₦airaland Forum

brocab:
Can I ask dolphinheart what are you talking about, none of what you have written make any sense.

a worn out excuse!, it is used when one can't respond to truth surpported with the scriptures, you could not respond to the issues, the questions and most expecially the scriptures posted their, you cannot quote it talk less of explainING it.

And every time I had shared the word of God to you, it seems you think by tearing the words I give to you apart, this gives you some sort of power that strengthens you, over myself and God's word.

you did not share the word of God with me, I've asked you to qoute and explain several scriptures from the word of God for months now, you have vehemently refused to do so!

To be honest, the word of God stands above, and everything you say against it will not prevail.

therefore, stop lying against the word of God, twisting and adding to what it says, cus it will not work!, listen to the word of God and stop being blind to certain verses in it!.
For example in a post I posted directly to you on 3:11 PM , June 10, page 89 on this thread,( PLS NOTE, UP TILL NOW HE COULD NOT RESPOND TO THAT POST) you said :

{John 10:30} -Quote the bold is a lie it never said so.

unlike you, I quoted that verse out for all to see, I said I agree with what it said , and also pointed to sentences that that verse did not say or imply!, you keep on adding " one God to that verse, but the verse never said so!

Look at how I replied you :
[b]" How can I say say the verse never said so, of cus , the verse said what is recorded their na!
But I can say , with full confidence and full conviction that the verse never said any of the following :
"I and the Father are one God ”
"I and the Father are one person”
"I and the Father are one spirit”

what did john 10: 30 say?
Joh 10:30I and the Father are one.”

what did Jesus mean?
Joh 10:37If I am not doing the works of my Father, do not believe me.
Joh 10:38But if I am doing them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, so that you may come to know and may continue knowing that the Father is in union with me and I am in union with the Father.”

Joh 17:11“I am no longer in the world, but they are in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, watch over them on account of your own name, which you have given me, so that they may be one JUST AS we are one.

Joh 17:21 so that they may all be one, just as you, Father, are in union with me and I am in union with you, that they also may be in union with us so that the world may believe that you sent me."[/b]

PLS NOTE ONCE AGAIN THAT BROCAB COULD NOT RESPOND TO THOSE SCRIPTURES , HE COULD NOT QUOTE AND EXPLAIN THEM, EXPECIALLY THE UNDERLINED SENTENCES, YET HE IS TRYING TO CLAIM THAT HE IS TELL ING ME ABOUT THE WORD OF GOD.

Do You honestly believe you are right and the bible is wrong-this of course makes you look like a fool, I am trying to help you dolphinheart to see the scriptures as they stand, of course you believe otherwise, and because you are spiritually dead, which doesn't help.

I never had that assumption or belief, it is you that now look like a fool by assuming that I had that kind of believe, I've always used the scriptures as part of my explanations when I tell you the truth, I dnt just mention them, I QUOTE THEM!.

who do you think is trying to show that he is right and the bible is wrong, is it the one who quotes and explains scriptures, who quotes and explain scriptures posted to him , or the one who does not even qoute the scriptures he mentions, who runs away when certain scriptures are posted to him for explanation.

I pointed it out where in scripture it talks about the Godhead, but because you refuse to believe who Christ is, you have tried to rip the scriptures apart, twisting them into your own words of disbelievement.

the above is a lie, you pointed out where the kjv mentioned Godhead, and I've shown you the insincerity of such actions by the kjv. The kjv translated 3 different Greek words to mean the same English word and you are desperately trying to combine the definition of those greek words as the definition of the English word. only people with sinister intention does that.
Also I've shown you the insincerity of the kjv on the 3 greek words it translated to Godhead, cus in the NKJV, IT CHANGED THE WORD GODHEAD IN ONE OF THEM!

And because the bible doesn't mean anything to you-then I advise you-to leave it with those who had chosen to believe in the scriptures.

see advice borne out of falsehood, I should leave it to you who have refused to quote and explain certain scriptures!

And of course we Christians had chosen. We have carried the Word of God across the nations, sharing to you, and the other atheist belonging to your Church about Christ.
Which you and your organisation have refused to do so.

jehovahs witnesses tell you about Jesus and his God everyday, in every country they are allowed to do so, on the streets, through their magazines which is the most published and widely distrIbuted in the world(while no tithes are collected to fund it), on the internet, in homes, from house to house, EVERY WHERE!.
you can't even be a witness of Jehovah if you dnt go about telling others about your god, the only true god, the one God, and the one he sent, JESUS CHRIST.

And with your own mental state of mind, you can't seem to break through your darkness of fears, nor are you allowing anybody else to break through their darkness of fears, the truth is the bible is right in every way possible and you and your associates are wrong.

you have tried lies, you have tried defamation, now you are claiming expert in psychiatry, you do all this so that you wunt respond to posts, or quote and explain certain scriptures that will expose your false doctrines .

No-one can beat the word of God, not even you-once it's written it stays written. You either believe it, or you don't, it's as simple as that, Jesus said He would rather you to be Hot or Cold then Lukewarm.
And from the evidence across the world the JW's are lukewarm. You are dead in the natural and you are dead spiritually.
You either believe in Christ fully, or you stay dead eternally.

then it must be quite easy for you, claiming to be alive, to be able to answer these :
(note , it has bee asked earlier, but he faIled to answer it )

"[b]Now let's put brocabs sincerity to the test, pls note if he will respond.
he had earlier said this:

In each of the 3 verses a slightly different Greek word is used, but the definition of each is the same deity or "divine" nature, the Word Godhead is used to refer to God's essential nature.

now the kjv says this in 2 peter 1:3,4
King James Bible
According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust
PLS BROCAB, IN YOUR REPLY TO THIS POST, PLS TELL, WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO BE PARTAKERS OF THE DIVINE NATURE.?
note: some translations us "sharers" , "share", "participate".
expo: 1 Co 15:50-54; Php 3:10, 11; 1Pe 5:1; 2Pe 1:2-4; Re 20:6.

Jozzy4:
brocab is a confused person, maybe it means they will be partakers of the Godhead

he will not answer that question, it will affect his false doctrine.

dayowunmi:
Is it on earth? Garden of Eden

yep

YOU COULD NOT REPLY TO THE POST DIRECTED TO YOU, THE NEXT THING IS TO QUOTE MY POST DIRECTED TO SOME ONE ELSE.

brocab:
What is the Godhead?
Dolphinheart you don't give to heart about anything that is written either in the bible, or you don't acknowledge any of the scriptures that are explained to you in pure English.
These verses may not be found in the NWT bible, if they are I am sure, the wording wouldn't be written like it's in the King J Version.
But sadly enough it is found 3 times in the KJV
{Acts 17:29} Being then God's offspring, we ought not to think that the divine being is like Gold or silver or stone, an Imaged formed by the art of imagination of man.
{Romans 1:20} For this invisible attributes, namely His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.
{Colossians 2:9} For in Him the hole fullness of deity dwells bodily.
In each of the 3 verses a slightly different Greek word is used, but the definition of each is the same deity or "divine" nature, the Word Godhead is used to refer to God's essential nature.

for the Greek text of acts 17:29, check this Web page:
biblehub.com/text/acts/17-29.htm

Theion may refer to
θεῖον, Greek for " sulfur "
θεῖον, Greek for "divine",
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theion_(disambiguation)


Englishman's Concordance
θεῖον (theion) — 1 Occurrence
Acts 17:29 Adj-ANS
GRK: ἀνθρώπου τὸ θεῖον εἶναι ὅμοιον
NAS: not to think that the Divine Nature is like
KJV: not to think that the Godhead is like
INT: of man that which [is] divine to be like

At acts 17:29 , Paul, when in Athens, showed that it is illogical for humans to imagine that “the Divine Being [to theiʹon, form of theiʹos ] is like gold or silver or stone.” Many translators here use terms such as “the Godhead,” “the Deity,” or “the divinity” ( KJ, AS, Dy, ED, JB, RS ), while E. J. Goodspeed’s translation says “the divine nature.”
According to The International Standard Bible Encyclopedia, the expression to theiʹon “is derived from the adjective theíos, meaning ‘pertaining to God,’ ‘divine.’” (Edited by G. Bromiley, 1979, Vol. 1, p. 913)

Liddell and Scott’s Greek-English Lexicon gives as the meaning “the Divinity.” (Revised by H. Jones, Oxford, 1968, pp. 787, 788)

So the phrase to theiʹon can be understood to refer to a person or to a quality. Obviously, then, the context must guide the translator in his choice of words. Here at acts 17:29, the context clearly shows that the person of God is being described, and so the expression is appropriately rendered “Divine Being” in the New World Translation. —Compare NIV.

Paul was a witness of the artistic splendor of Athens, developed around the worship of the Grecian gods and goddesses, and he showed an audience there how illogical it was that humans, owing their life and existence to the true God and Creator, should imagine that “the Divine Being is like gold or silver or stone, like something sculptured by the art and contrivance of man.” He thus demonstrated again that artistic beauty, no matter how impressive or attractive, does not of itself recommend any religion as being true worship.—Compare . joh 4:23, 24


At this point, I'll like to emphasis the silliness of brocabs attack on the difference in translations between the NWT and the KJV
Acts 17:29
NKJV: that the Divine Nature
KJV: that the Godhead
King James 2000 Bible: that the Deity

PLS NOTE THE DIFFERENCES IN THIS TRANSLATIONS AND NOTE WHAT THEY TRANSLATED THE GREEK WORD AS. THIS RUBISHES BROCABS CLAIMS ABOUT TRANSLATIONS ABOVE.

................................

For the Greek text of Rom 1:20, check this Web page
biblehub.com/interlinear/romans/1-20.htm

θειότης (theiotēs) — 1 Occurrence
Romans 1:20 N-NFS
GRK: δύναμις καὶ θειότης εἰς τὸ
NAS: power and divine nature, have been clearly seen,
KJV: power and Godhead; so that they
INT: power and divinity for

Strong's Concordance
theiotés: divinity, divine nature
Original Word: θειότης, ητος, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: theiotés
Phonetic Spelling: (thi-ot'-ace)
Short Definition: divinity
Definition: divinity, divine nature
biblehub.com/greek/2305.htm

At romans 1:20, the apostle refers to the undeniable visible evidence of God’s “invisible qualities,” particularly his “eternal power and Godship [Thei·oʹtes ].” Other translations read “Godhead” or “deity” ( KJ, NE, RS, JB), conveying to many the idea of personality, the state of being a person.
However, according to Liddell and Scott’s Greek-English Lexicon, the Greek word thei·oʹtes means “divine nature, divinity.” (P. 788) So there is a basis for rendering thei·oʹtes as referring to the quality of being a god, not the person of God, and this is supported by the context.
The apostle is discussing things that are discernible in the physical creation. For example, while the creation does not reveal the name of God, it does give evidence of his “eternal power”—needed to create and sustain the universe. The physical creation also displays his “Godship,” the fact that the Creator truly is God and is worthy of our worship.

The creative works testify to the fact that God exists. But, according to Paul, even certain of those people who “knew God” suppressed this truth. Rather than serving God in harmony with the truth concerning his eternal power and Godship, they made idols and worshiped these. Not being real gods, idols are an untruth, a lie or falsehood.
Hence, these persons, though having the truth of God, exchanged it “for the lie and venerated and rendered sacred service to the creation rather than the One who created.” Their turning to the falsehood of idolatry led them into all kinds of degraded practices.— .Rom 1: 18-31

.................................

θεότητος (theotētos) — 1 Occurrence
Colossians 2:9 N-GFS
GRK: πλήρωμα τῆς θεότητος σωματικῶς
NAS: the fullness of Deity dwells
KJV: all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
INT: fullness of the Deity bodily

At col 2:9 the apostle Paul says that in Christ “all the fullness of the divine quality [form of the·oʹtes ] dwells bodily.” Here, again, some translations read “Godhead” or “deity,” which Trinitarians interpret to mean that God personally dwells in Christ. ( KJ, NE, RS, NAB )
However, Liddell and Scott’s Greek-English Lexicon defines the·oʹtes in basically the same way it does thei·oʹtes, as meaning “divinity, divine nature.” (P. 792)
The Syriac Peshitta and the Latin Vulgate render this word as “divinity.” Thus, here too, there is a solid basis for rendering the·oʹtes as referring to quality, not personality.

A consideration of the context of clearly shows that having “divinity,” or “divine nature,” does not make Christ the same as God the Almighty. In the preceding chapter, Paul says: “God saw good for all fullness to dwell in him.”
New International Version
For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him,
English Standard Version
For in him all the fullness of God was pleased to dwell,
King James Bible
For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;

Thus, all fullness dwells in Christ because it “pleased the Father” ( KJ, Dy ), because it was “by God’s own choice.” ( NE ) So the fullness of “divinity” that dwells in Christ is his as a result of a decision made by the Father.
Further showing that having such “fullness” does not make Christ the same person as Almighty God is the fact that Paul later speaks of Christ as being “seated at the right hand of God.”
col 3:1King James Bible
If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.

Considering the immediate context of , it is noted that in verse 8, Christians are warned against being misled by those who advocate philosophy and human tradition. They are also told that “carefully concealed in [Christ] are all the treasures of wisdom and of knowledge,” and they are urged to “go on walking in union with him, rooted and being built up in him and being stabilized in the faith.” (Col 2:3, 6, 7 )
In addition, verses 13 to 15 explain that they are made alive through faith, being released from the Law covenant. Paul’s argument, therefore, is that Christians do not need the Law (which was removed by means of Christ) or human philosophy and tradition. They have all they need, a precious “fullness,” in Christ.— .col 2: 10-12.

