₦airaland Forum

alexis:
dolphinheart

You are not being honest here, which other translation apart from NWT? If he doubt, go to the earliest sources or even the earliest manuscripts to confirm for yourself. The problem then becomes, why don't JW translate other parts of the Bible to be the same word. The New World Translation of the JW says: "And the Word was a god" contrary to all other translations I have ever seen. Can you list the other translations apart from New World Translation please. Your officials say that this translation is justified because in the original Greek the word "God" is without the article. It is without the article but it is clear that this is not their real reason because verses 6, 12 and 13 of the same first chapter of John contain similar usages of the word 'God", all without the article. You guys translated all of these correctly with a capital "G" and without inserting "a". The only instances I have found in which you guys translate "God" with a small "g" are when "God" refers to Christ. It is certainly not done consistently whenever the Greek word for "God" lacks the article. (See the examples in John 3:21, 8:54, 9:16, 9:33). In the case of John 1:1-3, to avoid a translation that correctly identifies Christ as God, the New World Translation ends up attributing the creation of all things to "a god"

List the ones that changed or inserted the additional comments like you claimed. I have researched most of these manuscripts as I used to be a Muslim and very interested in what you are saying.

Have you tried to see if there are other translations that use "a god"? .
Even if you have not, dnt worry, me and you will discuss john 1:1 shortly.(maybe during The day)

On john 5:7, Bro if you had researched on the manuscripts , you would have known why most translation removed or did not put the words you quoted in that verse .

You are missing what I am saying. Only God can forgive sins and only God can be worshiped. Both of these characteristics belong to Jesus as well. Jesus can forgive sins, that is why we can give him such a title as God. Only Jesus demanded worship just as God.

And I did tell you that the authority and power to forgive sins, which is inherent in the authority to judge, was giving to jesus by God, his father. And if something was giving to. Someone, it means that at a time he did not have such authority. This authority was later extented to the disciples and it also did not make them God. If you say only God can forgive, are the disciples God too?
On the issue of worshipped, (even though I do not subscribe to that word, ill use it here). Bro, you read the scriptures, you read why jesus is worshipped, your read why he was exalted above his compannions, he was worshipped cus the angels where told to do so by someone superior to jesus. As long as jesus is not that superior God, jesus is not the almighty God.

So, it was Jesus that said - "My Lord and My God". Why are you being dishonest? Jesus called himself my Lord and my God. Is that what the verse said? Cha

Is that what I said ? Absolutely no, I never said jesus said " my lord and my god, read my post again before you accuse me of dishonesty, and after you have done so, ill like you to retract ur accusation.

In the Bible, who is addressed as the Alpha and Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end? Is that Jehovah or Jesus?

Pls show me which verse(s) you are reffering to . And while doing that pls always not, that jesus is always subjected to his God, the father, the almighty God.

obixcel:
lol, when last did u watch a movie so touchy dat u had to fast forward to d end b4 rewinding to continue, cos I know u felt d chill and d thrill of dat movie. I so much love dat "No Escape". At the end I exhaled saying to myself, thank God at last they were saved. It's been a while a movie made me feel dat way. Certainly one of d best movies of 2015.cheers!

I enjoyed it from a to z, but can't fit allow suspense give me heart problems. When I realised my heart was beating faster, I just kukuma go see the end, confirmed that they are ok , then came back to enjoy the film with rest of mind.

phelanor:
pls can u send me a link so dat i download d movie?

I downloaded mine from movievilla.in

makavele:
Everybody is required to preach for house to house for the Bible said . . WOE TO ME IF I DID NOT DECLARE THE GOOD NEWS
and also goes to to say, if u dont warn ur neighbor of his bad deed, you will be held liable for his blood.
the bible also say, HOW WILL THEY HEAR WHEN THEY WILL NOT LISTEN, HOW IN TURN WILL THEY LISTEN WITHOUT NO ONE TO PREACH
Matthew said, AND THIS GOOD NEWS OF THIS KINGDOM MUST BE preached in all the inhabited earth . . . matt 24:14
You shot yourself in your leg. God doesnt compromise his standards . . occultism and spiritism and voodoo are no no for God and his people . .
so why celebrate him? so some churches would have, just for the money or fat envelope he would drop every sunday.
Mind you, we have members richer than Michael Jackson who never dabbled into the occult . . .
Even Paul of old who studied law under the tetulage of well-known Gamaliel had to abandon it and become a tent-maker, correct me if i am wrong . . . What is more ??

