₦airaland Forum

twosquare:
because it can be hard to understand. Salvation is not going to heaven. Because the heaven you're going to will perish and it will pass away. If salvation is going to heaven, then you will pass away with it. Salvation is becoming like the Father(to put it simply). That's why I said, no one is as saved as God. Do u want a prototype of someone who is saved? Check the Father, check the Son, and take a look at the Holy Ghost. Many will even go to heaven(the planet called Heaven is so spacious), and heaven even won't know they have arrived in that world. You know these angels have sight to decipher people, when they look at you, they will say this one hasn't not started even an iota of the course(salvation). He is not savEd...even though he had the chance...that's what will birth weeping. When what you're supposed to become, you didn't become it. It is worse than going to hell.

My brother i have just one reminder for you and i hope you consider it diligently:

James 3:1 My friends, we should not all try to become teachers. In fact, teachers will be judged more strictly than others.

While you defend your division of the Word you must be careful to ensure your division is driven by revelation from Yeshua and is hence infallible otherwise by your exposition many may derail and you may get a greater condemnation...

Our exegesis should not stand on man's introspective capacity but on the power of Yeshua that comes by grace and obedience unto the truth!

samuelkew:
They are worn as gods for protection so men and women wore them. Aaron collected it as gods. Jacob collected in Genesis 35 and buried them as part of strange gods. It was not just a norm but a form of amulets.God made them get rings from Egyptians as a beauty items but the mind already acculturated the pagan connection. As it was so it is this day.

so must women wear earrings? and if women can, why can't men wear earrings? why is the use of earrings gender specific?

pls anyone with an idea of the cost of accomodation in the pg halls of residence should pls provide info!

colossus2:
Depending on your department, some depts pay 120,000 and some pay 150,000.
So its between 120,000-150,000

Wow is it d@ xpensive?

twosquare:
looks like Nairaland don't notify people of long post again or what!
Salvation is relative...what I mean is we have to know the in-depth of salvation. You can be in heaven and yet you're not save as you ought to be saved. When angels looks at such a fellow, they will say this one has not passed through salvation and that's what will give birth to cries and weeping and gnashing of teeth in that time(Luke 13:28) It is worse than being thrown into the Lake. Like I said that if you want to know a prototype of what salvation is: look at the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost. So, if you ask me if those in hell will end up being saved, this will I say to you: I won't use "saved" coz it is deep but if they can stroll to heaven? Yes.

Concerning the 1st and 2nd resurrection(coz two types of resurrection will happen): the saints and the wicked. To be a partaker in the 1st meant you're sealed, ur fate is not staggering maybe u'll be there or here and there is surety about your destiny. But the ones that will have the 2nd resurrection, you're OYO. Anything can happen. That's why they will be judged according to their works. Even Death and Hell was cast into the Lake before them. But the yardstick for humans is the clause, anyone not found written in the Book of Life. There is a reason it was said like that. In other words, there is a probability to escape the "death which God Himself will administer to spirits"- which we call the 2nd death. All is needed is your name be found in that Book. Whosoever, God won't look at faces. Not everyone is a "Lake" material,the scripture in Revelation mentioned the category of those who will partake in the 2nd death. Since Revelation is the realm of the sealing times(check 20:5, maybe they lived again after the thousand yrs. Just drawing attention to something there,I won't talk abt that). These are the category:

Rev 21:8: the fearful, unbelieving, abominable, murderers,whoremongers, sorcerers, idolaters and all liars. These are the category of people that shall be a partaker. Know that those are spiritual terminologies, it is beyond the works of the flesh. No..;just look at them again. I will summarize it.

-Fearful(cowards, those who doesn't want to lose their life-which is a lie and want to save it)

-unbelieving-( believing a different way,shortcut-they don't believe in overcoming(Life of God)

-abominable(hateful to the Truth which is Life. Made Unclean by their love for the Lie which are according to the workings of satan)

-Murderers(beyond killing your fellow human being. These ones are those who annihilate Life of God in themselves and others- self suicide)

-Whoremongers(beyond being a fornicator or an adulterer. Those who are pleasure seekers of another Life that differs from Truth. They love the pleasure of this present age.)

-sorcerers(beyond practices of magic. Those who sorcerize with their soul. High wisdom of deception. Not physical magic.)

-idolaters(beyond graven image worship. These are simply worshippers. Those who shall worship the way of satan. Who have the might to carry out satanic agenda.)

-Liars(beyond literal lying. Those who lived a lifestyle different from Truth. John 14:6)

So, this is it....maybe, maybe not..someone with a higher revelation can disprove this. The yardstick is with Him but the categories are mentioned. Maranatha.

your theology tickles!