BROCAB IS TRYING TO TELL US THAT THESE THREE GREEK WORDS MEANS GODHEAD, BECAUSE THAT IS HOW IT IS RENDERED IN THE KJV, BUT TO SEE THE INCONSISTENCIES OF THE KJV AND THE TEXT IT TRANSLATED(THE TEXTUS RECEPTUS CONCERNING THOSE THREE GREEK WORDS, PLS CHECK THE WEB PAGE BELOW.
hermeneutics.stackexchange.com/questions/15746/what-does-the-greek-word-θεότητος-in-colossians-29-mean

Now let's put brocabs sincerity to the test, pls note if he will respond.
he had earlier said this:

In each of the 3 verses a slightly different Greek word is used, but the definition of each is the same deity or "divine" nature, the Word Godhead is used to refer to God's essential nature.

now the kjv says this in 2 peter 1:3,4
King James Bible
According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust

PLS BROCAB, IN YOUR REPLY TO THIS POST, PLS TELL, WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO BE PARTAKERS OF THE DIVINE NATURE.

note: some translations us "sharers" , "participate".
expo: 1 Co 15:50-54; Php 3:10, 11; 1Pe 5:1; 2Pe 1:2-4; Re 20:6.

Rawblings:
Colosians 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

you did not tell what the Godhead is?

solite3:
all you are interested in, is asking nonsensical questions. Humm I God will help you

you have used many terms to prevent the fact that you refused to answer those questions, Or quote and explain the scriptures posted to you,
you came on nairAland a little over a month ago, that same day you where asked a question on this thread, up till this moment, you have not answered!

Rawblings:
Jesus is God.. He's the second person in the God head

Isaiah 9:6

For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, MIGHTY GOD, EVERLASTING FATHER, Prince of Peace.

He is also known as a son of God because he has human nature which is subject to the holy spirit. We who believe in God and have the holy spirit in us are also sons of God. you can't be called the son of God if your flesh controls you.

Romans 8:14King James Version (KJV)

14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

sir, what is the Godhead, and where can we find the word " godhead in the scriptures?

brocab:
Dolphinheart is always looking for an accuse, this is how I know he twist his own words.
He says one things and says another.

pls , just give one example where I have done this !

PLS NOT AGAIN THAT BROCAB HAS NOT ATTEMPTED TO RESPOND TO THE QUESTIONS BEING ASKED OR HAS SHOWN ANY WILLING NESS TO QUOTE AND EXPLAIN CERTAIN SCRIPTURES POSTED TO HIM!
he prefers to still bring up issues and refuse to respond when previous issues had been made clear to him. His grand aim is to find fault by amy means while offering no alternatives.

brocab:
You have tried to answer Revelation who is, but you haven't answered {Acts 1:10-11} and why does it say Jesus is coming back in the clouds, and not the Father?

I have answered some verses in rev , not the whole book, and of the one I answered, showing you what I believed in, you have not been able to respond.

answer to your question: the context is about Jesus , therefore there is no need to mention the father! jesus was the one the disciples saw ascending, not the father and jesus! it was this ascention that was used to describe the future coming of jesus !

I find your teachings are out of wack from the actual JW teachings. C.T. Russell had even admitted Jesus is the Almighty, and you still refuse to follow after his teachings, Why is that? How does one refuse to listen to some of Russell's teachings' and not the other?

no problem with if you find my teachings out of wack with Russells, as long as it's not out of wac with the scriptures you refused to quote and explain.
and mostimes, when you start with the letter "i", what comes next will most probably be a lie!

I only write back to you dolphinheart because I know your blood presser is on the raise, and you know every scripture is given to you is the truth about Christ, and you can't seem to shake it off you quick enough, so you lower yourself to the point of lying in public, and denying Christ in the makings, denying His Word, calling the KJV bible a lie-

good afternoon doctor brocab, reality says you are wrong! wishing high blood pressure on me is something that will never come to pass!

{John 10:30}-Quote the bold is a lie it never said so.

How can I say say the verse never said so, of cus , the verse said what is recorded their na!
But I can say , with full confidencecan full conviction that the verse never said any of the following :
"I and the Father are one God ”
"I and the Father are one person”
"I and the Father are one spirit”

what did john 10: 30 say?
Joh 10:30I and the Father are one.”

what did Jesus mean?
Joh 10:37If I am not doing the works of my Father, do not believe me.
Joh 10:38But if I am doing them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, so that you may come to know and may continue knowing that the Father is in union with me and I am in union with the Father.”

Joh 17:11“I am no longer in the world, but they are in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, watch over them on account of your own name, which you have given me, so that they may be one JUST AS we are one.

Joh 17:21 so that they may all be one, just as you, Father, are in union with me and I am in union with you, that they also may be in union with us so that the world may believe that you sent me.

read those verses above brocab, it will help you understand what being one with the father means!

Believing in your own words and not the word of God shows your heart is seared with a hot iron.

unlike you , I dnt search for indirect meanings to gods woRd and I don't act as if I'm blind to scriptures and refuse to quote and explain them , I used the scriptures to guide my words,
for example , you claim that Jesus is your god, I claim using jesus and the disciples direct words that the father is my God, to make my claim solid , I asked you to explain those words of jesus and the apostles , but you could not!

Joh 20:17Jesus said to her: “Stop clinging to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.’”

1Co 11:3But I want you to know that the head of every man is the Christ; in turn, the head of a woman is the man; in turn, the head of the Christ is God.

Eph 1:17 that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give you a spirit of wisdom and of revelation in the accurate knowledge of him.

1Co 8:6 there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him.

sincere christians now know who the one God is , he is the father!
the one jesus called the ONLY TRUE GOD! - john 17:3

{1 Timothy 14:27-29} Some teaching come through hypocritical lairs Having your conscience seared with a hot iron.

sir , where did you get this verse from, which translation has 1 Timothy 14: 27-29. you can lie about the scriptures, you can refuse to qoute certain scriptures while saying something it did not say, but to quote a fake, non existeNT verse is a new low for you brocab, I'll keep on insisting until you tell us which translations that verse exists .

{Hebrews 1:2-5} Hath spoken unto us by His Son, whom He had appointed heir, of all things, by whom also He made the worlds.
Who being the the brightness of His glory, and the express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had Himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the majesty on high.
Being made so much better then the angels, as He have by inheritance obtained a more excellent name then they.
For unto which of the angels said He at anytime Thou art My Son this day I have begotten the? And again, I will be to Him a Father, and he shall be to Me a Son.
After doing a little research I am not expecting you to agree with me, nor the writer, matter of fact like always I am expecting the worst from you. Firstly I am waiting for you to reject my studies once again on any truths that is written about the word of God.

Chapter "1"{Hebrews 1:1-3}
God spoke to His ancient people at sundry times, through successive generations, and in divers manners, as He though proper, sometimes by personal directions, sometimes by dreams, sometimes by visions, sometimes by divine influences on the minds of the prophets.
The gospel revelation is excellent above the former; in that it is a revelation which God had made by His Son. In beholding the power, wisdom and goodness of the Lord Jesus Christ, behold the power, wisdom and goodness of His Father {John 14:7} the fullness of the Godhead dwells, not typically, or in a figure, but really in Him. When, on the fall of man the world was breaking to pieces, under the wrath and the curse of God, the Son of God undertaking the work of redemption, sustained by His Almighty power and goodness. From the glory of the person and office of Christ, we proceed to the glory of His grace. The glory of His person and nature, gave to His sufferings such merit as was a full satisfaction to the honour of God, who suffered and infinite injury and affront by the sins of men.

you are a very cunning person, does you explanation say mine was wrong? no .
does it say Jesus is God ? no
does it say Jesus is the God being refered to in heb 1: 1 ? no! in fact it say "that it is a revelation which God had made by HIS Son."

YOUR EXPLAINATIONS AGREE WITH MINE THAT GOD USED PROPHETS AND OTHERS MEANS TO PASS MESSAGES TO HIS PEOPLE IN THE PAST , BUT IN THE APOSTLES TIMES , GOD USED JESUS .
IS THE ONE USED AND THE ONE USING THE SAME PERSON ? no !

There are some important things said in those verses which you deliberately omitted, probably the place you did your research added it, but you deliberately omitted it when posting it here.
1. The verses said Jesus is appointed by God to be heir of all things. This shows that Jesus is not the almighty god, as the almighty is not an heir!
the statement also shows that Jesus is not the same person as one who appointed him, the one who apointed him is God!

2 . you also refused to explain this very very important words found in verse 3
" when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;"

CAN YOU SEE HOW BROCAB DELIBERATELY TRY TO WITHOLD EXPLAINATIONS ON SOME SALIENT FACTS IN THE SCRIPTURES?

This statement found in verse 3 helps us to understand that Jesus is not the Majesty on high?
or Is jesus the ,Majesty on high?( pls notice that he will not answer)

I am not expecting you read any further about {Hebrews 1:4-14}
Many Jews had a superstitious or Idolatrous respect for angels, because they had received the law and other tidings of the divine by their ministry. They looked upon them as mediators God and Men, and some went so far as to pay them a kind of religious homage or worship.

Thus it was necessary that the people should insist, not only on Christ's being the creator of all things, and therefore of angels themselves, but as being risen and exalted Messiah in human nature, to whom angels, authorities, and powers are made subject.
To prove this 'several passages are brought from the old Testament, comparing what God says about the angels, with what He say's to Christ, the inferiority of the angels to Christ plainly appears. Hear is the office of the angels; they are God's ministers and servants, to do His pleasure.
But, how much greater things are said about Christ, by the Father. And let us own and honour Him as God, for He had not been God, He had never done the mediators work, and never worn the Mediators grown. It is declared how Christ was qualified of the office of Mediator. He has the name Messiah from being anointed, and as anointed with the Holy Spirit, He is above all prophets, priest and Kings, that ever were employed in the service by God on earth.
{Psalms 25, 27} The Almighty power of the Lord is declared, both in creating the world and changing it. Christ will fold up this world as a garment, not to abused any-longer, not to be used as it has been.
The end.

why did God say Jesus is superior to the angels ? the answer will be explained below.

No wonder you didn't add these two verses {Hebrews 1:4-5} to your collection, these were the hidden gems.
Jesus was made much better then the angels, meaning to say Jesus is not one of the archangels, One of your teachings the JW's had written.

heb 1: 4 English Standard Version
having become as much superior to angels as the name he has inherited is more excellent than theirs.
King James Bible
Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

open your eyes brocab and read what the scriptures tell you.
The verse says " jesus became" , it did not say "jesus was". The kjv says " being made" . common sense and a desire to know the truth will lead someone to examine this scriptures carefully.
did the verse say Jesus has always been better than the angels? no it did not
did the verse say Jesus has always had the name that made him better than the angels? no!

so what is the verse telling us, it is telling us that jesus became better than the angles or became more superior to the angels cus he was made to become better or superior to the angels.
how did this occurr, the verse says this occured because he had inherited a more excellent name than the angels.

did the verse say Jesus had always had that name that made him become better than the angels ? no, heb 1:1-4 helps us to know that Jesus inherited that name after he was exalted, after he had made purifications for our sins!

brocab, pls tell us.
Can someone be given a name he already has? notice , Jesus called that name " my new name in Revelation.

the following scriptures might help you, I say might cus I fear you will not read them, talk less of explainING them

Php 2:9, 10 For this very reason, God exalted him to a superior position and kindly gave him the name that is above every other name
10so that in the name of Jesus every knee should bend—of those in heaven and those on earth and those under the ground—

Eph 1:20, 21[u]which he exercised toward Christ when he raised him up from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places,[/u]
21far above every government and authority and power and lordship and every name that is named, not only in this system of things but also in that to come.

1Pe 3:22 He is at God’s right hand, for he went to heaven, and angels and authorities and powers were made subject to him.


heb 1:5
English Standard Version
For to which of the angels did God ever say, “You are my Son, today I have begotten you”? Or again, “I will be to him a father, and he shall be to me a son”?

this verse only exposes your false doctrines further, here is God asking a question about someone else, but you are trying to tell us that that someone is also the god asking the question!wow.
well the answer to that question is jesus Christ !

Lu 9:35Then a voice came out of the cloud, saying: “This is my Son, the one who has been chosen. Listen to him.”

2Pe 1:17For he received from God the Father honor and glory when words such as these were conveyed to him by the magnificent glory: “This is my Son, my beloved, whom I myself have approved.”

[quote author=solite3 post=46426844][/quote]pls modify the post and stop claiming my words as yours, dnt let it look like the only thing I said where the ones you quoted !
I'll like to reply that post , but first modify it and stop pasting my words as yours!

meanwhile have you answered these?

[b]Jesus has a God, yes or no,?
Jesus is subjected to that God , yes or no
if Jesus has a God, how can He then be almighty God ?

2. on April 27 jEphz
"for those saying Jesus is God.. pls. explain these Scripture for me ... Ephesians 5:1,2 1timothy 2:5 John 8:42 Act 2:22 Hebrews 12:2...... "

3. April 29
" the God of our Lord Jesus Christ " Eph 1:17, who is the God of Jesus Christ ?

4. "You say Jesus is still a man in heaven, you also say Jesus has a God when he was a man.
NOW DOES Jesus STILL HAVE A GOD IN HEAVEN?"

who anointed Jesus? who is that person to Jesus?
you can see that the questions are numbered, so dnt muddle it up , or give part response

solite3, pls respond to these post if you can( it was posted on may 28, 1: 17pm)

The first verse of Revelation had set a precedent for you to use to examine the whole book, it tells you that "God gave Jesus" the revelation , God did not give himself, Jesus did not give himself, it was God who have Jesus the Revelation. God ( in the book of revelation)and Jesus are not the same person!
verse 4-6 also clears who is who in the Book of revaluation, it helps us to understand that the one who is, who was, and who is coming is different from Jesus Christ.
brocab says it's Jesus, you say it's the father, yet you refuse to discuss and tell the whole world who is right and who is wrong!
to make sure that you dnt confuse yourself on who the al mighty God is, Jesus told you severaly in that book that he has a God! , using the words " my God " several times in that book. I ve several times asked if the almighty can have a god superior to him, cus Jesus had now indicated when he was in heaven, when he came to earth, and when he back in heaven that he has a God! he did not just call that God "a God ", he said "my God", "your god" , "the only true god".