You re not wrong Bro.

makavele:
Funny
Michael Jackson didn't leave. he was disfellowshipped on the account of this music videos which portrays belief in the occult
and of humans transforming into demons and tormenting fellow humans. Such a belief is contrary to what the Bible preaches, cos even the Bible said, anyone practicing spiritism should not be found among God's people.
Please get your facts right, for even Michael Jackson even added a disclaimer to his video Thriller, that he doesnt support occultism
but how come you dont' support something, but spend millions of dollars to promote it via music video
Please think well, sir
Thank you

As a witness, he was required to go preach from house to house, no matter the level of his stardom.

If he where to go to some churches, he will be the main attraction, despite having a video with occultic views.

Esdb3:
Who has the earth seen. Jesus or God?

No one can see God and yet live. God sent jesus.

Who died for your sins Jesus or God?

God cannot die, he has imortality, that you say jesus died shows he is not almighty God.

Who do you pray to Jesus or God?

I pray to God,the true God, the father, just as jesus did and taught me to.

So Jsus was being silly when he said 'if you have seen me you have seen God?"

Jesus is a representative of God,he is not the almighty God.

The trinity means Jesus is God and God is Jesus but God is greater than Jesus. The things of God are hidden from the wisdom of the wise.

As God has not hidden it from you, can you explain how God is jesus and he is at the same time greater than jesus?
Does jesus have equal authority to the father? The only true God?
If no , then jesus is not the almighty God.

The JW bastardized John 1:1 by writing 'the word was a god'. John couldn't have been describing some god and go on to say 'there was nothing made that was not made through him'

I sincerely requesting that you look up translations of john 1:1 and see what some scholars and translators said about that verse.

What you fail to understand is - Jesus and God are like the body and spirit they are so intimate and close. That is why God called him his beloved son.

Using unscriptural logic will not suffice.

God even went on to make Jesus name greater than every other name including his. 'YHWH'

False Bro.

is a name and Jesus is a name so before you argue think. How can you pray in the name of Jesus and not be worshipping him.

I pray in the name of jesus cus
Of the words In these scriptures. It is not worshiping jesus.

Hebrews 10:19-22
Therefore, brothers, since
we have boldness for the way of entry into the holy place by the blood of Jesus, which he opened up for us as a new and living way through the curtain, that is, his flesh, and since we have a great priest over the house of God, let us approach with sincere hearts and complete faith, having had our hearts sprinkled clean from a wicked conscience and our bodies bathed with clean water.

John 4:6
Jesus said to him: “I am the
way and the truth and the life.
No one comes to the Father except through me.

John 15:16
You did not choose me, but I
chose you, and I appointed you
to go and keep bearing fruit and that your fruit should remain, so that no matter what you ask the Father in my name, he(not jesus) may give it to you.

John 16:23,24
In that day you will ask me no question at all. Most truly I say to you, if you ask the Father for anything, he will give it to you in my name.
Until now you have not asked
for a single thing in my name.
Ask and you will receive, so that your joy may be complete.

1 cor 1:2,3
to the congregation of God that is in Corinth, to you who have been sanctified in union with Christ Jesus, called to be holy ones, together with all those everywhere who are calling on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, their Lord and ours: May you have undeserved kindness and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Eph 2:18
because through him we, both peoples, have free access to the Father by one spirit.

Remember, the head of Christ is God. Jesus said the father is his God, and jesus is not the father.

Ramos16:
Again, they do not believe that Jesus Christ is the son of God, that is why they appeal to Muslims

Again, they believe jesus Christ is the son of God.

alexis:
For the Jehovah witnesses, I have a question:

1. Was Jesus resurrected as a spirit or as a human with a body?

Jesus became a life giving "spirit".
He could not have ascended into heaven with physical body cus flesh and blood cannot enter there.

alexis:
dolphinheart

The word was [b]with God, the word was also that same God? [/b]

It says "And the Word was God".

There are a lot of translations and scholars that have a contrary view, they view and translated part of that verse to "the word was a god". These translations goes along with the fact that jesus is not the father and the father is God
Almighty.