Shawl001:
. I think, you should be able to GRAB it from the previous explanation. Pls read it again and digest it. I don't prolong matters that are already solved.

My bro if i GRABBED i wouldn't have asked at all...why not just answer the question as plainly as possible without the expositions! The simple question is:

what are you?
a. spirit
b. soul

Shawl001:
. It has to do woth our soul. That's us, not the spirit. The spirit belongs to God. Its the breath øƒ Life He gave us from start. Its the renewal øƒ our soul that's @work. The new creature in 1Cor5:17 is the soul. Ur soul is made right with God instantly. Then, when U̶̲̥̅̊ hunger ƒσя the Holyspirit, He comes in and bears witness ur spirit that you re a child øƒ God. He helps you to guide ur soul and teach U̶̲̥̅̊ into all things. He becomes ur Spirit man.

Wait! What are you? Are you spirit or soul?

Shawl001:
@OP, its not øƒ years, months or days. Its an instant action. The moment you are ready to give and submit every bit øƒ your life to Jesus...instantly, you are saved...the very moment you confess your sins to Him and you invite Him into your heart. That's all. Then you are free.

what happens instantly, regeneration of the spirit or the renewal of the soul?

yea d@s w@ i am...they are all for me... 1Cor 3:22 Whether Paul, or Apollos, or Cephas, or the world, or life, or death, or things present, or things to come; all are yours;

Another evidence against gradual soulish transformation:

1Pet 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently: KJV

1 Peter 1:22 You obeyed the truth, and your souls were made pure. Now you sincerely love each other. But you must keep on loving with all your heart. CEV

These verses suggest that the salvation of the soul is a deal that doesn't take a life time and certainly not gradual!

Olufemiolaolu:
U re a member of which church?

synagogue church of all nations, MFM, champions royal assembly, mercyland deliverance ministry...anywhere the name of God is named and his altar is installed i worship there...

clearly there's no unity of faith... and this is due to the dearth of mature ministers, prophets, apostles, teachers and pastors... May the Lord send us more shepherds!

Olufemiolaolu:
Y not.

that's wrong sir...If scriptures did not specifically permit women to wear earrings and earliest jewish traditions permit even men to wear earrings...

I advocate that if women must wear earrings then men can too and if men musn't then women musn't...

Olufemiolaolu:
The fact dat it is written doesnt make it explicitly right. Acts 24:16 And herein do I exercise myself, to have always a conscience void of offence toward God, and toward men. (NIV) 1.4 - Tit 1:15 To the pure, all things are pure, but to those who are corrupted and do not believe, nothing is pure. In fact, both their minds and consciences are corrupted. God didnt sanction this ok, they were just following their personal will ok

Then sir must women wear earrings if men are not permitted to?

On one of the occassions when Jesus met his disciples after his resurrection he did this:

John 20:22
And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:

Now unless Jesus lied or spoke and acted carelessly the disciples actually received the Holy Ghost that moment.

If the disciples received the Holy Ghost at this point in time then why did they have to tarry at Jerusalem waiting for the promise of the Father - the Baptism of the Holy Ghost in:

Acts 1:4-5
And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me. For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

The two questions to be addressed are:

Why was the baptism on the day of pentecost necessary when the disciples already received the Holy Ghost from Jesus himself?

And if it was necessary what really is the baptism of the Holy Ghost?

As clear as possible Jesus Christ himself had this to say:


Matthew 23:8-10

But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren. And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven. Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.

Here Jesus clearly stated we should call no one: master, rabbi or even father but we are quick to identify spiritual fathers in the church. Worse still is the division caused in the church by this issue and Paul addressed this:

1 Corinthians 1:12-13

Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ. Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?


Is it valid for church leaders to call and regard themselves as 'SPIRITUAL FATHER and MOTHER'?

Over to the brethren.

dawealthiestman:
OP, this post is HIGHLY unnecessary. Did you wear any piece of earrings (even to church ) and get any harassment? Why don't you do the needful and tell us about your experience. Another post by a randy teenager.

I don't believe in outward adornment...i adhere to:

1Pet 3:3 Whose adorning let it not be that outward
adorning of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of
gold, or of putting on of apparel;

i'm only asking a question to challenge the morality of wearing earrings...if women must wear them, men should also be permitted...and if men musn't women also musn't!

ps: I am not randy and i am not a teenager... your hasty deduction could be devastating...