All this facts are presented to you in the Book of Revelation, you could not discuss any of them, but you choose to believe a verse from the Textus Receptus that you can't defend, that you can't show where the Textus Receptus got it from! that majority of scholars have shown to be spurious, that can't be found even in translations of the authors that surpport trinity.
lastly, even if you would not answer the questions being posted to you several times , pls can you tell us the name of your church or organization you associate with at the moment?[/b]

note, some of these questions where asked on the same day you registered your moniker.
which says a lot about the human behind the moniker and it's intentions!

solite3:
[/quote]now let's look at my question again:

yours or mine

OK for your ranting to stop God gives revelation to Jesus to show his servants things that will come to pass shortly because Jesus is the mediator between God and man. Jesus signify it through an angel.

in your own words, you have acknowledged that the God that gave jesus the Revelation is THE SAME PERSON AS JESUS!

in my explanation, I told you who that God that gave jesus the Revelation is, but you refused to do so why?, cus doing so will expose you further .

I already told you it was Jesus

It was jesus, now let's see what jesus had to say, in heaven o, not on earth!
(PLS NOTE, THE WORDS OF JESUS THERE IS THE MAIN REASONS WHY THEY COULD NOT QUOTE THAT VERSE EVEN FOR ONCE)

Re 3:2Become watchful, and strengthen the things remaining that were ready to die, for I have not found your works fully performed before my God.

Re 3:12“‘The one who conquers—I will make him a pillar in the [u]temple of my God, and he will by no means go out from it anymore, and I will write upon him the name of my God and the name of the [/u]city of my God,[/u] the New Jerusalem that descends out of heaven from [/u]my God, and my own new name.[/u]

right there in heaven, Jesus reiterated the facts that he has a God! , a god who gave him the revelation, a god who commanded him to sit at his right side, a god who is called the most high, the almighty, the only true god. you might believe that Jesus is that same God who exalted him, but the scriptures let us know that they are different persons!

Vs 4 John convenes greeting from the father referred to as he which was n which is, n which is to come and also from the seven spirit of God.

good, unlike someone who tried to claim that him(just one person), who is, who was and who is to come is jesus .

your answer points to the fact that verse 8 is talking about the father too! abi no be so?

English Standard Version
“I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”

if you say the father is the one who is who was and who is to come, then it also means the almighty is also the father, the almighty is also the " Alpha and omega.
therefore jesus and the apostles are right to call the father their God !, the only true god and one God !.
This revelation also shows that the father is Jehovah, because it's only jehovah that is called the almighty God. The kjv preference of removing god's name from most verses in the scriptures has affected this truth.(an issue you will never respond to )

Vs 5 John convenes greeting from Jesus who he described as a faithful witness referring again to Christ mediatorship also, it also reveals that Christ redeemed Christians with his blood

there are reasons you could not quote that verse, it's because some of its content will affect your beliefs, the part you omitted and did not mention say" the firSt born from the dead!" this words let's us know, that these jesus is not the almighty God, cus the almighty God cannot die!

Vs 6 they are now priest unto God.
This is another strong reason why you could not quote those verses, cus you wunt like to explain some things recorded their.

Re 1:6and he made us to be a kingdom, priests to his God and Father—yes, to him be the glory and the might forever. Amen.
the underlined points to the fact that Jesus has a God, the most high cannot have a god over him, therefore Jesus is not the most high.

who does the bible call the most high:
Ps 83:18May people know that you, whose name is Jehovah, YOU ALONE are the Most High over all the earth.

who is jesus in relation to the most high?
Lu 1:32[u]This one will be great and will be called Son of the Most High,[/u] and Jehovah God will give him the throne of David his father,

is jesus ever called the most high? no!

[quote]I av address that

I know that if I ask you to post where you adressed it, you will refuse, (note:I'm not saying you have or have not). so ill just ask you to direcT us to where you addressed it!

if you can't explain these verses, then its you that needs forgiveness. "

I've done so repeatedly on these thread.

dolpinsheart can you see your lies

who is dolpinsheart?

quote author=solite3 post=46426625][/quote]I do not know where you got that post you replied from or what damage you had tried to do to the post.

but here are my last few posts to you!
(posted 6: 54pm ,June 5,page 82)

solite3:
sincerely dolphins heart you are not making sense.

HOPE YOU CAN ALL SEE THAT HE TOO CAN NOT SAY ANY THING AGAINST THE POINTS I THAT POST. HE COULD NOT QUOTE AND EXPLAIN THE SCRIPTURES FOUND THEIR

Sorry to say. Thank God you have finally agreed that Jesus is a man even in heaven but that's not the whole story,

will you stop lying against me!

Jesus is also God Almighty but not the Father even Russell agreed.I advise you to go back and read slowly our previous quote your questions had been answered, please be guided.

Solite , stop lying you, solite3 , have not answered the questions : meanwhile:
your questions are still pendin sir

Jesus has a God, yes or no,?
Jesus is subjected to that God , yes or no
if Jesus has a God, how can He then be almighty God ?

2. on April 27 jEphz
"for those saying Jesus is God.. pls. explain these Scripture for me ... Ephesians 5:1,2 1timothy 2:5 John 8:42 Act 2:22 Hebrews 12:2...... "

3. April 29
" the God of our Lord Jesus Christ " Eph 1:17, who is the God of Jesus Christ ?

4. "You say Jesus is still a man in heaven, you also say Jesus has a God when he was a man.
NOW DOES Jesus STILL HAVE A GOD IN HEAVEN?"

who anointed Jesus? who is that person to Jesus?
you can see that the questions are numbered, so dnt muddle it up , or give part response

solite3, pls respond to these post if you can( it was posted on may 28, 1: 17pm)

The first verse of Revelation had set a precedent for you to use to examine the whole book, it tells you that "God gave Jesus" the revelation , God did not give himself, Jesus did not give himself, it was God who have Jesus the Revelation. God ( in the book of revelation)and Jesus are not the same person!
verse 4-6 also clears who is who in the Book of revaluation, it helps us to understand that the one who is, who was, and who is coming is different from Jesus Christ.
brocab says it's Jesus, you say it's the father, yet you refuse to discuss and tell the whole world who is right and who is wrong!
to make sure that you dnt confuse yourself on who the al mighty God is, Jesus told you severaly in that book that he has a God! , using the words " my God " several times in that book. I ve several times asked if the almighty can have a god superior to him, cus Jesus had now indicated when he was in heaven, when he came to earth, and when he back in heaven that he has a God! he did not just call that God "a God ", he said "my God", "your god" , "the only true god".

All this facts are presented to you in the Book of Revelation, you could not discuss any of them, but you choose to believe a verse from the Textus Receptus that you can't defend, that you can't show where the Textus Receptus got it from! that majority of scholars have shown to be spurious, that can't be found even in translations of the authors that surpport trinity.
lastly, even if you would not answer the questions being posted to you several times , pls can you tell us the name of your church or organization you associate with at the moment?[/b][/quote].............................


(posted 8:12 PM, June 5, page 83)

solite3:
[/quote]1. They are points detailing how God gave jesus the Revelation and that Jesus is not the one who is, who was and who is to come.
It gave a detailed explanation of rev 1: 1,4-8 that you could not refute.
you could not quote and explain the scriptures mentioned their.

2. you could not even show prove of where I said what you accused me of .

3. In not posting for you to believe me, cus I know you wunt, but I want you to answer the questions posted to you.
and pls, stop cutting parts of my post ofF!

your questions are still pendin sir

Jesus has a God, yes or no,?
Jesus is subjected to that God , yes or no
if Jesus has a God, how can He then be almighty God ?

2. on April 27 jEphz
"for those saying Jesus is God.. pls. explain these Scripture for me ... Ephesians 5:1,2 1timothy 2:5 John 8:42 Act 2:22 Hebrews 12:2...... "

3. April 29
" the God of our Lord Jesus Christ " Eph 1:17, who is the God of Jesus Christ ?

4. "You say Jesus is still a man in heaven, you also say Jesus has a God when he was a man.
NOW DOES Jesus STILL HAVE A GOD IN HEAVEN?"

who anointed Jesus? who is that person to Jesus?
you can see that the questions are numbered, so dnt muddle it up , or give part response

solite3, pls respond to these post if you can( it was posted on may 28, 1: 17pm)

The first verse of Revelation had set a precedent for you to use to examine the whole book, it tells you that "God gave Jesus" the revelation , God did not give himself, Jesus did not give himself, it was God who have Jesus the Revelation. God ( in the book of revelation)and Jesus are not the same person!
verse 4-6 also clears who is who in the Book of revaluation, it helps us to understand that the one who is, who was, and who is coming is different from Jesus Christ.
brocab says it's Jesus, you say it's the father, yet you refuse to discuss and tell the whole world who is right and who is wrong!
to make sure that you dnt confuse yourself on who the al mighty God is, Jesus told you severaly in that book that he has a God! , using the words " my God " several times in that book. I ve several times asked if the almighty can have a god superior to him, cus Jesus had now indicated when he was in heaven, when he came to earth, and when he back in heaven that he has a God! he did not just call that God "a God ", he said "my God", "your god" , "the only true god".

All this facts are presented to you in the Book of Revelation, you could not discuss any of them, but you choose to believe a verse from the Textus Receptus that you can't defend, that you can't show where the Textus Receptus got it from! that majority of scholars have shown to be spurious, that can't be found even in translations of the authors that surpport trinity.
lastly, even if you would not answer the questions being posted to you several times , pls can you tell us the name of your church or organization you associate with at the moment?[/b]


.........................................

(posted 2: 54pm June 8, page 87)
[quote author=solite3 post=46381995]dolphins heart your lies ehh. I don't blame you sha, that's the trademark of your organisation. Keep it up

all this post crossing will not help you, go and respond to the posts which I directed to you!
you claim I lie, yet you could not point it out !

...................................

(posted 5:20 PM , June 8, page 87)

solite3:
dolphinsheart I can not begin to root out all your lies but one of your biggest lie is repeating questions that had already been answered not just me, but by others.

then it will be easy for you to post one of theM na, what is preventing you if you think my lies are many.

have you solite3 answered the questions asked ? no !, if you have, you would have posted it.

your posts are becoming stale, all your lies had already been busted and thrown away like trash that it is and repeating it will not make it better either, I suggest that if you don't have anything to say keep quiet but if you have any question, ask in honesty and by God's grace you will be answered

for ya mind!

Solite3 pls respond:

Sorry to say. Thank God you have finally agreed that Jesus is a man even in heaven but that's not the whole story,

will you stop lying against me!


Jesus has a God, yes or no,?
Jesus is subjected to that God , yes or no
if Jesus has a God, how can He then be almighty God ?

2. on April 27 jEphz
"for those saying Jesus is God.. pls. explain these Scripture for me ... Ephesians 5:1,2 1timothy 2:5 John 8:42 Act 2:22 Hebrews 12:2...... "

3. April 29
" the God of our Lord Jesus Christ " Eph 1:17, who is the God of Jesus Christ ?

4. "You say Jesus is still a man in heaven, you also say Jesus has a God when he was a man.
NOW DOES Jesus STILL HAVE A GOD IN HEAVEN?"

who anointed Jesus? who is that person to Jesus?
you can see that the questions are numbered, so dnt muddle it up , or give part response

solite3, pls respond to these post if you can( it was posted on may 28, 1: 17pm)

The first verse of Revelation had set a precedent for you to use to examine the whole book, it tells you that "God gave Jesus" the revelation , God did not give himself, Jesus did not give himself, it was God who have Jesus the Revelation. God ( in the book of revelation)and Jesus are not the same person!
verse 4-6 also clears who is who in the Book of revaluation, it helps us to understand that the one who is, who was, and who is coming is different from Jesus Christ.
brocab says it's Jesus, you say it's the father, yet you refuse to discuss and tell the whole world who is right and who is wrong!
to make sure that you dnt confuse yourself on who the al mighty God is, Jesus told you severaly in that book that he has a God! , using the words " my God " several times in that book. I ve several times asked if the almighty can have a god superior to him, cus Jesus had now indicated when he was in heaven, when he came to earth, and when he back in heaven that he has a God! he did not just call that God "a God ", he said "my God", "your god" , "the only true god".

All this facts are presented to you in the Book of Revelation, you could not discuss any of them, but you choose to believe a verse from the Textus Receptus that you can't defend, that you can't show where the Textus Receptus got it from! that majority of scholars have shown to be spurious, that can't be found even in translations of the authors that surpport trinity.

lastly, even if you would not answer the questions being posted to you several times , pls can you tell us the name of your church or organization you associate with at the moment?[/b]

............................
EVERYONE CAN SEE THAT SOLITE3 HAS NOT ANSWERED THE QUESTIONS ASKED!

dayowunmi:
Yes and No. Eden literally means "presence" it is the presence of God that was why God walked and moved in the garden because it was also his habitation, and no matter the pilgrimage you do you can never get to see the garden of Eden anywhere. If -you think Eden was really on earth check Gen 3:24 it says God placed Cherubims and a flaming sword swinging every way to prevent to guard the garden. The Bible did not state that these angels and Cherubims were later removed, so where is Eden on the earth so we can go and see Cherubims (angels) and flaming sword!

@ bolded, where did you get that from?
so Genesis 2:5- 15 is not talking about this earth abi ? There is euphrates river in heaven too? and all those animals on land and in the sea where in heaven too?

1. pharaohs have been mummyfied for thousands of years before prophet mohamed
2. There is no emperical proof that that particular pharaoh was the the one that drowned in the red sea.
.3. salt is used as part of the mummyfication, and it is present in all paraohs, do you think they leave the intestines of those mummies their for one to now say he drowned .
. that mummy was taken to France cus it was deteriorating dur to the activity of Tomb raiders
4. the report could not state who wispered to the professor .