Which manuscript is it in and which is it not in? Or which manuscripts is it not in and which is it in?

There are many manuscripts , listing them here will derail the thread. Pls( and I believe you are sincere in ur questions) put 1 john 5:7 on a search engine and see the various commentary, translations and views on that verse. Once you have done that, pls quote me and let's discuss.

Hebrews 1:8-9: Is lifted from Psalm 45:6-7: It's a reference to the deity of Jesus Christ as God and His superiority over other beings. I am not claiming Jesus is Almighty God as I would claim that I and my father are the same. I am claiming He is God in that He commands worship and He can forgive sins. Only God holds that position and no one else

Good Bro, the only God that holds that position is not jesus.
Even the "worship" that you say jesus commands was given to him by God.
Even the authority given to jesus to judge and forgives sin was given to him by God.
God, his father is superior to him!

To my point - Thomas after seeing the resurrected Jesus said - My Lord and my God. Thomas was a jew and knew that there was only one true God yet He called Jesus God.

Thomas, realising that it was really jesus made that exclamation.(that exclamation has been explained on these thread) But jesus had ealier told mary to tell them that he has not ascended to his God, which is also thomas' God.

So, I think people get it twisted when we say Jesus is God. God exists in more than one form at the same time.

And he is always talking to himself abi, taking things from himself to do things right?

Ramos16:
Uhmm, point of CORRECTION, they are not Christians, they do not believe that Jesus is the son of God,

They do believe jesus is the son of God.

they do not believe in eternity in Heaven,

they do believe that some people on earth will go to heaven.

they do not believe in the existence of Hell.

They do believe that there is hell.

They are a religion, not Christianity in any way... I do not mind if you like them, but do not compare them with Christianity cos they are not the same

They are followers of jesus Christ and they try their best to get and accurate knowledge of God and the one he sent to us, jesus Christ.

promzyugo:
JW are just turning the bible upside down joor! JESUS CHRIST is the KING OF KINGS no man cometh unto the father GOD except by me.

We come to God through jesus, what does that make jesus, definitely not the one we need to come to cus you have to go through him to get to that one.

They claim that they will inherent the earth. Be not decieve all jehova witnesses cos this earth will be melted with fire and brimstone once the trumpet shall sound and the righteous will follow JESUS CHRIST to heaven while those that reject CHRIST will be tormented by anti christ for seven years to receive the mark of the beast which is 666 those christian that refuse the mark after that seven year will use their blood to pay for their sins and those that accepted the mark will go to hell fire with Satan till eternity so hear the word of God and turn away from your sins so that when Christ shall come we all will meet him in glory.

I pray that God will open their eyes so they will know that jesus is the son of God and believe in trinity in one God..[/quote]Eccl 1:4 , pslamms 78:69 : the earth will last forever.

gasgenius:
The Jehovah's Witness organization has produced its own bogus version of the Bible. This version is called the New World Translation. It contains deliberate changes to many verses of Scripture. These changes try to hide the fact that Jehovah's Witness teaching is unbiblical and false.
A Comparison of the Bible an

Can you give an example of some of the changes they made ? We will examine it together here.

alexis:
I don't know if you are a Christian It's Christian belief that Jesus Christ is God. It's runs through the entire Bible. I will give you some examples:

1. John 1:1: “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.”. The Word is identified later in the same chapter of John 1 verse 14
2. John 1:14: And the Word was made flesh.

The word was with God, the word was also that same God?

If that is not clear, another place in the Bible states:

3. 1 John:5:7: "For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one"

That above was inserted into the translations, it is not in most manuscripts. Its a false/wrong translation, that is why most translations dnt put what you quoted in there versions.

Here is God the Father calling Jesus God:

Hebrews 1:8: “But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom”.

And the next verse (verse 9)continues the word of the father: you have loved righteousness and hated wickedness; therefore God, your God has set above your companions[/b]by anointing you with the oil of joy.
The father is the [b]God of jesus therefore jesus is not the almighty God.

So yes - Jesus is God not as in the same person but the same form that exist at the same time

olubankemi:
@poster, kindly answer why you people don't donate or accept blood transfusion. I lost a colleague in September because she failed to allow blood to be transfuse to her when she lost blood during child birth. Her husband the same JW I learnt was involved in extra marital affairs and don't take care of her.