SuperModerator:
men should not wear what partaineth to a woman






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scripture did not assign earrings to women alone as seen in the quoted verse...and Exodus 32:2

and if your comment is valid then women should not wear trousers and the likes!

koligs:
@op, its obvious ur brain isn't connected to ur head....

My brother i just asked a question to challenge the gender attachment to the use of earrings...As christianrg we are bound by the tradition of scripture and scripture did not assign earrings to women alone as seen in the quoted verse.

Earrings do not make you male or female or otherwise... My personal view is that no piercings, marks and attachments be made to the body and we all know that the use of earrings requires piercing or attachments...as 1 Peter 3:3 states outward adornment should not be priority.

1Pet 3:3 Whose adorning let it not be that outward adorning of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of gold, or of putting on of apparel;

ROSSIKE:
You mean Yahweh? Please stop calling a Jewish tribal deity ''God''.

fella dis is 4 Christian theologians and analysts not athiests and the like!

it appears the theologians have gone to sleep!

If women are permitted to wear earrings as an ornament so are the men as well! The verse below speaks volumes:

Exodus 32:2 And Aaron said unto them, Break off the golden earrings, which are in the ears of your wives, of your sons, and of your daughters, and bring them unto me.

The tradition of the Israelites was compatible with men and women wearing earrings as an ornament and it was as old as the time of Abraham. This is evident when Abraham's eldest servant seeking a wife for Isaac found Rebecca and gave her gifts and among the gifts was an earring.

Genesis 24:22
And it came to pass, as the camels had done drinking, that the man took a golden earring of half a shekel weight, and two bracelets for her hands of ten shekels weight of gold;

Now if by the tradition of the Israelites women wear earrings then men should also wear earrings...

Howeves in our time female Christians wear earrings as an outward adornment contrary to the doctrine (popularized by some):

1 Peter 3:3-4
Whose adorning let it not be that outward adorning of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of gold, or of putting on of apparel;But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price.

but if female Christians are permitted to use earrings why aren't the male Christians permitted as well in some congregations?

Answers!

while you giants slug it out, pls examine this thread

https://www.nairaland.com/2074519/law-handed-down-god-moses#2074519.1

It is also a burning issue and i'd like to get comments on it.

plaetton:
I didn't have to answer or address the topic I exactly the way you want it.

My point is that faith, mostly resting on wishy washy stuff, would always seek ways to validate itself.
This shows that faith is nothing other than what it is,. The constant and persistent struggles with Doubts.
Prophesy, therefore, is just another tool for self delusion.

Thanks man! I understand you.

twosquare:
to die in sin is a different thing. And I mentioned where I said hell is for the disobedient ones and there is no where I said someone who died in sin is heaven bound. Salvation of the soul is beyond your definition of if someone dies in sin or not. That's isn't my business, my business is even if that person doesn't make the "perfect man, full stature" , he will still continue his course in heaven.

but bro wait first let me give an instance, a new dude that was in church yesterday, heard the sermon, got convicted, said the sinner's prayer (as it is called) and starts the so called journey to the salvation of the soul but today he visited his neighbor's wife who happens to be alone and is very 'hor.ny'. One thing led to the other he 'browses' another man's wife and while he's at it the husband bursts in, catches the unfortunate dude, pulls out a loaded gun and 'bam' 'bam' 'bam' the new 'convert' bro drops dead...

Where would that brother wake up?
a. heaven
b. hell

plaetton:
Again, prophesy is just one more proof that Christianity is a religion that relies heavily of skight-of-hand tricks and outright fraud to sustain and perpetuate itself.

I have stated severally that faith=doubts
Faith is a constant struggle with doubts.
Faith uses a number of tools to tell itself that it is winning the war with doubts.

The so-called prophesies is one the ways that faith self- medicates itself in it's mostly futile and regular attempts at self- validation.

What is prophesy, and what are it's intended value?

In modern times, prophecy is called forecasting and it relies on information, data, statical modelling, mathematics, and the simple application of common sense to make projections based on what is already known or manifest.

A simple prophesy would be, for example, to say that the upcoming elections are going bring tensions, violence and bloodshed in areas not expected, or that it is going to be a very close race that would be filled allegations of rigging by both sides.

But of course, in magic land of Christians, this would be divine revelation if comes from the mouth of a pulpit love-vendor.

your comment didn't attempt to address the core of my opening comment. you only attacked the validity of prophecy from the pulpit from your own world view... More grace to you sir!

twosquare:
how many years the salvation of the soul takes depends coz our experience varies and ability(strength) to yield to the Truth differs. It may take 15 yrs, 20yrs, 30yrs, it may take 50yrs or beyond and you may not even complete the process if you're lackadaisical about it till death comes.