5. This professor that is wondering about the Koran is a personal physician to the president of Egypt and the Saudi royal family o, he is now claiming innocenty

6. The pharaoh was about 90 years old with severe arthritis , how could he have been able to pursue the isrealites on chariot!
7. The Koran cannot on its own specify or know which pharaoh died in the red sea.

My view, that pharaoh that that professor claimed to examine is not the pharaoh of the bible, the whole story is just a propaganda!

dayowunmi:
You answered the question yourself already in your conclusion. There wouldn't have even existed the concept of heaven or hell if Adam had not sinned, because it was sin that brought separation (death) to Man. God placed Adam in the garden of Eden(presence) which means presence of God, so he was meant to live in Eden (presence of God) i.e Heaven forever, it was his sin that canceled that divine plan. So to answer your question, he would have made heaven

pls, where did you get the bolded from, are you saying the Eden that adam and eve lived was in heaven?

zodiakzax:
Dolphinheart, did you read my post well? Did I say the prophets called the king you were referring to God? I gave an example saying if I am King and I call myself God, does that make me God? Then I went ahead to ask you that did God and His prophets call that king in question God? I did not say the prophets called him God. I asked a qtn. Open your eyes. Lemme break it down for you since you probably might not understand:

you can give any example you want , what I noticed is that you like the rest of theM refuse to see the example I gave , the scriptures I gave and the question I asked!
I shown you two persons bearing the same title, but reading further on the scriptures shows they are different persons, this is to show you the futility of searching for similarities in the scriptures without reading the scriptures.

Was that king referred to as the Son of God? was he referred to as Mighty God? Everlasting Father? Prince of Peace? God with us? King of Kings and Lord of Lords (cf Deut 10:17,Ps 136:2-3), was he referred to as the Word of God? Was he referred to as God? Was that king called the Creator?( if that king in question was given all of the above attributes then I can boldly tell you he is God)

the king of babylon was never called most of the above, same way jesus is not called most of the titles attributed to God almighty , for example, most high, supreme , almighty God,

neither was the God almighty called the firstborn from the dead, son of God, firstborn of Gods creation, etc.

Now,

Was nebuchadnezzer then not a king?Was he not a king over all the kings?
Just like pharoah was a king over all other kings bcs then his kingdom was very powerful? Did God or any other God's prophet called him king of kings and Lord of Lords? Did Jesus not tell pilate his kingdom was not of this world? Was all authority not given to Christ both in heaven and on earth? Is He not the King in heaven? Was nebuchadnezzer a king in heaven? Any learned man won't even assume that.

Good, you can see that when you examined the scriptures further, you realised that the King of babylon is not Jesus. If one had taken the title King of kings of nebuchadnezzer and Jesus and just say they are same person, without first reading those verses in full and and using the scriptures to seperate them, one will be reading the scriptures wrongly. but the above tactic is what you employed when you tried to say because of similarities between almighty God and jesus, then jesus is that same person called almighty God. hope you can see now why that method is not good. When you see two person being given same title, pls try and find out why.
Jesus is a person, Jesus is a god, but he is not the same God as the one who anointed him, that person is his God!

Maybe you think this thread is about you alone, all those scriptures you have mentioned has been explained, maybe you should go back and read our posts.

who is "our"?
This "our" and "we" excuse you have used is getting not tenable , hope you have not joined the league of those who refused to quote and explain scriptures. Anytime you are being asked to explain scriptures, you lie that it has been explained, but refused to show where it was quoted and explained .

here they are again.
1.Heb 1: 1-4,9
2. Col 1:15,16
3. proverbs 8: 22,27-31
4. Co 8:6

I did comment on prov 8, and my brothers commented on most of the other scriptures.

sir , I did not ask you to comment, I asked you to quote and explain those scriptures, hope you too will not start selecting scriptures you want to respond to and omitting the ones you dnt want to respond to.
If you feel your brothers, whoever they are, have quoted and explained those scriptures, pls post what they said , or direct me to where they said it. You can see that when I showed you proof of my posts which you refused(up till now) to respond to, I showed you where these posts are!
I never relied on anyone in explaining the scriptures I qouted to you, why can't you share your own views of these scriptures!

So if you want my explanation kindly go back and start reading my posts and the posts of my brothers. You still havn't explained Heb 1:5-8, I said explain and stop asking me useless qtns. Also am waiting for the reply of my post on the worship of Christ.

see excuse!, it just shows what you are ready to do and say so as not to be faced with those scriptures, continue!

like I said before, If you are truth full, you will quote those scriptures I posted and give your own views about them, but if you are not truthful, you will keep on omitting and refuse to explain those scriptures.

does heb 1:1-4, 9 say Jesus is not God and 5-8 say Jesus is God?, if not why do you insist on 5-8 and refuse to quote and explain 1-4
?

I you truly want your questions and issues answered, then quote and explain those scriptures, for if I give you more scriptures to examine, you will still refuse to quote and explain them too!

zodiakzax:
Mr dolphinheart, do you really read your own posts? Does it make sense to you? If I am king and I call myself God, does that make me "God"?

never said anything that correlates with what you just said sir, where did you get the above!

Besides the king you Are talking about, was he not punished for his Arrogance and stupidity? Did any of God's prophet call that king God? Did God call him God? So why then do you even compare him with Jesus.

first, I did not say the prophets called the king God, listen to what I said very well.
Let me explain it to you again.

King James Version
Da 2:37Thou, O king, art a king of kings: for the God of heaven hath given thee a kingdom, power, and strength, and glory.

the above is in reference to the king of babylon , no be so?

[b]King James Version
Re 17:14These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.
the above is referenced to jesus , no be so?

both are called King of kings, no be so?(I can bet you wunt answer these question)

now since both jesus and the king of babylon are called King of kings, why dnt you say they are the same?
answer: because you have read the scriptures, and the scriptures have shown you that despite the fact that they have the same titles, they are different persons!

apply this same logic to jesus and God and you will see clearly the difference. read the scriptures I pointed to you, examine the questions I asked , and you will see the futility of saying Jesus is God cus of their similarities?
someone told Jesus to sit at his right hand, is that person jesus? no !
Are they the same person ? no !

I don't refute your explanations bcs it doesn't make sense and obviously you dont know what you are saying. Maybe I didn't read, please do me the favor by explaining again Heb 1:5-8. Don't get me wrong, our discussion is on whether Jesus is both God and man when on earth and in heaven or man on earth and Angel Michael in heaven. You claim He was man on earth (which should even tell you that as a man He will have a God) and angel Michael in heaven. Heb 1:5-8 has the answer. Pls take your time and explain. Plus my posts on the worship of Christ havn't been replied. Still waiting for tht.

sir, do you agree with the explanations I gave on the scriptures I quoted? , if you do let us know that one first, and if you dnt, pls quote those scriptures and tell us what you understand by them . In case you have forgotten those scriptures, here they are again.

1.Heb 1: 1-4,9
2. Col 1:15,16
3. proverbs 8: 22,27-31
4. Co 8:6

after you had quoted and explained those scriptures which I've quoted to you several times, whicy you did not agree with its explaination and refuse to give yours, then we will move on to other discussions like " worship of jesus ".
dnt scatter it, let's clear each issue one by one.

like I said before, If you are truth full, you will quote those scriptures I posted and give your own views about them, but if you are not truthful, you will keep on omitting and refuse to explain those scriptures.

does heb 1:1-4, 9 say Jesus is not God and 5-8 say Jesus is God?, if not why do you insist on 5-8 and refuse to quote and explain 1-4
?

EVERYONE CAN SEE YOUR DECEPTIVE TACTICS, YOU LEAVE THE POST DIRECTED TO YOU AND QUOTE THE POST DIRECTED TO OTHERS, SAME TACTICS USED BY THE OTHERS PERSON. AND EVEN WHEN YOU QUOTE THE POST YOU FAIL TO RESPOND TO THE ISSUES, QUESTIONS AND SCRIPTURES FOUND THEIR.
well ,since the post posted to you has exposed your false doctrine, the best next thing is to leave it alone, cus quoting it will only expose you further!

brocab:
I find even in your own teachings, theirs is a large twist, how God is described.

there are no twists, large or small.

You can't seem to get your head around "Who is, who was, and who is to come, you are either reading the Watchtower magazines and receiving your teachings from them, Or you have gone after your own.

I've used the scriptures to Identify to you him who is who was and who is coming, you could not refute what I showed you, neither could you qoute and explain those scriptures I used.

You believe God is a person? "But you don't believe He came Hear as a Man. You believe No-one had seen God at anytime-but you don't believe Jesus was seen and lived among us as both Man and God.

sir, the scriptures say no one has seen God at any time, but people saw Jesus, therefore Jesus is not the God no one has seen at anytime.
If you had taken time to read that verse to the end , you would have noticed that Jesus is not the God who was being mentioned their.
try to quote that verse fully next time, it will help.

You had actually described God coming to Earth as a person, but you don't recognise who He is. You have read God created all things in the universe, but you don't believe Jesus created all things in the universe.

hope you have read heb 1:1,2, read it and learn!

You believe their is only one Father but you don't believe Jesus said He and His Father are One the same {John 10:30} I and the Father are One.

the bold is a lie!, the verse never said so!

The Jews knew exactly what Jesus had said, look at their evidence they wanted to stone Him. But a question for you is, was Jesus lying?

What evidence, the one based on wrong understanding of what jesus said?
Jesus did not lie, it's you that is lying againSt jesus, calling him what he did not call himself
did Jesus call himself God ? no ! he said

Joh 10:36[u]do you say to me whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world,[/u] ‘You blaspheme,’ because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’?[/u]

YOU REFUSED TO FOLLOW WHAT JESUS CALLED HIMSELF, WHO THE ANGEL TOLD MARY THAT JESUS IS, YOU REFUSED TO FOLLOW WHAT JESUS SAID ABOUT THE FATHER, YOU PREFER CALLING JESUS THE FATHER!

[b]Joh 5:20[u]For the Father has affection for the Son and shows him all the things he himself does,[/u] and he will show him works greater than these, so that you may marvel.

Joh 14:28You heard that I said to you, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would rejoice that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I am.

Joh 10:25Jesus answered them: “I told you, and yet you do not believe. The works that I am doing in my Father’s name, these bear witness about me.

YOU PREFER TO BELIEVE THE PHARISEES, CUS THEIR BELIEVES RHYMES WITH YOURS, YOU REFUSED TO LISTEN TO WHAT JESUS SAID ABOUT THAT BELIEVE

Joh 5:46In fact, if you believed Moses, you would believe me, for he wrote about me.

what did Moses write about Jesus, did he say Jesus is God?no , did he say God himself is the one coming? no .

Moses said:

De 18:15Jehovah your God will raise up for you from among your brothers a prophet like me. You must listen to him.

Lu 24:44He then said to them: “These are my words that I spoke to you while I was yet with you, that all the things written about me in the Law of Moses and in the Prophets and Psalms must be fulfilled.”

Joh 1:45Philip found Na·thanʹa·el and said to him: “We have found the one of whom Moses, in the Law, and the Prophets wrote: Jesus, the son of Joseph, from Nazʹa·reth.”

You had described God as Jesus coming to earth {Colossians 1:16} All things were created through Him, and for Him..Jesus created everything that was created.

you are a liar brocab, no wonder you could not quote where I made such description.
you refused to quote that verse, probably because quoting it will prevent you from twisting it. The previous verse has clarified who god is
King James Version
Col 1:3We give thanks to God and the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, praying always for you,

Which of course you can't believe Jesus is coming in the clouds 'that every eye will see Him, but you can believe God is coming in the clouds 'and every eye will see Him.

stop lying againSt me brocab!

{Acts 1:9} After He had said this He {Jesus} was taken up before their eye's and a cloud hid Him.
You say this is God in {Revelation 1:7-8} Every eye will see Him coming. Same God said no-one has seen Him at any time?

you are a liar brocab , the lies has eating deep into you. This is what I said :

the verse (rev 1: is talking about God, the Father, the almighty, the most high! and below is what the verse said :
New International Version
"I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty."

English Standard Version
“I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”

BROCAB, YOU HAVE PERFECTED THE ACT OF NOT QUOTING MY POSTS SO THAT YOU CAN BE ABLE TO LIE, STATING THAT I SAID AND BELIEVED THINGS I DID NOT SAY OR IMPLY.

THE ABOVE IS ONE OF THE REASONS YOU REFUSED TO RESPOND TO THE POSTS IN WHICH MY EXPLAINATIONS ON REV 1: 1,4-8 REV 3: 2:12 AND HEB 1:9 IS GIVING.

{Acts 1:10-11} They were looking intently into the shy as He was going up, when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them. Men of Galilee they said; why do you stand there looking into the sky? This same Jesus who had been taken from you into heaven, will come back the same way you have seen Him go into heaven.
{Mark 16:19, } Says it all who was taken up into the clouds and who's returning the same way.
And let me say Jesus hasn't made His final leap yet, His time is still to come.

the scripture has told you the truth brocab, stop twisting it !

zodiakzax:
ooopppssS waiiittt. What happened to from vs 5-8 (Heb 1), you were quick to quote 1-4 Then jump to 9, pls do continue from 5-8. Jesus was the creator, God said "I by my own hand laid the foundation of the earth" qtn why didn't He say I by my Son laid the foundation of the earth? Is God a liar? Does His words change? Anyway waiting for Heb 1:5-8.