She is dead and gone, this man will continue his women affairs ministry and maybe her children may suffer for her decision not to allow blood to be transfuse into her.

Throw more light in this. I believe your women are at the receiving end in this. Saving life should be you people believe too.

Blood transfusion is not a guarantee for survival. Saving life is important, but obedience is better than sacrifice. If I lose my life now cus I obeyed, I will be rewarded. Has her obedience brought her nothing ? No, it has giving her a better chance of gaining everlasting life in perfection . Let the husband keep on enjoying the temporary enjoyment of the flesh, we all know the outcome.

I had an accident on the expressway, at the hospital, I refused blood to be used during the operation and that caused the operation to be posponed for a while and I was in pains during that period. The man beside me had the same health issues and agreed that blood should be used for him.
About a month after his operation, which is a little over 2 weeks after mine, he died due to complications from the blood he took, despite his pators always selling annointing oil to his young wife.
I'm still alive today typing this post. So taking blood transfusion is not a guarantee for survival but a sure guarantee for loosing Gods favor.

Kennitrust:
if u don't sale your magazine, why then do they always demand for a "stipend" to make for each magazine u required?

They dnt sell their magazines, they dnt always demand for stipents but ask if you want to support the publication .
Note, the watchtower is published 2 twice a month in 254 languages. It costs money.
The public edition of the watchtower presently has an average print of nearly 59 million copies every month.
The study edition has 15 million.
This does not come easy for an organization that does not collect tithe or praise rich men.

Septre:
My issues with jehovah's witness are

1 They dont like praying with other christains

They will pray with you if they know your heart condition is geared towards that prayer, claiming Christian does not mean you follow Christ teachings.

2 They invite you to their programs but will not come for yours when you invite them

Coming to their programs is a personal decision, if you feel cus they did not come to urs then you will not go to theirs, then you have added sentiments to the decision, and you dnt worship God cus of sentiments.

3 They dont usually allow members to marry christains frm other denominations.

"dnt usuually allow" ? Bro its either they allow or they dnt.

I believe that Jesus is the Son of God and he died for our sins and i try as much as i can to emulate him. Now why will a fellow christain do all the above to me cos i dont worship in the same place as him? Is it not annoying? Jesus told his disciples that he who is not against us is with us. So why dont jwits see other christains as part of them 'us' just like Jesus. In heaven there will only be saints, but there will be no denomination no catholic, anglican, winners, reedem or christ embassy so why cant we be more united?

Do you remember the words :
"Not everyone saying to me lord! Lord!
And the parable about the harvest!
By their fruits you shall know them, and jehovahs witnesses use such fruitage to determine who is serving God or not, expecially among its members, talk less of other denominations.

I also have a problem with jwits not accepting blood transfusion. They would rather die than accept it. Makes no sense to me.

"He who gives his life for my sake will have it back".
There are specific instructions as to the use of blood. To be obedient is better than sacrifice.
I prefer to live everlasting in a peaceful new world than to break that law and extend my life in this world full of strive and pain. That is what I call "faith!"

I love awake magazine though and one of my best friend is jwits. He is selfless

That magazine is the second most published magazine in the world, it is done whorely by voluntary contributions and has never missed an issue since inception. You can always support that work if you want to.

major466:
Do not get me wrong am not prejudice to Jehovah's Witness group. On the contrary, I like their sense of seriousness and modesty. Their ''Awake Magazine'' is one of my favorite magazines; very informative and colorful. I still read them to this day.
The only thing that spoil the show is their doctrine about the Divinity of the Lord Jesus Christ. They believe Jesus is of equal status with Arch Angels in heaven.

Arch angel, no arch angels.

It is written all over their literatures. To Jehovah witness, Jesus Christ is not GOD. This belief is a massive contradiction to John1:1 which states that:
''In the beginning was the Word , and the Word was with GOD and the word was GOD.''

They believe jesus is a god, but like he told mary, they believe he has a god that is superior to him, which is God almighty, the father!.

2. ''He was in the beginning with GOD.

You can't be with someone and still be that same person.