Heaven, the thief on the cross is just an example of someone who hasn't undergone a bit of the salvation of the soul. Infact that one na narrow escape. To enter heaven is easy just like entering our earth domain. All u need is to give your life to Christ. But such a person won't enter the Kingdom. Hell is another dimension I don't want to venture coz they are meant for the disobedient ones(a temporary abode of punishment). But this you must understand...salvation of the soul is not about escaping hell or making heaven. Christ has saved us from the condemnation. It is about upgrading the soul to the consciousness of what the spirit has become. The spirit is CHRIST, so also the soul has to become one. Salvation of the soul is operating at the same level(frequency) your spirit is operating and this can be made possible by continuous obedience to he Truth.

The blueprint which the salvation of the soul entails is what the Father wants was spoken through Paul in Ephesians 4:13(underlining the word perfect and full stature)

James was writing to believers and urged them to continue so that they can attain this state.James 1:21.

Salvation still continues in heaven even if you haven't finish your course here...

so a convert undergoing the salvation of the soul that
dies in sin would go to heaven!!!

Wow! No wonder we have many that sin in the church... Okay, i'v got your view.

Is the Law handed to Moses by the LORD God obsolete?

Let's examine two instance.

The first is this. Is it okay for a Christian to make markings, piercings, tatoos and cuttings on its body?

The Law states:

Leviticus 19:28 Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.

but fortunately for some and unfortunately for others this statute was not mentioned in the new testament and since the law is termed obsolete, would it be okay for a Christian to make markings, piercings, tatoos and cuttings on its body?

The second is, the verse below seem to suggest that the keeping of the sabbath is a statute to be observed forever by the isrealites (that is jews by birth and grafted jews)... and it is a perpetual covenant...meaning this covenant is timeless and 'dispensationless' to go on forever.


Exodus 31:16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.

but since the law is obsolete, the sabbath on the last day of the week is expunged now for the first day of the week... Does this not make God, the giver of Exodus 31:16, a liar as the sabbath is no longer a perpetual covenant? And this is sanctioned by new testament Christians.

It is written:

Joel 2:28-29

And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions: And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.

1 Corinthians 14:31 For ye may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted.

The Joel 2:28-29 verse tells us that our churches should be packed with Christians that prophesy not necessary as persons called into the prophetic office but as partakers of the new covenant as described by Joel.

In Paul's inspired words, the Holy Ghost obviously expects us all to prophesy one by one and he states that this is for us to learn and be comforted. Many of the arguments and controversies in the body of Christ would have been resolved and we would have been at peace with eachother irrespective of the denomination...

The current friction, disagreements, accusations and rivalry in church in Nigeria is a reminder that the recommendations of the Holy Ghost by the mouth of Paul in 1 Corinthians 14:31 is lacking.

Do Christians, i mean regular members of the congregation and church workers not the church leaders, still prophesy.

The question is: How long does the salvation of the Soul take? Does it take place instantly as opined by John Crowder in ( http://www.thenewmystics.com/Articles/1000129594/Home_Page_of/Articles/Sanctification_is_Not.aspx ) or does it take an unspecified period which may be for a lifetime as posited by Erwin Gane ( http://www.sabbathfellowship.org/biblestudies/erwingane/biblestudy_gane_sanctify.htm )

If you can read the two articles, please do and share your views and while you are at that answer this question too:

If a convert undergoing the salvation of the soul dies in sin where would that person go?

a. Heaven
b. Hell

Please choose an option first and explain your choice.

Well Mr JMAN it appears you've got it all figured out...We'll the end of time would put one of us in the right and the other wrong...As for me I'v listened to TBJ and I'v experienced the healing and prophetic services and i find him to be true

I am not a member of TBJ's church but i believe he's from and of God!

waldigit:
What many say is not always the will of God. A born again person is NOT expected to dwell in sin because he has access to a system to keep him holy. Not that he can't sin, but sin cannot have dominion over him because the cycle of perfection is put in place to help him overcome. As he moved through these stages he grows toward perfection. The process is cyclic that means he cannot attain to a peak point and says I have arrived. Paul says he was pressing forward to this perfection, which he did until death, hence the process stops at death.

anyone who sins, is dominated by sin...many so called 'born again' folks sin terribly and still claim they are bornagain and by so doing they let strangers and unbelievers MOCK AND SCORN Jehova El Kannah, his son Yeshua and his Spirit 'Ruach ha Kodesh'