WELL, ALL CAN SEE MY EXPLAINATIONS AND THE SCRIPTURES I QUOTED, WHICH YOU CANNOT EXPLAIN OR REFUTE.

your statement would have been understood if the issues had been on heb 1: 1-9, but the isues had been on if jesus is God and what your statement on thier similarity really means.
ive shown you that Jesus is not the God mentioned their, and also explained the issue you had on creation. that post is the 3rd time I explained it to you but you still refuse to respond or qoute and explain the scriptures found their, you also failed go examine the other issues found in the post, acting as IF they do not exist.
ive once told you, read the scriptures, dnt just look for similarities. A king in babyLon called himself the same title used for Jesus, does this mean the king of babyLon is jesus ? No!, how do we know this? through examination of the scriptures sir.
If you are truth full, you will quote those scriptures I posted and give your own views about them, but if you are not truthful, you will keep on omitting and refuse to explain those scriptures.

does heb 1:1-4, 9 say Jesus is not God and 5-8 say Jesus is God?, if not why do you insist on 5-8 and refuse to quote and explain 1-4

solite3:
dolphinsheart I can not begin to root out all your lies but one of your biggest lie is repeating questions that had already been answered not just me, but by others.

then it will be easy for you to post one of theM na, what is preventing you if you think my lies are many.

have you solite3 answered the questions asked ? no !, if you have, you would have posted it.

your posts are becoming stale, all your lies had already been busted and thrown away like trash that it is and repeating it will not make it better either, I suggest that if you don't have anything to say keep quiet but if you have any question, ask in honesty and by God's grace you will be answered

for ya mind!

Solite3 pls respond:

Sorry to say. Thank God you have finally agreed that Jesus is a man even in heaven but that's not the whole story,

will you stop lying against me!


Jesus has a God, yes or no,?
Jesus is subjected to that God , yes or no
if Jesus has a God, how can He then be almighty God ?

2. on April 27 jEphz
"for those saying Jesus is God.. pls. explain these Scripture for me ... Ephesians 5:1,2 1timothy 2:5 John 8:42 Act 2:22 Hebrews 12:2...... "

3. April 29
" the God of our Lord Jesus Christ " Eph 1:17, who is the God of Jesus Christ ?

4. "You say Jesus is still a man in heaven, you also say Jesus has a God when he was a man.
NOW DOES Jesus STILL HAVE A GOD IN HEAVEN?"

who anointed Jesus? who is that person to Jesus?
you can see that the questions are numbered, so dnt muddle it up , or give part response

solite3, pls respond to these post if you can( it was posted on may 28, 1: 17pm)

The first verse of Revelation had set a precedent for you to use to examine the whole book, it tells you that "God gave Jesus" the revelation , God did not give himself, Jesus did not give himself, it was God who have Jesus the Revelation. God ( in the book of revelation)and Jesus are not the same person!
verse 4-6 also clears who is who in the Book of revaluation, it helps us to understand that the one who is, who was, and who is coming is different from Jesus Christ.
brocab says it's Jesus, you say it's the father, yet you refuse to discuss and tell the whole world who is right and who is wrong!
to make sure that you dnt confuse yourself on who the al mighty God is, Jesus told you severaly in that book that he has a God! , using the words " my God " several times in that book. I ve several times asked if the almighty can have a god superior to him, cus Jesus had now indicated when he was in heaven, when he came to earth, and when he back in heaven that he has a God! he did not just call that God "a God ", he said "my God", "your god" , "the only true god".

All this facts are presented to you in the Book of Revelation, you could not discuss any of them, but you choose to believe a verse from the Textus Receptus that you can't defend, that you can't show where the Textus Receptus got it from! that majority of scholars have shown to be spurious, that can't be found even in translations of the authors that surpport trinity.

lastly, even if you would not answer the questions being posted to you several times , pls can you tell us the name of your church or organization you associate with at the moment?[/b]

zodiakzax:
it seems you don't read my replies. I gave u scriptures to explain to me and show me if Jesus wasn't both God and man, (in that Christ was worshiped).

I do read you replies well well, I told you my views on what you posted, it's an attempt by you to not respond to my post to you, if truly you where sincere about your beliefs, you would have responded to that post and explained the scriptures found in it, but you prefer to ignore an existing post only to now mention me again with new questions.
I'm not saying I wunt answer you questions, but pls do so in the post I specifically directed to you! This method of skipping existing posts is is an attempt not to answer questions, read scriptures and explanations giving in that post. dnt about mentioning dolphinheart in other posts while you refuse to respond to existing ones.

And I did Reply your posts, maybe you still can't comprehend what am saying.

no sir , more than once now you refused to respond, only to mention my name in another post to someone else. If you dnt believe me, check the post made by me on may 31, 3:40 PM, page 72 of these thread. Also check my post made on 9: 28 am June 2 page 77 and 11:19PM June 3 page78.
If truly you can proof that you quoted and replied those posts, I'll apologise!

I've reminded you about those posts, second and third time being 7:14PM June 5 page 83,and 7:40 PM June 5 page 83.

You did not respond to the posts I reminded you about , but you went ahead to bring another issue up which I responded to on 11: 53 PM June 5 page 84 and completed the response on 1:06 PM June 6 page 85

before this time, you had stopped quoting me directly in a bid not to answer the questions asked or to respond to scriptures quoted to you, you now mention dolphinheart in other posts, Leaving my previous response and scriptures.

you can see that, I had provided proof to back up my claims, hope you will respond accordingly.

I said, you will only understand my point if you understand that Jesus Christ came and is still both Man and God I did give scriptures which you explained some according to YOUR understanding and also failed to explain the rest.

all the scriptures you have provided so far,(apart from the post where you mentioned many scriptures)I have qouted it, and explained it. You could not even quote the scriptures you mentioned. I have also provided other scriptures that help one understand the issues under discussion, but you refused to quote them , talk less of giving any explanations.

I asked you some questions about Jesus being both man and God, you failed to respond to that. How can I believe something that is unsriptural!

I did say that as to the remaining scriptures in that first post of yours, I'll respond to them soon , remember I numbered each point you raised and will continue from last point responded to.

In some of your explanation you quote some scriptures I use and you ask me if that scripture meant Jesus is God, which doesn't make sense to me bcs Jesus is said to have the Characteristics of who God is, and if that doesn't make Him God then I don't really know what to tell u again. For example God is said to be the Creator and it is said of Jesus that He created the world. Now Just bcs Jesus is not specifically called the Creator doesn't mean He's not the Creator, so like one of my brothers asked, how do you call one who creates if that one is not the Creator Jozzy is a confused JW, more confused than you even though in a good way, in a good way bcs at least he is not that deep into the things of satan (which is of course your doctrines and organization). You on the other hand should be careful.

Once again, I did explain to you the issue of creator, but you did not respond to that post ,you decided to bring it up here again. well, here was my response, let's see if you will respond to the scriptures and give your understanding, if contrary , to the scriptures posted there.

"Do these verses mean that Jesus is the same person as God? I answer is no .
why do I say so?
reading from verse 1 oF Hebrews shows that it is God that was talking and that God was not talking about himself but talking to and about someone else. The attributes he asigned to the person he was talking go and about cannot be applied to God, in this case I'll refer to this God as Almighty God .

excerpts from previous verses of heb chapter one before we get to verse 10.
King James Version
Heb 1:1-4,9: God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2. Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his(a) Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
3. Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
4. Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.
9. Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God,(your god) hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

What have I learnt from those verses, I've learnt that(pls correct me if Im wrong)
1. that the person (Jesus) being referred to in verse 10 is not the God that was talking in that verse.
2. that the person , Jesus in an heir, the almighty God is not an heir to no person.
3. The person being refered to in verse 10 sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, thus that person(jesus) is not the Majesty on high, which indicates jesus is not the most high!
4. the person being talked about in verse 10 has a God who anointed and promoted him!

With the above, I do not think that person is almighty God , who is said to be the creator.
but the question is still there, how can this person who god was talking about be said to have laid the foundation of the earth as God is said to have done. The answer lies in the following scriptures.

[b]Ps 33:6By the word of Jehovah the heavens were made, And by the spirit of his mouth everything in them.

Col 1:15,16He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation;
16 because by means of him all other things were created in the heavens and on the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All other things have been created through him and for him.

Pr 8:22, 27- 31: Jehovah produced me as the beginning of his way, The earliest of his achievements of long ago.
27 When he prepared the heavens, I was there; When he marked out the horizon on the surface of the waters,
28When he established the clouds above, When he founded the fountains of the deep,
29When he set a decree for the sea That its waters should not pass beyond his order, When he established the foundations of the earth,
30Then I was beside him as a master worker. I was the one he was especially fond of day by day; I rejoiced before him all the time;
31I rejoiced over his habitable earth, And I was especially fond of the sons of men.[/b]

This scriptures proves to me, and I hope it does so to you too that jehovah, who is called the almighty God is primarily responsible for creation, the power for the creation came from but he used his only begotten Son, who was his master worker, to do it .
That is why the apostles could rightly distinguish between jesus and God and their roles in creation, they told us :

1Co 8:6there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him.

Joh 1:10He was in the world, and the world came into existence through him, but the world did not know him.
pls do not forget what the God talking in verse 10 of heb chapter was said to do with Jesus in verse 2."

In another post, I reminded you about this post above and added more scriptures:

"if you had read my post with all seriousness, you would have seen the answers to these statements. Since you have refused to quote and explain the scriptures I have shown you, it seems you know the truth, but want it covered!
look at the bolded again, " God said of the son" , how do you think the one who is talking about another person now be the same as the person he talking about?
pls read heb 1: 1,2 again

King James Version
Heb 1:1God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

is God the prophets? no , the prophets where messengers of God!
why then do you think God spoke through himself in the next verse?

King James Version
Heb 1:2Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

solite3:
dolphins heart your lies ehh. I don't blame you sha, that's the trademark of your organisation. Keep it up

all this post crossing will not help you, go and respond to the posts which I directed to you!
you claim I lie, yet you could not point it out !

zodiakzax:
hahahhahahhaha yes exactly. And as you said they would have by now changed it in their bible saying Jesus says "I am a god" instead of "I am God". John 1:1 and Heb 1:8 really got me very furious. If only Dolphinheart and his pple can just Understand the ministry of Jesus an both Man and God, they wouldnt be asking some senseless qtns.

Jozzy is one liar, he claims they are one in understanding yet he says Russell is not the founder of JW's whilst the OP of this thread says Russell is the founder, is that not division? I am being quiet bcs no matter what I tell him it seems he's blinded to the truth and would even lie even if the truth is right there in his face. Is God's nature and God's divine nature not the same? He knws it but bcs dolphinheart was fumbling about the nature of God, he decided to quickly cook up a lie to rescue his brother. I pity them

Jozzy and Dolphinheart, why have u guys changed Heb 1:8??

1. you coUld not respond to my posts to you, hence you want to bring other issues up that will enable you not to respond to those posts.
2. you accuse me of fumbling about divine nature, and yet you could not state what I said about it, you could also not state what jozzy4 said about it, your character is being shown little by little.
you too could not quote and explain certain scriptures, I'm starting to think this is a universal charater of people who believe in trinity, they will not read, comment, qoute or explain certain scriptures!
sir if you want to ask me questions, go back to our posts, reply me there and ask your questions!

add also, my statements on divine nature and jozzy4 statement and lets compare, if you can't do that, then you have joined the league of false accusers .

brocab:
Dolphinheart everything is a lie to you, you don't even believe in C.T.Russell and his own manuscripts, about who Christ is.

1. is everything a lie to me? no , brocab, stop making false statements!
2. do you believe in Russell's and his book about who Christ is?
pls quote what Russell said about Christ when responding, (remember I said quote, not mention)

Dolphinhaerts-Quotes>did the Father become man? NOOo!, it was the son that became man!
{Revelation 1} If this is your case, then how can you believe God the Father is the one coming, and not Jesus?

HOPE EVERYONE CAN SEE THAT HE COULD NOT RESPOND TO THAT QUESTION: did the father become man?
my answer again is NOOO! the father did not become man, the scriptures Emphasized who became man! jesus, the son of God!

you refused to answer that question and put up a question that does not relate to who became man, hope everyone can see these.
The question is false from the begginING, answering it would imply that I said or believed "God the father is the one coming, and not Jesus Christ". Since I never said nor implied so, the question is thus not for me, go and find the person who said that and ask him or her!

How does one separate two that have the same qualifications with the other, can you separate yourself from your fathers seed. NOOo.

answer: by being a different person from your father!
is the father and Jesus the same person? no
are you the same person with you father , despite the fact that you are his seed? no
you might have brothers or sisters or both, are you the same person since you are all your father's seed ? no !
EVERYONE SHOULD NOTE THAT HE WILL NOT ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS.
PLEASE NOTE AGAIN HIS ATTEMPT AT LINKING THE WORD "FATHER" WHICH I USED TO THE SENTENCE "FATHERS SEED".

brocab, your statement has already seperated them , but in your cunning way, you refuse to complete it!, pls tell , two what!?, is it two numbers, two persons, two gods,?

do they have same qualification's? no
did the scriptures call the father the first born of all creations? no
Did the scriptures say the father died ? no
did the scripture call jesus the most high? no jesus sat at the right side of the most high and the psalmist identified the most high.

So why is it dolphinheart you believe God and His Son is separable, Jesus couldn't do anything without God, and you are trying to tell me

Did I say they are seperable? no , I say they are seperate beings , seperate persons?
JESUS IS NOT THE FATHER!

{Revelation 1:8} is only about the Father and 'not the Son? BOTH OF THEM ARE NOT SEPARABLE.

because only the father is the "him who is, who was and who is to come," only the father is the almighty, the father never called anyone "my God!.".
The book of rev is clear on that one.

Everything the FATHER did JESUS did, And you are trying to convince me otherwise.

read the scriptures brocab

john 5:19,20,26(ESV)
19 So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of his own accord, but only what he sees the Father doing. For whatever the Father does, that the Son does likewise.
20 For the Father loves the Son and shows him ALL that he himself is doing. And greater works than these will he show him, so that you may marvel.
26. For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son also to have life in himself.
brocab read the scriptures above and explain!

You won't listen to reason, nor do you understand who the Alpha and the Omega the first and the last is, every eye will see him coming in the clouds-He was alive, and became dead, and look He is alive forevermore.

and for the umpteenth time, you have failed to show where you got this from, despite being asked several times.