]All things were made through Him, and apart from Him not one thing was made that has been made.''
The term ''Word'' from the verse above is refering to Jesus Christ. And He (Jesus Christ) was in existence before the creation of heaven and earth. He was with GOD from the very beginnging quote And He was GOD. All created objects in heaven (including all the angels big and small) and earth were made through him. Without Him, not one thing was made.
If the Jehovah Witness group hold the believe that Jesus Christ is not GOD but a majestic being, created just like Arch Micheal, how come the Bible categorically recognizes Jesus Christ as GOD and that all things both in heaven and earth were made through him in John1:1-3?

God has no beggining, all other things where created through jesus, he was Gods master worker . Prov 8 : 22- 31.
Jesus has always remained subjected to the father, the almighty God, in heaven or on earth, and it was not a position he wished to grabe but has always remained loyal, despite being in the same nature with God.

Kamxin:
One sentence is too much for you to support your claim? Keep beating around the bush.

Those pictures where not beating about the bush. Claims plenty, that's why it is not giving in one sentence.

Secondly, digital coloured images from second world war is a fallacy.

You might be right, but those pictures are not digital, neither where they all coloured.

Watched " no escape " last night. Liked it. Though it got to a point I had to fastfoward to the end of the film just to make sure the girls are alive at the end. After that I now went back to where I was before to enjoy the rest of the movie with normal heart beat. I no fit allow suspence come give me heart attack, I'm a nigerian.

johnw74:
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God[theos], and the Word was God(theos).
The Greek for "God", and "the Word" in that verse that the English word comes from is "theos"
John would not have used the same word "theos" for God and the Word in that short sentence, if the word "theos" had a diffrent meaning in one of the two instances, he would have used a diffrent word.
John used "theos"-God for God, and he used "theos"-God for the Word.
jw change one of them to "a god" to agree with their satanic teaching that "the Word" is not God.

Exerpts from a website.:
........
1808 “and the Word was A
god” - Thomas Belsham The New Testament, in An
Improved Version, Upon the
Basis of Archbishop Newcome’s New Translation:
With a Corrected Text , London.......

1864 “and a god was the
Word” (left hand column
interlinear reading) The
Emphatic Diaglott by Benjamin
Wilson, New York and London......

1867 “In the beginning was
the gospel preached through
the Son. And the gospel was
the word, and the word was
with the Son, and the Son was
with God, and the Son was of
God” - The Joseph Smith
Translation of the Bible......

1935 “and the Word was
divine” - The Bible—An
American Translation, by John
M. P. Smith and Edgar J.
Goodspeed, Chicago......

1955 “so the Word was
divine” - The Authentic New
Testament, by Hugh J.
Schonfield, Aberdeen.......

1978 “and godlike sort was the Logos” - Das Evangelium nach Johannes, by Johannes Schneider, Berlin......

1822 "and the Word was a
god." - The New Testament in Greek and English (A.
Kneeland, 1822.);.......

1863 "and the Word was a
god." - A Literal Translation Of The New Testament (Herman Heinfetter [Pseudonym of Frederick Parker], 1863);.......

1885 "and the Word was a
god." - Concise Commentary On The Holy Bible ( R. Young, 1885);......

1879 "and the Word was a
god." - Das Evangelium nach Johannes (J. Becker, 1979);......

1911 "and the Word was a
god." - The Coptic Version of the N.T. (G. W. Horner, 1911); .......

1958 "and the Word was a
god." - The New Testament of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus
Anointed" (J. L. Tomanec, 1958);.....

1829 "and the Word was a
god." - The Monotessaron; or, The Gospel History According to the Four Evangelists (J. S. Thompson, 1829);......

1975 "and the Word was a
god." - Das Evangelium nach Johannes (S. Schulz, 1975);......

1975 "and a god (or, of a
divine kind) was the Word" Das Evangelium nach Johnnes, by Siegfried Schulz, Göttingen, Germany........

For a complete list of 70 non
traditional translations of John
1:1 see this reference..........

Some scholars staunchly
oppose the translation ...a god,
while other scholars believe it is possible or even preferable.

Coptic scholar George Horner
renders the Sahidic Coptic of
John 1:1c as "and [a] God was the word," while his apparatus mentions, "Square brackets imply words used by the Coptic and not required by the English".

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_1:1

This(below) is the full statements(s) that johnw74 edited cus he can't comment on the other parts .

