But one especially stands out as being God’s only begotten Son[John 3:16] by virtue of him being the first creature ever made by God—Jesus Christ. Colossians 1:15-16
Jesus and his Father, Jehovah enjoy a very close relationship. Matthew 11:27, John 17:5
That’s why the qualities of his Father such as humility, compassion, love[2Samuel 22:36, Psalm 103:8] rubbed off on him to the point that he could say that anyone who had seen him had already seen the Father. John 14:9

Even while on earth, Jesus admitted to having a God[Matthew 6:9, Mark 10:18, John 20:17]
He also acknowledged that he was not on the same level with his God and Father[John 14:28, Philippians 2:6] Jesus’ disciples addressed him properly as the Son of God[Matthew 16:16, John 20:31] so the identity of Jesus Christ is not hidden or a mystery.

After returning to heaven, we still see that Jesus continues subject to his God and Father, Jehovah because according to Psalm 110:1 and Acts 2:34-35, Jehovah commanded Jesus to sit down at his right hand and exercise patience for the appointed time of the nations to be fulfilled.
Luke 21:24

Also in Revelation 3:12,21, there is also a clear distinction made between God and Jesus. The latter kept on calling Jehovah, “My God” “My Father” because he knew that his authority was given to him by Jehovah.
Matthew 28:18, Philippians 2:9-11, Hebrews 1:8

The Trinity doctrine was fabricated and forged so that the name of the true God—Jehovah would become hidden. An essential part of someone’s salvation is acknowledging Jehovah’s name. Joel 2:32, Romans 10:13
Hence by inventing the Trinity doctrine[worthless tradition], the Catholic Church put many in line for destruction, not salvation.
Matthew 23:13, Mark 7:13

And so, according to Jesus’ words recorded at John 17:3, everlasting life[salvation] depends on knowing the difference between the true God Jehovah and his Son whom God sent. Compare John 6:38

Now concerning the doctrine of “hellfire”, please note that several major and minor religions also have this doctrine e.g. Islam, Buddhism etc
The Catholic Church adopted this false teaching from the pagan worshipers around them and even went as far as including purgatory and Limbo. This false teaching was used for centuries by the Catholic Church to have a cause for extorting, maiming and even killing innocent men, women and children who did not subscribe to their beliefs. If you think I’m making all of these up, please go and read up about the Inquisition and the crusades[so-called holy wars].

On the other hand, the Bible doesn’t teach of such an abhorrent thing as a “hellfire”. I know, you might want to go and quote Scriptures such as Matthew 5:22, Mark 9:48, Luke 16:19-31 but bear in mind that those Scriptures have nothing to do with a fiery place of torment as the Luke 16 account is a parable with a hidden meaning and the other two contain the word “Gehenna” which was a place outside Jerusalem where rubbish was burnt and dead criminals who didn’t deserve a proper burial were incinerated. Jesus could not have been referring to a place of everlasting torment for two solid reasons:

1. The idea alone of burning someone alive in fire disgusts Jehovah. Jeremiah 7:31
It was also partly for this reason that God exterminated the Canaanites, because those pagan worshipers burnt their children alive in fire. Deuteronomy 12:31
So why would God go around his own standards and burn sinners[who made it their choice not to serve him] forever in fire?

2. Mark 9:48 parallels the inspired words of an ancient Hebrew prophet, Isaiah.
The bodies of those going to Gehenna, as has been previously stated, were dead bodies, not live ones. That’s the reason why Isaiah 66:24 says that it is the corpses/carcasses of wicked men who will be thrown into the fire and not people who are alive.

The words “hell”, “hellfire” and “lake of fire” mean totally different things and are usually interchanged.

The first one “hell” is often rendered “pit” in the Old Testament, but the actual rendering is meant to be “Sheol” in Hebrew, “Hades” in Greek and “Grave” in modern English which means the common grave of mankind and depicts a state/condition of inactivity/unconsciousness.
Ecclesiastes 9:10

The second one as has been said was fabricated.
The translator of the KJV felt at liberty to replace “Gehenna” with “hellfire” so as to scare people and unfortunately other translators followed suit. But they don’t know the harm they were bringing to themselves. Revelation 22:18-19

The third one “lake of fire” symbolizes the “second death” which means total destruction/annihilation, a death from which there can no be hope of resurrection and not everlasting torment.
Revelation 21:8

Interestingly, Revelation 20:14 says that “hell” will be thrown into the “lake of fire”.
Does that mean “hell” would literally suffer and burn? Or does it not rather mean that “hell” which is actually “Grave” would become nonexistent in order for people not to die anymore?
Compare Revelation 21:3-4

Know today, that Jehovah wants all to serve him from their hearts and out of love for him[Matthew 22:37-40] and not out of morbid fear, since God himself is the embodiment of love.
1John 4:8

iyambz:
(1 John 5:7 kjv) “For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.”

Go and research more on “Comma Johannine” if you want to understand the truth behind the rendering of that verse. Other reliable Bible translations have cleared up the confusion already.