If no-one had seen God at anytime? Then who will the people see coming in the clouds, if this isn't Jesus

quote where you got this from sir, I'll explain to you.

Jesus said to Thomas, how can you say show me the Father, you have been with Me for so long, and still you don't recognise the Father? I and the Father are One.

did you read, " I am the father" there? did that verse tell you that Jesus is the father?
husband and wife become one, does it mean the wife is now the same person as the huband? nah!
the disciples are to become one with jesus and the father , does it mean that they will be the same person as jesus and the father? no ooooo!

brocab, the father is greater than I am, Jesus said!

What your problem is, you have your head so far up your back side, that every time you think you are becoming closer to the Lord, darkness over shadows you with more darkness, and if there was a little light shinning, you wouldn't recognise it.
Artiest as you are, and artiest you will stay. God help you.

defamation, derogatory words and abuse will not help you.

PLS NOTE THAT:
1. He could not find scripture that surpports this statement of his
" Jesus in Spirit had become a man, Father like Son One Spirit became man.".

2. He could not respond to my explanation of phil 2: 6-8 and the scriptures quoted to surpport the explanation.

3. He has refused to comment or retract the statement he said I believed in after I've shown him to be wrong about my beliefs.

4.he could not respond to this statements :
are you trying to say that the father died!
that the father sent himself!
that the father anointed himself!

PLS REMEMBER HIS WORDS
"so if this is the father, the the father is Christ, because it was Christ who was alive and was dead and look He is alive forever more" and,
"Everything the FATHER did JESUS did"

ill end this post with the scriptures he can't quote, talk less of explain.

john 17:3 (ESV)And this is eternal life, that they know you the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.

john 20:17(ESV)
Jesus said to her, “Do not cling to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

EVERYONE, PLS NOTE THE NEW METHOD ADOPTED TO PREVENT THEM FROM ANSWERING DIRECT AND SEPERATE QUESTIONS POSTED TO EACH OF THEM.

brocab:
Does this sound like dolphinheart hates me with a passion. What a joke, but thanks bro for answering all these meanness Questions dolphinheart keeps on throwing at me. Bless you brother.

I do not hate you sir, but I don't like lies or cunny behaviors, I also dnt like defamation of someone else when you views dnt go along with theirs!

as for the issues at hand sir, you have not responded to it

issues at hand:
(A)I brought up and issue on what he said about Jesus when he was on earth, hope you will agree that God's Spirit helped him make such statement too, but knowing you, I believe you will stay as far away from that issue as possible even though you where being mentioned there!

(B]PLS ! ,BROCAB, PROVIDE JUST ONE EXAMPLE WHERE YOU HAD ASKED ME TO EXPLAIN " WHO IT IS" AND ALL IVE DONE IS TO WRITE THE SCRIPTURE

(C)you said this : "But first you need to think about this, "we are Christians" and Christians are not Jehovah witnesses, Christians don't think the same as you, nor do we believe in any of your doctrines."
I asked you :
you dnt believe any of our doctrines? ok , one of the doctrines of jehovahs witnesses doctrine is that followers of Jesus are not supposed to participate in warfare , do you accept this doctrine or you believe that Jesus followers are supposed to participate in warfare, by warfare, I mean war among countries, nationalities, and tribes, e.g the nigerian civil war!
Another teaching is that fornicators, people who deliberately and continuously commit fornication after being found out, are not allowed to be part of
brocab, there are still other isues at hand

(D)WRITTEN WHAAAT? pls point to what I've written and post it, anytime I say you said something, I endeavor to direct you to wheee and when you said it, so pls direct me and others to where I said " God and the Word is a two headed god"?
bunch of liars!
2. Brought what back to my attention, I know you desperately want him to bring those words he accused me of saying out, it pains you that he could not, hence you have to find alternatives!

(E)And yet no response from you on the issue you yourself raised?
also up till now , you have not answered these questions
(ill find that post and point it to you)

(F)you have also refused to respond to these questions and scripture:
[b]Just tell us the name of the church you associate with, that you are a member of!. If possible you can include its official website, at least you surpport using technology in Gods work.

(G)Tell us, do you know that Jesus Christ told someone that he has a God? And that statement was recorded in the kjv.? Can you tell us where this can be found?
If you can't answer this question brocab, then you dnt know the truth about Christ!.
Expecially. The one spoken by Jesus himself.

(H)Examine this questions brocab
1. If you say one body, one spirit, was Jesus a spirit before he came to earth?
2. When Jesus was on earth, was the spirit in him his, the father or the holy spirit.?
3. After Jesus left the earth, did he remain in the body or became a spirit?
4. What does Jesus mean by " the father is greater than I am"
5. Why does Jesus say he is going to the father when you are trying to say he is spirit.
6. You asked a question, the answer is yes, but ill like to ask you, what about the soul, why did you remove the soul when fomulating your question.

(1)brocab , readers will note(again) that you have NOT quoted and explained ANY of the following scriptures :
1.rev 1:1,6
2. Rev 3, 2,13
3. John 17:1-3
4. Heb 1:1 -9
5. John 20:17
6. 1 cor 11:3
7 . 1 ti 2 :5,6
8.Acts 4:10
9. Acts 2:36
10. Acts 2:24
11. Acts 5:30
12.Acts 10:38,40,43
11. Phil 2:9,11
12. john 14:6
13. Acts 4 : 26,27, 30
14. 1 john 4:14
15. Heb 5:7
16. ps 28:18
17. 2 cor 1:3
18. Eph 1:3
19. 1 pet 1:3
20: 2Cor 8:6
21. 1 cor 15: 27,28
And a host of others

(J)Brocab , examine these scripture
Acts 5: 31.
Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
John 3:16.
For God so loved the world,
that he gave his only begotten
Son, that whosoever believeth
in him should not perish, but
have everlasting life.
Jesus is Gods only begotten son, Jesus is not God almighty!


(K)YOU HAVE AGAIN ADDED LIES TO YOUR VIEWS.
Lets see if Jesus was recognizable to those who knew him:
[b]King James Version
Joh 20:14And when she had thus said, she turned herself back, and saw Jesus standing, and KNEW NOT THAT IT WAS Jesus!
King James Version
Joh 20:15Jesus saith unto her, Woman, why weepest thou? whom seekest thou? SHE SUPPOSING HIM TO BE THE GARGENER, saith unto him, Sir, if thou have borne him hence, tell me where thou hast laid him, and I will take him away.
I dnt think the disciples would have been able to recognize Jesus more than Mary, she probably would have known Jesus from birth, and the picture of Jesus in her memory would have been sharper than a 100 mega pixel camera!
but here you are , lying again that Jesus was recognizable to those who knew him!
dnt you think Mary should have been able to recognise Jesus instantly if he had been raise in the same body he died in?
* this is a question ill hope you can give us answer to .
Do you notice how Jesus appeared to his disciples who had locked the doors, his actions transcends the physical realm, he appeared to them gram!, in a locked rooM!. yet until he showed them death dealing wound marks, that was when they believed they where swing the Lord.
brocab pls tell us
1. DOES SOME ONE FACE CHANGE WHEN HE OR SHE IS RESSURRECTED WITH THE SAME BODY HE OR SHE DIED IN?
2.DOES SOME ONE GETS RESSURRECTED WITH THE WOUND'S OR INJURIES THAT KILLED HIM?
If your assumptions are true, I bet during the ressurection, we will know those whose throut where slit, cus there will still be a gapping hole in there necks. and those whose brains where blown out will have a hole in their head, cus they will be resurrected with that same body!
before, I digress, let's further examine ya lie.
King James Version
Joh 21:4But when the morning was now come, Jesus stood on the shore: BUT THE DISCIPLES KNEW NOT THAT IT WAS Jesus.
john 21: 12 New International Version
Jesus said to them, "Come and have breakfast." None of the disciples dared ask him, "Who are you?" They knew it was the Lord.
even after seing Jesus after his resurrecting, after being with Jesus for years, they still do not recognize Jesus at first glance. If Jesus had been resurrected with the same body he had died in, the disciples will have no doubt, they wunt need to even bother to ask the question that dared not to ask, "who are you".
Jesus had just showed them who he is, it is left for us to understand that they still had issues with Jesus physical features, despite knowing that the person inviting theM to a meal is actually Jesus.
I for one believe that only spirits do appear and dissappear at will!
spirits can manifest physical bodies of any liking for any particular purpose, the scriptures is awash with such occurrences, they can even use it to have sex sef!
sir do you ever read the scriptures at all.
It says flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God!
human body is flesh and blood!
how then do you espect the king of gods kingdom to have flesh and blood while his Co rulers do not!
how do you expect the physical to rule in the spiritual realm.
brocab, Jesus was a spirit before he came to earth, was he not?
how come , you refuse him his spirit nature when he had accomplished the work he was sent to do here on earth?

zodiakzax:
@ Dolphinheart, like I said you don't make sense. If Christ wasn't both God and Man when He came, then explain these scriptures:

John 1:10, John 1:14, John 5:18,Mark 2:27-28, John 10:30-33, John 14:7-11,John 8:58, Phili 2:5-8.

The Wise men worshipped Him: Mt 2:11
His Disciples worshipped Him: Mt 14:33
Canaanite woman worshipped Him: Mt 15:25
Others Worship Him: Mt 28:9

After ascension He was worshipped: Luke 24:52 etc

Only God can be worshipped cf Rev 22:8-9.

John 5:18: clearly the Jews understood His stand when He said God was His Father, that indeed made Him equal with God. Unless you blv you know more than the Scribes and the Pharisees.

Another qtn: why was Heb 1:8 changed in your NWT. And why did Thomas call Him " the Lord of me and the God of me" hence rendered My Lord and My God?


DolphinHeart, you claim I don't read your posts well, but clearly it seems you also don't read mine well. I told you to use Kingdom Interlinear greek bible in our further discussions but you refused. Pls I won't reply to you again unless you use the greek bible. The KIT is published by your own pple so feel free and use it.

All your replies doesn't make sense, you are clearly speaking against the very scripture we use. Your pple deny your founder Russell, if I were you, I would want to find out why your very founder Russell's teaching was banned, why he made those claims, but No, you won't bcs you are scared of the truth. I only pray for you.

sir, I wunt lie to you , I see this as a desperate and bad attempt at not responding to my post , expecially the questions and scriptures fOund their.
like I said, if you cant respond to my post, pls respond to the scriptures found there.

You seem to be trying to find fault by any means posSible, hence once and explanation is giving , you could not counter it, you quote not give your own explanation on any the scriptures posted there, but prefer to bring up other things that you think might surpport you aim ,
Pls attend to my response to your views , as a learned person would, then you can bring up New issues.

I told you to quote the kingdom Interlinear if you want to, your explanat ion to force me to use something is utenable and wrong!

dnt force people to do certain things cus of your interest, use watever scriptures you want to use, but if the person you are using it for finds some issues with it, he or she has the right to bring it up. Not following your commandment does not mean I did not read your post very well, you can see that I made some questions as to your posts which you have refused to respond to .

This ya new method of running away from posts directed to you and preferring to respond to post directed to someone else is interesting

brocab:
Lets finish {Philippians 2:6-7} in the NWT bible.
Although He was existing in God's form, gave no consideration to a seizure {Other words a heart attack} Namely that He should be equal to God.
{V 7} No but He emptied Himself and took a slaves form and became Human.
{V 8} More than that when He came as a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death.

good !

Jesus in Spirit had become a man, Father like Son One Spirit became man.

this is a lie! , that's why you could not quote the any scripture that surpport it.
did the father become man? NOOo!, it was the son that became man!

Read my explanation on phil 2: 6-8 again, read the scriptures you find there!, if you can, which I believe you cannot, respond to those scriptures, look at the questions and examine them


"you are very wrong sir, Jesus did not come as both man and God, I'll first quote and explain the scriptures you mentioned then add mine .

phil 2:6 English Standard Version
who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped,

the previous verses gives us an insight into what Paul was saying here , Philippians 2:6 makes no sense at all if Jesus is viewed as ‘God.’

[b]3.nothing from selfish ambition or conceit, but in humility count others more significant than yourselves.
4 Let each of you look not only to his own interests, but also to the interests of others.
5 Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus,[/color]

some translations translate verse 5 as:" Have this attitude in yourselves, which was also in Christ Jesus."

If Jesus was ‘God’ he could not have been tempted to do something from “selfishness or empty conceit” nor could he be tempted to “merely look out for” his own “personal interests.
paul counsels Christians to imitate Christ in the matter here being discussed. Could they be urged to consider it “not robbery,” but their right, “to be equal with God”? Surely not!
However, they can imitate one who “gave no consideration to a seizure, namely, that he should be equal to God.”

now does jesus beING in the form of God mean jesus is almighty God ? no , the earlier discussion about father and son being humans cus they have same nature clears that, and the fact that Jesus did not consider grabING the notion that he could be equal to God surpports that.
These other scriptures also give credence to the fact the jesus is not almighty God.

col 1:15 English Standard Version
He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.

English Standard Version
gen 5:3 When Adam had lived 130 years, he fathered a son in his own likeness, after his image, and named him Seth.
some translations say : " in his image"
if seth is not adam cus he is in the image of adam and same nature with adam, then we can see that Jesus is not God cus he is in the image of God, just like seth is a man, like Jesus is a god.

let's continue, for verse 7, I'm going to quote from different translations to emphasis the point there
[b] phil 2:7
New International Version
rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant, BEING MADE IN HUMAN LIKENESS.

English Standard Version
but emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men.

New American Standard Bible
but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.