Jesus is a god, the scriptures tells us that. But it also tells us that Jesus has a god that he has always been subjected to, always obeyed and has always been loyal , doing that ones will. That that god is the almighty god, the supreme lord.

Kamxin:
I said quote a sentence from POPE, you brought websites as if the website's views are different from that of the owner.

The websites supported their views with pictures of known members of ur church frolicking with the people that caused millions of death, or are you saying that those pictures are not real.
It is a fact that some members of the church participated in these killings and some blessed such killers .
Did the pope take action against such people?
Where they expelled from the church?
Did the church stop associating with such one?
As long as the church allowed them to still be members while they continue to so such atrocities, it means the church supports there actions. No matter how much the church condemn the actions of the war, I see it as gimmick, a publicity stunt that does not reach the heart of its members.

Using 21st century picture to support 20th century events
#laughable

Those pictures where taken as at when the event occured or where occuring. What did the church do after it occured?

orisa37:
Everycase in the New Testament teaches Trinity.

no case in the new testament teach trinity. No case teaches that the father, jesus and holy spirit are equal.
Acts 2: 33,36:
Exalted to the right hand of God, he has received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit and has poured out what you now see and hear. 36 “Therefore let all Israel be assured of this: God has
made this Jesus, whom you
crucified, both Lord and Messiah.”(but not almighty god)

The case of the paralytic man who was let down the roof to Jesus. When Jesus saw the Faith of the man's friends, He said, "son, your sins are forgiven you". And the people around who heard this, reasoned in their hearts that, "Only God can Forgive sins". St. Mark 2: 1-12. This is practical Trinity.

They reasoned in their hearts that only God can forgive sins, but jesus showed them with prove that he, the son of man, has the authority to forgive sins. This authority he was given.
This same authority was later extented to the disciples through the holy spirit and it did not make the disciples equal to God.
So Bro, the event is not practical trinity!

Acts 10: 38,42
how [b]God anointed Jesus of
Nazareth with the Holy Spirit
and power,[b] and how he went
around [b]doing good and
healing all who were under the
power of the devil, because
God was with him.......
He commanded us to preach to
the people and to testify that
he is the one whom God
appointed as judge of the
living and the dead. 43 All the prophets testify about him that everyone who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name.”.

Scholar8200:
When you read the Gospels, appreciate the fact that when Paul said:

And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: [size=13pt]God was manifest in the flesh[/size], justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
1 Timothy 3:16

DO YOU BELIEVE THE HIGHLIGHTED!

I do not believe the highlighted cus the highlighted is an adulteration/ a mistranslation/a scribal error/ a false statement that has been inserted into the scriptures. The Greek word for God is not present in that verse.

but made himself of no reputation,

To show you that he was not 100% god while on earth.

and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: 8 and being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient
Philipians 2:7,8

He was obedient when he was in heaven, he was obedient when he came to earth, he was obedient when he went back to the father as a spirit.
When all authority has been giving to him, he was still obedient to the one who gave him such authority. He never claimed equality with his father.

he(Paul) meant every word.

When God was manifested in the flesh, the aspects of God and Man relationships should be evident!

false translation.

Now considering your text, let's go a little further in vs 5:

And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was

That was a request that was granted when he went back to heaven, he was exhaulted by his god and given a position beside his god, his father. He was beside his god .That was the vision Stephen saw when he was about to be killed.

He did not say the, "glory which I had FROM Thee" but "WITH Thee".

Jesus acknowledged that his glory comes from the father, these same glory some christians will partake in, it does not make them god or equal to god after sharing in the divine nature.

You quoted me, saw the points I brought out and the things I said jesus said, but you did not comment on them.

PastorAIO:
When the body called Church was formed we are told the following:

When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.

This was before the scriptures of the new testament written by the followers of jesus
.
After it guided them to the truth, they wrote these truth down.
All that is beneficial was written down.
Even the reason why they had the truth in them, that the holy spirit guided them , was written down. If it was not written down in the scriptures, you wunt be quoting it in ur post. So the inspired scriptures is fully equipped.
You know why God did it this way, so that in the future some people will not form an organization and start spewing false doctrines while claiming its from the holy spirit. If it does not go along with what the spirit had guided the apostles to write down , then it is false.

Jesus didn't mention anything about bible.

The holy spirit guided them to know what they should do, jesus did not need to tell them about the bible.

Furthermore we read in Joel:
“And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my Spirit on all flesh; your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, and your young men shall see visions.

Even this was written down, so that when it happens we wunt be confused and Satan wunt have a chance to confuse things, and even if he does, we will know how to search for the truth. With the scriptures
We can know if ur prophecy, miracle, healing, words, are true or not. The catholic church wants to take this power away from the scriptures cus it exposes and falsify some of their doctrines.

What in your opinion is the status of such inspirations of the holy spirit in the church? Is it less that what you read in your bible text?

I do not understand ur question.



Do you believe that the church has the Holy Spirit and that it was given to the church as a guide?

When the apostles introduced doctrines to the church, how do you gauge the validity of the inspiration? Is it less than or greater than your bible text?[/quote]

@ sistersister

I did ask you to provide proof of ur view that man is made up of the body, spirit and mind.

Who is Jesus? Is Jesus God
http://www.everystudent.com/
features/faith.html

You said god is not a person
And I asked: Is Jesus a person or not? The site you provided does not answer that question.
The site also failed woefully in explaining why jesus is god.
If you feel I'm wrong, you can post the site here.

Who is the Holy Spirit?
http://www.everystudent.com/
forum/hspirit.html

Even though I have a contrary view to some of the things said in that site, ill hold on for now. For now, below is what I take out of that site as I believe it is response to the question: is the holy spirit a person or not ?
: "The Holy Spirit is a real
person who came to reside
within Jesus Christ's true
followers after Jesus rose from
the dead and ascended to
heaven."

Now if you say the holy spirit is a real person, what about jesus and the father.?

How Can One God be Three Persons?
http://
www.christiananswers.net/q-
eden/edn-t002.html

The site cannot be displayed on my phone, maybe you can you post the content here.

1 John 5:7 says, the Father, the Word and the Holy Ghost and these three are one. Why do you say the translation is false and the doctrine is
false?

According to a scholar: there are times when people adore their theology more than the God-breathed original, and they fight for the man-made
addition as if it were the original words of God. This has been the case with 1 John 5:7 and 8, and we applaud the honesty of the translators of modern versions who have left it out of their translations.

For a better understanding of what I'm trying to tell you, pls read what in on these sites.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comma_Johanneum

http://www.biblicalunitarian.com/verses/1-john-5-7-8


http://hermeneutics.stackexchange.com/questions/12/why-is-1-john-57-8-found-in-the-kjv-kept-in-the-nkjv-when-it-is-believed-to-b

http://www.hebrew-streams.org/works/texts/1john5-7.html

http://www.angelfire.com/space/thegospeltruth/trinity/verses/1Jn5_7.html

Even the NKJV reads in its footnote : U-Text and M-Text
omit the words from in heaven
(verse 7) through on earth (verse . Only four or five very late manuscripts contain these words in Greek.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+John+5&version=NKJV

John 20:16-18 (KJV)
Jesus saith unto her, Mary.
She turned herself, and saith
unto him, Rabboni; which is
to say, Master. 17 Jesus saith
unto her, Touch me not; for I
am not yet ascended to my
Father: but go to my brethren,
and say unto them, I ascend
unto my Father, and your
Father; and to my God, and your God. 18 Mary Magdalene came and told the disciples that she had seen the LORD, and that he had spoken these things unto her.
Jesus told what would
happen to him before it even
happened. Yet, his disciples
didn’t see at first. Jesus said
he would be crucified, resurrect and return to heaven. And, that is exactly what he did.

Hope you understand what jesus told mary, he told her that he has a god, that that god is also mary's god. That their god(both jesus and mary ) is the father! .

lacum:
I stumbled on this thread this evening and i must thank the op and all that contributed especially d Catholics(Italo, ub, karxim etc), pastor(i dont know ur church but ur highly enlihtened), Dolphinheart(Jehovah Witness) etc. thank you. Pls Mr Dolphin try to write God with d capital G not g as god. Goodnite all

Ok ill try to, just felt that doing so all the time, is to conform with the style used by those who removed gods name during translation. But I think ill agree with ur request, and use it when making reference to the almighty God .