International Standard Version
Instead, poured out in emptiness, a servant's form did he possess, a mortal man becoming. In human form he chose to be,

NET Bible
but emptied himself by taking on the form of a slave, by looking like other men, and by sharing in human nature.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
But he stripped himself and took the form of a Servant and was in the form of the children of men, and was found in fashion as a man.[/u]

did this verse say Jesus retained his divine nature or form when he took on human form? no! the verse indicate jesus EMPTIED HIMSELF and became human. There was no addition of any form but a total change in form!

verse 8 supports this view
English Standard Version
And being found in human form, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.
Jesus was found only in one form when he came to earth, not 2 in 1 form.
If jesus was fully God when he came to earth , satan would have right to claim no human can remain Faithfull to God and sinless till death, cus according to you jesus was more than human, he was also God .

verse 9, and 11 now concludes the matter, snowing us that jesus is not God, nor he the God he was reffering to earlier, he also identified who god is.
HOPE YOU REMEMBER WHO JESUS CALL ED THE TRUE GOD, WHO HE IDENTIFIED AS OUR GOD AND WHO THE APOSTLES LISTED AS OUR GOD OUT OF THE MANY GOD'S.

English Standard Version
Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name
New International Version
and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

do we have other scriptures that surpport this
[b]Joh 1:14So the Word BECAME FLESH and resided among us, and we had a view of his glory, a glory such as belongs to an only-begotten son from a father; and he was full of divine favor and truth.

Heb 2:9But we do see Jesus, who WAS MADE a little lower than angels, now crowned with glory and honor for having suffered death, so that by God’s undeserved kindness he might taste death for everyone.

Isa 52:13Look! My servant will act with insight. He will be raised up high, He will be elevated and greatly exalted.

read also Ac 2:32, 33; Joh 14:28; Isa 53:2, 3; Joh 10:17"

As you believe> {Revelation 1:8} I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end say's the Lord, who is and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty Is the Father.

as I believe? no sir, this is What I believe:
rev 8:1
New International Version
"I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty."

English Standard Version
“I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.”

New American Standard Bible
"I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty."

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
I am The Alap and The Tau, says THE LORD JEHOVAH God, he who is and has been and is coming, The Almighty.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
"I am the A and the Z," says the Lord God, the one who is, the one who was, and the one who is coming, the Almighty.

brocab , I believe that "I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty." is in reference to Jehovah, the father, the one who sat on the throne and the Lamb collected the scroll from, the almighty God who is the true God.

so next time pls pls pls, brocab, dnt tell lies about what I believe, pls I beg, dnt formulate what I believe in.

So if this is the Father, then the Father is Christ, because it was Christ who was alive and was dead and look He is alive forevermore.

haha a a! can you see what defending a lie has started to make you say!
so jesus is the father in heaven
so jesus is lying when he told us to pray, our Father in heaven when actually he is the father right here on earth?
you are trying to tell us that jesus never had a second witness , that he is is own witness?

you are trying to say that the father died !
that the father sent himself!
that the father anointed himself!

READERS CAN YOU NOW SEE THAT WHEN THEY ARE BEING FORCED TO QUOTE AND EXAMINE CERTAIN SCRIPTURES , THERE FALSE TEACH INGS BECOME ABUNDANTLY CLEAR.

THE SCRIPTURES MADE IT CLEAR BELOW
King James Version
Joh 17:3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

King James Version
Joh 20:17Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

{Other words who is, who was, and who is to come, the Almighty}
Which leaves Jesus and the Father are One Spirit One Man........

another addition of false analogy, things that cannot be proven with the scriptures.

you quoted my post to someone else, but failed to respond to this:
"Secondly , you said the father is greater than me in position, can we apply these to jesus too,? if so then jesus is not the almighty God , cus no one is superior to the almighty God in position, that is why he is called the most high!"

brocab:
But like me, most people would go further into the Finished Mystery and find the actual site where C. T. Russell had written his manuscripts. Which again you failed to do, from this site given to you, had shown to all the world 'who see's C.T.Russell said in he's own words the Alpha and the Omega is Jesus Christ, which you have once again refuse to take notes off.

unlike you , I prefer to examine the scriptures and learn what it is telling me, did it tell me that Jesus is the alpha and omega ? no .

I quoted those scriptures to you,(Rev 1:1,4-8, Rev 3:2,12, heb 1:9) I explained what it said there, but fear of exposure has kept you from quoting and explaining those scriptures, you , brocab is searching left and right for people and books that surpport your views, but you will not quote and explain the scriptures that explain who the Alpha and omega is!

even when those scriptures are posted and explained to you, all you do is run away from it and act like you did not see it, you refuse to respond to the scriptures quoted to you in them!

Stop lying dolphinheart everyone and "I" have written the scriptures over and over to you, and of course the world can see the hardship us Christians had laid verse after verse, so even you may have enough sense to know the word of God, is true.
But of course your argument is yours, who could stand with your period-er state of mind, no-one is cutting your post and I suppose you still think the boogie man is living in your closet.

did I ask you to write the scriptures ?no !
This is my request, that you should respond to issues at hand :
meanWhile, issues at hand:
issues at hand:
I brought up and issue on what he said about Jesus when he was on earth, hope you will agree that God's Spirit helped him make such statement too, but knowing you, I believe you will stay as far away from that issue as possible even though you where being mentioned there!
PLS ! ,BROCAB, PROVIDE JUST ONE EXAMPLE WHERE YOU HAD ASKED ME TO EXPLAIN " WHO IT IS" AND ALL IVE DONE IS TO WRITE THE SCRIPTURE DOWN!
........................................................
you said this : "But first you need to think about this, "we are Christians" and Christians are not Jehovah witnesses, Christians don't think the same as you, nor do we believe in any of your doctrines."
I asked you :
you dnt believe any of our doctrines? ok , one of the doctrines of jehovahs witnesses doctrine is that followers of Jesus are not supposed to participate in warfare , do you accept this doctrine or you believe that Jesus followers are supposed to participate in warfare, by warfare, I mean war among countries, nationalities, and tribes, e.g the nigerian civil war!
Another teaching is that fornicators, people who deliberately and continuously commit fornication after being found out, are not allowed to be part of
brocab, there are still other isues at hand
.......................................
1. WRITTEN WHAAAT? pls point to what I've written and post it, anytime I say you said something, I endeavor to direct you to wheee and when you said it, so pls direct me and others to where I said " God and the Word is a two headed god"?
bunch of liars!
2. Brought what back to my attention, I know you desperately want him to bring those words he accused me of saying out, it pains you that he could not, hence you have to find alternatives!
..............................
And yet no response from you on the issue you yourself raised?
also up till now , you have not answered these questions
(ill find that post and point it to you)
......................................
you have also refused to respond to these questions and scripture:
[b]Just tell us the name of the church you associate with, that you are a member of!. If possible you can include its official website, at least you surpport using technology in Gods work.
Tell us, do you know that Jesus Christ told someone that he has a God? And that statement was recorded in the kjv.? Can you tell us where this can be found?
If you can't answer this question brocab, then you dnt know the truth about Christ!.
Expecially. The one spoken by Jesus himself.
Examine this questions brocab
1. If you say one body, one spirit, was Jesus a spirit before he came to earth?
2. When Jesus was on earth, was the spirit in him his, the father or the holy spirit.?
3. After Jesus left the earth, did he remain in the body or became a spirit?
4. What does Jesus mean by " the father is greater than I am"
5. Why does Jesus say he is going to the father when you are trying to say he is spirit.
6. You asked a question, the answer is yes, but ill like to ask you, what about the soul, why did you remove the soul when fomulating your question.
brocab , readers will note(again) that you have NOT quoted and explained ANY of the following scriptures :
1.rev 1:1,6
2. Rev 3, 2,13
3. John 17:1-3
4. Heb 1:1 -9
5. John 20:17
6. 1 cor 11:3
7 . 1 ti 2 :5,6
8.Acts 4:10
9. Acts 2:36
10. Acts 2:24
11. Acts 5:30
12.Acts 10:38,40,43
11. Phil 2:9,11
12. john 14:6
13. Acts 4 : 26,27, 30
14. 1 john 4:14
15. Heb 5:7
16. ps 28:18
17. 2 cor 1:3
18. Eph 1:3
19. 1 pet 1:3
20: 2Cor 8:6
21. 1 cor 15: 27,28
And a host of others
.............................................
Brocab , examine these scripture
Acts 5: 31.
Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.
John 3:16.
For God so loved the world,
that he gave his only begotten
Son, that whosoever believeth
in him should not perish, but
have everlasting life.
Jesus is Gods only begotten son, Jesus is not God almighty!
................................................
YOU HAVE AGAIN ADDED LIES TO YOUR VIEWS.
Lets see if Jesus was recognizable to those who knew him:
[b]King James Version
Joh 20:14And when she had thus said, she turned herself back, and saw Jesus standing, and KNEW NOT THAT IT WAS Jesus!
King James Version
Joh 20:15Jesus saith unto her, Woman, why weepest thou? whom seekest thou? SHE SUPPOSING HIM TO BE THE GARGENER, saith unto him, Sir, if thou have borne him hence, tell me where thou hast laid him, and I will take him away.
I dnt think the disciples would have been able to recognize Jesus more than Mary, she probably would have known Jesus from birth, and the picture of Jesus in her memory would have been sharper than a 100 mega pixel camera!
but here you are , lying again that Jesus was recognizable to those who knew him!
dnt you think Mary should have been able to recognise Jesus instantly if he had been raise in the same body he died in?
* this is a question ill hope you can give us answer to .
Do you notice how Jesus appeared to his disciples who had locked the doors, his actions transcends the physical realm, he appeared to them gram!, in a locked rooM!. yet until he showed them death dealing wound marks, that was when they believed they where swing the Lord.
brocab pls tell us
1. DOES SOME ONE FACE CHANGE WHEN HE OR SHE IS RESSURRECTED WITH THE SAME BODY HE OR SHE DIED IN?
2.DOES SOME ONE GETS RESSURRECTED WITH THE WOUND'S OR INJURIES THAT KILLED HIM?
If your assumptions are true, I bet during the ressurection, we will know those whose throut where slit, cus there will still be a gapping hole in there necks. and those whose brains where blown out will have a hole in their head, cus they will be resurrected with that same body!
before, I digress, let's further examine ya lie.
King James Version
Joh 21:4But when the morning was now come, Jesus stood on the shore: BUT THE DISCIPLES KNEW NOT THAT IT WAS Jesus.
john 21: 12 New International Version
Jesus said to them, "Come and have breakfast." None of the disciples dared ask him, "Who are you?" They knew it was the Lord.
even after seing Jesus after his resurrecting, after being with Jesus for years, they still do not recognize Jesus at first glance. If Jesus had been resurrected with the same body he had died in, the disciples will have no doubt, they wunt need to even bother to ask the question that dared not to ask, "who are you".
Jesus had just showed them who he is, it is left for us to understand that they still had issues with Jesus physical features, despite knowing that the person inviting theM to a meal is actually Jesus.
I for one believe that only spirits do appear and dissappear at will!
spirits can manifest physical bodies of any liking for any particular purpose, the scriptures is awash with such occurrences, they can even use it to have sex sef!
sir do you ever read the scriptures at all.
It says flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God!
human body is flesh and blood!
how then do you espect the king of gods kingdom to have flesh and blood while his Co rulers do not!
how do you expect the physical to rule in the spiritual realm.
brocab, Jesus was a spirit before he came to earth, was he not?
how come , you refuse him his spirit nature when he had accomplished the work he was sent to do here on earth?

Also you can read John 12:37-43. Can't wait to see how you will explain it. Since you fight against Textus receptus so much pls be my guest to use any other greek rendering to explain it. We blv ur bible translation is wrong, you say ours (kjv) is wrong. In order to understand each other pls let's use a greek version. Kingdom Interlinear greek (KIT) will be perfect since it was published by the watch tower.

1. I did not condemn the Textus Receptus in its entirety. I point to the particular verse there are issues with!

2. you can use any Greek version you like, if I have issues with it ill bring it up

King James Version
Joh 12:37But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him:
Joh 12:38That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?
Joh 12:39Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,
Joh 12:40He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.
Joh 12:41These things said Esaias, when he saw his glory, and spake of him.
Joh 12:42All the same, many even of the rulers actually put faith in him, but they would not acknowledge him because of the Pharisees, so that they would not be expelled from the synagogue;
Joh 12:43For they loved the praise of men more than the praise of God.