PastorAIO:
The people that Jesus called out of the world.

If by church, you mean the organization/body of those jesus called out to the world, the scriptures is a guide to how that organization or congregation should operate. It gives them the experience, teachings and process of organization and responsibility and tells them how the holy spirit will help the organization and give gift in men.

Trinitarians generally look to analyze statements in the scriptures, with the view of using those analysis to support their beliefs. but most times when those analysis are reviewed, it does not surpport their beliefs(whichever version they come up with).
Jesus is a god, the scriptures tells us that. But it also tells us that jesus has a god that he has always been subjected to, always obeyed and has always been loyal , doing that ones will. That that god is the almighty god, the supreme lord.
That is why it is said that he never thought of grasping that opportunity to claim equality cus he knows that that god is superior to him.
When he came to earth, he made no direct statement that he is equal to that god and he even made sure that his disciples know who he is in relation to that god. He made them know that that god commanded him to come to earth, that everything he does, has learnt and the glory of his activity belongs to that god, so that all may know that that god, the father sent him and that the father is the only true god.

Even after his ressurection when he said that all authority has been given to him, he made sure that his disciples know that he still has a god . On ascension to heaven and in the presence of that god sitted on a throne, he was told to sit at the right hand of his god, he was given a name , he was made better than his companions, but he was not made equal to his god, cus even after everything was made subject to him, he was still subject to that god that made everything subject to him.

Many people had tried to formulate different reasons and formular on why jesus is equal to god, some even went as far as trying to mistranslate the scriptures or alter the scrolls when making copies. But jehovah keep showing there works out .

John 17: 1-3
These words spake Jesus, and
lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father,(his god) the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify theejesus is gods son) 2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh,(the power jesus had over humans was giving to him, at a time he did not have such power) that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
3 And this is life eternal, that they(humans, you and me) might know thee(father) the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.(jesus was sent by someone superior to him).

PastorAIO:
Abeg, please don't mind me o. I just want to exercise a little bit of pedantry.

I think when he says 'so equipped' he means the 'so' in the sense of referencing the manner at hand. Like when you might say 'thus equipped'.


in the manner now being indicated or exemplified; in this way.
"she rang up Susan, and while she was thus engaged Chignell summoned the doctor"
synonyms: like this/that, in this/that way, in this/that manner, in this/that fashion, so, like so; More
3.

so the 'so' is still referring to the 'completely'. It is like someone says, 'John is coming'. Then someone else says,' oh, He is coming?'.

Then the first guy retorts that he didn't say 'He is coming' he said 'JOHN is coming'. As long as the He is referring to John there is no problem.

As long as 'so equipped' is a reference to 'completely equipped' there is no problem.

it is equipped so. How so? completely so.

Now I have another question. Would any of us say that the Church is completely equipped for salvation?

Pls what is the church?

Empredboy:
what do u mean by what you said that the scriptures is completely equipt?

It means that the inspired scriptures provides knowledge that can equip or enable us to do all that is good. It can help us to look at things from God’s point of view. And we know that God’s knowledge and wisdom are far above that of anyone else.
It has provided guildlines to all that is needed for salvation.

2 Tim 3:16

Empredboy:
this is where u said the scriptures is completely equipt (abi scripture is different from Bible?).

Good, did I say "so equipped", did I say " not equipped enough"? .
If I did not say those words, stop ascribing me to them.
If you do not understand what I meant by completely equipped*(corrected), pls ask and don't change my words.

Empredboy:
from what you just said now you don't have problems with images of Jesus but Bible say thou shall not make images.

Bro, why are you doing this na, I just told you to stop twisting my words and you are still doing it. I did not tell you that I dnt have issues with the use of the images of jesus, my discussion is, has and will be based on the use of the images of mary! I have not discussed nor will discuss the use of the images of jesus until the use of the images of mary is concluded.

Secondly between image of Mary and that of the no 1 enemy of God (serpent that Moses erected) which one is meaningful to you?

Bro, moses did not erect the image of the number 1 enemy of god. If such incident that occured then(the event that neccessitated the making of the image) should occur now and jehovah has giving a way out, if you prefer to go look at the images of mary cus you feel that the other image is that of an enemy of god, Bro you go just die from snake bite. Obedience is better than sacrifice.