KNOWING what Isaiah and other prophets had written about the Messiah, the Jewish nation long anticipated his arrival. By Jesus’ day, in fact, many Jews “were in expectation” of the Messiah’s imminent appearance.- luke 3:15
Significantly, Bible prophecies include remarkable details of the Messiah’s life. No mere human could either foretell such events or arrange for Jesus to experience them.
Details Surrounding the Messiah’s Birth. Isaiah foretold that the Messiah, or Christ, would be born of a virgin. After describing the miraculous circumstances of Jesus’ birth, the apostle Matthew wrote: “All this actually came about for that to be fulfilled which was spoken by Jehovah through his prophet, saying: ‘Look! The virgin will become pregnant and will give birth to a son.’” -matt 1: 22,23; isa 7:14
Isaiah also foretold that Christ would be a descendant of David, specifically mentioning Jesse, David’s father. Jesus did indeed directly descend from David. Matt 1: 6, 16; Luke 3: 23,31,32
Thus, before the birth of Jesus, the angel Gabriel told Jesus’ mother, Mary: “God will give him the throne of David his father.” — Luke 1:32, 33; Isaiah 11:1-5, 10; Romans 15:12

Details of the Messiah’s Life. In the synagogue in Nazareth, the adult Jesus read aloud from Isaiah’s prophecy, including these words:“Jehovah’s spirit is upon me, because he anointed me to declare good news to the poor.” Applying the prophecy to himself, Jesus stated: “Today this scripture that you just heard is fulfilled.”- Luke 4:17-21; Isaiah 61:1, 2

Details of the Messiah’s Suffering. Isaiah prophesied that the Messiah would not be accepted by the majority in Israel but would instead become “a stone of stumbling” to them.- 1 Peter 2:6-8; Isaiah 8:14, 15

And indeed, despite Jesus’ many miracles, the people “were not putting faith in him, so that the word of Isaiah the prophet was fulfilled which he said: ‘Jehovah, who has put faith in the thing heard by us?’” John 12:37, 38; Isaiah 53:1

Contributing to the Jews’ lack of faith was the popular, though mistaken, belief that the Messiah would immediately rid the nation of Roman rule and restore an independent Davidic kingdom on earth. Because Jesus suffered and died, most Jews could not accept him as the Messiah. But, in fact, Isaiah had foretold that the Messiah would experience suffering before becoming King.
In the book of Isaiah, the Messiah prophetically says: “My back I gave to the strikers . . . My face I did not conceal from humiliating things and spit.” Matthew reports what happened when Jesus was being tried: “They spit into his face and hit him with their fists. Others slapped him in the face.” - Isaiah 50:6; Matthew 26:6

“He was letting himself be afflicted; yet he would not open his mouth,” wrote Isaiah. Thus, when Pilate questioned Jesus about the Jews’ accusations, Jesus “did not answer him, no, not a word, so that the governor wondered very much.”— isaiah 53:7; Matthew 27:12-14; Acts 8:28, 32-35

Details of the Messiah’s Death. Isaiah’s prophecy continued to be fulfilled at Jesus’ death and even afterward. Isaiah foretold: “He will make his burial place even with the wicked ones, and with the rich class in his death.” How could this apparently contradictory prophecy be fulfilled? When Jesus died, he was impaled between two robbers. But later, wealthy Joseph of Arimathea laid Jesus’ body in his own newly quarried tomb. -isaiah 53:9 ; matt 27:38; matt 27:57-60

Finally, Jesus’ death fulfilled one of the most important elements of Isaiah’s prophecy. Speaking of the Messiah, Isaiah says: “The righteous one, my servant, will bring a righteous standing to many people; and their errors he himself will bear.” Indeed, Jesus’ death provided the ransom so that the burden of sin can be lifted from all faithful people.—Isaiah 53:8, 11; Romans 4:25

So despite all the good done by the Messiah, many people would not believe in him. Showing that this prophecy was fulfilled, the apostle John wrote: “Although [Jesus] had performed so many signs before them, they were not putting faith in him, so that the word of Isaiah the prophet was fulfilled which he said: ‘Jehovah, who has put faith in the thing heard by us? And as for the arm of Jehovah, to whom has it been revealed?’” - john 12: 37,38
Also, few put faith in the good news about Jesus, the Messiah, during the ministry of the apostle Paul.— . rom. 10:16, 17

they did not believe Him despite what happened in verse 28
KJV
Joh 12:28Father, glorify thy name. Then came there a voice from heaven, saying, I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again.

note verse 27 and 28 when we consider verse 41 of John chapter 12.

which glory did isaiah see?
Isa 6:1In the year that King Uz·ziʹah died, I saw Jehovah sitting on a lofty and elevated throne, and the skirts of his robe filled the temple.
Isa 6:8Then I heard the voice of Jehovah saying: “Whom shall I send, and who will go for us?” And I said: “Here I am! Send me!”

what did the one who he saw his glory tell him? The things that isaiah recorded, part of which is fulfilled in John 12: 37-43.

did the one who isaiah saw his glory tell isaiah he will be the one who will come, who he will send, who will die and fulfill the other things he told isaiah? no!
King James Version
Isa 53:11He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.
Isa 53:12Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.
you can read isaiah chapter 53 for better understanding.

Is jesus the same person as the one isaiah saw seated on the throne?
Da 7:9“I kept watching until thrones were set in place and the Ancient of Days sat down. His clothing was white like snow, and the hair of his head was like clean wool. His throne was flames of fire; its wheels were a burning fire.
Da 7:13I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.


zodiakzax pls read the scriptures, searching for similarities in it will not help.
king James Version
Joh 12:49For I have not spoken of myself; but the Father which sent me, he gave me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak.
Joh 12:50And I know that his commandment is life everlasting: [b]whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto me, so I speak.

King James Version
Joh 17:3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.[/b]

zodiakzax:
oo. Dolphinheart Listen to wisdom: if you have the same Nature as your father then both of you are humans.

good, me and my fathers are humans, apply the these statement to jesus. If jesus and God have same nature it means both jesus and God are what? gods!, no wonder the disciples specifically seperated the gods and told us who our God is!(A verse you refused to respond to)

Your father is a human being but is greater than you in position, that's because he is your Father. Jesus and God the Father have the same nature and what nature is that? God's nature. And if He has God's nature who is He? Human or God? that God Nature makes Him God just as Human nature makes us Human.

now zodiakzax, in heaven is jesus as God nature , equal to the father?
If you had read my post very well, you will see that I had no time said Jesus was human when I said he had the same nature with God, so your question is unnecessary.
I can agree with you if you had said that nature makes him a god, cus actually we are talking about two persons here, the father and the son, unless you want to say they are the same person .
likewise iF my Father is a Person and also a human, and I'm a person and also a human, it means we are two humans, not one!

Secondly , you said the father is greater than me in position, can we apply these to jesus too,? if so then jesus is not the almighty God , cus no one is superior to the almighty God in position, that is why he is called the most high!

And we keep on telling you that Jesus came as both God and Man," Even Though in the Form of God, thought it not Robbery to be Equal with God: but made Himself of no reputation and took upon Him the form of a servant (whose servant? God's) and was made in the likeness of men..." Philp2:6-7,8. Jesus was both God and man. Read Mathew 21:15-16,cf Ps 8:2,

you are very wrong sir, Jesus did not come as both man and God, I'll first quote and explain the scriptures you mentioned then add mine .

phil 2:6 English Standard Version
who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped,

the previous verses gives us an insight into what Paul was saying here , Philippians 2:6 makes no sense at all if Jesus is viewed as ‘God.’

[b]3.nothing from selfish ambition or conceit, but in humility count others more significant than yourselves.
4 Let each of you look not only to his own interests, but also to the interests of others.
5 Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus,[/color]

some translations translate verse 5 as:" Have this attitude in yourselves, which was also in Christ Jesus."

If Jesus was ‘God’ he could not have been tempted to do something from “selfishness or empty conceit” nor could he be tempted to “merely look out for” his own “personal interests.
paul counsels Christians to imitate Christ in the matter here being discussed. Could they be urged to consider it “not robbery,” but their right, “to be equal with God”? Surely not!
However, they can imitate one who “gave no consideration to a seizure, namely, that he should be equal to God.”

now does jesus beING in the form of God mean jesus is almighty God ? no , the earlier discussion about father and son being humans cus they have same nature clears that, and the fact that Jesus did not consider grabING the notion that he could be equal to God surpports that.
These other scriptures also give credence to the fact the jesus is not almighty God.

col 1:15 English Standard Version
He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.

English Standard Version
gen 5:3 When Adam had lived 130 years, he fathered a son in his own likeness, after his image, and named him Seth.
some translations say : " in his image"
if seth is not adam cus he is in the image of adam and same nature with adam, then we can see that Jesus is not God cus he is in the image of God, just like seth is a man, like Jesus is a god.

let's continue, for verse 7, I'm going to quote from different translations to emphasis the point there
[b] phil 2:7
New International Version
rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant, BEING MADE IN HUMAN LIKENESS.

English Standard Version
but emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men.

New American Standard Bible
but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.

International Standard Version
Instead, poured out in emptiness, a servant's form did he possess, a mortal man becoming. In human form he chose to be,

NET Bible
but emptied himself by taking on the form of a slave, by looking like other men, and by sharing in human nature.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English
But he stripped himself and took the form of a Servant and was in the form of the children of men, and was found in fashion as a man.[/u]

did this verse say Jesus retained his divine nature or form when he took on human form? no! the verse indicate jesus EMPTIED HIMSELF and became human. There was no addition of any form but a total change in form!

verse 8 supports this view
English Standard Version
And being found in human form, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.
Jesus was found only in one form when he came to earth, not 2 in 1 form.
If jesus was fully God when he came to earth , satan would have right to claim no human can remain Faithfull to God and sinless till death, cus according to you jesus was more than human, he was also God .

verse 9, and 11 now concludes the matter, snowing us that jesus is not God, nor he the God he was reffering to earlier, he also identified who god is.
HOPE YOU REMEMBER WHO JESUS CALL ED THE TRUE GOD, WHO HE IDENTIFIED AS OUR GOD AND WHO THE APOSTLES LISTED AS OUR GOD OUT OF THE MANY GOD'S.

English Standard Version
Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name
New International Version
and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

do we have other scriptures that surpport this
[b]Joh 1:14So the Word BECAME FLESH and resided among us, and we had a view of his glory, a glory such as belongs to an only-begotten son from a father; and he was full of divine favor and truth.

Heb 2:9But we do see Jesus, who WAS MADE a little lower than angels, now crowned with glory and honor for having suffered death, so that by God’s undeserved kindness he might taste death for everyone.

Isa 52:13Look! My servant will act with insight. He will be raised up high, He will be elevated and greatly exalted.

read also Ac 2:32, 33; Joh 14:28; Isa 53:2, 3; Joh 10:17

Jesus used the word meant for God for Himself. What does that tell u?

King James Version
Mt 21:15And when the chief priests and scribes saw the wonderful things that he did, and the children crying in the temple, and saying, Hosanna to the Son of David; they were sore displeased
Mt 21:16And said unto him, Hearest thou what these say? And Jesus saith unto them, Yea; have ye never read, Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings thou hast perfected praise?

King James Version
Ps 8:2Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings hast thou ordained strength because of thine enemies, that thou mightest still the enemy and the avenger.

zodiakzax, if you had been a reader of the scriptures you would have understood better
read the scriptures and stop looking for similarities
Ps 8:1 O Jehovah our Lord, how majestic your name is throughout the earth; You have set your splendor even higher than the heavens!
Ps 8:2 Out of the mouth of children and infants you have established strength On account of your adversaries, To silence the enemy and the avenger.

Mt 21:9Moreover, the crowds going ahead of him and those following him kept shouting: “Save, we pray, the Son of David! Blessed is the one who comes in Jehovah’s name! Save him, we pray, in the heights above!”

did Jesus come to proclaim his name,? no he came to proclaim the fathers name(jehovah)
who Did Jesus claim to be the source of his wonderful works? the father.
that crowd, unlike the Pharisees know who they are praising and who they are blessing, and Jesus knew too.

Also you can read John 12:37-43. Can't wait to see how you will explain it. Since you fight against Textus receptus so much pls be my guest to use any other greek rendering to explain it. We blv ur bible translation is wrong, you say ours (kjv) is wrong. In order to understand each other pls let's use a greek version. Kingdom Interlinear greek (KIT) will be perfect since it was published by the watch tower.

ill adress this part in ma next post .

[quote author=solite3 post=46304235][/quote]1. They are points detailing how God gave jesus the Revelation and that Jesus is not the one who is, who was and who is to come.
It gave a detailed explanation of rev 1: 1,4-8 that you could not refute.
you could not quote and explain the scriptures mentioned their.

2. you could not even show prove of where I said what you accused me of .

3. In not posting for you to believe me, cus I know you wunt, but I want you to answer the questions posted to you.
and pls, stop cutting parts of my post ofF!

your questions are still pendin sir

Jesus has a God, yes or no,?
Jesus is subjected to that God , yes or no
if Jesus has a God, how can He then be almighty God ?

2. on April 27 jEphz
"for those saying Jesus is God.. pls. explain these Scripture for me ... Ephesians 5:1,2 1timothy 2:5 John 8:42 Act 2:22 Hebrews 12:2...... "

3. April 29
" the God of our Lord Jesus Christ " Eph 1:17, who is the God of Jesus Christ ?

4. "You say Jesus is still a man in heaven, you also say Jesus has a God when he was a man.
NOW DOES Jesus STILL HAVE A GOD IN HEAVEN?"

who anointed Jesus? who is that person to Jesus?
you can see that the questions are numbered, so dnt muddle it up , or give part response

solite3, pls respond to these post if you can( it was posted on may 28, 1: 17pm)

The first verse of Revelation had set a precedent for you to use to examine the whole book, it tells you that "God gave Jesus" the revelation , God did not give himself, Jesus did not give himself, it was God who have Jesus the Revelation. God ( in the book of revelation)and Jesus are not the same person!
verse 4-6 also clears who is who in the Book of revaluation, it helps us to understand that the one who is, who was, and who is coming is different from Jesus Christ.
brocab says it's Jesus, you say it's the father, yet you refuse to discuss and tell the whole world who is right and who is wrong!
to make sure that you dnt confuse yourself on who the al mighty God is, Jesus told you severaly in that book that he has a God! , using the words " my God " several times in that book. I ve several times asked if the almighty can have a god superior to him, cus Jesus had now indicated when he was in heaven, when he came to earth, and when he back in heaven that he has a God! he did not just call that God "a God ", he said "my God", "your god" , "the only true god".

All this facts are presented to you in the Book of Revelation, you could not discuss any of them, but you choose to believe a verse from the Textus Receptus that you can't defend, that you can't show where the Textus Receptus got it from! that majority of scholars have shown to be spurious, that can't be found even in translations of the authors that surpport trinity.
lastly, even if you would not answer the questions being posted to you several times , pls can you tell us the name of your church or organization you associate with at the moment?[/b]

zodiakzax:
Dolphinheart, did you say Jesus has the same nature as God? Wow, so if He has the same nature is He not God? You again said. All things were created through Jesus, so why would the God say " I by my own Hands laid the foundation of the Earth"? God did not say " I by my Son or my Word laid the foundation of the Earth" but by His own hand, this shld tell you Jesus is God. What I can't understand Is, why have u changed your words? You are disgusting...

I have the same nature as my father, I'm I my Father? no
my Father is human, I am a human! I'm not my Father neither I'm I equal to Him.
As to the issue of creation: ZODIAKZAX, GO BACK TO THAT POST I EXPLAINED THINGS TO YOU USING THE SCRIPTURES , STOP ACTING AS IF YOU DID NOT SEE IT.

people who personality attack others during a discussion without proof show who they really are!